Thinking

Jesus was never like that ……and the Christian life back then had its problems as well…..the Corinthians cong was not all rosy……no cong even now is all rosy……we were warned wolfs would enter in amongst us after Paul was gone…he was already dealing with superfine apostles at this time…with in the Christian congs of the time.. Facts Ditimar….deal with Facts….we are all works in progress ….

No the Catholic Church hierarchy..copied to a point the Christian’s hierarchy or order directed by Holy Spirit… .Just the same as The Babylon religions copied the Jewish heirachy and rituals directed by Holy Spirit to an uncanny degree …..Satan mimicking Jehovahs rituals to a tea….. as a people have we been too authoritarian…to dogmatic at times…yes… Just like Moses going mad at the people when he had no right… Too right we made administrative changes after Rutherford…we needed too….. ….

Should Peter have known to the depth he would fall In Renouncing Jesus…did he understand the extent of his persecution…no…he still failed in sinking into the stormy seas…but Jesus spoke kindly to him even tho lacking faith. The problem here Ditmar..is you actually cause more harm than good to the truth…you come out so self righteous ..and no matter how some one tries to be kindly to you…no matter how many try to make allowances for your over zealousness…you won’t listen. Thus you are not acting like Jesus in any form….but roaring out of piousness…..you would condemn the very men Jesus loved when they fled in terror and abandoned him….in your actions and words what you are showing is the very lack of the understanding of Christ….the very essence of his being and reason for being ….Jesus would not speak as you do…nor would he judge as you do. Im not saying some of your thoughts are wrong…for they are not all wrong…but the spirit in which you speak is wrong…..you are not helping anyone come into the truth or even want to…..you are doing more harm than good. you yourself are acting as a rouge element of Jehovahs people even being on this forum….yet that’s okay with you…..because you feel you have a right to….as we all do here….you honestly feel you are being used to defend this institution….thus in your mind defending Jehovah and Jesus…..thus you condemn yourself with a double standard …so why do you condemn us your fellow brothers and sisters. I know talking and trying to reason with you is actually whistling in the wind..and it’s no good even being kindly to you…but I hope that those that read you…or this realize we are not all like you…you are very proud Ditmar and you lash out at one’s who truly are your brothers and sisters…. Anyway these days are hard and we need to keep putting up with each other….and I know you mean well 🤗

I’ve seen pics in really old publications…back in Russell’s day…of a snake slithering up a tree and eating the fruit and turning into a wonderful looking man…..sort of made sense to me then and still does now ….

it’s both….he has a Plan….and he will execute with his wrath…that’s why Jesus will be back as a roaring lion… A good example of this is how he dealt with Sennacherib and Hezekiah Message Bible 2 Kings 19:25 ( I use the message Bible because it’s straight to the point ) Did it never occur to you that I’m behind all of this Long Long ago I DREW UP PLANS and now I’ve gone into ACTION Using you as a DOOMSDAY weapon reducing proud cities to piles of rubbish Leaving their people dispirited slumped shoulders limp souls useless as weeds fragile as grass unsubstantial as wind blown chaff. I know when you sit down and when you get up ( Sennacherib/ type of Satan )when you come and when you go. and yes I’ve marked everyone of of your tantrums against me It’s because of your temper tantrums against me It’s because of your temper your blasphemous foul temper That I’m putting my hook in your nose and my bit in your mouth and turning you back to where you come from. Jehovah has a Great Plan….at that appointed time ..at the right time….Jesus will ROAR….. Your questions Srecko can be found laid down in patterns of the Bible… but we will have to wait and see…we might get some surprises..only Jesus has the right to judge as to how to handle your question.

No Ditmar I don’t have fellowship with everyone here..I have blocked two who get their thoughts/ so called scriptural understandings directly from the demons..and I know that for a fact…having personal conversations with such over a decade ago…. you are and I understand why you converse with them….for the sake of others who may read their inaccuracies..I get that…and I think you and space Merchant have had some preety amazing conversations….with certain ones of which you both articulated far better than I would. You are not nobody..and I’m sorry if my words make you feel like that…but please…we all must recognize as witnesses we are not robots..we all have our own personalities…for many different reasons…some of us have been hurt badly but survived…some of us may not see things quiet the way you do…..for what ever reasons….the apostles didn’t always agree with each other…but had sharp bursts of anger…….all the best to you brother …

Well I dont know who is disfellowshipped on here and who isn’t…I might hazard a guess…but I dont have any concrete evidence …I have no proof of what it was supposed to be about…a lot of hearsay…and ..I’ve got to have more than that. I want FACTS…I want PROOF….have you got that? I dont even know who you are…I upvote you when you say things that I think right..i think you say a lot of things right……I don’t think I have ever downvoted any one…but I might have…but I doubt it..let me play the politican and say I dont recall….if I have.( that should cover my tracks for those who might go and search and find me guilty of it ) As far as I know ..you could be a fake witness….but I do apologize for mentioning your fruit-ages…that was out of line …so I’m sorry for that. Personally I cannot work JWI out..nor you…and hey..I think we are all a bit dodgy for even being on line…me too..😏

I’m hoping the fact that Jehovah interceded and did t let the Tower of Babel be finished also indicates he will do likewise with the UN….wait and see job i guess

Okay….nicely …..🙃..your both wrong and right…off course we beleive in the basic doctrines of what Russell understood from the scriptures and corrected…. …Gods kingdom plan… no trinity.. dead do not go to heaven.. the grave is hell… Jesus king of the Kingdom which he will hand back to his father when perfection has been achieved.. Having no part of the world. ..the 144,000 anointed are the first resurrection and will rule as kings alongside Jesus… there will be a great crowd who survive the tribulation. the soul is man in the flesh… we are awaiting Judgement day of a thousand years and the great resurrection over which Jesus will rule and organise…. How to pray… Those who do Not take the mark of the beast will be saved…faith in Jesus and baptism.. the preaching work must be done before the end Satan is a fallen angel with followers who rules the world at this time. As far as us changing thoughts..off course we have….Russell distributed food at the proper time..and it seems only at sufficient amounts that the world could consume at that time…he was fed gradually just as the apostles were fed. yes you are right about the new light and old light stuff…I’m not going to defend that…how can I !!, We have had good changes…and bad changes..some which then got changed back to what Russell first thought…and other changes that had to be changed because Russell had it wrong… We have had men go beyond the written word and put in their own interpretations….types and anti types..etc..and they have had to be acknowledged….we had to acknowledge and correct policies…we still dont have everything right and nor will we get it all right….and we will all hold a accounting before Jehovah… You know ….if I had been Uriah’s mother …I would have absolutely hated and despised with the greatest of loathing King David……I would have wanted ..no…I would have demanded him stoned to death as The Law stated….in my pain and grief…….now where do you think my righteous anger and my right-full demanding of justice would have left Jehovah’s great plan…..and that is what you are missing …..you are lacking the understanding of what Jehovah will put up with to accomplish his plan….and also his depth of mercy… So you and others come on forums and tear down..at times rightfully so…at times blatantly wrong…you really dont understand what you are doing because you see thru your eyes…mere human eyes…..thus incapable as to trying to see it thru Jehovah’s eyes of understanding …you cannot even work it out by the patterns laid out in the scriptures of how Jehovah’s people act and how he treats them. Five or six years ago a brother from bethel stated at an assembly that they were aware there were a lot of things wrong with the organization and they were trying to fix them but he didnt think they would be able to correct everything before the end… They Know Sereko..and Jehovah knows….now it’s time to trust in Jehovah…or do you think Jehovah cannot control his people…whom ever they are?

Can you explain this?…it’s a messy statement…and not really true…rather misleading actually…from what I’ve read they couldn’t go along with some of the changes Rutherford brought In…the one I’m thinking about is how he changed the understanding of the ARK representing Jesus ransom…to the earthly organization…and who can blame them for that…because that one thing led to a fair bit of dogmatism..and heavy handiness ….and was so totally wrong…..so I do get why they with drew away from what Rutherford was pushing….but I dont know that we have ever said we do not beleive what Bible students once believed…?? I read an account of one JW who was not happy with what was happening with in the org so he went to the Bible students..a few different ones..but said he found the same problems within them as he had found with us… I like all Bible students…the ones I’ve talked with are kind and generous people doing the best they can….they seem a bit loose on pagan holidays…sometimes I think…wrongly or rightly they are caught in a time warp of Russell’s full teachings…not realizing he was just coming out of BTG and tho used by Jehovah very greatly..along with his associates of that time period ..he and they never had the time and the time was not right for a fuller understanding of certain things…but he had a lot right..I admire him greatly…and I’m not saying we have everything right either…because we don’t!

Yeah that sounds more like it…my old memory constantly needs prodding and readjustment..thanks for that

No one is going to ridicule you..and you are big enough to to apologise…an admiral quality…..I vaguely remember the audience you speak of saying loudly NO…not sure if I read it or seen it on the net…but I think your wording may be wrong….wasn’t he correcting us about how we used to say we were a Jehovah Witness …???? ..we’ll anyway that’s how I remember it….

What a joke…listen…I’ve butted heads with JWI a few times but ..I have never seen him express anger…in Fact i would say as much as I’ve disagreed with him at times..his fruitages are finer than mine or yours …

Agreed!… Christ’s followers were confused a lot of the times…first when they went out on their first preaching missionary they taught and thought that Gods Kingdom had already come and Jesus was there to rule now….( wow that was misleading …and the thing was Jesus knew that but let them go on with it anyway)…..seems they got confused many times over Jesus and his actions…how on earth could he ever talk to the Samaritan woman..that was a big one…confusion over circumcising..confused over drinking Jesus blood and eating his flesh…and what of Peter renouncing Jesus three times..out of fear…all of them were confused and frightened on the night of Jesus and his betrayal….they scattered frightened and left him alone ..they never had a clue as to what was going on..yet he told them…they should have… And they fought amongst themselves and yelled at each other…brothers and sister of the anointed at that(…even after Jesus death and their anointing…) Yet they had the scriptures…they should have known …should have discerned what would happen to the coming Messiah….they lived with him..knew him In The flesh….he TOLD THEM….yet they abandoned him in his hour of need…confused …they didn’t understand anything!!! Yet who of us does not want to be like them…..Dmitar….why do you think Gods people will be any different in the time of the end …or at any time in the past…. Those men were constantly learning…failing ..enduring…growing in years and age as well as understandings…and probably the wisest they ever were was just before they died. But HE chose the foolish of the world, remembering they are but from dust and he keeps putting up with the weak earthly vessels…that are all cracked and flawed….so why do you expect such a high standard when HE knows it’s not possible . 1Cor 1:27 but God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong.

As far as I know I’ve never tried to defend the undefendable……which all religions are guilty of…yes as well as us….your blind to deep understandings serko ..and ones like you….it’s right there for you to read but you have to have insight…you have deceived yourself into thinking you are awake…and you genuinely believe what you feel ….like a sheep that has wandered into the wilderness only to be devoured by the beasts. where I did Joshua run to…where did Kaleb run to…did they run out and away from Gods people…. No..and they didn’t beat their fellow brothers and sisters either…they stood back…and waited for Moses ( Jesus ) to come back and clean the mess up..which he did. What the likes of you are doing is presumptuous…you think you can do the job that only Jesus can do….even the apostles never showed such self righteousness and presumptuousness as you are. When Jesus cleaned up the temple with a whip …did they step up with him and help him….no…because they had no right to….yet you think you are needed to straighten Us all out…. Gods people have always disappointed him down thru the ages..and he always disciplined them and corrected them….it’s not your job nor anyone else’s right to do that. what you are doing is what Jehovah HATES…and that is to cause divisions and doubts and to weaken one’s faith even in the creator…..how many have left the org and gone on to become atheists…or gone back to BTG…to the belief of the trinity and idol worship…..heaps sereko… Have you ever asked yourself if you have been guilty of extinguishing someone’s flickering flame …and been guilty of killing some one’s faith of entirely ….you want to be careful..because some one is watching the damage you do…and yes watching the damage we do….we all will be accountable.. Do I feel sad…..you bet!..I’ve had a lot of reasons to feel genuine righteous anger…but I don’t beat those around me who lack the insight I have had to dig deep to understand as to why such things happen… Your bitterness is your undoing…and until you master it…you will never get such insight as to why Jehovah allows the wrongs he does. YOU…are the one that was afraid of man…and others like you here…you bowed to their errors…..they broke you…because you don’t really know Jehovah and how he works and why he does certain things. YOU let them change you serko…..and you don’t even know the woe you are bringing on your own head because of what you and others here are trying to do. Your so full of self righteousness that you accuse us of… Moses is not the type of the GB..nor Arron of the helpers…. When some one stumbles serko….we pick them up…we carry them…we don’t beat them and endanger their faith…your ignorance is bathed in bitterness and blindness…..so therefore you cannot and will not ever see the pattern laid down of Gods people since their existence….nor how Jehovah deals with them.

Rubbish….what you have here are witnesses who do not worship the GB and can think for them selves yet still respect the GB in promoting and getting the basic plan that Jehovah’s has for the world out to the people. They make mistakes and some big ones at that…the disfellowshlpment over organ transplanting is one of them…. They make mistakes just like any other ancient Godly men of old…just like King David did….just like Moses did…just like Peter did…. we just do not panic and flee when we see these errors…something may stump us or rattle us…but maturity and understanding that Jehovah uses faulty men aids many of us to stay with in the camp boundaries…at that time we would not have hung around the mob that demanded the building of the golden calf…..as tempting as it may have been when one is in panic mode which is what they did. Im in..and mentally in as well…but I have always seen the GB down thru the ages are mere men who do make mistakes and are not actually inspired…so I and many others act like the beroeans did and check with the scriptures first … As to what happened to those that followed Aaron with the making of the golden calf….When Moses came back…he still gave them an option of standing beside him…before he ( Jehovah /Jesus) destroyed the rest who did not take him up on that offer….around 3,000 were destroyed…not a huge number compared to the millions that came out. That is a lesson for all witnesses today…not to leave the camp because of trouble with in it even if that trouble comes from someone as high up as the second man in charge as Arron was…..actually the first man in charge whilst Moses was absent…..a thought to ponder on… I’m not saying that there are not witnesses who do exactly as the GB always directs thinking it comes directly from Jehovah…because there are…but there are many who sit and listen and work things out for them selves…as we have here on this site….

When he said he’s made a ass of himself it was over a book he wrote…and I forget the actual heading but I’ll have a go st….then is finished the mystery or something like that…it was a study book….I remember the word mystery….and I also remember feeling thankful I wasn’t around at the time as it was a big book to study and then realize all that time and effort would have been wasted…that was the reason why he said that…..I’m not sure of anything else..other than his changes to so many of Russell’s thoughts….of which many as you say have been returned to…thank goodness! Things we’re rough back in those days…you should here of some of the stories from old Australian brothers and how they reacted to being banned….in the Second World War…a few physically tried to defend the KHs…..as they were being confiscated legally by the government.Those men back then built and payed for those halls…life was very hard then. Different era…different culture…tough people….probably had to be like that to survive those times….must say that was a nice post JWI

...... My first thought was wondering what the ellipses in the quote were leaving out, that it may have been taken completely out of an overall context. (I do not have the book "Reconciliation") Other than being completely false and embarrassingly wrong cosmology, any comments? Rutherford himself admitted he ..”had made a complete ass of himself over a lot of his writing..”….he was the one that changed the understanding of the ark representing or a type of Jesus….to representing the org……and if you stop and think about the ramifications by that it’s mind numbing…the GB has since changed it back to Russell’s understanding……but I give Rutherford great credit in getting us out of idolatry with the pagan celebrations…Jehovah puts up with a lot from ones he sees fit to use…..thank goodness !!!

Aaaaah…we’ll that’s a lesson learnt for me,..✌️

No need to ask anyone if they are a JW here…but you did…arauna is..it’s obvious to all..so why the need to insult her with that question. I dont ask space merchant as I know he isn’t….but I respect him and his beliefs…as far as I have seen he’s never insulted anyone…and I have learnt from him. Look Dmitar..you seem to have been around the forums before …you sound experienced enough…..and no…people here shouldn’t be rude and abnoxious…it’s not the Christian way….but we are all so imperfect…we are all battling our own weaknesses …which is why I stepped back as I can be just as bad and my fruit ages of the spirit were flying out the window..but hey…you have had a few digs yourself…your human… but why do you want to be included in this fold…but as you say…it’s an open forum…so good luck with it.

Are you one?….being a witness of the Almighty does not make us push overs..or doormats….I dont join in a lot here because it gets a bit childish ….but do not be mistaken Dmitar….Jesus is the Chief Commander of Jehovahs army…he trained and was with Joshua and Kaleb and their ilk to go in and slaughter men women and children and to do so without any compassion or sorrow….and he had good reasons for that tough seemingly cruel action….why are YOU here…if you are not JW…do you want to find error with us…..don’t bother….we have a massive amount of errors that have proven to be cruel and ruthless at times……I am not like some here who won’t acknowledge them….but…we also have much love and empathy…and the ONLY people that put Jehovahs name back on high where it belongs…however you want to pronounce it….they/we are also the only people that organized a massive preaching work at much effort and cost to get Jehovahs plan known and the hope out to the nations…..all that even with those massive errors…and just for that one fact alone…he will reward any….ANY…who have tried to do that……….so what is it you want from here….why are you here?

Yes you are right.

The majority of the scientific community are basically toeing the line or are genuinely ignorant due to the artfully contrived propaganda and the deliberate blocking of true science being spoken off. Dont use google or utube…they are useless and tools to the satanic agenda….you have to go to places like… BITCHUTE ….RUMBLE …NEW YOU TUBE … …BRIGHTON…there are many others but I can not keep up with them…..look for the specialists in the field of vaccinations ..science and medicine… A few names to give you a head start…. Geert Vandon Bosch…..this poor man is highly credentialed and a expert on vaccination….he’s also a very brave and principled man….what he foretold would happen has eventuates …my advice would be to watch all of his videos especially his first one … Dr Robert Malone….one of the creators of the MRNA vaxination pathways…again highly credentialed and brave man. Prof Delores Cahill… Dr David Martin….fascinating to listen to….on the patterns and vaccination laws etc…..personally I think he is in the genies category…tho I may not agree with some of his other topics..on this subject he is amazing with his knowledge Catherine Austin Dr Richard Fleming…. Dr Peter Mc Cullough….incredibly brave and highly credentialed in a number of fields .. Judy Mikovitis….very brave woman… Dr Mike Yeardon….very highly specialized and very brave man…..as he said..we are standing at the gates of hell! You will see some of these men just break down and cry..due to the implications this is having on mankind and them being gagged as to getting it out to the population. You may already know all of these and researched them yourselves….I’m don’t mean to assume you haven’t…sp please don’t be offended …but this is just scratching the surface of the MOST HIGHLY SPECIALIZED EDUCATED SCIENTIST speaking out but are being deliberately silenced and gagged by others working for the dark side… remember they don’t all agree with each other over every detail …nor do I…but on the main points and basic facts…and science they all are in agreance with…the implications for mankind is terrifying… Indeed looking at it from a cold hearted unemotional stand..it has been a master stroke ..a undeniable genius act or war strategy by Satan….

Australian politicians have openly stated we are in the New world Order….and also in a three year trial with this vaccination…( which isn’t a vaccination at all ) .we are now waiting to see if this bill will pass in the upper house…which gives the Victorian premier dictatorship powers….then each state will acquire the same powers ….the people are rising up in the tens of thousands…and the government are goading the people to attack… It feels like we are living in the movie Green Solvent….and yes I agree with you about the s protein….but comfort comes knowing it’s Bible prophecy playing out …

It has to be…The Old World Order is dying …thus making way for The New World Order…