1 hour ago, Anna said:

This hardly applies to Child Sexual Abuse which is a crime and a sin, not some conflict. Didn't you know that?

The GB gives orders to hide it and it seems it is the Elders that still do not see it as a crime. 

When Elders knew about a situation in 2016 but kept it hidden until 2019 then the Elders must have considered it was just a conflict within that time period.  

1 hour ago, TrueTomHarley said:

I don’t think he knows anything.

But I'm learning more and more each day Tom.

And each day more and more truth about JW Org is being made public.

I see HQ are grabbing all the money and property from the UK Kingdom Halls now. 

So the suggestion here is that it is the devil that causes the 'discouragement' in JW Org.

So wow, everyone in the Org is happy but it is only the devil that causes discouragement. 

The Devil is working well through JW Org then isn't he. 

Where can you find security in this world?"

That is almost funny in the current situation of Child Sexual Abuse earthwide in JW Org. 

But it's not funny because of the seriousness of it. 

Quote " But if you keep quiet, then all will be safe."    

Quote "So next time a conflict arises between you and any of your brothers or sisters, WILL YOU SHOUT ?@

Another topic is talking about manipulation. Well here is a great example of it.

Telling congregants to keep quiet and put up with it all. Telling congregants that they will be safe if they keep quiet. 

Have you not heard ? This child sexual abuse is still happening now in JW Org. 

DON'T KEEP QUIET, TELL EVERY ONE ABOUT IT, THEN YOU MIGHT EVENTUALLY BE SAFE FROM THESE PAEDOPHILES .

Yes, it reminds me of a scripture about building a house on sand and it gets washed away.

The JW Org was definitely built on very poor foundations. 

Each Creative day being 7,000 years long ? I think that idea got washed away. 

But i know nothing about the pyramid and the eye.  ???? 

Quote @Arauna " So the argument that the children are 'victims' of JWs is just another ploy or a 'manipulation' of the truth......."

Everything I wrote above is true. Unfortunately Arauna and Tom do not want to see the truth. 

The JW Org makes people accountable to them, not to God.  

Remember 'You must be a baptised JW to gain salvation', IN THEIR OPINION 

And a person has to get baptised into JW Org, because they DO NOT use the proper words at Baptism.

Now that is manipulation. 

Ah is that where those poor GB members used to live, poor guys. 

Following on from above comment. A quote from the link :-

"It is incontrovertible from these documents that the elders of the congregation knew about (the girl's) allegations since at least December 2016 - when (she) was aged nine.They did not report those allegations to the police until July 2019.

To ALL those JWs that say it is all old cases that happened years ago. 

This is NOW. And shows it is still happening. Get your heads out of the sand and stop denying it. 

Elders deliberately protect paedophiles.

For whatever reasons, JW Org is still protecting / hiding Paedophiles. 

1 hour ago, Isabella said:

At least 20 former Jehovah's Witnesses are suing the group over historical sexual abuse they say they suffered.

The group has a policy of not punishing alleged child sex abuse unless a second person, alongside the accuser, has witnessed it - or an abuser confesses.

It says its elders "comply with child-abuse reporting laws even if there is only one witness", though, and always tell police if a child is in danger.

But one former elder said it had been failing to involve the authorities.

Read more: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51006771

It's not going to stop whilst the GB are in charge. Time for proper Anointed to step in, but it won't happen unless God through Christ makes it happen. 

Um, Children of JW parents. @TrueTomHarley are manipulated. 

Didn't a member of the GB say something like 'Don't let them have their driving licence until they get baptised'.

I do know, having known the JW Org for over 50 years, that children of JW Parents are bribed / manipulated.

A child raised as a JW has to go to the meetings, has to mix with mainly JWs and other JW children. And had to go on the ministry at weekends. They do not get an option. They have to go where their parents take them. 

Then there is the competition that you don't believe in, about getting them baptised. At 6 or 7 years old ? Well maybe the child gets to be 10 before the real pressure in put on, or the bribery.

Then of course if a child hasn't been allowed to mix with 'people of the world', because 'the world is so wicked', then that is a form of manipulation. Why ? Because it has formed a wrong opinion in the child's mind. The child will actually believe it's parents. The child will be frightened to mix with 'people of the world' and won't trust anyone outside the Org.  Totally unfair. And then you have the 'You don't need higher education'. Now that again is manipulation. If you stop your child getting higher education, you have changed the direction of that child's life. That is manipulation. 

In my opinion, manipulation isn't just pushing a person in a direction, it can also be, putting up a barrier to make a person change direction, especially if that new direction is the deliberate intention of the person in control.

And of course once a child is baptised the manipulation gets worse as the Elders now have control. The threat of shunning and disfellowshipping, and thereby being thrown out of home, is the new fear a child has. I've seen it all take place. I've seen a young man made to live in the family garage as he had nowhere else to live, but they would not let him live in the house. 

Manipulation is alive and well in the JW Org. It's not in people's mind. There is proof of it happening. 

@James Thomas Rook Jr.   Um, I remember you writing about marking your cheque 'For Local Needs' or something like that.

So what do you think then ? 

" Five documents were leaked, including a private letter to all elders, a separate letter to be read to congregations, ............ "

So sly but why ? What do they need to hide ? And some say this religion is 'the truth'  

" The language used cleverly suggests that the merger is optional: "

" It may be of interest to the Charity Commission that congregational compliance to central directives is not optional. All resolutions placed before congregation members from the Jehovah’s Witness governing entities are passed without contest. "

" ...the latest directive appears to give the Kingdom Hall Trust the ability to extract funds normally marked for local use only, and allocate them for use by Jehovah’s Witness leadership anywhere in the world." 

The next move is to to take all the money and whatever land documents, and take it all to the USA HQ.  UK JWs will own nothing. Well I've said it before, the GB are a dictatorship. 

And made a lot of money for 'some people' too 

Um, I'll just go with the fact that you are American. And each to their own ways.  

@James Thomas Rook Jr.  Quote "Never ONCE have they been right about anything in the real world.

If they did not have an unlimited and constantly flowing waterfall of "Free Money", they would have imploded, years ago. " (end of quote)

And have they been right about much spiritually ?  

But James, you and many others still follow them, still go to conventions, still put money in their pot. Still listen to the words of the GB and read the words of the Writing Dept. 

Why ?  If, as you know, they are not guided by God's Holy spirit, then isn't it all just a waste of your time ? Of every JWs time ?  And those people in Russia are suffering for nothing. Just because they serve the GB and it's Org. 

Well in my opinion the GB have much blood on their hands and have no chance of being Anointed servants of God at all. 

Didn't you open the PDF file on the very first comment of Jack's ? 

It open clearly enough. And if it's lies then I would think it could be regarded as fraud or slander. 

You know how much the GB's lawyers would make of it if it was fake. 

1 hour ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I don't know about you .... but when in a fight, I try not to lean INTO a punch.

The best place to be when troops fix bayonets ... is somewhere else.

I could not imagine you running away if persecution came your way. 

But seriously, if this is the expected thing to happen to JWs earthwide, then what is the recommended course of action from your 'leaders' ? 

Personally I'm a coward and it would take a lot of answered prayers for me to stand firm against physical persecution.  So should JWs pray and stand firm, or turn and run ? 

3 hours ago, Isabella said:

Leaders of the Jehovah's Witnesses have been told to pay £62,000 in damages to a former member who was raped after door-to-door visits.

The woman was attacked 30 years ago by Mark Sewell after evangelising for the religious group near Cardiff.

A "judicial committee" of the group's elders found the allegations against Sewell "not proven" in an internal inquiry in 1991.

But High Court judge Mr Justice Chamberlain ruled in the her favour.

Read more: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-51316153

Mark Sewell was jailed in 2014 for raping the woman

 

That is not a large amount considering what she went through.

And it proves that the Elders were either useless or deliberately dishonest. 

And to think the GB / Org used to say that Elders were chosen by holy spirit. 

I think Joseph and family acted under instruction from God, not man. It was for obvious reasons too.

Matthew 2 v 13 & 14.

After they had departed, look! Jehovah’s angel appeared to Joseph in a dream,h saying: “Get up, take the young child and his mother and flee to Egypt, and stay there until I give you word, for Herod is about to search for the young child to kill him.” ¹⁴  So Joseph got up and by night took along the young child and the child’s mother and went into Egypt. 

BUT I'm sure I've seen at JW assemblies this idea of facing the 'enemy' 

What's that scripture about 'Stand up tall and see the destruction of your enemies' (something like that)

However Did first century Christians RUN AWAY ?   

Should JWs run away ? 

Isn't it about being able to suffer persecution for your faith in God and your love of God ? 

Or were they 'inspired of God' to flee to Norway ? 

A great example of how wrong the GB / Elders and JW Org are

And remember that they teach that a person MUST BE a BAPTISED JW to be SAVED.

So it is as if they have deliberately killed you @Kosonen 

Not just spiritual murder, but if Armageddon came it would physical murder. Those Elders and / or Circuit Overseer would be blood guilty. 

And one even said  We have to obey the Governing Body. 

Most JWs here probably will not believe you, or at least don't want to believe you. Some even say that you don't have to obey the GB. But proof of the pudding .....  

Oh this is so funny, because the GB and JW org and Watchtower Soc have been adjusting the Bible interpretations to suit themselves since the very beginning of the Bible Students and CCJW. 

Armageddon was supposed to happen so many different times it's laughable. The last one was 1975, but oh dear it didn't happen.

Then there is the adjusting ideas on the Blood issues. 

Then the adjusting ideas of This Generation. 

Also the adjusting of 'not all the remnant of anointed are the F&DS', but now it's only those 8 men in America. 

The only good thing in your little comedy show is where it says "We need to look in the bible", because God's word tells us not to put our trust in 'man'

Psalm 146:3-5 King James Version (KJV)

³ Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.

So no point in putting your trust in a GB or JW Org that have proved themselves false to the TRUTH. 

Quote The Bible should not be adjusted to make people feel more comfortable with their behavior.

Tell that to your GB and Writing dept. 

Oh dear yes my link above  will not open. Sorry. 

The PDF on the end of Jack's original comment opens. Is anyone saying that is fake ? 

Expert Opinion, Holly Folk, Massimo Introvigne, J. Gordon Melton. 

1. We have been requested by the law firm of Mr. Shane Brady, representing the “Christian Congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses in the Netherlands”, to examine the report “Sexual Abuse and Willingness to Report Within the Community of Jehovah’s Witnesses,” 

file:///C:/Users/ohnja utlerba/Downloads/TK+Bijlage+1+Expert+Opinion (6).pdf

@James Thomas Rook Jr.   So is the above fraud ?  It's easily available online. 

Shane Brady is / was a Bethelite it seems as I've previously uploaded. So is it all  lies ? 

@James Thomas Rook Jr.  You have a great, and realistic, sense of humour. 

However, the 1st century Christians were persecuted but i don't remember reading about them running off to foreign lands to hide. 

The scripture at Acts 5 v 29 comes to mind. 

 In answer Peter and the other apostles said: “We must obey God as ruler rather than men.

So, a question arises. Should these 'brothers and sisters' now run off and hide, or should they suffer the persecution ?  

It's a bit like what John Butler said about the GB when relating it to people that were destroyed by God in bible times. It is so easy to read about God killing people, such as at 2 Kings 19 v 35

New International Version
That night the angel of the LORD went out and put to death a hundred and eighty-five thousand in the Assyrian camp. When the people got up the next morning--there were all the dead bodies!

And we can read about how God killed the Egyptian Army, and about the Flood of Noah's day.

BUT when it comes to NOW, it is a totally different matter. This is where TRUE FAITH comes alive. The faith in the resurrection. But true faith can only result from TRUTH, and unfortunately JW Org does not have TRUTH. 

As for me I would not suffer persecution for the sake of JW Org. It seems that many in Russia feel the same way. 

8 hours ago, James Thomas Rook Jr. said:

I have a reputation for diplomatic subtlety ....

And it seems you also have two heads

13 minutes ago, Isabella said:

On January 22, 2020, a court in Sochi left 68-year-old Nikolay Kuzichkin in custody until February 24, continuing to hold him in a pre-trial detention center where he is being denied needed medical treatment although his condition is critical.

https://jw-russia.org/en/news/2020/01/43.html

But is he serving God or an Organisation ?