Thinking

What lesson should we gather from that. Once again, what fellowship is worthy here?
Then why be quarrelsome about spiritual leaders if you indeed accept all men but one are imperfect, yet, God saw fit to use those imperfect men. God is not a God of confusion, neither should Christ followers.

@Witness 
What fellowship should I have here?
1 Corinthians 15:33 Paul is talking about those people with whom we associate or fellowship. We tend to take on the character of the group with which we associate. If we associate with people of bad character, they will succeed in pulling us down to their level.

I fail to see the difference given the definition.
God and Christ demand that of us, not men, even though that was the purpose to descend, Jesus a spirit as a man. Therefore, we are obligated as Christians to listen to that man if we wish to remain in his fellowship.
I fail to see how projecting your personal feelings amounts to following in Jesus footsteps.
You would think, any Christian leader would exercise being humble and responsible. Where can you find a perfect man to commission leaders today? Isn't that the truth spoken in scripture?
Spiritual leaders should have access where a concern is deemed necessary. How many personal conversations do you think the Pope has in a day, if it isn't indirectly mentioned to him by his Cardinals or Bishops?
I see no difference with a structured organization. Why should any Christian have a problem with that. It was conducted in the first century church.

As far as I know I’ve never tried to defend the undefendable……which all religions are guilty of…yes as well as us….your blind to deep understandings serko ..and ones like you….it’s right there for you to read but you have to have insight…you have deceived yourself into thinking you are awake…and you genuinely believe what you feel ….like a sheep that has wandered into the wilderness only to be devoured by the beasts. 
where I did Joshua run to…where did Kaleb run to…did they run out and away from Gods people….
No..and they didn’t beat their fellow brothers and sisters either…they stood back…and waited for Moses ( Jesus ) to come back and clean the mess up..which he did.
What the likes of you are doing is presumptuous…you think you can do the job that only Jesus can do….even the apostles never showed such self righteousness and presumptuousness as you are.
When Jesus cleaned up the temple with a whip …did they step up with him and help him….no…because they had no right to….yet you think you are needed to straighten Us all out….
Gods people have always disappointed him down thru the ages..and he always disciplined them and corrected them….it’s not your job nor anyone else’s right   to do that.
what you are doing is what Jehovah HATES…and that is to cause divisions and doubts and to weaken one’s faith even in the creator…..how many have left the org and gone on to become atheists…or gone back to BTG…to the belief of the trinity and idol  worship…..heaps sereko…
Have you ever asked yourself if you have been guilty of extinguishing someone’s flickering flame …and been guilty of killing some one’s faith of entirely ….you want to be careful..because some one is watching the damage you do…and yes watching the damage we do….we all will be accountable..
Do I feel sad…..you bet!..I’ve had a lot of reasons to feel genuine righteous anger…but I don’t beat those around me who lack the insight I have had to dig deep to understand as to why such things happen…
Your bitterness is your undoing…and until you master it…you will never get such insight as to why Jehovah allows the wrongs he does.
YOU…are the one that was afraid of man…and others like you here…you bowed to their errors…..they broke you…because you don’t really know Jehovah and how he works and why he does certain things.
YOU let them change you serko…..and you don’t even know the woe you are bringing on your own head because of what you and others here are trying to do.
Your so full of self righteousness that you accuse us of…
Moses is not the type of the GB..nor Arron of the helpers….
When some one stumbles serko….we pick them up…we carry them…we don’t beat them and endanger their faith…your ignorance is bathed in bitterness and blindness…..so therefore you cannot and will not ever see the pattern laid down of Gods people since their existence….nor how Jehovah deals with them.
 

As far as I know I’ve never tried to defend the undefendable……which all religions are guilty of…yes as well as us….your blind to deep understandings serko ..and ones like you….it’s right there for you to read but you have to have insight…you have deceived yourself into thinking you are awake…and you genuinely believe what you feel ….like a sheep that has wandered into the wilderness only to be devoured by the beasts. 
where I did Joshua run to…where did Kaleb run to…did they run out and away from Gods people….
No..and they didn’t beat their fellow brothers and sisters either…they stood back…and waited for Moses ( Jesus ) to come back and clean the mess up..which he did.
What the likes of you are doing is presumptuous…you think you can do the job that only Jesus can do….even the apostles never showed such self righteousness and presumptuousness as you are.
When Jesus cleaned up the temple with a whip …did they step up with him and help him….no…because they had no right to….yet you think you are needed to straighten Us all out….
Gods people have always disappointed him down thru the ages..and he always disciplined them and corrected them….it’s not your job nor anyone else’s right   to do that.
what you are doing is what Jehovah HATES…and that is to cause divisions and doubts and to weaken one’s faith even in the creator…..how many have left the org and gone on to become atheists…or gone back to BTG…to the belief of the trinity and idol  worship…..heaps sereko…
Have you ever asked yourself if you have been guilty of extinguishing someone’s flickering flame …and been guilty of killing some one’s faith of entirely ….you want to be careful..because some one is watching the damage you do…and yes watching the damage we do….we all will be accountable..
Do I feel sad…..you bet!..I’ve had a lot of reasons to feel genuine righteous anger…but I don’t beat those around me who lack the insight I have had to dig deep to understand as to why such things happen…
Your bitterness is your undoing…and until you master it…you will never get such insight as to why Jehovah allows the wrongs he does.
YOU…are the one that was afraid of man…and others like you here…you bowed to their errors…..they broke you…because you don’t really know Jehovah and how he works and why he does certain things.
YOU let them change you serko…..and you don’t even know the woe you are bringing on your own head because of what you and others here are trying to do.
Your so full of self righteousness that you accuse us of…
Moses is not the type of the GB..nor Arron of the helpers….
When some one stumbles serko….we pick them up…we carry them…we don’t beat them and endanger their faith…your ignorance is bathed in bitterness and blindness…..so therefore you cannot and will not ever see the pattern laid down of Gods people since their existence….nor how Jehovah deals with them.
 

I just realized how i comment about this topic on another topic about same issue. Let me copy/paste the same comment.
---------------------------------
 
Suicide in the ancient world did not carry the same negative connotations as it does today. Even bible text nowhere said how suicide is a sin or forbidden by Law. The biblical attitude toward suicide ranges from ambivalence to praise. Never made Judgmental statement against those who done that act of self-destruction. 
-Abimelech came to the tower, and fought against it, and came near to the entrance of the tower to burn it with fire. But a certain woman threw an upper millstone on Abimelech's head, and crushed his skull. Immediately he called to the young man who carried his armor and said to him, “Draw your sword and kill me, so people will not say about me, ‘A woman killed him.’ ” So the young man thrust him through, and he died.
-the counselor Ahithophel hanged himself                                                                                                                                                                                            When Ahithophel saw that his counsel was not followed, he saddled his donkey and went off home to his own city. He set his house in order, and hanged himself; he died and was buried in the tomb of his father.
-Zimri, King of Israel, burned down his house around himself after military defeat.                                                                                                            When Zimri saw that the city was taken, he went into the citadel of the royal palace and set the palace on fire around him. So he died,
-Saul and his armor-bearer                                                                                                                                                                                                                       Then Saul said to his armor-bearer, “Draw your sword, and thrust me through with it, so that these uncircumcised may not come and make sport of me. But his armor-bearer was unwilling, for he was terrified. So Saul took his own sword and fell on it. When his armor-bearer saw that Saul was dead, he also fell on his sword and died. Thus Saul died; he and his three sons and all his house died together
-Samson                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Then Samson prayed to the Lord,“Sovereign Lord, remember me. Please, God, strengthen me just once more, and let me with one blow get revenge on the Philistines for my two eyes.... Samson said, “Let me die with the Philistines!” Then he pushed with all his might, and down came the temple on the rulers and all the people in it. Thus he killed many more when he died than while he lived.
-even Judas suicide is an act of remorse, deep regret. According to JW elders instruction, he gave visible, strong signs of repentance :))      When Judas, who had betrayed him, saw that Jesus was condemned, he was seized with remorse and returned the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and the elders. I have sinned,” he said, “for I have betrayed innocent blood
 

Yes, the right wing in India is allowed to go unchecked. They kill those who eat beef.  They are also persecuting those who become Christians.

Rubbish….what you have here are witnesses who do not worship the GB and can think for them selves yet still respect the GB in promoting and getting the basic plan that Jehovah’s has for the world out to the people.
They make mistakes and some big ones at that…the disfellowshlpment over organ transplanting is one of them….
They make mistakes just like any other ancient Godly men of old…just like King David did….just like Moses did…just like Peter did….
we just do not panic and flee when we see these errors…something may stump us or rattle us…but maturity and understanding that Jehovah uses faulty men aids many of us to stay with in the camp boundaries…at that time we would not have hung around the mob that demanded the building of the golden calf…..as tempting as it may have been when one is in panic mode which is what they did.
Im in..and mentally in as well…but I have always seen the GB down thru the ages are mere men who do make mistakes and are not actually inspired…so I and many others act like the beroeans did and check with the scriptures first …
As to what happened to those that followed Aaron with the making of the golden calf….When Moses came back…he still gave them an option of standing beside him…before he ( Jehovah /Jesus) destroyed the rest who did not take him up on that offer….around 3,000 were destroyed…not a huge number compared to the millions that came out.
That is a lesson for all witnesses today…not to leave the camp because of trouble with in it even if that trouble comes from someone as high up as the second man in charge as Arron was…..actually the first man in charge whilst Moses was absent…..a thought to ponder on…
I’m not saying that there are not witnesses who do exactly as the GB always directs thinking it comes directly from Jehovah…because there are…but there are many who sit and listen and work things out for them selves…as we have here on this site….

Rubbish….what you have here are witnesses who do not worship the GB and can think for them selves yet still respect the GB in promoting and getting the basic plan that Jehovah’s has for the world out to the people.
They make mistakes and some big ones at that…the disfellowshlpment over organ transplanting is one of them….
They make mistakes just like any other ancient Godly men of old…just like King David did….just like Moses did…just like Peter did….
we just do not panic and flee when we see these errors…something may stump us or rattle us…but maturity and understanding that Jehovah uses faulty men aids many of us to stay with in the camp boundaries…at that time we would not have hung around the mob that demanded the building of the golden calf…..as tempting as it may have been when one is in panic mode which is what they did.
Im in..and mentally in as well…but I have always seen the GB down thru the ages are mere men who do make mistakes and are not actually inspired…so I and many others act like the beroeans did and check with the scriptures first …
As to what happened to those that followed Aaron with the making of the golden calf….When Moses came back…he still gave them an option of standing beside him…before he ( Jehovah /Jesus) destroyed the rest who did not take him up on that offer….around 3,000 were destroyed…not a huge number compared to the millions that came out.
That is a lesson for all witnesses today…not to leave the camp because of trouble with in it even if that trouble comes from someone as high up as the second man in charge as Arron was…..actually the first man in charge whilst Moses was absent…..a thought to ponder on…
I’m not saying that there are not witnesses who do exactly as the GB always directs thinking it comes directly from Jehovah…because there are…but there are many who sit and listen and work things out for them selves…as we have here on this site….

WWI, WWII, Vietnam, Gulf War, Spanish-American, Civil War, to name a few. “People helping people:”—I admit I have never looked upon it that way. You are on to something, Srecko.
To be sure, many will go to war with noble intentions. What the overall picture shows, however, is that “man is dominating man to his injury.” Isn’t there a religion somewhere that points to the solution to that predicament?

The truth about John 1:1 has been long hidden from the masses. Why is learning this scripture vital to your spiritual health? Because words matter! In Greek there are two different words for God. Also, using a definite article emphasizes the subject spoken about. First instance is ton theon which means the God and the second instance is theos which means a god.
How does John 1:1 read with a literal translation?
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the God, and a god was the Word.”
Jesus is never referred to as the theon because Jesus was begotten and came into existence. Therefore, the Apostle John used the nominative title theos which means a god referring to the Word’s divinity and godlike qualities.
1975 “and a god (or, of a divine kind) was the Word” – Das Evangelium nach Johnnes, by Siegfried Schulz, Göttingen, Germany 1978: “and godlike sort was the Logos” – Das Evangelium nach Johannes, by Johannes Schneider, Berlin Free eBook...
 

When he said he’s made a ass of himself it was over a book he wrote…and I forget the actual heading but I’ll have a go st….then is finished the mystery or something like that…it was a study book….I remember the word mystery….and I also remember feeling thankful I wasn’t around at the time as it was a big book to study and then realize all that time and effort would have been wasted…that was the reason why he said that…..I’m not sure of anything else..other than his changes to so many of Russell’s thoughts….of which many as you say have been returned to…thank goodness!
 
Things we’re rough back in those days…you should here of some of the stories from old Australian brothers and how they reacted to being banned….in the Second World War…a few  physically tried to defend the KHs…..as they were being confiscated legally by the government.Those men back then built and payed for those  halls…life was very hard then.
Different era…different culture…tough people….probably had to be like that to survive those times….must say that was a nice post JWI

When he said he’s made a ass of himself it was over a book he wrote…and I forget the actual heading but I’ll have a go st….then is finished the mystery or something like that…it was a study book….I remember the word mystery….and I also remember feeling thankful I wasn’t around at the time as it was a big book to study and then realize all that time and effort would have been wasted…that was the reason why he said that…..I’m not sure of anything else..other than his changes to so many of Russell’s thoughts….of which many as you say have been returned to…thank goodness!
 
Things we’re rough back in those days…you should here of some of the stories from old Australian brothers and how they reacted to being banned….in the Second World War…a few  physically tried to defend the KHs…..as they were being confiscated legally by the government.Those men back then built and payed for those  halls…life was very hard then.
Different era…different culture…tough people….probably had to be like that to survive those times….must say that was a nice post JWI

When he said he’s made a ass of himself it was over a book he wrote…and I forget the actual heading but I’ll have a go st….then is finished the mystery or something like that…it was a study book….I remember the word mystery….and I also remember feeling thankful I wasn’t around at the time as it was a big book to study and then realize all that time and effort would have been wasted…that was the reason why he said that…..I’m not sure of anything else..other than his changes to so many of Russell’s thoughts….of which many as you say have been returned to…thank goodness!
 
Things we’re rough back in those days…you should here of some of the stories from old Australian brothers and how they reacted to being banned….in the Second World War…a few  physically tried to defend the KHs…..as they were being confiscated legally by the government.Those men back then built and payed for those  halls…life was very hard then.
Different era…different culture…tough people….probably had to be like that to survive those times….must say that was a nice post JWI

I didn’t like when he shot the jackass, though I suppose you can’t sacrifice the entire WWII effort on its account. I did like when he reappraised his toast decision, based upon ‘one SOB to another.’
Where is that recollection of the old bro tilting back in his chair whenever the younger ones take to squabbling and observing, “It’s amazing what Jehovah accomplishes considering what he has to work with.”? I like the observation of Jesus that it’s the one’s in need of a physician that actually seek one out.

They were responsible for leading the people away from Jehovah by teaching teachings of men - hence making themselves very important

Changing back to Russell's view has happened with several teachings, including the elder arrangement, identification of the superior authorities, etc. But I also give Rutherford great credit in getting us out of idolatry, not just with the pagan celebrations, but with the idolizing of Russell himself. Rutherford claimed that the brotherhood was literally worshiping Russell and he called it "creature worship."
But we shouldn't get the idea, of course, that Russell was always such a paragon of virtue himself. He lied in court about business matters he had involved the Watchtower with. And when his perjury was obvious, Russell changed his story 180 degrees. Rutherford knew these things about Russell, having been his attorney, as his defense of Russell in 1915 shows.
Curiously, right up to the last book of the Hebrew Scriptures (OT) the Jews are still being condemned for giving in to idolatry. Yet it was the scribes and Pharisees who deserved credit for freeing the Jews from idolatry from that period forward, so that idolatry was no longer the problem in Jesus' day. It's true that Jesus condemned them for hypocrisy, but Jesus didn't condemn them for all their teachings. In fact, Jesus told his audience that they should still do what the Pharisees tell them to do, just not to do as they do. In Mark, Jesus says to one of them: (Mark 12:34) . . .At this Jesus, discerning he had answered intelligently, said to him: “You are not far from the kingdom of God.”. . . And we also know that not just Nicodemus, but a great many from the Pharisees became believers. And one became an apostle.
I thought that was only over his failed predictions for 1925. And it was evidently only privately to a few persons at Bethel that he admitted this. In the Watchtower he blamed the brotherhood for believing it, rather than admitting that he himself had anything to do with it.
To me, I think all of this is a great lesson that we don't put our trust in earthling man, in whom no salvation belongs. But we appreciate the good teachings and continuing improvements that we have shared together. The copper has become gold. It's not about the overseers themselves, but about what the right motivations bring.
(Isaiah 60:17) . . .Instead of the copper I will bring in gold, And instead of the iron I will bring in silver, Instead of the wood, copper, And instead of the stones, iron; And I will appoint peace as your overseers And righteousness as your task assigners.
If you look closely at the words here, it's not saying that the overseers themselves will be righteous humans, but that we will be led by peace and righteousness "itself." Not humans, specifically. Here's how the NIV puts it:
(Isaiah 60:17, NIV) Instead of bronze I will bring you gold, and silver in place of iron. Instead of wood I will bring you bronze, and iron in place of stones. I will make peace your governor and well-being your ruler.
So, yes, Russell might have sometimes been a perjurer, and Rutherford might have been a "drunken, womanizing, cigar-smoker" (as my old "table head" at Bethel called him). But we still greatly appreciate what has been accomplished over the years. What Jehovah has accomplished is often (as some old-timers still say) in spite of us, not because of us. What must actually be happening is that Jehovah's spirit acts upon us as a group because of our own love for one another. It's not specifically because of what we are always told to believe, but because of our pure and peaceful and righteous motivations. Love and joy and peace and faith, etc., are what bring Jehovah's spirit to all of us, including the good influence on the ones taking the lead.

That's definitely true too. But Jesus still encouraged people to follow what they said. Naturally that didn't mean in everything without question.
(Matthew 23:2, 3) . . .“The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the seat of Moses. 3 Therefore, all the things they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds, for they say but they do not practice what they say.

Aaaaah…we’ll that’s a lesson learnt for me,..✌️

Rutherford himself admitted he ..”had made a complete ass of himself over a lot of his writing..”….he was the one that changed the understanding of the ark representing or a type of Jesus….to representing the org……and if you stop and think about the ramifications by that it’s mind numbing…the GB has since changed it back to Russell’s understanding……but I give Rutherford great credit in getting us out of idolatry with the pagan celebrations…Jehovah puts up with a lot from ones he sees fit to use…..thank goodness !!!

Rutherford himself admitted he ..”had made a complete ass of himself over a lot of his writing..”….he was the one that changed the understanding of the ark representing or a type of Jesus….to representing the org……and if you stop and think about the ramifications by that it’s mind numbing…the GB has since changed it back to Russell’s understanding……but I give Rutherford great credit in getting us out of idolatry with the pagan celebrations…Jehovah puts up with a lot from ones he sees fit to use…..thank goodness !!!

If you knew more about zoology you would realize that therein lies the answer to your previous question. The stars of the Pleiades are quite close together, making it easy for a kangaroo to hop from one to another.  

Like Hitler's team chose the stories whict went on the air....    In a healthy situation ALL reporting is supposed to have no bias... and both sides published.... in a normal situation..so that people do not just hear one side.
That is why I mentioned on this forum my shock  in 2018,  the UN agreement which had a clause which stipulated that reporters had to be "retrained"..... to tow the line.  In China they do e exactly that.  There is a virologist which fled China now giving interviews about Covid. She tells how she is threatened and her life in danger in a foreign country. The tentacles of CCP is everywhere - like a monster in the dark. 
In Germany a new reality was created for all it's people (gaslighted) and one had to believe the narrative or propaganda or feel the consequences...... this has been going on in China and already being imported in the West....... as I warned 2 years ago.  The UN saw China as the model..... 

Yikes! It turns out that John Lennon liked Chairman Mao and regretted writing the lyric that suggested he didn’t.
https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/beatles-the-lyric-from-revolution-john-lennon-regretted.html/
He and @JW Insiderwould get along just fine! In fact, didn’t JWI say he knows has friends in the music biz?
It is enough! I have figured it out! 
PSomH is John Butler. I am Dr. Max ‘Ace’ Inhibitor. Pudgy is—well, I know he’s been around under a different name. The Librarian is That ‘ol Hen. Dmitor is—the list would stretch off the page.
if you don’t have an extra handle, you are nobody! And face it—JWI is not nobody!
So……….(drum roll please)……..JWI is actually …..
JOHN LENNON!  (the pinko)
I think I’ve said before that my permanent year text is a modification of Romans 3:4.   
Every man online is a liar.
There’s no way anyone can know, so why answer? Anybody can say anything. It will have to be one of those “Does not the ear test words as the tongue tastes food?” kind of things, and if different people come to different conclusions—that’s okay too. It’s not as though anyone can construct their very own online congregation here.
I’ll say one thing about Jehovah’s Witnesses, though. The requirement to be humorless is not put forth in any of the baptism questions. Nor is the requirement to be holier-than-thou. Nor to restrict ones’ diet to Bible-sandwiches.

“But if you go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao…”

He did get a bit heated with PSomH once. But that character would test anyone’s patience.