JOHN BUTLER

@Anna you have been well trained (brain washed) by the JW org.  I do hope nothing of these sorts ever happens to you or your family. 
Yes I'm sure you would tell my local elders if i gave you their phone numbers, tell them to destroy evidence that is. 
i didn't find that piece of paper with the details on, maybe I destroyed it.  I honestly cannot remember the man's name, so now i have no info at all. Oh well if the Elders can destroy evidence and still think they have peace with God ...... 

In one hand your word is right Anna, but Shiwiii have better argument because Natural Law, or if you like Bible verses, have stronger argument, and that is; ..... do what is good in your eyes, by your conscious, what is good before people and before God, obey God more than men. Or if you want Ultimate and Final bible text about ALL things in LIFE ----- Love your neighbor as yourself.  
 
...so what ever GB or WT Manual Book or lawyer or Court or police say .....do love  .... and do find the way. 

Based on your statement and the word "obligate" 
https://www.thesaurus.com/browse/obligate
Synonyms for obligate
require
constrain
oblige
bind
force
restrain
restrict
astrict
indebt
 
common sense says no, but now were dealing with people who cannot think for themselves because the gb has told them otherwise. 
I understand, your org is precious and when outsiders (government commissions included) point out things that are just plain WRONG, it hurts your view of right and wrong. Its called cognitive dissonance.  

only if forced by the law of the land, otherwise.....SHHhhhhhhhh  don't tell anyone because it will make jehovah sad. 

so jws have to wait until forced to what is good? 

so why doesn't the policy state to bring it up to the police? 
Would they if it was murder?     it is in a sense murder, murder of their innocence. 

Romans 13 says they are bound by means of doing what is good. 

Romans13
1 Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4 for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing. 7 Pay to all what is owed to them: taxes to whom taxes are owed, revenue to whom revenue is owed, respect to whom respect is owed, honor to whom honor is owed.
 
How come this does not come into the minds of jws when talking about CSA and the authorities? 

Defending the weaker from stronger in any form, spiritual or physical is obligation to all, inside or outside the JW  community. 
Bible is full of examples where crude force is allowed to protect other person !!!!!!!!!!!  ... to safe animals too. 
This short part in video is example how sometimes people on position and their lawyers want to avoid the truth and responsibility. ARC testimonies repeated this issue and showed how Australian elder have no interest to help children outside his congregation if pedophile is in their midst. Shameful. Anna, please do stop to protect those who are not protecting the weakest in society (JW society or outside)!  

This is irrelevant. You are making the mistake of mixing two separate things together. You do not need two witnesses to make a report to the police. This is only for congregational action.
9. Elders never require victims of child abuse to present their accusation in the presence of the
alleged abuser. However, victims who are now adults may do so, if they wish. In addition, victims can
be accompanied by a confidant of either gender for moral support when presenting their accusation to
the elders. If a victim prefers, the accusation can be submitted in the form of a written statement
No, and they never will because it is not scriptural.
Yes, WT always hands over any necessary confidential documentation pertaining to a case. WT will not hand over confidential documentation that has nothing to do with a specific case. The supreme court agreed with WT on that. (Any $4,000 fines per day were reversed and removed).

If conversation about this issue can make frustration of sort inside this circle of us who talking from distance to each other, imagine what heavy and hard and painful it is for those who experienced this things and must be in face to face situation ! 

Quote @Anna  "....you just want the congregation to be informed to protect the children in that congregation. "
I don't think it is possible to instruct the Elders that you want the congregation to be informed.... As far as I am aware the Elders DO NOT INFORM the congregation that there is a Pedophile within it. They certainly would not name the Pedophile. 
And it seems you are advising the idea of hiding a Pedophile within the JW Org, which is one of the things I've been saying from square one.  By not informing the police it would be hiding that Pedophile in that congregation. It would also be protecting a criminal. 
Quite strange really as this is what you are accusing me of, failing in my duty to report it.  But in this 'hypothetical situation' he would have first hand evidence, therefore be more entitled to report it, and more morally duty bound to do so. 
But also, are you saying that the Elders are not bound by scripture / service to God, to report it to the police, even if there is no 'law' of the land to do so ? Are you suggesting that those men (Elders) who, you would say, are chosen by God or Jesus Christ, through Holy Spirit,  yet are not bound to care for the safety of people inside and outside the JW Org ? Is there not obligation for such ones to care for widows and orphans, and little children within and outside the Org if it is possible for them to do so. 

Quote @Anna  "....you just want the congregation to be informed to protect the children in that congregation. "
I don't think it is possible to instruct the Elders that you want the congregation to be informed.... As far as I am aware the Elders DO NOT INFORM the congregation that there is a Pedophile within it. They certainly would not name the Pedophile. 
And it seems you are advising the idea of hiding a Pedophile within the JW Org, which is one of the things I've been saying from square one.  By not informing the police it would be hiding that Pedophile in that congregation. It would also be protecting a criminal. 
Quite strange really as this is what you are accusing me of, failing in my duty to report it.  But in this 'hypothetical situation' he would have first hand evidence, therefore be more entitled to report it, and more morally duty bound to do so. 
But also, are you saying that the Elders are not bound by scripture / service to God, to report it to the police, even if there is no 'law' of the land to do so ? Are you suggesting that those men (Elders) who, you would say, are chosen by God or Jesus Christ, through Holy Spirit,  yet are not bound to care for the safety of people inside and outside the JW Org ? Is there not obligation for such ones to care for widows and orphans, and little children within and outside the Org if it is possible for them to do so. 

What would it be if it were happened.....
We do not need this imagination because we have real people with real events dear Anna.

Did WT made change about need for TWO witnesses?
Did WT allow that sisters/women be present in investigation process as support for male and especially female minors victims and other victims  no matter of ages? 
Did WT allow that sister/women be involved in Judicial process that involve sex crimes and domestic violence inside and outside family environment when female victims are involved? 
Did WT open secret files and fully cooperate with police and Courts?
.....etc.
 
 

You do say some stupid things Kid. I never once said the GB or JW Org wrote the Bible. BUT they did translate it to suit their own use, and they DO MISUSE SCRIPTURE that was meant for our instruction, guidance and protection.
The GB make up rules for disfellowshipping. They do not only use the instruction from the scriptures, such as you have quoted above, but the GB add their own interpretations to it. If they in fact used the principal from the instruction as mentioned above, then there would be far fewer pedophiles in the JW org.... Each one that was found would be removed, handed over to the local authorities/police, and not hidden in the Org. 
One thing you seem to have overlooked though is this is an Anointed man (Paul ) talking to other Anointed men. This brings us back to the perfection of the Anointed that I mentioned earlier. It also confirms to me that the Bible is written for the Anointed not for the Earthly class. The TRUE Anointed would know how to use the scriptures properly. 
Now in the JW congregations the Elders and Circuit Overseers or equivalent are mostly not of the Anointed, and therefore are not qualified to do the judging. And when it is a crime that has been committed then it becomes a legal matter not a spiritual one. Hence it should be immediately handed over to the legal authorities, 'that stand in place by God Himself, to do God's will in dealing with such matters, as mentioned in God's written word.
As for those 'in the body of Christ', they are the TRUE ANOINTED, NOT THE GB of JW Org. 
 

Proper context from who's viewpoint Kid ? 
Once again you place the GB on high. And it was once the belief that ALL ANOINTED WERE THE FAITHFUL AND DISCREET SLAVE.
So tell me what scriptures suddenly told your GB that the rest of the ANOINTED are now less important than the GB ? 
If you rely on your GB and do not rely on God's word and prayer to God through Jesus Christ, then you are in fact SERVING YOUR GB. 
Quote : Every Christian fellow in the body of Christ obeys God's commandments as instructed by Christ.' 
So where in the Bible does Christ tell anyone to serve the GB of JW Org ? 
The main issue here is that the GB of JW Org have proved themselves to be the WICKED SLAVE CLASS so should not be served by anyone. 

Proper context from who's viewpoint Kid ? 
Once again you place the GB on high. And it was once the belief that ALL ANOINTED WERE THE FAITHFUL AND DISCREET SLAVE.
So tell me what scriptures suddenly told your GB that the rest of the ANOINTED are now less important than the GB ? 
If you rely on your GB and do not rely on God's word and prayer to God through Jesus Christ, then you are in fact SERVING YOUR GB. 
Quote : Every Christian fellow in the body of Christ obeys God's commandments as instructed by Christ.' 
So where in the Bible does Christ tell anyone to serve the GB of JW Org ? 
The main issue here is that the GB of JW Org have proved themselves to be the WICKED SLAVE CLASS so should not be served by anyone. 

I can clearly see that @Anna is doing her very best to go OFF TOPIC. 
She sees me as an easy target, which she thinks will distract people from the EARTHWIDE CHILD ABUSE within the JW ORGANISATION.
She also tries to pretend that it is all about ABUSE IN THE PAST. Not true of course as many recent cases seem to be coming to light. 
And those victims from the past 50 years are still suffering. It's a lifetime thing, it does not go away. 
Does anyone have a follow up on the English translation of the BLUE LETTERS topic ? 
It might just add a bit more fuel to the fire  
By the way Anna it seems to have been proven that Elders deliberately destroy 'notes' / paperwork about Child Abuse accusations, so that when Police ask for the evidence it's 'no longer available'. So I would not go and warn the elders anyway. Why would i want to give them chance to destroy evidence ?  If I did take any action it would be to go directly to the Police, but it is doubtful that I will.  

I can clearly see that @Anna is doing her very best to go OFF TOPIC. 
She sees me as an easy target, which she thinks will distract people from the EARTHWIDE CHILD ABUSE within the JW ORGANISATION.
She also tries to pretend that it is all about ABUSE IN THE PAST. Not true of course as many recent cases seem to be coming to light. 
And those victims from the past 50 years are still suffering. It's a lifetime thing, it does not go away. 
Does anyone have a follow up on the English translation of the BLUE LETTERS topic ? 
It might just add a bit more fuel to the fire  
By the way Anna it seems to have been proven that Elders deliberately destroy 'notes' / paperwork about Child Abuse accusations, so that when Police ask for the evidence it's 'no longer available'. So I would not go and warn the elders anyway. Why would i want to give them chance to destroy evidence ?  If I did take any action it would be to go directly to the Police, but it is doubtful that I will.  

I like this thought very much. First time that i saw somebody put it in writing or say it aloud in this simple but distinctive sentence. Bravo John!

If i can recall this post of John about this information (correct me if it is wrong) John has heard that from other person. So now, we here are in some similar, strange position, because we heard, about crime that has happened, from John. 
I think how some scientific discipline, like sociology and psychology, could explain what happens inside people in such situations we talking about. Why do we react or not react? How do we react? Why we do not want to interfere in someone else's problems? Why it easier to be passive and to go on other side? .... etc. 

You do say some stupid things Kid. I never once said the GB or JW Org wrote the Bible. BUT they did translate it to suit their own use, and they DO MISUSE SCRIPTURE that was meant for our instruction, guidance and protection.
The GB make up rules for disfellowshipping. They do not only use the instruction from the scriptures, such as you have quoted above, but the GB add their own interpretations to it. If they in fact used the principal from the instruction as mentioned above, then there would be far fewer pedophiles in the JW org.... Each one that was found would be removed, handed over to the local authorities/police, and not hidden in the Org. 
One thing you seem to have overlooked though is this is an Anointed man (Paul ) talking to other Anointed men. This brings us back to the perfection of the Anointed that I mentioned earlier. It also confirms to me that the Bible is written for the Anointed not for the Earthly class. The TRUE Anointed would know how to use the scriptures properly. 
Now in the JW congregations the Elders and Circuit Overseers or equivalent are mostly not of the Anointed, and therefore are not qualified to do the judging. And when it is a crime that has been committed then it becomes a legal matter not a spiritual one. Hence it should be immediately handed over to the legal authorities, 'that stand in place by God Himself, to do God's will in dealing with such matters, as mentioned in God's written word.
As for those 'in the body of Christ', they are the TRUE ANOINTED, NOT THE GB of JW Org. 
 

bah, I do not believe you. 
I believe you would talk to elders and then keep quiet so that you don't make Jehovah sad. 
That's policy, right? 

If it is so as this declaration No 10 say, than WHY elders must contact Legal Department first on how this purely religious proceeding must continue. ?? How it is possible that mature elders can not decide (independently, according to their so called "Bible-educated" conscience or better - according to their Natural God given Conscience) how first thing, in benefit for the victim, is that POLICE have to secure PHYSICAL SAFETY FOR VICTIM, and then after this first step or parallel to this very first move that  must been done, is SPIRITUAL SAFETY for victim that this so called "mature men" have to provide. 
According to your brother Asch in his deposition, he made this CLEAR DISTINCTION about PHYSICAL SAFETY and SPIRITUAL SAFETY and how WT GB and their Lawyers defending themselves and their money and their Organizational Honor.
Your respond on John's post is how things he mentioned is from past, in 1980 es. ARC is from 2015 and WT elders in Australia are very bad role model as those elders from 1980 period. No progress was made in benefit for victims. All because of money and WTJWorg Corporation Public Picture.
Face the TRUTH and Reality please!