Srecko Sostar

Yes, good evidence/proof that there is only "one law" (moral code or sense for justice) for angels and human.

No word problems. I agree that we can find a terminological and practical difference in - a different law and a special law. But I would like to continue commenting on "different" laws. There is even a difference between the law for Adam and Eve and the law for their offspring regarding sin. Adam and Eve sinned (disobedience to God) and according to the WTJWorg interpretation have no cover through Jesus ’sacrifice. People after them commit the same kind of sin but have cover through Jesus ’ransom. Thus, the application of the “same law” is applied differently with respect to offenders and their circumstances. It is certainly an interesting legal moment.

It was just a moment of weakness. :))) Yes, but a burning bush, a donkey, a voice from heaven do not support the claim/view as sort of rule. JWs who say that they are part of 144000 believe they will be sort of spiritual creatures similar to angels but much higher in position. Sort of transformation from human to angels?

Well, of course, Thinking's thesis about a special law for angels, and a special one for people, is not probable. Because both types of creatures have free will, and they interact with each other according to Bible text. It is this/those characteristic that connects them more than anything else (life form, place of life and abilities) separates them.

I don’t understand how a prophetic book can explain legislative topics. Ezekiel is a book that contains visions, prophecies, and hopes for the restoration of worship of God, according to your publication: TEACHING BOX 1B An Overview of Ezekiel

@Thinking mentions two separate laws in the universe. One for angels in heaven, the other for people on this planet. If we go this way of thinking, then the logic of one sacrifice of Christ for the whole Universe should not be the final thesis. God can create various forms of life according to different criteria or laws of existence and interaction. Well on the this planet itself there is a visible difference about different laws in one place. God gave to animal species to devour each other, even within the same species. It is a "law" for them. But we do not see that it is permissible for a man to eat a man. If the existence of different laws is present on only one planet, why should we be limited by the idea of one Universal Sacrifice that arose because of one situation on Earth? In addition, if there is another civilization that was created by the creative act of one and the same Creator, this Earth civilization does not know about the other and vice versa, so the idea of applying Christ's sacrifice for unknown civilization somewhere in space is unclear. If another civilization was created with a different (or even same) intention, purpose or idea of the Creator, I don't see sense in the universality of Christ’s sacrifice. Jesus came on this planet for this humankind for one act of Adam and Eve in the past.

Maybe it makes sense. But then we wonder, if some action is a sin in one group?.... and the same action in another group is not a sin? What two different laws are you actually talking about? Where does the Bible list them?

Although it was not my intention when using the word "saints" (holy ones), one of Dmitri's comments encouraged me (inspired :))) to comment further now. “Saints” have come to this status in the past through anointing with/by the Spirit. Today’s “anointed” come to their status as they take symbols of bread and wine. And some others sort of "anointed" people (elders) in WTJWorg are set/install by GB.

I thought it (this verse) was about if you wanted to jump from 100 meters and tell God, now save me if you're powerful. It seems to me that this could be related to the idea that "God allows evil". If he allows it to happen everywhere and towards everyone and from everyone then it might be clear to you why caution is in place.

Dear Thinking, if this is the case with me then in my defense I can say that I am neither the first nor the last to whom this has happened. And, smarter heads than mine made far bigger misinterpretations.

Please define what the phrase "reading the Bible" means to you in the context of the name Srećko? In what way do I claim, “I read the Bible”? I don’t read the Bible every day, or occasionally. When I refer to a biblical passage or report I do so from memory or go to a book or google to see where it is and what it says. So your claim, that I claim to be reading the Bible, is not provable, it is just your opinion.

Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to determine if they are from God,... - 1 John 4:1 God is spirit, demons are spirits, WTJWorg are spirit guided organization, Bible is inspired by spirit, human also have spirit. All of this numbered are connected to "spirit". What is wrong to put all sorts of this spirits to challenge, to test?

It is reminiscent of Russell's time, when assemblies elected their own elders. I have nothing against it.

That's fine with me. We disagree on many things, but I appreciate your intention. Yes I saw the comments. Prohibition is nonsense. If I see you driving drunk then you should definitely be banned from driving. SM? Ahhh. I was here. Do you/what you expected from me to do about that?

Here's how I see the content of the quotes you cited. The trial should be conducted only by "saints". Are there enough "saints"? Who declares someone as "saint"? Is there a numerical limit to the number of people who can be “saints”? WTJWorg has doctrines, with which it would be difficult to solve these dilemmas. It is hypocritical of the Organization that male “saints” have the right to act as “kings and priests” already today, in a world where the Kingdom of Christ does not rule. Admittedly, WTJWorg believes that the Kingdom still rules over the Earth through the Organization. If so then female “saints” should have the same role as their male counterparts. Or maybe the solution is to change gender/sex to male with the help of surgery?

So we have a scenario like this: Adam and Eve are perfect. Angel xy is perfect. Adam and Eve sinned (as perfect individuals) and were punished for slowly aging, getting sick, and dying. Angel xy sins (as perfect individual) but does not punished to grow old, does not get sick and does not die. What's this all about? -Are there two or more kinds of "perfection"? -Isn't the punishment for sin death? -Does the Bible promote the postponement of the death penalty for sin? -In both cases, is it not disobedience that should be punished by death? -Why didn't Moses get the inspiration to tell us in writing whether God warned / informed the angels during the creation of the angels that they would be punished by death or that there might not be such punishments for them? In the Bible, God has written that the impunity of the guilty causes the guilty to continue to do evil and that evil will therefore spread more easily and quickly and prevail over the good. What message did God send to men, and what to angels when God immediately expelled the first people from Paradise and left Satan in his Perfect Family in heaven?

I don’t understand why you oppose the idea of women (JW women) participating in the survey and judicial process? WTJWorg tries to retain the right of men to be spiritual leaders and to govern the Words of the Bible based on some biblical passages. But on the basis of which biblical passages can women be forbidden to participate in investigative / forensic and judicial proceedings when it comes to CRIME? Or is it about SPIRITUAL CRIME when it comes to CSA and other abuses? Absurdity.

No, but you do promote there should be no leaders, or that everyone should be their own leader, like @Witness? Just like she confuses the word "oneness" so do you. 😏 So isn't SM promoting the same/similar, because from what he has written about himself so far, it could be concluded that his non-belonging to the "church" expresses independence from any established religious system. He advocates exclusivity for the Order based on Scripture. But he excludes his affiliation with the church/churches. Although every (christian) church is called to exist on the foundations of the Order of the Bible (Christian Order)

Agree, however, in our institution, there is no such thing. Unity in Christ is appliable by Christ instruction and God's command. Therefore, there are no divisions or different churches among our ranks. You seem to have shown SM what is, how it looks and where he can find the true and real Christian Order.

I’m glad you’re talking about the perfection of people who are “imperfect”. Interestingly, the word “imperfect,” as far as I have seen, is not found in the Bible at all. But we can find the term “perfect” that binds not only to God but also applies to humans. Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete (perfect), go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.” - Mat 19:21 Therefore you are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. - Mat 5:48 And let endurance have its perfect result, so that you may be perfect and complete, lacking in nothing. - James 1:4 For by one offering He has perfected for all time those who are sanctified. - Heb 10:14 All these being men of war, who could order the battle array, came with a perfect heart to Hebron, to make David king over all Israel: and all the rest also of Israel were of one heart to make David king. - 1. Chronicles 12:38 With the merciful you will show yourself merciful. With the perfect man you will show yourself perfect. - 2. Samuel 22:26 God is my strong fortress. He makes my way perfect. - 2. Samuel 22:23 etc. We need to start dealing with different terminological terms when describing and analyzing our own and others ’actions/words. We must stop claiming that we know the difference between a perfect man and an imperfect man. If we are imperfect as we are, on what basis do we know what is like and what is the difference from the perfect? Based on speculation and interpretation, obviously.

One should always appreciate and believe in the honesty and integrity of other people. It is commendable that JW have faith that GB wants to be fair and honest. Other people outside the JW community need to be able to understand that JW members want to trust their leaders and consider them honest. It is a good quality in any interpersonal relationship that enables success. I think the problem is in withdrawing the thesis that equates (human) perfection with infallibility. It's not quite the same. The best examples of this are Adam and Eve. Perfect people, but that didn't save them from making a fatal mistake. Invoking imperfection, over and over again when something is said and done wrong, becomes meaningless because the state of "imperfection" becomes a tool to justify and excuse one's own inability to do something with the least bad consequences. GB uses such a tool to justify his own misguided guidelines that they worked for in the name of God. Therein lies their guilt. If they had said clearly and loudly that they have an opinion and belief about a doctrine that is such because it seems to them most accurate, then they could rightly invoke imperfection, so they were mistaken. But when they claim that doctrines are the only and unique truth because they come from God, then all subsequent wisdom, they later show, makes no sense.

It is with such things that GB juggles. They claim how they are not inspired by spirit and they are not infallible but they are guided by the spirit, ............. so it is a guarantee that they can be given complete trust. :))

This is completely irrelevant to me, regarding what is important to me given the comment made. What kind/sort of Unitarian you are or to what denomination you belong or not belong, that is important only to you dear SM.

Excellent observation! SM so strongly advocates a specific Christian Order, but is not prepared to act within the specific Order of the Unitarian Church or here within the Order of JW Church. Both churches are Christian churches. Are JWs in America back on the 'door to door' work now ? Space Merchant replied to Patiently waiting for Truth's topic in Jehovah’s Witnesses's Topics ...I am a Biblical Unitarian Christian yes, however I am not of the Unitarian Church.