Space Merchant

It never stops. The game of command and conquer is ongoing.

There is more going on in Russia than you realize. If anything, I recommend you seek the 777 crew, but you'll have to look them up in Russian. Free Radio Europe is another source. I know of a guy, irl friend of course, too, a non orthodoxy Christian, who knows some things.

Other that all eyes in the Christian space is on Russia and Israel right now.

7 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I agree 100%.

The GB's current position is based on greed.

They do not want to be sued out of existence, lose their cushy well-fed jobs, and all those billions in free money.

The Lawyers and Accountants are now deciding Theology and Doctrine for Jehovah's Witnesses.

The GB are merely puppets to their "Helpers", the Society's Lawyers, and the Society's Accountants.

Currently, if we separate blood into fractions and hook up 13 different IV's, it's "legal".

If it come into our bodies in ONE tube, we get disfellowshipped.

it makes no sense whatsoever with any other explanation than pure, unadulterated greed.

 

The only blood that should be of anyone's concern is the Christ. It isn't easy when one recognizes what Covenant he or she is under. In the end, as they put it, it is up to choice.

7 hours ago, Hankulan Tunani said:

Does this mean you don’t eat meat? Have you ever gone to a restaurant and ordered a juicy steak? I read this somewhere in the past in this forum. Does animal blood completely get drained by the butcher? Should all witnesses then become vegetarians even though God told Adam he could eat meat?

https://www.news.com.au/national/revolutionary-blood-hboc-201-saves-tamara-coakley/news-story/94e7b09e2b540c87f30fbf08d929bff1

As I recall here. It took about 6 drops of cow blood to make this synthetic blood. 

I know it isn't the case in some parts of the US. To me, even my own people, they see blood as something sacred, that blood is life, therefore consuming blood of any kind they will not do, be it from man or beast, far deeper than that there is superstition regarding blood use by those who are occult, those who practice voudou, to which in English is referred to as Black Magic, and such is practiced very heavily in forbidden areas of the country in the Caribbean. Anyone who practice such tends to consume not just blood, but flesh too, even from human beings, which is satanic to the highest degree.

Although most of us live in the US or elsewhere, this part of which we abide by still in effect.

Whenever we are to eat something, we clean it because in the US, chemicals is put on to the food, especially meats and poultry, seafood, we do so by using lemons and lime to clean with hot water. This is the same case as making sure the blood is 100% cleaned out, hence using lemon, lime and hot water, sometimes vinegar.

I think what needs to be done is cleaning the meat properly, but for me, it angers me how some here, mainly in New York just unpack some red meat and throw it on the grill like that, no realize things can go south, others can get a sickness and or cancer.

Another factor is what they are feeding the animals, such as Cows, Chicken, and or other, for if the Cows were given drugs and or some hormones or something of that nature, people can end up consuming such.

I know there are JWs who are also Caribbean, some African, Latinos, they clean the meat thoroughly before eating, even non-JWs among them too.

As for blood transfusions it is a mixed bag, for I know JWs are not the only Christians with this view. In Islam, they do not take blood unless you force them, but they are semi-compliant with another Muslim who is their doctor, for Jews, it is 50/50 for some are for it and others are not.

Then you got Project Ambrosia, and the Black Market whereas young children and teens from Black and Latino communities.

On 10/10/2018 at 11:24 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

Dear friend, if you are so busy in helping people in need, how you find time to respond on "stupid" things and loosing your valuable time on me and similar like me.?!  

I have the time and I make the time. If you noticed, there  is a certain amount of time I am on and other times I am absent.

Ah, using the word "stupid" now are we.... I it makes me question if I am dealing with a grown man or a mere child. I guess the term in application should the obvious, especially with the little smiley face at the end, so therefore, I know the type cryptic person I am dealing with. Your a grown man, that word is beneath you, or is that so.

That being said, whenever it is not something technical, I spend most of my time at a Boys and Girls Club, helping the little ones, of which last time you assume you need to be a doctor or some sort to help out.... An absurd claim, on your part.

On 10/10/2018 at 11:58 AM, Anna said:

You are relatively new on this forum, if I'm correct. So my advice is don't take anything personally, whatsoever. It's ideas that are being dissected and discussed, not so much the character of the person. Although I agree, ideas can speak of the character of the person, I think a good discussion forum steers away from "ad hominem" ( @TrueTomHarley most admired expression) remarks and tries to keep to the issue at hand. That is the only way a subject can be properly explored. I think anyway.

I would say he is semi-new. He was here several months ago I believe for I had the first discussion with him regarding his claim of focus.

On 10/10/2018 at 11:48 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

As i see you support Watchtower and Jehovah's Witnesses.

Does Watchtower and Jehovah's Witnesses support you as Unitarian and Unitarianism as movement?  

It's not a support, it is merely correct the wrongs here. Like I told you before, if you say something that is in error, about Judaism, Islam and or even things of the Bible, I will speak, even if you say something out of line regarding JWs, I will speak, remember Glasgow and the Registry information you tried to pass off as something big? Things of that nature.

Unitarianism isn't a movement.... Do you even know what a Unitarian is or which denominations among them are present? That being said, you'd be surprise of how Restorationist tend to agree with others on some points.

Anyways, discussion, Armageddon, in accordance with you.

4 minutes ago, BillyTheKid46 said:

Wouldn’t this depend on what kind of casualty and liability protection the Watchtower has?

There are many misinformed people on how the Watchtower operates its finances. They don’t have billions of dollars like the Vatican to just through money away. So they find the best solution to protect the integrity of the Watchtower. The GB does not overlook every aspect of the Watchtower operation. Their main function is to interpret scripture as guided by God’s Holy Spirit. They proofread publications to see if there is a Biblical conflict with what is written. The writing department makes up those publications, not the GB. To witnesses, this is all too clear. This means, donated funds are not wasted on frivolous claims. The legal argument is made as a legal process that any business needs to attend to, not because the Watchtower wants to.

I’m sure the POPE dislikes being the center of controversy when it has to do with legal matters. I’m sure he would rather be on his popemobile waving.

Many ex-witnesses seem to have a serious problem not understanding something so obvious.

 

An appeals court in New York upheld the 4000 a day penalty from San Diego. This doesn’t mean the fat lady has sung yet.

 

That's pretty much what is being talked about all over the place. But when people speak up, disgruntled ones will also speak and they will attack.

Not all former JWs are on a warpath like their counterparts, but those that are on a warpath will be going nowhere.

On 10/10/2018 at 10:48 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

The WT says the following, for this is but one of several: The need to be humble was repeatedly stressed by Jesus: Become like a little child; take a lowly seat at a banquet; when praying be like the lowly tax collector, not like the self-righteous Pharisee. Note also that a command to be humble served as the springboard for Jesus’ scathing denunciation of the proud and hypocritical religious leaders of his day. In striking contrast to their proud course was the humble course of Jesus, that of honoring God at all times: “I do nothing of my own initiative.” His very coming to earth as well as his entire earthly sojourn was a shining example of humility, as the apostle Paul so clearly shows at Philippians 2:5-8. Typical of Jesus’ humility was his willingness to wash the feet of his apostles.—Matt. 18:3, 4; Luke 14:7-11; 18:9-14; Matt. 23:12; John 8:28; 13:5.

They also have more to say,

So applying the expression to these two classes, it becomes understandable in all its different settings, and makes sense whether referring to situations in Israel in Jesus’ day among the Jews, or referring to the addition of Gentiles to the church class, or to conditions in Christendom in these last days. The exalted clergy class once thought to be first are abased to last, and humble ones abased to last God exalts to first position with him.—Luke 14:11.

SM will you please give me exact publications these quotes came from. Thank you. 

Simply go to their online library, look up the verse and viola, as easy as making scrambled eggs.

Biblehub and Gateway you simply scroll down and or look for commentary or it is spotted under Bible Study Tools website.

22 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Yes i think he likes to look very intelligent and knowledgeable to everyone. However I'm not impressed. 

That because I am. It is not something done on purpose for I have said knowledge is power. I do not care for I didn't come to impress, I come to correct.

Also your trust in the guardian is somewhat.... telling.

As for the other thing you said, most news media, news outlets and the like are not always trusted, for me, personally, I go to independent sources, 3 of which are very credible, mainly when it comes to world affairs and things happening, like in Israel and so forth, another in Russia.

But it would seem someone who is educated offends you and others here. No worries. This is the case with those are as so, for the care isn't there but the information still presses forward.

On 10/10/2018 at 10:44 AM, JOHN BUTLER said:

Yes i thought you didn't see it as a JW forum. So this is where we differ SM. 

And where have I mentioned or assumed that?

2 hours ago, Gone Away said:

I'll go along with this.

And as for the rather self indulgent "bantering" in this thread, isn't it time call it a day and to wakeup to what is really happening at this time and place in the history of civilisation?

Just look who's coming to dinner!!!!

No one pays attention to what is going on in the world.

Those who seek security will be at odds with these men shown above, angering the US, Israel and other US allies. The UK has their hands dirty too, granted they are US allies themselves.

You have the Pope and the religion of Babylon seeking to united all religions into one fold.

One seeks peace, the other seeks security and we know what that is all about.

• 1 Thessalonians 5:3 - While people are saying, “There is peace and security,” then sudden destruction will come upon them as labor pains come upon a pregnant woman, and they will not escape.

So far only a few of us, me included, is aware of what is going on.

Also if you own any Huawei devices, you might want to seek an upgrade, there s spy chips in their, place of origin: China.

3 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

Bite back!

Think of it as playing a game of "Whack-A-Mole".

Except for those people that are always wrong about EVERYTHING, seeing the world from the inside of a frosted glass bubble, I don't think the Admin, or any other sane person would object to you lambasting stupid ideas.

It would be a mistake to shrink from the insane. ( No pun intended ... )

With stupid people, it is necessary to be obtuse, and diplomatic.

Sometimes Snowflakes pile up into snow drifts ... and you need a snow PLOW to progress.

They will eventually melt all by themselves, as Reality is a harsh taskmaster, and cares not at all.

Some people are good at Whack-A-Mole

Some people are just waaaay to good at Whack-A-Mole

Some people are not good at Whack-A-Mole

Controversial Posts, thee cometh here best be ready, Fir it is smite or be smited here.

In English, if I remember what the heading here use to be, something along the lines of you can be challenged or be put to task, something like that.

I see it just as that.

17 hours ago, Hankulan Tunani said:

It seems her father the Elder didn’t see the warning signs if this victim was receiving gifts from an older man, and her father miraculously didn’t see what was going on. Parents are responsible for their children. This victim must really be dissent with her father, especially if she didn’t have the sex talk that the majority of parents have with their teenage children.

Since we are getting secondhand information from the news. How she alleged the congregation mishandled her case is inconsequential since civil laws only require a reasonable belief in civil cases versus a burden of proof in a criminal case. The Preponderance of evidence is very different.

Who dropped the ball in this case?

This is the gray area those that have a problem with the Watchtower don’t seem to want to see or acknowledge.

Most parents and even friends do not see the signs at all, only those who are taught and or trained to see the signs of any kind of abuse and or neglect can see this very easily. The gift giving is a big red flag, and has always been this way regarding sexual abuse of children, this also goes with abuse in relationships, gift giving and the like.

Not many parents talk about sex to their children when they are that age, let alone stranger danger and or bad associations. They often also ban their children from any sex-ed classes in school.

NBC is not a trusted news media so one would have to dig deeper for information, for they also are known for hiding lies or not being truthful of their words.

And yes, I agree on this also. Some people are not as knowledgeable, and the fact NBC news mentioned the Watchtower's two witness ruling, anyone who does the research can see this ruling has no play in this case, but they make it seem as such.

As for the Scholars NBC speaks of, the only hardcore opponents of the Watchtower and Jehovah's Witnesses as a whole are Trinitarian Scholars. Why? Because JWs, like others, are Non-Trinitarian.

19 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

:)))) i need to give you some smile and laugh about your methods of teaching. In almost all your respond, not only to me, but especially to me i will say... You using all past and present and future commentary on all kind of comments, conversation, reactions that i,  as your interlocutor made in mutual responses and even wider, that i made to someone else. 

That is because you leave questions unanswered as well as you being cryptic with a hint of trickery, so they will be brought up and no, it isn't a method of teaching, it is bringing up claims in regards to such. You cannot heed command of the Christ if you think the way you do of very specific things, and you show yourself to be openly accepting of Traditions of Men in some of your claims and confusing passages, thus I will remind you every time until you better yourself. You are dealing with a Unitarian from CSE, what did you expect?

That being said, I only bring them up briefly because I know if I bring up the specifics, you will wiped them out.

What is being asked of you is recent stuff, not past items so I ask you the following:

You directed your last response towards me being stubborn and persistent. So how is it this time I am somehow a Jew part of a Jewish Community? 

You can start with that, in the other thread you can address what is being asked of you there - otherwise this will be a reminder of you just as your very reflect always reminds you of who you are everyday and every night.

19 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

It's pretty boring, if you have not noticed, and if that has not already been said to you by someone else. Please, try to focus your response on actual subject and not to disperse, spin  discussion from Adam to Melchizedek to Revelation book. :)))

How haven't I noticed if I am the one who brings it up time and time again? I bring it up so people know your stance, so they can see for themselves or before such information is wiped out.

You know by now I respond to a response, if you've forgotten of how this recent response come to this point, there is no spinning because if the topic is of your focus, you'd have to checked.

I didn't start the thread, Srecko, look again and see how things turned up the way they are, you were not too focused yourself.

If you want to speak about Armageddon, speak your resolve now, but this time when you want to go back to this focus, you say, do so without adding opinion and emotion into the text, use the Bible this time, nothing else but that and what the Word itself says.

49 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Space Merchant. You are acting like a parrot. Have you ever been a Jehovah's Witness ? If not then you really have no idea of how it all works.

How many times have I told you when I said I study religions and theology? Must I tell you a 6th time, a 7th, perhaps an 8th?

You do not have to be a JW to know how they function, if scholars can study a religion, so can those who take the time to read into Christian history.

If you want to play that game, you do not have to be a reader of the Bible to understand what Ambassadors in Bible times are.

That being said my response was not directed to you, but if it is such you seek, it is such you shall have.

52 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

What you have is how it's written down and maybe how it should work.

And? What I have written down is their function in terms of how and where they get their rules from, nothing more.

52 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

But you are talking about ELDERS that only OBEY the GOVERNING BODY. The Elders are like robots, they do not think for themselves.

So Christians listening to Clement of Rome, Apostle Paul, and Timothy were possibly robots. You already spoke of religious leadership as something of pharisees with no facts to back it up.

54 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Why do you think some elders are leaving the JW org and becoming whistle blowers ? It's because they are sick of obeying the rotten rules laid down by the GB. Some actually get a conscience about 'trying to make the Org look clean' at the expense of Victims. 

Anyone and everyone leaves any religion for something, even that of child abuse, it is no surprise, as I had told you before, it is the same with JWs.

We are all imperfect, JWs, even their leaders are also imperfect, for as I told Srecko, who thinks there is perfection in some folks, all men are imperfect regardless of how you try to knock it.

56 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I was with the JW Org from age of around 18 until January this year. In different congregations here in England as i moved around the country a bit. So I have experience of different congregations, not just one. In Reading near London for instance they are very materialistic... In Bristol they were quite snobbish.  Here in Devon they tried to make the country folk talk posher. That's just a few points. 

I heard your story already even months ago and I know the specifics of your story, unless you have forgotten my very first discussion with you. If you had the experience, you know more about your former faith that surface information. All of them? Ever ran into Kathgar? Who is a JW, who lives in England and is one of the many, many people who ends up at Speaker's Corner? Surely you'd know more, Butler.

Other than that, this is going on your word because there others, both JWs or former, who had very different things to say.

Indeed, a few points.

58 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

I know the JW Org as they are in Southern England UK. 

They are all over the place.

59 minutes ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

There is much more I could tell you, like the time an Elder threatened to have me disfellowshipped, but what's the point. You and people like you will only believe what you want to believe. 

I have believed you if you forget our first discussion, I even gave you encouragement and you showed yourself to be sincere, but it would seem you threw that all out of the window, and show yourself to bash and insult when you see fit. When I spoke against brazen conduct, you make it seem that God does not help such folks, and your word I showed to others of that community who were literally running a lynch mob at every word you said.

And how is it I do not believe you when I have in the past? Don't assume things.

1 hour ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

CHILD ABUSE IS AN EARTHWIDE PROBLEM WITHIN THE JW ORG.

Child Abuse is globe and everywhere, not just within JWs, a few weeks ago a girl was taken into a men's room and nearly molested, he was taken care of and nearly met with Jungle Justice and a list of other things.

I even told you such things are not the same elsewhere and or is unheard of in places, like the Congo and others.

To assume child abuse only happens with solely JWs is being narrow minded and ignorant, this is ALL over the place, also you should know what your money does in such things, like in the EU, in the UK as is done in the US also. This is coming from a guy who deals with young ones who speak boldly of this issue as with young adults, even I teaching them and they teaching others to see the signs and help prevent child abuse.

That being said, if the specifics in the story are said, let it be known, at least take that into consideration.

Therefore, all I have said, regarding this article is in correct, I am still reviewing other sources too, and can update if I have to.

5 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

Atheism has been made to a religion. I believe your view extends through extremism as any other religion. The Watchtower holds the extremism of the first century Christian, as taught by Christ. Jesus went through what the Watchtower now goes through. I believe the message from Christ and the Apostles was to maintain faith with whatever came across as being tested.

And those who maintain faith ere burned at stakes, fed to the dogs, killed and used in rituals and a list of other things as time progresses to present day and onward.

I can imagine a day will come where things can be outlawed for in some parts of the US you can't even read and or quote the Bible.

5 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

Atheism as you state fairs the same compulsion. This in itself does not condemn one entire group because of certain misguided views by certain people. If this was normal, then those people are positioning themselves as kings among men, as they cannot do this with God. Administrators also have a certain responsibility to allow all voices to we heard.

Some Atheists tend to detest all religions, others, among them, do not, they wish to understand religion and the Bible, others to the Qu'ran. And there is that small few that will go out of their way to cause problems.

Also true, but not all admins are the same, as to why I compare them to Game Masters, for you take his or her gold, they can boot you from the server, in this sense, admins tend to have a large control of a forum space, but at times can feel somewhat threatened and or other, thus taking action.

Although this is true, there are some admins who have a chill personality, and as we can see this thread isn't locked yet.

At all people like to hear the voices of others, be it the truth or false truths.

5 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

I’m afraid this has not been the case in this forum. This is why I reject the advice of TTH and will tread lightly as not to offend the owner, as some have seen fit to offend others without repercussions. I have kept an eye for a while enough to see the reality.

That is his situation, for we had an example some months ago with a specific individual on this forum. He is still here, but is rumored to be under a different name and possibly pops up on occasion, mainly when anything more focused on Watchtower specifics is being talked about.

5 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

In my opinion, too much emphasis is being placed in one individual that is rallying to portray a certain religion in a negative way, when it can easily be said about any other religion. The truth of the matter is inertia.

The truth should always be spoken, but not everyone likes hearing the facts, thus resorting to name calling and a few other things, also repetitive things in an attempt to get a thread closed, and or topic derailing.

5 hours ago, Paul Dedee said:

This is why, a single unproven claim carries no lasting weight, not even when the chips are stacked up high.

That said, this is an open forum for all is it not? If not, then it should be set to private so only those the owner likes will be granted and set as a target for a specific audience.

It is open, however things can get a little hectic. It isn't as bad as several other forums which can go from a rain forest to fire blazed woodland in an instant.

But originally, this area in the forums use to be called Controversial Post where often times you can be challenged and you have to be ready. Although it does not say that, such atmosphere is still present and we end up having forums posts like this.

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

ohh Space, why you are so reckless? And why you put my quote out of context that is given as response to other participant of this conversation? Why you have to act similar as ......"Like one who grabs a stray dog by the ears is someone who rushes into a quarrel not their own."

Not out of context, it is actually true, hence why I put forth the examples.

I don't mind the insult because I am unfazed, this is going from a man who has seen things you consider unreal.

And no, everything uttered is exact truth unlike your claims of Peter being tempted or Chloe leading a church.

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Do you see yourself as person who have to put in right all things that is not right according to your own sense of "strictness" and your own feeling of "righteousness"?

I don't. For as said to you before I am bounded by what the Bible says, what the church teaches, what comes from God, his Christ and the Word that is written. I am bounded by my culture in terms of respect, truth and integrity and so forth.

I speak what is right because such ones like to cloud information, such ones base their belief on opinions and emotion, not realizing what is the actual truth in the matter.

That being said, tell me Srecko, how am I basing everything on my own feelings and emotion, in this sense?

And no, my culture does not allow to be prideful and or righteous, nice try though.

3 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

Relax ... it is better. You will not change the World no matter as much you want and as much you try :))) Why not to learn something from others, why not let others to "correct" your way of correcting other people :))))  

I am always relaxed. I have changed lives, I have made a bit of change in the world, in my own country when it was hit by an earthquake and have witnessed death and a list of other things, even coming face to face with the occult that has plagued the islands, to add more salt to injury, our children was nearly taken into human trafficking and someone who was fighting against it was assassinated and his death ruled out to be a suicide and yet we still press forward. I helped out in Texas and even Puerto Rico when it was hit by the hurricane, when Sandy hit in 2012, I helped out on rebuilding the shore. I went to Africa and Thailand and met some good people, some of which who didn't know God, and the list goes on. I do not care what I was given, I do not do things to show off, I did such things because I choose to for God's people are able bodied and will give a helping hand.

Others can have their say, but surely no one is going to accept correction from a man, who stated God isn't surprised about people who change not just their sex, but their literal reproductive organs. It is thinking like that that shows you are not putting into application of God's Word let alone confusing Barak for Deborah, purposely, if you forgot that one.

If you want to "correct" show me evidence your Chloe claim, as with Peter's temptation because when I asked you, you dodged and evaded several times. Perhaps this time you can speak to correct something you yourself know to be false.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Biblehub tells me nothing as I never even look at it, and basically I have no idea what it is. 

Have you bother to take 2 seconds to scroll down? You yourself stated that regarding Luke 14:11 the GB has their own idea of what it is vs. others, or should I quote you?

Your GB say that they are important, exalting themselves, and we know what Luke 14 v 11 says about those that exalt themselves don't we ? 

The WT says the following, for this is but one of several: The need to be humble was repeatedly stressed by Jesus: Become like a little child; take a lowly seat at a banquet; when praying be like the lowly tax collector, not like the self-righteous Pharisee. Note also that a command to be humble served as the springboard for Jesus’ scathing denunciation of the proud and hypocritical religious leaders of his day. In striking contrast to their proud course was the humble course of Jesus, that of honoring God at all times: “I do nothing of my own initiative.” His very coming to earth as well as his entire earthly sojourn was a shining example of humility, as the apostle Paul so clearly shows at Philippians 2:5-8. Typical of Jesus’ humility was his willingness to wash the feet of his apostles.—Matt. 18:3, 4; Luke 14:7-11; 18:9-14; Matt. 23:12; John 8:28; 13:5.

They also have more to say,

So applying the expression to these two classes, it becomes understandable in all its different settings, and makes sense whether referring to situations in Israel in Jesus’ day among the Jews, or referring to the addition of Gentiles to the church class, or to conditions in Christendom in these last days. The exalted clergy class once thought to be first are abased to last, and humble ones abased to last God exalts to first position with him.—Luke 14:11.

Let's go to Biblehub:

• (11) Whosoever exalteth himself shall be abased.--The reproduction of the teaching in words which are almost an echo of these, in 1Peter 5:5, is interesting as showing the impression which it had made on the minds of the disciples.
• For whosoever exalteth himself,.... Either in the above way, or any other, shall be abased, humbled and mortified: and he that humbleth himself; behaves in an humble and modest manner, shall be exalted; See Gill on Matthew 23:12.
• 11. whosoever, etc.—couching them in a chaste simplicity and proverbial terseness of style which makes them "apples of gold in a setting of silver." (See on [1668]Lu 18:14).
• 14:7-14 Even in the common actions of life, Christ marks what we do, not only in our religious assemblies, but at our tables. We see in many cases, that a man's pride will bring him low, and before honour is humility. Our Saviour here teaches, that works of charity are better than works of show. But our Lord did not mean that a proud and unbelieving liberality should be rewarded, but that his precept of doing good to the poor and afflicted should be observed from love to him.

So how is this different from what the GB were spouting about? You did consider Biblehub interesting, but when it is in use, somehow the interest has subsided.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

You seem to think you are the only one that knows anything and that you are always correct. 

then am I wrong regarding my response, to you about Luke 14:11? Am I wrong regarding Restorationist Christology? Am I wrong because someone assume human and angels can be hybrids? Am I wrong for correcting a man who compares me to a Jew, let alone thinks a woman led a church in Corinth? Or am I wrong for correcting someone regarding nakedness in terms of the Greek Language?

Tell me Mr. Butler if I am not correct on these things, speak your resolve.

And no, I do not seem to know anything and everything, I am always learning, as I have been learning about religion, the bible and a list of other things for years now.

But it would seem if someone knows way too much, they are often found as targets because they come to correct.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

This forum is enough and I have my own thoughts and don't need you to try to correct my every thought. 

But I can correct you on any biblical violation you speak, or of any Christology. When I corrected you on Peter, it was as accurate as 2+2 equaling 4.

Indeed, this forum is enough, but you have to remember where you are, for originally this space you can always get a response, even challenged, for this use to be Controversial Posts and this still applies.

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Let's make this simple for you. The Governing Body are 8 men. Mostly American, mostly white. All the Elders of all the JW congregations serve the Governing Body to the extent of worshipping them.  The Elders have proved this by acting like puppets, following orders without question. 

No need to be simplistic, Butler, I know who they are and their church structure.

In the early church, Christians of the church followed people of God such as Apostle Paul, Timothy, and others. One of which being Clement of Rome (90-96 A.D.). He may be the Clement mentioned in Paul's epistle to the Philippians. This epistle to the Corinthians does not carry his name, but is simply addressed from the church at Rome to the congregation at Corinth.

However, a epistle from Corinth to Rome a few decades later refers to "the letter we received from your bishop Clement, which we still read regularly. Other early writers are unanimous in attributing the epistle to Clement. The epistle is occasioned due to a group of Christians at Corinth who had banded together against their leaders and had deposed them from office. Clement writes to tell them that they have behaved wrongly, and to remind them of the centrality of Christian unity and love.

So in this sense, you have the Church and it's people, and there is one, a pastor/bishop who takes the lead among them, for that is referred to as Orderly Worship. In the case of the GB, they do not do such on their own, for they, being the Restorationist as they are, put that into application, hence you have 8 of them who is taking the lead among 8.5 million plus others.

I remember before you made the false claim that leadership of the church is of Pharisee, yet you completely ignore the fact that Paul and others led, even wrote to the Churches.

So if you want to call people puppets, I, as I told those who are Anti-Pauline, to tear anything regarding Paul from your Bible if you do not agree with him, or the Christ, you should same if that is your view.

No one worships religious leaders. They are in place to give advise and instruct, as did Paul, as did others. No one worshiped Paul they took instruction, as is the case if you paid attention to and read both letters to the Corinthians.

You are going to have to prove the claim that elders of a church worships religious leaders because I see no proof of this in your words, therefore, I can say you are incorrect.

See, very simple, if you understood Church Structure. Learn it: https://www.gotquestions.org/church-hierarchy.html

4 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

The JW Org say that a person cannot serve God without being part of that Org. Where does the JW Org get this information from ? It gets it from the Governing Body.  Now I would think even you disagree with the Governing Body on that issue ?

They say this because there are denominations that say things of God that is not true, and or anything of the bible. Example is what you stated about Peter's nakedness, you assume something literal and of what is found in a dictionary, but the Strong's says otherwise, Peter was girdled before he went fishing. I need not have to explain the ambassadors thing again also because such things is taken out of context, of which have shown to do before - as with with assuming we do not follow the commandments when the foremost commandments has said commendations in principle.

It is both an agreement and a disagreement because not many, outside of JWs take the time to know what the truth is, something of which I mentioned in the past, even quoting people like Simon Brown, Brother Kel and even from Muslims who point out that you do not need a JW to help you understand the Bible.

I also posted evidence of former JWs who clearly do not know what is in the Bible and are quick to speak badly about them, examples like Magic Hands, Bob the Builder, and the 3 men who believes the Holy Spirit is a person.

Brother Kel, who does not hold to any denominational, even said it himself for those who leave JWs often end up adhering to the accursed, he himself is neutral with JWs.

You do not have to like or even agree with the religious leaders of JWs, but to speak of slander and or deceit, even pushing insult, infighting or conspiracy, a correction will be made.

5 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

So, I would be happy if you stopped trying to 'correct' me every time I comment. Please realise we have totally different opinions on most issues. Thankyou. 

Well if you had seen what I stated to witness, I will do what I have always done. I will not make a response to you unless your information is correct.

As for what issues? We have to speak what is accordance to the Bible, which brings us back to Luke 14:11. WT and Biblehub as with ALL Bible Study and Tools website point to the same exact information for this verse. So if you say that the WT only comes up with such regarding this verse, I will simply point out that it is not only them, it is everyone.

Therefore, do the research regarding anything biblical, even a single verse, then say something.

And you're welcome, not everyone scrolls down to commentary on the hub or Gateway.

On 10/7/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jack Ryan said:

a woman who alleged the congregation mishandled her childhood abuse

Alleged, we must keep this in mind just as the gun situation during the mass murder-suicides taking place some months ago.

On 10/7/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jack Ryan said:

Elihu Rodriguez, a 25-year-old man in her Seattle-area congregation. When he started giving her gifts, like new clothing and a cell phone, Smith — who was taught through her religion that sex is only between a husband and wife — did not think she was being groomed for sexual abuse.

Now according to Child Abuse and Neglect Prevention, this is obviously a sign. Abusers will get close to their target, victim, by being friendly and giving them an abundance of gifts, it is easier if the abuser is in an educational, sports, club, and or religious institution, in some cases medical.

So new clothing and a new phone is a sign as well as an abuser grooming his or her victim, which is the case here.

As for the other bit, sex between a man and woman is for those in wedlock and or married.

Moreover, abusers tend to get the trust from the family and friends of the victim, which is a sign with what took place.

On 10/7/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jack Ryan said:

Smith says it was in October 2012, five days before her 15th birthday, that Rodriguez had sex with her in the bedroom of the house she lived in with her father, a respected Jehovah's Witness elder. More sexual abuse followed for the next three months, she said. Ridden by panic attacks but ashamed and confused by what was happening, Smith didn't tell anyone, including her family, what was going on.

Smith, who was not barely 15 had intercourse with the abuser, who had gifted and groomed her, and said intercourse took place in Smith's home, to which she lives there with her father. If this act was taking place, in her bedroom, in her father's home, her father was most likely not present in the home. The abuse, according to her took place for several months.

Abused victims will not say a word to friends and family because when someone of her age succumbs to such it is as if they are a prisoner to the abuser themselves and the hold he/she has on targeted victim.

On 10/7/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jack Ryan said:

"I didn't understand anything really about sex," Smith, now 20, said. "I also had the fear of disappointing God. Not only that, but I could potentially be shunned."

The following year, Smith moved to Fairfield, Washington. Although she still did not feel comfortable disclosing to her parents — who she says did ultimately cut off contact with her when they found out years later what she endured in her prior congregation — she worked up the courage to report it to three elders at the Fairfield Kingdom Hall.

The elders "basically told me that it was my fault. They told me that I wasn't sorry enough to God for what I had done," said Smith, who has since left the religion and works in the Spokane, Washington, area as an administrative assistant at a private medical company. "They talked about putting Jehovah first, putting God first in your life, and I wasn't, apparently, doing that to their standards."

When the abused do not speak up regarding the abuse they endure, they do not talk to anyone about it, so there was no potential to be shunned and or excommunicated, it would most likely prompt church disciplinary action for an internal investigation to be made since this is a religious institution.

It would have been best for her to actually speak up to her parents regarding the issue, perhaps those who are better equipped to take in the information regarding the abuse, granted Child Abuse and Neglect prevention does say to speak up to others, not just parents.

If she had been cut of with the church before, how is it she is able to come into contact with them later on? Therefore there was not much of a cut off from her parents, but just clearly not much communication going on.

What also does not add up is this statement by Ms. Smith "They told me that I wasn't sorry enough to God for what I had done". According to their church, they have judicial committees to which they try to see what was going on, and another factor is if she was originally in a different church, those she somehow got into contact with in the newer church were clearly not in the loop or have all the facts.

On 10/7/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jack Ryan said:

How the Jehovah's Witnesses handle sex abuse claims

In the tight-knit Jehovah's Witness community, outsiders, including authorities, are often viewed suspiciously, according to religious scholars. As a result, accusations of any sort between members of the congregation are typically first dealt with through an internal judicial process — one that requires two witnesses to a crime to prove guilt, a tenet that's in keeping with the Witnesses' strict, often literal interpretation of the Bible.

The religion's handling of abuse claims has recently come under fire. In the past decade, there have been at least 30 lawsuits nationwide against the organization arising from its responses to childhood sex abuse, and a jury award of $35 million on Sept. 26 to a Montana woman who claimed the congregation covered up the abuse she suffered at the hands of a congregation member as a child put a rare spotlight on the insular religion.

In Smith's case, she said the elders she reported to privately reproved her, Jehovah's Witnesses' quiet way of denying wrongdoers in the congregation of certain privileges. Rodriguez was not punished, she said.

"They had used the Bible to victim-shame me for what I had done, and they never did anything to him."

"They had used the Bible to victim-shame me for what I had done, and they never did anything to him," Smith said. "He got married, and he remained within the congregation — a child molester living among them."

Smith's allegations led to charges against Rodriguez. NBC News verified the details of her claims through charging documents filed in King County Superior Court in Washington in July; in addition to rape of a child in the third degree for what allegedly happened with Smith, Rodriguez was also charged with rape of a child in the second degree involving a 12- or 13-year-old Jehovah's Witness girl he allegedly had a relationship with around the same time.

When reached by phone, Rodriguez repeatedly told NBC News that he had no comment. He has not entered a plea in the case.

The Office of Public Information at the World Headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses responded to last month's Montana jury verdict with a brief statement that said Jehovah's Witnesses "abhor child abuse and strive to protect children from such acts," while adding it planned to appeal the $35 million fine.

Photographs of Moriah Smith's grandparents, (from left) her mother, her brother and her father, sit on a table at her house near a memento signifying the date of her baptism into the Jehovah's Witnesses faith in 2011. Rajah Bose / for NBC News

In response to questions from NBC News about what happened to Smith, Fairfield Kingdom Hall did not return a request for comment, and the Office of Public Information at the World Headquarters said in an email that "it would be inappropriate for us to comment on specific cases."

It directed NBC News to its "scripturally based position on child protection," a two-page document on its website that intersperses Biblical references with denouncements of child abuse and outlines how the congregation aims to protect its children.

"When elders learn of an accusation of child abuse, they immediately consult with the branch office of Jehovah’s Witnesses to ensure compliance with child abuse reporting laws. (Romans 13:1) Even if the elders have no legal duty to report an accusation to the authorities, the branch office of Jehovah’s Witnesses will instruct the elders to report the matter if a minor is still in danger of abuse or there is some other valid reason," says one bullet point in the document.

Smith says that kind of protection was never offered in her case. Even worse, when she finally told her family a couple of years later that she had been in a sexual relationship with an older man at age 14, she says they accused her of flirting, and have since stopped talking to her because they view her as a "spiritual threat" to their own commitment to their faith.

"They were willing to turn their back on their own child to pursue a religion rather than support their own child," she said.

The Jehovah's Witnesses, as stated before are Restorationist Christians hence they are united as a community by the teachings of their church, practicing a primitive form of Christianity that is aligned with the apostolic church, if you do not know what that is click this link:

No one sees them as suspicious granted they can be found anywhere, anyplace, anytime and out in public. So knowing NBC news, they tend to think people are not aware of all the carts and door to door stuff going about with this faith group. The religious scholars they spoke with were Trinitarian scholars, for it is only them who have issues with anyone who do not believe Jesus is God or adhere to the mainstream - for this is known due to people like James White, and several who are like him, the same case is made by his troop regarding Islam.

What is true is the faith group will always take any accusations in and make use of church disciplinary action and or protocol, hence the judicial committee process, prompting an internal investigation.

Now, they've mentioned the whole Two Witness Ruling the faith group has and according to NBC they stated the following: one that requires two witnesses to a crime to prove guilt, a tenet that's in keeping with the Witnesses' strict, often literal interpretation of the Bible.

There is more to it and not much is known when people do not do the research.

We already know Jehovah's Witnesses are Restorationist, meaning they take the Bible seriously, for Restorationism, also described as Christian primitivism, is the belief that Christianity has been or should be restored along the lines of what is known about the apostolic early church, which restorationists see as the search for a more pure and more ancient form of the religion. Fundamentally, "this vision seeks to correct faults or deficiencies (in the church) by appealing to the primitive church as a normative model." according to The Encyclopedia of the Stone-Campbell Movement: Christian Church (Disciples of Christ).

As for their rule, to them, their policy of  states: "When any one of Jehovah's Witnesses is accused of an act of child abuse, the local congregation elders are expected to investigate. Two elders meet separately with the accused and the accuser to see what each says on the matter. For this is based in Deuteronomy 19:15 and reaffirmed in Matthew 18:15-17.

From this alone, it should be noted that this two witness ruling has nothing to do with whether the alleged abuse is reported to the authorities, despite what some people even NBC is led to believe, for we have to thank the ARC to better clarify this rule the WT has. For even though they have this policy and or ruling, even in their books and publications  never state that abuse or crime should not be reported unless there are two witnesses to the crime, case and point.

The two witness rule as applied by Jehovah's Witnesses and their church is only applied to determine if a judicial committee should be formed to handle any form/type of sin and or wrongdoing within the JW church itself, hence internally criminally, for JWs are not Law Enforcement. WT pastors also send letters to the elders and stewards of their church to show that anyone is free to report child abuse to the authorities at any time without sanctions from the church, even encouraging such reporting.

But again, people who do not do the research themselves will constantly say that this is bad policy since child molesters usually do not attack their target with others around, such also are lead to believe that and or even profess that this ruling protects the abuser and not the abused. Granted JWs take the Bible both seriously and literally, such ruling stems from the Bible itself, regarding them, for they, and or the bible, according to how this ruling is, repeatedly speaks of the need for two witnesses to establish any matter, as seen in a few verses for example: Matthew 18:16, 2 Corinthians 13:1,  and 1 Timothy 5:19.

And because of this like this, people tend to throw things out the window, even calling these Bible  and passages like these obscure and not applicable in these modern times - for they forget that Jehovah's Witnesses, are Restorationist, for Restorationist do everything in their power to separate themselves from mainstream Christendom and align themselves with the how everything was done in the early church, thus taking scripture literally, therefore they, the Jehovah's Witnesses, believe that it is best for them to follow the words of the son of God and the inspired apostle Paul rather than the opinions of others, hence their strong stance.

So the fact of the matter is, many people, even NBC, do not realize just what the two witness ruling entails without making the research. Others may know but they don't want you to know and just so they try to hide just who or what can serve as two witnesses, in this sense.

With all these facts, it is unscriptural to apply excommunication an individual at the mouth of one witness, in terms of ruling, for God's word should take precedent over the thinking of imperfect ones. Regarding Jehovah's Witnesses, applying the two witness ruling, on their part, is reasonable and logical, and clearly not to otherwise deny the Bible itself.

The situation is a bit different regarding a single witness, but a bit of research one can actually understand it.

Now, Ms. Smith stated the following "They had used the Bible to victim-shame me for what I had done, and they never did anything to him."

If the Bible was used to victim-shame, one would have to point to her other responses to which she stated before, thus speaking on what known and haven't even used the Bible at all, in this sense. She then said "He got married, and he remained within the congregation — a child molester living among them."

The best course of action would have been to go straight to the police with this information, granted the church will not stop you from going to the police at all, be it internal investigation is done or not. Therefore, he would not be in that position if something was done prior, for abusers can and will get away with anything if nothing is said.

Also Ms. Smith said the abuser had intercourse with her in her home, there is always a way to track things via DNA and other things, if talk show host Maury can get this done somehow, it does not stop the general public.

When reached by phone, Rodriguez repeatedly told NBC News that he had no comment. He has not entered a plea in the case.

NBC made several attempts to contact Mr. Rodriguez, but to no avail, granted Ms. Smith's allegations led to charges.

• NBC News verified the details of her claims through charging documents filed in King County Superior Court in Washington in July
• In addition to rape of a child in the third degree for what allegedly happened with Smith, Rodriguez was also charged with rape of a child in the second degree involving a 12- or 13-year-old Jehovah's Witness girl he allegedly had a relationship with around the same time.
• When reached by phone, Rodriguez repeatedly told NBC News that he had no comment. He has not entered a plea in the case.

The article also says that the World Headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses responded to last month's Montana jury verdict with a brief statement that said Jehovah's Witnesses "abhor child abuse and strive to protect children from such acts," while adding it planned to appeal the $35 million fine.

In response to questions from NBC News about what happened to Smith, Fairfield Kingdom Hall did not return a request for comment, and the Office of Public Information at the World Headquarters said in an email that "it would be inappropriate for us to comment on specific cases."

As for the JW church itself, that specific church Ms. Smith went to, NBC tried to contact them, but no return of request for comment. The Office of Public Information at the World Headquarters said in an email that "it would be inappropriate for us to comment on specific cases." Which they are basically in the right to do/say such.

The article goes on to say, it directed NBC News to its "scripturally based position on child protection," a two-page document on its website that intersperses Biblical references with denouncements of child abuse and outlines how the congregation aims to protect its children, and it says the following: "When elders learn of an accusation of child abuse, they immediately consult with the branch office of Jehovah’s Witnesses to ensure compliance with child abuse reporting laws. (Romans 13:1) Even if the elders have no legal duty to report an accusation to the authorities, the branch office of Jehovah’s Witnesses will instruct the elders to report the matter if a minor is still in danger of abuse or there is some other valid reason," says one bullet point in the document.

Smith says that kind of protection was never offered in her case - when it should be realized in her own area there is a lot of JW churches, and a law of areas to report abuse, examples being other cases that take place in other institutions, schools, clubs even other churches, all of such can be reported promptly and fairly easily.

Now, it says the following, when she finally told her family a couple of years later that she had been in a sexual relationship with an older man at age 14, she says they accused her of flirting, and have since stopped talking to her because they view her as a "spiritual threat" to their own commitment to their faith. Which is somewhat sketchy granted she never spoke to her parents about the sexual abuse, that took place in her home, that took place for several months of which she kept quite about to friends and family, and even as she got older, she herself stated she was supposedly cut off from her family and went on to possibly a different church to report the allegations to which they most likely had no idea about. She ends it also with "They were willing to turn their back on their own child to pursue a religion rather than support their own child," which is somewhat different from what she addressed before.

If anything NBC should go speak with the parents, although something some information isn't lining up properly.

20 hours ago, JOHN BUTLER said:

Your GB say that they are important, exalting themselves, and we know what Luke 14 v 11 says about those that exalt themselves don't we ? 

Biblehub tells you the same thing, so it is not only a GB/JW thing: https://biblehub.com/luke/14-11.htm

Mr. Butler, before you say things like this, I suggest you do the research first.

If you thing this forums is out of line, give CSE a try, and even there if you say something about religion or the Bible you will be corrected with bricks upon bricks of factual information.

https://christianity.stackexchange.com/

The biblical hermeneutics section can grill you easy for they dissect anything and everything regarding the Bible.

https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/

19 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

members of other religions have same or similar beliefs 

Incorrect. There things some have common ground on, but not similar. Example some faiths believe God has a literal wife and a couple of wives/concubines, other faiths do not, but both believe their is a God.

There are those who believe there are thousands and thousands of Gods, and others believe in 3, while others believe in 1 God, that God being the Father.

19 hours ago, Srecko Sostar said:

also Holy book said to pray for Secular kings and rulers who not trying

Well, it will be good  not to be "strict" to much about many things mentioned here :))  

The Bible say to pray for others also, for this hangs in the foremost commandment itself. How should one suddenly ignore this something that Jesus held near and dear to his heart as a child into manhood?

On 10/7/2018 at 1:50 AM, Paul Dedee said:

In my opinion, should this be a correct understanding that the majority in this world that is atheist have no compulsion for religion, then you as the administrator also need to understand the need to allow those in favor or opposition to freely state their opinion without this administration picking sides.

There are some Atheists who do have sympathy for religion and the Bible, some who in secret who try to learn something, for there are many Atheist, some may not claim it, who do study theology and or Religion as well as the Bible. On the other side of the spectrum, some Atheists become who they are because of being misguided or not being able to understand something properly, while others will say why can't all religion simply be united as one, but they forget the whole ramification regarding interfaith and apostasy,

That being said, an Admin is like a Game Master, they can do, choose, commit, take, and release, etc as they please. Admins also have their views and opinions as well as having a faith, thus it is no surprise should one takes the side of others or not - this is HIS playground, not ours.

On 10/7/2018 at 3:54 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

Yes i believe! In fact i have no need  to just believe. Something about  is written in Bible. Paul was excellent example.

“I am a Jew, born in Tarsus of Cilicia, but raised in this city. I was educated at the feet of Gamaliel in strict conformity to the Law of our Fathers. I am just as zealous for God as any of you here today. 4I persecuted this Way even to the death, detaining both men and women and throwing them into prison,…

As such member of Jew community he was very stubborn in self idea how he got the truth and how god's will for him is to speak and prosecute other people who disagree with his STRICT idea !!!!  

If you consider Apostle Paul as an example you would not have been speaking negatively of Abraham in the first place, or his wife, Sarah. You would not have spoken slander when you and Witness attempted to defend religious leadership roles given to women in modern day when such was forbidden and unheard of in the past or the whole Temple Chest thing you had an issue with.

And you've yet to show me anywhere in the Bible to your claim of Chloe being the Leader of the Church of Corinth - to which is unfounded, therefore, you have broken God's Word about those who add to the scripture when you are not suppose to. Tough cookies, Srecko, you cannot giggle your way out of that one.

You directed your last response towards me being stubborn and persistent. So how is it this time I am somehow a Jew part of a Jewish Community? I have studied a bit of Judaism, but I do not see how man who's roots is traced back to the mother land, Africa, is somehow a Jew.

Followers of God were strict also, for they wanted people to not be led astray and they were persistent in their word so the church remains clean of the accursed. Therefore, you example or point is totally meaningless.

That being said, be strict on what the Bible says, mainly on what Paul said about Orderly Worship in terms of God's Order, is a mercy towards you.

Also you are using those verses out of context....

On 10/7/2018 at 4:01 AM, Srecko Sostar said:

.... do not worry about it SM. We all working  on fruits of Spirit :))))))

Then work harder because need to show yourself to be God fearing. I guess perhaps in the future I might post questions via thread so it is neutral whereas both anyone even JWs and hop in, for I have came across some very complex questions with actual answers, so if anyone were to stop you guys on such, you should be able to answer.

That being said, Srecko, I will have to point out, for truly I say to ye, that what you have spoken of regarding Chloe is a lie, and the biblical facts I provided to you, use that for your study and research.

Remember these verses:

• Proverbs 9:8 - Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you; reprove a wise man, and he will love you.
• Proverbs 15:31, 32 - [31] The ear that listens to life-giving reproof will dwell among the wise. [32] He who ignores discipline despises himself, but whoever heeds correction gains understanding.
• Proverbs 19:20 - Listen to advice and accept instruction, that you may gain wisdom in the future.

Do not be a forgetful hearer, be one who listens, Srecko. And read your Bible.

On 10/6/2018 at 8:57 PM, Witness said:

@Space Merchant , You must type awfully fast   We've already discussed the "new creation" in Christ.  I'm sorry you don't get it.  We also have discussed "earthly" Jerusalem, which still boggles my mind.  The fulfillment today is with "New Jerusalem" - the literal Jerusalem has nothing to do with prophecy.  In fact, JWs will tell you the same.  

Your positions that have met approval here have not met the approval of the GB, thus with all JWs.   The Watchtower teaches it is the "one true religion".  That's it, only that religion.  YOU are not part of that perceived one true religion. 

Do you understand...yet?  You are welcome to rant at me all you like, but my views and my belief in Christ and the spiritual "New Jerusalem", holds. If we held the same belief, I may accept your corrections, but we don't.  

I concentrate solely on the Watchtower where the anointed and their companions reside under the rule of a wicked slave.  They receive my message.  

Indeed I do. It is a habit picked up from being use to typing up essays very fast, code algorithms in my youth, and quick way to pick up information so it does not go amiss.

Actually I do get it, thus the reason why before in our past discussions, I corrected you on what Earthly and New Jerusalem is and explained in full detail on what the New Creation entails, to which you were adding to the word at this point and mixing verses, as you have done before and as you are doing now, do you know remember your attempt with Zechariah 8:3 or perhaps the Spiritual House or maybe you trying to say something ill of an interlinear translation not realize the difference between a 1245 or a non-1245?

And no, I am not referring to Literal Jerusalem (granted I had a few words to say about modern day Israel and Jerusalem already), I only mentioned Earthly Jerusalem to which you confused what it was all about before, and I have told you, several times, that Earthly Jerusalem has rejected the Christ. but those of New Jerusalem have not.

You were also called out for mixing verses, and I told you before that before you consider posting verses, to maybe try and read them first and see if the cross-references are correct, you prompted someone else to do it for you so no one else would be mislead by the obvious mixing, i.e. comparing Rock in the OT to rock in the NT, is an example.

But you yourself posted something vastly different before, if that was the case, you saying the JW will tell me the same puts you in error, granted, you were posting from their publications time and time again, which is not too different for you believing JWs somehow has a role in things like Nintendo and Victoria Secret, if you have forgotten that.

But you just said briefly that no one pays attention to this truth I am speaking, to which I am. That being said, Islam also teach they are the one true religion and that they are a peaceful religion, the Baptist say they are the only ones who have the truth, the new agers say they are the only religion in the world that has the keys and so forth, JWs saying they are the one true religion does not really mean much, for if they think of themselves to have the truth, granted their Restorationist roots of which I encourage you to study, then they can say that. The ONLY problem here is one can claim they havr the truth or they are a religion of peace or one true, but they have to live up to what the truth actually is. As I have mentioned to you before, Jehovah's Witnesses are Restoraionist, in their Christology, they are trying to be or striving to be like the Apostolic Church, granted some of their practices are not common with mainstream Churches that teach the Trinity, furthermore, Restoraionist as a whole do everything and anything to separate themselves from mainstream Christendom.

You should try studying Theology, Witness, for it may benefit you, but even when I tell you time and time again, you ignore it, just as you have when you confuse yourself in Bible translations when anyone can see if a 1245 is in use or not.

I am not ranting I am correcting. It should occur to you by now I make a response if:

• I am mentioned
• If someone response to me
• If I spot conspiracy I response
• If I spot falsehood I will response
• If I have to correct myself I will make a response
• I make a response when something in error is being spoken of regarding the Apostolic Church and or anything taking place today.
• I make a response to historical accounts
• I make a response to mixing of verses and or misuse of a verse or passage
• I make a response regarding Bible translations by means of minimum hermeneutics.

If you say people become human and angels, I will correct you. If you say something out of line of someone or something, I will correct you, etc. This is how we roll in CSE, we correct the wrongs and errors of others.

So if giving you a history lesson about Restoraionist seems like a rant to you, I suggest you do the research, but even when the research is presented to you several times, you ignore it and continue to speak of things in Restorationism to which you do not realize you are putting yourself in error. Must I link information about Christian Primitivity for like the 5th time for you, Witness?

 

So ask me, what is it in the Christology and Theology of Restorationist Christianity you do not understand?

On 10/6/2018 at 9:22 PM, Witness said:

Guess what!  I agree with you! 

Ok, but you make it seem like the truth of which I speak is in error.

To be honest, you are better off trying to bring forth truth against mainstream Christendom, and the real religion of Babylon the Great.

Speaking about Babylon, if you live in Texas and someone invites you to a Christian event, it is of Babylon. AS I said to Mr. Butler, JWs/Restorationist are not fans of Interfaith practices, this also includes other faiths who are against Babylon who says such interfaith things is forbidden. This is of what you must avoid and this is what is your actual enemy.