JOHN BUTLER

You know, you are right. My apologies.

Due to this gracious response, you have restrained me from highlighting John's words "I am not you mate" and letting them stand without comment. Thank you sincerely for this and for your overall help in getting me to reign in some of my hyperboles and occasional dignified barbs.
I have pointed out before that it is beneath me to resort to despicable trolling. I confine myself to engaging in dignified perusal of internet resources in search of fatheads to set straight.

And I made it look like I was blaming you. Sorry. As I recall, you had already defended yourself very well a few hundred posts back in this thread. They even talked about threaded replies. And I knew it wasn't your fault from the start. I've been asked to split off several threads myself, and I always have trouble with the fact that the initial post is the oldest relevant post that can be added to the thread so it looks like that person started the new thread. It gives the impression that some innocent person had deemed a side-track topic to be important enough for its own thread. 

IT was the librarian, he was punishing me for not sticking to a topic. Now it looks like I started this thread. I would never start a topic with a title like that.

I've just watched a video link of Bro Jackson being 'sworn in' at the Australian Royal Commision and he swore on the Bible.
I've always thought that JW's should not swear on God's word the Bible. I thought there was a scripture that says not to swear on anything, but to let our own Yes or No mean Yes or  No..........  Matthew 5 33 - 37 
And I'm sure somewhere in his statements he says that the GB might not be the 'only' channel God is using. 
So, I'm wondering how much his words or opinions can be trusted. 
  33  “Again you heard that it was said to those of ancient times: ‘You must not swear without performing, but you must pay your vows to Jehovah.’34  However, I say to you: Do not swear at all,c neither by heaven, for it is God’s throne; 35  nor by earth, for it is the footstool of his feet;d nor by Jerusalem, for it is the city of the great King.e 36  Do not swear by your head, since you cannot turn one hair white or black. 37  Just let your word ‘Yes’ mean yes, your ‘No,’ no, for what goes beyond these is from the wicked 

I'll just say thank you, and admit you made me laugh. 

Oops, misunderstanding here. We are most certainly not friends, in any sense, if you thought I was implying such. No, we are "mates" in this sense: MATE: "used to show that two people share a space" and that space is here on this forum, "forum-mates". Bit like travelling on the London Underground in the same carriage. Then we would be "tube-mates" But we probably wouldn't know each other from Adam. Hope that's clear? No offense intended.
If you are referring to your "almost funny" comment, I still don't know what you meant. I'll assume you mean "strange or peculiar" because no comedy is involved in the subject matter. So my comments still apply. And I'm quite happy being "funny" in any sense for that matter, so "get over it"? Not really an issue.
Oh, a clarification. Well that's useful. I'll duck out of it now then,  'though I will echo @JW Insider 's comment that it is "your reaction to WTS policies that is very important for most of us to reflect on".
All the best with your search, (forum) mate. ☺️

I think you are getting confused with John the Baptist who ate locusts. 
However you may see the reason for my comment if you look on other topics, and i did say IF it is true.  

I for one, thank you for sticking around for this discussion. Yes, I remember how unfair it seemed that someone started a thread with your name in it, just to make it clear that they didn't trust your own stated reasons. But, of course, forums are full of opinions sprinkled with a few facts sometimes, but just to bolster opinions. People rightly treat most of this like YouTube comments, or some other "worst" example of the way people's opinions can cloud out anything useful. But I stll think that what you have provided here is a first hand experience (prior to JW association) and a subsequent reaction to WTS policies that is very important for most of us to reflect on, even if it's different from the way most of think we would react.

Wow, True Tom and Billy doing their bit to pretend the JW Org / Watchtower are so so good and pure. Well done boys, good acting. 
But it still comes back to Collateral damage. So i can only presume it has never happened to you and you have no idea what sexual abuse, or emotional abuse, or physical abuse is like.  
It seems the Australian JW org had records going back 50 years. And the GB / legal departments in USA have records going back at least 20 years containing thousands of accusations. Did they do it for 'kicks' ?  Keeping these records / documents /files, to read and get high on ?  Strange that the GB should keep so much info' but keep it all to themselves. 
Of course Victims are angry. I'm still angry at what happened to me, though it wasn't in the Org. It has ruined my life, so i can understand it has ruined the lives of thousands of others. Not only does it ruin the lives of Victims, it ruins the lives of families. And not only that but in the JW Org it has killed thousands spiritually, hence i say 'Offering Children to Molech'. 
But to your guys it's just collateral damage. Why should a few thousand suffers matter to you when your 8.5 million JW Org is still functioning ok. 
' yielding to the instinct to not air dirty laundry'.  Is that what they are Tom, the Victims. Just 'dirty laundry'.  And you call yourself a Christian 

Because knowing ... when others do not ... is what has given, scam artists, flim-flam men, shamans, priests, and ecclesiastical tap-dancers  power prestige, and money, and position in various societies, since four guys went hunting for animals, and OG, the caveman,  supposedly was the only one who knew where the best hunting grounds were.
You do not actually have to BE a wise man, or in the case of Punxsutawney Phil, a weather predicting Groundhog in Gobbler's Knob Pennsylvania .... you only need the REPUTATION !
Clergy by ANY nomenclature are trained experts at "knowing the mind of God".
It's their Busine$$.
 
 

Since the evidence supports that, and without your denial or affirmation, I will take that as a "yes".
Not that I care at all ... just a matter of trying to correctly understand where you are coming from.

Billy:
Your writing style has changed dramatically.
Did a committee write that for you?

The end is indeed near. There are people who want to see it happen, some of old age, including someone that I know, tears up because he wants to be living to see that day, everything spoken of in the Bible coming true.
At the end of it all, the wicked will be no more and as judgment continues, there will also be the Christ who by means of God and authority given to him will bring back people who have since died and will most likely do what Prophet Isiah plans to do and anyone who survives will live on earth without the problems that came from things that during this time, will be of the past - this includes what bothers you the most, it will be gone also.

I can't imagine someone as nice as you ever being outraged Tom. 

The Beverly Hillbillies began playing in reruns that night and the ones that you despise love that old show.

@JW Insider  Quote "Admittedly, I am somewhat of a critical reader and often find things that are easy to disagree with, at least slightly. Usually, it's when our publications make a statement that is not necessarily wrong, but could easily need to be updated in a future publication. This might be for any of the following reasons:
Some explanation was worded as if the meaning of a thing can only be understood in one specific way when in fact the Biblical evidence makes it clear that there are other possible meanings and our conclusion is really speculation. Or when a quote is used but it was misunderstood or misused by the writer. Or when a historical event is referred to as evidence of something when the event didn't really occur exactly as was stated. Or when a concept isn't actually explained or defined correctly. Or when examples are used that can easily become obsolete, out of date, and might later require a new explanation if trends change. Or when a specific date or chronological system is used without Biblical or secular support. (Our date might be correct in those cases, but since we sometimes make use of an alternate dating system without Biblical or secular support, I always feel that at least an explanation of our assumptions should be included, so people know why we give a different date from 99.9 percent of encyclopedias, for example.)" So basically when the GB tell lies and / or deliberately mislead the congregation. 
As it's often quoted: "Ours is not to reason why, ours is but to do or die...... Like I've said before, Puppets. 
I wonder, What was the true reason the Group study of a Tuesday Eve was stopped ? Sorry that's off topic. 

Sorry but that is the biggest squirm I have read on here so far. 
We get back to this thing about the GB being the 'Faithful and discreet slave' and Jesus saying that 'Whatever the Anointed ask for in Jesus name it will be given'. And again that 'What father when his child asked for a fish gives a stone instead'. And how much more so will God give the guidance of His holy spirit to those that ask. 
So why has the GB and the Writing Department needed to misquote, misuse,  and mislead the congregation,
And you said they, 'use date or chronological system is used without Biblical or secular support'.
So guessing eh ? No. Pretending to know, when in fact they don't know. Come on, that is as bad a lying. 
People hang on their every word. 8.5 million JW's,  hang on every word of the GB.  And another 9 million bible studies also do the same, because they are told to. 
 

@Gone Away  Um, erroneous eh ? 
15 February 1983 Watchtower, pp 12-13, article Four Requirements for Salvation: “Jehovah is using only one organization today to accomplish his will. To receive everlasting life in the earthly Paradise we must identify that organization and serve God as part of it.”
Watchtower March 1, 1985 p 14: “Only Christian witnesses of Jehovah who successfully pass this test will survive and come forth like fire-refined gold for God’s use in his precious new order.”
Watchtower September 1, 1989 p 19: "Only Jehovah's Witnesses, those of the anointed remnant and the "great crowd," as a united organization under the protection of the Supreme Organizer, have any Scriptural hope of surviving the impending end of this doomed system dominated by Satan the Devil." Watchtower September 15, 1993 p 22: “But if we were to draw away from Jehovah’s organization, there would be no place else to go for salvation and true joy.”
Watchtower May 15, 2006: "During the final period of the ancient world that perished in the Flood, Noah was a faithful preacher of righteousness. (2 Peter 2:5) In these last days of the present system of things, Jehovah's people are making known God's righteous standards and are declaring good news about the possibility of surviving into the new world. (2 Peter 3:9-13) Just as Noah and his God-fearing family were preserved in the ark, survival of individuals today depends on their faith and their loyal association with the earthly part of Jehovah's universal organization."
Watchtower December 15, 2007: "But Jehovah's servants already belong to the only organization that will survive the end of this wicked system of things."
Now i will admit that i haven't looked up these Watchtowers and checked the quotes, so maybe if you disagree with them you may want to check them out yourself. 

Be cautious and evaluate, yes of course. 
But not be blind or pretend not to see the truth about the JW Org. 
Unless you too are saying all the Child Abuse Victims are telling lies. Are you ? 
I agree with the Proverbs scripture, but the naive ones are the JW congregants that believe every word of the GB. 

For an actor, timing is very important!

If you have an early Sunday Morning meeting, you know that you have to race away from the Kingdom Hall as soon as possible to get to the Golden Corral before the Baptists show up like a plague of locusts!

John Wayne was for 20 years buried without a headstone, but he was buried after death. in Corona Del Mar, California.

That's why I am a big fan of the fictional character John Wayne ... he can endure ANYTHING, and barely notice.

I think you used the wrong word here .... the topic is not slanderous .... and if any accusations made are true, that is the perfect defense to the CHARGE of slander.
There are topics that are "sensitive", even "taboo" ... but that varies from culture to culture, and from time to time..... and from person to person.