Srecko Sostar

You mean like King of the North, Gog of Magog and the classic kazoo club wazoo wow-wow … Nebuchadnezzer’s toes?

I would like to qualify that above statement by Srecko Sostar.   I think that 65% of the Societies problems are that they completely ignore the clear instructions in Matthew 18 about how to Justly disfellowship, why, and when and how.
…. and 30% of the problems are tied to being wrong on 1975, and trying to cover it up and shift blame since then.

At WTJWorg, all theological issues are tied into one single issue, problem.

Just recently, last week, I heard from a JW brother that many years ago he preached in the countryside, about 1 hour away from Zagreb (approx. 45 km). Many people, whose doors he knocked on, very quickly said when they understood what he was preaching, oh you are the ones who went to the hill in 1975.
Since he was younger at the time, he did not immediately understand what kind of hill and 1975 the people in the village were talking about. Only much later did he connect what it was all about. 
So the JW brothers of that time went/climbed to the hill to wait for Armageddon. It's smart that they didn't sell their houses so they had somewhere to go back to and of course they stopped being JWs.

I was there in 1975. 

…. and paying attention.
From California to Virginia to Zaire everybody was expecting 1975 to be “the end”, as Srecko Sostar documented.
At Assemblies the clarion cry was “Stay Alive ‘Till ‘75!”.

“The fact that fifty-four years of the period called the “last days” have already gone by is highly significant. It means that only a few years, at most, remain before the corrupt system of things dominating the earth is destroyed by God.” Awake! 1968 Oct 8 p.13
 
“If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. Of the generation that observed the beginning of the “last days” in 1914, Jesus foretold: “This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.”-Matt. 24:34. Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in highschool and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!” Awake! 1969 May 22 p.15
 
“Yes, since the summer of 1973 there have been new peaks in pioneers every month. Now there are 20,394 regular and special pioneers in the United States, an all-time peak. That is 5,190 more than there were in February 1973! A 34-percent increase! Does that not warm our hearts? Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world’s end.” Kingdom Ministry May 1974 p.3 How Are You Using Your Life?

Yes, human being is that rock.

Okay, my brother @TrueTomHarley...🙄🤪😆
 
<<makes list of excuses why to not show love...>>
 
 
 









😆

(Perhaps someday in the future you'll get to do something like this...😁)
 
 
 
 
"All things are possible with God." 🥰

Their greatest fear is that the waterfall of unending free money will slow down or stop. The accountants and lawyers are the puppeteers of JW theology, as we have seen in Sweden and Finland, and now Norway.
Years ago someone documented that when they globetrot all over, they fly first class or business class.
I have done both, three times in my life, because someone else was paying the bill. I even flew once as the sole passenger on a small Lear Jet.
I LIKED IT !!!!!
You can see the pilots and the radar screen, and through the windshield. The left seat Pilot turned around and asked me “Sir, would you mind if I “punched it?”.
I replied “Go!” and we went up at full trust and at 45°.
In what seemed like an instant we were at 47,000 feet!
I LIKED IT !!!!
I was even wearing a new Suit at the time !
…… VERY addictive.
 
 

Jesus resolutely trashes those things - the leaven of the Pharisees, the false doctrine of FDS/GB-Benefactorworship, and the satanic, antiChrist so-called "discipline" of the disfellowshipping doctrine. He is coming to trash them completely in the very near future. Will you shun Jesus too?
 
 
The Bible is God's Word, and at present many Jehovah's Witnesses are on the opposite side of Jesus' clear teachings. They should not be content with all of what the GB is teaching them, because a lot of what the GB teaches apostatizes from God's Word.
 
 
You "can live with that", true, if the "people" you disagree with are just nobodies like me, perhaps...but what if the "people" you disagree with are Jehovah and Jesus? The Kingly Law of Love is not optional. It's a command. If you choose to continue disagreeing with that Law, it will not go well for you.
 
 
"Insight slows down anger." I have learned that sometimes crazy "abusive" types like the MoiseRacette and boyle characters are just coping with some issues and don't know what they're doing, or they're just fooling around. I prefer their company to some who strain out the gnat but gulp down the camel, claiming to be holy and close to God yet disobeying Christ's clear command that is so simple a kid could follow it: Love Your Neighbor.
 
If the MoiseRacette and boyle characters were real, I am convinced that they would stop and pick up a beat-up person on the side of the road, because the person behind the puppets showed mercy at times during the discussions, which is more than I can say for those who kept walking on by during truly abusive situations, people who you strive to imitate and would consider to be in "good standing" as Jehovah's Witnesses, including your GB idols and Bethel branch people.
 
Today's Watchtower is all about how loving "Jehovah's Witnesses" are, superior in love to those labeled non-"Jehovah's Witnesses". The Daily Text was all about how important it is to go to meetings because people there care about you and want to be your friends, unlike those labeled non-"Jehovah's Witnesses." 
 
While there are sincere loving Jehovah's Witnesses, any one of Jehovah's Witnesses who follows the disfellowshipping doctrine as taught by the GB is antiChrist and unloving. For them to say "we are the most loving people on earth - everyone else is less loving than us" is the pot calling the kettle black.
 
 
"In reply he said to them: “Why do you overstep the commandment of God because of your tradition?  For example, God said, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Let the one who speaks abusively of his father or mother be put to death.’  But you say, ‘Whoever says to his father or mother: “Whatever I have that could benefit you is a gift dedicated to God,”  he need not honor his father at all.’ So you have made the word of God invalid because of your tradition.  You hypocrites, Isaiah aptly prophesied about you when he said:  ‘This people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far removed from me.  It is in vain that they keep worshipping me, for they teach commands of men as doctrines.’”
 
 
Jesus loves you, @TrueTomHarley @Anna @Arauna @JW Insider that is why he disciplines you. There is a lot of dross in the organization that needs to be cleaned off, and he wants you to help comfort others in the days ahead. But you have to wake up and put on your clothes first and stop walking around naked.
 
@Pudgy and @Srecko Sostar are already awake. When the tribulation hits, they will know what to do. They already know what it means to show impartial love.

GB and 1975. They blame JW members for wrong expectations, misunderstanding of articles in WT publications and similar.

GB and 1975. They blame JW members for wrong expectations, misunderstanding of articles in WT publications and similar.

https://www.osce.org/odihr/430985
.., and part of 1st Session of Conference in 2017  
General Counsel Brumley. Mr. Brumley. Thank you for those kind words, Mr. Hurd. And we want to thank the U.S. Helsinki Commission--Chairman Wicker, Co-Chairman Smith, and you particularly, Mr. Hurd--for hosting this briefing. It has been also very illuminating and encouraging to hear the words of Ambassador Kozak, Dr. Mark, and Dr. Collins. Their insightful comments confirm our own concerns about the situation of Jehovah's Witnesses in the OSCE region. There are over 8\1/2\ million Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide. Over 3 million live in the OSCE region. We enjoy religious freedom in 51 of the 57 participating States. The exceptions include Tajikistan, Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan and, since last April as we know, the Russian Federation. When domestic courts have failed to protect our fundamental rights, we have resorted to seeking relief from international tribunals. Since 1993, we have obtained 64 favorable rulings from the European Court of Human Rights and 11 favorable decisions from the U.N. Human Rights Committee. But, Mr. Hurd, by far the worst problems we are facing in the OSCE region--by far--have to do with Russia, so I'll be concentrating on Russia in my presentation. In 2006, the government amended its law on counteracting extremist activity. It removed incitement to violence as a component of what constitutes extremism. The U.N. Human Rights Committee, the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, and the Venice Commission have all strongly criticized the amended law because it gives the Russian Government carte blanche to prosecute anyone it deems to be out of step with its version of what is acceptable. So, based on this law as it's been amended, the authorities concocted a three-step process to mis-categorize Jehovah's Witnesses as extremists and to use this as the foundation to strip us of our fundamental rights of speech, press and religion. The first thing the government did was to criminalize our religious literature. And it did this through bogus expert studies, and then backed up by baseless court decisions. They even banned our website, JW.org. It's worthy to point out, gentlemen and gentleladies, that JW.org is available worldwide with the singular exception of Russia. Second, Russia criminalized local congregations who had been using our literature even before it was declared extremist. Once literature that we had formally been using was on the extremist list, we removed it and stopped using it, but the authorities went so far as to plant banned literature in our places of worship so that they could later discover it and bring charges. And we have this on video. Then, third, it criminalized our religious activity at our national offices and in our local places of worship. So since this amended law on extremism was enacted, Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia have been subjected to the following: searches of their homes, places of worship, loss of employment, having their bank accounts frozen, mistreatment of their children by school authorities, detentions, secret video surveillance of their homes, monitoring of their mail, and intimidation to abandon their faith. This decade-long campaign culminated, as you've mentioned astutely, on April the 20th with the Supreme Court decision. The court ruled that the administrative center and all of the 395 local legal entities are guilty of carrying on extremist activity and that their property should be confiscated and their activity terminated. Due to a risk of criminal prosecution, we have ceased using our places of worship and our national offices. Our branches in Europe, Canada and here in the United States inform us that there is an escalation in the number of Witnesses from Russia seeking asylum. We're tracking three developments with particular interest, and you've mentioned them. The first is the criminal prosecution of Dennis Christensen; he's a citizen of Denmark. If convicted, he faces 10 years' imprisonment. He's been denied bail and held in pre-trial detention since last May, and his offense, singularly: he was worshiping along with a local congregation. Secondly, we're giving close attention to the proceeding by the government to take possession of our national offices. And this is in complete disregard for the fact that our administrative center, or our national offices, are owned by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania, a U.S.-based corporation, and that the national offices are worth millions. The government is nevertheless seeking to confiscate it. Third, whether an appellate court will confirm a decision by a lower court to declare our Bible--the New World Translation--to be extremist. The New World Translation is available in over 150 languages and has been printed over 20 million copies. The very same translation in Russia is deemed to be an extremist publication. For just having this in one's possession, one risks criminal prosecution. These relentless and coordinated efforts confirm that Russia is bent on a minimum of driving Jehovah's Witnesses underground. Now, that said, to date, we are not witnessing mass arrests of Jehovah's Witnesses, but as you brought up, Dr. Mark, there are 175,000 Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia. The government seems to be taking the position that someone can be one of Jehovah's Witnesses, but you have to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses and keep it to yourself. Anyone who, in any way, engages in any activity related to our worship risks criminal prosecution. So the government is saying, in essence, you can be one of Jehovah's Witnesses, but don't associate with other Witnesses. Don't read your Bible or any of your literature, don't gather for worship, and whatever you do, don't talk to anybody about your faith. So we thank the many governments and their agencies, such as the U.S. Helsinki Commission, for your diplomatic efforts and statements. When we were at the hearing earlier this year--the Supreme Court hearing--the strong presence of the diplomatic community sent a clear message to the Russian authorities that the international community is well aware of what Russia is doing, and they're not deceived, either. They realized that these proceedings are nothing more than a thinly- disguised effort to legitimize the government's goal of stripping us of our fundamental right to worship. And just, very, very briefly, I'm going to hit on the situation with Jehovah's Witnesses in Central Asia and in Azerbaijan. We mentioned that in Kazakhstan, we're caught between two camps within the government: one that seems to be leaning towards application of the rule of law and maintaining our legal status, and another component of government that is mimicking what's going on in Russia. We were banned in Tajikistan in 2007, and we continue to worship in secret. Uzbekistan is the second-worst offender of our fundamental rights in the OSCE region. Just to give you a capsule, since last September--September 2016--there have been 185 police raids on religious meetings, 153 convictions for religious activities, 148 fines. And by the way, these fines amount to 100 times the monthly minimum wage. They're not small. Seven Witnesses were jailed for religious activity, and there have been 15 documented accounts of severe beatings by the police of men and women who are Jehovah's Witnesses. Witnesses are fined for even having a copy of the Bible in their home. With regard to Turkmenistan, we have the same situation. Bahram Hemdemov, a 52-year-old Witness, has begun serving a four-year sentence that he began in March of 2015. And his only offense, again, was worshiping with fellow believers. There have been some small improvements in Azerbaijan, but although we number less than 2,000 Witnesses in that country, we have 18 applications pending with the European Court of Human Rights, and we have filed 11 complaints with the U.N. Human Rights Committee. So, in conclusion, we are gravely concerned about the welfare of our community in Russia. We are going to submit, for the record, a copy of my briefing and also a copy of a short video from Professor Heiner Bielefeldt--that's the former U.N. Special Rapporteur of Freedom of Religion or Belief, who commented on the state of religious freedom in Russia and gave particular emphasis to the situation Jehovah's Witnesses are facing in that land. His point was, or is, that as the space for one religion diminishes, civil society and religious freedom, in general, diminishes. Thank you, once again, for allowing us to comment on the situation with Jehovah's Witnesses in the OSCE region. Mr. Hurd. Thank you. Just a quick reminder about the Q&A. I'll ask each one of our panelists two questions. If you could hold your answers until I finish asking all of my questions, and then we'll eventually turn it over to the audience. We'll start with Chairman Mark. Taking advantage of your recent trip to Uzbekistan, in the full range of steps that they can and should take to improve their record when it comes to religious freedom, and, in particular--let's assume, for the sake of argument, that they're re-designated as a CPC--what are the most important actions the government needs to take in order to change that designation and improve the situation for religious freedom in Uzbekistan? Secondly, was there an acknowledgment, when you were there, from the authorities that their crackdown on religious freedom over the years might actually be undermining their efforts to counter terrorist groups and counter violent extremists? For Dr. Collins, going back to Kazakhstan for a moment, you've noted that prior to their 2011 religion law, at least in the region, they had one of the most permissive environments for religion and for religious freedom. Why the shift? Why the change? Secondly, I was particularly intrigued at your comments that in your research of Christian groups in the region, they rarely band together in response to persecution. I'm wondering what your best hypothesis is, or evidence is, about the ``why.'' It is pointless for JW Brumley to ask why there is a deterioration in religious freedom in one of the OSCE countries. As an elder, he preaches from house to house and in KH and JW Congresses, that JWs will soon experience persecution from all governments on the entire planet Earth, including OSCE countries. So he knows the answer to this question and he should not ask for it from a person who, I assume, does not believe in YHVH theology as presented by WTJWorg.
Secondly, WTJWorg is known for its exclusivity. Although the OSCE Conference and some other gatherings are an exception, due to JW hypocrisy, it is clear that a JW member must not participate together with a member of another religion in some joint society where they should reach some agreement or simply participate together in some ceremony or celebration. JW elders do not attend gatherings organized by the state where representatives of other religions are also invited.
A JW member must not go to a religious meeting of another community even out of mere curiosity. He may not attend a person's funeral if a priest of another church is there. Etc.
So this JW Elder, General Counsel for WTJWorg has continuity to show how duplicitous he is.
Nathaniel Hurd, Policy Advisor, U.S. Helsinki Commission (Moderator), Ambassador Michael Kozak, Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights, and Labor, Department of State, Dr. Daniel Mark, Chairman, U.S. Commission on International Religious Freedom, Dr. Kathleen Collins, Associate Professor of Political Science, University of Minnesota, and Philip Brumley, General Counsel, Jehovah’s Witnesses (Left to Right, Photo Credit: U.S. Helsinki Commission) - https://religiousfreedominstitute.org/2017-12-4-congressional-commission-hearing-examines-religious-freedom-in-osce/

I was there … I saw it. 
Perhaps that is why the line resonates with me so dramatically, “Don’t piss on my back and tell me it’s raining”.

I am not sure, @Srecko Sostar, if this is how you meant that word: "Unsubordinate: Not subordinate; not of inferior rank, dignity, class, or order."
 
Jesus was truly superior to everyone on earth, since he was the only perfect person and he was God's firstborn son, in that way he was "unsubordinate". While he could be considered "independent" from sin, he lowered himself to become a slave and was willing to lower himself to obey the direction of the imperfect organization of his time, even though that organization was extremely corrupt.
 
He told us to imitate his example, to follow his way. Jesus submitted himself to the authority of the organization bearing Jehovah's name at that time, but Jesus did not compromise his integrity. Today, we can submit to the direction of those in authority (whether it be the authorities in a congregation or the authorities in the local governments). But if those authorities (any of them) ask us to do something that would lead to a compromise of our integrity, then we resolutely "obey God as ruler rather than men."
 
Jesus was willing to obey the secular authorities as they put him through a kangaroo court trial with false charges and no justice. Jesus was willing to submit to a course of abuse that was designed to humiliate him (although he despised shame and the real humiliation was on his persecutors) and then he submitted to death on a torture stake. 
 
Sometimes it is possible to remain in a congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses and keep integrity. A lot of people feel "cognitive dissonance" but are able to continue in the congregation, knowing that in time Jehovah will clear things up. Some people are not able to conscientiously remain in the organization at this time and disassociate themselves with it because of conscience. Others are willing to remain but are kicked out. Many people in the congregations are just ignorant of the false doctrines at present and go on their merry way in a temporary peace. 
 
Jehovah knows the heart. To the degree possible, we strive to imitate the Christ. As far as autonomy, or self-government, we exercise our free will to submit to Jehovah's will for us, even though sometimes it's distasteful at present. It was distasteful at first for Jesus to go through what he did, but it worked out for a blessing.
 
"And going a little way forward, he fell facedown, praying: “My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass away from me. Yet, not as I will, but as you will." (Matthew 26:39)
 
Jesus self-governed himself in a way that showed immense strength. He did not take up a sword or a gun. He did not fear death or torture or what people thought. He knew what he was going to face, he trusted God's projection and interpretation, or will, for him, and he went through with it.

@Fausto Hoover
Different "products" can bear the stamp, character, idea, personality of the person who disclosed them to others. But also, over time, a person creates new works that have no resemblance to previous works. The OT and NT portray this beautifully.
I looked through some of the presented links with more or less attention. Fortunately, the "secular sources" are first studied by the Bethel committees, who then choose what and how to write in the preparation of "ready-made spiritual food" so that ordinary JW members do not have to bother with links like the ones you have shown. Some JWs might while reading them themselves come to "wrong" conclusions and "fall away" from the faith.
Support for polygamy, slavery, wars, conquest of other people's property in wars, class differences, patriarchy that does not recognize that women are as valuable as men..., are some of the things that began to change with the advent of Christianity. But even today, some topics are still subject to discussion.
Different denominations are faced with the same questions. WTJWorg has found its own interpretation of the Bible and invokes its own autonomy and the right to maintain that religious autonomy as a Corporation. At the same time the Org.  does not allow an individual member of his Church to be like Jesus, who as a Jew realized his own autonomy in the projection and interpretation of the Law. Of course, he paid for it with his own head in the end, but he remained independent and unsubordinate to the Church Clergy of his time.

WTJWorg is considered themselves as "God's Chosen People". The words of Isaiah were addressed to the Jews who were in BCE because of the Covenant. Analogous to your theology, these words are for every JW in the organization, not for those individuals or people outside the JW Church.

WTJWorg is considered themselves as "God's Chosen People". The words of Isaiah were addressed to the Jews who were in BCE because of the Covenant. Analogous to your theology, these words are for every JW in the organization, not for those individuals or people outside the JW Church.

There is at least one other choice that I can think of immediately:
1.) sometimes they guess, and guess wrong and when they do they never apologize…… Never ever…… And so they have to cover it up.

An interesting read. One has to ask oneself some questions. GB often repeats the mantra that Jesus did not promise "perfect spiritual food", so the interpretation of WTJWorg has sometimes been wrong, and will continue to be, it seems.
The main point of WTJWorg is that spiritual food comes from the Source aka Jesus and travels through the "Only Channel" to the believers.
What kind of "error" is it about? Random mistake in communication between Jesus and GB? Or is it about flaws of character in Jesus or in GB?

An interesting read. One has to ask oneself some questions. GB often repeats the mantra that Jesus did not promise "perfect spiritual food", so the interpretation of WTJWorg has sometimes been wrong, and will continue to be, it seems.
The main point of WTJWorg is that spiritual food comes from the Source aka Jesus and travels through the "Only Channel" to the believers.
What kind of "error" is it about? Random mistake in communication between Jesus and GB? Or is it about flaws of character in Jesus or in GB?

I usually tell that joke using ketchup, but today I changed it to barbecue sauce because nobody seemed to laugh whenever I told it before.

It is interesting how some people "throw away the Bible" as a source of wisdom because of these older accounts; whereas others try to make rules for modern society based on these older accounts - when in truth they are there as a historical record for us. 
 
For example, the Watchtower says that having Bethel is like having the temple organization of old with singers and workers and leaders and so on, and they look at the two witness rule and try to make it fit for today. They try to say shunning is like the old stoning. But in all actuality, none of those things are for today. Jesus did not set up a commune arrangement with singers and tithes and Levites. Jesus did not say to stone anybody figuratively. (If he wanted to he could have, but he didn't say anything remotely like that.) That was the old way. 
 
"Nobody sews a patch of unshrunk cloth on an old outer garment, for the new piece pulls away from the garment and the tear becomes worse.  Nor do people put new wine into old wineskins. If they do, then the wineskins burst and the wine spills out and the wineskins are ruined. But people put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved." (Matthew 9:16,17)
 
People don't like change. They get comfortable with the old way. It seems easier to have rules than to think for ourselves. Jesus said that's how people are.
 
"No one after drinking old wine wants new, for he says, ‘The old is nice.’” (Luke 5:39)
 
But we all have to grow up sometime.
 
"But speaking the truth, let us by love grow up in all things into him who is the head, Christ." (Ephesians 4:15)
 
The old way with the rules on polygamy and regulating slavery and so on was appropriate at the time, because the cultures the people lived among did all those things. They were a stiff-necked people and they weren't ready for the "new wine". In many ways, the people today are stiff-necked too. But the new wine is coming anyway. It is the appointed time. The training wheels are about to be removed, and the Way of the Christ will shine brightly.
 
"I pray that he may grant you through the abundance of his glory to be made mighty in the man you are inside, with power through his spirit,  and that through your faith you may have the Christ dwell in your hearts with love. May you be rooted and established on the foundation,  in order that with all the holy ones you may be thoroughly able to comprehend fully what is the breadth and length and height and depth,  and to know the love of the Christ, which surpasses knowledge, so that you may be filled with all the fullness that God gives." (Ephesians 3:16-19)

If conscience is implanted in man directly by God, then it is the best guide for man. You mention that as an "addition" he gave his wise advice and instructions. I assume that this means written sacred things, mainly what can be found in the Bible, at least as far as the Christian world is concerned.
If the conscience can be corrupted and become dull, and as most people believe, it is placed in a man by God himself, then it is a terrible misfortune for mankind. If God's wise counsels and instructions, aka the Bible, can be corrupted through human intervention through theological explanations and interpretations, then it is nothing strange, because conscience as the first line of defense has already fallen much earlier. Because the conscience should be able to distinguish between human interpretations and recognize deceptions. But a misconception prevails. When JW members are able to recognize this, that deception is also in their house, then they will be on the road to restoration. Renewal is an ongoing process. And, in my opinion, it is not an institutional matter, but a personal one.