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Space Merchant

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  1. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Thinking in "Don't Talk to Your Neighbor. Don't be Friendly" - Australian response to COVID19   
    We are a small nation in number and a isolated country..we always were a prime target for the Satanic NWO..now renamed the Great reset…neighbours are turning on neighbours..police turning on the people..laws being in ignored and overruled…parliament shut down when it suits those in power….Hysteria and fear even amongst brothers and sisters….fearful times indeed ….and many not having insight into the evil workings behind it all…..this is so much more than virus and vaccinations…it’s just the start ….
  2. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to xero in It's interesting how when we read scriptures which give analogies of the delta between us and Jehovah   
    Like these....
    Isaiah 55:8-9 "For my thoughts are not your thoughts, And your ways are not my ways,” declares Jehovah. "For as the heavens are higher than the earth, So my ways are higher than your ways And my thoughts than your thoughts."
     
    42 Then Job said in reply to Jehovah:
     2 “Now I know that you are able to do all things
    And that nothing you have in mind to do is impossible for you.+
     3 You said, ‘Who is this who is obscuring my counsel without knowledge?’+
    Therefore I spoke, but without understanding
    About things too wonderful for me, which I do not know.+
     4 You said, ‘Please listen, and I will speak.
    I will question you, and you inform me.’+
     5 My ears have heard about you,
    But now I do see you with my eyes.
     6 That is why I take back what I said,*+
    And I repent in dust and ashes.”+
     
    ...we implicitly act as if this isn't true, boldly concluding things Jehovah's going to do or not do and even the manner of his doing or not doing.
    We can't let it go.
  3. Confused
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in Since everyone is jumping on the Textual Criticism bandwagon...   
    Not here, you were the only one to utter JWs and NWT. This is in relation to Translations in general that follow the TR and those that do not follow the TR, in correlation with manuscripts.
    If you want to use the NWT, then by all means, go ahead, for if that can help you against TR related translations.
    This is why Textual Criticism when TR is addressed is vital relation to those verses.
    This is Textual Criticism based, John.
    To determine if a word/passage is added or not, you have to know what Strong's and or roots that violates the text itself. "God/Deity/Divine" or "a God/a Deity" isn't a violation unless it is something other than, outside of THEOS. Likewise with your tortures stake remark, if it has no connection to what a Stavros entails, then you have a violation.
    So, address the violations instead of just looking at the verse at face value. Those verses are no different from 1 Timothy 3:16, Acts 10:48 or Acts 16:7.
    That being said, if you are using the NWT or anything that isn't based on TR, I don't see how you can address the above.
    TR is based off of Greek New Testament from Erasmus, where as the verses mentioned are the effected ones in the KJV If I remember correctly, the NWT is based off of Westcott and Hort. That being said, the verse you misquoted, but was attempting to quote was Matthew 27:32.
  4. Confused
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in Since everyone is jumping on the Textual Criticism bandwagon...   
    This longer version was founded much later on, was never part of the original. The Long part can only be read in the KJV and or translations that follow the later sources.
    The Gospel of Mark ends at verse 8, hence Mark 16:1-8. There are 2 of the oldest and most respected manuscripts, the Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus. As the oldest manuscripts are known to be the most accurate because there were fewer generations of copies. Since and the oldest manuscripts do not verses 9 to 20, it is concluded and affirmed that these verses were added later by scribes, again, like the Adulterous Woman, this passage isn't only defend by Trinitarians or that of MSC as a whole, it is viewed as spurious as well. In the 4th century, Early Church Fathers like Eusebius and Jerome noted that almost all Greek manuscripts available to them didn't really have any evidence of this longer version, although they doubtless knew those other endings existed in their time. Irenaeus himself may have known about other long endings because he made a note to it, however, these Church Fathers knew of the added verses, but even by the 4th century, Eusebius said the Greek manuscripts did not include these endings or any other one, in the originals.
    As seen in the verse what is marked in red was added, no Strong's or root even supports this.
    The added part was mostly from later sources which has no connection to the early ones.
    Also there is no question as to why it was added, it was for a gain on the MSC side of Christianity.
    11 Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
     
    Among all forgeries, this is the biggest one - The Comma Johanneum.
    The real verse is For there are three that testify: [these three witnesses]
    Trinitarian and those of MSC NOW admit this verse was not written by the hand of John. Having access to collections of hundreds of manuscripts, modern scholars are able to determine this verse was introduced into the Bible long after John wrote this letter. The evidence is so clear as day that it cannot be denied. However, there are still those out there, especially KJV Onlyists of the MSC crowd, who are unwilling to accept the facts on this matter and claim this verse is authentic.
    My quote to Brando regarding Jesus Defender:
    My quote for this one was to Srecko when he addressed Bible errors and inspired text:
     
    Jesus Christ was replaced with Lord.
    The Strong's show us a strong indicator that Jesus Christ (Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ) is suppose to be in the verse, however, we see Lord instead. The verse should either have in the name of Jesus Christ or in the name of our Lord Yeshua The Messiah or in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.
    This some would only catch by accident if they're not paying attention, however, it can easily be missed.
    Similar to Acts 10:48, but the difference between most translations and the KJV is that of Jesus or Jesus is unfounded.
    A parallel with the verses in Acts, for the verses has added by Jesus Christ. There is no Strong's or root to even attest to that addition being true, more evidence to that is the Codex Sinaiticus
     

    That being said, some of these are known by some, even by you JWs, but the others you mentioned are of the tricky kind, but in the realm of Hermeneutics and Textual Criticism, these are often discussed.
  5. Like
    Space Merchant got a reaction from xero in Vaccine time   
    Then you may be in subjection to added protection, should J&J go down that route. Regarding the other vaccines, some people will get a 3rd shot, even a 4th, more if we go Endemic, which seems to be the case for many and Truthers called this before we hit pandemic. For they've been experimenting these vaccines for sometime. In Dominican Republican, need to confirm this because I myself is looking into this, they've been testing on people mixed dosages. If this is the case, it would not surprise me if others started to do this. On the other side of the spectrum, in some parts of the EU, they swapped out vaccines allegedly.
    https://www.npr.org/2021/08/11/1026863219/nurse-fake-covid-vaccine-germany-saline
    That begin said, the fear as gotten to some folks' heads to the point they want another shot, even if they're not eligible for a booster shot for the other 2 noted vaccines.
    The only group of people some do not really talk about are the people who have T Cell immunity, whereas, although not vaccinated, their able to fight off COVID-19 without even getting sick, pre-Delta and Lambda era.
  6. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to TrueTomHarley in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    Next thing you know, she’ll have the wrongdoer ascending with Jesus to paradise that day, nevermind how it conflicts with the rest of the scriptures.
    I think it is pretty clear that scholarship does not matter to her and that she uses her special ‘anointed’ sense to tell if a passage is any good or not. If it helps her in her battle against her ‘rival anointed,’ is is golden.
  7. Upvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    Indeed. God has made him the Lord and Christ, and has resurrected him, he  has been made to be immortal, incorruptible, as is being the king above mankind's kings (1 Timothy 6:15, 16).
    In relation to what you addressed, this goes hand in hand with the references to the above verses, which can be found in concerning the church Matthew 16
    18 And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. 19 I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.” 20 Then he ordered his disciples not to tell anyone that he was the Messiah.
  8. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Dmitar in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    *** it-1 p. 12 Abaddon ***
    In the Hebrew scriptures just considered, it is evident that ʼavad·dohnʹ is paralleled with Sheol and death. At Revelation 1:18 we find Christ Jesus stating: “I am living forever and ever, and I have the keys of death and of Hades.” 
     
    I was afraid. However, Christ holds the keys to the first and second resurrection. That is the theme in Revelation. When Jesus died as a man, he was granted immortality where he cannot be destroyed as an angel, while other angels can.
    Here's an example coming from another Christian interpretation, which Jehovah's Witnesses refine. ETERNITY
    Therefore, the first resurrection is for the people of God; the second resurrection is for the judgment of unbelievers. The difference between these two groups is based on one's relationship with God through Jesus Christ. It is essential for every person to hear the good news and be saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9) to receive eternal life (John 3:16).
  9. Haha
    Space Merchant reacted to Pudgy in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    The REAL question is .... who is going around making all these keys?
    ...and would they be SKELETON Keys?
     
     

  10. Like
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    First time I have seen you speak your peace. The theme was address already. But of course, in regards to this, there is context and Hermeneutics.
    Abaddon not only have relating Strong's, but also roots, but in regards to who he is in Revelations, is key.
    Speaking of keys, most people do not realize who gave him the key and or where he got it prior to tossing Satan into an abyss for 1,000 years.
  11. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Dmitar in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    What is the common theme by different interpretations?
     
    Harper Collins
     
    Abaddon (uh-bad′uhn; Heb., “destruction”).
    1 In the Hebrew Bible, a place of destruction for the dead (Ps. 88:11; Job 26:6; 28:22; 31:12; Prov. 15:11). The term is typically regarded as a synonym for Sheol (cf. Prov. 27:20); if there is any distinction, it might be that people are sometimes said to be “brought up” or rescued from Sheol, but never from Abaddon. See also abyss; Sheol.
    2 In the NT, the Hebrew name for the ruler of the Abyss, whose Greek name was Apollyon, “the Destroyer” (Rev. 9:11). See also abyss; Apollyon.
    Apollyon (uh-pol′yuhn; Gk., “the destroyer”), a possible allusion to the Greek god Apollo or, perhaps, to the angel of death (Rev. 9:11). See also Abaddon.
     
    Catholic Bible Dictionary
     
    ABADDON (Hebrew, “destruction”) The name is used with several meanings. These include ruin and destruction in a broad sense (Job 31:12), a place of destruction, and the abyss in the sense of the abode of the dead (Job 26:6; Prov 15:11). Other references are found in Psalms (88:11) and Job (28:22). Abaddon is personified in the New Testament (Rev 9:11, presented in the Greek as Apollyōn) as an angel with authority over hell. Abaddon in this sense is the ruler and author of havoc and destruction on earth. (See also Asmodeus and Sheol.)
     
    Oxford Dictionary of the Bible
     
    Abaddon
     
    In Hebrew = destruction, and in Job 26: 6 and Prov. 27: 20 denotes the abode of the dead, also called sheol or Hades. In Rev. 9: 11 it is personified to mean the destroyer of all life and peace.
     
     
    Abyss
     
    The depths of the sea. Because the Hebrews disliked the sea (cf. Rev. 21: 1), deep waters were regarded as the abode of demons. It was the appropriate destiny for the Gadarene swine when the demons had entered into them (Luke 8: 31, 33), and from the abyss antichrist will rise (Rev. 11: 7). In Rom. 10: 7 Paul refers to sheol, the abode of the dead, as ‘the Abyss’, which he seems to take from Ps. 71: 20 (‘earth's watery depths’, REB).
     
    The New Unger's Bible Dictionary
     
    ABAD´DON (a-badʹdon; Gk. Abaddon, “destruction”). The angel of the bottomless
    pit (Rev. 9:11), and corresponding to Apollyon, “destroyer.” The word abaddon
    means destruction (Job 31:12), or the place of destruction, i.e., Hades or the region of
    the dead (Job 26:6; 28:22; Prov. 15:11).
     
    Holman Illustrated Bible Dictionary
     
    ABADDON  Name meaning “to perish.” In the KJV Abaddon appears only in Rev. 9:11 as the Hebrew name of the angel of the bottomless pit whose Greek name was Apollyon. Abaddon occurs six times in the Hebrew Bible (Job 26:6; 28:22; 31:12; Prov. 15:11; 27:20; Ps. 88:11). The KJV and NIV translate Abaddon as “destruction,” while the NASB and RSV retain the word “Abaddon.” See Hell.
  12. Haha
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    I didn't go off topic. Abaddon has a strong connection to the Locusts. So anyone reading Joel or Revelations has to understand who Abaddon is. You locked it because you didn't want to expose yourself. Granted the WHO factor can make or break anyone's state, which was the case with Witness.
    You were asked WHO he was not HIS name/title.
    evidence below:
    The reason one must know WHO he is, is due to the fact that he controls/leads the Locust Army.
    Unlike you, I don't cower from questions, for I adhere to 2 Timothy 3:16. You? I guess that is for you to find out.
    That being said, next time you mention Locust, know what these things are, for a preacher of the gospel, running from such a thing only proves the point Christians and Muslims make about former witnesses. More so, your reaction proves me right.
  13. Haha
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in Abaddon, also known as Apollyon - The Angel of the Abyss   
    I will address the below briefly because apparently when someone "calls" you to claim, they run away from even the basics of asking. I will also repost key points of a debate I had regarding this topic with better quotations, this because when forums update, some words or punctuations turn into symbols.
    What is Abaddon, and what does that name/title means:

    Abaddon (אֲבַדּוֹן‎) is a Hebrew term, that derives Avaddon, meaning either Destruction or Doom. Like the Hebrew term, the Greek equivalent  is Apollyon (Ἀπολλύων) which means Destroyer [The Destroyer]. This appears in the Scriptures in both instances, in regards to a place of destruction, as for the angel in question, it is interpreted as an Archangel of the abyss. 

    Who is Abbadon:

    As shown in the other thread, it is obvious as to what the name/title means, however, it was never addressed who it is, clearly there is reason behind that because there are only 2 sides concerning the Angel of the Abyss - one good, and one bad, which can make or break a viewpoint not only verily easily, but quickly. Running from such does not help either. For this angel is very well connected with the Locust Army itself. In the Hebrew text, Abaddon is used with reference to a Bottomless Pit, often appearing alongside the place שְׁאוֹל (Sheol), meaning the realm of the dead.
    Notes:

    Hebrew Text

    The term Abaddon appears six times in the Masoretic text of the Hebrew Bible; Abaddon means destruction or "place of destruction", or the realm of the dead, and is accompanied by Sheol. In the Hebrew Old Testament, Abaddon, is mentioned several times, in a sense, often in reference to the grave (Job 26:6; 28:22; 31:12; Psalms 88:11; Proverbs 15:11; 27:20). Even when it comes to oral traditions of legends of Rabbinical Literature, Abaddon is identified as a separate realm where those in damnation are laid dead in both fire and snow, moreover, shown as one of several places in Gehenna that Moses the Levite has visited.
    Greek Text
    We see the appears of Abaddon in the Greek text as well. In Revelation 9:11, this is the first known depiction of Abaddon as an individual entity instead of a place. Because of this, this left the identity of Abaddon open to interpretation. In 1708, a Protestant, Matthew Henry believed Abaddon, to be The Antichrist, another such as Jamieson-Fausset Brown in 1871, as well as Henry Hampton Halley in 1922, didn't believe Abaddon to be The Antichrist, but rather, Satan the Devil. This is also in contrast for some the Methodist publication, The Interpreter's Bible, which  states that Abaddon is an angel, but not of Satan, instead, but from God, performing his work of destruction at God's bidding, all this by citing the context at Revelations 20:1-3. Likewise, for most Restorationist, including Jehovah's Witnesses, also cite Revelation 20:1-3 where the angel having the key of the abyss is actually shown to be a representative of God, which brings the conclusion of Abaddon being Jesus (Michael for some), in title after resurrection.

    Secondary Notes:

    Destroyer can equate to other things/persons as well

    1 Corinthians 10:7-10, this passage is about Apostle Paul’s focus on those of Israel who succumb to murmuring and putting God to the test, and the "Destroyer" here is regarding God’s messenger sent to destroy – that is, if you take into account the context of the references.

    Isaiah 33:1 or chapter 33 in general is regarding the "Destroyer" (The Assyrian/Assyria). Who in turn is eventually destroyed by another, an Angel (Angel of Death also known as a Destroyer). For the history of Sennacherib, who is an Assyrian, for Assyria (the Destroyer mentioned in Isaiah 33:1) threatened to destroy Jerusalem, which at the time its ruler being Hezekiah, the son of Ahaz. God responded by sending an Angel, and this Angel, who was sent, took out, or as some would say, steamrolled 185,000 Assyrian Soldiers as they prepared to enter the city (2 Kings 18-19, Isaiah 37:33-38). For none do not see Satan or Jesus, but an Angel, and before that we know of Assyria, who was a Destroyer themselves, thus the God of Hezekiah, going with Prophet Isaiah has said, destroyed the destroyer, which is, Assyria with the destroyer that was sent.

    [When you have ceased to destroy, you will be destroyed;]

    Another example is that God sent an angel to take action, Hebrews 11:28, the "Destroyer" here was indeed an Angel also known as "The Angel of Death" called by some or other translations. This same verse is a quotation found in Hebrews 11:28 which reads:

    By faith he kept the Passover and sprinkled the blood, so that the Destroyer of the firstborn might not touch them.

    So we can identify the “Destroyer” here to be an Angel, sent by God during the days of Moses and Aaron and their ordeal with Egypt’s Pharaoh.
    With that in mind, the destroyer(s) often relates to enemies of God's people, as is, with those in support of God's people, i.e. angels. in this case. Where does that put Abaddon? Is this person a friend, or is he a foe?

    The Good:

    There are those who later come to understand that Abaddon is an Angel of God, some even assume that Abaddon is the same Angel who had dealt with the Assyrians back in the days of King Hezekiah. Some assume the Angel to be Michael The Archangel, to others, this angel, thus being associated with Michael The Archangel, will say that Abaddon is the Lord himself - Jesus Christ, and the Locust, whom follower their King, are on his side. Abaddon is often spoken of as God's Right Hand.

    The Bad:


    Very early on, since the symbolism of Revelations was not 100% understood, there are those who associate Abaddon with Satan The Devil or some unknown Demon. This also led them to believe that The Devil, or this Demon controls an Army of evil Locusts to cause trouble for God's people.

    What is Abaddon's role and how does the Locust play into all this:

    Abaddon, being the angel of the abyss is very simple - Revelation 9:1-12

    He is the one given the keys to the abyss.
    Revelation 9:1 - And the fifth angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star fallen from heaven to earth, and he was given the key to the shaft of the bottomless pit. Not only the Locusts were released, freed from it (Revelations 9:3), it is the same place where Satan the Devil is hurled into the abyss, held in captivity (Revelations 20:3). Some would find this part confusing for if Abaddon was Satan or an ally of Satan, why would he lock up his own boss, with a key given to him? For this point right here is where most of Christendom later changed their understanding, hence restoration, mainly when it came to them having connected Joel and Revelations 100%. Likewise as to the Locust not attacking God's people, or having the spirit poured to them, which rf. Acts 2:39, which drew question and further study as more and more people began to not just read Scripture, but commit themselves to research.
    What are Locusts:

    Locusts are a group of certain species of short-horned grasshoppers in the family Acrididae that have a swarming phase. These insects are usually solitary, but under certain circumstances they become more abundant and change their behavior and habits, becoming gregarious. No taxonomic distinction is made between locust and grasshopper species; the basis for the definition is whether a species forms swarms under intermittently suitable conditions.
    In ancient times, the Study of literature shows how pervasive plagues of locusts were over the course of history. The insects arrived unexpectedly, often after a change of wind direction or weather, and the consequences were devastating. The Ancient Egyptians carved locusts on tombs in the period 2470 to 2220 BC. A devastating plague in Egypt is also mentioned in the Book of Exodus, committed by this swarm. The Iliad mentions locusts taking to the wing to escape fire. Plagues of locusts are also mentioned in the Quran. In the 9th century, the Chinese authorities appointed anti-locust officers, for such a swarm was that intense to deal with.
    Who represents the Locusts:

    Although some are quick to equate these symbolic representations with demons, a scourge of wickedness, an undead army, etc. They fall to see what this represents, mainly due to the fact the Locusts mentioned here do not harm God's people.

    Locusts in figurative use can equate to 2 groups (3 if you count Nahum).

    Babylonians - Joel’s prophecy relates to an attack as shown in Joel 1:6; 2:1, 8, and 11, and this attack is concerning Babylonian soldiers which has been revealed in 2:25 to deal with the Israelites who disobeyed God. The army evidently organized and was able to overwhelm the Israelites like, of which they are described as, a Locust swarm. They overran and ransacked the Israelites' dwelling very quickly. Soldiers of the Babylonian Army.

    The Locust representation although similar they are different, which brings us to God's people.

    God's People - In Revelation 9:1-11. Some in the past connected the Locusts in Joel in relations to the actions and operations of the gospel work, therefore, they make a similar connection in the role of the Locust in the Book of Revelations. The prophecy in question is a swarm of Locusts that  have human faces, adorn golden crowns, and have long hair, and teeth like that of a lion, all going into battle (Revelations 9:7-8) We come to see that they torment those an enemy to God who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads. The connection to Joel also reflects life-span, for there is an limited amount of time, a period of 5 months, for these Locusts to commit their act, something of which is also spoken of in commentary, which is no different from life-span of and operations of literal Locusts.

    Words of Nahum concerning Assyrians - Although not the focus, but the representation of Locust can also be equated to The Assyrian Army. Nahum 3:16-17 when they were compared to Locusts that remain in their dwelling in cold weather, thus making them unable to act and remain numb. But the second the sun shines, this will result in them rushing away from their dwelling, fleeing - flying away.

    Between the 2 who [focused] represented as Locusts, there is a difference.

    Reasons why Joel and Revelations connect with each other via references is because [A] Locusts swarm at great numbers [B] They operate and take various actions.
    In this case we can see the differences though, for we have Locusts that attack the Israelites, and the latter only attacks, symbolically, those who are not of God. One swarms as a means to cause problems, the latter, swarms as a means to commit to what God has tasked them. One takes judgement in a way to suppress, the latter proclaims judgement.
    What is there role:

    The events of old had past, however when Satan is locked away in the abyss, those who represent the Locust are to commit to the work - God's people. But their gospel message will not be good news always, but also judgement.
     
    Granted this was talked about for sometime now, everything mentioned is brief, for the other thread was locked due to question dodging.
  14. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Equivocation in Since everyone is jumping on the Textual Criticism bandwagon...   
    What do you think of the following below, like the other passage that was discussed, these are said to be spurious or forged, be it added or removed, whatever.
    Let's keep this BIBLE SCRIPTURE ONLY, for once this thread needs something neutral instead of the world war III stuff going on, reasons why I asked if ANYONE really changed
    Simply just quote whatever verse or passage, and show your findings. If you have to interact with someone else, only use Scripture and your findings.
    Consider this a Bible based activity.
    Mark 16:9-20 Revelation 1:11 1 Timothy 3:16 1 John 5:7 Acts 10:48 Acts 16:7 Hebrews 1:3 Ephesians 3:9
  15. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to TrueTomHarley in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    So here we see why WItness defends the passage, despite flimsy evidence for it being genuine and strong evidence for it being spurious. She does it to undermine the provision of disfellowshipping.
    There is plenty of reason to not believe it. Though Jesus forgives sin frequently in scripture, there is always some evidence of repentance on the sinning one’s part. There is some basis for forgiveness. Here there is not.
    All that is lacking in the spurious passage is for Jesus to say at the end: “Boy, I can’t believe what a nasty bully my dad is!” 
  16. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Pudgy in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    Faith is when you believe something that has some overall evidence but not enough to prove it with a reason and logic, or perhaps even textual dating.
    I believe the scripture is true, even though it may well not be.
    I believe the scripture is true, even though it may well not be. 
     
    either way, I’m not up and out on much of a limb.
    I would much rather err on the side of Mercy, than err  on the side of the Pharisees ….. and THAT is where the rubber meets the road !
  17. Upvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from TrueTomHarley in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    @Witness The WHY is due to a gain on the opponent's end. It all points back to the councils.
  18. Downvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    The Locust term is used for not only used for God's people, but was also used for Babylonian army of old. One of the reasons why some of the verses interconnect (from both Joel and Revelations) with each other is due to how Locust are, they do not come as one, two or a few, but a swarm:

    Christians early on assume the Locusts in Revelations to represent the enemy and or demons, which is in similarity as to how Bible students viewed it early on as did most, even connecting Joel and Revelations at times, however, some after learning, people came to a conclusion in their understanding of things to know who Revelations speaks of, granted the Locust and regards to Joel concerning Babylonians. In Revelations, those who represent the Locusts not only come out of the abyss, they are to finish the gospel work, and proclaim judgement. The way I see it, people's view back then was different due to how the Locust Army seen in Revelations looks like, not knowing that this is a symbolic representation.
    The only group who speaks of the Locusts as enemies, even equating Joel to Revelations as identical are anything who shares the same mindset as most Trinitarians. There are other views, which are somewhat nonsensical, and very far from the truth, which some believe today sadly.
    For us Biblical Unitarians, we at a time thought of the Locust as Satan's Army against God at a time, ignoring the symbolic representation and took what was said literally, hence the speculation that the horde of demonic locusts, only later to know the true representation.
    That being said, people who come to learn and understand what a passage or verse is conveying, it shows that such ones are slowly learning as to what is true; and whatever old reasoning that they had that was not correct, for after learning, they see. If the JW pastor were to continue living, it is by no doubt he would come to that conclusion himself. It is also how they operate due to what Butler linked from the JW website, for the first paragraphs pretty much explains how Christians were back then compared to now, they had to collect findings.
    Before the update of this forums, @The Librarian had a list of things concerning how Bible Students, well into JWs come to learn of their findings, you can check it out down here. It will be somewhat difficult because the responses are from the same usual suspects:
     
  19. Downvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    I asked for who. You just gave me a name deemed a title. 
    Therefore if you are going to say someone is wrong, you have to explain.
    To anyone else who reads, the name was professed by @Patiently waiting for Truth, his reason for not telling WHO Abaddon is, would either make or break his entire thread - Therefore, to make a claim as to someone being wrong about the Locust notation, but unable to back it up, shows a huge level of bluff on his end. - So if I am wrong, show your evidence.
     
     
    That being said, if that isn't addressed, I'd gladly answer by using the Bible alone, if you can't address WHO this angel is. Thanks for the name, despite it is already known, as is, deemed a title.
    I thought I should let this known to you, Angel of the Abyss and the Locust has been debated for years now, even predating you and even me. So the make or break factor in this is huge here.
  20. Upvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Thinking in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    The Locust term is used for not only used for God's people, but was also used for Babylonian army of old. One of the reasons why some of the verses interconnect (from both Joel and Revelations) with each other is due to how Locust are, they do not come as one, two or a few, but a swarm:

    Christians early on assume the Locusts in Revelations to represent the enemy and or demons, which is in similarity as to how Bible students viewed it early on as did most, even connecting Joel and Revelations at times, however, some after learning, people came to a conclusion in their understanding of things to know who Revelations speaks of, granted the Locust and regards to Joel concerning Babylonians. In Revelations, those who represent the Locusts not only come out of the abyss, they are to finish the gospel work, and proclaim judgement. The way I see it, people's view back then was different due to how the Locust Army seen in Revelations looks like, not knowing that this is a symbolic representation.
    The only group who speaks of the Locusts as enemies, even equating Joel to Revelations as identical are anything who shares the same mindset as most Trinitarians. There are other views, which are somewhat nonsensical, and very far from the truth, which some believe today sadly.
    For us Biblical Unitarians, we at a time thought of the Locust as Satan's Army against God at a time, ignoring the symbolic representation and took what was said literally, hence the speculation that the horde of demonic locusts, only later to know the true representation.
    That being said, people who come to learn and understand what a passage or verse is conveying, it shows that such ones are slowly learning as to what is true; and whatever old reasoning that they had that was not correct, for after learning, they see. If the JW pastor were to continue living, it is by no doubt he would come to that conclusion himself. It is also how they operate due to what Butler linked from the JW website, for the first paragraphs pretty much explains how Christians were back then compared to now, they had to collect findings.
    Before the update of this forums, @The Librarian had a list of things concerning how Bible Students, well into JWs come to learn of their findings, you can check it out down here. It will be somewhat difficult because the responses are from the same usual suspects:
     
  21. Downvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    The Locust term is used for not only used for God's people, but was also used for Babylonian army of old. One of the reasons why some of the verses interconnect (from both Joel and Revelations) with each other is due to how Locust are, they do not come as one, two or a few, but a swarm:

    Christians early on assume the Locusts in Revelations to represent the enemy and or demons, which is in similarity as to how Bible students viewed it early on as did most, even connecting Joel and Revelations at times, however, some after learning, people came to a conclusion in their understanding of things to know who Revelations speaks of, granted the Locust and regards to Joel concerning Babylonians. In Revelations, those who represent the Locusts not only come out of the abyss, they are to finish the gospel work, and proclaim judgement. The way I see it, people's view back then was different due to how the Locust Army seen in Revelations looks like, not knowing that this is a symbolic representation.
    The only group who speaks of the Locusts as enemies, even equating Joel to Revelations as identical are anything who shares the same mindset as most Trinitarians. There are other views, which are somewhat nonsensical, and very far from the truth, which some believe today sadly.
    For us Biblical Unitarians, we at a time thought of the Locust as Satan's Army against God at a time, ignoring the symbolic representation and took what was said literally, hence the speculation that the horde of demonic locusts, only later to know the true representation.
    That being said, people who come to learn and understand what a passage or verse is conveying, it shows that such ones are slowly learning as to what is true; and whatever old reasoning that they had that was not correct, for after learning, they see. If the JW pastor were to continue living, it is by no doubt he would come to that conclusion himself. It is also how they operate due to what Butler linked from the JW website, for the first paragraphs pretty much explains how Christians were back then compared to now, they had to collect findings.
    Before the update of this forums, @The Librarian had a list of things concerning how Bible Students, well into JWs come to learn of their findings, you can check it out down here. It will be somewhat difficult because the responses are from the same usual suspects:
     
  22. Downvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Dmitar in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    The Angel of the Abyss is in relation to the Locusts mentioned in the Scriptures, mainly Joel and Revelations.
    Asking WHO this angel is, isn't going off topic or trolling. A troll is someone who posts inflammatory, insincere, digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages.
    After all, you mentioned me, so here I am.
    Again, you already addressed the NAME, but in order to know if there is misuse of Scripture, we need to know WHO this angel is.
    If we are to as you said [Can we please set matters straight about the wrong use of scripture. ] then let's us get down to the Truth here concerning the Locust.
  23. Upvote
    Space Merchant reacted to Equivocation in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    @JW Insider Thank you, the thread alone has more detail.
    It wasn't much when @Patiently waiting for Truth said the 2 points he addresses, which didn't have that much detail as seen here -
    1. Jesus allowed an immoral woman to wash His feet with her tears, then wipre His feet with her hair, then she anointed His feet with oil. Then Jesus said to her "Your sins are forgiven you "   2.  The Jewish way of life, The Law, demanded death.  However the New way, through Christ, demanded mercy and forgiveness. Jesus and the disciples never punished anyone by killing them.  But this thread alone has more detail as to what I was asking for, not sure as to why he didn't bring that up early before his usual boxing match with SM. Although debatable, majority of people see it as spurious, even us JWs, reason why I cited JW library, and my pervious post was from a study, where I quoted my old comment about the history of that passage. Even while preaching, there are people who do not consider this as part of the Scriptures, even more when it was used much much later on in some translations.
    Thanks again because you took literally a minute to do this vs someone else who took days.
  24. Upvote
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Thinking in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    I only used a meme twice. The first was on purpose to the quote, which you reacted to, hence the FBI comment.
    I don't need to prove who you are when the latter proved it for me.
    Actually I do spend my time on serious matters, as mentioned to you already, I am dealing with the Sophie situation which is in the realm of missing/persons and child abuse. I had pass over to others several missing persons information. And as of recent, dealing with information on vaccination mandates, which as of right now hit San Francisco.
    I only spent, 8 minutes to gather all that information, I already know who you are, just waited for someone to call it, which adds justification to JWI and the others when you spoke in 3rd person numerous times.
    Hence the claim by those concerning ExJWs - you make up the hold of that "some" who end up this way. Also true with what I am asking of Srecko right now.
    I do not hold to agendas, I am against them - another lie on your point.
    Well essentially it is, my credit goes to Tom, Anna, JWI, Srecko and other mentions.
    That being said, the fact you cannot debate shows your irrelevancy, good day sir - you are a waste of time, for my concern in this thread is New Thought, Bible Errors being professed, if the claims are true, during a pandemic at the hands of JWs. The reason I didn't ask any current Jehovah's Witnesses here is because the claims were often spoken of by their former counterparts and scholarly rivals - they immediately got the idea as to why I asked Srecko those 2 questions.
    Likewise with misinformation of equating Anti-Trinitarianism to a religious rival who believes in the Trinity and used Televangelism since the 1950s.
     
    I am waiting for that

    Those simply prove my points because you can't get around them.
  25. Haha
    Space Merchant got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in DRAGGING UP OLD NEWS BUT STILL SOME JWs and others, DON'T BELIEVE, LOCUSTS & SUPERIOR AUTHORITIES.. WERE WRONGLY USED BY WATCHTOWER   
    I asked you who is The Angel of the Abyss, I didn't ask for a name. Again, if you are going to say someone is false, prove to your claims, JB.
    It isn't a hard question by the way.
     
    EDIT:
    You continue to prove my points - 
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