Srecko Sostar

Some commentators lead us to conclude, after showing some historical incidents or accidents in WTJWorg;

-That every good thing that happens to JWs is due to God's blessing and guidance.

-On the other hand, that every bad thing that happens to JWs is a consequence of GB intellect and their overpowering the influence of HS.

Logical right? :))

5 hours ago, Pudgy said:

…. anyone wishing to prove you wrong is a long task, but can do it simply.

Make a list of the actual facts presented that you have downvoted, and count the downvotes.

It’s a sad state when your being proved wrong so many times can be shown to be by your own hand. 

I think the problem is in the spark plug .., or lack of gasoline.

2 hours ago, JW Insider said:

Personally, I absolutely believe the WTS's explanation that it was all about access to the library. Any non-profit organization could already have standard access to the UN library, but the library was also a pre-Internet source of information about past, present and future UN backed seminars and reports, and therefore the advantages of becoming an NGO would have been seen as tempting. Those seminars are related to world health, world crime, religious persecution, holocaust memorials, etc., and are attended by writers, researchers, journalists and other religious and political organizations, too. In fact, the WTS still attends seminars that are backed by UN NGO's because it can help highlight the WTS's own involvement with some of these same issues. 

Paradox. The Israelites of old liked to occasionally seek help from Baal even though they primarily worshiped YHVH.
How can and should information from UN statistics become important for the theology and strengthening of the faith of followers and those who will become followers?

Yes, maybe there is nothing secret about being an NGO, but why was it hidden from the membership? Or to turn the question around; Why wasn't it proudly announced that WTJWorg was a member of the Library and that the supremacy of YHVH over Baal was thereby demonstrated?

13 hours ago, JW Insider said:

The fact that there were tours of the UN doesn't mean anything.

Does this mean that this post from another channel is not a forgery or an exaggeration or a fraud? That the picture and the letter are authentic?

13 hours ago, JW Insider said:

go in to the church.

I remember that even in my time (70s) there were controversies and questions about entering the churches of "Babylon the Great". From the fact that "real Christians" have nothing to look for there, and especially not to listen to their sermons, to the fact that it is just a visit to artistic and historical monuments and that it has no significance. Although, on the other hand, JWs run away from everything that has "pagan origins". It means somewhat contradictory and uneven thinking.

Heretics, schismatics, apostates and other types can be found everywhere.

Of course, this does not mean that they are wrong and the "faithful" members are right.

2 hours ago, Fausto Hoover said:

why not publish all the RNZ claims made by other religions that they focus on?

What is holding you back from publishing the desired information? Is someone forbidding you? No commentators has anything against you posting news about Catholics, Mormons, Adventists, etc.

8 hours ago, Fausto Hoover said:

Does RNZ have information on the number of active pedophiles in other religious institutions and government centers, as well as globally? What about this place?

Who should care what happens in the rest of "Babylon the Great"?

Clean things up in your house, then take care of your neighbors.

Just suggestion  

By the way, RNZ focus is not on WTJWorg only, as you can inform yourself on their web.

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/495727/rnz-investigation-reveals-11-alleged-paedophiles-active-within-the-jehovah-s-witnesses

RNZ investigation reveals 11 alleged paedophiles active within the Jehovah's Witnesses

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/495802/jehovah-s-witness-elder-alleges-order-to-destroy-evidence-in-child-sex-abuse-cases

Jehovah’s Witness elder alleges order to destroy evidence in child sex abuse cases

6 hours ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

The understanding and acceptance of the concept of overlapping generations can vary among different Christian denominations, including Jehovah's Witnesses (JWs). The differences in interpretation can stem from a variety of factors:

1. Interpretation of Scripture: Different Christian denominations may have varying interpretations of biblical passages that are relevant to the concept of overlapping generations. Various theological perspectives and hermeneutical approaches can lead to different conclusions regarding this topic.

2. Doctrinal teachings: Each denomination has its own set of doctrinal beliefs and teachings. These beliefs can shape how they understand and interpret certain biblical concepts. In the case of Jehovah's Witnesses, their unique doctrinal framework emphasizes the significance of the generation that witnessed the events surrounding 1914, which influences their understanding of overlapping generations.

3. Organizational teachings and authority: Christian denominations often have their own organizational structure and leadership, which can influence the dissemination and acceptance of certain teachings. For example, the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses has a central role in interpreting Scripture and disseminating doctrinal teachings to their adherents.

4. Historical and cultural factors: Historical and cultural factors within a denomination can also impact the acceptance or rejection of certain theological ideas. Different denominations may have varying historical backgrounds, traditions, or theological emphases that shape their perspectives on overlapping generations. It is essential to recognize that individual viewpoints can also play a significant role in the acceptance or rejection of this concept, irrespective of denominational affiliations. People's personal beliefs, experiences, and understanding of Scripture can vary, leading to differing conclusions on theological matters.

The reasoning presented here nicely shows that GB's claim that they are led by HS has nothing to do with reality, but is a fantasy of GB and JW members.

Thanks.

1 hour ago, Pudgy said:

A picture is worth a thousand words.

Please consider these as a two thousand word reply.

 

Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food. (The Watchtower February 2017 study edition pg. 26 par. 12)

This could mean;
- that Jesus does not send perfect spiritual food from his heavenly throne
- that GB improvises his interpretations and instructions relying on his own intelligence

What does this mean for JW members? It means that they are led by blind leaders. This in turn means that Jesus' conclusion about blind religious leaders leading their sheep is being fulfilled. In this way, we arrive at the result that the JW sheep may not be the sheep of Jesus but are under the rule of the GB. So they are not in Jesus' fold but Watchtower's.

11 hours ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

Given that Jesus and the apostles were the ones who crafted the New Testament without knowledge of future events, it stands to reason that their understanding would have been incredibly comprehensive.

It is important to approach the interpretation of Bible verses with careful study and consideration of the context in which they were written. Matthew 24:34 can indeed be a challenging verse to understand. In this particular verse, Jesus says, "Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened."Different interpretations exist regarding the meaning of "this generation" in this context. 

I notice a possible problem. You are stating that Jesus had no knowledge of future events, while Jesus is making a claim about the generation in which he says what will happen to it.

Furthermore, Jesus nowhere claims that the future is not unknown to him, he only stated that he knows nothing about "the day and the hour".
But from the further text you wrote about scholars and theologians and "generation", they seem to know more than Jesus, so they are ready to harass their members with spiritual interpretations.

5 hours ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

Dialogue plays a key role in addressing diverse perspectives and promoting understanding, but it is important to ensure that arguments about religion are represented accurately and respectfully. When discussing matters related to religious beliefs, it is essential to approach the topic with care and avoid misrepresenting others' viewpoints.

Sometimes, individuals who have left a religious group or have been disfellowshipped may hold personal opinions that differ from the official stance of the religious organization. It is crucial to recognize that these individuals may approach scripture from their own perspective and interpretations, which can lead to differences in understanding.
 

Different religions or religious groups, large and small, have different views and opinions on theological issues. What is a religion but a system run by leading individuals or united groups, like GB. This actually means that it is about one's own individual or group perspectives and interpretations. Everyone, with more or less success, can refer to the Bible, the Koran, Mao Tse Tung or President Tito.
So, what are the crucial things when it comes to current, future and former members of a religion? These are all performances and litanies religiously and intellectually colored with attempts to exalt one's spirituality. 

Some of them shout about victory and success at the same time, but always and only  remain individuals who are ultimately lost and often in suffering. Man ends his life in his own or other people's illusions.

What do you and/or the Watchtower actually have to offer, when all this has long been invented?

On 8/9/2023 at 10:11 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

That many? That’s worth addressing.

Out of context. 

On 8/9/2023 at 10:11 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

1) Because the complainers against anything always outnumber and are more vocal than those satisfied. It is a basic law of human nature and is seen everywhere.

Excessive description. The majority is silent and suffers, that's why the bad ones succeed.

On 8/9/2023 at 10:11 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

2) Because of the thought expressed at Psalm 130:3. “If errors were what you watch, O Jah, O Jehovah, who could stand?” Watching errors is the modus operendi of today’s culture, typified in its media. Nobody stands as their enemies magnify, enhance, and even concoct evil reports—see it play out on the internet with any public figure. Of course, in addition, to those of a different agenda, everything is an error.

Some say that there is a saying, You learn from mistakes. Then why is it a problem to indicate "errors"? "Errors" brought us to where we are now.

On 8/9/2023 at 10:11 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

3) Because of the sentiment expressed at John 15:18-19. “If the world hates you, you know that it has hated me before it hated you. If you were part of the world, the world would be fond of what is its own. Now because you are no part of the world … on this account the world hates you”.  (John 15:18-19) Of course, just because you are hated does not mean you as a group are Christ’s followers. However, any group NOT universally hated (and the list is not that long) is automatically disqualified from consideration.

‘No part of the world’ will sink you every time in the eyes of those who embrace the world.

Who hates you here? Criticism of your theology is a platform to feel hated?

On 8/9/2023 at 10:11 PM, TrueTomHarley said:

Though I was once active in this open club, I have not been for some time, deferring to the GB’s wishes. (also because it does little good—I have never known any opponent to change) I can’t say I ‘watch’ the contents exJWs provide, for I am invariably put off by how pedantic and boring they are, but through reading I do try to keep up. This is along the lines of Anna, who had a teenaged son and didn’t want to find him one day stumbled by something he had come across and herself powerless to help him because she had no idea what he had come across.

Your choice in this contradicts what you are taught in KH. Some in WTJWorg would call your activity "disobedience to God's authority as manifested through GB and elders". But as far as I'm concerned it's better to know more about your religion than less.

On 8/9/2023 at 6:07 PM, Errikos Tsiamis said:

While it is not necessary to engage in spiritual discussions with former members, it is important for the public to understand the nature and extent of deception, exaggeration, and falsehoods propagated by these individuals who have been expelled from the group.

Former members who have been dismissed from a spiritual group often harbor negative sentiments and may distort the truth. Their motives for spreading misinformation can range from personal grievances to seeking retaliation against the group. Therefore, it is crucial to approach their claims with caution, skepticism, and critical thinking. By gaining awareness of the potential biases and agendas of these individuals, the general public can make informed decisions about the information they encounter. 

It is important to consider multiple perspectives, consult credible sources, and apply discernment when evaluating any claims made by former members. It is also essential to recognize that spiritual matters are deeply personal and subjective experiences. Different individuals may interpret and understand spirituality in different ways. What may be true or meaningful for one person may not resonate with another. Hence, it is crucial to respect the diversity of beliefs and experiences within spiritual communities. 

The path of the Watchtower is a spiritual journey that entails faithfully obeying God and following the teachings and example of Jesus Christ. Watchtower adherents strive to uphold both divine laws, as dictated in the sacred scriptures, and human laws, which are necessary for maintaining order and justice in society. The foundation of this path lies in the sincere devotion and allegiance to God. Watchtower believers seek to develop a deep and personal relationship with the divine, recognizing that God's guidance and authority are paramount in their lives. They are committed to adhering to God's commandments, acknowledging His sovereignty, and realizing that His will should always take precedence. 

Furthermore, walking in the footsteps of Jesus plays a crucial role in the Watchtower philosophy. Jesus, as the perfect embodiment of divine love and wisdom, serves as an exemplar for Watchtower followers. They strive to emulate His teachings, His compassion, and His selflessness. By following Jesus' path, Watchtower adherents aim to deepen their spiritual connection with God and positively impact their relationships with others. In addition to obedience to divine laws, Watchtower followers recognize the importance of respecting and abiding by human laws. They understand that these laws are necessary for maintaining societal order, justice, and the well-being of all individuals. Watchtower adherents strive to be law-abiding citizens, contributing positively to their communities and respecting the governments and institutions that have been established.

Ultimately, the path of the Watchtower encompasses a commitment to faithfully obey both divine and human laws, while following the example of Jesus. It is a journey of seeking spiritual growth, deepening one's relationship with God, and striving to live a life that reflects the principles of love, justice, and harmony.

The lack of regard from former members may seemingly hold no consequence. When it comes to the members of a closed club who choose to support an individual who has been disfellowshipped, their actions are a matter of their own personal relationship with God.
 

The way you describe and defend the Watchtower opens the door to the conclusion that you are not a member of the JW Church, but an advocate or apologist of a JW aka Watchtower religion. 

18 hours ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

On the contrary. It is a rational approach to thinking. The thought process of former members who are part of a cult is undeniably irrational. Those who believe they can single out one religion are particularly susceptible to the influence of Satan.

What is the extent of the harm caused to Jehovah's Witnesses by the rhetoric of former members? How many First Amendment rights have been violated by permitting only former witnesses to speak? 

Please note that the Closed JW Club is half the size of the Open one. Let's ask ourselves why this is so? And how many members from the Closed Club are ready to violate the GB 1st Amendment, which is; don't talk to ex-JWs and don't engage in dialogue with them and don't watch the contents they gave?

This thread has 4.1k views. Apart from the few of us who are in the polemic, Who are the other people who viewed the content?

Your last question is super funny.

JW member's way of thinking:

All religions of the world, except the JW religion, are ungodly and under Satan rule. All world governments are evil under the influence of Satan. So, every evil and injustice (CSA also) that happens to them there is because their minds are in the dark under satanic influence.
If something like this is happening in the only JW true religion then it is because the JW members are imperfect people. In the JW true religion, the evil that sometimes happens, happens because some JW member has become spiritually weak, and that's it. Satan has no influence over JW Christians because they are in a spiritual paradise that is protected. We are protected spiritually but not physically. Physical protection of JW members is the responsibility of the police and secular authorities (Richard Ashe deposition).

Decision Charity Inquiry: Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Britain

4 August 2023

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/charity-inquiry-watch-tower-bible-and-tract-society-of-britain/charity-inquiry-watch-tower-bible-and-tract-society-of-britain#contents

..,

Though not disclosed to the inquiry this information was disclosed to IICSA by CCJW (not the charity), as part of its thematic strand on child abuse in religious settings. The report states that JW records show that allegations concerning 67 individuals were reported to their Branch Office within the previous 10 years. This included 25 allegations against Elders, 32 allegations against ministerial servants and 10 people accused of abuse within an institutional context (such as abuse at a place of worship by a congregant or non-Jehovah’s Witness)

..,

1 hour ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

Is it possible that your interpretation is incorrect, considering that the Watchtower asserts itself as the organization that faithfully follows the teachings of Jesus and the commands of God, as guided by the principles established in the first century? Which other Christian sect passionately adheres to these standards, which include not engaging in killing, fornication, adultery, immoral acts, and so forth?

Do those other sects discipline their members?

Many can assert themselves in various forms and claim whatever they want about themselves. Among other things, they can claim that Jesus chose them in 1919 to be his "chosen ones". At the same time, they can lead a multinational company "following the example of Jesus" in same manner? And asking followers to sign a "vow of poverty"? Should that be proof to someone that they are "chosen" and that they have "received the spirit"?

For many it is doctrinal nonsense.  

1 hour ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

Does this have negative implications for you?

We discussing WTJWorg, not me.

1 hour ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

Your focus was on the destruction of data, rather than its collection. You have the capability to discern the distinction using your own words.

Collecting and destroying is part  of one and same process.

1 hour ago, Errikos Tsiamis said:

I don't remember the Org ever suggesting that the Holy Spirit ceased its work in the first century. If I understand correctly, you are implying that the interpretation of Jesus' words could potentially be false. Can you explain why?

Please read WT publications again.

GB is in focus not Jesus.