Srecko Sostar

Such as the hypocritical “Pharisees” of today - the GB.
“Then he gave them strict orders: “Watch out! Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the leaven of Herod.”  Mark 8:15
Matt 15:7-9:  You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said:
8 “‘This people honors me with their lips,
    but their heart is far from me;
9 in vain do they worship me,
    teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’”
Exactly; which is why we are to recognize and reject rotten fruit when we hear it.  Matt 7:15-20 
Jer 23:16 - Thus says the Lord of hosts:  "Do not listen to the words of the prophets who prophesy to you, filling you with vain hopes.  They speak visions of their own minds, not from the mouth of the Lord."  
Ps 26:4 – “I do not sit with men of falsehood,
    nor do I consort with hypocrites.”
 

@BillyTheKid46 You see your list of types of people means nothing because it is all subject to personal interpretation. 
Unbelievers, unbelievers in what ? What YOU mean is people that don't believe that your GB are the F&DS.  
But, those people may still believe in God and in Jesus Christ. So they are only unbelievers in the eyes of JW's.
Unrepentant, but unrepentant to whom ? Once again you base it on the JW Org's viewpoint. You expect people that know how bad the GB and it's Org are, to crawl back and ask forgiveness from MEN. 
Bas association that Christ warned us to  stay away from.  Well I am staying away from bad association, the JW Org is the bad association, full of lies, deceit and pedophiles.
Lack of bible understanding, now that is definitely JW congregants, because they rely on the GB and writing department to supply all their 'Bible knowledge'. Unfortunately the congregants do not have the intelligence or inclination to question anything for themselves and so are totally misled. But the congregants only have themselves to blame really because if they asked God, through Jesus Christ,  for the guidance of His Holy Spirit, then God would show those congregants that the teachings of the GB and JW Org are false.   
As for your point about " should a captain and crew be needed on a symbolic ship, or can we navigate on our own spiritually since God will hold us personally responsible for our own actions. "
I will come back to one of my favorite scriptures about 'Ten men clinging to the robe of a Jew'. The Bible tells us that the Anointed will be recognisable and that spiritually minded people would follow those Anointed. 
I completely agree with your point that God will have us judged as individuals, by Christ or the angels. So yes it up to us which way we go. But then I think God will make it clear, when He is ready to do so, who the Anointed really are, so that a person can follow those of the true Anointed. 

Fantastic mixture you offer in this description. 
It is and it can be true how some of this people would made bad influence on some of us. Well, if we consider how spiritual weak we are/we can be, your advice and reasoning in which you involve Jesus have some reasonable argument to stay away from this sort of bad influence.
BUT than, how to follow Jesus example? HE was braking The Law (Old Testament ... and Your's) and eat and drink and associated with "garbage", .... for entire time of his short life.   ..... ??

As a person who understands and can do Ocean Navigation, I would rather know it and not do it ... than get on a ship guided by fools who know nothing and sail out into danger and probable death.
It's like the parable of the Grasshopper and the Ant.
All summer the industrious Ant worked hard, storing seeds and leaves below ground ... and all summer the Grasshopper fiddled away, doing nothing.
Then the winter snows came, and the Grasshopper moved to Florida, and someone stepped on the Ant.
.... but look on the bright side .... at least Billy did not mention Penguins, other flightless birds, or small aquatic animals.
 

Oh the persecution those jw's are undergoing.

@Srecko Sostar  Now that is a bit of progress. Thank you for this information, I've been waiting to hear it for a longtime.
@BillyTheKid46  Here you are Kid, some news for you. But of course you won't believe it.  
Let's hope they find some good evidence with proof of same concerning JW Org. After all, the JW's think that their Org is better and safer than any other and that it has God's approval. I think not.

Like a Roman Catholic Bishop, who was also a General in the Army of Spain once said, when informed that a Spanish Muslim controlled Fortress contained as many Catholics as Muslims, which he was in the process of defeating and chasing from Spain ....
"Kill them all, and let God sort them out!".

Inquiry announces new investigation into child protection in religious organisations and settings
  2 May 2019 The Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse has announced a new investigation into child protection in religious organisations and settings.
The investigation will be thematic and will review the current child protection policies, practices and procedures in religious institutions in England and Wales.
Organisations falling under the remit of this investigation will include non conformist Christian denominations, the Jehovah’s Witnesses, Baptists, Methodists, Islam, Judaism, Sikhism, Hinduism and Buddhism. This investigation is separate from our investigations into the Anglican and Roman Catholic churches.
Religious settings such as mosques, synagogues, churches and temples are in scope. Places of faith tuition such as Muslim madrassahs and Christian Sunday schools and places where children and young people gather in connection with their religious beliefs, including youth groups and camps will also be investigated by the Inquiry.
More than one in 10 survivors of child sexual abuse (11 per cent) who shared their accounts with the Inquiry’s Truth Project reported sexual abuse in a religious institution. Of this group, almost a quarter (24 percent) told the Inquiry they were abused in institutions in scope of this new investigation, including Jehovah's Witnesses, Baptists, Methodists, Judaism and Islam. Not all participants provided details about the religious denomination of the institution or perpetrator.
Organisations and individuals are being invited to apply for core participant status. Core participants must have a significant interest in this investigation and have special rights defined by legislation.
A preliminary hearing will take place at 2pm on 23 July 2019 and public hearings will take place in 2020.
source: https://www.iicsa.org.uk/news/inquiry-announces-new-investigation-child-protection-religious-organisations-and-settings

I was baptized in 1964 .. LONG before they changed the rules, and the words, of the Baptismal Corporation Contract ... which evolved over the years as stated above to its current form. which was substantially finished its evolution in 1985.
I have no need to reject the current Corporate fealty oath .... as I was baptized in the name of Jehovah, Christ Jesus, and presumably in the Holy Spirit, which I felt very strongly when I was baptized. in 1964 .
... before politics and lawyer driven agenda driven controls screwed the lid down.
Those of you who were baptized AFTER 1985 ... I feel very strongly sorry for you. as you have in actual fact dedicated your lives to the current version of "The Organization", and are in actual fact legally liable without recourse.
They "got" you. 
You are morally obligated to keep your oath, as stated at the time you made it.
Many people are very happy and content with the new arrangement, and its ramifications.
I sincerely hope you are one of them.
 
 
 
 

In the recent Watchtower book, “Pure Worship of Jehovah, Restored at Last!”, it is stated:
“In the past, our literature has referred to Christendom as the antitype of apostate Jerusalem. The conditions in unfaithful Jerusalem—including IDOLATRY AND WIDESPREAD CORRUPTION—certainly remind us of what is happening in Christendom. However, in recent years our publications, including the one you are now reading, have not taken the type-antitype approach to prophecy except where the Bible provides a clear basis for doing so. Is there a solid Scriptural basis for referring to Christendom as the ANTITYPICAL JERUSALEM? 
NO.
In view of the foregoing, what may we conclude? When we examine Bible prophecies that were fulfilled on unfaithful Jerusalem, we may say, ‘This or that reminds us of what we see in Christendom today.’ But there appears to be NO SCRIPTURAL BASIS for referring to Christendom as the antitypical Jerusalem.” Pure Worship of Jehovah—Restored At Last! p. 174
First off, what do they mean by “antitypical”? An “antitype” is, 
…something that corresponds to or is foreshadowed in a type
…or an opposite type.
After many years, the Watchtower is now saying Christendom does not correspond in any way to ancient Jerusalem. Jerusalem was the “holy city” of God. Under the New Covenant promise, “Jerusalem above” is the “city whose architect and builder is God”. Heb 11:10 It is referred in scripture as the “mother” of the anointed ones. Luke 22:20; Gal 4:26,24; Heb 9:15 Mothers bring life, and this mother/promise brings immortal life to those faithful sealed anointed ones. Together, they become the “New Jerusalem”, Zion. Heb 12:22,23 
As the fulfillment of that New Covenant/promise, “New Jerusalem”, the Holy City, will be seen “coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. Rev 21:2
And, as the fulfilled promise, the Bride will bring life to the rest of the children of God.
“And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Look! God’s DWELLING PLACE is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God.” Rev 21:3
Rom 8:19-21; Rev 22:17 
The city of Jerusalem was the location of God’s dwelling place – His temple at the time. Today, God “dwells” within the hearts of His anointed priests through His Holy Spirit. His dwelling place, or His “house”, is His Temple. 1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; 2 Cor 6:16; Eph 2:20-22
“New Jerusalem”, the Temple, the Holy City, all refer to one and the same; comprised of this priesthood joined under Christ, their High Priest. Heb 7:26 This makes “New Jerusalem” the “city/house that bears My name”. Acts 7:49; Rev 3:12
If Christendom is no longer taught as the “antitypical” Jerusalem, the organization can no longer point to Christendom to fulfill the many prophetic scriptures that concern the “holy city”/Temple/New Jerusalem. JWs, this means all the earlier teachings by the WT that point to Christendom as that “city” which receives condemnation for its abominations, realistically points to the anointed under covenant with God.
The organization admits:
“Jerusalem was the ONLY city in all the earth that was DIRECTLY ASSOCIATED WITH GOD’S NAME. (1 Kings 11:36; Matthew 5:35) It was the capital of a God-approved earthly kingdom. 06/7/15 p. 5,6
Past teachings of the WT tell a different story in the following quotes from the Watchtower:
#1 – Christendom’s congregations say ‘Lord, Lord,’ even as sexual immorality flourishes in their midst. “Will you steal and murder, commit adultery and perjury, burn incense to Baal and follow other gods you have not known,” Jehovah asks, “and then come and stand before me in THIS HOUSE, WHICH BEARS MY NAME, and say, ‘We are safe’—safe to do all these detestable things?”—Jeremiah 7:4, 8-10, g89/1/22 pg 11
#2 - Christendom will be the FIRST PART of this system of things to go down, for she is the modern-day counterpart of the apostate kingdom of Judah and Jerusalem. To typify that, the kingdom of Judah was made the first to drink the “cup” that contained “the wine of rage.” Jehovah said that it was with “THE CITY UPON WHICH [HIS] NAME IS CALLED” that he would start off in bringing the international calamity. (Jer. 25:29) Unchristlike Christendom is the most accountable religious section before God and Christ, and so from her the world calamity would go, as in a chain reaction. W79/9/15 pp. 22-29, par 23
Now, going back to the same book that declares, “there appears to be no Scriptural basis for referring to Christendom as the antitypical Jerusalem”, the statement is made,
#3 - “During the war of Armageddon, Jehovah will execute people, not in a cold, clinical manner, but in a “great rage.” (Read Ezekiel 38:18.) He will direct the explosive force of his anger, not against one army or one nation, but against countless individuals living across the globe. On that day, those slain by Jehovah “will be from one end of the earth clear to the other end of the earth.”—Jer. 25:29, 33. RR, chapter 18, pp. 189-199
Do you notice in all three quotes, reference is made by either listing scripture or by quoting it in the paragraph, to the “city” or “house that bears My name”, which today is the anointed in covenant with God?
Paragraph #1 quotes Jer 7:4,8-10: “Do not trust in deceptive words and say, “This is the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord, the temple of the Lord!” “But look, you are trusting in deceptive words that are worthless.9 “‘Will you steal and murder, commit adultery and perjury, burn incense to Baal and follow other gods you have not known, 10 and then come and stand before me IN THIS HOUSE, WHICH BEARS MY NAME, and say, We are safe”—safe to do all these detestable things?”
Is it not true that the “safe haven” for JWs is in “Jehovah’s spiritual temple” – the organization and a counterfeit Zion? This idol tramples down the authentic Temple of God, His priesthood. 1 Cor 3:16,17 Isn’t this a sign that God’s people are committing “spiritual adultery and perjury” through their devotion and dedication to “Jehovah’s spiritual temple”? Matt 24:15; 2 Thess 2:3,4, 9-12; Rev 11:1,2; 13:1,4-6
 
Paragraph #2 quotes Jer 25:29 – “See, I am beginning to bring disaster on THE CITY THAT BEARS MY NAME, and will you indeed go unpunished? You will not go unpunished, for I am calling down a sword on all who live on the earth, declares the Lord Almighty.’”
#3 - In this new book, although it clearly states Christendom does not correspond to Jerusalem, again Jer 25:29 is sited, which says the disaster in the last days comes upon THE CITY THAT BEARS MY NAME. Did you catch this, JWs? Can you untwist the history of Watchtower teachings and perceive what and where the disaster will fall? Yet, they deceitfully continue to put the blame of the prophetic disaster to come, on everyone else, except on the now apostate “city that bears My name”, the anointed under covenant with God. Deut 12:2-5; Zech 4:7-9; Rev 6:15,16; 8:8; 16:20
Pearl Doxsey wrote the following in 2013, well before the “new light” (barely visible) came into being:
God Himself says of His own people,
"The faithful city has become a harlot" Isa.1:21; 63:18; Rev.17:1
Is "Christendom" the "faithful city"?
If not...Then it is not the "harlot".
Hosea makes clear that this "harlotry" is the act of an "adulterous wife" (Hosea9:1; 1:2; 5:4; 9:1).
Being as a wife to God requires a marriage covenant (Isa.54:5,6,7; 48:17; Jer.3:8,14; Hosea2:19; Ps.73:27). 
Is "Christendom"/"nominal Christians" in covenant with God?
Revelation's Harlot is not "Christendom"/"nominal Christians" at all!...but are ruling, unfaithful anointed in covenant with God...
the "wicked steward" (Luke12:42,45; Rev.17:6) (Luke12:46; Hosea6:5; Jer.5:14; 23:29; Rev.18:8)
and all anointed who stay a part of her organizational Beast, are committing fornication with her (Rev.13:1; 17:2,12,16; 18:9; 1:5; 5:10; John18:36). 
From within that Sodom-like City, God will cleanse a remnant and restore them, IF they are repentant.  They are restored back to being "the city of righteousness, THE FAITHFUL CITY". (Isa.1:25,26,27; Zech.13:9; Mal.3:3; Zech.4:9,6,12,14; Rev.11:4,3; Rev.3:12; 21:2; Ps.48:8) 
Is that faithful remnant from the city OF JERUSALEM, from "Christendom"?
According to Jesus, "Jerusalem" is "the City of the living God/Great King" (Matt.5:35; Ps.48:2).
IT IS NOT “CHRISTENDOM”.
These prophecies about "Jerusalem" are not about "Christendom".
THESE PROPHECIES DO NOT APPLY AS THE “WATCHTOWER” HAS TAUGHT.
There is no "anti-typical Jerusalem" according to scripture.
If the Bible says "Jerusalem", it means "Jerusalem".
While their pride refuses to apply God's warnings and discipline to themselves;
the scriptural clarity of "Watchtower" ERROR, is inescapable.
The prophets of Jerusalem were compared to Sodom (Jer.23:14). Their land was to become a desolation (Jer.49:18; 50:39; Rev.18:2).
This speaks of God's people...Lam.4:6
DO NOT BE DECEIVED! (1Thess.5:3,6,7; Mark13:36,37,35) 
As a result, can Revelation’s end time fulfillment to come against God’s people, be sourced outside of the Watchtower and outside of where the House/dwelling/now “apostate” city of God resides? 
No! Not even Watchtower’s interpretation of the “King of the North.”
 “Son of man, will you judge her? Will you judge this city of bloodshed? Then confront her with all her detestable practices 3 and say: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: You city that brings on herself doom by shedding blood in her midst and defiles herself by making idols, 4 you have become guilty because of the blood you have shed and have become defiled by the idols you have made. You have brought your days to a close, and the end of your years has come. Therefore I will make you an object of scorn to the nations and a laughingstock to all the countries. 5 Those who are near and those who are far away will mock you, you infamous city, full of turmoil.
Again the word of the Lord came to me: 24 “Son of man, say to the land, ‘You are a land that has not been cleansed or rained on in the day of wrath.’ 25 There is a conspiracy of her princes within her like a roaring lion tearing its prey; they devour people, take treasures and precious things and make many widows within her. 26 Her priests do violence to my law and profane my holy things; they do not distinguish between the holy and the common; they teach that there is no difference between the unclean and the clean; and they shut their eyes to the keeping of my Sabbaths, so that I am profaned among them.27 Her officials within her are like wolves tearing their prey; they shed blood and kill people to make unjust gain. 28 Her prophets whitewash these deeds for them by false visions and lying divinations. They say, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says’—when the Lord has not spoken.29 The people of the land practice extortion and commit robbery; they oppress the poor and needy and mistreat the foreigner, denying them justice. Ezek 22:2-5,23-29
“Armageddon” – Obadiah’s blog
Pearl Doxsey, 4womaninthewilderness:
        “Sodom/Four Horsemen”
        “End of the New Covenant”
       “The Disgusting Thing Standing in a Holy Place”Matt 24:15
 

 
 

You crack me up Billy. The level in which you interact with others is very telling. 
 
Also, it doesn't hurt my feelings if you down vote my posts. It actually makes me smile..........because you read it. 

Spoken like a true arrogant WT lawyer .... or Gerritt Losch.
The bottom line is, you said NO, to my challenge.
 

This is very good sentence, from which i read next: 
All and every moment of efforts numbered here (intensive Bible study, organizational experience, faith in Jehovah, meditation and prayer) reveals one side - human efforts, to gain, what? ....these things are combination of preconditions, causes that will, supposedly,  result in spiritual guidance (from above). 
What i see here is, only/solely working (almost fleshly) efforts of particular human who strive to get, to receive something divinely, spiritually from God, by deeds, by work (aka intensive bible study, more preaching, more meetings etc).
What is omitted in this sentence (not by purpose and not from you personally) but by common/general view in WT organization is the role of Second Part in this "equation". Influence and power that depend of that very Person who is The Source of spiritual guidance.   
Pushing made by/from WTJWORG  how person must and have to do this and that and to do it more and more, is something that can be obstacle, dam, close door for Divine Power. Yes, Divine Power destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah or Jericho Walls, BUT it can be very "Powerless" to change human minds and hearts. Because in case of Sodom and Jericho we talking about Naked Power. But when people are involved, this Spirit Force is on Next Level, in my opinion, on level of soft, gently, unobtrusively, discretely actions and effects...... After all, JHVH ask, plead for love by your free will.

In God I trust.
All others pay cash!

GB Helper quote: "That person's relationship with JHVH is forever ruined. JHVH discards the person like a piece of garbage."
GB terminology: sinful person is garbage
CO terminology: someone's (person's) faith is garbage
"Garbage" is in WTJWORG lexic. And can be using for determining some person's spiritual or literal position inside WTJWORG or in front JHVH God.
 
 

This is very good sentence, from which i read next: 
All and every moment of efforts numbered here (intensive Bible study, organizational experience, faith in Jehovah, meditation and prayer) reveals one side - human efforts, to gain, what? ....these things are combination of preconditions, causes that will, supposedly,  result in spiritual guidance (from above). 
What i see here is, only/solely working (almost fleshly) efforts of particular human who strive to get, to receive something divinely, spiritually from God, by deeds, by work (aka intensive bible study, more preaching, more meetings etc).
What is omitted in this sentence (not by purpose and not from you personally) but by common/general view in WT organization is the role of Second Part in this "equation". Influence and power that depend of that very Person who is The Source of spiritual guidance.   
Pushing made by/from WTJWORG  how person must and have to do this and that and to do it more and more, is something that can be obstacle, dam, close door for Divine Power. Yes, Divine Power destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah or Jericho Walls, BUT it can be very "Powerless" to change human minds and hearts. Because in case of Sodom and Jericho we talking about Naked Power. But when people are involved, this Spirit Force is on Next Level, in my opinion, on level of soft, gently, unobtrusively, discretely actions and effects...... After all, JHVH ask, plead for love by your free will.

If you don't mind for my interruption in your's conversation. 
Isaac Newton or other similar person hasn't, as i know, created Organization in which people will worship someone or something. Isaac not made GB of self and few friends of him who interpreted Bible or some other Holy Book.
Religious nation as JW members, expecting more from GB than followers of Isaac would expected from him. Isaac was not made statements how he and his friends are only channel for spiritual food. :))
Saul of Tarsus believed in his strong "misinformation", that was based on Scriptures. He was "chosen" by JHVH for two  task. One task was to persecute Jesus's followers. Second task was that to put Saul under power that will change his "suited misinformation" and his wrong, misdirected "loyalty".  
Would Saul became Paul without his "wrong" way of worshiping? In fact, What was wrong with his faith in God when Scriptures teaches him to be zealous for JHVH name and to excommunicate (prosecute and persecute) all Jew who not worship god according to the Law?  
Dear JW Insider. Can i, by some of your perspective, make conclusion, how GB are in same/similar position and how in their "loyalty" and "misinformation zealous" also making forms of "prosecution and persecution" of those who disagree with the GB Law, because they see how their (god's) Organizing and Interpretations of Divine Will is Process of Rowing to the Some More Perfect and Final Point of worshiping god in the future? 
This is interesting. I have some specific personal experience about this. In one period of time i was jobless, and working many jobs including gardening. One day (between 2002-2005 i think) sister Tekla, while working on reception desk in Zagreb Betel received telephone call from one woman (Adventist) who are looking for JW who will gardening (shearing the grass and similar) in her garden. Tekla called me and i made phone call to this Lady and was working there for several seasons. Well, this Adventist woman was show more confident in JW than in her brothers from her congregation :))  (A little self praise and humor  - she was lucky that i was that one who get this call from Betel ahahhaha)      
 

That experience could be used at the next convention. Of course, it could be for other reasons. I know some Witnesses here who don't want other Witnesses doing their lawns and landscaping out of concern for privacy among the friends, or just to avoid business dealings and potential misunderstandings. We also had a brother in our congregation who ran a gas station only a quarter mile from the KH, and he was so taken advantage of that an announcement had to be made from the platform that brothers should pay their debts and not expect credit when doing business with fellow Witnesses.

OK. I see where you are coming from on this now. I don't know that the GB instructed the hiding from authorities and others in the congregation, but they certainly have known about the hiding, and have gone along with it, and could have ordered exposure of the problem instead of continued hiding. (In the past, hiding apparently happened in most, but not in all cases.) From that perspective, exposure of such crimes and sins would undoubtedly have reduced the problem. Especially the problem of repeat offenders. There are some cases that will probably never come to light in this system due to the systemic nature of trying to protect the reputation of an organization and leaders at the expense of protecting children.
They were late in their correct responses to this problem, in my opinion, but they do see it as a problem. Even if it's exposure and cost. But I know that many have seen it as a problem of justice for the victims, too. Unfortunately, that had previously been dismissed by some in power as less important.
Just an analogy to show how someone can be both right and wrong at the same time.
There are huge scriptural problems with this claim of the GB to be the exact and complete fulfillment of the FDS. I've dealt with that elsewhere. But we can't forget that it is a Christian duty to try to feed spiritual food to fellow Christians. The GB truly believe this is their duty and they also know that they are not perfect, and must admit to providing wrong guidance at times and sometimes bad spiritual food, too, in the form of false doctrines and false predictions. They probably thought them right at the time, but you are right, that it was not all 'food at the proper time.' 
People guided by God have made mistakes in Biblical times, when the very same persons had the privilege of seeing Jesus personally, or were even inspired at other times to write books of the Bible. Yet, the GB make no such claim about themselves that they are inspired in this same way. They feel that intensive Bible study, organizational experience, faith in Jehovah, meditation and prayer will all combine in some spiritual way to guide them. Other people have made claims that they claim inspiration, and the distinction gets blurry. And some Witnesses teach "present" truth as immutable in such a way that they, too, have blurred the distinction. In any case, God is not misguiding. It's just that people are so imperfect that we must learn to trust and obey God as ruler rather than sons of men in whom no salvation belongs.
No. The inability to question something is often because something just seems so clear and obvious that we just can't imagine that it could ever be wrong. Or it has been repeated so often that we can't imagine it could be wrong. We don't question things we are "sure" of. It happens to all of us, and then we might be surprised some day to find out we were wrong after all. But by not questioning, we probably will never have to find out.
So the early Corinthian congregation must also have been an unclean organization. Jesus' organization of his apostles must have been an unclean organization, too.
I think it will come close to that. It won't come immediately, but there will be some countries soon, I think, where we won't be allowed to preach unless we stop shunning family members for example. We will agree, and shunning will become a personal, private thing. Most Witnesses don't want to shun, we just do it because we are told it is loving. When there is no longer any threat of getting in trouble for not shunning, most of us will see that it is more loving not to shun. The change will happen organically from that point.
Food at the proper time.

If you don't mind for my interruption in your's conversation. 
Isaac Newton or other similar person hasn't, as i know, created Organization in which people will worship someone or something. Isaac not made GB of self and few friends of him who interpreted Bible or some other Holy Book.
Religious nation as JW members, expecting more from GB than followers of Isaac would expected from him. Isaac was not made statements how he and his friends are only channel for spiritual food. :))
Saul of Tarsus believed in his strong "misinformation", that was based on Scriptures. He was "chosen" by JHVH for two  task. One task was to persecute Jesus's followers. Second task was that to put Saul under power that will change his "suited misinformation" and his wrong, misdirected "loyalty".  
Would Saul became Paul without his "wrong" way of worshiping? In fact, What was wrong with his faith in God when Scriptures teaches him to be zealous for JHVH name and to excommunicate (prosecute and persecute) all Jew who not worship god according to the Law?  
Dear JW Insider. Can i, by some of your perspective, make conclusion, how GB are in same/similar position and how in their "loyalty" and "misinformation zealous" also making forms of "prosecution and persecution" of those who disagree with the GB Law, because they see how their (god's) Organizing and Interpretations of Divine Will is Process of Rowing to the Some More Perfect and Final Point of worshiping god in the future? 
This is interesting. I have some specific personal experience about this. In one period of time i was jobless, and working many jobs including gardening. One day (between 2002-2005 i think) sister Tekla, while working on reception desk in Zagreb Betel received telephone call from one woman (Adventist) who are looking for JW who will gardening (shearing the grass and similar) in her garden. Tekla called me and i made phone call to this Lady and was working there for several seasons. Well, this Adventist woman was show more confident in JW than in her brothers from her congregation :))  (A little self praise and humor  - she was lucky that i was that one who get this call from Betel ahahhaha)      
 

If you don't mind for my interruption in your's conversation. 
Isaac Newton or other similar person hasn't, as i know, created Organization in which people will worship someone or something. Isaac not made GB of self and few friends of him who interpreted Bible or some other Holy Book.
Religious nation as JW members, expecting more from GB than followers of Isaac would expected from him. Isaac was not made statements how he and his friends are only channel for spiritual food. :))
Saul of Tarsus believed in his strong "misinformation", that was based on Scriptures. He was "chosen" by JHVH for two  task. One task was to persecute Jesus's followers. Second task was that to put Saul under power that will change his "suited misinformation" and his wrong, misdirected "loyalty".  
Would Saul became Paul without his "wrong" way of worshiping? In fact, What was wrong with his faith in God when Scriptures teaches him to be zealous for JHVH name and to excommunicate (prosecute and persecute) all Jew who not worship god according to the Law?  
Dear JW Insider. Can i, by some of your perspective, make conclusion, how GB are in same/similar position and how in their "loyalty" and "misinformation zealous" also making forms of "prosecution and persecution" of those who disagree with the GB Law, because they see how their (god's) Organizing and Interpretations of Divine Will is Process of Rowing to the Some More Perfect and Final Point of worshiping god in the future? 
This is interesting. I have some specific personal experience about this. In one period of time i was jobless, and working many jobs including gardening. One day (between 2002-2005 i think) sister Tekla, while working on reception desk in Zagreb Betel received telephone call from one woman (Adventist) who are looking for JW who will gardening (shearing the grass and similar) in her garden. Tekla called me and i made phone call to this Lady and was working there for several seasons. Well, this Adventist woman was show more confident in JW than in her brothers from her congregation :))  (A little self praise and humor  - she was lucky that i was that one who get this call from Betel ahahhaha)      
 

Oh @JW Insider it's probably not worth the effort to answer you but I have a bit of time before my darling wife puts my dinner on the table for me.
Let's start with a Quote "You probably know that there were infamous cases of immorality that Paul referred to in his letters even to the very Corinthian congregations that Paul himself had "planted." 
Are look Paul made the immorality known. Whereas, the Elders of the JW congregations hid it all in leters to their HQ and in filing cabinets. Why did the elders hide it ? Because on instructions from the GB. That's why it is all coming into the open now. It follows scripture about 'nothing being hidden that will not be revealed' ...
Quote " But when the Org sees it as a problem, .. "  The Org didn't see it as a problem. It was put 'in their face' by victims of abuse. The problem the GB saw was the cost of the court cases and compensations. 
Why do you use examples of people 'of the world' such as Isaac Newton etc ? They were not 'supposed to be guided by God's Holy Spirit' were they ? 
Your GB pretend to be the 'Faithful and discreet slave' providing the PROPER FOOD at the RIGHT TIME'.  BUT they have to keep changing the food as they give poison instead. So how can they be guided by God to do that ? Do you really think God deliberately misguides His people ? 
Quote "I can't see how it "suits themselves."  The Armageddon threats are obviously to frighten people to get baptised and serve the JW Org. I'm sure we've had quotes on here where the Watchtowers would say the only way to 'get saved' through Armageddon was to be in the Org. More members = more donations.  But then, as with the 7,000 year creative days, it all falls apart and can be seen as lies.  
Quote "the inability to question 1914" ? Are you suggesting more lies ? 
Quote "It's now just a matter of fully implementing the processes that have been put in place." And the two witness rule, what of that ? I'm sure in my own mind that the scripture was not for that use. 
Quote " I  think we agree completely on shunning. I have no doubt at all that we have been implementing the shunning practice in an unchristian, unscriptural, and unloving manner. "
So are we looking at a 100% turnaround on it then ? I very much doubt that.  Remember ,'By their works you will know them'.
Quote " I would never claim we are more moral than any other group of people.".  That's one thing we can agree on then.  
But that being the case, thousands of JW's are hypocrites. So it's an unclean Org. 
Quote "If enough Witnesses perform their Christian duty, however, even a mass of disfellowshippings will automatically produce changes. "
I was hoping for a mass 'leaving the JW Org when I left, but it didn't happen. I was hoping that would have produced change.
Enough for now , my wife is calling me to dinner. 

You probably know that there were infamous cases of immorality that Paul referred to in his letters even to the very Corinthian congregations that Paul himself had "planted." So it doesn't seem reasonable that if the GB had acted as Paul was saying that Child Abuse / Pedophilia would somehow no longer be a problem.
No, I don't see it as just collateral damage. But when the Org sees it as a problem, I do think it's necessary for its leaders to do all they can to remove it, and "progress" in processes and procedures that can be seen to help eliminate it.
I had said that "the core of the religion itself is one that does perhaps the best job of all religions in fighting the machinations of the Devil" to which you replied:
You are asking how it can be logical I guess that someone can be right on some things and not on others. I think you probably already know of many examples. Isaac Newton was right on a surprising number of things, but was wrong on some things, too, and only partially right on many things that he could not have been fully aware of at the time, so that he is still considered right for all practical purposes on many of those things. Aristotle, Pythagoras, St. Augustine, Jerome, Attilla the Hun, Martin Luther, Charles Taze Russell, probably even Hitler were both right on things and wrong on things. We remember them for their overall value or detriment to people or societies.
Misinformation reaches us from liars, but usually from people who truly believe the misinformation, even if it does NOT suit their own purposes. Can you imagine that Rutherford really thought he was lying when he predicted that the "Old Testament" princes like Abraham and David would come back in 1925? If so, he was preparing to be made fun of, to be seen as a fool. He evidently even admitted that he had made an a** of himself, according to the Watchtower. That doesn't strike me as trying to suit his own purposes.
Just as with Rutherford, I can't see how it "suits themselves." It's because of misinformation that they have believed for the same reason that we have believed it. GB are chosen not because of their ability to question, but because of their "loyalty." In other words, they are chosen for their reputation of not questioning. But when they get into that position, they realize that questions do come at them that are difficult to answer. Except for the "generation" fiasco, I think most changes since around 2000 or so have been for the better. And the only reason for the "generation" fiasco is the inability to question 1914. It seems like just too much of a coincidence.
It took a while, but I think they've almost gone as far as they can as of the most recent Watchtower article that covers this topic. It's now just a matter of fully implementing the processes that have been put in place. There is still a matter of compensating for the past, and this is a difficult issue to be discussed elsewhere, I hope.
I think we agree completely on shunning. I have no doubt at all that we have been implementing the shunning practice in an unchristian, unscriptural, and unloving manner. I can see our practice as OK from an "OT" perspective, but not at all from a "NT" perspective. If I get in complete trouble with the Org, it will be because I refuse to shun beyond what is written in the scriptures. I am more concerned about being in trouble with Jehovah than with humans in an organization. And even then, if I am shunned, it does not mean that I will shun in return. As far as it depends upon us, we should work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to us in the faith.
No. Very serious. I think that moral cleanliness is preached correctly, even though we see that there are exceptions to how it is practiced. Many Witnesses lead double lives. Many are involved in adultery, fornication, child sexual abuse, spousal abuse, violence against children, cheating, lying, drugs, etc. But most aren't, and most appreciate the value and reminders we get from the platform. Most of us appreciate the association of like-minded persons who also wish to remain clean. I have heard persons say that they wish they could only hire Seventh Day Adventists and Jehovah's Witnesses, one time from a person who didn't know I was a Witness. I know of worldly persons who have come into the congregation to try to find a wife from among JWs, based on admiration of their morals. I would never claim we are more moral than any other group of people. But I think we have the best advantage in terms of an overall call to morality that includes not only personal morality, but a realization that we should not even be tainted by immorality of commercial greed, nationalistic murderous wars, etc.
Sure. It might turn out to be a temporary sacrifice for some of us. Some of us might have found ways to question and avoid any consequences. If enough Witnesses perform their Christian duty, however, even a mass of disfellowshippings will automatically produce changes. Open questioning of doctrines at Bethel became common as early as 1974 when it was obvious that 1975 would not likely turn out as Fred Franz had been repeatedly hinting at, even though he didn't predict "1975." (He only predicted what must happen before the 1970's were complete, because of 1975.) Questions became open at Bethel tables, and around Bethel "water coolers" until a crackdown began happening in mid-1978 through 1979. People got dismissed and disfellowshipped in large numbers, but this also resulted in a backlash and exposure of the witch hunting and star-chamber methods. I think the Internet itself is already resulting in a flood of questions all over again that are proving very valuable. It is these that have been been driving many of the new (and better) doctrinal changes since 2000.  

Dear Billy, If you are JW member you already know the answer on this, that was given not only by JW but also by other kind of people (religious and non religious people) who rejecting/ed to obey something that is violate their conscience or moral standards. Some would call this act as civil disobedience. 
If you are JW member perhaps you done this also, or at least you know someone from your worldwide brotherhood who has done this and disobeyed secular authority on some issue (WTJWORG publications wrote about).  
Your question addressed to me on this issue, and in this way is out of power, it is mishit . :))

That's a very revealing statement about where you would love to live, but it would certainly explain a Lot (and Lot's wife, even more so).