Srecko Sostar

Romans13
1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4 for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing. 7 Pay to all what is owed to them: taxes to whom taxes are owed, revenue to whom revenue is owed, respect to whom respect is owed, honor to whom honor is owed.
 
How come this does not come into the minds of jws when talking about CSA and the authorities? 

If conversation about this issue can make frustration of sort inside this circle of us who talking from distance to each other, imagine what heavy and hard and painful it is for those who experienced this things and must be in face to face situation ! 

What would it be if it were happened.....
We do not need this imagination because we have real people with real events dear Anna.

Did WT made change about need for TWO witnesses?
Did WT allow that sisters/women be present in investigation process as support for male and especially female minors victims and other victims  no matter of ages? 
Did WT allow that sister/women be involved in Judicial process that involve sex crimes and domestic violence inside and outside family environment when female victims are involved? 
Did WT open secret files and fully cooperate with police and Courts?
.....etc.
 
 

Quote @Anna  "....you just want the congregation to be informed to protect the children in that congregation. "
I don't think it is possible to instruct the Elders that you want the congregation to be informed.... As far as I am aware the Elders DO NOT INFORM the congregation that there is a Pedophile within it. They certainly would not name the Pedophile. 
And it seems you are advising the idea of hiding a Pedophile within the JW Org, which is one of the things I've been saying from square one.  By not informing the police it would be hiding that Pedophile in that congregation. It would also be protecting a criminal. 
Quite strange really as this is what you are accusing me of, failing in my duty to report it.  But in this 'hypothetical situation' he would have first hand evidence, therefore be more entitled to report it, and more morally duty bound to do so. 
But also, are you saying that the Elders are not bound by scripture / service to God, to report it to the police, even if there is no 'law' of the land to do so ? Are you suggesting that those men (Elders) who, you would say, are chosen by God or Jesus Christ, through Holy Spirit,  yet are not bound to care for the safety of people inside and outside the JW Org ? Is there not obligation for such ones to care for widows and orphans, and little children within and outside the Org if it is possible for them to do so. 

This is now sounding exactly like Allen Smith. 

The GB twist scripture to create doctrine.  For not accepting doctrine outside of God's Word , I was disfellowshipped, it wasn’t for rejecting the Word of God. 
Does it stop with the apostles?  Should the rest of the Temple of God (anointed Body of Christ) begin obeying uninspired men and their false priesthood?  It is clear that this is evidence of a "wicked slave" that "beats" down his fellow slaves into submissiveness.  Matt 24:48-51  The entire congregation is under their thumb.  If the anointed priesthood are not used, then how can the organization call itself Zion?  As John Butler said, "The TRUE Anointed (Temple stones,1 Cor 3:16,17) would know how to use the scriptures properly. "   They would use the law written on their heart to judge and teach in righteousness.  
Many peoples will come and say,
“Come, let us go up to the mountain of the Lord,
    to the temple of the God of Jacob.
He will teach us his ways,
    so that we may walk in his paths.”
The law will go out from Zion,
    the word of the Lord from Jerusalem.  Isa 2:3
If faithful, they will reigning “kings”. Rev 5:9,10  Who is King of Kings?  Rev 19:16  You are expecting others to replace the Head of the Body – Christ.  There is no substitute leader over the anointed ones. 
Yet, an anointed "leader" of true teachings of Christ does not expect obedience to them, but to the Word. This is how the “saints will judge the world” – not by their opinion, but the Word, the decrees of God fulfilled in Christ, that issues from their hearts. Heb 4:12; 8:10-12  They are to teach the Word of God which leads/directs people to  the Word, - to Christ and the Father.   Mal 2:7; John 13:20 
This is how they are found to be "faithful and discreet" when Jesus returns.  Matt 25:23
This is only possible if the same “living water” from Christ fills their heart.  Any deviance from Christ’s teachings, such as doctrine of men, is blasphemy.  It is also blasphemy that Christ’s priests/kings are to obey those not anointed and those who speak falsehoods, which is failed doctrine and “empty words”.  Eph 5:6; Matt 7:15-20
Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.
Jesus answered, “My teaching is not my own. It comes from the one who sent me.  John 7:16
Matt 7:24-26; 10:12-15; 12:36,37; 19:11; John 7:38, etc.
If you support others to rule over the anointed, you support spiritual “Gentiles” ruling over spiritual “Jews”/”Israel” – God’s possession.   You support the Man of Lawlessness who has “set himself up” in the Temple of God.  2 Thess 2:3,4,7; Rev 11:1-3; Matt 24:14-16
I do hope you can see this. 
 
 
 

What would it be if it were happened.....
We do not need this imagination because we have real people with real events dear Anna.

Did WT made change about need for TWO witnesses?
Did WT allow that sisters/women be present in investigation process as support for male and especially female minors victims and other victims  no matter of ages? 
Did WT allow that sister/women be involved in Judicial process that involve sex crimes and domestic violence inside and outside family environment when female victims are involved? 
Did WT open secret files and fully cooperate with police and Courts?
.....etc.
 
 

I like this thought very much. First time that i saw somebody put it in writing or say it aloud in this simple but distinctive sentence. Bravo John!

Terminology:  judicial committee and reinstated are clearly, plainly Corporational words in WTJworg inc. Religion.
 The Bible calls people to forgive each other's sins.  The Bible invites us to pray to God in this way:  and forgive us our debts (sins), as we also have forgiven our debtors.
By MESSAGE in Lord's Prayer, God is very willful to forgive all sins to people, .... in fact he has already done that, even before your birthday. By Jesus words, God is more interested for another thing, that people forgiving each other. Because Jesus speaks of a precondition; "Forgive your neighbor" ... then God will look at you mercifully too.
If we confess our sins, [God] is faithful and righteous so as to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
“Openly confess your sins to one another and pray for one another, that you may get healed.” 
By this Bible logic in this 3 places it is not needed to give confess and/or ask for forgiveness from some Legal Religious Body.
Ones "secret sin" will be "forgiven" if you in your mind and heart "confess" it to God, not to men.
Another thing is our psychological side and our inside need to "tell someone" about our inside soul problem and turmoil.
"Sin" aka injustice that ones have done to his neighbor is also separate thing. If you are aware of your bad act toward somebody around you, then you must go to this person who you offend, say bad words, done bad or evil thing. You must confess and ask forgiveness FROM HIM.   

I like this thought very much. First time that i saw somebody put it in writing or say it aloud in this simple but distinctive sentence. Bravo John!

I can clearly see that @Anna is doing her very best to go OFF TOPIC. 
She sees me as an easy target, which she thinks will distract people from the EARTHWIDE CHILD ABUSE within the JW ORGANISATION.
She also tries to pretend that it is all about ABUSE IN THE PAST. Not true of course as many recent cases seem to be coming to light. 
And those victims from the past 50 years are still suffering. It's a lifetime thing, it does not go away. 
Does anyone have a follow up on the English translation of the BLUE LETTERS topic ? 
It might just add a bit more fuel to the fire  
By the way Anna it seems to have been proven that Elders deliberately destroy 'notes' / paperwork about Child Abuse accusations, so that when Police ask for the evidence it's 'no longer available'. So I would not go and warn the elders anyway. Why would i want to give them chance to destroy evidence ?  If I did take any action it would be to go directly to the Police, but it is doubtful that I will.  

I like this thought very much. First time that i saw somebody put it in writing or say it aloud in this simple but distinctive sentence. Bravo John!

If i can recall this post of John about this information (correct me if it is wrong) John has heard that from other person. So now, we here are in some similar, strange position, because we heard, about crime that has happened, from John. 
I think how some scientific discipline, like sociology and psychology, could explain what happens inside people in such situations we talking about. Why do we react or not react? How do we react? Why we do not want to interfere in someone else's problems? Why it easier to be passive and to go on other side? .... etc. 

You do say some stupid things Kid. I never once said the GB or JW Org wrote the Bible. BUT they did translate it to suit their own use, and they DO MISUSE SCRIPTURE that was meant for our instruction, guidance and protection.
The GB make up rules for disfellowshipping. They do not only use the instruction from the scriptures, such as you have quoted above, but the GB add their own interpretations to it. If they in fact used the principal from the instruction as mentioned above, then there would be far fewer pedophiles in the JW org.... Each one that was found would be removed, handed over to the local authorities/police, and not hidden in the Org. 
One thing you seem to have overlooked though is this is an Anointed man (Paul ) talking to other Anointed men. This brings us back to the perfection of the Anointed that I mentioned earlier. It also confirms to me that the Bible is written for the Anointed not for the Earthly class. The TRUE Anointed would know how to use the scriptures properly. 
Now in the JW congregations the Elders and Circuit Overseers or equivalent are mostly not of the Anointed, and therefore are not qualified to do the judging. And when it is a crime that has been committed then it becomes a legal matter not a spiritual one. Hence it should be immediately handed over to the legal authorities, 'that stand in place by God Himself, to do God's will in dealing with such matters, as mentioned in God's written word.
As for those 'in the body of Christ', they are the TRUE ANOINTED, NOT THE GB of JW Org. 
 

It most certainly does negate and or replace the criminal aspect if they do not take it to the police. They are then an accomplice to covering up abuse. Why do you think there are so many lawsuits going on right now?  
 
Are you just playing dumb or are you serious? I think you are trying to make this seem silly and petty, when in fact it is far from it. Children are being raped and molested, and this org and its supporters of "WT policy" are covering it up and refusing to protect the victims and or future victims.
 
Was it considered lies by the devil or Satan's media/fake news when this was/is going on within the Catholic church and jws talked about it then? 
 

If it is so as this declaration No 10 say, than WHY elders must contact Legal Department first on how this purely religious proceeding must continue. ?? How it is possible that mature elders can not decide (independently, according to their so called "Bible-educated" conscience or better - according to their Natural God given Conscience) how first thing, in benefit for the victim, is that POLICE have to secure PHYSICAL SAFETY FOR VICTIM, and then after this first step or parallel to this very first move that  must been done, is SPIRITUAL SAFETY for victim that this so called "mature men" have to provide. 
According to your brother Asch in his deposition, he made this CLEAR DISTINCTION about PHYSICAL SAFETY and SPIRITUAL SAFETY and how WT GB and their Lawyers defending themselves and their money and their Organizational Honor.
Your respond on John's post is how things he mentioned is from past, in 1980 es. ARC is from 2015 and WT elders in Australia are very bad role model as those elders from 1980 period. No progress was made in benefit for victims. All because of money and WTJWorg Corporation Public Picture.
Face the TRUTH and Reality please!

If it is so as this declaration No 10 say, than WHY elders must contact Legal Department first on how this purely religious proceeding must continue. ?? How it is possible that mature elders can not decide (independently, according to their so called "Bible-educated" conscience or better - according to their Natural God given Conscience) how first thing, in benefit for the victim, is that POLICE have to secure PHYSICAL SAFETY FOR VICTIM, and then after this first step or parallel to this very first move that  must been done, is SPIRITUAL SAFETY for victim that this so called "mature men" have to provide. 
According to your brother Asch in his deposition, he made this CLEAR DISTINCTION about PHYSICAL SAFETY and SPIRITUAL SAFETY and how WT GB and their Lawyers defending themselves and their money and their Organizational Honor.
Your respond on John's post is how things he mentioned is from past, in 1980 es. ARC is from 2015 and WT elders in Australia are very bad role model as those elders from 1980 period. No progress was made in benefit for victims. All because of money and WTJWorg Corporation Public Picture.
Face the TRUTH and Reality please!

@BillyTheKid46 Quote : This is why the GB adheres to scripture without confusing its understanding like many here.
That is a good laugh ! Thanks Kid.
Like the two witness rule used in Child Abuse cases, but not used in Fornication accusations.  
And the fact that a person has to agree to 'serve' the Org when they get baptised. 
Kid you are completely blind. 

Oops.  If they expect obedience from their anointed “brothers”, they certainly have “substituted” themselves for Christ, robbing the lowly insignificant anointed of their ability to listen only to Christ.    The GB have made it very clear by their  Bible translation, using the word "substitute" twice, for emphasis.  NWT 2 Cor 5:20  Since they claim to be the only "faithful and discreet slave", who other than themselves can "substitute" for Christ?  Matt 24:48-51
In reality, no one.  No one can substitute as the Head of the anointed Body of Christ.  
Another oops.  Their false “priesthood”, the elder body, do just that.  Haven't you heard of a "judicial committee"?  They have the power to kick someone out as a sinner, and feel qualified to discern that God has forgiven a sinner, to allow them back in the congregation.
Where have you been?
 
 

Should watch the Australian royal commission on child sex abuse within JWs victims which is available online and you will see first hand how our procedures and everything is handle within the organization, you will be shocked. 
It has been some years since then and we have heard nothing from it and no 1 policy changed even though many several recommendations were given by the Australian commission to be changed.

Anna,
So you are not going to give your answer, and instead regurgitate what the wt says.  
 
Did you notice that nothing is said of taking this "serious sin" to the police, when in fact it is a serious crime? 

You really don't want to listen do you.
The Elders know about the situation. The Elders have the names of both parties concerned. I don't have the name of the victim.
Now if what you say is true, the Elders would have already informed the Police right ?  No, i don't think so. 
And i cannot talk to the accused or the Elders as I have left the org and not one of the 120 / 130 people will talk to me. 
Now i haven't told people not to talk to me, so it's their fault if I cannot warn them. I left the Org so that i could warn people, but those congregants have chosen of their own free will (because of fear of punishment) not to talk to me. So i no longer feel responsible. 
Nearly 12 pm here in England, so good night to you.