Thinking

The Presence of the Son of of Man began in 1914. "For nation will rise against nation and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be food shortages and earthquakes in one place after another.  All these things are a beginning of pangs of distress." (Matthew 24:7-8)
"For just as the lightning comes out of the east and shines over to the west, so the Presence of the Son of man will be." (Matthew 24:27) Are you gaining the understanding that these things are fulfilled in a Spiritual Manner? Ever since 1914, right-hearted ones have been witnessing the Presence of the Son of man. After 2034, the wicked will also start to gain the understanding that they are really dying and lament all the way to everlasting destruction.   As the Last Days come to their conclusion and the seperating work is completed, even the wicked will SEE but after it is too late! Yes, the Revealing of the Son of Man will soon begin for the 'ungodly' as we head into Christ Millennial Reign.   Read more...

Some just never see it…maybye a good cong or such things are not obvious….believe me there are a lot of us survivors in my neck of the woods so take heart ..that you may be one of them….big victory brother ..bigger than you realise…

Even Franz who wrote the book Crisis of conscience…stated clearly on a utube interview he did not think JWs had any more of a problem with this than  any other faith.

Some just never see it…maybye a good cong or such things are not obvious….believe me there are a lot of us survivors in my neck of the woods so take heart ..that you may be one of them….big victory brother ..bigger than you realise…

There is…nobody should be beaten..not spiritually  or emotionally….but it does and has happened and if anyone says that not true then they are either lying or have genuinely never seen it or experienced it….beleive it or not but there really are some good congs who don’t ..and there are some appalling ones who do….
We are not door mats..tho many things can be excused as normal common human responses and we need to forgive or just not take notice of some things…as many many times I have experienced such forgiveness also from my brothers and sister.
Yet there are things that at times one must stand up like David did when facing Goliath…and it’s not pleasant…it’s not nice…and blood symbolically speaking may be shed…even doing it the right way ..the theocratic way…this will still happen.
1) You take your complaint and  lie it before the Court  of the God of Justice first…number one thing to do…
2) Make sure your written formal letters is addressed to Elders Co then the Branch and the GB…apparently then those who it is addressed are forced to read it. Write your letter well and only once…as Jehovah has it in his Justice  court.
3) Be respectful and not a smart….but be blunt and to the point…and do not skirt any emotional trauma…right from the heart…use only a few scriptures…( very important as they don’t have time to read novels ) lay it all out on the ground…the truth and even the ugly parts..and personal faults as well.
Give it directly to your CO…they then must then Handle it theocratically..keep a copy….then muster up your strength to go back to those meetings …DONT…DONT EVER Let them chase YOU away from amongst Gods people…YOU FIGHT your spiritual fight..just as you had to when in the world.
Give up any hope of ever hearing again from your letter….it will never happen….no apology…as if it was never written.
This is hard to take…but don’t let those guilty change your Personality…fight your own inclination to become resentful and bitter ..it took me two years and at times I still battle it.
Consider Joesph and  his battle In getting justice..8-10 yrs his cries went un heard..are you any better than him..I know I’m not.
one has to learn a new humility as Joesph did…unfair treatment…down right server injustice with blatant lies involved…lack of loyalty and a trusted friendship ruined…some dont like to hear this but it happens in the truth as well…
My experience took the greatest toll as a mother….and yes I’m still a bit cynical which I hate…as I was never like that before…it’s hard…but with Jehovah’s help it’s doeable….and most of the brothers and sisters are loving and kind …some are not..and I dont mix with them…my motto is..if you don’t build me up but tear me down stay the h…..away from me…and yes I slip back into the bitterness at times…it’s a hard fight they put on you…and then  Jehovah reminds me of my considerable errors..and I am shamed and humbled.
Did I  get justice…sort off… not what I wanted….elders were removed…( it took two long years ) three years latter a assembly the last talk was given by a bethel brother and it was absolutely scathing on the elders and those in positions of authority….he got the cat of nine tails out on them and beat them over and over……I was stunned.and had tears running down my face…..and at times I felt for them…I watched them as they sat thru that…..I don’t feel sorry for them anymore as you never get an apology….you never get  …do you want to talk over a coffee……you get grunts when you humbly say hello to the….well I tried all that lovey dovey stuff and it didnt work so I don t waste my time with them anymore…..even Jesus say you have to repent to be forgiven…
If you have been wronged and I’m talking severely wronged….after the shock wears off ….TAKE YOU STAND….and then leave it and try to let it go…or put it on the back burner or find another cong and move.
As to Bro Morris’s 111….he’s not my favourite speaker …but In Fairness he didn’t laugh over one’s dying his little laugh or smirk was the match acted like a little unexpected firecracker before it blew out….fairs fair…
I loved Dan Sydlick…..but he wasnt perfect…a little on the chauvinistic side…he gave great talks but one talk he introduced himself saying he never had children …but he’s got a wife…and I guess that’s like having a child…..I remembered I   cried out ..whoooooah..and so did the audience…you could hear them..but he was a genuinely warm loving brother and we easily forgot his blunder…not sure if his wife did tho…lol….. …
Just don’t let them make you angry and resentful….then Satan has got what he wants..Jehovah will deal with all of us eventually ….and kindness may even be shown to these ones….so don’t be a victim…be a soldier  of a Christ and stand up to the serious  wrongs…with out hatred and remember Jehovah know the full story.
Our whole cong changed but it too, two years of facing those men…I don’t call them brothers…I wouldn’t even look at them when they had their parts…and blocked my ears at their voices ….and read my Bible…I got anxiety at these times…my heart beat faster…and I felt sickly…it was like torture..and I would silently say to Jehovah in a heated voice,,,this isn’t fair, how much longer do you expect me to last!!!!
The truth is I really wanted to get up and smash them one….should I have been a brother…I would have been prepared for jail time and disfellowshippement  over that,….such was the pain and mental torture…but I had to not behave as I wanted and act before Jehovah in a judicial matter…
I don’t know what it was like in the 1950s….do tell more …
 

There is…nobody should be beaten..not spiritually  or emotionally….but it does and has happened and if anyone says that not true then they are either lying or have genuinely never seen it or experienced it….beleive it or not but there really are some good congs who don’t ..and there are some appalling ones who do….
We are not door mats..tho many things can be excused as normal common human responses and we need to forgive or just not take notice of some things…as many many times I have experienced such forgiveness also from my brothers and sister.
Yet there are things that at times one must stand up like David did when facing Goliath…and it’s not pleasant…it’s not nice…and blood symbolically speaking may be shed…even doing it the right way ..the theocratic way…this will still happen.
1) You take your complaint and  lie it before the Court  of the God of Justice first…number one thing to do…
2) Make sure your written formal letters is addressed to Elders Co then the Branch and the GB…apparently then those who it is addressed are forced to read it. Write your letter well and only once…as Jehovah has it in his Justice  court.
3) Be respectful and not a smart….but be blunt and to the point…and do not skirt any emotional trauma…right from the heart…use only a few scriptures…( very important as they don’t have time to read novels ) lay it all out on the ground…the truth and even the ugly parts..and personal faults as well.
Give it directly to your CO…they then must then Handle it theocratically..keep a copy….then muster up your strength to go back to those meetings …DONT…DONT EVER Let them chase YOU away from amongst Gods people…YOU FIGHT your spiritual fight..just as you had to when in the world.
Give up any hope of ever hearing again from your letter….it will never happen….no apology…as if it was never written.
This is hard to take…but don’t let those guilty change your Personality…fight your own inclination to become resentful and bitter ..it took me two years and at times I still battle it.
Consider Joesph and  his battle In getting justice..8-10 yrs his cries went un heard..are you any better than him..I know I’m not.
one has to learn a new humility as Joesph did…unfair treatment…down right server injustice with blatant lies involved…lack of loyalty and a trusted friendship ruined…some dont like to hear this but it happens in the truth as well…
My experience took the greatest toll as a mother….and yes I’m still a bit cynical which I hate…as I was never like that before…it’s hard…but with Jehovah’s help it’s doeable….and most of the brothers and sisters are loving and kind …some are not..and I dont mix with them…my motto is..if you don’t build me up but tear me down stay the h…..away from me…and yes I slip back into the bitterness at times…it’s a hard fight they put on you…and then  Jehovah reminds me of my considerable errors..and I am shamed and humbled.
Did I  get justice…sort off… not what I wanted….elders were removed…( it took two long years ) three years latter a assembly the last talk was given by a bethel brother and it was absolutely scathing on the elders and those in positions of authority….he got the cat of nine tails out on them and beat them over and over……I was stunned.and had tears running down my face…..and at times I felt for them…I watched them as they sat thru that…..I don’t feel sorry for them anymore as you never get an apology….you never get  …do you want to talk over a coffee……you get grunts when you humbly say hello to the….well I tried all that lovey dovey stuff and it didnt work so I don t waste my time with them anymore…..even Jesus say you have to repent to be forgiven…
If you have been wronged and I’m talking severely wronged….after the shock wears off ….TAKE YOU STAND….and then leave it and try to let it go…or put it on the back burner or find another cong and move.
As to Bro Morris’s 111….he’s not my favourite speaker …but In Fairness he didn’t laugh over one’s dying his little laugh or smirk was the match acted like a little unexpected firecracker before it blew out….fairs fair…
I loved Dan Sydlick…..but he wasnt perfect…a little on the chauvinistic side…he gave great talks but one talk he introduced himself saying he never had children …but he’s got a wife…and I guess that’s like having a child…..I remembered I   cried out ..whoooooah..and so did the audience…you could hear them..but he was a genuinely warm loving brother and we easily forgot his blunder…not sure if his wife did tho…lol….. …
Just don’t let them make you angry and resentful….then Satan has got what he wants..Jehovah will deal with all of us eventually ….and kindness may even be shown to these ones….so don’t be a victim…be a soldier  of a Christ and stand up to the serious  wrongs…with out hatred and remember Jehovah know the full story.
Our whole cong changed but it too, two years of facing those men…I don’t call them brothers…I wouldn’t even look at them when they had their parts…and blocked my ears at their voices ….and read my Bible…I got anxiety at these times…my heart beat faster…and I felt sickly…it was like torture..and I would silently say to Jehovah in a heated voice,,,this isn’t fair, how much longer do you expect me to last!!!!
The truth is I really wanted to get up and smash them one….should I have been a brother…I would have been prepared for jail time and disfellowshippement  over that,….such was the pain and mental torture…but I had to not behave as I wanted and act before Jehovah in a judicial matter…
I don’t know what it was like in the 1950s….do tell more …
 

Thank you.

Now that is SA humor!

There is…nobody should be beaten..not spiritually  or emotionally….but it does and has happened and if anyone says that not true then they are either lying or have genuinely never seen it or experienced it….beleive it or not but there really are some good congs who don’t ..and there are some appalling ones who do….
We are not door mats..tho many things can be excused as normal common human responses and we need to forgive or just not take notice of some things…as many many times I have experienced such forgiveness also from my brothers and sister.
Yet there are things that at times one must stand up like David did when facing Goliath…and it’s not pleasant…it’s not nice…and blood symbolically speaking may be shed…even doing it the right way ..the theocratic way…this will still happen.
1) You take your complaint and  lie it before the Court  of the God of Justice first…number one thing to do…
2) Make sure your written formal letters is addressed to Elders Co then the Branch and the GB…apparently then those who it is addressed are forced to read it. Write your letter well and only once…as Jehovah has it in his Justice  court.
3) Be respectful and not a smart….but be blunt and to the point…and do not skirt any emotional trauma…right from the heart…use only a few scriptures…( very important as they don’t have time to read novels ) lay it all out on the ground…the truth and even the ugly parts..and personal faults as well.
Give it directly to your CO…they then must then Handle it theocratically..keep a copy….then muster up your strength to go back to those meetings …DONT…DONT EVER Let them chase YOU away from amongst Gods people…YOU FIGHT your spiritual fight..just as you had to when in the world.
Give up any hope of ever hearing again from your letter….it will never happen….no apology…as if it was never written.
This is hard to take…but don’t let those guilty change your Personality…fight your own inclination to become resentful and bitter ..it took me two years and at times I still battle it.
Consider Joesph and  his battle In getting justice..8-10 yrs his cries went un heard..are you any better than him..I know I’m not.
one has to learn a new humility as Joesph did…unfair treatment…down right server injustice with blatant lies involved…lack of loyalty and a trusted friendship ruined…some dont like to hear this but it happens in the truth as well…
My experience took the greatest toll as a mother….and yes I’m still a bit cynical which I hate…as I was never like that before…it’s hard…but with Jehovah’s help it’s doeable….and most of the brothers and sisters are loving and kind …some are not..and I dont mix with them…my motto is..if you don’t build me up but tear me down stay the h…..away from me…and yes I slip back into the bitterness at times…it’s a hard fight they put on you…and then  Jehovah reminds me of my considerable errors..and I am shamed and humbled.
Did I  get justice…sort off… not what I wanted….elders were removed…( it took two long years ) three years latter a assembly the last talk was given by a bethel brother and it was absolutely scathing on the elders and those in positions of authority….he got the cat of nine tails out on them and beat them over and over……I was stunned.and had tears running down my face…..and at times I felt for them…I watched them as they sat thru that…..I don’t feel sorry for them anymore as you never get an apology….you never get  …do you want to talk over a coffee……you get grunts when you humbly say hello to the….well I tried all that lovey dovey stuff and it didnt work so I don t waste my time with them anymore…..even Jesus say you have to repent to be forgiven…
If you have been wronged and I’m talking severely wronged….after the shock wears off ….TAKE YOU STAND….and then leave it and try to let it go…or put it on the back burner or find another cong and move.
As to Bro Morris’s 111….he’s not my favourite speaker …but In Fairness he didn’t laugh over one’s dying his little laugh or smirk was the match acted like a little unexpected firecracker before it blew out….fairs fair…
I loved Dan Sydlick…..but he wasnt perfect…a little on the chauvinistic side…he gave great talks but one talk he introduced himself saying he never had children …but he’s got a wife…and I guess that’s like having a child…..I remembered I   cried out ..whoooooah..and so did the audience…you could hear them..but he was a genuinely warm loving brother and we easily forgot his blunder…not sure if his wife did tho…lol….. …
Just don’t let them make you angry and resentful….then Satan has got what he wants..Jehovah will deal with all of us eventually ….and kindness may even be shown to these ones….so don’t be a victim…be a soldier  of a Christ and stand up to the serious  wrongs…with out hatred and remember Jehovah know the full story.
Our whole cong changed but it too, two years of facing those men…I don’t call them brothers…I wouldn’t even look at them when they had their parts…and blocked my ears at their voices ….and read my Bible…I got anxiety at these times…my heart beat faster…and I felt sickly…it was like torture..and I would silently say to Jehovah in a heated voice,,,this isn’t fair, how much longer do you expect me to last!!!!
The truth is I really wanted to get up and smash them one….should I have been a brother…I would have been prepared for jail time and disfellowshippement  over that,….such was the pain and mental torture…but I had to not behave as I wanted and act before Jehovah in a judicial matter…
I don’t know what it was like in the 1950s….do tell more …
 

Even Franz who wrote the book Crisis of conscience…stated clearly on a utube interview he did not think JWs had any more of a problem with this than  any other faith.

Wow!  

Prove the 15 percent and show the other 95% that you deem unfit to contemplate.

Pudgy is merely an affectionate literary device, like “BLACK BEAUTY”, the novel, being told from the perspective of the horse.
As have stated before, over an over and over here, for perhaps nine years, that I consider Jehovah’s Witnesses right only 15% of the time …… but WHICH 15% make all the difference.
For perhaps nine years I have constantly challenged all comers to show me something better, and ALL HAVE FAILED TO DO SO.
Humans, all humans, are “just ugly bags of mostly water” And are prone to all manner of failures and faults, and so are you and I .
If it wasn’t for Jehovah’s Witnesses my entire life would have been much worse, and I may have killed innocent people in Vietnam, the Congo, the Middle East, or Peru.
I have no fear of death, because I never expected to live past my 40’s, so “theocratic” Boogyman threats, and even directed gunfire I find silly, not scary.
It is YOU, PwfT, that are half afraid JWS MAY BE RIGHT, not me.
That is why you continue to hang out here.
My estimation is that they are right 15% of the time …… in a world where all the others are so much worse.
When a person is afraid of dying, there begins the search for comforting lies.

I have it on good authority that he should be.

laughing?  You know, my husband says: There is nothing so democratic as the presence of sin in every person. That is why it is so important to be close to god, be humble, and work on yourself every day. 
While I agree, one can be naïve regarding human wickedness - there is nothing as good as being taught by Jehovah and having the fear of Him. This alone keeps one on the straight and narrow and helps one to maintain godly devotion.
Rejecting the only organization which tries to maintain cleanliness (pure worship) according to Jehovah's standards - that is true naivety. You see, while we cannot expect perfection from all brothers ( due to imperfection), we do well to expect them to keep the congregation clean of people who can wreck the faith of others or bring the leaven in. 

Yes, I know, Pudg, but it appears that’s the way it is and always has been, even in the first century, and you should try to get your head around it. Pray to God for intervention and he says, “I’ve got people who handle that stuff.” Point out to him that some of those people are pieces of work, and he says, ‘Well—you’re no cream puff yourself. Do you have any idea how much you try me? You’ll just have to work it out.”
I say ‘always has been’ because the Bible does not celebrate the ‘free speech’ that is axiomatic in the West. Sometimes it celebrates shutting people up. Certain ones have to be muzzled because they are stumbling entire households. The tongue is even more damaging than actions since ‘see—how little a member can set the whole forest ablaze.’ Few actions you could do will have that effect. Even if you chased after the lithe and tantalizing young prostitutes of Thailand like Lloyd it would not have that effect.
So you do well to practice self-control, and chalk certain things up to discipline, even if they weren’t meant that way. Sort of like the kid Mark Twain wrote about who complained to his dad about getting punished for something he didn’t do. Well, the old man replied, in that case its for something you did do for which you should have got punished but didn’t.
Strictly speaking, the statement is not even true, though it certainly is true by Western standards where people argue their grievance to the nth degree and don’t give up until the other side is bludgeoned submission, and since that doesn’t happen, they don’t give up. You get to blow off steam but little more is accomplished. Come come. We must not be like the obstinate politician who just prior to hanging is asked if he has any last words. “Yes! This is unacceptable!” he cries, as the trap door swings open and the rope snaps taut.
I suspect there’s a small local consortium of those who know you personally who hold you in high regard as they should—upholder of justice, defender of the widow, the downtrodden, and so forth. But online it takes some time to realize you’re not a spiritual terrorist. You might be better striving to be one of those ‘watchtower brothers’ you once said your life would have turned out better had you been one of them. Strive to be ‘one of the boys’ and from that position influence them to be better. You piss away your talents making common cause with ones who are resolutely opposed to the 15% you cherish. I mean, the day one of these characters likes a post of mine, I will take it as time to do a swan dive off the Golden Gate Bridge.
 

You have no proof of that number - it is merely an accusation. since 1957 until the Australian commission there were slightly more than ONE thousand names...... cases where there were accusations made. So yes, there may be more but not to the extend you are wildly accusing of.... in your mind every JW is a criminal ready to commit a ' porneia' act.
Also, in your accusative frame of mind you try to pretend that porneia is accepted as part of JW teachings - which is a blatant lie!  
Who is the fibber here ?   Does your false accusations make you righteous before god? Does your false teachings make you more righteous with god?  or are you just a hateful person taking out your gall on JWs here, with NO hope of eternal life yourself.  Many people choose to become opposers instead of showing repentance. 

I just rope-a-dope and ignore any counsel I don't think applies or is unscriptural and keep the aforementioned reaction  to myself. I had young brothers coming to me to confess that they'd seen a boob on the internet, I asked one "So what do you want me to do about it? Just stop doing that. Maybe meditate on where staring at boobs got King David and realize going down that path leads to nothing good."

Thinking up votes 
him because he’s encouraging and often seems to reflect Russell’s views,..of which I hope come about as they are kinder ….and if some people cannot accept Jehovah’s patience as Bro Rando explains …. what do you expect Jehovah to do with them,,,….and he’s very brave in his faith to write before fools such as you..I think you have a sick problem you may be projecting on to him…..Go Bro Brando …keep up the fine work…none of us have everything right…and I’m sure we will be In  for some surprises….

My observation was about you, PwfT, being unfair and slanderous to BroRando, not about what TTH said.
Instead of apologizing, you made excuses.
 

Come, come, don’t gloat over an absentminded typo. You are not PSomH. She has many times said her eyesight is terrible.
If I had been saved from massive bloodguilt and my entire life been markedly improved, I would not continually find cause to bite the hand that fed me.

With regards to the above - I find ex-witnesses love to gloat over any form of negative news or findings regarding JWs.
They are losing sight of this:  Authorities are letting violent criminals out of jail at present because they are not supposed to be 'confined' ; or..... they are from one of the minority groups which cannot ever be deemed criminal or racist but are criminal due to their social conditions or the past racism towards them or... some other made-up philosophy .  All kinds of wickedness is now tolerated as long as the perpetrators profess the new transgender values and the new warped sexual values as acceptable; justice is no longer justice but targeted to achieve the new goals.
In this kind of environment "everything" (meaning every deviation) is acceptable to the majority...except a clean condition before Jehovah.  Do you not think this is by Satan's design in the system he is running?  Do you not think this will become worse and JWs will eventually be persecuted as prophesied?
Yes- JWs are very flawed as people but very few of us have criminal inclinations........... So ask yourself the question.
Whose side are you on?  The good and bad values of Jehovah or your own. Take into consideration that this was the original sin:  Adam rejected the "good and bad" of Jehovah and chose his own values.  In this system you will eventually be forced to except the values of the system.  There are just two sides:  Human government and its values or Jehovah and his values.

“Insults are the first and last resorts of cowards, and the incompetent”. -  somebody famous. 

1. Mass
2. Black Mass
You have presented no evidence to stand on…. roughly the equivalent of stating that the horse Mr. Ed lives on Mars. Two more False assumptions…. Unless you can provide HARD actual real EVIDENCE.
3. Yes, they do pass the Emblems. Christ’s sacrifice extends to all people of faith, no matter how they fail. That is the whole point.
I attended disfellowshipped for four years, and passed the Emblems, just like anyone else. 

I had a short conversation with my GP today..he showed me something on his computer…and said…the government Have Total control ( over all of us ) he is not Australian and his home country is in civil war…yet he is noticing these things…and seemed quietly astounded at their iron clad grip…..it’s not like his country…because the grip is silent…and he could see that..( and no the time wasn’t right to do our thing ) ….I see Pakistan has fallen…I remember a article written about the country and it’s role seemed to be crucial in all of this??…Blowed if I can remember  any of it now?…