Srecko Sostar

In addition to the description of the child Jesus as a kind of "publisher" according to the context of WTJWorg, I note that the "predecessor" of Jesus, later known as "John the Baptist" was not "preaching active" as a child. Does it have some significance? Apart from that, I don't remember that there are examples from the Christian life of the community of believers in the NT that would provide proof that their children (minors) in the 1st century were "unbaptized publishers".

Whose movies are better in your opinion, JWs or Mormons?

lol Good. So which Jesus are we talking about? The one who is 12 years old or the one who is 30+?

@George88 Jesus was not baptized at the age of 12. Jesus at that age was not in any conflict with the Jewish elders.

What is the biblical basis for the existence of the status called "unbaptized publisher"? This is how it is explained in the JW cartoon. Of course, some elements in this interpretation are outdated doctrine that is no longer valid. If we exclude the "small unimportant detail" that "hours no longer count", the question still remains: Did Jesus become an "unbaptized preacher at the age of 12"? And if so, how? Key words in this video are: license, approved, elders, desire to be JW = unbaptized publisher. Are those words in Bible, too? pk_E_048_r720P.mp4

I believe that the "Jews congregational activity" expressed by the term "preaching", as it understand by JWs administrative and organizational "humanitarian-work program" today, is something that did not exist when Jesus was 12 years old. According to your understanding, was Jesus an "unbaptized preacher" at the age of 12? And did the Jewish elders give him the consent like today's JW elders? I ask this because WTJWorg says the Bible gives them instructions on how to run the congregation. Where in the Bible is there a clearly explained model of conduct by which a person today, inside JWs or outside JWs, can be called an "unbaptized preacher"?

Regardless of some theological elements associated with Jesus' baptism, because he was "perfect" and came from "Heaven", it still remains as a powerful reminder of the fact that he was baptized at the age of 30. All the theology of the WTJWorg fails in every element about baptism, because it dared to depart from the path given by Jesus as the only correct MODEL of when to be baptized. If he was baptized as a "perfect man" at the age of 30, how old should an "imperfect man" be before he decides to take such a step of complete dedication to a religion and ideology (which changes more and more anyway, because it has been proven fallible and inaccurate). Caught in their "own wisdom", GB misdirected and allowed their lawyers to refer and appeal to the UN Charter on Human Rights. Because UN rights have never been theologically justified for the functioning of the WTJWorg administration and their "theocratic and hierarchical system" in which a man (male) rules. WTJWorg's reference to UN rights has only one-sided meaning; "acknowledge, admit my JW religion and leave me and my sort of worship alone". Having the freedom to stop being Catholic and become a JW is a welcome human right for GB. But when a JW needs the freedom to change his religion and become something else, then WTJWorg wants to abolish all his right to freedom of choice, because it blackmails him with its "theological and doctrinal dictatorship".

google Translation of the verdict https://drive.google.com/file/d/13g-lcV2r67Z0Q6l1CKeYdaYMlHwY7eK4/view?pli=1

Update: The Norwegian court ruled in favor of the Norwegian state. Will the JWs complain? They mostly complain about unfavorable judgments. Video with one of the ex-Jew participants in the process.

I would expect a "perfect" person to understand the people around him better than an "imperfect" person can. Or?

Do you have some individuals or a certain group in mind as such who faithfully follow "God's commandments"?

No, I don't suggesting nothing/anything, i just say how it is good to remove this privilege from clergy.

Considering the victims who have lived through hardships at the hands of the clergy, it is a good move to remove this privilege for such things/reasons.

You're making claims I didn't make. But if you want, I'll answer the question. If Jesus felt like Paul, who said that he "was everything to everyone", then Jesus could also identify himself with everyone else in his society.

Are you so sure of yourself (and own reading of the Bible) so you equate "the righteous" with "membership in the JWs religion"?

If humanity has been "alienated from God" since the fall of Adam and Eve and if this world is "ruled by Satan", then there is no "Biblical chronology" od "God's chronology" but only "Satanic chronology". lol

Isn't the WTJWorg "system" also "evil" in some of its elements? WTJWorg religious leaders claim that they are imperfect and make mistakes. They admit that among JWs there are those who are not well-intentioned. They confirm this with biblical passages that "prophesy" that there will be "wolves" among themselves and that these "wolves" still exist today and that they will be there until the "end of the world". So within the WTJWorg system there is a parallel world ruled by "evil". So how are you different from the rest of the "evil world"? You are actually a greater danger to those naive and innocent who are part of the JWs community, who believe they have found "protection" within the WTJWorg.

1. The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms guarantee the rights and freedoms set out in it subject only to such reasonable limits prescribed by law as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society. - https://www.bccourts.ca/jdb-txt/sc/24/00/2024BCSC0027.htm It is amusing to observe WTJWorg doing "global and international educational work" in which it announces the destruction of all forms of government and social systems, including this democratic one in Canada, because as they say, it is under the "rule of Satan". JWs appeal to all the human rights that come from that same "secular and democratic society". It was the "democratic society" that managed to develop into this kind of libertarian society not thanks to JWs and WTJWorg, but to people with libertarian ideas, who were or were not religious. So the WTJWorg "theocratic society" is at an "advantage" over any democratic society. Under the rule of WTJWorg there is no free criticism or freedom of thought and religion. Because anyone who opposes the hierarchically established doctrine and dogma of the JWs religious leaders deserves to be excommunicated and rejected from society. In the extreme reaches of JWs theology, all such deserve to die in Armageddon, and also in the New World, according to their preaching. Today, everyone who is not on the WTJWorg line can thank "Satan and his democratic society" for being alive at all, because according to JWs religious belief they should be "removed" from the Earth.

From your comments, one would conclude that ex-Jws members are so powerful that they have no equal. lol Which is so religiously important and religiously inappropriate, unacceptable in the JWs religion that it is a problem for them to send a few sheets of paper (if there are even that many) about 2 former members? quote from https://www.bccourts.ca/jdb-txt/sc/24/00/2024BCSC0027.htm: [1] This is a judicial review of an order made by British Columbia’s Office of the Information and Privacy Commissioner (“OIPC” and/or “Commissioner”). Two former members of the Jehovah's Witnesses each sought disclosure from their former congregations of all records that include their personal information. The elders of the congregations refused, arguing that disclosure of confidential religious notes would be contrary to their religious beliefs. [3] The petitioners in this case are two elders, John Vabuolas and Paul Sidhu, Grand Forks Congregation of Johavah’s Witnesses, Coldstream Congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses, and the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of Canada. Together they argue that they should not be compelled to turn over their records to the adjudicator because PIPA infringes on their religious freedoms which are protected under s. 2(a) of the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms [Charter]. They argue on this judicial review and constitutional challenge that PIPA is unconstitutional.

It is interesting to hear Georg's assertion that any "worldly idea" that differs in some way or shape from WTJWorg theology, and if accepted by any JWs or ex-JWs, begins to be considered "apostate". So, as long as some "worldly" claim exists only in the world and in the minds of "worldly" people, then it is only part of the "world apart from God" and does not pose a direct danger to JWs. The moment that same claim starts to be the reason for some JWs or ex-JWs to look critically at WTJWorg, then by some unknown miracle such, until then almost marginal claim that normally lives outside the "spiritual paradise", becomes the most dangerous thing for every devoted JW. We do not find examples of this only in connection with such a disputed chronology represented by WTJWorg. Examples are found in every part of human activity. WTJWorg knows more not only about history but also about medicine, education, space, psychology, women and children. When "WTJWorg theorists" find themselves in a dead end, they simply justify their stupidity with phrases; "We are imperfect", "We do not know", "God is not obliged to explain his decisions to us" and similar nonsense. JWs, generally, drink such an approach to explaining existing dilemmas, like water from a poisoned well of GB incompetence.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-jehovahs-witness-privacy-battle-1.7079252 The B.C. Supreme Court has ruled against two congregations of Jehovah's Witnesses that tried to argue their religious freedoms were infringed when the information and privacy commissioner ordered them to turn over records containing personal information about two former members. On Monday, Justice Steven Wilson upheld an order requiring the Coldstream and Grand Forks congregations to disclose records concerning the ex-members' breaks with the church to the Office of the Information and Privacy Commissioner (OIPC). The Jehovah's Witnesses had argued that the sealed records contain confidential religious discussions between church elders about membership matters, and releasing them would violate their rights under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. But the judge disagreed, saying that any violation of the congregations' religious freedoms in this case was reasonably justifiable in a free, democratic society. "While production of the disputed records to the commissioner is not an insubstantial breach of the congregation elders' right to religious freedom under s. 2(a) of the Charter, it nonetheless furthers the interests of society as a whole by ensuring access to their personal information," Wilson wrote. He pointed out that the order did not require the congregations to release the records to the former members who'd requested them, but only to the OIPC to determine whether they should be released under the Personal Information Protection Act. The law regulates the collection, use and disclosure of personal information by private organizations like churches. The judge said the duties to disclose imposed by the law are meant to give British Columbians some measure of control over their personal information. "The requirement to disclose information is a tool available to individuals to hold organizations accountable for the collection, use, and disclosure of personal information. It also serves as a deterrent to misuse and allows individuals some measure of control over their personal information," Wilson wrote. The B.C. Humanist Association intervened in the case, and is applauding the outcome. "An individual's right to privacy is crucial. We're pleased to see the court recognize the importance of upholding that right," the organization's executive director, Ian Bushfield, said in a news release. The original requests for information came from Gabriel Liberty Wall, who used to belong to the congregation in Grand Forks, and Gregory Lyle Westgarde, who was part of the Coldstream congregation, according to the judgment. The two men independently asked the congregations for records containing their personal information in 2020, and both were told they could not see documents concerning their disassociation from the Jehovah's Witnesses. Wall and Westgarde turned to the OIPC, but the congregations told an adjudicator that the record at issue was "a confidential religious summary prepared by a committee of three congregation elders pertaining to spiritual status decisions," the judgment says. In June 2022, the OIPC adjudicator ordered the congregations to turn over their records for review. They in turn filed a petition for judicial review, alleging that the Personal Information Protection Act is unconstitutional. The church argued that religion should be included in an exemption to the act that says organizations are not required to disclose someone's personal information to them if it has been collected solely for journalistic, artistic or literary purposes. The judge described that as a bridge too far. "Reading in such an exemption would significantly compromise the government's objective in giving individuals the ability to control their personal information," Wilson wrote. He pointed out that even under the current exemption, the privacy commissioner still has the power to review the requested information to see if it truly was collected only for the purpose of journalism, art or literature. The Jehovah's Witnesses had also argued that if the documents were disclosed, they might be published more widely "for the purposes of mocking either the petitioners or elders, causing unnecessary embarrassment." Wilson countered that as long as the documents remain secret, "the concerns are impossible to assess because the record is incomplete." Comment about quote: The church argued that religion should be included in an exemption to the act that says organizations are not required to disclose someone's personal information to them if it has been collected solely for journalistic, artistic or literary purposes. WTJWorg and JWs congregations do not engage in "journalism, art and literature". They are run as a religious non-profit organization whose primary mission is "to spread Christianity within the JWs belief system". As part of this and such activities, they are engaged in publishing activities on paper and digitally. "Confidential writings" regarding the "spiritual events, condition and status" of these members are partly publicly known in situations where these members are publicly reprimanded or excommunicated. Why do we say that information is partially known? Because they contradict Jesus' instructions in Matthew 18. The congregation was not informed what is the "sin" and why a member was/should be reprimanded or expelled. The "sin of the member" is not publicly known, but the information about it must be given only to the elders who will investigate the matter and, if necessary, form a "Judicial Commission". According to Jesus, the "church/congregation" should participate in this process, and not one, two or three elders. JWs elders under the auspices of WTJWorg continue to deceive the courts and the public.

Partially agree, but the proverb says; "old joke, new fool". lol

A little break for a joke. A Trump supporter was seated next to an older woman on an airplane and he turned to her and said, “Do you want to talk? Flights go quicker if you strike up a conversation with your fellow passenger.” The old woman, who had just started to read her book, replied to the total stranger: “What would you want to talk about?” “Oh, I don’t know,” said the man. “How about how they stole the election in 2020 and Donald Trump should be president.” “Okay,” she said. “Those could be interesting topics but let me ask you a question first. A horse, a cow, and a deer all eat the same stuff – grass. Yet a deer excretes little pellets, while a cow turns out a flat patty, but a horse produces clumps. Why do you suppose that is?” The man, visibly surprised by the old woman’s, thinks about it and says, “Hmmm, I have no idea.” To which the old woman replies, “Do you really feel qualified to discuss politics, when you don’t know shit?”

Children, like adults, can be wise and foolish (smart and stupid). Children, like adults, can be good and bad. Children, like adults, can be empathetic and abusive. In Jesus' time, "children" could "understand" Jesus' teaching, because his theology did not consist of type and antitype models. His theology did not include interpretations that would change because they would prove to be wrong. His theology was not like that of Russell, Rutherford and GB. His theology "revealed hidden things" that religious leaders obscured with their failed interpretations and ulterior motives. If today's religious leaders would like to teach people like Jesus, then they themselves must be/become "like children". Because a "child" will understand another "child". As long as religious leaders strive to be "mature, wise and spiritual" as expected of "adults" in the context and standard set by those same religious leaders, then they will not be able to come close to the example of Jesus. Did Jesus idealize things with his statement and comparison? Maybe. But with such a statement he did not say that only "worldly people" or members of "Babylon the Great", i.e. those who do not believe in Him in the "right way" will be such "wise and intellectual" and therefore unacceptable to God. This is often the only explanation WTJWorg has when using this Bible quote. WTJWorg thinks of itself and its members as "children" who are "humble" to understand every thing in the Bible. Unfortunately for all JWs, this boasted attitude is proving to be false. They have been caught many times in the trap of "their own wisdom and intellect".