Thinking

I’m not having a shot at you ..and I know you didn’t do this ..(and I’m going to address this to all brothers and sisters here)......but to post a brother or anyone’s photo up without absolute bullet proof evidence.. ...something just of the internet is incredibly serious....this is not how Jehovah handles his judicial matters at all...so why are we all talking on this with out evidence.... Personally I would think the moderator better jump on this...and those of us that claim to be one of Jehovah’s Witnesses better pull our heads in and shut our mouths.....remember how Jehovah acts on such incidences and not judge a matter before all the evidence has been gathered.... I have seen what false accusations or misunderstood trials etc has done to a man...and woman...it’s absolutely cruel...and if a person is guilty...then same thing applies... If this brother did this...then let the courts handle it...and we mind our own businesses ...we DO NOT KNOW THE CIRCUMSTANCES OR DETAILS... This sort of thing puts this forum down In to the gutter PROVERBS 18:13 NLV Sprouting off before listening to the facts is both shameful and foolish Message Bible ...Proverbs 18:13 Answering before listening is both stupid and rude.

I know a number of people who have been convicted and later proved to be innocent...I don’t know what is going on here...and I’m not going to comment on this because I don’t have proof of anything....it seems he has yet to go to trial???....

Take heart you are not alone with your boggled mind.....Jehovah’s people have never got it all right at any given time he has had a people...why expect it of today? Your/our confusion is just a testing of our faith...so don’t feel bad about it...

Thank you brother for your posts....and I hope you are coping okay in your old age home and they are treating you well. wow to think you are on line and speaking here and still encouraging others is so very much appreciated...I wish I could sit and have coffee with you...I deeply appreciate ones like you..so very very encouraging...keep well brother...and may we meet one day in that New World ....

I think two reasons...one for protection of the sheep...and one for their own protection. True apostates are devious and incredibly selfish...con men and women who speak artfully contrived things and aid in scattering the sheep who are already beaten down and wounded,....Apostates were stumbled..and need to have ones think like them to justify their stumbling. Keep in mind many who are branded Apostates are not True apostates...I’m talking about True Apostates here, Secondly They truly have been used by Jehovah in advancing Gods work and knowledge of his Great Plan....BUT....pride and humility And abuse of such a position may also prove to be their stumbling stone...

Great common sense post...

Can I ask what the book was called..I would be interested in it ...

Well you are funny as well..and witty I’m sure if we were all in the same cong we would get on great...🤗

King David lacked the mental in ability to admit he was wrong....and he was purposely devious...and dishonest....and he absolutely wanted to keep his reputation intact....so now we judge Rolf and condemn him ...let’s leave it with Jehovah....take what we know to be true...think whatever on the rest...but don’t assassinate his character..unless you are prepared to do the same to King David....to my knowledge he’s not the only one thinking that about the creative days...I’ve heard it on the grapevine before,,,, no one has got it all right...not yet anyway,,,,

Aaah Tom you talk a lot..you have a lot of words.....and you at times come over as a bit self righteous...why did I chose thinking,,,not for the reasons you so wrongly presume....thinking was ..because I simply often dont know...what to think...is this right...is that right?...is he right...what if I’ve got it wrong?..Am I leaning on my own understanding??....always thinking..because I cannot afford not to...not having your confidence and assurity of one self...so alas..as old as I am...I have to keep thinking...to make sure...You are to cocky Tom...too self assured....but hey...every Congs got one.... If you read his book he clearly explains he spoke up because of the many who were disfellowshipped wrongly ...he had first hand experience ....and there was a lot of truth in this section of his book. there were other reasons also...but that one stood out to me the most... I guess he fell on his sword because he felt it was the right thing to do basically..he is getting old..his time is short...maybye there are other reasons..but I don’t know the brother myself..not personally. ive never spoken to him...never watched him with other brothers and sisters...I have not read his other books....but that would prove nothing....Personally I think he would have done more good staying with in the cong..But he must have thought speaking up was worth the sacrifice. your on a forum..I’m on a forum...JWI is on a forum...Billy the kid is on the forum.....but that’s okay...our sin is not as big as Rolfs sin after all...Is it?....ours is just a little sin...so we should be right....after all...a forum is different to writing a book isn’t it....Rolf did on a big scale what we do on a small scale... you gotta give it to him...he had more guts than me and nearly everyone else on this forum...name and picture up for all to see.... we all use monikers ( not you ) because we know very well if we published our names and pictures we would be marked or out in that back room like jack flash. we have been warned from the platform about forums...when we had meetings...I have anyway.... thats one point he was making in the book... I totally agree with you that all the scholarly knowledge means nothing with out the basic love...And words are just as useless with out love too....Now I’m writing a novel...picking up your bad habit I think 😉

A lot of what he said was true...I have yet to study his book...and I will....I have read it...but quickly in some parts. But i will make a study of it....which actually requires pulling some things apart and it is worthwhile doing that because that’s how one learns.....and I may disagree with some of the scriptural things he said....and as I said I agree with him on some things already...more than likely I will simply not understand one way or another... on some subjects...but does that make me narcissistic???. I don’t have any problems with 607...and yes I’ve read Olaf and many others who believe as you do....personally I don’t understand your belief...but that is your right to have that belief....and I respect that,

Yes you are right...you are wrong

I remember this but that date seems to be way off from my recollections??? it affected a few of us in the cong...then again maybe it was a second letter re-emphasising their stand on a persistent practise.?

Yes I knew where he got that from and the point wasn’t missed...too sad...and I hope I’m wrong....dam ..I hope I’m wrong...

You make me sick...you have shown your real core to everyone here....a man puts up what could be his eulogy to all..and you post up something to promote your belief...you try to score a point....you are ruthless and cruel..and so are some others here....you have shown the whole forum what condition your heart is...How about showing a little common decency..and some respect....you disgust me as a human.. Unbelievable!!!

I feel nothing but sadness over this...I actually feel sick....I don’t know his past as most of you all do here..but I could see that obviously he had been hurt and badly disappointed in things he had witnessed and experienced or heard..that goes on InThe Org. I hope sincerely he does not become brother watchtower ....Because we don’t follow watchtower...no matter what others say....or try to infer on many of us here. I believe he had a genuine heart. I also hope he has left to do as you think he has ...and he isn’t dying !!!. I would also like to point out what Bro. David Splane from the GB said at our Melbourne assembly I can only paraphrase it from memory. (There are brothers and sisters who have been hurt with in the org....and we may have to allow them and put up with ...WILD TALK....from them...it’s part of their healing..). He was mocked a lot and some down right cruel comments thrown his way ....I actually was surprised at how well he took it......I hope he comes back for selfish reasons...but for his sake....he would probably be safer and more content And remain faithful by going into his interior room until the denunciation has passed over.

I am truly saddened by this....I hope you are okay brother and you have been a great encouragement...because even tho you were obviously hurt with in the truth....you never lost your genuine love for your God Jehovah...and you underestimate your faith...faith is easy when it has not been beaten,,,,but to still have faith when you have been beaten and lay wounded.....that’s real faith...and it would be a honour to have served shoulder to shoulder with you. I don’t know what’s going on..but I sincerely hope you are reasonably well....and a huge thank you from me....for being REAL !!!!!!

Thanks I have been able to get hold of them...big read ahead I suppose

Can I ask what your thoughts and summary were of these books as I cannot get them in Australia...

No one can know who is anointed or not...that is between Jehovah and them... It’s one of the reasons you would be a fool to worship the GB...never alone the clear scriptural warnings against it. The organization exists as a tool to get the basic preaching work done....and just as there was a Judas working alongside of the apostles and worked with Jesus....so too there will be a Judas element at the top..... who ever Gods people are...and where ever they are. It Is true what you say...Moses was known when he was born and Jehovah intended to use him in his assignment...but he was still a murderer before he took up that assignment ... Time will sort many of us out......you are actually incredibly self righteous and have marked so many of us...unjustly so.......and you don’t even know that is what you are doing. instead why not try to develop the attitude that Paul had....because only Jesus is going to correct the errors that you see...and that we see also...and the confusions . Keep in mind he was talking to Gods People here...followers of Christ... why do you think it will be any different today? Phillipians 1:15,18 NIV It is true that some preach Christ out of envy and rivalry, but others out of goodwill. The latter do so out of love, knowing that I am put here for the defence of the gospel. the former preach Christ out of selfish ambition not sincerely, supposing that tthey can stir up trouble for me while I am in my chains. BUT WHAT DOES IT MATTER the important thing is that in every way, wether from FALSE motives or TRUE Christ is preached . And because of this I rejoice. Yes and I will continue to rejoice. By The way even sporting organisations have a Governing Body to organise their body of members... And our GB will stand before their God for accountability just as you and I will....or do you not trust Jehovah to be fair and Just?

How does this make any sense to average jws? ............................ Try not to underestimate the Average JWs....many have and are working things out...but they are also working out some things that others here are not... the thing you have to remember....is Jehovah will and always has disciplined his chosen men in authority over his people... 1) Moses ...he was a murderer before he was ever given his assignment....and at nearing the end of their journey...due to such a heavy load upon him and stresses that none of us could bear...he actually became self righteous and proud..and I am imagining that attitude would not have happened over night or just when he walked and stood before the Rock.. all Jehovah told Moses To do was to SPEAK to the rock...but no...Moses first yelled abuse at the people.( I dont really blame him but he was not ordered to do that ) he had no right to do that. And Moses becoming full of himself and his importance ( pride ) he felt HE had to do MORE than what was asked of him. He struck the rock ..not once...but his personal decision and leaning on his own Underderstanding and reasonings...he struck TWICE..because he deemed the stupid people needed that..( do you or have you ever felt that the GB have beaten you with their rod ) ...and then he gathered the miracle to himself by saying .. SHALL WE....As we all know it had nothing to do with him..but everything to do with Jehovah...( he took the glory to himself and ignored Jehovah ) now we all know he was disciplined very harshly later for that but what most miss...and this is a very important point...is Jehovah still expected the People to follow his instructions that he gave to Moses.....he STILL USED the about to be disciplined Moses....and he EXPECTED the people to follow those instructions ...because they never came from Moses but Him. yes Jehovah allowed Mosses to sin...as he did Aaron...as he did King David...and countless others he used.........because there is no human that can rule over or govern his people on this earth..and he knew that all along...he knew whoever takes authoritarian position over his gathered people will commit such grave errors.. yet he still expected the people to stay together......but he expects us to work these things out...to reason on why he allows these things... Moses didn’t trust Jehovah enough to just speak... Jehovahs approach was much more gentle and kind to the Israelites ...take your rod, assemble the people and speak to the rock. Moses was rather bombastic Prideful and harsh and he did it His way... Numbers 20:24 Because you rebelled against MY Command at the waters of Meribah you will not enter into the land for which I have given to the sons of Israel. Imagine that....calling and accusing Moses and Aaron of being Rebels and yet it was Moses and Aaron who accused the people of being rebels ... Numbers 20:10 .....hear now YOU REBELS the point being is Jehovah will always discipline those he allows authority and those who claim to have it.... yet he still loved Moses very much and even after death..Jesus safeguarded his bones .... Until MOSES death he still expected the people to follow his instructions...as his job was still yet to be completed....nobody fled the camp after Moses verbal abuse of them or harsh display of frustration and piety....they stayed...and trusted Jehovah..to handle the situation.. so too today...we must trust that Jehovah knows what he is doing... Soon we will cross over Into that New Land....and as Joshua/ typifying Jesus led the people..into the land flowing with milk and honey........so to will Jesus....lead those who prove faithfull. Yes it’s excruciating at times..but the night is well along...and the day will soon break forth....

@James Thomas Rook Jr. it is one of my greatest laments also....and now it will be done in fear sadly

Yes it’s very very interesting isn’t it ...

James he is the creator of the Law...without him no law....no creation...no mankind... as such he can decide who’s life to end and who’s not to because they are not following his Laws. Thus the lawmaker has the right to take a life without it being classified as murder, You yourself have used many words to ask a question which really as someone pointed out to you... answered yourself...which leaves me laughing at myself for being so crazy to reply to this thread...but it is a question that others have asked so I’ve gleaned from others here on how to help someone who has the same question. Job 37:23 Understanding the Almighty is beyond our reach He is great in Power and he never violates his justice and abundant righteousness. But you already knew all this didn’t you.

They have brother...and it shouldn’t require to much insight to see that...perhaps you may need to rephrase the question