Srecko Sostar

Is 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

despite Isaiah, the true prophet of JHVH, claim???

Yea, Adam is quilty as charged :))) Isaiah 53: 1 "Who has believed our message and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?" On first part of this question we can tell very confidently -- many are believers. (in various messages, hehe) On second ... that is not easy one :))

Thanks for information. But Catholic church is not "only true religion" and their interpretation on Bible are not guided by JHVH :))))))) But what if both religion are in wrong about Isaiah? JW members can not take for granted any of Catholic teachings. Because they are part of Babylon according to WT. On other hand JW members can not be 100% sure in WT explanation also because WT history prove how their interpreting on Bible goes to extremes too. For example. More than 50 years FDS assured members (domestic) how Jesus choose and appointed them in 1919. But they are not, after new "clarification" :)))) So can we trust GB? They teaching cross and Christmas as Bible truth for decades, but not any more. How can such "representative of god" be trustfull? They teached "1914 generation" for decades as "bible based truth" but WHERE is this TRUTH today? :)))) Do not put your trust in earthly man! Even if he has appointed by god! :))

Bible contents various verses and description about some heavenly persons. @DeeDee Terminology that are used in naming person can assure us how Bible speaks only about one person, BUT sometimes the same names, titles are used for somebody else. But this conclusion in my second sentence above can be true or error - IF reader (believer) trusts in one of various concepts, explanations, teachings on issue - Who is God? Somebody believes in three persons who are in one person. Somebody in three persons who are separate but acting as one person. Somebody believes, as JW, in two persons and crude (natural,raw)force. In various WT explanation on various bible verses, as in example of Isaiah chapters 9, 44, 48 (Mighty God, Everlasting Father, //first and last//) they said how this verses describing Jesus Christ the Son of God JHVH. AND about Revelation (Alpha and Omega- first and last) they said how AO is JHVH, despite fact how book of Revelation is about Jesus and his second coming. Rev 1 "I am the Alpha and the Omega," says the Lord God, "who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty." Rev 1 "When I saw Him, I fell at His feet like a dead man And He placed His right hand on me, saying, "Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last, and the living One; and I was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore, and I have the keys of death and of Hades. Rev 21 Then He said to me, "It is done I am the Alpha and the Omega, the beginning and the end I will give to the one who thirsts from the spring of the water of life without cost. "He who overcomes will inherit these things, and I will be his God and he will be My son. (go to Isaiah again) Rev 22 "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end." Old testament and New Testament contents same attributes, names, titles for JHVH and Son ( in concept of JW religion as two different, separate persons with different even opposite attributes) ABOUT John 6 and Father - Son description. What if Jesus in his explanation using only possibility that he can used in/for describing to humans (we "stupid" humans with our own similar or different limited and conceptual prejudices about unknown) about himself. The concept of Father and son is something what is close to humans experience, everyday life, cognitive and intellectual acceptance and more of all religious acceptance. Because it is "normal" that God is immortal and can not dye, but Jesus will die, so he can not be God. Only, just god (small g) or in the best and only option he can be "The Son of God". Which is also blasphemy according to Jew, as we read in Bible, because that can mean how God came from heaven and have wife, and with his wife he have son. And this son became Son of God. See, you have in both examples very questionable issue. With very hard explanation on issue. AS Jew they know about angels came in time of Noah and how their, angels children's also can and was called as "god's sons and daughters", because angels also have title/name "gods". See how was difficult for Jew to accept Jesus as SON OF GOD?! HOW more blasphemy would be if Jesus represent himself as GOD himself and their FATHER as he is (or he is not that) in the book of Isaiah (according to WT, words in Isaiah are about Jesus, he is Everlasting Father and as i recall in WT book Prince of peace, WT called JHVH as grandfather of humankind) When old Jew read this particular verses in Isaiah about "Everlasting Father and Mighty God" and others titles... on whom they think that HE is??? - god Jesus or god JHVH ??

1. i have question about, "on their terms". Do you mean by that "by their own free will"?? My terms means my free will. God gave free will. What is problem with "on their terms"? God gave us intellect to solve problems, with more or less success. :))) Then you immediately continue with sentence about devil influence. 2. i have question on "influence". How some person can detect did influence on him came from devil or from JHVH? Previous was presented various sort of influence from different sources and with different, opposite outcomes. Is it possible to be sure under whose influence some person or group are working? Because JHVH can make good and bad outcome for people. Also Devil can make similar or same outcome. He can present himself as "angel of light" and support "true religion" but in the same time promote his ideas and no one can/would not see that. His primary goal must not be complete destruction of "true religion" but to spoil it. He can do that in some elements of worship or in some "organizational arrangements" on whom people stay blind with no idea how something is wrong. We all pay price for free will. Not only for our own free will. Or free will of our friends, neighbors, brothers....We all pay price on free will of JHVH and angels, and on free will of devil and demons. Yes we all must endure consequences of "general free will concept" :)))))) This idea of free will finally destroy us. In some of my dark days, minutes, or hours :)) i am very sure that Big Powers of Heaven playing their game, and we all are Puppets on the stream.

yes, yes, thanks for correction. All those names , who would know what is right one :)))) as you see, we here have all sorts of examples :))

You sure about this? When JW explaining to other people in preaching, for example,"how is possible that people doing so bad things, as killing in wars, when all people in fact want peace?, then JW provide explanation that all World are under influence of devil. That also means how one person under influence of devil can make also influence on other people and drag them into the violence with or without their deep, inner consent. Ap. Paul was under influence (did he want to renounce, deny Jesus willingly or not??) Do you separate sources of influence on, "earthly sources", and on "heavenly sources"? You said; "No one on earth..." Do you mean by that how people can not make no one else on earth to do something he don't want?? Because in continue you said; .... Does this mean how only good spirits can make people to do something against their will?? You said; " Only JHVH can make people......" But, when god JHVH ask angels who will go.... 20"Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD and said, 'I will entice him.' And the LORD said to him, 'How?' 21"He said, 'I will go and be a deceiving spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.' Then He said, 'You are to entice him and prevail also. Go and do so"- 2. Chron. 18 If you go to other Bible verses you can see how devil and demons can do exactly same thing - deceiving humans. So devil have no such power??? Influence on human. Yes he have. Your statement are contradictory to WT JWorg stand on this issue. More important, comment you gave are opposite to claim how JHVH gave humans "free will" to choose between two or more possibility, circumstances, paths of living. If "free will" is not possible to be always practice - actively or passively by humans - then we have not free will , because you also said how JHVH has done exactly that in some rare occasion. Rare - as 1 in a lifetime - or periodically, if somebody using his power over you to exercise his "free will" over your free will, then in that rare moment you are losing your free will, even for a few seconds in your lifetime. Bible text make your statement questionable. But also history make weak such claim, belief. People can doing something against their will because they can be DECEIVED. If you are deceived then you are doing someone else's will not your. :))) Because you are without your full awareness and consciousness of what is happening in fact. Question of cognitive dissonance is just problem more that can make this situacion harder. But then we are on a doorstep when we are in moment to found the real truth or to go back to the image of the truth.

GB with WT Board of directors are afraid of Fifth Column. But they are already there and works. From the day first when WT has been established.

:)) I apologize, but wish to react on this "fraze", on this "fama" from WT Company. In Prov 4:18 we read this; "The path of the righteous is like the morning sun, shining ever brighter till the full light of day." First of all the main point here is THE PATH and not the light! Path of some person (righteous one) can go in good direction only with help from higher Source (the light aka God and this LIGHT is NOT CHANGEABLE as it is JW light of/on interpretations. Light from god is the same in all stages of the day - no shadows. In literal meaning of Proverbs, daylight gets brighter because of sun. But this light changes his intensity in the same day. Until evening you are in the dark again. In parable (with modern fulfilment on WTBTS inc.) or allegorical meaning picture looks something like this short description ; :))) WT JWorg is the sun (despite the fact that JW members firmly believe how their and WT source of "light" is JHVH ), because WT doctrinal explanation are making full day circle - morning, noon, evening, night. And just as the daylight have all this phases, the same "destiny" WT interpretations have too. In the "morning" some of WT teachings looks like it shows something what promise big hope. In the "noon time" this teaching firmly stand as "the truth based on bible evidence". As daylight lose his power "evening" bring disappointment to JW people (and GB bible scholars too) and through the dark period of night some sleepless people (bible scholars) try hard to see where they made mistake. And after working in the night (without the proper light) they are ready to bring "new light idea" in the "morning" of a new day. :))

This particular scene @Nicole shared, i believe is arranged in advance, flash mob as they called. Empty space for dancers. Or i am wrong - doesn't matter, it is not of big importance, right or wrong conclusion. Another think, about similar scenes on various conventions in last few years. "Happy Bethel" in NY song and dance, cowboy dance or others scenography. What i have noticed is this; in fact JW members not invented nothing new, they just IMITATE so called "worldly" people and their way of fun, joy, entertainment, satisfaction, approval ... and similar. Here we have question. Does worldly people have "wrong" way of entertainment, party, because of only one reason, because they are, in fact "worldly"? :))) In general, according to WT JWorg "worldly" people have not JHVH blessing and approval on anything they doing because devil is their god not JHVH. WT warns for decades about "worldly entertainments", and how JW must have different way to fun, watch how dancing, moving body, what singing, what kind of humor to use and other attempts to regulate this part of human everyday life. If JW people on conventions using same way of making party for fellow believers, as worldly people have too, if JW people imitate worldly way how to make joy and fun and entertain each other - then worldly people are not so wrong in choose how they making fun, dance and sing. Because JW people using the same, similar sort of music, dance and jokes and by that justifies worldly people acts. If it is this way then what makes JWorg different, holier, or separate from the "World" and their inhabitants who are not JW members? Then Why main church body bombing their followers with constant warning to be separate from this "World"? Separate from what, and how - except doctrines of course? :)) Now another picture and way of perception on issue. David (the king) and his "mad" dancing, mad to some people in public. "And David was dancing before the LORD with all his might". -- With all his might! Imagine how must looked his dancing! Does not some modern dances (modern must not be only modern in period of last decade, but far back in past time, 20, 40, 70 years in past) Every older generation are/was, been disgusted, horrored how young people dance and sing. And that is repeating every 10 years. :)))) Imagine dance on kings court in middle age, or in period of baroque .... until today. In some culture and period of time male and female dancer did not had any touch of body or even not with hands, because of moral. Some people would tell how dancing waltz is very moral dance in compare to tango or even some other ballroom dance. So, how JW people today should look on dancing, singing when all older, previous generation will say (where said) how "today youth is without moral"? :))))) Would you as JW dancing like David, with all your might?? on Convention - before the Lord ??? and before bro/sis? :)))) You see what is under the surface? Why JW speak against this world when they are just humans like all other? I have nothing against JW way of creating their traditions and culture or subculture :))) but please, stop preaching against other people and their conduct because they are "worldly" as your publication named them! They are just "worldly", and nothing more. :))

At first short look, lady in blue have two different posture of body, and of course length of skirt of other two lady :)) "Worldly" woman wears trouser , but spiritual sisters wearing skirts :)))

My full quote: "Some JW explanation have better logic than Catholic explanation, but that not must give reason/prove how this "new" JW explanation is truth and will stay truth forever." So, we agree in looking on issue. Some examples of not logical or not biblical would be; celibat, forgiving of sins by priest, using idols in worshiping god, baptism of babies, pope as leader and one who is inerrable.

Mr Cos, please explain me more about these

I thought on people who changed their faith/beliefs, leave parents religion and came to be JW.

Bible reports said about more "active witnesses" than only 12 apostles. One number was 70 who was sent to preaching. Maybe you will find more in reading, this is just my recall in moment. Or perhaps "active" members, publishers became "inactive" as today's elders would be say :)))) Secret location..., well secret for reason of turbulent time and events with Romans. I think this can be main reason for it. And maybe not secrecy but rather discretion in connection to other Jew who are not sympatized "new teachings" and some sort of reformation Jesus introduced. Because celebrating Pasha would not trigger any animosity inside opposition in Jew clergy. Inside "legal" celebration, custom He integrated new meaning.     for sure

That is good because revealing real face and motive of Company.

In period of my leaving this organization i realized that WT (and all other entities under WT, as JWorg, CCJW and all other) are in fact Company with branch companies, branches of Mother Company. That recall me this moment on vine and branches of head vine :))) But in Bible vine is Jesus not Mother Organization aka WT :))) and branches are not registered daughter or sister companies but people.

1. To Society Watch Tower, Watchtower and corporations 2. To Jehovah's Witnesses and all assemblies 3. To all whom this concern Declaration on termination of membership to a religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses I was baptized in 1977 at the age of 17, then a minor. But, in good faith I answered the following two questions just before baptism, which is symbolized my dedication to God in terms of the beliefs of Jehovah's Witnesses religion. At that time (before the change of June 1 1985) questions have read as follows; A) Have you repented of your sins and converted, recognizing yourself before Jehovah God as a condemned sinner who needs salvation, and have you acknowledged to him that this salvation proceeds from him, the Father, through his Son Jesus Christ? B) On the basis of this faith in God and in his provision for salvation, have you dedicated yourself unreservedly to God to do his will henceforth as he reveals it to you through Jesus Christ and through the Bible under the enlightening power of the holy spirit? Since I have over decades closely followed the changes in various aspects of activity of this religion, I noticed some frequent collisions (1 John 4:1; 1 Th 5:21). It is visible in: a) the content of the various interpretations; b) in the theory and practice of action in everyday life issues. Overview of many historical aspects of the spiritual heritage, which the organization has, since its inception in the 19th century, left to its members-followers, and wants to cover it up, revise and incorrect display, is astounding. Who wants to drink a water from a cup in which there is a single drop of dangerous substances? The purpose of my statement is not to explain doctrine and practices of society and the board of directors, who are disturbed my conscience and reasoning within the love, faith, knowledge and understanding that I feel and I have to God and Jesus Christ and to the people, so I will taxatively single out only a few of them (Rom 14:4). These are obvious example, on the one hand, theological acrobatics from the main church body of Jehovah's Witnesses, and on the other hand, their dishonesty and practice in which one they are learns, and other they are works; 1) Confusing conceptions about their own identity (Who shared spiritual food? One servant, all 144 000, a composite body or the governing body ...,) 2) Pragmatism in changing dogmatic interpretations before the change was "firmly biblical established", such as a series of explanations about the "generation" ..., 3) Speculation about the meaning of biblical statements and how they should be understood. More than once the revised interpretation were in style of YES-NO-YES-NO; then this year's "changed approach to the interpretation of reports from the Word of God" ..., 4) Switching of responsibility from the governing body and their representatives on the ordinary believers in respect of the decisions and attitudes that members should be carried out, when it becomes apparent that they were endangered spiritually, mentally and literally health of fellow believers (eg, multiple expectations of Armageddon, Malawi and Mexico of the 1970s, questions about blood, juvenile members / Bulgaria /, neutrality ...,) 5) Co-operation and association with political organizations such as the UN and the OSCE. 6) Increasingly open calls for financial donations and contributions to the funds of the corporation. 7) Careless and unkind treatment of victims of pedophilia within the congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses Regardless of how, as collective or personal, members of the Jehovah's Witnesses will treat me after this letter of resignation, considering the worldwide-known practice of ignoring and avoiding (shunning) that Jehovah's Witnesses apply to all who are outside of their religion ("worldly" people, dissociated and disfellowshipped) - I with fully conscious and reason declare still this; My relationship with the people / persons in the Jehovah's Witness religion and those who are not, is based on the words of Jesus; "Love your neighbor as yourself"; "Love those who hate you"; "Whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them." I expecting from you, that any kind of information which is stored anywhere, in connection with me and has my full name, such as personal files, or any other files you immediately destroy! Zagreb, July 27/2015 Srećko Šoštar ------------- Verified by notary public

... that must not always be the case. People belongings to something are strong force that make them to stick to that what is familiar to them. And because such predestined opinion, standpoint, belif, are not willing to hear nothing different/opposite. I the beginning of WT, Russell and similar people was been able to skip that obstacle, they searching for something "better". Better or not it is for other discussion. They were "reformators". And that is good to the some point. But as we see, all are fall in similar or same trap. They became dogmatic and "force" others to accept same attitude. They force members to accept and believe to dogmatic explanations so far as that same main church body, aka GB in the WT case, not decided to change "the dogma", particular teaching. And then members, who must be followers, are called to reject "preconceived thought" aka belief and to accept new "preconceived thought" aka "new light" as god's revelation to GB aka mediator between god and JW people. Some Catholic, Protestants, Muslim etc embraced JWorg teachings, some not. Were those persons who refused JW explanation "preconceived" ?? Some JW explanation have better logic than Catholic explanation, but that not must give reason/prove how this "new" JW explanation is truth and will stay truth forever. We, who was in JW religion for longer time was been able to compared "evolution" (in whatever direction, good or bad) of WT JWorg teological thoughts and so much wandering. And where they, WT, are now? In the era of free mass communication, people are able to see how this WT Company are not different than some other company, religious, political or marketing company. So, how we should, need to approach to JW religion, to Catholic religion... to Bible?? With how much open mind? With how much preconceived, sceptic or open approach? We have good chance to be deceived or to deceive ourselves by own reasoning. In any way we are losers, of some kind :))) Did old JW was "losers" in some way, despite the fact how they are/was the only one true religion, according to WT JWorg western civilization preconceived thought and belief? If that is so, no matter of changes that later came on Jew scene, are all that Jew nation was not now in JHVH disfavor, according to JWorg? So why all that effort of old Jew and century of beliefs how they are god's chosen nation, when they are not, according to JW org? What if the same thing is also happens with JWorg? Despite the strong self conviction, belief, prejudice of JW clergy and members how they alone are the only true religion? God choose old Jew and rejected them, again according to Christian doctrine, and why would not this same JHVH repeat again the same pattern, choose WT JWorg and after some time reject them? Are JWorg position is so strong and that will not happen to them? What if that already happened? I found how something is wrong with WT and not want to be part of it. I am not "reformator" :)))

That Russian act is more proper and morally justified than of WT when they sell their KH, for money of course too, to some "false religion" church or to some "worldly" business manager. :)) For hospital or some other human, charity purpose is very good. Devil in russian government is not so "evil" as we think before.

hehehe, if WT are so polite, humble, obedient and modest to go extra mile, ...... than why WT Company not produce all documents of paedophilia when Court request it and ordered to do so ?? Hypocrite behaviour. They will do it only if something is for their, WT Company, benefit, and to look holy. :))) By using such "legal" bureaucracy paragraphs to ban other people for free and open reveal of WT Company deeds, they, WT, prove how bad they are!

Nice try, but with no real effect Nana First of all the main point here is THE PATH and not the light! Path of some person (righteous one) can go in good direction only with help from higher Source (the light aka God and this LIGHT is NOT CHANGEABLE  as it is JW light of/on interpretations, This light is the same in all stages of the day - no shadows). In this verses, here, wise man talking about humans path, not God's light. Humans evolution, spiritual progress in righteousness is in fokus. Not progress about doctrines of some religious system. It is about Your/mine personal progress and development  in love, justice, mercy, compassion and such things  -  not in type and antitype interpretations, not about prophecies meaning of some bible books, not about procedures on how to handle organizational issues of WT Company.  Light is from the same source as in the morning and in the middle of the day and in the evening. In verbatim life, sunny light in the morning and in the evening are not sufficient for person to see things in full picture. So, these circle are repeating every single day. Does this mean that JW are living in periods, stages  of morning, day and evening light in circles??? Because literal light have all this stages as Proverbs gives us to conclude. Is it the same with JW spiritual light??  Is it the same with doctrines and interpretations of JWorg? What teaching of JWorg give us assurance that particular teachings are in stage of morning light, and what teachings are in stage of full daylight, and what teachings are now in stage of evening light?? In literal way, translated to you, and in fact asking you or other JW member; "What teaching will come in the future with morning light?? What teaching will stay whole day under full daylight? And what teaching will perished as daylight going down into the evening light or night (or darkness, hehe) ?  Â

Just little more thoughts on "lost persons". Example in Luke 15 about "lost son" and comparison with other illustration/parable of "lost sheep" (coin too) also in Luke 15.. Different way of behaviour, standpoint, interaction, solving "problem". In "sheep issue" shepherd made active concern about his loving sheep. He go to search for lost soul. He noted, first of all, that sheep missing.  (But what if sheep  "missing" while in same time it is in sheep's backyard?). Then he made decision to go for the quest, he made effort searching for traces, determined to find it alive or dead. No matter how long. Active approach. In second parable Father  was waiting that his lost son taste all what he want to taste of this life and to choose is it something that he want or not. (What would be if son had spend his money more cleverly and stay in "world" with own, new created, happy family?)He was not go to search and to "free" his son of bad things or to prevent him of "worldly" experiences and joy or sorrow of "worldly things". No, he leave to his son to decide - to stay out of home or to come back. So, how different way of showing love. How different sort of helping. How different, opposite methods of dealing with something, someone that was "lost". :))  And why Heaven are more pleased and happier with lost "sinner" then with "righteous" who are at home?? Or such conclusion is only for purpose of parable story    Â

http://thinkingwitnesses.org/organisation-sponsored-my-higher-education/ Vincent Joseph Toole, 67, legal counsel for the Australian branch of Jehovah’s Witnesses. Philip Brumley, 59, overseer of the legal department at world headquarters of Jehovah’s Witnesses, was himself a beneficiary of a Watchtower sponsored higher education.