Srecko Sostar

I was being sarcastic

... just one complex thought ... destroying whole families  to discipline one person is philosophical familial genocide.
Shunning should NOT be an institutional mandate ... or why do we even NEED a conscience at all?
There is a REASON "The love of the greater number will cool off".
Cruelty.
 

That is how control is maintained ... fear through arbitrary punishment that makes no sense,  for fear you will be NEXT.
The same thing happened in Vietnam ... the logic was "we have wasted so many lives, we need to send more to validate them."

Of course it's all politics ... and the current policy is also cruel, and unscriptural.
That is how control is maintained ... fear through arbitrary punishment that makes no sense, for something someone else did, for fear you will be NEXT.

I know I'm late in this thread, but I disassociated myself, some jw's shunned me and some didn't. I know some disgellowshiped ones who still had a relationship with their jw family.
But I ask, how do elders punish someone if they are not jw's?

Let's baptize pregnant mothers.........

what he said, please? to make you change your mind? in reasoning you made down 
"reason why 1975 was brought up again (at convention) was because it was a reminder that the Slave err, and that some of the new things i.e. the OVERLAPPING GENERATION theory was perhaps to be treated with caution."
because i can not believe that you believe in such logic  you stated
and what kind of logic Herd provide to win your logic
 

Just so you know @DespicableME, I removed my own comment regarding a link about a porn star who left the JWs. With that comment gone, your comment in response to it (referencing Ruud) seemed even more out of place, so I deleted it along with mine. I didn't do this as a censorship, just didn't want to make your comment seem more awkward than it was.
Just so you know @Srecko Sostar someone (not me) moved your comments about copyright to a new topic, linked below, so I moved the other followup comments from this topic over there too, which included a couple of my responses. I ended up dragging over about 10 comments that had veered off onto that topic, also affecting comments by @DespicableME and @Noble Berean
 

No.......but I can discuss this in the appropriate topic

1924 "The year 1925 is a date definitely and clearly marked in Scriptures, even more clearly than that of 1914. (Watchtower 1924, p. 211)
1968 "True, there have been those in times past who predicted an "end" to the world, even announcing a specific date. Yet nothing happened. The 'end' did not come. They were guilty of false prophesying. Why? What was missing? Missing from such people were God's truths and the evidence that He was using and guiding them.'' (Awake, Oct. 8, 1968)
1971 -  "Shortly, within our twentieth century, the "battle in the day of Jehovah" will begin against the modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom." (The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah; 1971; 2nd ed.; p. 216)
“The true prophet never foretold simply to satisfy human curiosity. Every prediction related to God’s will, purpose, standards, or judgment. (1Ki 11:29-39; Isa 7:3-9) Often the future events foretold were the consequence of existing conditions; as the people sowed, so they would reap. The false prophets lulled the people and their leaders with soothing assurances that, despite their unrighteous course, God was still with them to protect and prosper them. (Jer 23:16-20; 28:1-14; Eze 13:1-16; compare Lu 6:26.) it-2 pp. 694-698
“When faced with far-reaching decisions, we do not trust in our own wisdom but look to Jehovah and his organization for guidance.  
And just as a child seeks his parents’ protection when a storm rages, we seek protection in Jehovah’s organization when, like a thunderstorm, the problems of this world strike us.”  Wt 11/4/15 pp. 3-5
It-2 continued:  But the true prophet was not solely or even primarily a prognosticator, as has been shown. Rather, he was an advocate of righteousness, and his message dealt primarily with moral standards and their application. He expressed God’s mind on matters. (Isa 1:10-20; Mic 6:1-12) Hence, it was not necessary to wait perhaps for years or generations to determine whether the prophet was true or false by fulfillment of a prediction. If his message contradicted God’s revealed will and standards, he was false. Thus, a prophet who foretold peace for Israel or Judah, at a time when the people were engaging in disobedience to God’s Word and Law, of necessity was false.
“Jehovah’s people enjoy a special environment of peace in the earthly part of his organization.”  Wt 15/7/15 
“For when they say, ‘Peace and safety!’ then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape.”  1 Thess 5:3
“See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ.”  Col 2:8
 “But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death.”  Deut 18:20 
 “‘Because they lead my people astray, saying, “Peace,” when there is no peace, and because, when a flimsy wall is built, they cover it with whitewash,  therefore tell those who cover it with whitewash that it is going to fall. Rain will come in torrents, and I will send hailstones hurtling down, and violent winds will burst forth.  When the wall collapses, will people not ask you, “Where is the whitewash you covered it with?”  Ezek 13:10-12
 
 

Gotta feel sorry for those who feel they have to have a relationship with a book publishing company in order to have a relationship with God.

-fair use rule as far is "fair" for those to whom critics is addressed. WTBTS is proud when can address "argumentative, Bible based" critics, judgement, revealing of hypocrisy in other parts of human society (religious,as first choice and then other, politics and trade systems).
But when observers, critics, ex members or even JW members questioning, reveals inside spiritual and hierarchical structure of doctrines, rules, instructions and corporational moves in aspects of money and such part of life inside WT, then WT consider such behavior as "not fair use", even against law of "publishing rights" or "intellectual property" and against WT freedom of speech, freedom of religion.   
Double standard? or theocratic warfare methods?

Much of what the Watch Tower Society has produced since 1879 is in the pubic domain. MOST of what is not already in the public domain has been offered to the public, and if a price was put on it, this was said to only "cover the cost of printing."  Then the outcome of some lawsuits (e.g., Jimmy Swaggart) convinced the WTS to stop requesting a specific price for the items if they wanted to keep their tax-free status in the United States. At this point it was declared that the literature offered to the public was to be distributed free of charge, and within a few years this policy was also applied to the rest of the world. Also, all Jehovah's Witnesses have been commended in the same publications of the WTS for their free and wide distribution of literature (Bibles, books, tracts, booklets, magazines, videos) in the Yearbooks, pointing out that even an Internet distribution can be counted as one of those placements. 
You may also look up the term "Bible-based literature" and "Bible-based publications" on the Watchtower Library CD and notice the number of times that such literature is not only indicated as free, but "life-saving," "life-improving," "important" and again, individuals are praised for considering it and reading it even when they were not the intended audience. The costs of transporting it to remote regions is noted. The fact that there are volunteers of all ages who are involved in all aspects of publication and delivery is also important.
So the copyright issue of "fair use" on a forum where much of the content of those publications is discussed for learning and critiquing is a fair point, and I think that hundreds of Witnesses and non-Witnesses have sites that break the "fair use" rule. But it's also quite possible that the WTS finds itself between a rock and hard place, or like Moses, "between the Pharaoh and the deep Red Sea." Because the WTS has already praised volunteers who distribute and promote this free, life-saving literature, they would look hypocritical if they began picking on sites that provide extensive access and quotes to such literature, along with discussion of the same. Legally, they could go after all sites except their own, but this would also give out the impression that they are afraid of critique in the way Scientologists are, for example.

It started officially when "offset" printing in color was being tried in 1978. (My Book of Bible Stories) But the Photoplate Dept with E.Robinson, B.Gehring, (and Randy and Maureen mentioned earlier) was already able to do this, with a very large expensive camera, bought in 1975, where half of the camera was in a darkroom. It didn't take the pictures of people, and was rarely used for still objects, but it could take an existing photo or piece of art, and add the screen filters so that the final negative or positive could be used to create a metal plate from which to produce photos on paper. This practice has been used for over 100 years, especially in newspapers. But both special effects and simple versions of artwork based on a photo could now be used, especially since 1975 with the new camera, stat cameras, and darkroom procedures that all of the artists were able to take advantage of. (Most didn't take advantage and just sent their line drawings in two or three colors to Photoplate, and then Ed and Randy would use a color filter to produce a black plate and a color plate.) Except for the Bible Stories book, all magazines and books up until then still used only two ink colors plus black on each magazine, and any one picture was always in just black and one of the two ink colors. That changed in the 80's but not overnight. Models had been used by the artists for their work since the 1960's. But different artists preferred different methods, often just copying from photographs and magazines.

I do not know when Art Department started to making photos (and after videos) with JW members as actors of JW and non-JW for purpose of illustration in publications and after for real photographs of real people :)))) even in artificial, fictive, SF situations.

Hi James. But you know how the illustration from WT magazine said - "Would you drink a water from a glass where most of  water is clear, healthy water but only one drop of poisson??
And you made another ratio - 15% clear healthy water and 85% of questionable substance   

That is actually hilarious

@Srecko Sostar listed a few faithful and discreet slave teachings; here are a few more.  Still, they don't cover them all.
Russel was considered the “faithful slave”, even up to 1923.
At one point it was taught that Jesus AND/OR the anointed ones were the “faithful slave”.  (1927)
Wt 13/7/15 pp. 20-25 - “Jesus did not say that he would appoint an evil slave. His words here are actually a warning directed to the faithful and discreet slave.”
If these words are a warning, should the possibility be completely dismissed that an evil slave can indeed exist? Presently, the self-assuming governing body says there is no evil slave.    
With this parable, the purported “faithful slave” today has decided to erase a good deal of its application to suit their needs; and only accept Matt 24:45-47 as verifiable scripture – that they fulfill the term, “faithful and discreet”.  In fact, David Splane remarked that the “slave” is not 1900 years old. 
Srecko, I believe you can flush all those ‘old light’ teachings about a faithful slave, down the toilet.  (Matt 7:17-20; John 15:16)
The rest of the matter concerning the faithful slave, Matt 24:48-51, has been discarded.  The GB has proposed a straw man argument to refute Jesus’ warnings of their own debased tactics used against their “fellow servants”.  With one sweep of the hand, individuals, both anointed and those not anointed are disfellowshipped for rejecting “new light”; while the governing body is still considered “faithful and discreet” above and beyond any further established “new light” that they most assuredly will decree.  Matt 5:11,12; Isa 66:5; John 16:2; James 4:12
 “New light” is an actual rejection of their own doctrine. 
This implies that one’s faithfulness is gauged on accepting man’s changing doctrine.  That doctrine appears to carry more validity than God’s scriptures.  Man’s decrees can substitute what Jesus and the apostles have outlined for us. Watchtower doctrine, is a yoke placed on the shoulders of “fellow servants” that is never relieved, but only made heavier. It is the result of the "timeline of the light getting brighter".    Ezek 34:16
 “King Rehoboam took counsel with the old men, who had stood before Solomon his father while he yet lived, saying, “What counsel do you give me to return answer to this people?”
 They spoke to him, saying, “If you are kind to this people, and please them, and speak good words to them, then they will be your servants forever.”
 But he abandoned the counsel of the old men which they had given him, and took counsel with the young men who had grown up with him, who stood before him.  He said to them, “What counsel do you give, that we may return answer to this people, who have spoken to me, saying, ‘Make the yoke that your father put on us lighter?’”
 The young men who had grown up with him spoke to him, saying, “Thus you shall tell the people who spoke to you, saying, ‘Your father made our yoke heavy, but make it lighter on us;’ thus you shall say to them, ‘My little finger is thicker than my father’s waist.  Now whereas my father burdened you with a heavy yoke, I will add to your yoke. My father chastised you with whips, but I will chastise you with scorpions.’”
 Is this not true with the Wt. changes of who is the “faithful slave”?  It has come to the point that the  anointed now must listen to seven men, not to Christ individually. They also must obey an army of elders. God’s anointed people are treated as imbeciles who are unable to discern truth on their own, contrary to every scripture that refers to their ability to do so. James 1:5; John 14:26; 1 John 2:20,21
Jesus said, “Come to me, all you who labor and are heavily burdened, and I will give you rest.  Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me, -  not from men who blame Jesus for imperfect food; which in reality is faulty, uninspired doctrine.
for I am gentle and humble in heart; and you will find rest for your souls.  For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.”  Matt 11:28-30
Scorpions; they are found in Revelation, combined with plaguing locusts, and who are released by the false prophet, “Wormwood”, to torment God’s anointed ones. Watchtower refers to the locust/scorpions as missionaries who bring a “stinging message” to the world.  Has any person contacted in the “preaching work” felt that the message presented by JWs, “stings”?  The locust/scorpions torment the anointed, who have not been sealed by God, (Rev 9:4,5) which indicates the source of this tormenting army comes from within the Watchtower.  (Rev 7:3,4)
Revelation “signifies” this torment (Rev 1:1); not as physical, but as an emotional turmoil; yet, the emotional can superimpose onto the physical, creating “significant” upheaval in the mind and heart of anointed ones, as well as their brethren. Rev 9:6; Matt 24:9,21; Luke 21:12,13; James 2:6; John 16:2; Rev 13:15  An “evil slave” uses the locust-scorpion/elder body to carry out this torment against the anointed ones; through teachings, rules of obedience, and subsequent disfellowshipping for speaking against doctrine. Isa 9:15,16; Matt 24:48,49; Rev 9:3-6;13:7  
JWs, if there is one doctrine that you may disagree with, are you ever soothed by Watchtower’s words to continue to obey without question, or does it always nag the conscience; that is, if we exercise our God-given conscience? 
If the Governing Body, whom we remember is not inspired, can call itself with determination that it is the “faithful and discreet slave”; then according to scripture, it is a valid claim that anointed who are actually inspired, and who have experienced the “beating” by the Governing Body and their henchmen, can confidently address them, as the “evil slave”. 
Which anointed ones have God’s blessing? They are those who listen to, and can hear ,Jesus Christ, their true and only Master, through the guidance of Holy Spirit.  They are not the showy ones, not “prominent”, and not highly esteemed; but neither was Jesus.  Matt 25:40; James 2:2-4; 1 Cor 1:26-29
This split among the anointed ones; the segregation of those who love only truth in Christ from those who prefer the “new light” from an evil slave, was prophesied to occur during the last days.  2 Thess 2:1-12.  When an anointed one upholds Christ, the evil slave cannot tolerate such dissension.  They are disfellowshipped – spiritually “killed”. They suffer for their testimony of Christ.   Luke 22:31; Rev 13:7,10,15; Rev 12:17,11; Mark 10:29-31; John 12:25
“Dear friends, don’t be surprised when the fiery ordeal comes among you to test you as if something unusual were happening to you.  Instead, rejoice as you share in the sufferings of Christ, so that you may also rejoice with great joy when his glory is revealed.  If you are ridiculed for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests on you. Let none of you suffer as a murderer, a thief, an evildoer, or a meddler.  But if anyone suffers as a Christian, let him not be ashamed but let him glorify God in having that name.  For the time has come for judgment to begin with God’s household, (1 Pet 2:5; Eph 2:20-22; Heb 10:21)  and if it begins with us, what will the outcome be for those who disobey the gospel of God?” 1 Pet 4:12-17
 
 
 
 

Anybody can give out free bibles and teach others to read.

I have read somewhere in publications how dfd family member can come to meeting in the same car with rest of the family, but he/she can not seat with them in KH, but separate in some other corner of hall, not in the same seats as rest of family. Then when meeting is over he/she can seat in the same car to go back to home.
Imagine how this sound and look so bizarre and unnatural and crazy rule to obey :))))

Many "illustrations" as in this fictive (or real?) drama or video movies that WT producing for giving "spiritual lessons and guidance" to members, are made in a way to mask or not to show some other circumstances, elements, factors, possibilities that exist in human nature and in responding to such issue in different situations. 
Some mothers, as one in video, would not pick up the phone and talk to dfd child. But some would. This lesson in video was made for those who not obey the rule, and for those who have to learn what to do in some future fictive or not fictive circumstances.
But you put very very good questions. Thanks.      

of course, it is possible. But as it was showed in some examples from WT publications in this Forum, WT using such tactics of omitting and skips commas, words, quotation, verses with purpose to misrepresent  other people thoughts and words. Perhaps some bad ex-JW imitate former religion leaders. :))) but we have many ex-JW who are honest and truthful in stating things. If you want you will accept that fact :))