Space Merchant
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On 7/29/2018 at 1:41 PM, Jack Ryan said:
If he could turn sticks into snakes in Egypt, it's reasonable he could fix cancer.
Those influenced by Satan are capable of doing works and miracles and claim such comes in name of the true.
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6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
I believe how God can manage things if situation would been changed in case of Abraham ..... to Messiah.
Possibly, but not so much, the fact that God intervene in this situation only makes my response, according to the passage itself - correct. If Abraham did perish, there would not be any talk about him, later on at all, there wouldn't be a Tribe of people because Jacob was never born, the Tribe of Judah would not have existed, and there would not be a Messiah, thus making Genesis 3:15 prior to Adam and Eve's disobedience be for nothing. This is the same case with Jesus escaping death by the hands of those who hate him as well as miracle fanatics who wanted to grab and throw Jesus off a cliff, clearly it was not Jesus' time otherwise it would have destroyed what the prophecy regarding the Prophet even met, let alone what Jesus had read to the miracle fanatics who switched up from Happy persons to ALL KILL MODE on the Messiah., and clearly Jesus wasn't having that happen nor did he stick around to find out because it was not his time (Luke 4:16-31).
That would most definitely put more fire in what God had said, that he regretted making man. Perhaps you, me and everyone else would not even be here right now and those who are alive would be at each others necks in full force because nothing of the Spiritual House came forth, and the seed that was suppose to be of Abraham had never came to be.
That is a pretty grim reality that I am happy to say it never came to that and or existed.
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:Do you agree in this quote (sentence constructed as it is)Â how Abraham was in fact tell a lie? If you agree, then does it mean how I have to accept the reasons for that and your explanation about his act?
Do you justified Abraham dealing with situation because of possible reasons that he - Abraham consider as good reasons to do so? Or because you today consider his reasons as good reasons for deal with such situation in such way?
Well you yourself said it, you stated it clearly:
On 8/1/2018, Srecko Sostar said: Picture of Abraham and Sara came to me. What spirit guided Abraham when he lied about Sara, how she is his sister and not wife? Is his lie in red field, or he has "theocratic warfare" and not told privileged information to person who is not entitled to hear/know it? :))
You continued on to say the following:Â
Abraham did this same lie 2 time - Gen 12
Well, i can see (in chapter 20:11) how Abraham has prejudice that people of different tribe, people, religion are all bad, immoral, without ethics, not honest... how similar with some JW members standpoint on so called "worldly" people, that they are not worth of their society because of similar reasons.Â
Second, he has not told people "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth", but his version of tribal and family connections and customs (and such explanation came at the culmination of problem, not at first contact, in the beginning). And this is not even in sphere of WT thesis about "theocratic warfare". Reason is, as he told, fear for his own life. He did not care about Sara's life and her moral integrity, honesty. Not about what will people talking about his God, religion, beliefs. Only about his life - according to text.Â
Now you cannot be contradicting yourself as you go forward when your own words is expressed here. What Abraham and Sarah did was indeed a form of Spiritual Warfare for Abraham was worried about two things [A] His life being Sarah being taken, for if you had not notice what this verse(s) had said:
(11) When he was about to enter Egypt, he said to Sarai his wife, “I know that you are a woman beautiful in appearance, (12) and when the Egyptians see you, they will say, ‘This is his wife.’ Then they will kill me, but they will let you live. (13) Say you are my sister, that it may go well with me because of you, and that my life may be spared for your sake.
He did care for his life, yes, and him being alive as to what promise was in store for him, as for Sara, she agreed with his plan for seven she knew, even Abraham knew what a people who does not fear God will do to people, mainly to their reasoning as to what happens to people and they themselves do not want to end up as such, thus both being alive in the process, but the promise still remains.
Plus Sara has total respect for Abraham, even calling him Lord, granted Abraham is above Sarah.
as Sarah obeyed Abraham, calling him lord. And you are her children, if you do good and do not fear anything that is frightening.
Abraham didn't lack in what he said and was not about prejudice and or hatred of a people, the early people of God had enemies, enemies that seek to kill them on a daily basis and they do not care about the God of Abraham as long as they waste Abraham and or his people, that is what matters to them, and these people have no idea who God is.
Abraham said it best himself in chapter 20 of Genesis, verse 11:
“I did it because I thought, ‘There is no fear of God at all in this place, and they will kill me because of my wife.’
, granted majority of women in the Bible had succumb to Spiritual Warfare, the very reason why people point to Sara, as well as the other women as heroes, to some degree.
Srecko Sostar: Abraham has prejudice that people of different tribe, people, religion are all bad, immoral, without ethics, not honest...
Response: Abraham spoke of people who are enemies of God an these enemies of God seek to kill people who are for God. These enemies have no clue and or any idea who the God of Abraham is and what He has done, they only find out afterwards. Some who are neutral with Abraham's people also didn't really have a clue who the True God is either, enter The Ruler of Gerar.
Srecko Sostar:Â What spirit guided Abraham when he lied about Sara, how she is his sister and not wife?
Response: Clear what led him to lie in regards to the Pharaoh taking interest in his "so called sister" by his own reasoning he thought a Godless people would kill him the second they realize that him and Sarah are husband and wife. Sarah will be taken, and Abraham will be killed, therefore destroying the Promised Seed (Abrahamic Seed) when a old man, who is God's friend, is struck down by whatever means the Egyptians use to kill people. If you had not noticed, Satan's goal with Adam and Eve was a success, his job would have been much more easier if Abraham was indeed killed, thus the Abrahamic Seed regarding the people and the Messiah would have never taken place. That would have been a very dark and bleak situation and putting God in a position where HIS Promise was done away with due to his adversary. Since Abraham, as well as Sarah, while in Egypt, did survive, God intervene saving the both of them and revealing to the Egyptians that HE is the God of both Abraham and Sarah as well as the God of all men and women of Abraham's people. Issac did the same thing like his Father because he too knew how the people were.
Srecko Sostar:Â he has not told people "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth", but his version of tribal and family connections and customs (and such explanation came at the culmination of problem, not at first contact, in the beginning).
Response: For if he had told the Egyptians, he would have been killed, and would not be a pretty sight for the so called brother to be among friendly people and sudden being torn apart the second said people became unfriendly. The Egyptians didn't attempt to execute Abraham because they found out who God really is, which prompted the Pharaoh to hand back Sarah, also thwarting a marriage between Sarah and the Pharaoh.
Older times were brutal, yes, but it has nothing to do with Tribal and or Family Connections, as you say, it has to do with people of God being in constant fear of those who hate and or detest God, let alone being unaware of who God is and they are not friendly to Abraham's kind and will deal with them in the worse way possible. According to history, The Egyptians were very violent in killing people, they even kill babies right out of the mother's womb in a grim fashion which is called Infanticide.
NOTE: Baby Moses escaped that fate that to his mother and his sister, Prophetess Miriam (The daughter of Am'ram).
Srecko Sostar: he told, fear for his own life. He did not care about Sara's life and her moral integrity, honesty.
Response: He indeed feared for his life and did what he did due to his reasoning and Sarah herself, was loyal to Abraham and complied with his plan for she and Abe knew about enemies of God. Sarah herself also lied for she never acknowledged her husband Abraham because she knew they'd kill him. And to both Sarah and Abraham, that would put a Promise that is of Covenant level with God obsolete, becoming broken. Therefore, what they did was an act of Spiritual Warfare/Civil Disobedience. This is why many people, mainly women, see Sarah as a Hero, for if she did not comply with her husband, Jesus would have never existed as a man by means of the Abrahmic Seed.
This is why I said before, somewhat, Spiritual Warfare/Civil Disobedience is mainly done by women in the Bible. Sarah is one of them and clearly everyone knows about this.
Srecko Sostar:Â "theocratic warfare"
Response: It is. Even though the name is different, it is still categorized as Spiritual Warfare/Civil Disobedience. Done by several men in the Bible, the most infamous being Apostle Paul, who enforced it further, but Spiritual Warfare/Civil Disobedience was done by majority of female persons in the Bible, the women.
Srecko Sostar:Â Only about his life
Response: His life so that the Promise is not Broken and lied due to his own reasoning to protect his life of which he was in fear of losing. The same can be said of Sarah, who knew about the Promise, and complied so that Abraham does not perish, if Abraham dies, the Promise dies for it is by means of his seed, the Promise is moves on forward. The very reason why it is so explicit in the New Testament, namely as to what we see in Galatians or rather, what Jesus said.
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:Do you justified Abraham dealing with situation because of possible reasons that he - Abraham consider as good reasons to do so? Or because you today consider his reasons as good reasons for deal with such situation in such way??
Both Abraham and Sarah had the same reasoning and it was in good intentions in regards to Spiritual Warfare, and that is to perverse the Promise of the Abrahamic Seed, which we later see in chapter 17. This was the case with Issac and Rebekah as well.
So Spiritual Warfare regarding both couples was justified, in the same sense Johnathan didn't tell his Father about David's location (otherwise David would have been killed instantly), the same way the prostitute, Rehab, didn't let the guards of Jericho know about the spies (otherwise the Spies, Rehab and ALL of her household would have been executed and possibly the very people who sent the spies)
Spiritual Warfare is Spiritual Warfare, anything that puts a shackle on anything in regards to God, and later on in conjunction with hinders what was entrusted to the Church and her people.
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said::))) No problem. I forget how my life is mine not Abraham's  life or someone else's life  :)))) sorry to  your lost  reading time :))))
Last I checked, never hear of you speaking of God speaking about what is to come for your offspring, your seed. You used an example that does not really connect with Abraham's situation, the very reason I told you earlier, put yourself in Abraham's shoes and tell me what you would have done, mainly when God's Promise is on you and your wife. You make it seem as this was a difficult answer and went on about military service and being in jail - there is no connection, Sostar, and not only it was irrelevant, despite your own ordeal, it didn't make sense to what was being asked.
Anyways, if it was not a problem, you would not have stated what you said previously and somehow attempt to turn the tables right now. And just as though you seem to be not so keen on some things, it is expected that when it comes to something you cannot bring forth to claim you will not answer it and bring forth something entirely different and or to move away from what is being talked about, this isn't your first rodeo, Sostar and this isn't my first wrangle. As for the other response, I read everything and all things, and that reading has got you to make a "change" elsewhere.
5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:I think that this man is/was inherited all from Adam and Eve as all other human. So, if you want make me to believe how Abraham never told a lie (half true or some other white lies) that is or it isn't written in the Bible reports, then please do not expect such from me. If you want me to show compassion, understanding for his situation and weakness of flesh that made him act that way, that is something else.Â
There is no need to think, last I recall, this situation regarding Abraham and Sarah in Egypt took place many many MANY years after Adam and Eve, so of course they are imperfect also,if they were perfect, perhaps if Abe and Sarah were alive today, they'd be willing to share some wisdom with you, Sostar, I can already picture Abe telling you want went down before Sodom and Gomorrah was dealt with by God.
All giggles aside, I know you love to giggle and smile spontaneously when you response, I never said Abraham never told a lie, I merely stated as to why he did it, and what was the conclusion, if you forgotten already, I briefly went over this in the last page, here is the link:
I really do not expect much from you because regardless of anyone says, granted you seem to be in somewhat of an agreement with someone elsewhere on this topic. For the Bible tells us exactly what the passage conveys, and what is is showing us and the very actions of Abraham himself, as well as his wife, Sarah, who complies and even calls Abraham Lord. Other than that, Abraham and Sarah's reasoning was very clear, and it is very clear what they did was in the realm of Spiritual Warfare/Civil Disobedience.
So in short, you were have open on a specific verse that involved Jesus, you should be very thankful of the couple's actions because you would not have a passage, spoken of by Jesus, to even quote on this forum.
Also for next time when you read a Bible passage, read the WHOLE thing for context, you simply stopped on a point and not understand what is being mentioned for this is not the first time you'd been caught for this.
If you wish to speak of Issac and Rebekah, which is related to Abraham and Sarah's situation (The sister-wife narrative), by all means, say what you need to say.
As for the last part, I do not care about politicians, and using them in what i being talked about here - is absurd and silly. Other than that, would it kill you and or give you despair to not mention the name of a person who made the quote? Cite what ye speaketh Srecko, or thy claim is invalid.
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8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
..because she is so beautiful."
yeah... people kill each other because of money, power and beauty
But you brought up Abraham, so why speak of him as such when he was defending both a promise and his wife as well as his life? The verses in both start. passage and conclusion is placed before you and still here you do not see what took place, let alone seeing what God had to do to prevent a promise from even breaking, if such a route continued on it's course, Jesus, the Messiah promised would not have been born and perhaps you and I wouldn't be here right now because of that.
I am glad you marked that highlighted portion because that is what is said in the Bible, let alone the Hebrew people themselves, how they are seen, described and mentioned, etc. You have a lot to learn, Sostar.
8 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:What i said is not for purpose of humor, but to show how some WT elders, obviously "under WT spirit guidance" manage such situations.
Very serious, but in sphere of bad humor or irony and bizarreness that is product when 3 male interrogate woman in private/judicial chambers. Â
So what was the point of your last response only for now to bring this up? Perhaps you should re-read your comment and make a better response because if you wanted to say all that, you would have addressed it, and it is a clear attempt to shit convo./dis. as you did before.
Rape is very very serious and you'd have to be very wise with words and not add fuel to the fire for even worse can bring out things of some people, mainly when it comes to dealing with those who had talked to people who are victim, and it happens in ALL spaces, education, religion, etc, some cases be it child on child. Abusers will be punished but attacking everyone as a whole for the actions of one is not going to help you, in fact, it is only make the situation better for those who are the real enemy.
As for the last part, I believe I discuss with you about this before and Mr. Butler and others, as did others who were part of the discussion, therefore, it is a waste to re-post and mention the same thing said months ago for a second time.
Other than that, I am not one for mind games and brief end-sentence giggles, Sostar and you like playing quite a bit of that.
5 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:Hi again!
Such questions was addressed to me in 1980 when i was put before several military officers in ex Yugoslavia period, for reason of my rejection to accept military service, clothing, equipment and weapons. That ended in 3 years prison/jail.Â
So, i really have no wish, no will to answer on same today.Â
Or if you like to hear some Bible verses i can find them for you. Only if you would insist. But because i consider you as man who have wide insight on Bible text, i have no doubt how you can guess what verses will fit as answer on that question. :))Â Â Â Â
I concur, this has nothing to to be equal and or amounting as to what you have said, therefore, somewhat irrelevant. The question in focus is what is said previously: what would you have done in Abraham's sandals? Perhaps what would you have done if you were in his Son, Issac's sandals?
To be more in-depth, you put yourself in A'bram's place and yo are met with the exact promise, the challenges, struggle and position as A'bram, let alone the weight of what God had said to A'bram, you in A'bram's place, a great honor in promise God gives you for from your seed, the Messiah is to come very soon.
This also is in connection with Issac, who is Abraham's Son, so I ask you again:
what would you have done in Abraham's sandals? Perhaps what would you have done if you were in his Son, Isaac's sandals?
Granted with the core of this question being God's Promise, what you yourself would have done?
As for your response, you are speaking of military service and what became of you for your own decision. I do not see you being given a promise, nor having anything to do with a woman, be it if you are married or not, which is unknown, I do not see one in fear of his life, however, those who end up being in the military end up with fear and or is fearful and go nuts at times when they are in conflict and or returning home from conflict.
No one is making wishes, this isn't Major Nelson and his I Dream of Jeannie type of situation. This question is solely biblical, so I do not see the problem. I bring forth this question because of your response to others and what was said to you. You speak of Abraham being a lair, but make no mention of the conclusion to the narrative.
You can spout any bible verse you want, but the fact you didn't understand why Abraham did what he did, how can you be taken seriously?
Regarding the passage
- Why did A'bram lie? To preserve his life.
- What was his lie? Called Sar'ai his sister when really she is his wife.
- Who fancied [took interest in] Sa'rai? The Pharaoh of Egypt.
- How did the Pharaoh find out that Sar'ai? God intervene.
- What did the Pharaoh do? Returned Sar'ai and supplied the couple with resources.
- Why did God intervene? The promise he made to A'bram, which is in connection with what God said in Genesis 3:15.
- Where do these narratives take place? Only in the Book of Genesis, common to the household of Abraham in those ancient times.
This is very basic and elementary.
I believe what you should have said is what is it in the Bible of which you do not understand so that people here can explain it to you, Sostar. You went from Abraham, to Watchtower, to elders, to Military Service to saying you can point out a scripture to tell us when the thing is you need us to tell you what the verse says. But every time when it is explained and or given to you, be it right and or wrong you do not accept it anyways.
And no, we are not talking about a verse that fits an answer, we are talking about accepting the context of a passage and or verse - the question directed towards you in is total reflection of A'bram's position, no one asked you to go treasure hunting in the Bible.
As for biblical verses people do have to explain it to you, regardless of the fact you never accept a verse totally. You stopped at 318 men, but fail to bring to point why 318 men were used. The answer, the Hebrews had enemies that hate them very much and their God of whom they hate. You stated Abraham lied, but fail to see why he did it, the answer, he was in fear for his wife would be taken and the only thing that is coming his way is returning to the dust - being killed, God later intervene because that would break the promise of the seed and put mankind in a very VERY dark state because Jesus would have never come to earth for Mary would not have existed, no Jesus, no Messiah to crush the head of the snake with his heel.
You kill a butterfly in the past, it will effect the future, every heard of the butterfly effect? The cause and effect of such a change, in a biblical standpoint, would be very different.
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4 hours ago, Gone Away said:
No more than a fire or flame change location when doing the same surely
And yet he mentions a verse regarding the Resurrection, thus having the audacity to speak of not ceasing, not only he adheres to the Trinity and Immortal Soul doctrines, but the doctrine Apollinarist.
He does not only contradict himself here, but Cos pretty must contradicted his own words in this regard relating to this subject elsewhere months ago.
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5 hours ago, Cos said:
We had the claim that the passage in Luke 23:46 means that Jesus ceased to exist, but now we have this by @Gone Away that Luke 23:46 is Jesus’ “future life prospects to God as opposed to describing the death state”, Now the person who proposed Luke 23:46 as meaning Jesus ceased to exist, liked this (up voted), even though this proposal by Mr. Joyce’s, contradicts that persons earlier claim!
This passage does indeed state that Jesus had expired, thus dying, which was part of prophecy regardless of how you try to change it. Luke 23:46 and both Mark 15: 37, 39 speak of Jesus' death, and every cross-reference, inducing that of which is found in the other 2 gospel accounts point to this very fact.
@Gone Away is correct, he isn't contradicting anything. Jesus' future life prospect to God began when God raised him out of death (the pangs of death if I may add), therefore we see Jesus called Risen Christ and or Risen Jesus (Lord), as well as the other title known as Firstborn out of the Dead [out of Death]. When Jesus had risen, he didn't even ascend yet until AFTER he met with his disciples and told them about the promise, once again, for months, you are evasive when Acts 1 and 2 is mentioned and or talked about because the context defeats you here and now as it did months ago.
What is contradicting is you saying this now vs. your own comment about what the Disciples did prior to Jesus ascending to Heaven.
You speak of this Mr.Joyce, does hurt to post and or link what he said?
5 hours ago, Cos said:Then @sami who also "up voted" Mr. Joyce’s above comments but then does an about face by going back to the ceased existing nonsense.
It is not nonsense, it is a fulfilling of prophecy, the very reason why Jesus is said to be the Life and the Resurrection for he conquered Death (John 11:25, Revelation 1:18). You've yet to proven anything pertaining to anyone who has the pangs of Death on him to having been alive after ceasing, therefore your sheer denial of prophecy is visible and clear contradiction to your claims in the past.
And the response of Spirits in Prison was also incorrect for the Risen Jesus had spoken to solely evil spirits, bounded and chained for Judgement.
Again, you mention Joyce, link and or quote the response.
5 hours ago, Cos said:Scripture shows that when a person dies their spirit does not cease to exist but leaves the body (Psalm 146:4).
The verse saying the following:
- Psalms 146:4 - When his breath [spirit] departs, he returns to the earth; on that very day his plans perish.
Cross-References Below:
Ecclesiastes 9:5-10 - (5) For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. (6) Their love and their hate and their envy have already perished, and forever they have no more share in all that is done under the sun. (7) Go, eat your bread with joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart, for God has already approved what you do. (8) Let your garments be always white. Let not oil be lacking on your head. (9) Enjoy life with the wife whom you love, all the days of your vain life that he has given you under the sun, because that is your portion in life and in your toil at which you toil under the sun. (10) Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might, for there is no work or thought or knowledge or wisdom in Sheol, to which you are going.
Isaiah 38:18 - For Sheol [Hades] does not thank you; death does not praise you; those who go down to the pit do not hope for your faithfulness.
It speaks of the departing of one's spirit and or breathe of the human/soul, humans are not literal spirits. God is the Life-Giver, the source of Life, clearly the story of Adam and Eve, our first parents, is basic knowledge. When we succumb to pangs of death, or rather when we die, everything about us, what we do, what we use to do under the sun - is gone, thus we - perish, cease and or expire, in the most simplest term, we die/are dead.
It would be understandable if all men were really spirits, but we are not, for we are flesh and bone.
Therefore, the Immortal Soul Doctrine is wrong. The irony of it all is you like to try and use the words of Church Fathers, what do you think they were fighting against in Asia Minor?
5 hours ago, Cos said:In Luke 8:55 we read that the spirit of Jairus’ daughter returned to her body and she rose up immediately.
This verse is in connection with what is mentioned above as well as Genesis 2:7, Ecclesiastes 3:9, Isaiah 42:5 as well as Matthew 17:50. The life of which Jai'rus' daughter, who is 12 years of age, once had, was given back to her, for she had lost her life and her life had been returned. She didn't go into some Afterlife of which you believe in for the Jews and the people at the time never believed in such, the Immortal Soul Doctrine you attempt top defend.
We also see that anyone who had died and returned have no recollection of an Afterlife, and if they did believe in such why take their daughter away from the so called peaceful state Sorcery believers such as yourself put forth to claim?
This isn't the first time someone has been resurrected. Also, seems a bit hypocritical for you to even mention that verse because, again, you believe in the Immortal Soul Doctrine, let alone one such as yourself who revealed to be an Apollinarist.
You already shown yourself to be in denial of what the resurrection is and it's meaning, why speak of it when you believe people, of which you see as spirits, do not cease?
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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:
Could be worse .... when women are substituting for men in a church, instead of a head covering, they COULD have to wear Ronald McDonald shoes.
Guess which Sister is the Substitute Congregation Coordinator?
Clearly not number 2 because that looks and appears to be the rival of The Burger King, also we cannot tell if any of them is wearing a head covering.
The only thing that is bad about being a religious man and persecuted is 75% of the time you will be killed, the other 25% is being imprison. Which tends to be the case overseas.
Other than that, they have to cover their heads, even if a situation like this takes place, they must continue in the faith, as well as be very adhering to what is written.
Â
But here is a Pilot Twist for you: What if the men AND women were taken?
Certainly Ronald McDonald's shoes (size 18) are way too big for any child to wear.
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7 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
so after all.... there is a life after death :)))))
It's a figure of speech and or expression, common to American folk and some in the EU, read about it:Â https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turn_in_one's_grave
If that were the literal case then perhaps a zombie apocalypse would take place, an absurd idea. That being said, you really need to learn what is literal and what is a figure of speech, it is elementary. For instance, I can say my car sings better than Céline Dion because of my new engine, it tends to burst in song, clearly, a vehicle, a car, isn't really singing vocally let alone having a vocal capability to literally sing.
Â
Not literal because stuff like that is seen in cartoons and or stories that are not real:
Sentence: Rook's God a new engine for his car and let me tell you man, his car can sing better than the skilled opera singer.
Not Real:
Reality:
Â
Â
That being said, there is no life after death and or the so called Afterlife, nor is there Immortal Souls for humans are not spirits and or become spirits.
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33 minutes ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:
It is "generally" considered that if a man has sex with a young teenage girl, it is a crime worthy of considerable punishment and he gets a kick in the teeth... but if a woman has sex with a young teenage boy, he is "lucky", and he gets a grin, raised eybrows, and a jealous elbow in the ribs.
EXACTLY, a broken system. Women who abuse children tend to get off Scott-Free at times with little to no sentence, but when it is men, people are prepared to lynch and tear him apart.
Abusers of all kinds love to target religion and educational systems for the sole reason they can reach kids, even holding a position within said institution in order to use whatever rules or regulations to their advantage to abuse children, it is insane. If the abuser looks like a Barbie or a Supermodel, expect the Judge to be very very easy on the abuser because it would seem to be the case.
The biggest problem is there are people, as we speak, trying to make pedophilia legal and when that happens, if they're fight is winning, all institutions will expect a storm of pedophiles running rampant in full force, like watering accumulating and eventually breaking a dam.
There is a specific group in government who is 100% shielded when it comes to pedophilia, but no one seems to talk about it, and even if they did, they'd end up like Seth Rich, Claus Ebrewein and a whole list of others.That is why those who know things tread carefully, this seems to be the case with Las Vegas Survivors ending up dead by so called accidents, the same can be said for those who go after people who shield those who freely practice pedophilia, making children out to be some kind of food menu which is sick.
For a losing fight against pedophilia will really put a killing blow on those who fight against it the real way, no one never aims for the root of the problem, they only go after a small selected few of individuals when there are REAL threats who are trying to make such things legal, children, young girls, are already forced to marry their rapist in several states of the US already and the list goes on.
All I can say is if we let the really villains win, not even make an attempt to prevent them, then it will be a problem, as for religious churches and institutions, they will have to deal with a Horde of pedophiles that come in form of a storm. So far, the fight is a global tug-o-war, I myself have been against this since the whole drag queen thing slowly took form around the mid 2014s when this information was sent my way.
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6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
what if this most beautiful wife say... "why not, this is most beautiful man i ever seen!"
According to the Bible:
- Genesis 12:11 - When he was about to enter Egypt, he said to Sar'ai his wife, “I know that you are a woman beautiful in appearance,
- Genesis 24:16 - Now the girl was very beautiful, a virgin who had not had relations with any man. She went down to the spring, filled her jar, and came up again.
- Genesis 26:7 - But when the men of that place asked about his wife, he said, "She is my sister." For he was afraid to say, "She is my wife," since he thought to himself, "The men of this place will kill me on account of Rebekah, because she is so beautiful."
- Genesis 29:17 - Leah had no sparkle in her eyes, but Rachel was shapely and beautiful.
How the Beauty/Beautiful is seen in the Bible:
beautiful, as an outward sign of the inward good, noble, honorable character; good, worthy, honorable, noble, and seen to be so.
And no, the Pharaoh and rulers took interest in women, not men. Sodom and Gomorah is that-a -way → Genesis 18-19.l
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:perhaps she would scream and by that not be guilty for sex. When some elder in judicial committee ask her did she enjoyed, she can tell, i was so busy with screaming and not have time to enjoy!
And not we shift from Abraham to something entirely different, but it is no surprise to the man of surprises, Sostar. As far as I see, Sarah was not forced to do anything whatsoever, she was in accordance with Abraham's plan for she herself also knew of what God told Abraham, the reason why she was feeling a bit of laughter when God spoke through his angels and questions as to why she find what is said too hard to believe, for a woman of her age, which is read later on in Genesis.
Also I would like to add, rape is not a joke,do not make it out to be as such. Regardless of who done it and who is victim, so I rather not take part in your form of humor.
As for Sarah, you clearly miss the whole meaning and conclusion of the passage from start to finish.
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:Oh man, buddy.... Abraham sandals are his not mine. :))
That is why I told you, what would you have done if you were in Abraham's Sandals. Clearly you were him, you'd put God's purpose and will for Jesus to come on into the earth as a man in jeopardy, given God further regret of why he made man. Moreover, the situation between you and God would be vastly different for he made a promise to you and you failed. That is a huge gamble.
6 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:"And when Abram heard that his relative had been captured, he assembled the 318 trained men born in his household..."
Alas, poor Srrecko Sostar. Did you not read of the very Tribe removed from the fold? The Tribe of Dan and their actions?
That being said, who else you think was able and ready to kill the people of God to begin with?
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7 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:
I have heard several jw's say, 'that doesn't happen in Jehovah's organization, only in Christendom'.
Everyone talks about pedophilia happening elsewhere even though it happens to them also, be it they are aware or not, not much of a surprise, but the surprise that come from all the abuse is how either female abusers are treated to male abusers in any type of institution, be it religious and or educational. You probably talked to the newbies because there are many who are aware of this, the thing is here who is knowledgeable in the signs and the like vs. those who do not know any of the signs. the PSA teaches these things.
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4 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
agree :))))
But Revelation 2:10(NW) says: “Do not be afraid of the things you are destined to suffer. Look! the Devil will keep on throwing some of you into prison that you may be fully put to the test, and that you may have tribulation ten days. Prove yourselves faithful even with the danger of death, and I will give you the crown of life.”
But we are just humans. No matter if someone is Job, Abraham, David, Saul, Peter, JW, Buddhist or Atheist.
You do realize Abraham's situation is in the Old Testament? As is his Son, Issac, both Father and Son had to deal with the same person of power,the very reason it is called the wife-sister narrative.
The verse you mention is of the Revelation of John account, and such has taken place well after the New Covenant replaced the Law Covenant, the coming of the Christ, which has been foretold and fulfilled, his death and his resurrection, his ascension and exaltation and eventually his return. We should forget what the Promised Seed, God's promise to Abraham was all about, or rather what Jesus said in John 8:58.
Abraham, called A'bram at the time was fearful, even feared one taking plunder of his women and he himself being slain, killed as if he was nothing in the middle of nowhere. Furthermore, he took delight in God's promise and wanted to remain so that such may come top pass through his seed. So then, Srecko, what would you have done in Abraham's sandals? Perhaps what would you have done if you were in his Son, Iassac's sandals?
That being said, you'd be surprise of how people rather take death than refuse service to God and his Laws for they know that they will be resurrected on the day that is coming. Atheist do not believe in anything, and they do have fear of death, as if the general public, they themselves do not fear it at times but they fear of those around them who have to deal with their death, mainly family. Buddhist believe in the afterlife, which is false, JWs believe in the resurrection, they're Reforestationist, as for David, Saul, and even Peter, buddy you really need to read into their account.
One of the things of man is that they are and can be fearful, mainly when the tipping point has been reached.
As for the example in question highlighted, a man sees your wife has the most beautiful thing ever but does not know you are married to her, what you have done if you were A'bram or Issac, let alone another situation whereas a man took your wife in the night, not knowing she is your wife.
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@Srecko Sostar Whatever a man can do, woman can do also. However regarding the church, women can be ministries and preachers, they cannot take up the position of an bishop, elder, pastor and or other, the ONLY TIME they can do this is if all pastors, elders, and or other are not present in the church and or purged from service, this was the case when ISIS was a far bigger threat in the Middle East killing the young and older men, the women and girls were taken as wives and or sex slaves, those who escape continue on for those who cannot lead, for such ones are either held captive and or saved for execution, example, would be what took place in 2016 whereas US American allies left a Christian town in the hands of ISIS, Syrian Christians almost got this kind of treatment regarding US ally, Israel, which resulted Syrian Christians to run and seek protection from the leader of Syria and Marshal, Bashar al-Assad (بشار الأسد).
Now let us put you in another example, Srecko: You are a pastor of a church (Syrianic Church of Hashem-yahuh) somewhere near Yabrud, Syria, you have a total of 22 grown males, young adults to elderly, out of that 22 you have 5 older men under you. There are children amounting to 20 young boys, and 15 young girls, as well as 18 older women ranging from young to elderly, half of that amount are married to several of the men in your church.
Head of the Church: Pastor Srecko Sostar, you are 1 in total
22 older men, 5 among them are higher rank and are right under you as both ministers and church servant (Stewards)
18 Women, half of them married
20 Boys
15 Girls
The Total being: 76 members
The Government issued all men for military service and you and all the males of your church refuse, amounting to you and the others, totaling to 23 people being forced out of their homes and or the church. You and the other men are in prison now and it is only the women and children of the church because their is no pastor, no stewards and or servants, the women, the among them is able to take charge until you or any of the men return, granted this is Syria (In the midst of Rebel Conflict), you'll be in jail for a while.
Only then a wide and older women can take up such a position, but out of respect of God's Law and the fact that the head of the Woman is the man, she must cover herself.
So in a way, women do have roles, but clearly cannot have a role that a man has, unless the situation calls for it. Take all the men out of the Churches and leave only women, you will see the end result. What is an accursed practice is giving a position to women even though the men are present, something of which today's Churches do, therefore it can be said our church father are rolling in their graves for the practice is outlandish when no grim situation has befell the Church.
Other than that, whatever men can do, women can do also, however in the realm of God's Laws, women can do things a man can do as long as it respects the very Laws of God, and done so in utter respect to the head of the Christ, being God, and to Jesus himself because he is the Head of the Church.
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12 hours ago, Gone Away said:
The one that indicates that "concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father."
I presume you are talking about what constitutes a "generation" in Jesus prophecy at Matt.24:34?
Well isn't it obvious? We cannot actually know how long the generation Jesus spoke of is until "all these things happen".
If Jesus wanted us to know how many years were meant here, he would have said the number of years wouldn't he surely? So actually trying to put a number to it by convoluted mental gymnastics based on 101 general understandings and comparisons of what constitutes a "generation", Biblical or otherwise, is just a game to play while you're waiting for the bus.
Nice table though , with an excellent theme scripture, very well demonstrated. That, I can use actually. Thanks. ?
What people also fail to see is that those of that generation, those destined for Priesthood are seeing the signs of the end times which will lead to a great tribulation that is possibly on a whole other hardcore level beyond of what we can understand. 1922 of what took place prior to the League of Nations well into the whole situation with Israel, jumping years upon years later, the sudden conquest for peace with religious leaders joining forces with bankers, politicians and even those of the MSM who supports them, making the claim since we all believe in one God we should unite, things of that nature of which was not really done before in the past, and it getting stronger and stronger each day and very visible to those destined and those among the righteous and meek.
Most certainly, this generation will not pass away, for these persons of the church do indeed see these things. Speaking about signs, the conversion of followers to a branch of these religious leaders will take place in several months, I can already see very soon this being talked about in the religious space by all persons, and surely I will address it here too for briefly I made this known in another post on this forum.
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9 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
I do not know how it is in country you living, but chlorine is still implemented in water purification and much more.
This I agree with. Chemicals in our water, in our food in products, chemicals that damages the body and or the environment. The sad reality is even if you fight against it, there is no resolve and I learn this the hard way several years ago.
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23 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:
Space Merchant:
... obviously you expect to be paid by the word.
What you are writing about is a complete mystery.
To a degree it is no mystery for people think and blame God for everything when he clearly has no part in what they are doing, some even blame God for taking their loved ones when in reality he does not take them nor do they go anywhere upon death. Moreover, God can interfere with some things, but not as what people make it seem to be by their understanding of things. Example: We cannot blame God for our own misfortune by stepping on a Lego piece, tumbling down 3 steps and breaking a leg in the process, resulting in long hospital stays and a large bill to pay, and lastly, being wheelchair bound. A silly example but people do blame God for taking their legs and or arms, mainly if so and so uses that part of their body for sports and the like. Also stepping on a Lego does indeed hurt and is very, very painful.
Other than that, it would be good to be paid for writing and typing things, the more money made, the more I can give to those indeed and sustain my household.
But I had a wonderful response I made a while back to an Agnostic, but I since lost that information in regards to having it being somewhat an answer to your example, but alas, I do not have it, so I'd have to do more research in order to make a more fitting response.
On the other side of the spectrum, going back to the topic at hand, the truth of the matter is the Jehovah's Witnesses, as said before, are not immune, no one is immune, if anyone says they are immune, I suspect cheating. Pedophila, as of late, is getting bigger and stronger and it is very hard to hit the weak-spot of such a beast due to Pedophila, by the general public, is being pushed to be made legal and to be promoted. When this goes into full effect, all hell will break loose at this point and both educational and religious institutions will be hit x10 as much should the current society of this world continues to feed and pet the beast, a beast that can't really be harmed when it is strong enough. the LGBTQ community is on the front-lines in support of what many of us are against. So a time will come when secular and religious laws will also be hi- oh never mind, it already has been hit (the talk about the 1st Amendment regarding Religious Rights).
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9 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:
Abraham did this same lie 2 time - Gen 12
Well, i can see (in chapter 20:11) how Abraham has prejudice that people of different tribe, people, religion are all bad, immoral, without ethics, not honest... how similar with some JW members standpoint on so called "worldly" people, that they are not worth of their society because of similar reasons.
Second, he has not told people "the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth", but his version of tribal and family connections and customs (and such explanation came at the culmination of problem, not at first contact, in the beginning). And this is not even in sphere of WT thesis about "theocratic warfare". Reason is, as he told, fear for his own life. He did not care about Sara's life and her moral integrity, honesty. Not about what will people talking about his God, religion, beliefs. Only about his life - according to text.
That would defeat the purpose of the Great Commission if that was the case, thus preaching the gospel would be done with a hypocritical mindset of what the early Church adheres to. Theocratic Warfare is just another name for Spiritual Warfare and it is a practice that is done by Christians today, as did people in ancient times who stand in defense for God and or His Laws. This is also coupled with Civil Disobedience, which was practiced and put into action by Apostle Paul and the churches of which he writes to, Johnathan, the eldest son of King Saul and a close friend of King David who did such in order to save his friend, moreover, Civil Disobedience was predominately done by solely women in the Bible, a very good example is Re'hab and or perhaps Jael, also known as Yael. Spiritual Warfare and Civil Disobedience is usually allowed and done by Christians should anything is in conflict with God's Law, in this sense, the Laws of God vs. Man's Law that seek to change, and or put God's Law into conflict, regardless of what said Laws of God is in connection to, an obvious one is to not making God's purpose and will by means of spreading the gospel known which results in persecution, the Law of Men can conflict and or seek to change God's Law which is a No-No to Christians, this also goes with Religious Freedom, as discussed with you on this matter before in regards to Religious Rights and Rights to Practice.
In Abraham's case, you also need to realize that the fold of which Abraham is part of is deemed an enemy by those on the outside, haters of God and His people, the very reason you have a whole lot of fighting going on seen in the Old Testament, and what I can say, some of these battles can be brutal at times.
Now, In The Book of Genesis, chapter 12 (The Call of A'bram),
NOTE: Such is refereed to as the Wife–sister narratives in the Book of Genesis and is part of the Torah,which took place inasmuch as 3 times.
In outlined form:
- A'bram leaves Ha'ran for Ca'naan (1-9)
- God’s promise to A'bram (7)
- A'bram and Sar'ai in Egypt (10-20)
A'bram and his wife Sar'ai (later on known as Abraham and Sarah via change) traveled to Egypt due to famine that has taken up in the land of Ca'naan. A'bram gave instruction to his wife, Sar'ai, to tell people in Egypt that she was his sister instead of his wife. The reason A'bram said this was to protect himself, granted with what can happen if they took the alternative approach or at least according to his reasoning. Furthermore, because of Sar'ai's evident beauty, A'bram feared someone come and slay him and take Sar'ai as his wife, for he feared being killed because of someone who would fancy his wife, for it was a thing in those days to kill the mate of someone and take his spouse for their own. A'bram's plan to pass her off as his sister would ensure that A'bram would be well received by those he met, build up a reputation, per-say and not be a man marked for death (having a target painted on his back).
While in Egypt, Sar'ai’s beauty attracted people and it caught the attention of Pharaoh who was the ruler at the time. This resulted in Sar'ai being taken into the Pharaoh’s house, and this resulted in surplus of gifts being given to A'bram.
We have these 2 verses to look at:
- Genesis 12:16, 17 - A'bram and Sar'ai in Egypt - (16) And for her sake he dealt well with A'bram; and he had sheep, oxen, male donkeys, male servants, female servants, female donkeys, and camels. (17) But the Lord [YHWH] afflicted Pharaoh and his house with great plagues because of Sar'ai, A'bram's wife.
Bizarre, yes, but in the end, the Pharaoh was apparently a victim of A'bram and Sar'ai’s plan, which is evident as to what is said above. The conclusion of this punishment reveals the obvious reason. When the Pharaoh realized Sar'ai was A'bram’s wife, he summoned A'bram and said, the following of which we will see in both verses 18 and 19 of the same chapter:
(18) So Pharaoh called A'bram and said, “What is this you have done to me? Why did you not tell me that she was your wife? (19) Why did you say, ‘She is my sister,’ so that I took her for my wife? Now then, here is your wife; take her, and go.”
Now we will see the reasoning as to why God did what he had to do. For if God had not caused the plagues to come upon the Pharaoh and his household, he may not have known anything was wrong and or even suspect a thing. The affliction itself led to the discovery that Sar'ai was indeed A'bram’s wife, and not his sister. If Pharaoh had kept Sar'ai, A'bram would not have had a child, son with Sar'ai in fulfillment of God’s promise to him (Genesis 12:2; 17:19). A'bram was indeed in the wrong to lie, and did so because he was in fear of losing his wife and being killed in order for his killer to take hi wife, hence why he had such reasoning and concluded to this plan from the beginning. On the other hand, God YHWH intervened in order to keep His Covenant with A'bram.
Even with all this going down and the conclusion of this ordeal, the Pharaoh returned A'bram’s wife, Sar'ai to him and was pretty much cool with A'bram by providing him protection:
- Genesis 12:20 - And Pharaoh gave men orders concerning him, and they sent him away with his wife and all that he had.
Despite A'bram’s own wrongdoing, God worked to fulfill His promise by any means necessary. Soon, A'bram left Egypt with his wife Sar'ai, in addition to the protection provided by the Pharaoh, and added prosperity.
With that being said, this whole chapter tells you from start to finish and gives you the conclusion and even tells you why A'bram did what he did in this passage, he was in fear, in this sense, he was in fear of men who can take his wife by simply killing him, for a dead man cannot do anything to rescue his wife, or any of his household and or belongings.
This passage also serves as a good example of how God sometimes does not intervene in regards to someone’s life, actions made an choices, for it all is part of a bigger situation. We see that God used the affliction of the Pharaoh’s household to bring about good for A'bram. For at times may not always know exactly as to why bad things do occur, but that doesn't mean that the purpose in such is unfounded. God has and always will have a purpose behind everything that takes place
- Jeremiah 29:11 - For I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord [YHWH], plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.
And according to what Apostle Paul taught in,
- Romans 8:28 - And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.
In A'bram's case, by means of his reasoning and fear, he unwisely trusted in his own reasoning in order to preserve his life, and he was caught in a deceit of his own doing, caught in a lie. God proved His help to his friend and that He, God YHWH, is the only One with the power to save (save the/His people). We also see God has a greater purpose in all things, which also includes that of suffering. His will is indeed sovereign, and His Name will most surely be glorified.
As for Genesis 20:11, it points to what was addressed with what took place between A'bram and Sar'ai to the Pharaoh. In chapter 20 of Genesis, you also have to realize also that A'bram, who is now called Abraham was stating what people can do to get what they want, people willing to kill in order to get whatever it is that they want - in short they can make him [is] no more should they choose. A couple of verses prior, his wife, Sar'ai, now known as Sarah, was in captivity by the one named Sarah Abimelech, the King of the City of Ge'rar, to which a similar situation took place as done in Egyptt, but slightly different.
Both Abraham and Sarah took up temporary residence in the city and Abimelech thought that the couple were both brother and sister. Which resulted in Abimelech taking Sarah to become his wife, but he did not did not touch or defile her. Abimelech was met with warning in a dream and God was the one who gave the warning to Abimelech, which caused the king of Ge'rar to return Sarah to Abraham together with compensation consisting of livestock and slaves and, he also included a thousand shekels of silver as a guarantee of Sarah’s chastity (for Abimelech did not touch and or had relations with Sarah whatsoever). Later on, Abimelech concluded a Covenant for Peace and Mutual confidence with Abraham at Beer-sheva (Beer-sheba), read into this passage fully - Genesis 20:1-18 and 21:22-34.
NOTE: God healed Abimelech and his wife and his slave girls, and they were able to and began having children normally because originally, God had made all the women, from wife to slave girls, in Abimelech's household barren (their wombs have closed; unable to have children) all due to Abraham’s wife, Sarah.
NOTE: The wife-sister narrative was also in regards to Isaac and Abimelech regarding the wife of Issac, Rebekah (Genesis 26:1-33).
FACT: No one is trying to get jumped and killed for their wife, mainly with how things were back in those days.
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@Jack Ryan What about them, Ryan? Seeking companionship perhaps? As far as what the eye can see, these are just church members of the JW faith and it is very obvious. I believe that is one of their churches in Greek judging by the letters in the background, I could be wrong, but I am taking a guess that is a Greek JW church, or just a church of theirs that houses several languages.
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Rape is a variant of fornication and is in connection with the same Strong's as is anything related to sexual relations and or immortality - πορνεία porneia, Strong's number 4202. In a way, as said by some, in the Hebrew in this passage of scripture, it hints that Dinah is responsible for her actions, though not her misfortune, for despite her own reasoning, whatever it was, Dinah bears a bit of the responsibility for going it alone which lead her to the man in question, while the man himself, Shechem, carries the full responsibility for his criminal and violent act toward a defenseless woman, that woman being Dinah.
An example, you were told not to go to so-and-so's party because of various reasons, and yet you purposely went to a party anyways, curious perhaps? Seeking fun and thrills? The party itself you soon realize it was clearly not a good one, let alone now that you are there you can't really leave and it results in you being associated with anything and everything bad in this party, including the women at said party who you have gotten yourself involved with for they know what they are seeking and what takes place is left to speculation, some of the responsibility is on you for going to the party to begin with when told not to.
Children are taught about Dinah's ordeal, mainly those who read the Bible early, such as myself. Children will also see for themselves of the positives and negatives of actions done by people, like Dinah and others, they also learn that Dinah had not been abandon either, so I do not see the harm in teaching young ones about this passage, about who Dinah is and her story and what happens in which changed her life, and what took place afterwards.
Unless you think the Bible, mainly the Old Testament is too wild for you.
That being said, there are other passages in the Bible that have somewhat of a similar stetting, for instance, Joseph who had escaped an attempt made by Potiphar’s Wife’s attempted rape (sexual relations), to add more fuel to the fire, this was someone's wife, who was willing to commit adultery with a man who wants nothing to do with whatever she was attempting to do, thus fleeing the scene and was blamed for something he did not commit.
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@James Thomas Rook Jr. You forgot the ice, succession rate is always 100%.
@Jack Ryan It is not always of how one dress, for even a woman who dresses 100% in total modesty, eyes seem to be looking in her direction no matter way. But there are some men out there with fleshly desires and ill intent, some to the point of brazen conduct. In some cases, there are men out there who want to see your mate/wife, if it comes to that, which results in some cases where a husband and or boyfriend of said girl is overly protective, and the one seeking to take his woman will do the most absurd things and even bad things.
In a way, it can go from minor to silly to absurd to violent, sometimes all the same fruit from the tree if it comes to it. At the end of the day, it always comes down to the type of person the man is, if he is lusting over other women, even women who are the mate of other men, and regardless if the women is dressed modestly, and in today's society, some women tend to also not dress modestly, they will and always will catch some eyes, mainly if said women looks like she is beyond the league of the man.
On the other side of the spectrum, you have women, who are not modestly dress, who do this stuff on purpose to attract someone, mainly one who is already married and clearly someone who is weak in his relationship will get caught in this trap.
The worse thing that could happen besides an angry spouse is getting slapped into next week, perhaps into next month... Or hope that your spouse does not know how to throw a punch or two at you for having such obvious lust for other women because the pants in the relationship will most likely change.
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1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:
A man is on a tree covered island in the middle of the river ... and the water is getting higher and higher.
He prays to God for help.
Rescue Squad shoots a rope over to him, with a life jacket attached and he disconnects it and lets it go, proclaiming "I have faith that GOD will save me"
The water is higher, and he is in a tree.
Police power boat crew tries to save him but he waves them off proclaiming "I have faith that GOD will save me!"
Coast Guard helicopter drops a line with harness to him and he throws it away, proclaiming " I have faith that GOD will save me !!!!"
Just before he drowns he screams "OH GOD, WHY DID YOU NOT SAVE ME?"
God replies: " I sent the Rescue Squad, the Police and the Coast Guard ..."
A wise question one would ask is why do bad things happen, such calamity and the like. Questions like this people will ask you regardless of where you are in the world, the city, village, the slums, etc. because the mainstream teaches God takes who he chooses, which is an utter lie, this often leads to people blaming God.
Another thing is people believing that they could heal with their hands and give the Holy Spirit by means of touch for it will come to the individual in a form of a person, which is also absurd.
Other than that, I had a good explanation for something in this regard from a while back, but then the whole Windows 10 thing happen and let's just say the hard drive didn't make it for some of reason. One of the very reasons I have and also recommend, military grade hdds.
As for the other bit about nations, checked any news in the EU and the Middle East lately?
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6 hours ago, Gone Away said:
Valid point. They might also find the following hard to defend:
- The first report of a death from a serpent bite occurred in 1922 at the Church of God Evangel.
- In 1955, George Went Hensley, the founder of modern snake handling in the Appalachian Mountains, died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service in Altha, Florida.
- In 1961, Columbia Chafin Hagerman died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at the Church of the Lord Jesus, Jolo, West Virginia.
- In 1967, Jean Saylor, wife of a snake-handling preacher, died after being bitten by a rattlesnake in Bell County, Kentucky.
- In 1982, Rev John Holbrook died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service at the Lord Jesus Church in Jesus' Name in Mullensville, West Virginia.
- In 1983, Mack Ray Wolford died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at the Lord Jesus Temple in Mile Branch, near Iaeger, West Virginia.
- In 1995, Melinda Brown from Parrottsville, Tennessee died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name in Middlesboro, Kentucky.
- In 1995, Kale Saylor (husband of Jean), a Pentecostal preacher, died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service at a church in Crockett, Kentucky.
- In 1997, Daril Colins died after being bitten by a snake during a service in Bell County, Kentucky.[60]
- In 1998, John Wayne "Punkin" Brown (husband of Melinda), a snake-handling evangelist, died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at the Rock House Holiness Church in rural northeastern Alabama.
- In 2004, Dwayne Long, a Pentecostal pastor, died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service in Jonesville, Virgininia.
- In 2006, Linda Long died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at East London Holiness Church, London, Kentucky.
- In 2012, Mark Randall "Mack" Wolford (son of Mack), a Pentecostal pastor, died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake while officiating at an outdoor service at Panther Wildlife Management Area, West Virginia.
- In 2014, Jamie Coots died after being bitten by a timber rattlesnake during a service at the Full Gospel Tabernacle in Jesus Name in Middlesboro, Kentucky Coots starred in the TV series Snake Salvation and his death was widely reported.
- In 2015, John Brock died after being bitten by a rattlesnake during a service at Mossie Simpson Pentecostal Church in Jenson, Kentucky.
(Courtesy Wikipedia)
You'd be amazed how some Christians profess the drinking of snake venom/poison/handling of such as well as being bitten by snakes and say that such ones cannot be harmed by it - as you can already tell, there were negative results, and some end up finding out the hard way and it is too late. Another reason why the KJV is in error and majority of revised Bibles make the wise choice not to follow the Textus Receptus.
There were also situations where during a debate, those who are against the mainstream and or KJV-Onlyist, were challenged to accept what their own TR says, if they would drink the poison and or be bitten by a serpent and not be harmed, the reactions are quite funny, but the sad reality is, even to this day, people still adhere to a verse that is uninspired and it is quite shocking. Those who revised their Bibles, even when the KJV took over everything, they never adhere to and or spoke of any of these verses because they know it is wrong.
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@JW Insider Indeed, but it seems silly for people to just paint such to a single person or group, to justify that the actions of one define all and it is not the first time this was done. It is similar to how those treat individuals of another race and or nation due to the actions of someone who is not of relations to sole person who has done the crime. Other than that, such ones need to be awake and realize stuff like pedophilia is all over, it is like a virus that gets some people and such people go about infecting others.
Other than that, what is spoken of about the angels of God, this I believe as do others.
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On 7/29/2018 at 1:39 PM, Jack Ryan said:
Look at what happened to Adam and Eve. Look at Jesus?
Kinda unfair when the perfect person had eons of experience with Jehovah compared to a 1 day old perfect person.
How was this justice?
Looks like you may need to re-read the first couple of chapters of Genesis yourself. As for Jesus, he was pure and sinless, as for Adam and Eve, molded from the earth, were perfect until they disobeyed, to be fair, also, Genesis 3 was kind pretty much gives you the conclusion in someway - sort of.
God found out, questions Adam and took care of the Snake, eventually blocking the other, had them removed from Eden and God the Father set in motion to fix the wrongs (Genesis 3:15)
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I believe it was mention to you before that such people are not inspired, in fact, those who literally practice Christianity in Primitive form rarely claim to be inspired.
Is the Governing body still "spirit directed"?
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That is ironic, I could have sworn I said this before to you and you said something entirely different, take a good read at the other page and read it til you reach this point. Just know what you assumed to have been guiding Abraham and you making no mention of Abraham's as well as Sarah's reasoning.
Alas poor, Screcko Sostar, this time you didn't bother to clean the bread crumbs you left behind when everyone can see it and now see what you say now, therefore, you proven my point over and over and over again, and will continue to do the same every time and it goes all the way back to what you said to @Gone Away and what he addressed to you. Now that is what they say, the cookie crumbles, and next time don't make it obvious.
And here we go with this again, my politician comment was in regards to your so called Health Minister. I do not trust politicians for a variety of reasons and a great deal of experience. But you are incapable of knowing what I know because you are not the type of person to look into such things, let alone can stomach the things I see and know to which at this point do not faze me, but still brings concern.
But allow me to enlighten you:
Caesar Augustus, also Octavius, was the 1st Emperor of the Roman Empire. His full name, Gaius Julius Caesar Octavianus (or either Octavius or Octavian). Around 2 B.C.E. a decree was issued by Caeser Augustus, and this decree is in regards that all were to be registered, which resulted in the people traveling there, each of his or her own city is to be in the system they had back then.
This decree allowed Jesus to be born in Bethlehem in, which is a fulfillment of Bible prophecy. However, other than the registration itself, Caesar Augustus did very little to nothing with with local government and law. Furthermore, for his policy continued after his death, which enabled The Jewish Sanhedrin ability and or powers for some sort of control. This imperial leniency gave the people less provocation to rebel and we all know what happens to rebels.
Note: Herod was somewhat of a Politician also, what do you think he'd do to Jesus and his parents only for them to be warned by an Angel of God to literally make haste in a whole other direction. Surely Mary and Joseph were not going to indirectly hand over a baby, born in Bethlehem to a mad man.
Slightly off topic to response,
But surely Caesar's decree didn't go after people in Las Vegas who witnessed and survived, only to be killed again by those who work for politicians, one by one they were kill and sometimes by the two until they stop talking about the shooting, nor did Caesar kill children, take their bodies, sell it to Al-Qaeda to bring forth forced propaganda in order to provoke their enemy to attack another nation to cause an all our war of 5 nations vs. another 5 nations, one of which who was the target by a terrorist group. All this because of politicians and you expect me to trust them? And in my cause, they are not too keep of people of a specific race, and or color and we know what happens when the politicians say and or do things, mainly force people into famine and poverty and I do not know if you ever been to America, but you can see the actions of politicians when it comes to violence and famine, what you do not here is what they do to homeless people, where they bring them and what they do to them, it is as grim as what the Nazi's have done to the Jews and no one speaks of the matter. Let's not forget children to young adults being taken for their blood and organs, there was a case where a teen was found with no organs, but newspapers in his stomach. There is a lot of things in regards to the Dark Web and the shadow government of which really cannot be spoke that much here, mainly in full detail, so I stand true to what I say: I do not care about politicians, nor do I trust them, and knowing what I know you will end up as the same, which is the case with millions of people. Granted this is around the world, most likely your country is effect as is all of each to his own nation.
Surely if Mary and Joseph were alive today, they'd be taken, and disappear for those in the shadows come to realize who they are, and they will end up like Rich and Ebrewein and many, many others - for that is how grave things are.
Lastly, sure they did so for such was part of prophecy regarding Bethlehem, and it is silly for you to even mention Mary and Joseph as well as Jesus because you were literally on the side of Abraham might end up being killed for what he said thus Joseph, Mary and Jesus would not have existed. Srecko Sostar, you, in your own mind and understanding have created a paradox in what you speak of in your own complex form of exegesis.
Okay, we got the name, but if the quote is so famous, can you cite where it originated from? At least a year of the so called famous quote so it is easier to narrow it down? You just post 2 links of Herang, the Son, but the famous quote should be there and or looked up? Unless you are looking for it now?
Every quote someone and or some character has made in a show and or game is always cited and it either orginates from something directly, and or the actual source is given, all these quotes from real life people to not so real people can easily be found for these quotes are indeed famous.
Some examples:
Actual quotes that can be found and or looked up
So now we know the person's name, Andrija Hebrang (The Son), you mentioned he said this quote: I never lie, but sometimes I say untruth, and that is much more polite. (possible translation: Nikada ne lažem, ali ponekad kažem istinu, i to je mnogo pristojnije.)
Any chance you know when and where he said it because I really do not see it anywhere, so that would be nice.
Anyways, back to what is being talked about because I know where you tend to do and it is obvious,
And now back to topic
All in all, what was said about Abraham and Sara was indeed correct, you need to learn and realize the conclusion to their actions of which you not making mention of, let alone you not mentioning Sarah who complied to this plan to begin with. I give you a link to the sister-wife narrative so you understand what is going on here. You can say Abraham and lied, okay, but to avoid why he did it, what he truly wanted to protect and how he was in fear of his life as the one who calls him Lord also fears for him for they BOTH know that the Egyptians do not know God, we see the conclusion, as is with the other situation that began very different compared to the deal with the Pharaoh.
Take a read here, Sostar, if you do not want to read verse after verse from a passage in the Bible, after all, quotes here CAN be found and this may be easier for you to read and understand: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wife–sister_narratives_in_the_Book_of_Genesis