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Srecko Sostar

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  1. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in REMOVAL / DESTRUCTION OF THE GOVERNING BODY   
    That is so ludicrous I don't even know where to start.
    The reason the Brothers were imprisoned for sedition, etc ... IS THAT THEY WERE GUILTY !
    They were not let out of prison early because of some imaginary vindication ... they were let out because the "Great War" was over.

  2. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in REMOVAL / DESTRUCTION OF THE GOVERNING BODY   
    I may have missed something BTK46, but I do not see where in this particular thread, as shown above, where John Butler threatened ANYBODY.
    Please correct me with a quote, as you apparently see something that is NOT THERE.
    No surprise at that .....
    It's either you, or me that is wrong about this, and historically, it's always been you.
    If I say the Governing Body is it's own worst enemy, because they keep shooting themselves in the foot and systematically destroying their credibility, day by day, that is NOT a threat.
    .... merely a figurative  observation.

  3. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Well, BTK46, I personally do not think we have much to fear from external enemies .... if we are doing things  that are correct ... they have no case at all . 
    All sane, reasonable people know this.
    The fact of the matter is this ... day by day, in the eyes of the World, Jehovah's Witnesses are losing what credibility we USED to have, with general nuttiness .... and the Governing Body, in it's self aggrandizing attempts at damage control, are day by day, losing THEIR credibility, except with the slowest, the dull, and the trusting.
    They are their OWN worst enemy.
    With all the real good that they do in directing the preaching of the Good News, the drivel that they add chases just as many people away, as the Truth attracts.
    When you have the TRUTH ... we would not have to knock on THEIR doors ... they would be knocking on OUR doors.
    The general impression is that we dress well, are fine people, but are bat-crap crazy.

  4. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from Shiwiii in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Yes. In fact WHY they have to call Legal Department for advice on - to call or not to call - if Bible PRINCIPLES and GUIDANCE of holy spirit are powers SUFFICIENT for Elders when making decisions? :))
  5. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    This is why I prefer to be called just "Rook", (no first or middle name), or JTR ... to keep from being identified with the Apostle James, which would be a stretch of multi-dimensional proportions .... or with Sean Connery , the only REAL James Bond ...... I mean .... besides the Ornithologist ( Bird Watcher, for those in Rio Linda ...) named James Bond, from whom Ian Fleming  the author and creator of the James Bond Character took the name., who wrote several  books on birds that impressed Ian Fleming, also a bird watcher ... ....
    Why do you think I got 18 chickens?
    They are birds, and a lot cheaper than parrots.

                        Left to right .... 006, 007, 009

    Super Chicken Intro.mp4
  6. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    I'll give you one rude word for that comment James, Bullshit. I do not normally swear on here but your comment is just an excuse. 
    The comment also shows a lack of faith in Almighty God. 
    Remembering that the JW Org is nothing like the Nation of Israel. In that Nation most people were born into it and had to live under the LAW.  In JW Org most people are NOT born into it, they are volunteers. They, supposedly, want to be there. 
    So what you should have is 8.5 million people willing to serve God properly in what SHOULD BE an inspired organisation, led by inspired Anointed brothers. 
    By saying that the GB / JW Org / Watchtower Soc 'are operated beyond their design capacity,'  you are saying that it is not God's organisations and not inspired or even guided by God's Holy Spirit. 
    So how does it make it 'the only game in town', when it's not even in the running ? 
    It would have to be God's chosen Organisation, being inspired / guided / run by God's Holy Spirit through Jesus Christ, who would be operating through willing, humble,  God fearing, true, honest human servants.  
    Oh dear multi fail by JW Org. 
     
  7. Thanks
    Srecko Sostar reacted to Colin Browne in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    The person in black at the right side of my wife (Green bathing costume) who was about to be baptized, was himself a baptised brother who even endured two years of detention at military barracks in Pretoria during the early seventies. I was among those welcoming him back.
    On return to the congregation in Southern Wood East London, South Africa he did an about turn in a letter to the local Daily Dispatch newspaper apologising to the people he called on during his field ministry, for spreading false good news. He felt that the elders who refused to attend to the needs of people on the outside, or something to that nature. I wasn't present when that particular meeting. He became politically involved, often submitting letters to the Daily DIspatch.

  8. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    There are two parts to a Corporate Baptism:
    1.) Dedication and public declaration of agreement of being adopted by Jehovah God, and Christ Jesus,  and
    2.) An oath of fealty and subservience to the Corporation's ( The "Organization" ) policies and procedures.
    I suspect the Watchtower Lawyers, which now dictate the nuances of our "Corporate Theology", will have to work a LOT of overtime, when this issue hits the courtroom, as respects to Corporate baptized  minors, below the age of 18, when challenged on that point alone.
    UNless legally emancipated, they do NOT have the right to make contracts, except for food, clothing, shelter, and suchlike absolute essentials .... and CERTAINLY (to be tested in court ...) not contested fealty to a Corporation, the contract being entered into before the age of majority.
    I do NOT agree with JW.ORG, becoming JW.BORG .... but the Watchtower Lawyers and accountants are now running the show, and there is NOTHING... NOTHING, anybody on Earth can do about it.
    The Governing Body CANNOT be fired by anyone on Earth.
    ...and they know it!
  9. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    It makes no sense to you because you have missed the point tht Baptism to God and Christ is what is in the person's heart ....the fact that Witnesses are DELIBERATELY kept ignorant OF THE  CORPORATE LOYALTY OATH, that they are ALSO swearing fealty to a Corporation excuses their ignorance, completely.  Not every soldier is a John Rambo.
    The Corporate Fealty Oath  is deliberately obscured and hidden until the very last moment for a specific reason.
    That part of the ceremony is a deliberate legal trap.
    The Governing Body and the Watchtower lawyers know EXACTLY what they are doing, and exactly what the words mean .... in a court of law .... where someone  is suing them for malfeasance or other crimes against the dignity of the individual.
    With those weasel words, expertly disguised or completely hidden, and DELIBERATELY not taught ... to the baptismal candidate ... they can legitimately say to a judge or jury ... and have it hold up in a court of law ... that the baptized Witnesses agreed to be subordinate and mistreated by the Corporation.
     
  10. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to Witness in TODAY'S ANTICHRIST   
    "Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks. God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.” John 4:23,24
    In one publication by the organization, it uses 1 Cor 10:14 and 1 John 5:21 to explain that a true Christian would not worship God at any place of ‘special value’. Their comment is based on Jesus’ words in John 4:21-24. The publication states that doing so would incur idol worship, resulting from viewing any place as holy in itself. This article is in a public addition of the magazines, dated 2016. Search, “shrine”.
    SHRINE – “any structure or place consecrated or devoted to some saint, holy person, or deity, as an altar, chapel, church, or temple.”
    Kingdom halls and assembly halls have been referred to as “God’s House”, also the Bethels. (Bethel means “House of God”) Since the organization is taught as being “spirit-directed”, belonging to “Jehovah”, and owned buildings are included in his “earthly belongings”, they are all considered “holy”. The presence of God’s Spirit is assumed as being within a building, and within the organization as a whole. Rev 13:15 (see John 20:22) In fact, kingdom halls and assembly halls particularly, are frequently dedicated to God as the ancient temples were; dedicated to God, until men make the decision to treat it as real estate and sell it off.
    Don’t you find it an anomaly, JWs, that God’s spirit appears to be everywhere at man’s whim, except in the hearts of your leaders, who admit they are not “inspired”? 2 Tim 3:1,5,7,8
    In summarizing your leaders’ documented words, it reveals that you have been encouraged to practice idolatry by applying a special value to the organization and its earthly goods. Matt 6:19,20;19:24 Does this make JWs, “true Christians”? We are very aware that idolaters are not true Christians following the teachings and command of Christ. Isa 2:7,8; Matt 5:19,20 (The organization has a routine of speaking some truth, but putting the opposite into practice, and expecting JWs to do the same - to fall into idolatry.) (Exod 32:2-8; Isa 44:20; Rom 1:25)
    “Woman,” Jesus replied, “believe me, a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.” John 4:21
    The organization is considered “mountain-like”, prophesied to be established in the last days, (Isa 2:2,3) yet it stands in defiance of Jesus’ words spoken to the woman at the well. Can we say we believe in, and know the Son, if his teachings - his admonition about how we should worship - are not followed? Luke 11:28; John 12:48; 14:24 “Antichrist” means “against” Christ; as an opponent of Christ. In action, we can see that the organization is against this teaching of Jesus, fully contradicting his words. It continues to build its holy places, and comparing them to temples. Luke 4:5-8; John 2:19-21; Acts 7:48-51; 17:24-25
    It must be confusing to believe that both an earthly organization, as well as God with His Son, can grant one salvation. Isa 46:5; 57:13; Dan 11:38; Rev 13:4 Please, sort it out in your mind and heart, JWs. You have in one hand, a counterfeit teaching that a fabricated earthly “mountain” will lead you to eternal life; that you must be baptized into “Jehovah’s organization” to receive eternal life. In the other hand, you are presented by Christ, God’s way of approved worship. His definition of Mount Zion is far different than what your leaders promote. “Daughter Zion” is not an earthly organization comprised of buildings and people. It doesn’t refer to every “Jehovah’s Witness”. It refers to chosen, faithful anointed ones who will serve the Father and Jesus eternally as “priests and kings” in God’s Kingdom. They are the spiritual descendants of Jacob, and God’s spiritual “dwelling”. This is the true Temple today; the authentic ZION. 1 Pet 2:5,9,10; 1 Cor 3:16,17;2 Cor 6:16; Eph 2:20-22; Rev 3:12
    “In the last days
    the mountain of the Lord’s temple will be established
    as the highest of the mountains;
    it will be exalted above the hills,
    and all nations will stream to it.” Isa 2:2
    For those who reject the idolatrous way of worship highly promoted by the organization’s leaders, the “spirit-directed” idol “kills”/disfellowships any who desire to obey Christ’s teachings and search out the proper way to worship, as explained in the article. Luke 21:12; 9:24; John 15:21; John 16:2; Rev 13:15 When you compare the words in the article, with the subsequent actions carried out against its teaching, can you see the hypocrisy in this, JWs?
    The organization makes the enlightening statement that the “antichrist” can refer to a false “christ”, as well as any group as an organization, or group of people that makes the claim to represent Christ; but instead, oppose him. The identity of the Antichrist today has pertinent characteristics to help pinpoint that it is for certain, the organization and its leaders.
    1 John 4:1-3 addresses the spirit of false prophet/false “christs”:
    “Beloved, believe not every spirit, but prove the spirits, if they are of God; because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
    2 Hereby ye know the Spirit of God: every spirit which confesses Jesus Christ come in flesh is of God;
    3 and every spirit which does not confess Jesus Christ come in flesh is not of God: and this is that [power] of the antichrist, [of] which ye have heard that it comes, and now it is already in the world.
     “A true Prophet believes and preaches the physical incarnation of the Word, into Jesus Christ. He will preach Jesus as came to Earth and put on humanity in order to redeem us all. This previous incarnation would precede the next one (Heb 1:6; Acts 3:21; Matt 17:11; Acts 1:11). Any who deny this future earthy materialization of Christ and his co-rulers (Rev 5:10; Rom 8:19; John 1:51; Rev 21:2), essentially deny the first one (John 1:14). The very concept of an exclusive "heavenly hope", promotes the "spirit of the anti-Christ" (1 John 4:2,3; 2 John 1:7).”
    2 John 2:7 – “ For many deceivers have gone out into the world, they who do not confess Jesus Christ coming in flesh—this is the deceiver and the antichrist.”
    Pearl Doxsey, “Prophets Within Christ’s Body/Temple Foundation”  4womaninthewilderness
    Clearly, a false prophet that directs a “mountain-like” organization can be considered “anti-christ” and which was also prophesied to appear in the last days. Rev 13:1,2,5-7,11,14-17 This two-fold powerful rule, advertised as led by Christ, is “lawlessness”. 2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 13:18 It is a counterfeit mountain which preaches a message of worship contrary to Christ’s teaching of worshiping in the Spirit and in truth.
    2 John 2 continues: “Anyone who does not remain in Christ’s teaching but goes beyond it, does not have God. The one who remains in that teaching, this one has both the Father and the Son. 10 If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your home, and don’t say, 'Welcome,' to him; 11 for the one who says, “Welcome,” to him shares in his evil works."
    "God is spirit, and His worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.” John 4:24
    “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’23 And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’" Matt 7:21-23 
    The “Man of Lawlessness” is determined to destroy God’s true way we are to worship. How? By “trampling” the authentic Temple of God; by appearing to be higher and mightier than God’s spiritual dwelling in the anointed ones; even more powerful than Christ himself.
    2 Thess 2:4 - "He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God (divinity) or is worshiped, so that he sets himself up in God’s temple, proclaiming himself to be God/divine.
    Dan 8:11 - "It even magnified itself to be equal with the Commander of the host; and it removed the regular sacrifice from Him, and the place of His sanctuary (Temple) was thrown down." 
    The organization’s perceived divinity is fueled by the men who operate it; the elder body, who are spiritual “Gentiles”. 
    Pearl Doxsey coments:
    Mark called the Man of Lawlessness, a "disgusting thing standing where it does not belong" (Mark  13:14).
    It does not belong to Gentiles/nations (Rev 11:2), to be in the midst of God's Temple (2 Chron 23:6; Num 3:10).
    Even worse, to rule over it and trample it down.
    Yet we see in the time of the end, God's Temple priesthood is trespassed and taken over, by the Gentiles... the Man of Lawlessness.
    It is important to know what God's Temple is today, or else, how will we recognize when it is being trampled?
    1 Cor 3:16 shows that God's Temple, is the hearts of his anointed and faithful priests...
    "you know that you yourselves are God’s temple and that God’s Spirit lives within you?" (1Cor.3:16)
    "Now He who establishes us with you in Christ and anointed us is God, who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge of what is to come." (2 Cor 1:21,22)
    So when we are looking for the man of lawlessness setting himself over God's Temple, we should be looking for that one, setting himself up over the anointed priests belonging to God's Temple, and those under-priests of Christ, accepting domination in their heart.
    From “Christs Return – When?” 4womaninthewilderness
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    What about the true Mount Zion to be established in the last days? Worshiping in spirit and truth requires recognizing the given authority of Christ over his Temple “stones”. (1 Pet 2:5,9) Man’s authority that regulates all activity and oppresses the anointed in the organization, is as Pearl brought out, “lawlessness”. Rev 13:8; 19:20; Ezek 14:10
    JWs, lawlessness exists in the absence of LOVE. Analyze your way of worship, coupled with the organization’s grandiose attempt to hide its blasphemous idolatry, by capping it off with this summer’s convention theme.
    John 5:41-43 “I do not accept glory from human beings, 42 but I know you. I know that you do not have the love of God in your hearts. 43 I have come in my Father’s name, and you do not accept me; but if someone else comes in his own name, you will accept him.
    “Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.” John 4:23
    JWs, Jesus has spelled out quite clearly, the criteria for worshiping the Father in the Spirit and in truth. Are you adhering to that criteria, evaluating Jesus’ words against those your leaders expect you to follow? Mark 13:21-33
    Whose words, carry eternal life? Matt 7:13,14; John 10:7-10; John 3:16; Matt 19:29  
    Pearl Doxsey, from “FAINT OUT OF FEAR”:
    God DOES have a "mountain"....a spiritual one.
    It is ZION, and IT is the place of proper worship "in spirit and truth", just as prophesied at Isa 2:2,3 and Rev 14:1.
    It is organized, according to the divine arrangement, of Eph 2:20-22,10; 4:11,12 and 1 Cor 12:12,14,18,27,28.
    It is God's spiritual Temple (Isa 2:2), established in the heavens (Heb 8:5;9:24; 12:22,23; 1 Cor 3:16,9).
    That temple...
    [from it's founding "cornerstone" (Ps 118:22; Eph 2:20) to it's "capstone" (Zech 4:7,9-11,14; Rev 11:3,4)]
    ...is made of chosen, living stones (1 Pet 2:5,9) who worship in spirit and truth.
    There is where you can find living waters, contained within their "fruit" (Luke 6:44,45)
    (John 7:38,39; 14:17; 16:13; 1 Cor 2:12,13; Rev 22:17,1-3; Matt 7:20.
    "So we say with confidence, 'The Lord is my helper; I will not be afraid. What can mere mortals do to me?'" (Heb 13:6)
    Isa 2:22
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    I pulled out my tattered Living Bible given to me when I was a young girl, to quote Zech 4:1-14:
    Then the angel who had been talking with me woke me, as though I had been asleep.
    2. What do you see now?” he asked.
    I answered, “I see a golden lampstand holding seven lamps, and at the top there is a reservoir for the olive oil that feeds the lamps, flowing into them through seven tubes. 3 And I see two olive trees carved upon the lampstand, one on each side of the reservoir. 4 What is it, sir? I asked. “What does this mean?” 5 Don’t you really know?” the angel asked. “No sir, I said, “I don’t.”
    6 Then he said, “This is God’s message to Zerubbabel: ‘Not by might, nor by power, but by my Spirit, says the Lord of Hosts—you will succeed because of my Spirit, though you are few and weak’.
    7 Therefore no mountain, however high, can stand before Zerubbabel! For it will flatten out before him! And Zerubbabel will finish building this Temple with mighty shouts of thanksgiving for God’s mercy, declaring that all was done by grace alone.”
    8 Another message that I received from the Lord said: 9 Zerubbabel laid the foundation of this Temple, and he will complete it. (Then you will know these messages are from God, the Lord of Hosts.) 10 Do not despise this small beginning, for the eyes of the Lord rejoice to see the work begin, to see the plumbline in the hand of Zerubbabel. For these seven lamps represent the eyes of the Lord that see everywhere around the world.”
    11 Then I asked him about the two olive trees on each side of the lampstand, 12 and about the two olive branches that emptied oil into the golden bowls through two golden tubes.
    13 “Don’t you know?” he asked. “No, sir,” I said.
    14 Then he told me, “They represent the two anointed ones who assist the Lord in all the earth.”
     
     
    Consider - “The Rise of Mount Zion” 4womaninthewilderness
     


  11. Haha
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    .... Psychological Beatings and heavy unnecessary burdens of every description will continue, until morale improves ...
     

  12. Haha
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    ...
     

    Perhaps TTH, the person dedicating his life to Jehovah wanted to do it NOW .... just as the Ethiopian Eunuch did..
    Apparently the Eunuch was smart enough to text and drive at the same time, and not run into a camel, and was aware enough to see a lake or pond nearby, while driving a chariot, listening to the "radio", and reading.
    Perhaps there are some people that do not agree with the philosophy that JW.ORG  should be JW.BORG, where resistance is futile, and everyone WILL be assimilated, and be exactly the same.

  13. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar reacted to Witness in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Not only do the have the Bible, but according to the Watchtower, they have been appointed by Holy Spirit:
    The "gifts in men" mentioned at Eph 4:8 are Christian elders, who are appointed by holy spirit and are given authority to care for the spiritual interests of fellow believers.  (Acts 20:28)  km 8/02 pp. 5-6
    Two lies:
    When it comes to child abuse, they must call for legal advice.  Their given authority to care for spiritual interests of fellow believers, stops there.
    The "gifts in men" do not refer to those not anointed, but to the anointed ones.  Eph 4:11-13
    Would they have Holy Spirit if this elder body from the top down, has lied about not only their false authority, but robbing the identity of who God has provided to serve under Holy Spirit's guidance?
    Would God really give these men the ability to shepherd justly if they rule behind a lie?
  14. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    If you think that the GB, Branch Office personnel and Circuit Overseers do not think of themselves as "Clergy", try baptizing your Bible Study one afternoon at a local public pool, without congregation oversight.
    The Baptism may be acceptable to God, and Christ .... but you will "catch hell" in the little back room, and may be disfellowshipped, yourself, for not including the fealty oath to the Organization., as represented by the Governing Body., and the Elders declare the baptism invalid.
    Or do you think the Ethiopian Eunuch answered all 100 questions, and pledged his allegiance to the Organization in Jerusalem, before he was baptized?
  15. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from Witness in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    If, then, the clergy-laity distinction is not based on the model set by Jesus’ apostles and other early Christians, does that make it wrong? According to the Bible, yes.......
    Spiritually older men did, of course, serve as overseers, which included being shepherds and teachers. (Acts 20:28) However, these men were not paid clerics........
    Sadly, when people disregard that divinely inspired directive, spiritual harm usually results, and that is true of the clergy-laity arrangement. How so? Please consider the following six points.
    1. The separation of a clergy class implies that one must have a special calling to be a minister of God. 
    2. The clergy-laity distinction exalts the clergy class, an evidence being adulatory religious titles.
    3. A paid clergy class can impose a heavy financial burden on the laity, especially when the former have lavish lifestyles.
    4. Because a clergyman may depend on others for financial support, he might be tempted to dilute the Bible’s message in order to please parishioners. 
    5. The clergy-laity distinction tends to cause lay people to relegate religion to the clergy, while the laity just turn up for weekly services.
    6. When the laity are Biblically uninformed, they can easily be misled by clerics, even exploited by them.
    source: https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102009288
    When GB, Elders and WT Lawyers defend themselves before Courts how in JW Congregations Worldwide existing clergy penitence as answer to Judges why they not want to give verbal or written testimony to Court, than all this what was said in Awake is worth NOTHING. We can also discuss some other claims here about this 6 points and found it problematic.   
    Dear @Anna answer would not come by WT Society loud public claim how clergy penitence WILL STOP TO exist in congregations. Well, according to Awake that same THING doesn't exist at all in WT Society or JW Church. :))))..... because JW have not CLERGY :)))) ... only on Courts cases when millions of $ are at stake.
     
  16. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Yes. In fact WHY they have to call Legal Department for advice on - to call or not to call - if Bible PRINCIPLES and GUIDANCE of holy spirit are powers SUFFICIENT for Elders when making decisions? :))
  17. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Yes. In fact WHY they have to call Legal Department for advice on - to call or not to call - if Bible PRINCIPLES and GUIDANCE of holy spirit are powers SUFFICIENT for Elders when making decisions? :))
  18. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    If, then, the clergy-laity distinction is not based on the model set by Jesus’ apostles and other early Christians, does that make it wrong? According to the Bible, yes.......
    Spiritually older men did, of course, serve as overseers, which included being shepherds and teachers. (Acts 20:28) However, these men were not paid clerics........
    Sadly, when people disregard that divinely inspired directive, spiritual harm usually results, and that is true of the clergy-laity arrangement. How so? Please consider the following six points.
    1. The separation of a clergy class implies that one must have a special calling to be a minister of God. 
    2. The clergy-laity distinction exalts the clergy class, an evidence being adulatory religious titles.
    3. A paid clergy class can impose a heavy financial burden on the laity, especially when the former have lavish lifestyles.
    4. Because a clergyman may depend on others for financial support, he might be tempted to dilute the Bible’s message in order to please parishioners. 
    5. The clergy-laity distinction tends to cause lay people to relegate religion to the clergy, while the laity just turn up for weekly services.
    6. When the laity are Biblically uninformed, they can easily be misled by clerics, even exploited by them.
    source: https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102009288
    When GB, Elders and WT Lawyers defend themselves before Courts how in JW Congregations Worldwide existing clergy penitence as answer to Judges why they not want to give verbal or written testimony to Court, than all this what was said in Awake is worth NOTHING. We can also discuss some other claims here about this 6 points and found it problematic.   
    Dear @Anna answer would not come by WT Society loud public claim how clergy penitence WILL STOP TO exist in congregations. Well, according to Awake that same THING doesn't exist at all in WT Society or JW Church. :))))..... because JW have not CLERGY :)))) ... only on Courts cases when millions of $ are at stake.
     
  19. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Quote @Anna If that's how you look at it. I thought our every thought and motivation comes from following the Bible.
    Are you really that naive ? 
    But please tell all of us here, who do you mean by OUR in your sentence ? 
    You obviously can't be including the GB, or the Lawyers, or any other top administration, or the Elders. 
    That only leaves the basic congregants in each congregation................... 
    As for your second comment there, it is a bit dumb. 
    if elders became mandated reporters, every time they phoned Legal for advice, they would be dictated by "central command" to report. 
    They would not need to phone Legal for advice, just report it directly to Police or Authorities. And if congregants knew beforehand that it would be reported to those authorities then it would be up to the conscience of the person that had the information or up to the victim to tell the Elders or not. 
    As it is now the Elders are protecting the GB and Its Org and hiding the pedophile from the Police and authorities if they do not report it immediately. But you know that anyway, because that's what this whole problem is all about.  
  20. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Regarding TTH always bringing in 'the world' to every situation, this time the Boy scouts. 
    In the world, when a government minister or a big business boss does something really bad, they either 'step down' from their position voluntarily or are requested to step down from their position of power. 
    So if TTH thinks the JW Org is equal to the world, then maybe the GB should step down voluntarily or be told to do so. 
  21. Like
    Srecko Sostar reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Because every thought and motivation would not then be dictated by "Central Command"
    The Elders would be using their NATURAL human conscience, instead of following the "outline" ... the script.
    One way to consolidate your authority is the exercise of arbitrary and capricious POWER.
    ---------------------------------------
    Hitler was OBVIOUSLY insane to all sane people ... but his arbitrary , capricious, and irrational exercise of power short-circuited the reasoning abilities of his minions.
    It also short-circuited their natural consciences, and their natural abhorrence to tyranny.
    The ONLY way to rationalize the irrational .... was absolute obedience.
  22. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar reacted to Witness in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    You have deflected to the Boy Scouts.  In your mind, you are desperately trying to preserve a corrupt leadership/organization that claims to represent the Almighty God.  Is it not more important to preserve our relationship with God, rather than with men who fail deliberately and repeatedly, to protect their "sheep"?  
    I am more "vested" in the prophetic outcome of this organization, of which this matter only contributes to.  
    When it is in your power,
    don’t withhold good from the one it belongs to.
    28 Don’t say to your neighbor, “Go away! Come back later.
    I’ll give it tomorrow”—when it is there with you.
    29 Don’t plan any harm against your neighbor,
    for he trusts you and lives near you.
    30 Don’t accuse anyone without cause,
    when he has done you no harm.
    31 Don’t envy a violent man
    or choose any of his ways;
    32 for the devious are detestable to the Lord,
    but He is a friend to the upright.
    33 The Lord’s curse is on the household of the wicked,
    but He blesses the home of the righteous;
    34 He mocks those who mock,
    but gives grace to the humble.
    35 The wise will inherit honor,
    but He holds up fools to dishonor.  Prov 3:27-35
     
     
  23. Thanks
    Srecko Sostar reacted to JW Insider in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    Any data that an organization keeps with respect to a policy or prior practice is always considered fair game in a lawsuit, because these lawsuits seek to find out whether the prior practice matched the stated "public policy." The claim, if one goes after an organization for damages, is that the practice has been different from the policy.
    For example, a particular city or jurisdiction claims that their policy is to always change the lead (Pb) pipes in all areas where the levels of lead reach a certain threshold, and they have kept data on all lead level complaints, and data on every area where they have changed pipes (or fought against changing the pipes).
    If the city is proud of their record, and wants to prove that their stated policy was honest, they would be happy to have this record made available to the courts. And even if the courts say that they only need it to determine the probability of organizational wrongdoing in one particular case, there is a chance that this document/database will be leaked, or that the knowledge of such a document/database will cause it to be requested for multiple future cases, for as long as it is still viable to sue the water district or organization. If the water district has done a commendable job, they might even be happy that the document/database gets leaked. They might even leak it themselves.
    Of course, no organization is perfect, and there will always be items in such a database that make organizations concerned, or even ashamed. The fact that over a thousand cases of abuse in the Australian Branch were NEVER reported to authorities, and that not even one was reported, produced powerful circumstantial evidence that there may have been pressure from somewhere to keep such crimes unreported. It may have shown that almost any excuse will be grasped at to keep such crimes unreported, even in areas where reporting is not only ethical, but mandatory. The Australian database was therefore very important to show a pattern, in the event that a new case would claim that such a pattern actually existed.
    The other concern, of course, is that, if the database cannot be redacted, that some well-known names of brothers at the highest levels of responsibility in the organization could be revealed, bringing shame on the organization, and the families of those brothers. The Australian database had two names, I'm told, that went to the very top of the Branch in Australia (still living), and one name that went to the very top of the US Branch (a person no longer alive who was moved around after accusations surfaced). If this is true, it would give a whole new dimension to why it is suspected that the US Branch will never release the US database.
  24. Upvote
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from JOHN BUTLER in The Man of Lawlessness in the 21st Century   
    What evidences and proofs you have to offer us for such claim? By which/what standards and methods you came to conclusion who was and who wasn't "inspired"? What Paul is and have done to be called "inspired"? .... and what Clement, Chloe and Epaphras are not and not done that you put them in group of "uninspired" Christians?
    Question come for our time. Who are "inspired" and who are "uninspired" Christians TODAY? Give us some names or tell us, where we can find this individuals in places we live today?
    Another question. You separate Christians in TWO CLASSES. What is the role of each one class ?
  25. Haha
    Srecko Sostar got a reaction from JOHN BUTLER in "WATCHTOWER APPEALS TO THE SUPREME COURT"   
    It seems sometimes how this "chariot" making speedy turns in ALL Directions IN the Same Time  
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