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ComfortMyPeople

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  1. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in who is referred to here?   
    I hope you know that the ruler I added to the illustration was just a joke, to show how anxious some people are to get any additional information about the timing of the Great Tribulation. The joke is actually based on comments that Russell made, and a related comment here by someone else about how Russell had used just such a method on a rough illustration of the Great Pyramid at Giza. He took the original illustration from C. Piazzi Smyth's book (1864) about the Great Pyramid, and tried to measure various lengths to show where all the prophesied dates in the pyramid landed and finally ended. Most of this was borrowed from Joseph Seiss who had not only done the same thing, but who had "teased" the readers of his book (MIracle in Stone, 1877) by producing an illustration which didn't exactly predict the end date but showed the reader the "known" dates, in an illustration and then tempted the reader with just how easy it would be to see where the dates of the Great Pyramid finally dropped off. He said he wouldn't include that date in the text of his book because it might not be prudent. It was clearly designed to tempt readers to get out a ruler and measure it for themselves.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramidology#Joseph_A._Seiss
    C. Piazzi Smyth himself and Seiss, elsewhere, had predicted dates for the end from the 1880's up until the early 1900's as each previous date failed.
    So my joke was NOT intended to add any further information about what we could know, but only because I agree with Jesus and Paul about the silliness of any such attempts:
    (Acts 1:7) 7 He said to them: “It does not belong to you to know the times or seasons that the Father has placed in his own jurisdiction. (1 Thessalonians 5:1) . . .Now as for the times and the seasons, brothers, you need nothing to be written to you.
  2. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in who is referred to here?   
    This is true. But then again this will always be true because the end is closer now than at the time we became believers.
    (Romans 13:11, 12) . . .And do this because you know the season, that it is already the hour for you to awake from sleep, for now our salvation is nearer than at the time when we became believers. 12 The night is well along; the day has drawn near.. . . Since the late 1600's, especially, religions that focus on where we are in terms of chronology and prophecy have claimed we are at the cusp of the Great Tribulation. The Millerite movement apparently produced at least 100,000 people who could be convinced that 1843/1844 was the end. A Millerite named Barbour was able to convince Russell from his updated version of Miller's chronology that Barbour had used to prove 1873/1874 was the end. The Watchtower said that the signs were unmistakable that the last days had begun in 1799 and the Watchtower pointed to heavenly signs in the sun and stars in the early 1800's as proof. The evidence is so overwhelming now, today, that it would seem crazy to deny that we are deep into the last days, and yet we should keep in mind that the evidences seemed just as overwhelming to Miller, Barbour, Russell and others, and probably just as overwhelming to Paul's contemporaries.
    And we truly HAVE been on the cusp of the Great Tribulation ever since 70 C.E. when the first part of the prophecy about the destruction of Jerusalem was fulfilled. Remember that Jesus said that "immediately after those days, the sun would be darkened" etc. As Peter said, it could be 1,000 years off, and yet we are still to live as if the parousia could be within our lifetime. If we happen to survive to that time, we were on the cusp, and if we happen to die before that time, we were on the cusp, because our next waking second after our death, should be in the resurrection.
     
  3. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Anna in Who Did Cain Fear Was Going To Kill Him?   
    This is just a quick reply, have no time to post any support for this, but I remember researching this at one time since I also had the same question. It would appear that since there is no time frame on what happened from Adam to when Cain left to wander somewhere else, it is possible that the people he might encounter were his distant relatives, who had already procreated sufficiently to establish several communities.  Also, the scriptures do not always detail everything. It was Moses who supposedly wrote about this, perhaps he had no need to explain where the other people came from, if he believed they came from Adam and Eve, since as Melinda mentions, he said that Eve became the mother of everyone living. So it makes sense that Adam and Eve had a heaps of children during their long life, besides the main characters of Cain and Abel, and these children had heaps of other children. I even did a hypothetical diagram of possible families and relatives, and it seemed quite feasible that after several generations there were quite a number of people scattered all over the place. Granted, not to the extent that "science" tells us. For me, scientific evidence, especially in the area of evolution, can be dodgy, and I am not sure everything can be believed as facts, even though you say there is hard evidence for it. However, I cannot argue with you on this because I have not investigated this "hard evidence" myself. Not thoroughly anyway. 
  4. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Melinda Mills in Who Did Cain Fear Was Going To Kill Him?   
    (Genesis 2:4-6) . . .This is a history of the heavens and the earth in the time of their being created, in the day that Jehovah God made earth and heaven. 5 Now there was as yet no bush of the field found in the earth and no vegetation of the field was as yet sprouting, because Jehovah God had not made it rain upon the earth and there was no man to cultivate the ground. 6 But a mist would go up from the earth and it watered the entire surface of the ground.
    Note: Before Jehovah made Adam there was no man to cultivate the ground.   The information seems scant but the Bible says enough.
    Cain later built a city named after his son, Enoch,  so it doesn't seem he was still worried of being killed.  Read here:
    (Genesis 4:16-24)  Then Cain went away from before Jehovah and took up residence in the land of Exile, to the east of Eʹden. 17 Afterward Cain had sexual relations with his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Eʹnoch. Then he engaged in building a city and named the city after his son Eʹnoch. 18 Later Iʹrad was born to Eʹnoch. And Iʹrad became father to Me·huʹja·el, and Me·huʹja·el became father to Me·thuʹsha·el, and Me·thuʹsha·el became father to Laʹmech. 19 Laʹmech took two wives for himself. The name of the first was Aʹdah, and the name of the second was Zilʹlah. 20 Aʹdah gave birth to Jaʹbal. He was the founder of those who dwell in tents and have livestock. 21 His brother’s name was Juʹbal. He was the founder of all those who play the harp and the pipe. 22 Also, Zilʹlah gave birth to Tuʹbal-cain, who forged every sort of tool of copper and iron. And the sister of Tuʹbal-cain was Naʹa·mah. 23 Then Laʹmech composed these words for his wives Aʹdah and Zilʹlah: “Hear my voice, you wives of Laʹmech; Give ear to my saying: A man I have killed for wounding me, Yes, a young man for striking me. 24 If 7 times Cain is to be avenged, Then Laʹmech 77 times.” 
    Note that it did not say Cain found his wife in the land of Fugitiveness (Nod) east of the Garden of Eden, but he had relations with her there. Note that the Bible does not mention the names of the daughters of Adam. It said only that he had sons and daughters in Genesis chapter 5.  It is likely that Adam had several daughters before he had Seth who was mentioned next. (See Reasoning Book and other publications under Where did Cain get his wife?)
    My take:  It also spoke about him building a city named after his son, Enoch, so it seems he was no longer worried about being hunted down. Lamech in his poetry spoke of  Cain being avenged, so it seems Cain's situation was known and that he was to be avenged seven times, if killed.
    A certain level of sophistication is noted here: Marrying, making instruments and playing music, lifestyle innovations, tool making with copper and iron, poetry writing and maybe songwriting too.
    It speaks of the talented people that descended from Cain  and their also taking wives and not saying where they came from. Seems female children were born regularly enough, among that pool of people, so there was no problem getting wives. Lamech took two, as they were plentiful enough. Occasionally the Bible said how old Adam was when he got another son, but generally intervals are not mentioned. So we trust the daughters were old enough to be married. Lamech seemed to be a writer/poet and he had talented children who made musical instruments, tools,  and invented other things and lifestyles. His wives and one of his daughter's name is mentioned (Naamah).
    I don't think we should worry about it. We would like to know more but the Bible says enough.
  5. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Melinda Mills in Who Did Cain Fear Was Going To Kill Him?   
    Interesting points, James, but it is all conjecture. 
    Based on Genesis 3:20 the person Cain married had to come from Eve (the mother of all living).  Therefore it would be one of his sisters or nieces. People were near to perfection then, and the Mosaic Law against incest was given much later (2500 years) when the genes would be starting to degenerate.
    So saying that there were other  humans living elsewhere in the wild who God ignored is a little too far out.   (They certainly did not evolve - God is the source of all life. He made his creatures all according to their kind, including humans. He made man in his own image as a special creation. Paul showed that all people do by nature things of the law written on their consciences.)
    God is interested in all his creations, even the birds and ants.  But he loves humans and they were made in his image. Jesus loved humans from the beginning and he said (in the gospels) his Heavenly Father would rather care for us than the birds.   Even in the Law of Moses he prescribed how foreigners who were not Israelites  were to be treated so they would not be humiliated.  Actually his selecting Abraham's offspring for blessings  was only a test case for how all mankind would be treated in the future. All humans are accountable to God, even those who were not under the Mosaic law. Remember these scriptures:
    (Genesis 1:26) Then God said: “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every creeping animal that is moving on the earth.”     (Notice he did not say any particular kind of man or race.)
    (Proverbs 8:31) I rejoiced over his habitable earth, And I was especially fond of the sons of men.
    (Jesus loved humans from the beginning.)
    (Genesis 22:18) And by means of your offspring all nations of the earth will obtain a blessing for themselves because you have listened to my voice.’”  (All nations are in for a blessing eventually.)
    Jehovah was using his friend, Abraham's, descendants as a test case for what he was going to do when mankind is restored to perfection.   It was not because they were superior in any way.
    (Deut 4: 32-38) “Ask, now, about the former days before your time, from the day when God created man on the earth; search from one end of the heavens to the other end of the heavens. Has anything so great ever happened or has anything like it ever been heard of? 33 Have any other people heard the voice of God speaking out of the fire the way you have heard it and kept on living? 34 Or has God ever attempted to take for himself a nation out of the midst of another nation along with judgments, with signs, with miracles, with war, with a mighty hand, with an outstretched arm, and with terrifying deeds, as Jehovah your God did for you in Egypt before your very eyes? 35 You yourselves have been shown these things so you will know that Jehovah is the true God; there is no other besides him. 36 He made you hear his voice from the heavens to correct you, and on the earth he made you see his great fire, and his words you heard from out of the fire. 37 “Because he loved your forefathers and has chosen their offspring after them, you were brought out of Egypt in his presence by his great power. 38 From before you he drove away nations greater and mightier than you, to bring you in and give you their land as an inheritance, as it is today.

    Jesus said Jehovah cares for all his creatures, but he would rather care for mankind.
    (Matthew 6:26-30) 26 Observe intently the birds of heaven; they do not sow seed or reap or gather into storehouses, yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not worth more than they are? 27 Who of you by being anxious can add one cubit to his life span? 28 Also, why are you anxious about clothing? Take a lesson from the lilies of the field, how they grow; they do not toil, nor do they spin; 29 but I tell you that not even Solʹo·mon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. 30 Now if this is how God clothes the vegetation of the field that is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will he not much rather clothe you, you with little faith?     
     Non-Israelite humans could come and pray at Jehovah's house.

    (1 Kings 8:41-43) “Also concerning the foreigner who is not part of your people Israel and who comes from a distant land because of your name 42 (for they will hear about your great name and your mighty hand and your outstretched arm), and he comes and prays toward this house, 43 may you then listen from the heavens, your dwelling place, and do all that the foreigner asks of you, so that all the peoples of the earth may know your name and fear you, as your people Israel do, and may know that your name has been called on this house that I have built.
    God always cared for people, even those who did not serve him.
    (Acts 14:16, 17) In past generations he permitted all the nations to go on in their ways, 17 although he did not leave himself without witness in that he did good, giving you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying you with food and filling your hearts with gladness.”
    It is still his will for all kinds of people to be saved.
    (1 Timothy 2:3-6) This is fine and acceptable in the sight of our Savior, God, 4 whose will is that all sorts of people should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of truth. 5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, 6 who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time.
     
    I know you don't like long talk or writing, but there is a reason why God inspired 40 men to write 66 books in the Bible; you can't say everything in one sentence. 
    (Ephesians 3:18) in order that with all the holy ones you may be thoroughly able to comprehend fully what is the breadth and length and height and depth,..
     
     
  6. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in Song #25 - "A Special Possession"   
    You could read between the lines that something like this was expected to occur from previous Watchtower articles, including the "rapture" discussion:
    *** w15 7/15 pp. 18-19 pars. 14-17 “Your Deliverance Is Getting Near”! ***
    It is the time when the remaining ones of the 144,000 will receive their heavenly reward. (1 Thess. 4:15-17; Rev. 14:1) This event will take place at some point after the beginning of the attack by Gog of Magog. (Ezek. 38:11) Then these words of Jesus will be fulfilled: “At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the Kingdom of their Father.”—Matt. 13:43.
    15 Does this mean that there will be a “rapture” of the anointed ones? . . .  Therefore, while we do not use the term “rapture” here because of its wrong connotation, the remaining faithful anointed will be gathered together in an instant of time.
    16 Once all the 144,000 are in heaven, the final preparations for the marriage of the Lamb can begin. (Rev. 19:9) But something else will happen before that joyous event. Remember, shortly before the remaining ones of the 144,000 are taken to heaven, Gog will attack God’s people. (Ezek. 38:16) What reaction does this provoke? On earth, God’s people will appear to be defenseless. They will obey the instructions given in the days of King Jehoshaphat: “You will not need to fight this battle. Take your position, stand still, and see the salvation of Jehovah in your behalf. O Judah and Jerusalem, do not be afraid or be terrified.” (2 Chron. 20:17) In heaven, however, there is a different reaction. Referring to the time when all the anointed are in heaven, Revelation 17:14 tells us this about the enemies of God’s people: “These will battle with the Lamb, but because he is Lord of lords and King of kings, the Lamb will conquer them. Also, those with him who are called and chosen and faithful will do so.” Together with his 144,000 corulers in heaven, Jesus will come to the rescue of God’s people here on earth.
    17 The resulting war of Armageddon
    *** w15 3/15 p. 29 par. 18 Loyally Supporting Christ’s Brothers ***
    Before Armageddon breaks out, anointed ones will be taken to heaven. (Matt. 13:41-43
    *** w13 11/15 p. 20 Seven Shepherds, Eight Dukes—What They Mean for Us Today ***
    LESSONS FOR TODAY
    16 The prophecy about seven shepherds and eight dukes has its major fulfillment in our day. The citizens of ancient Jerusalem were attacked by the Assyrians. In the near future, Jehovah’s apparently vulnerable people will come under attack from the modern-day “Assyrian,” whose intent will be to wipe them out. The Scriptures refer to that attack as well as the attack of ‘Gog of Magog,’ the attack of “the king of the north,” and the attack of “the kings of the earth.” (Ezek. 38:2, 10-13; Dan. 11:40, 44, 45; Rev. 17:14; 19:19) Do these represent separate attacks? Not necessarily. The Bible could be referring to the same attack under different names. What ‘secret weapon’ does Micah’s prophecy indicate Jehovah would raise up against that implacable foe—“the Assyrian”? A very unlikely one—“seven shepherds, yes, eight dukes”! (Mic. 5:5) The shepherds and dukes (or, “princes,” NEB) in this implausible army are the congregation elders. (1 Pet. 5:2) Today, Jehovah certainly has provided an abundance of spiritual men to shepherd his precious sheep, to strengthen his people for the future attack of the modern-day “Assyrian.” Micah’s prophecy states that they will “shepherd the land of Assyria with the sword.” (Mic. 5:6) Yes, among ‘the weapons of their warfare,’ you will find “the sword of the spirit,” God’s Word.—2 Cor. 10:4; Eph. 6:17.
    17 Elders who are reading this article can draw some useful conclusions from the account we have just considered: (1) The most practical step that we can take to prepare for the coming attack of “the Assyrian” is that of strengthening our faith in God and helping our brothers to do the same. (2) When “the Assyrian” attacks, the elders must be absolutely convinced that Jehovah will deliver us. (3) At that time, the life-saving direction that we receive from Jehovah’s organization may not appear practical from a human standpoint. All of us must be ready to obey any instructions we may receive, whether these appear sound from a strategic or human standpoint or not. (4) Now is the time for any who may be putting their trust in secular education, material things, or human institutions to adjust their thinking. The elders must stand ready to help any who may now be wavering in their faith.
    It's a similar point (in the 2013 article) about the fact that at this time it will be the congregation elders who take the lead. The elders take the lead in the absence of an anointed governing body. Of course, the point being spelled out here is the possibility that some of these elders will probably give direction at a wider level than just for a typical congregation. The possibility of each Branch continuing to operate for their own countries has been implied in statements at conventions, but this is the closest I have seen to implying an entirely new worldwide governing body.
    But how much we can read into this would depend on things like communications capabilities in the latter days of the great tribulation, or through Armageddon itself if it is an ongoing battle that is not resolved as quickly as some might imagine. The typical scenario that has been dramatized for us is one in which we trust local brothers, elders who have our best interests at heart, to give us direction . 
     
  7. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in Song #25 - "A Special Possession"   
    I thought that might be what you meant, but it sounded funny to use the term "anointed" as if it were the equivalent of saying "those who take the lead." That's because so few of the thousands of anointed are known to be taking the lead. But now I see why you included the question with Song 25, because the Governing Body will be among those who will disappear from the earth at some point prior to Armageddon.
    Perhaps this is preparation for us to begin thinking of accepting capable brothers from among the other sheep to begin taking the lead at higher levels, such as among the Governing Body in the very near future. For example, in 15 years if Armageddon has not arrived, and several members of the current Governing Body do not live that long, there may already be very few qualified anointed persons to choose from. Can we imagine a scenario where there are only two, and then only ONE member of the Governing Body? I believe that very few of the current GB Helpers claim to be anointed.
    I would agree that the actual, literal point of this article is to prepare us for the idea that there may be a sudden change to a kind of Governing Body made up of only members of the other sheep.
  8. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Anna in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    A few years ago I was in Pittsburgh visiting one of my husband's relatives and since we were right there, at the "nucleus" of where it all "began" we went to see Russell's grave, saw the Pyramid (which actually is not his tombstone as some think) and we also went to the Allegheny congregation. The brothers there regularly do unofficial tours of Russell sites if any visitor asks about it. I mentioned to the brother about pyramidology, he laughed, a little uncomfortably, and said "we don't talk about that". I understand it's a little bit of an embarrassment, but if you know the facts about it, it is nothing bad, and I would say it's quite understandable for men of God at that time who were searching for truth to have looked into all kinds of things along the route. It becomes a problem when opposers twist or embellish facts and make it look like Russell was into the occult and freemasonry etc. So in my opinion it would be better to explain where Russell was coming from, rather than trying to bury or ignore it. But, and this is the sad thing, perhaps the brother in question really didn't know the facts, and this is where the cult thinking comes in. You are a follower despite some unexplained beliefs. But perhap's I am doing the brother an injustice, perhaps he knew all about  Russell's "theories", but just couldn't be bothered to go into it....
  9. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    I appear to be behind the times here.
    Mike & Kim I know of from a video I watched of them on YouTube, where they seemed a bit too silly and flippant (perhaps even tipsy?). But their information was lousy, and they were promoting this idea that elders were destroying necessary CSA evidence, when they were really misinterpreting "good practice" counsel from the WTS about record-keeping.  Maybe they have done their homework on other videos, but I won't waste my time because I don't trust them based on the random one I watched. P. Asare I have never heard of. John Redwood is related to John Cedars, who is somehow related to Lloyd Evans, as I saw these names on JW Survey. I downloaded that site to read later, but I did read all the headlines from the site, just never got back to it. Average Joe I have never heard of. Bill Bowen is the former elder who put his face behind "Silent Lambs" which intended to expose CSA crimes among JWs. I understand that Barbara Anderson worked with him to get it started and get it named but that Barbara Anderson didn't trust his motives or his personality and backed away from it. (I have read much of Anderson's site, and the name comes up often when I search Google on several different historical and CSA topics.) WiFiBandit sounds very familiar but I do not know from where. (I suspect this is a Jehovahs-Witness forum participant. I don't care much about the work of most ex-JWs for purposes of testing their claims, or defense against their claims, unless I'm convinced that they have done their homework, and are not prone to taking things out of context. For this reason, I have purchased 2 books from M.J.Penton, 1 from C.O.Jonnson, and 2 from E.C.Gruss. (I also have two books from R.Franz that I picked up online as free pdfs. I also picked up a book called Apostles of Denial from archive.org, which is also from E.C.Gruss.)
    Otherwise, I pretty much ignore current online sources because I think they tend to get their info from other sources anyway, and misinterpret or misrepresent what they said. For this reason I won't bother with those who don't do their own work, when it comes to claims we should test for ourselves.
    Compared to people who appear to have gone to original sources and documented their work, I'd guess that most of these online personalities are probably just repeating things. Any of them, including the authors I mentioned, might also have had bad motives. We should expect that this taints their own conclusions. But it's worth looking at their work, especially if a lot of it is true, regardless of their own motives or conclusions. Perhaps we'll look at the same evidence and come to a different conclusion.
  10. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    Truth means "the whole truth, and nothing but the truth." Not whitewashed, partial truth, and not just the "spin" that tickles our ears.
    That's everyone's own business whether they would rather know the whole truth, or ignore the truth, or assume that others can and should prioritize for them what they need to know as "the truth."
    But, for me, I think we would be hypocrites to sing songs like we just did this last week. (Make the Truth Your Own), the comments on Colossians 2:8, etc., etc. Most of our meetings contain small reminders that we need to "love" truth. It shouldn't matter where it takes us. Actually, it should matter. And it should matter, even more, that some people don't want us to go where it takes us. 
    It's difficult for most of us to admit that the "Watchtower religion" has been a cult in the past. (In the more pejorative sense of the word.) The Watchtower publicly admits that this is true, claiming that many of the Bible Students were cult worshipers of Charles Taze Russell. We know that Rutherford said he determined to rid the Watchtower of the personality cult that worshiped Russell. He called this "creature worship" because they were worshiping a man. But we also know that, for many years, Rutherford himself was part of the same cult, and even bragged in 1916 that Russell's enemies would soon have to come and "worship at his feet."
    But, in general, I think Rutherford finally did a pretty good job replacing the cult members with persons who were looking for practical Bible truth, and not just for a man to do their thinking for them. But many persons, even Watchtower writers, have confused God and the earthly organization. And, this idea might surprise many, but I think that F.W.Franz gave evidence that he remained as a "cult" member until he died. He loved being seen as the the primary Rabbi --The ORACLE, they called him-- and it went to his head as he tried for his entire career to revive interest in dates, chronology, numerology, Jubilees, new truths (prophetic interpretations), parallel dispensations, the pre-eminence of the truly anointed, etc. I think his influence created cult members out of several ordinary Witnesses. I believe that my great-grandfather (from even before F.Franz was at Bethel) was a "cult" member in the organization until the 1960's when he died, even though my other relatives were (and are) regular JWs, and not cult members. I'm pretty sure that C.Woodworth was a cult member until the 1950's when he died. I know that when they searched out documentation and photos for the Proclaimer's book, they were astounded at the "cult" material still available in Witnesses' archives, including F.Franz himself.
    And many Witnesses, today, are tempted to look at 8 men exactly the way that Bible Students looked at Russell. The way we defend or dismiss the material from our past history can be an indicator as to whether we too have succumbed to cult thinking. Even the way we defend current material that came out of long-standing traditions of the past can also be an indicator. I can talk to Mormons and Seventh Day Adventists for hours and recognize almost immediately which ones are in a "cult" and which ones aren't by the manner in which they defend Ellen G White or Joseph Smith when glaring problems are pointed out.
    (Job 31:26-28) 26 If I saw the sun shining Or the moon moving in its splendor; 27 And my heart was secretly enticed, And my mouth kissed my hand in worship of them; 28 Then that would be an error deserving punishment by the judges, For I would have denied the true God above.
  11. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    There are people who have spent their whole lives in prison ... and when they get out ... freedom scares them so badly, they commit more crime for the sole reason to be convicted and GO BACK to prison, where they are surrounded with what they have become comfortable with.
    As a small boy, I maintained that Santa Clause was real, long after I knew he was not .... because although I did not believe in Santa, I believed in presents!
    Truth scares many people who have integrated a web of lies into their lives ... and they resist it and vilify it as it shakes the web and they are afraid of falling away.
    So ... they wait until the spider comes, and eats them, secure in the knowledge of their noble sacrifice.
     
     
     
  12. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    In many halls the very library itself can no longer be found. So there are no older books, just a shelf for current (but used) Bibles and Songbooks that folks left accidentally. But it's true that the out of print books are not banned. Just harder to find, such as Aid to Bible Understanding and Commentary on the Letter of James. But if it were not well known which writer wrote a specific book, and it usually isn't, then there was no need to remove those books. The need to replace the Aid book with Insight began in a hurry after R.Franz became known as the head writer, through his own admission in Crisis of Conscience, but most the entries are still exactly verbatim what was in the Aid book. But they still haven't replaced "Choosing the Best Way of Life" and it's still available on the Watchtower Library CD, and wol.jw.org.
    There are books that make us cringe, and those who ask specific questions about anything prior to 1970 will probably be looked at as if they are losing faith in the organization. Don't try to ask if anyone knows of anything still good in the Finished Mystery book, for example.
    There is still a lot of good information in some of the books and magazines prior to 1970, but most anything useful has been repeated, or updated/corrected in more recent books and magazines. Also, I have some memos I was going to share here once that showed that in assigning topics, the head of Writing had a kind of rule that every topic would be revisited before 20 years were up. So if a topic hadn't been touched in a while, you might at least see it updated, for example, in 1939, 1958, 1977 (and 1996, 2015 if they still kept the "policy" going).
    A couple of big changes that make a lot of books up to even 2000 obsolete is the fact that we no longer make a prophecy out of parables and narrative portions of the Bible. This doesn't make the good counsel obsolete, but usually it means that this counsel now applies to everybody, not just a specific class. (i.e., Shulammite class, Haman class, Esther class, Elijah class, Elisha class, Ruth class, Naomi class, Jehu class, Jezebel class, Jeremiah class, Jonadab class, Samaritan class, Prodigal Son's Brother's class, etc.)
  13. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    My wife, Susan,  sent me a link to this from the downstairs computer, of a woman reunited with her dog who somehow got into a shelter.
    If you want to distill three days of words, words, and more words, into one photograph ..... look at this one.

  14. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in Kingdom Songs   
    INTRODUCTION:
    It's quite possible that people who play a little on a piano, guitar, harmonica, flute/recorder, etc., might want to share their recordings of Kingdom Songs. This might encourage more people to pick up a new (or used) instrument and play a song. Of course, there will be no rule that someone can't also just sing, hum, or whistle. 
    Amateurs, like me, posting their performances here could attract other amateurs who might not otherwise think it's OK to post, just because a piece has mistakes. But we could also focus on the less complex songs, and perhaps give some pointers we've learned that might help others. (For example, the places you can safely skip a hard chord on the guitar, or invert a piano chord to make it easier.)
    On that note, I'll start soon by picking out the "Top 40" easy songs in the Songbook: "Sing Out Joyfully To Jehovah" and I'll first highlight the ones that are already in the Key of C.
    I'll play them on harmonica, and then perhaps on recorder (a simple kind of "flute") and later hopefully, others will follow on guitar, or keyboard/piano, or ocarina. If anyone wants to join in to add their own favorite Kingdom Songs, that would be great.
    Of course, this assumes that there will be enough interest in this section/topic/thread.
    RULES:
    None. It makes sense that more people would find a section like this entertaining if it were not used as a place to make fun of anyone's particular performances. Of course, no one should really expect this idea to be followed. There's always a critic somewhere; some with worthwhile criticism, and some worthless. After all, this is the Internet, where even YouTube comments about a cute, innocent puppy can get downright mean and nasty. Hopefully a "Kingdom Song" topic will fare a little better.
    Also, it's more appealing when we do not waste space in this section with comments, rants, or diatribes about Kingdom Songs in general, JW doctrines. Anecdotes about Kingdom Songs themselves might be interesting, but that's not the main idea of this topic. If things get too out of hand, or off-topic, I might be able to move those posts to a new section. It's a forum superpower I've been granted, and I'm not afraid to use it.
    IDEAS:
    When someone posts a "video" people are more likely to watch than to just listen to a sound file. But when people watch a video, remember that you might accidentally be including personal information about yourself that you didn't intend. (My piano is next to a bookcase with dozens of personal pictures of brothers, sisters, friends, and family.) If this is a concern, you might want to post a sound file. I discovered that I can get a good recording on my smartphone voice recorder app, then email it, and post the attached file directly to this forum through Safari or other browser apps on the phone. It's an m4a file.
  15. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Anna in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    Of course there is nothing wrong with that kind of sentimental love. Since I came to America I  have noticed people are more apt at showing this kind of emotion, as opposed to the stiff upper lipped Brits. I had never seen brothers cry while giving a talk on the platform until I came here (usa).  There is a lot of sentimental love at assemblies for sure as well. People are dewy eyed during the videos, songs, and when saying good bye to the brothers and sisters they've met. Honestly John, you are poking holes where you don't need to as it is a non issue. JW's for the most part are an emotional bunch, that is why there is no need to give talks on how to show "sentimental" love!
    However, the love we all need to learn is the principled kind. This is the love spoken about in Corinthians 13, and this is the love that is the theme of the convention. "Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous. It does not brag, does not get puffed up, does not behave indecently, does not look for its own interests, does not become provoked. It does not keep account of the injury.  It does not rejoice over unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth. Love is patient and kind. Love is not jealous. It does not brag, does not get puffed up bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.  Love never fails.
    Notice it says it never fails. Well romantic love can fail, so can sentimental love. You do not still "love" your ex wives do you, I didn't think so. Hovever, would you help one of them if they were in dire need and you were able to? That is principled love, AGAPE, the love described in Corinthians that doesn't always come easy to everyone and needs to be worked on. Hence the convention on that theme. If the whole world practiced that kind of love, there would be peace on earth. 
  16. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Melinda Mills in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    Next week DV I will know, and will tell you.   
    Maybe this time your children will learn something that will show them the need to visit more often and to process information so they practice godly devotion more fully which includes checking on your parents. (mentioned somewhere in 1 Timothy.) Work in progress.
  17. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    All you have said, Melinda, is true, but .... (assuming you have already attended the 2019 Convention ...) the question remains,
    WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?
    By the way ... I met my first wife at an Assembly ( she ran out on me with my best friend, an ex Bethelite and a Pioneer).
    I met my second wife in Peru, and we both worked on helping to build Bethel, there ( she ran out on me for no specified reason, other than she never loved me ).
    and ... I met my current and third wife, Susan,  on a JW dating website, and after six years, she is the love of my life, and my best friend.
    My three children, very VERY dedicated to the Organization, and who live within a 200 mile radius, have visited me less than ONE DAY in the last ten years ( this coming December 19th), so you can see why it is important for me to find out how OTHER people process information, and ...
    WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?
     
  18. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Melinda Mills in WHAT DID YOU LEARN THAT WAS NEW AT THE 2019 "LOVE NEVER FAILS" REGIONAL CONVENTION ?   
    Law of diminishing returns is also a fundamental principle in Economics, not only Engineering.  And you talking money already.
    But remember you go to meeting every week and you don't  necessarily learn anything new, it costs clothes, gas, tyres, road tax, etc.  The Convention is just a bigger meeting.  You don't complain for regular meeting, so why complain for a more exciting, bigger meeting, even if you are eating ordinary spiritual food served in prettier plates or settings.   Where did you meet your wife?  Put yourself in the place of those who are new to the spiritual food, are now meeting other Witnesses/Christians or are even looking for mates, all these are normal things Jesus mentioned in Matthew 24.  But he said some would take no note of the spiritual things until they are swept away. 
    So what can you/I do to show more  appreciation for what may begin to look ordinary?  Form a longing for the ordinary food (milk) - it is necessary to grow from infancy to maturity both literally and spiritually; it will help you to grow to salvation.  You know a year in advance and you prepare with anticipation. When it comes you show appreciation.  I already have three sets of clothes put out and a bag packed. My convention is next week. I got my lapel card today.
    (1 Peter 2:2) "As newborn infants, form a longing for the unadulterated milk of the word, so that by means of it you may grow to salvation,"
    Even if we really knew everything that we need to know, we are all works in progress, we need to work on what we know.  There is always room for improvement in putting on the complete suit of armour and the new personality; in setting spiritual goals.
    (Ephesians 4:23, 24) And you should continue to be made new in your dominant mental attitude, 24 and should put on the new personality that was created according to God’s will in true righteousness and loyalty.
    Always remember that the Israelites complained about the manna, then God send the bird with lots of flesh and while they were still eating they were punished.  (Someone can enlarge on the reasons why he gave them meat and then punished them.)
    (Numbers 11:31-34) 31 Then a wind from Jehovah sprang up and began driving quail from the sea and causing them to fall around the camp, about a day’s journey on this side and a day’s journey on the other side, all around the camp, and they were about two cubits deep on the ground. 32 So all that day and all night and all the next day, the people stayed up and gathered the quail. No one gathered less than ten hoʹmers, and they kept spreading them all around the camp for themselves. 33 But while the meat was still between their teeth, before it could be chewed, Jehovah’s anger blazed against the people, and Jehovah began striking the people with a very great slaughter. 34 So they gave that place the name Kibʹroth-hat·taʹa·vah, because there they buried the people who showed selfish craving. 
    Let's appreciate the spiritual manna.  Fancy a dish prepared by God himself and people were complaining about it!
    If we were starving and someone gave us plain rice and water,  it would help us to survive, though it might not satisfy us completely. While we are excited about new information, we still need the milk of the word as it would help us to live to salvation. It would help us renew our goals, remind us of what we already know,  and keep us on the path to salvation as the apostle Peter said. We need manna and milk to live, grow and mature.  People would be there who are at different stages of Christian development; some still need milk, some would be there who need solid food, some would be there who need the deeper things of God to satisfy them, but we all need spiritual food.   "Happy are those conscious of their spiritual need". Matt 5:3.
     
    If and when we get into the Kingdom of God, we will be learning about love forever, as there will always be Jehovah, Jesus, and people to love.  Love (Agape) never fails. (1 Cor 13:8)
     
  19. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    .... Just as a point of interest ... if I was a wretched cur, wouldn't my God be the human that fed me, and took me to the Vet?
    Seriously though ... I seem to remember that both Allen Smith and BillyTheKid46 have both alluded in the past to being mentally ill, and castigated those of us (?) who were ridiculing his/their "condition", when in fact I knew nothing about it until he/they brought it up.
    I make jokes about this or that person being mentally off, but then again I make jokes about everything and most of the time it is in jest, and the other person is mock-insulting me right back, which is what guys do.
    I even make disparaging jokes about myself, if I think the jokes work.
    I personally believe that Allen, Billy and Foreigner and perhaps one other are the same person, as a matter if casual speculation .... but perhaps we are making the mistake of assuming that the "Fantastic Four" are mentally competent, and at least marginally sane ... and therefor holding him/them to a higher standard than would be reasonable.
    What disturbs me is when a person that appears to be borderline insane "has" a fantasy .50 caliber BMG sniper rifle, in addition to another possibly fantasy arsenal, and is as insulting and bitter as he/they is/are.
    In 1972 I spent 6 hours in a psych ward from an allergic reaction to a drug I was taking for asthma, as I was delirious, my estranged first wife sent me there after the ambulance rescued me from the asthma .... and I walked around for awhile looking at the "crazy people" in the ward, and decided I had to get out of there quick, or soon I would become like them.
    The "doctor" wanted to keep me for further observation, although I was fine, until I said "You know, of course, that I am not going to pay you.", and I signed myself out.
    The point of this shaggy dog (cur?) story is that interacting with crazy people can make an empathic person just as nutso as they are, and I suppose that is why even psychiatrists have psychiatrists.
    If you get a chance, be sure to see the movie "One Flew Over The Cookoo's Nest", with Jack Nicholson getting electric shock therapy, walking out and winking at the Indian.  That scene was worth the whole movie!
    "Sling Blade" .... was another story!
     
     
  20. Like
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    I think that people were noticing some language issues, and he mentioned dyslexia, hardly in a category of "mental illness."
    But there is good reason for concern, not the least of which is the evidence that not just the three names, but literally more than 30 different names have been used by him. The "projection" and "blame-shifting" and something I'll call "grudge echolalia" seem to come too natural to be faked. And I think several here have suspected certain obsessions and pathological tendencies.
    That said, I think his defense of the WTS is actually sincere.
  21. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    You probably remember the time about 4 years ago, when I first mistook Allen Smith for a disgruntled ex-JW trying to make JWs look bad. At that time I came to the defense of other Witnesses on here (the old jw-archive.org forum at the time) and made it clear that all other Witnesses that I know, or have ever known, weren't at all like him. I certainly hope you not playing a game just to make JWs look bad.
    Then again, you appear to think that my goal is to make JWs look bad, although I would say that I'm pushing for improvements. Even if you can't see a need for any improvements in processes and doctrines, you might still understand why others could want better explanations for certain difficult doctrines, and want more transparency when it comes to certain decisions and policies.
    At any rate, I still find many of your points interesting, especially when you are talking to others here. When you talk to me, however, you seem to give up too easily, avoiding evidence offered, and offering non-responsible material in return. You do yourself no favors by merely lashing out with ad hominem vitriol, because it makes it look like you didn't have anything reasonable to offer.
    For example, I asked:
    You're answer was this:
    Maybe it's just me, but I really can't get the sense of this answer. I can't see how it lets your reasonableness be known to all.
    (Titus 3:2) " . . .  to speak injuriously of no one, not to be quarrelsome, but to be reasonable."
  22. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to Anna in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    Good observation and reminder. I think it's always a good idea to keep in mind the "customs" and general attitude of society in times past when judging a situation from the the perspective of the present. It explains a lot of things. For example we can see why the organization was so weary of certain things in the past, which it now accepts. (organ transplants, vaccinations, cooking with aluminium etc.....etc...) We can also better understand things in the Bible, some of which might sound positively traumatic to the "modern" mind.
  23. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    LOL! You are reverting to the habit Allen Smith was infamous for: trying to use a quotation to prove someone wrong, when that quotation fully supports what you are opposing. It seems like the problem with so many opposers is that they are so anxious to oppose that they are blind to the evidence in front of them, or they forget to look carefully at it.
    You really should just take some time and try to deal with the evidence at hand. So far, you have answered none of the items of evidence raised. And so far, every bit of evidence you have produced is exactly in support of what I have been saying all along. I agree 100 percent with your evidence. As usual, it helps make the same points I already made.
    In this case, of course, you are quoting from the letter from 1914 that Alex Evans (a "colored" brother from Louisiana) wrote to the St. Paul Enterprise newspaper, in defense of Russell personally holding the title of the "faithful and wise servant." It starts about a third of the way down into this link: https://web.archive.org/web/20160722143304/http://www.heraldmag.org/olb/contents/history/st paul defences.htm
    And speaking of opposers, I notice that you have now, on multiple occasions, stated that you believe that Russell actually did hold the office of "faithful and discreet slave."
    Can you explain why you think that Russell was the Faithful and Wise Servant when the Watchtower currently teaches that the slave did not come into existence until 1919 (well after Russell had died in 1916)?
  24. Upvote
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to JW Insider in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    It's easy to misunderstand Russell's position on this parable, but once you learn more about the historical context, it's easier. Above, you have highlighted "fellow-servants". This might imply to some that Russell did not see himself and as that individual servant. Note, though, that D613 is exactly the footnote that the "Divine Purpose" book gave earlier to show how the once-correct view gave way to seeing Russell himself as "that servant." It's called "D" of course, because D is the fourth letter of the alphabet and it's from Studies in the Scriptures Vol. 4, p.613.
    A more careful reading shows that the reason Russell explained the "fellow-servants" was to show how these are plural and yet "that servant" is singular, which to him, he claimed, meant that only one individual would distribute to his fellow servants who would then pass it on to yet others --and therefore, those fellow servants were not the one specially-used individual called "the faithful and wise servant."
    Using the current NWT, Russell's explanation was this:
    (Matthew 24:45) 45 “Who really is the faithful and discreet slave [Charles Taze Russell, individual, singular] whom his master [Jesus Christ] appointed over his domestics, [fellow-servants, plural; fellow distributors of Watch Towers and Studies in the Scriptures books (Millennial Dawn books)], to give them their food at the proper time?
    I'm sure you know that "gentlemen" of the 19th century were famous for "mock humility." It's part of what it meant to be of the "genteel" class, and even the Watch Tower itself praised Russell's "gentlemanly" character. I don't think Russell was exactly like this, but clearly, in keeping with the style of the times, Russell knew that it would not do to just crassly put his own name on this interpretation. A rule of the time was that you get others to praise you; it had to come from the mouth of other people. I don't know if Russell ever had to ask for it, but it was common in the 19th century for a speaker to write up a self-praising introduction about himself for another person to read when introducing him.
    Sometimes this made for some "work-arounds" that appear kind of comical today. For example, from the same book you are quoting (Expanded Biblical Comments), we have this from the parallel parable in Luke:
    [NTC - Luke 12:42]
    . . .
    Who then— . . . the Lord would appoint a servant in the household to bring these matters to the attention of all the servants. R3355:6, 2693:6
    That faithful—. . .
    Wise steward— . . . Not a composite steward, because we are not to recognize a . . . class; and the word "that". . .  implies a particular one. R3356:1 The angel of 1 Kings 19:7, the preparer of the Dawns and Towers. R4211:6*
    Same story, here of course. Woodworth (this book was mostly his doing) had to work with contradictory material in using Russell's "Dawns and Towers," as the view had been adjusted in 1896. (Dawns=Millennial Dawn aka Studies in the Scriptures, and Towers=Zion's Watch Tower and later Watch Towers.)
    But notice that the idea of ONE individual servant brings matters to the attention all the fellow servants, and it can't be a composite steward or "class" but a particular one. It doesn't name "Russell" but does mention the preparer of "Studies in the Scriptures" and the "Watch Tower." 
    I wonder who that could be!
  25. Haha
    ComfortMyPeople reacted to TrueTomHarley in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    This brings to mind when Anna started complaining that I never upvoted anyone, so I searched through her comments and upvoted if she so much as sneezed. 
    In no time at all, I had crashed her computer system.
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