Srecko Sostar
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Posts posted by Srecko Sostar
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36 minutes ago, AlanF said:
Awake! March 8, 1983, pp. 14-15, commenting on the 1981-1982 "scientific creationism" trial in Little Rock, Arkansas:
<< Their teaching that the earth and even the universe are less than 10,000 years old contradicts all the findings of modern science. They are so far out of step that they invite ridicule from scientists. . . The time to build mountains and wear them down is measured in millions of years. For continents to drift apart and form oceans takes hundreds of millions of years. To say that all of this goes back only 10,000 years is simply absurd in the eyes of geologists. . .
Didn't Arauna comment that the Supercontinent (Pangea) disintegrated in the Flood? And how new configuration of land with highest mountains are built?
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44 minutes ago, Matthew9969 said:
The jw's are so secretive and subversive it'd be hard to speculate how far they would go with their security, I can imagine though they have a lot of camera's covering every square inch of the place.
They could hire a security guard whose conscience allows the use of weapons. WT Lawyers and Legal Department for sure can justifies that.
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1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:
extraterrestrial life
According to the Bible, extraterrestrial life not only exists but exists in abundance.......
The Bible indicates that it is very unlikely that God at this point has created intelligent physical creatures on any planets other than our own.....
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/101990244
Here we have opinions, .... "guided by spirit" of course. :))
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13 minutes ago, 4Jah2me said:
bunkers
In some countries, building regulations may require that a shelter be built inside a new building.
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4 hours ago, Arauna said:
There is more than enough geological evidence. The flood was a very violent event as I said before. Everything on earth was destroyed. Most of the dinosaurs were deposited in graveyards hundred of miles long which were gullies. The water pushed the dinosaurs into gullies. .... and it was adults which were buried. Most adult animals had lost their babies along the way of running to higher ground as the water moved in.
All over the world the deposits of dinosaurs are found in long gullies - china, USA etc. Most of these animals are also in positions which show that they were dumped there in violence on top of one another. Their bodies often in twisted shapes.
There is much more evidence but if one only reads literature that proves the opposite - that is what you will believe.
The catastrophic destruction of men and animals by an overwhelming flood in the days of Noah, 2370 B.C.E. -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200001150
According to WTJWorg and your explanation, Noah and his family and many other people of his time lived together with dinosaurs, tyrannosaurus and many other prehistorical animals??
That would mean how God decide to destroy some sort of animals and to save other species. But how that is in harmony that all animals God created was good? So, dinosaurs didn't make God fell happy anymore, but he stayed good with crocodiles? :))
Fossils and deposits of dead animals speaks about past time, but dinosaurs and similar species are much much older then 4390 years.
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6 minutes ago, Arauna said:
Lol - that is my turf. My eyes are so bad I cannot do the research like I used to..... I write from memory alone.
Yes, with ages our sight getting weak.
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2 minutes ago, Arauna said:
No - but we know that they may have come from across the Mediterranean because Egypt was known as a bread basket. Rome later on got their wheat from Egypt. Jacob came from Canaan for wheat on more than one occasion.
Thanks. It can be that such words, narrative in Bible about Flood not necessary have literal meaning of Whole Planet Earth, as in case of Joseph and Famine where word "earth" definitely is not about Whole Planet Earth.
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2 hours ago, AlanF said:
After all, didn't just one angel kill 185,000 Assyrians in one night? Why wipe out everything?
If humans are incorrigible, what do animals have to do with it? The destruction of "evil animals" that were herbivores ... and some of them became carnivores after they came out of the Ark? :))
I am of opinion how that was local flood that affected all people and animals of that particular earth where Noah lived.
... earth was corrupt in God’s sight - Gen 6. Here we see expression tat is not literal. Earth can not be corrupt but people are what God have in mind. In Joseph's days and famine Bible text say: .
Moreover, people of all the earth came to Egypt to buy from Joseph, because the famine had a strong grip on all the earth- Gen 41
Do you really think how people from China, India, North America, Africa, Australia etc. came to Egypt to buy grain?
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47 minutes ago, César Chávez said:
Srecko, LEARN! About what you are up voting, you are now looking stupid!
Looking? Perhaps depends on your glasses :))
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4 hours ago, Anna said:
The only way anything to do with the flood and the aftermath is possible, is that supernatural powers had to be involved.
The only way is ... faith. If you have faith than all sorts of explanations that WTJWorg thinks they have to put in print or on JWTV it all becomes unnecessary. Saving money and energy invested in all such material things (Gilead schools, congresses, seminars, etc.) would be significant. Because why waste time proving something for which “faith” is quite enough. :))
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Are koalas clean or unclean animals?
But more important questions are:
How did seven pairs of koalas (or two pairs) travel from Mount Ararat to Australia? And what did they eat along the way? It is very picky in food and eats only the leaves of certain species of eucalyptus. For Koala this is actually the only food and survives, as well as two species of opossum , exclusively feeding on this plant. Koalas consume up to 400 grams (14 oz) of leaves a day.
"Polar bear", who was not polar bear in pre-Flood time ..., Why and how did the "polar" bear leave Ararat to live at the North Pole, when they had never seen snow and ice? When did he change the color of his fur?
Did fecal gases harm human and animal health in period of 1 year captivity of Ark? Where did Noah throw the animal and human feces in that 1 year period?
..... and so on and so on?
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On 12/31/2020 at 5:56 PM, Arauna said:
I have, and I have come to the conclusion that the earth-wide flood is responsible for the layers we see on earth today.... and the movement of Pangea as it is today. There is a model which explains much of it. The flood was a destructive event with tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanos erupting and major movement of Teutonic plates
Pangea, also spelled Pangaea, in early geologic time, a supercontinent that incorporated almost all the landmasses on Earth......Geologic time, the extensive interval of time occupied by the geologic history of Earth. Formal geologic time begins at the start of the Archean Eon (4.0 billion to 2.5 billion years ago) and continues to the present day. Modern geologic time scales additionally often include the Hadean Eon, which is an informal interval that extends from about 4.6 billion years ago (corresponding to Earth’s initial formation) to 4.0 billion years ago. - https://www.britannica.com/place/Pangea https://www.britannica.com/science/geologic-time
This explains why ocean floor rocks are generally less than 200 million years old whereas the oldest continental rocks are more than 4 billion years old. - https://www.britannica.com/science/plate-tectonics/Seafloor-spreading
According to Britannica, and to my understanding of these information, Creation Days according to WTJWorg lasted very short compared to the millions of years described by Britannica. General attitude about length of 1 Creative Day is about 7000 years in WTJWorg publications. By that JW members are misinformed by WTJWorg about history of Earth and Life on Earth.
Pangea was surrounded by a global ocean called Panthalassa, and it was fully assembled by the Early Permian Epoch (some 299 million to 273 million years ago).
And God said, “Let the water under the sky be gathered to one place, and let dry ground appear.” And it was so. God called the dry ground “land,” and the gathered waters he called “seas.” And God saw that it was good.
In this Bible verses i see similarity about "Pangea", you speaking about, and "dry ground". Also about "gathered waters". Bible said how in Day 3 that happened. So, we again have problem with WTJWorg view about what was/is length of Creative Day. JW's publications never connected each Creative Day with millions of years.
In light of what was said your statement or opinion or belief how: The flood was a destructive event with tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanos erupting and major movement of Teutonic plates is not supported with this Britannica quotes. Of course, Britannica don't bring exact, fixed numbers of years. But difference in view of length time with WTJWorg is drastic.
Bible don't speaking nothing about elements you put in focus (tsunamis, earthquakes, volcanos erupting and major movement of Teutonic plates). Bible speaking only about water!
Also, Bible said that God said this: I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish....The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.
Nothing about anything else, but only about water as tool for destroying all life and to cover mountains.
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1 hour ago, 4Jah2me said:
Even JWs on here seem to have no faith in God's Holy Spirit and it's capabilities.
Yes, JW's faith has been created, built by "Bible Study" Program, and then with all other "organizational requirements" aka meetings and conventions where they studying WTJWorg publications and by that they suck, hoover, inhale "uninspired spirit" of human doctrines made by leadership.
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8 hours ago, Witness said:
To produce this fruit the GB must be inspired by the Holy Spirit. Matt 7:18-20
According to their understanding, they are "guided by spirit". In their understanding about this wording, that means; reading Bible, prayers to God for understanding and working according to Bible aka working to own understanding of Bible (according to WTJWorg theology).
Obviously, as you accented, this what they are doing is not enough. Because they denied possibility that God can and would "inspired" people today, they put themselves in position to deny holy spirit, to stop HS, to insult God and the HS. To not believe in HS and his/her power and will to help people today as it was in the past.
By openly renouncing the possibility of being inspired by HS (Since the Governing Body is neither inspired ... - WT February 2017), they have no faith in HS and thus HS has no possibility of acting in such an Organization and on such people.
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7 minutes ago, Witness said:
John 15:1-8
"...If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be done for you."
According to this i would conclude how processes in WTJWorg, that suggests how "new light and brighter day" brings "the truth", actually they brings nothing but human error and myths. Ultimately, that means false teachings. If these people or their predecessors were ever branches on the vine, then something happened in the meantime that caused them not to remain in His Word. When they asked for something on their, GB meetings, for "guidance" or for "knowledge and understanding" they obviously don't get that.
Multiple changing or "clarification" of same doctrines is quite strong evidence how "their ask whatever they wish", Father didn't hear and/or did't want to respond. Even theological things that have not changed for a long time are not proof that they are correct. We have the opportunity to see a discussion of the 607 BCE. It’s a really long discussion, but it shows how WTJWorg scholars are wrong in their claims.
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1 hour ago, Witness said:
They state they were appointed as the “faithful and discreet slave”.
The subject regarding FDS is, have to be, the question of the quality of the characteristics of the individual and the fidelity of the individual to the teachings of Jesus and his instructions. Therefore, I am of the opinion that the "Governing Body" sees itself wrongly and puts itself in the position of Administrative Manager who Governs over people and does so internationally over/above every and each congregation and individual in that congregation.
A man's inclination (in this case a bad inclination) is to rule or govern over others, and to determine for them what and how they should believe and act.Sharing, giving food by meals does not involve determining how that food should be “digested” by someone. GB brings to the table the food that is not "healthy correct". But they order everyone at the table to eat it because it is the best food in the world. If someone refuses to eat, then they try to convince him that he is wrong, that he is disobedient, that he does not understand enough, that he has no faith, or that he is an apostate who opposes Jesus.
Did Jesus place them over people, the household? No, because it is the opposite of what Jesus taught: So Jesus called them together and said, “You know that those regarded as rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their superiors exercise authority over them. But it shall not be this way among you .... - Mat 20, Mark 10
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On 12/29/2020 at 9:39 PM, Arauna said:
this is it because they had never seen rain before.
... it is only an interpretation of Genesis 2:5 and an assumption.
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An excellent account about one of the key elements in WTJWorg theology - Memorial Partakers aka Anointed. Wherever you look, there is always something wrong with the Organization.
- Witness and vina sayers
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43 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:
One item is that they 1.) believe in love, not hate. Another is that they 2.) believe that "science is true." Now, I have nothing against science so long as it does not present itself as the be-all and end-all, but it strikes me that these two items do not exactly dovetail. Love is more closely associated with spiritual things, in our case with the sayings of Jesus. Science is more closely associated with survival of the fittest, hardly a recipe for love.
You explained almost well. :)) Also it would be quite appropriate to put parallel between "scientific methods" and "religious doctrines".
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9 hours ago, AlanF said:
For a thorough disproof of the Flood, and copious references to Watchtower material, see https://critiquesonthewatchtower.org/old-articles/2006/02/part-1-general-description-of-flood.html
General Description Of The Flood
The events of the Flood according to the Genesis account and Watchtower publications are:
From Genesis:
1. The flood was a global cataclysm.
2. It lasted about a year.
3. The highest mountains were covered by the floodwaters.
4. The draining of the floodwaters took about eleven months.
5. The source of the waters was the "floodgates of the heavens" and the "springs of the watery deep."
From the Insight1 book:
6. The source of the flood was the water above the "expanse" created on the second creative day of Genesis.
7. Prior to the flood there were no high mountains, no deep sea basins, and no icecaps.
8. During or after the flood the earth's crust shifted, mountains were created, and the shallow sea basins were deepened.
I read two or three articles you wrote this morning. Great. If such enormous amount of water stayed at earth surface in liquid state than nothing could be frozen, neither plants nor animals nor people. If they found few frozen animals, why they didn't find frozen people that died in Flood?
According to Genesis book Noah's ark floated on the water for months. So nothing was frozen , neither at the time of the outbreak of the Flood nor months later. "Sudden freezing" did not occur. How law temperature is required and how much time is needed for so much water to be frozen in minutes??
Law temperature will cause health problem for people and animals in Ark. They would not be able to survive because all would be frozen, not just few animals (found in, imagine, Siberia...., and not in Africa or some other area !!??)
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49 minutes ago, Arauna said:On 12/28/2020 at 5:15 PM, TrueTomHarley said:
, I got it that we are out of sync with the majority scholastic view on this matter. So? We are out of sync with the majority scientific view on the origin of humankind, too.
Bravo! true! and be proud of it!
Kind of ???? reasoning. WTJWorg somehow holds on position how life on Earth begun before 6 Creative Days and that one (JW members) should not really believe that fossils (plant and animal) are millions of years old.
The word “day” as used in Genesis can refer to long periods of time. In fact, at Genesis 2:4, the word “day” is used to describe all six days of creation.
The Bible’s narrative allows for the possibility that some major events during each day, or creative period, occurred gradually rather than instantly, perhaps some of them even lasting into the following creative days.*** .... How long, then, were the creative days? The Bible does not say; however, the wording of Genesis chapters 1 and 2 indicates that considerable lengths of time were involved. -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1102010234
But, at the same time WTJWorg scholars speaking how God's (Jesus') Kingdom is literally 1000 years long and as such is last part of 6th Creative day, which 6000 years ended in 1975 CE. By that they came to general conclusion how each Creative day last 7000 years. Or, if not every single day, but this final 6th Day have to be 7000 years long. :))) This is WTJWorg Chronology too!
*** another example of "overlapping" :)))
Insight into/about WTJWorg doctrines leads us to conclusion how, TIMELINE or WTJWorg CHRONOLOGY about 1000 year Kingdom and about Creation Day are not synchronized.
And as i see, TTH and Arauna don't care nothing about that, but are very proud how their Organization standing in such impossible position.
You making problem about 70 years, but have no problem about thousands or millions of years !!?? Dogmas and chronology about 607 BCE to 1914 CE and 1975 CE, as one part, in connection/relation to 1000 years of (future) Kingdom and Length of Creative Days, as second part, destroys your hopes and theology every single day, and you are not aware of that.
You can't have both. Awake!
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6 hours ago, scholar JW said:
"But when 70 years have been fulfilled'. so one must determine when these words apply. Was it at the time of Babylon's Fall in 539 BCE or after that time?
6 hours ago, scholar JW said:Clearly, Babylon was not desolated in 539 BCE. Finally, the verse describes the nature of the divine judgement -a desolate wasteland for all time'.
6 hours ago, scholar JW said:Jehovah's judgement against Babylon was not a momentary or singular event in time but would be one of desolation which as a process occurred over periods of time even up to the present day.
Why all this is so similar to, and remind me on, "overlapping" solution?
6 hours ago, scholar JW said:terminus ad quem
WTJWorg made Terminus Post Quem and Terminus Ante Quem for "this generation will not pass" in "old lights insightful knowledge". Without going into the nuances they created about the interpretations of the term "generation", it was clear to everyone, at that time, and especially today, that "that generation" should have lasted from cca 1914 + 70-80 years according to JW scholars, with "happy conclusion" to the end of 20th century. :))
Finnish author looks to fill the 20-year chronology gap
in Topics
Posted
I have no time nor ability to face all this important and interesting questions about chronology. Apologize for my passive "participation" (viewing) :).
If i may ask, how Mansikka justified or explained this "adding of 20 years"? And how he came to this particular time point where is needed to add this 20 years?