Srecko Sostar

https://www.sltrib.com/religion/2020/06/30/lds-church-says-pandemic/
I was raised as a Catholic and lived next door to a devout Mormon family, who were my extended family. I had basically two mothers, and learned from both.   I was guarded by their mutual love.  When I became a JW and my father died, I refused to attend his funeral in the Catholic Church.  My feelings were respected and my family's love for me never faded. 
While JWs reserve their love for each other, the Mormon Church reaches out into the community in massive ways.   Each religion, the Catholics, Mormons, Watchtower has its horrendous record of hidden child abuse; which proves that NO organization can boast that it is founded on love, no matter what it has accomplished. 
JWs instantly shut their brand of love off, when someone rejects the organization. For this, families are torn apart.   Is this love?  Victims of abuse are shunned for their outcry of injustice, committed by the elder body.  Is this love?  The organization’s lawyers fight to win court battles involving child abuse.  Is this love?  They don't stop once but keep at it, hoping to hold on to their riches.  This is so alien to the teachings of Jesus Christ.
The anointed Body of Christ is admonished not to bond together under their Head Jesus Christ and show love for one another. (1 Cor 12:15-27)
WHO has the authority to regulate love?  The governing body?
The love shown by JWs as an organization, is regulated by rules coming from these men, and enforced by the elders. 
This is not true love.
Yes he does.
The "mighty mountainlike organization" will fall.  The Temple/Zion/mountain of "living stones" that God established through His Son, will rise.  The anointed are bonding outside of this delusional mountain.(1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17)
"What are you, mighty mountain? Before Zerubbabel you will become level ground. Then he will bring out the capstone to shouts of ‘God bless it! God bless it!’”
8 Then the word of the Lord came to me: 9 “The hands of Zerubbabel have laid the foundation of this temple; his hands will also complete it. Then you will know that the Lord Almighty has sent me to you.
10 “Who dares despise the day of small things, since the seven eyes of the Lord that range throughout the earth will rejoice when they see the chosen capstone in the hand of Zerubbabel?”  Zech 4:7-1-10
The Rise of Mount Zion
 
 
 

I wonder if the Elders say this in answer to hiding Pedophiles in their congregations. 
JWs know that if they don't do as they are told then they will be 'killed' spiritually, by being disfellowshipped. And they will lose the immediate contact of around one hundred (or more ) people.  Tom knows this of course but pretends it isn't true. 
I do wonder what things you kept hidden in the Org when you were an elder, and if it bothers your conscience now. 

I guess this is a good statement for many aspects and situations in the lives of JW members as well?

"Jehovah's Witnesses did not voluntarily join because we object to the assertion that the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses assumes responsibility for children," the group said.
"Our objection is based on the fact that the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses does not and has not sponsored any activities that have resulted in children being under its care, custody, supervision, control or authority."
My problem with this is that it is so misleading. They had control and authority over my parent's so they got my parent's to do the dirty works with me by direction way of the leadership.
 
 

I see them as sitting on three - one in court, one in the organization as "elders", and one as counterfeit priests "sitting" in the Temple of God.  (Mark 13:14)
 2 Thess 2:3,4 - Let no one deceive you in any way. For that day will not come, unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction, who opposes and exalts himself against every so-called god or object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, proclaiming himself to be God."  
(1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22)

All baptized Witnesses are ordained ministers and share in the preaching and teaching work. - https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/no-paid-clergy/
In question about "representatives", as i am aware, "representatives" are those elders who are appointed by GB for some special service and/or task. Service as CO, for example. The task can be temporary, so the role of the "representative" in such case is only for a certain thing and for a certain time.
It would be interesting and useful to understand similarities and differences of these two concepts. I found this in short searching on internet.   http://www.hisholychurch.org/ministries/church/documents/ordained.pdf
1) Ordination by God is an unseen act of a calling, and acceptance of that calling.
2) Here in Acts 6:3, the appointment to administer this office took place after an ‘election’ by the people of men to carry out the daily ministration.
Perhaps you know what he meant with this. And perhaps TTH knows too. Maybe you will find time to explain. As for me, WTJWorg is Organization and  Institution (institution/noun -  an organization founded for a religious, educational, professional, or social purpose, ...... according to google search) 
I don't know what difference @TrueTomHarley have in mind. Perhaps he see "JWs" as people inside this particular Organization/Institution as some sort of "free people" which form a fraternity, and are somehow "outside" of Administration that, de facto, run the Church. 
But, answering on baptismal questions and that strict performed act, made by candidate, before witnesses, are in fact verbal contract with Organization, and supposedly with God.  Why i said supposedly? Because of the content of baptismal questions. And because of how baptism is performed.
Second baptismal question is pure administrative format. A format that automatically classifies a candidate, member, or follower into one of many religions. There is no Bible support for such question.
The act of immersion is not accompanied by the words of Jesus: "Then Jesus came to them and said: All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, ...
 
Here exists interesting, or better to say, worrisome inconsistency and discrepancy over who is who in the Organization. Over doctrinal idea. Over internal and public identification who are JW people and how they functioning/operate. 
WTJWorg Publications explain that JWs do not have clerical and lay classes. And that is obviously not true. Because of claims made by WTJWorg Representatives before Public and before Courts. 
Next thing is this. Because WTJWorg claims how elders are not clergy ("we have no paid clergy" GB said,..... but you have unpaid clergy i would say this way),.... to continue: If in WTJWorg Clergy not exists, than there is no need to have, to call for "priest-penitent" ("elder-congregant") privilege at all.  If somebody in congregation come and tell to elder something, than elder is also in obligation to be in silence about it, to anyone inside and outside congregation. Or not? Perhaps he would be in obligation to report crime to secular authorities only, but not to other elders too.  
That idea of this sort of "clergy privilege" is very strained in WTJWorg. Sitting on two chairs.
 
 

I also don't recall any Bible verse. It can be that Jesus, despite his "rebellious attitude" about Jew's customs and interpretations of "Moses's Law" (washing hands, working on Sabbath and similar) in many cases, he also didn't want to provoke spiritual leaders too much, also. If that was the case, perhaps he didn't publicly spoke God's name for same reason as all other Jews of his time. Just idea.    

Confusing idea. You want "separation" of church and state aka separation between ARC and WTYWorg and now suggesting me I have to to apply same measure for secular and religious entity. 
About what is ARC ignorant? ..... after whole ARC process and Study case 29? 
Before beginning in 2015 ARC wasn't aware how WTJWorg Australia , as Institution, handling with CSA inside Institution aka Church. Now, they are no longer in ignorance, and not many of us are ignorant anymore.  

https://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/robins-kaplan-justice-report-winter-4640478/?
ESTABLISHING DUTY IN CHILD SEX ABUSE CASES AGAINST THE JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES -
In 2019, 13 states and the District of Columbia amended civil statutes to enlarge statutes of limitations for child sex abuse claims. Eight of these jurisdictions enacted revival statutes allowing previously time-barred child sex abuse claims to proceed: New York, the District of Columbia, Montana, New Jersey, Arizona, Vermont, Rhode Island, and North Carolina.
In 2019, 13 states and the District of Columbia amended civil statutes to enlarge statutes of limitations for child sex abuse claims. Eight of these jurisdictions enacted revival statutes allowing previously time-barred child sex abuse claims to proceed: New York, the District of Columbia, Montana, New Jersey, Arizona, Vermont, Rhode Island, and North Carolina. Since implementation of these statutes, survivors of child sex abuse have filed complaints against many different institutions—not just against individual perpetrators of abuse—including, the Roman Catholic Church, various independent schools, the Boy Scouts of America, and the Jehovah’s Witnesses parent-organization, Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc. (“Watchtower”). Institutions may be directly liable for sex abuse committed by their agents through negligencebased claims, such as, negligent supervision, hiring/ retention, and failure to warn. In Jehovah’s Witnesses cases, perpetrators of sex abuse commonly hold the position of church “elder” or “ministerial servant.” In those cases, attorneys for the Jehovah’s Witnesses typically argue that elders and ministerial servants are unpaid volunteers, not employees or agents of the Jehovah’s Witnesses, and, thus, the organization has no duty to protect one congregant from abuse by another congregant, especially if the abuse occurred off congregation premises. Below are some examples of evidence that Plaintiffs’ attorneys have successfully marshaled to counter this argument. First, the Jehovah’s Witnesses organizational structure shows that elders and ministerial servants are indeed agents of the Church. In J.W. v. Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc., California’s appeals court provides a generally accurate description of the Jehovah’s Witnesses hierarchy. The relevant upshot is that, “[e]lders are the highest authority at the congregational level,” and, thus, are the Jehovah’s Witnesses equivalent of Roman Catholic priests.5 In order to be appointed an elder, a person must first be a Minsterial Servant in good standing. Top-down, the Jehovah’s Witnesses, or, “Watchtower,” as the parent-organization is known, is controlled by the Governing Body of eight elders, essentially the board of directors for Watchtower.  Below the Governing Body are circuits generally comprised of 20 to 22 congregations.  Below the circuit-level are local congregations, each managed by a body of elders, who select candidates for becoming elders and ministerial servants. Watchtower’s own documents and policies elucidate the institution’s agency relationship with its elders and ministerial servants, and reveal the Jehovah’s Witnesses’ own perception that a duty arises from those relationships. For example, in another California child sex abuse case, Watchtower produced a July 20, 1998 letter in which the organization admonishes All Bodies of Elders against appointing child sex abusers as elders or ministerial servants because, “this could result in costly lawsuits. . . . [C]ourt officials and lawyers will hold responsible any organization that knowingly appoints former child abusers to positions of trust, if one of these, thereafter, commits a further act of child abuse.” The letter concedes, “[t]hose who are appointed to privileges of services, such as elders and ministerial servants, are put in a position of trust. . . .this includes being more liberal in leaving children in their care and oversight.” As for any attempt to mitigate the role of ministerial servants as compared to elders, the Watchtower policy manual, “Organized to do Jehovah’s Will,” instructs that ministerial servants are authorized to perform tasks otherwise reserved for elders, when an elder is unavailable, such as: (1) conduct Congregation Book Study; (2) handle Service Meetings; (3) handle parts of the Theocratic Ministry School; and (4) deliver public talks in the local congregation. Based on the above, courts have been persuaded that Jehovah’s Witnesses congregations are liable for “violat[ing] [a] duty,” when a clergy sex abuse victim’s parents were “congregants, who in deciding to permit [the perpetrator] into their home reasonably relied on his status as an appointed ministerial servant as well as on his good standing and reputation within the congregation. . . .”13 In addition to the above, the California Court of Appeal rejected the notion that a plaintiff failed to sufficiently allege proximate cause when the sexual abuse had occurred off congregation premises, mainly relying on a respondeat superior discussion in Comment C to the Restatement (3d) of Agency § 7.05: “causation may not be present when the harm occurs outside the work environment. It does not reflect that causation cannot be found when the harm occurs outside the work environment.” Understanding the structure, history, and policies of the Jehovah’s Witnesses is important for proving the parentinstitution’s liability in a child sex abuse case; but this is just a start.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

It often happens that plants, larger or smaller, are planted too close to the border. Many people who plant plants while they are still young do not leave enough room to grow. After a few years the plant spreads in its natural growth and becomes a maintenance problem. Ignorance of how big the plant will be when it reaches its full size contributes to the problem for both parties. There are also those who plant trees along the border and do not really care about the consequences of such planting. There are also wild trees that are left to grow.
Trees and plants are a very valuable thing, but they must be controlled in urban areas, especially between two neighbors.

I also don't recall any Bible verse. It can be that Jesus, despite his "rebellious attitude" about Jew's customs and interpretations of "Moses's Law" (washing hands, working on Sabbath and similar) in many cases, he also didn't want to provoke spiritual leaders too much, also. If that was the case, perhaps he didn't publicly spoke God's name for same reason as all other Jews of his time. Just idea.    

What is silly, is putting importance on speaking or writing the word, "Jehovah" and then proclaiming that by not doing so - not speaking it, not writing it -  that person basically does not "believe", or does not have God's Holy Spirit.  
Can you tell me where Jesus spoke God's name? 
He carried God's name within him. 
"Yah Will Save, Yah Saves" - The name Jesus is the Greek transliteration of either the name יהושע (Joshua) or its shortened form (ישוע) Jeshua, and consists of two elements. The first part is the appellative יה (Yah) = יהו (Yahu) = יו (Yu), which in turn are abbreviated forms of the Tetragrammaton; the name of the Lord: YHWH, or Yahweh. - https://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/Jesus.html
"And they that went before, and they that followed, cried, saying, Hosanna; Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord:
10 Blessed be the kingdom of our father David, that cometh in the name of the Lord: Hosanna in the highest."  Mark 11:9-10
You know, JWs  (Rutherford to be precise) could have been more accurate in speaking the name of God if they did choose "Yahweh" instead of  the disastrous name,  "Jehovah".  
What an appropriate name to attach to an organization that has caused the ruin and disaster of so many lives.
 
 
 

Brother Jackson is not entitled to ask nothing from ARC or from Australia government. Brother Jackson, if want change in Australia inner politic, have to vote for such change or to participate and involve himself, in democratic way, how to change legislative and laws and other social climate in society for better solutions about problem. He is not in position to demand or to suggest. He can only express his opinion. .....but as i am aware of mentality in WTJWorg GB and other Administrative staff, the practice in WTJWorg is that they expect from a government to make a decision or suggestion, and then GB says: we will accept it / we will not accept it. In such scenario GB is not interested for, what you called, "full control" from secular authorities.
Is my statement "false or true" depends of fact in which corner you sitting and who you want to defend. But my "statement" is observation and publication of fact: WTJWorg deleted their first decision and make new statement how they will join The Redress ... now, because of (money, charity status and imagine, because of Romans 13)
Do we have to believe how GB+Helpers+Lawyers forget about existence of Romans 13 in their first decision?  :))

Brother Jackson is not entitled to ask nothing from ARC or from Australia government. Brother Jackson, if want change in Australia inner politic, have to vote for such change or to participate and involve himself, in democratic way, how to change legislative and laws and other social climate in society for better solutions about problem. He is not in position to demand or to suggest. He can only express his opinion. .....but as i am aware of mentality in WTJWorg GB and other Administrative staff, the practice in WTJWorg is that they expect from a government to make a decision or suggestion, and then GB says: we will accept it / we will not accept it. In such scenario GB is not interested for, what you called, "full control" from secular authorities.
Is my statement "false or true" depends of fact in which corner you sitting and who you want to defend. But my "statement" is observation and publication of fact: WTJWorg deleted their first decision and make new statement how they will join The Redress ... now, because of (money, charity status and imagine, because of Romans 13)
Do we have to believe how GB+Helpers+Lawyers forget about existence of Romans 13 in their first decision?  :))

For sure, you bring good questions. But you still want that few thousands years old rules and methods of Jews be in power today. That is why, enough hard situations for victims and wrongdoer and all beetwen, WTJWorg applicatiions of verses makes more difficult. Because they (GB and elders) navigate between sin and crime, and by that beetwen spiritual and literal punsihment, and beetwen religious and secular reality. 

I don't know what point you are trying to make, but "fellow citizens with the saints" is the merging of physical Gentiles with physical Jews to become one anointed flock under Jesus Christ. These, are spiritual "Israel".  
 So, then, remember that at one time you were Gentiles in the flesh—called “the uncircumcised” by those called “the circumcised,” which is done in the flesh by human hands. 12 At that time you were without Christ, excluded from the citizenship of Israel, and foreigners to the covenants of promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus, you who were far away have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14 For he is our peace, who made both groups one and tore down the dividing wall of hostility. In his flesh, 15 he made of no effect the law consisting of commands and expressed in regulations, so that he might create in himself one new man from the two, resulting in peace.  Eph 2:11-15
 

This is very serious. 
Just speculation, but what if each of 4 letters represents one word? Similar to expresion: And God said unto Moses, I Am That I Am

Again, the verses: 
(Matthew 18:15-17) 15 “Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go and reveal his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, so that on the testimony of two or three witnesses every matter may be established. 17 If he does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector
WTJWorg teaches that there are two kinds of sin: Big and small (Minor and gross). Elders do not want to deal with small sins, but say that the members need to solve them among themselves. Every great sin (serious wrongdoing) should be immediately reported to the elders (and therefore it is an assembly, elders=congregation).
Which is why you need to solve a small problem with your brother on your own, if you might still report it to the elders and the congregation.
Secondly, what is the use of Jesus' advice if you must not try to solve a big (gross) sin on your own with your brother, but must immediately report it to the elders?
Read this please, and you will see how Shepherd book interpret one situation in connection to Mat 18 and not giving support to your WOW: 
The congregation would not consider forming a judicial committee unless the offended Christian had taken steps one and two of Matthew 18:15, 16 and had initiated step three as described in Matthew 18:17.—lvs pp. 253-254. 25. If asked, elders could participate in step two, but they do not represent the body of elders. If the matter proceeds to step three, any elders who were witnesses in step two could serve only as witnesses in step three. They would not be used to serve on the judicial committee. - Shepherd 2019
Even your publication speaking contrary to general opinion (general interpretation) about meaning of verses in Matt 18. 

Again, the verses: 
(Matthew 18:15-17) 15 “Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go and reveal his fault between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, so that on the testimony of two or three witnesses every matter may be established. 17 If he does not listen to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector
WTJWorg teaches that there are two kinds of sin: Big and small (Minor and gross). Elders do not want to deal with small sins, but say that the members need to solve them among themselves. Every great sin (serious wrongdoing) should be immediately reported to the elders (and therefore it is an assembly, elders=congregation).
Which is why you need to solve a small problem with your brother on your own, if you might still report it to the elders and the congregation.
Secondly, what is the use of Jesus' advice if you must not try to solve a big (gross) sin on your own with your brother, but must immediately report it to the elders?
Read this please, and you will see how Shepherd book interpret one situation in connection to Mat 18 and not giving support to your WOW: 
The congregation would not consider forming a judicial committee unless the offended Christian had taken steps one and two of Matthew 18:15, 16 and had initiated step three as described in Matthew 18:17.—lvs pp. 253-254. 25. If asked, elders could participate in step two, but they do not represent the body of elders. If the matter proceeds to step three, any elders who were witnesses in step two could serve only as witnesses in step three. They would not be used to serve on the judicial committee. - Shepherd 2019
Even your publication speaking contrary to general opinion (general interpretation) about meaning of verses in Matt 18. 

Try with ... to excommunicate them (dfd them) :)).

When Bible said how "whole world is under the power of devil", that is not proof how whole world is automatically evil, but only that ruler of this World is devil. But because JW beliefs how Jesus is King from 1914, that would mean how Jesus is Ruler and how this World is under power of Jesus, too. Or not? That is question for WTJWorg Bible Scholars.
But back to first issue. Humanity is not more or less evil because of JW interpretations. Would we say how Eve and Adam became evil because of devil question about fruit? Did the evil influence of the devil come through the question? Or through some bad mental energy? Or by spoken words? Or by visualization  with snake? 
People are in capacity to doing bad things, but people are ready to help too. Also today, centuries after Adam and Eve perfection. So, whole world is mixed with good and evil things no matter of devil. Even in JW Spiritual Paradise we  see good and evil "fruits".

Try with ... to excommunicate them (dfd them) :)).

When Bible said how "whole world is under the power of devil", that is not proof how whole world is automatically evil, but only that ruler of this World is devil. But because JW beliefs how Jesus is King from 1914, that would mean how Jesus is Ruler and how this World is under power of Jesus, too. Or not? That is question for WTJWorg Bible Scholars.
But back to first issue. Humanity is not more or less evil because of JW interpretations. Would we say how Eve and Adam became evil because of devil question about fruit? Did the evil influence of the devil come through the question? Or through some bad mental energy? Or by spoken words? Or by visualization  with snake? 
People are in capacity to doing bad things, but people are ready to help too. Also today, centuries after Adam and Eve perfection. So, whole world is mixed with good and evil things no matter of devil. Even in JW Spiritual Paradise we  see good and evil "fruits".

When Bible said how "whole world is under the power of devil", that is not proof how whole world is automatically evil, but only that ruler of this World is devil. But because JW beliefs how Jesus is King from 1914, that would mean how Jesus is Ruler and how this World is under power of Jesus, too. Or not? That is question for WTJWorg Bible Scholars.
But back to first issue. Humanity is not more or less evil because of JW interpretations. Would we say how Eve and Adam became evil because of devil question about fruit? Did the evil influence of the devil come through the question? Or through some bad mental energy? Or by spoken words? Or by visualization  with snake? 
People are in capacity to doing bad things, but people are ready to help too. Also today, centuries after Adam and Eve perfection. So, whole world is mixed with good and evil things no matter of devil. Even in JW Spiritual Paradise we  see good and evil "fruits".

What is funny @César Chávez  is that you talk about " living a Christian life was too hard and not what you expected, because you lost certain human freedoms, especially those practiced in today's world of debauchery? "
But when some one turns that full circle and mentions that the JW org is full of immorality, you don't like it. 
This whole JW thing about the whole world being wicked, is wrong. The idea that everyone who is not a JW is part of a wicked world, is wrong.  The idea that JWs can be neutrel but no one else can, is wrong.  I'm sure there are many people that are not JWs but are good honest people with good moral standards. 
I think this scripture is very important. Romans 2 from v 14
For when people of the nations, who do not have law, do by nature the things of the law, these people, although not having law, are a law to themselves. 15  They are the very ones who demonstrate the matter of the law to be written in their hearts, while their conscience is bearing witness with them, and by their own thoughts they are being accused or even excused. 16  This will take place in the day when God through Christ Jesus judges the secret things of mankind, according to the good news I declare.
This is talking about people in the 'world' that you and others accuse of being so wicked. But by being pure of heart they prove they have God's law written in their hearts. And that has nothing to de with being a JW.