Srecko Sostar

@Jay Witness
Didn't notice this until now. What a terrible tragedy. I didn't listen to the report, because I started a couple of others first and realized that they are a little too negative for my taste. I still have a few long-time friends at Bethel, and a couple of them will talk to me about anything. Some of what I get from them is a bit too gossipy but they are firm believers in the idea that 'what you hear in the darkness you should shout from the rooftops.'
I don't know if they knew this sister but there was a definite lack of communication and lack of openness since the middle of last year with one of my friends. I wondered if there was something going on similar to what happened in  late 1979 and early 1980. If they are back to talking openly about anything, maybe they will tell me more about what this sister was doing.
From a Biblical perspective, I don't think an organization like ours has any right to secrecy. I think everything we do, we should be proud to preach about, and humble enough to let others evaluate it, too. And if we do things we are not proud of, these should be shouted from the rooftops so that all of us, even the world, can evaluate it. I'm angry that such a thing could happen. Reminds me of how Scaramucci went flailing and embarrassing himself yesterday because he thought his loyalty to the US president gave him a mandate to just wildly accuse people and it obviously clouded his judgment. I saw the same kind of flailing back in 1979-1982 and I saw good friends lied to back in 1980 as a way to get them to try to turn in their friends, and I saw political scheming behind the scenes that would have even scared off a lot of good Bethelites if they had been able to see what was going on in closed doors right around them.
The open court system of Jewish towns and cities mentioned in the Mosaic Law is a much better precedent for Society and congregation decisions than the secrecy we encounter (and are expected to adhere to)  today. The only problem I see is privacy concerns for certain types of cases, yet justice would always have a better chance of prevailing if everyone could be aware of the decision making processes. They say that sausage and apple-cider taste great, but you just don't want to go behind the scenes to see how they are made. I would add religion to the list, until we can learn to be humble enough to expose our processes to scrutiny and proud enough to allow the world to see why we are proud to be Jehovah's Witnesses.

LDS apostle speaks about church responsibility in Mormon LGBT suicides for first time 
http://kutv.com/news/local/lds-apostle-speaks-about-church-responsibility-in-mormon-lgbt-suicides-for-first-time

 
"That's a question that will be answered on judgment day," Oaks responded. "I will be accountable to a higher authority for that."
The Church of Jesus Chris of Latter-day Saints changed its policy in November 2015 to categorize married same-sex couples as apostates. At the same time, it prohibited children of same-sex couples from full participation in the church by requiring them to wait until they are 18 years old to be baptized and, then, only if they renounce their parents' marriage practices.

Last November the Mormon church issued new rules about homosexuality labelling those in same-sex relationships as apostates who can be excommunicated. Children of gay couples are now required to leave home and repudiate their parent's relationship before they can be part of the church.
At least 32 gay Mormon youths have killed themselves since the announcement of the new policy, and there’s been an alarming increase of suicidal teens and twenty-somethings in the church....

It is very clear that of the above opinions, bloviates and comments only Srecko Sostar’s have a solid multi-example Scriptural basis.
All else is agenda driven liberal claptrap.

Sorry Srecko. I can see what happened. You had quoted Thinking's comment complete, and I took the quotes from your quote, hence they came up with your name. I'm sorry, it's my fault, I got lazy. I should have gone to Thinking's original post for all of his comments. I cannot amend it now as it won't let me make changes. sorry.  I will learn a lesson from this and be more careful in the future. 
 

@Patiently waiting for Truth
Greeting.  
In your last comment, by mistake two Thinking's comments are presented under my name.

Suicide in the ancient world did not carry the same negative connotations as it does today. Even bible text nowhere said how suicide is a sin or forbidden by Law. The biblical attitude toward suicide ranges from ambivalence to praise. Never made Judgmental statement against those who done that act of self-destruction. 
-Abimelech came to the tower, and fought against it, and came near to the entrance of the tower to burn it with fire. But a certain woman threw an upper millstone on Abimelech's head, and crushed his skull. Immediately he called to the young man who carried his armor and said to him, “Draw your sword and kill me, so people will not say about me, ‘A woman killed him.’ ” So the young man thrust him through, and he died.
-the counselor Ahithophel hanged himself                                                                                                                                                                                            When Ahithophel saw that his counsel was not followed, he saddled his donkey and went off home to his own city. He set his house in order, and hanged himself; he died and was buried in the tomb of his father.
-Zimri, King of Israel, burned down his house around himself after military defeat.                                                                                                            When Zimri saw that the city was taken, he went into the citadel of the royal palace and set the palace on fire around him. So he died,
-Saul and his armor-bearer                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Then Saul said to his armor-bearer, “Draw your sword, and thrust me through with it, so that these uncircumcised may not come and make sport of me. But his armor-bearer was unwilling, for he was terrified. So Saul took his own sword and fell on it. When his armor-bearer saw that Saul was dead, he also fell on his sword and died. Thus Saul died; he and his three sons and all his house died together
-Samson                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Then Samson prayed to the Lord,“Sovereign Lord, remember me. Please, God, strengthen me just once more, and let me with one blow get revenge on the Philistines for my two eyes.... Samson said, “Let me die with the Philistines!” Then he pushed with all his might, and down came the temple on the rulers and all the people in it. Thus he killed many more when he died than while he lived.
-even Judas suicide is an act of remorse, deep regret. According to JW elders instruction, he gave visible, strong signs of repentance :))      When Judas, who had betrayed him, saw that Jesus was condemned, he was seized with remorse and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and the elders. I have sinned,” he said, “for I have betrayed innocent blood
Some people here looks "funny" with conclusions about suicide and intention to defend WT Company. And all that in the name of God and Bible.
 

I wasn't commenting on suicide, but on Srecko's comment - 
Some of you are already resisting the "nonsense" that comes from GB, while at the same time you are watching some of your spiritual brothers and sisters stumble under the burden of theology that you are aware has failed. ............. Don't you feel sad? Don't you want to help them not be afraid of man?

Being an ex-JW is not a bad thing. It is not a sin. Because it is plain to see that God and Christ do not work through the JW Org, and do not work through the GB. 

What you actually have IS JWs that are slaves of the GB.
1. Because the GB say that they are the 'Faithful and discreet Slave'
2. Because JWs have always only used GB material to witness to others.
3. JWs standing by a cart / trolly giving out GB propaganda. They are not handing out Bibles, which IS the word of God. They are handing out Watchtowers, Awakes, tracts, books, ALL written and/or approved by that GB. 
4. What are supposed to be 'Bible Studies' but in reality are Book Studies with the possible mention of a few scriptures. Those books are written by the GB.
Proof of such is simple when certain books are removed because certain GB members were also removed. Look at the history of the JW org. 
And Moses DIDN'T enter the 'Promised Land'.  Neither will the GB. But the GB state as fact that they WILL go to Heaven. A bit presumptuous ????? 
No indeed. In fact you comply. Continuing to hide Pedophiles in the JW org. Continuing to shun innocent victims and others that have been 'thrown out' just because the Elders do not like them. 
Wrong. You are not exactly mentally in or spiritually in if you know that the GB are not inspired and that you do not always believe what they say. Because if you were totally in you would believe they are the F&DS and you would follow their every word. 
So you are telling all JWs to remain in an immoral Org and to dish out the lies from the GB. 
Come on think about it. The mid-week meetings used to tell you (probs still do) exactly what to say to people 'on the doors'. The Sunday meetings comprised of a 'Public Talk' with a GB outline, and a Watchtower written by the GB. It was all the GB's words. Not the word of God. 
And because the GB and all the other hierarchy including Elders are so self righteous, Child Sexual Abuse probably still happens in congregations and is still not reported to the Police or the 'superior authorities'. I'm still waiting to hear what has happened to that 25 year + Child Sex Abuse Database that the GB / Lawyers are hiding in their USA HQ. 
You really expect JWs to invite young families into the JW Org when the JW Org is such an immoral dangerous place to be right now ????
 No, what they do is make excuses, just as you have done, and why ? Because you and others are frightened to 'go it alone'. That shows where your faith is, in the Org and not in God through Christ. 
JWs would have offered their children to a false god, and then JWs would have said 'but we didn't burn as many children as the other nations did'.
That is exactly what JWs are saying about Child Sexual Abuse. JWs are saying 'But we don't abuse as many children as other religions do'.  I've read it on here and I would think you have read it to. 
That is the Org you are part of.  That is what you defend. 

Those questions should pierce the heart of every JW.
“Teacher, which command in the law is the greatest?”
37 He said to him, “Love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.  38 This is the greatest and most important command. 39 The second is like it: Love your neighbor as yourself. 40 All the Law and the Prophets depend on these two commands.”  Matt 22:36-40
If the congregations were practicing these two “laws”, no one would be disfellowshipped or shunned for exposing the danger of men’s superiority over them, and exposing their false doctrines. Love of God and neighbor would require it.  If the leadership demand obedience to their word, they are exalting themselves above the words of Christ.  What's more important, allowing your neighbor to be stumbled by the "burden of theology", or leading your neighbor to the "simplicity that is in Christ"? (2 Cor 11:3)
 
 

I would say, how can we draw a parallel from the characters of Moses and Aaron. WTJWorg is considered the successor of all of God’s organizations that have emerged throughout history, to use their logic. Noah's Ark = God's Organization, Nation Israel = God's Organization, First Assembly = God's Organization, WTBTS = God's Organization.
However, each of the above had "Earth Representatives", so Moses would be the archetype of GB, and Aaron would be the representative of today's Helpers.
Both of today’s classes at WTJWorg feel that they are inspired (guided) by God and that their instructions should be followed without discussion.
As with Moses and Aaron, who made compromises to please the people, so today’s religious leaders are making changes in theology and practice. Sometimes they are a relief to the people, and sometimes an additional burden.
So, enough about the alleged "spirit guidance". Because the comment provided by Thinking proves this setting or thesis.
Like other leaders of the people, GB and Helpers = Administration, monitor the beats and pulse of their people. When the pressure in the “body” of the assembly becomes too high something must be done. In other words, there are changes in interpretations. You who are permanent members of the JW Assembly are better informed about the new changes, bigger and smaller. Sometimes they have to come because of changes in the “outside world,” and most come because of internal events.
It is unfortunate that you, JW members, who see the reality within WTJWorg, are still trying to defend what is indefensible. Because if a certain theology still lives in WTJWorg, and you are willing to support and defend it, how will you feel when it is changed, and you knew something was wrong?
Some of you are already resisting the "nonsense" that comes from GB, while at the same time you are watching some of your spiritual brothers and sisters stumble under the burden of theology that you are aware has failed. ............. Don't you feel sad? Don't you want to help them not be afraid of man?

I would say, how can we draw a parallel from the characters of Moses and Aaron. WTJWorg is considered the successor of all of God’s organizations that have emerged throughout history, to use their logic. Noah's Ark = God's Organization, Nation Israel = God's Organization, First Assembly = God's Organization, WTBTS = God's Organization.
However, each of the above had "Earth Representatives", so Moses would be the archetype of GB, and Aaron would be the representative of today's Helpers.
Both of today’s classes at WTJWorg feel that they are inspired (guided) by God and that their instructions should be followed without discussion.
As with Moses and Aaron, who made compromises to please the people, so today’s religious leaders are making changes in theology and practice. Sometimes they are a relief to the people, and sometimes an additional burden.
So, enough about the alleged "spirit guidance". Because the comment provided by Thinking proves this setting or thesis.
Like other leaders of the people, GB and Helpers = Administration, monitor the beats and pulse of their people. When the pressure in the “body” of the assembly becomes too high something must be done. In other words, there are changes in interpretations. You who are permanent members of the JW Assembly are better informed about the new changes, bigger and smaller. Sometimes they have to come because of changes in the “outside world,” and most come because of internal events.
It is unfortunate that you, JW members, who see the reality within WTJWorg, are still trying to defend what is indefensible. Because if a certain theology still lives in WTJWorg, and you are willing to support and defend it, how will you feel when it is changed, and you knew something was wrong?
Some of you are already resisting the "nonsense" that comes from GB, while at the same time you are watching some of your spiritual brothers and sisters stumble under the burden of theology that you are aware has failed. ............. Don't you feel sad? Don't you want to help them not be afraid of man?

I would say, how can we draw a parallel from the characters of Moses and Aaron. WTJWorg is considered the successor of all of God’s organizations that have emerged throughout history, to use their logic. Noah's Ark = God's Organization, Nation Israel = God's Organization, First Assembly = God's Organization, WTBTS = God's Organization.
However, each of the above had "Earth Representatives", so Moses would be the archetype of GB, and Aaron would be the representative of today's Helpers.
Both of today’s classes at WTJWorg feel that they are inspired (guided) by God and that their instructions should be followed without discussion.
As with Moses and Aaron, who made compromises to please the people, so today’s religious leaders are making changes in theology and practice. Sometimes they are a relief to the people, and sometimes an additional burden.
So, enough about the alleged "spirit guidance". Because the comment provided by Thinking proves this setting or thesis.
Like other leaders of the people, GB and Helpers = Administration, monitor the beats and pulse of their people. When the pressure in the “body” of the assembly becomes too high something must be done. In other words, there are changes in interpretations. You who are permanent members of the JW Assembly are better informed about the new changes, bigger and smaller. Sometimes they have to come because of changes in the “outside world,” and most come because of internal events.
It is unfortunate that you, JW members, who see the reality within WTJWorg, are still trying to defend what is indefensible. Because if a certain theology still lives in WTJWorg, and you are willing to support and defend it, how will you feel when it is changed, and you knew something was wrong?
Some of you are already resisting the "nonsense" that comes from GB, while at the same time you are watching some of your spiritual brothers and sisters stumble under the burden of theology that you are aware has failed. ............. Don't you feel sad? Don't you want to help them not be afraid of man?

I and the Father are one. - john 10:30

When you make an assumption without thought, then your word should follow with the word "possibility" in front of other people as though the evening meal was something more than a "presentation" that should be observed until Christ return in his memory and God's promise. Why would it matter if the apostles continued that presentation? Why would it matter, if Christ followers continue that now?
The word "rigid" should be used with your idea of that religious teaching and presentation. That makes your commentary, as your own word under quotation marks, indicates. That makes your response rude and obnoxious as anyone else with poor manners here. Therefore, your ideology and remarks are presented under a false tongue, since you are saying it.
How does that argument go against your perceived bible interpretation?

How can you ask me such "stupid" question. TTH mentioned Jesus ’words in which he invites people around him to eat his body and drink his blood. I only expanded the possibility that the apostles and other followers repeated Jesus ’words in front of other people. If they were “rigid” in preaching such “religious teachings,” my conclusion was in the commentary. So I really don’t understand how you don’t understand the context within which my remark is.  

Jesus had his reason for speaking. But even his listeners had good reason to be offended by what was said. I believe many of them remembered their ancestors and the prophecies that were fulfilled.
Therefore in your midst parents will eat their children, and children will eat their parents. I will inflict punishment on you and will scatter all your survivors to the winds. - Ezekiel 5:10
Then he asked her, “What’s the matter?” She answered, “This woman said to me, ‘Give up your son so we may eat him today, and tomorrow we’ll eat my son.’  So we cooked my son and ate him. The next day I said to her, ‘Give up your son so we may eat him,’ but she had hidden him.” - 2 Kings 6:28,29
And what to say. If in the 1st century they preached eating the body of Jesus and drinking his blood then no wonder they were persecuted. 
I don’t think Jesus said anywhere that they preach it, but to preach the good news about Jesus. Even the JWs stopped preaching directly about the guilt and destruction of the Catholic Church. Why? Because that would be hate speech, I guess.

How can you ask me such "stupid" question. TTH mentioned Jesus ’words in which he invites people around him to eat his body and drink his blood. I only expanded the possibility that the apostles and other followers repeated Jesus ’words in front of other people. If they were “rigid” in preaching such “religious teachings,” my conclusion was in the commentary. So I really don’t understand how you don’t understand the context within which my remark is.  

You are the one playing the 'fool's game' by living in that Org that is run by 8 men that pretend to be the Faithful and Discreet Slave.  You are a slave to the ones you serve, and those ones are the Governing Body of the Org. 
For over 100 years the Leaders of that Org have deliberately told lies. The Watchtower writers, Leaders, helpers, then the JW set up, JW Org, all telling lies about what they pretended to know.  We don't need to write details here of the lies as it's all been written here before. BUT you and others blind yourselves deliberately from all those things. Things which have been proven, not just made up stories. 
You crafty way of writing only fools those who want to be fooled. For instance this sentence of yours above.
"It is a fool’s game to base judgments on the flaws of those taking the lead anywhere,...." 
We are not talking about ANYWHERE, we are talking about 8 men that say they are the Faithful and Discreet Slave.
We are talking about 8 men that say "God and Christ trust us, so all JWs should trust us" 
We are talking about a GB that have told the Anointed 'not to gather together because if they do gather together those Anointed ones would be working against the Holy Spirit.
This is who you follow. These are Your Leaders. Those wicked men who do not serve God through Christ but serve themselves and make slaves of you all.  How can i say that ?
Well for instance, on the ministry (when it was street work and carts) JWs didn't often go out with Bibles. JWs didn't often speak from their hearts. JWs handed out magazines and tracts. JWs stood by carts / trollies full of the GB's written words. It was all the GBs / helpers written words. It was not the Word of God... And so called Bible studies, were really a book study which might possibly include a very few scriptures. 
Remember that your JW Org is all based on the teachings which come from those ones you say 
"It is a fool’s game to base judgments on the flaws of those taking the lead anywhere,.
Because those taking the lead are the ones you follow. 

Doesn't any (Church) do the same thing? Isn't that something you are doing by judging their interpretation? How does your interpretation of scripture fair against others, that it becomes greater? Isn't following in Jesus footsteps the blueprint to excellence?

The general fact is that we are, usually all, generals after a battle. But real generals also analyze their actions after the battle to be more successful next time. Everything is subject to criticism and questioning.
Doing nothing is wrong. But is the persistence in doing wrong things proof that we are still doing something good because we have convinced ourselves that it is better than doing nothing?
Preaching that Armageddon will take place in certain years or within a certain period gives some hope to people who believe in it. And after a failed theology, there are “generals and ordinary surviving soldiers” who comment on it.
We could accept the claim that accepting false hope is better than no hope at all. With such an idea, we could believe the claim that JWs have reached a high/er standard of faith and hope compared to some other people. 
Are JWs more honest and moral people than others? So now, do you really want to brag about that?
 

I find that this organization often follows its own interpretations of the Bible/scripture.   

But after I am gone, I will send the Spirit to you. - John 16:5-7
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. - John 14:16
I baptized you with water; but He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit -  Mark 1:8
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you. - John 14:26
When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds from the Father, He will testify about Me, - John 15:26
I just want to notice. If, according to WTJWorg, HS is just some kind of energy, then every person in heaven and on earth has their own spirit or energy. The spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are God’s children. - Romans 8:16.  God is holy so his spirit is also holy. Is Jesus as a person on earth or as a person in heaven holy? If it is then his spirit is holy, too.
From all this arises a really interesting question: which spirit Jesus sends, his own or God's. Can Jesus send the spirit of another person, his Father, and vice versa? Or is it logical to send his own HS?
HS is also called the spirit of truth, and Jesus claims that He is the Way, the Truth and the Life. It seems how Bible verses above speaking in both ways.

The idea of sacrificing to the god/s is not unusual, because people sacrificed to the god/s, because they want god/s to protect them or help them. To some extent, this is about bribery. Sometimes it is a way of thanking the god/s.
One aspect of why people made sacrifices is that they did not understand the laws of nature. Because they felt helpless or felt some debt to the Unknown. That is how god/s of all kind came into being.
The idea that people are obliged to make sacrifices to god/s does not exist in the initial (Bible) descriptions of the relationship between God and man (Adam, Eve, Abel, Cain ...).
WTJWorg explains that the most important reason why God rejected Cain’s sacrifice was that he had no faith, and Abel had. Meat and bloodshed also play a role, but WTJWorg publications do not claim that this was the sole reason.
But giving material or symbolic or spiritual or physical sacrifices to God should not be a practice in which the relationship between God and man should be developed. After all, it is said that God himself said and had it written in the Bible that obedience is more important to him than sacrifice.
The thought of having to kill someone to please God is terrible, frightening.