Patiently waiting for Truth

It's unfortunate people like (4jah2me) want to continue in ignorance 

@Tom Henry  Please do tell me what i want to continue in ignorance of ?  I'd love to here your opinion   

17 hours ago, 4Jah2me said:

GB are so puffed up with themselves, and make so many stupid videos and make up new rules as they go along.

@Arauna  said " To you they are stupid videos........ so I wonder who is really puffed up ?  "

It has not been me that has posted those videos on here. It has not been me that has gone looking for such videos. I only know about those videos from other peoples post on here. We don't need to go into subject matter but even some JWs seem to find them stupid, pointless and certainly lacking any spiritual guidance. 

Quote @Anna " But I think that has always been your stumbling block. Your insistence that there must be NO mistakes and NO fault, despite knowing that all humans, including the anointed are imperfect, and that all those inspired and God fearing men in Bible times (Hebrew and Greek scriptures) made mistakes, some quite major ones. "

So Anna, do you think those Bible writers made mistakes in what they actually wrote ?  Is the written word wrong ?  Were the Hebrew scriptures not inspired of God ? Was The Revelation not inspired by God ?  You see, what you seem to be saying is that humans making mistakes is the same as Bible writings being mistakes. Because you use the excuse that humans misusing scripture is because they are human and make mistakes. So maybe then you think that humans writing scripture made mistakes in their writings, because they are human. 

You and others deliberately misquote me by saying that I expect perfection from people. You use this to try to defeat my comments and ideas. It is quite sad to read actually. It shows that you have nothing else to offer. 

An example of my thinking. I know that I am imperfect and that i do things wrong. However if i look at a map (not sat nav) I can drive to London without getting lost.  Is that simple to understand. I, as an imperfect person can follow a map and reach my destination.  The map of course is made by an experienced person who has the knowledge and capability to design it and print it. 

So, the belief is that the scriptures are written, compiled, and printed with the help of God's Holy Spirit. 

Now where is the common sense of God doing all that if He doesn't follow through and INSPIRE the Anointed to interpret the scriptures properly ?

It makes no difference how many 'mistakes' / sins / wrongdoings that those Anointed may do in their personal lives. That is directly between them and God or Christ. 

But surely God would have an honest Organisation that would be able to, with the inspiration of holy spirit, interpret and give the proper food at the right time. OR give NO food at all if it wasn't the right time to give it. 

If God used imperfect men to write the scriptures PROPERLY, then God would also use imperfect men to understand those scripture PROPERLY and to feed His people PROPERLY. 

Why would God deliberately waste time and have His name dishonoured, because God didn't bother to inspire the Anointed to 'do the job properly' ? 

It does not make any sense. I could understand there being NO 'food' / message, but why a false message, poisonous food ?  

You mentioned the January W/t I think which says exactly what I've been saying for a long time. 

Ten men clinging to the skirt of a JEW. But the JEW would have to be seen to be guided by Almighty God.

Do you honestly think the JW Org can be seen as being guided by Almighty God ? With all it's 'mistakes' and all its immorality, and all its injustice in the courtrooms. Even many JWs, including some on here, are not completely in favour of the GB and the way JW Org is being run. 

 @"a holy place"  Oh dear, and do you believe all that you've written or copied ?

Quote "The problem isn't trying to figure out ‘the times and seasons’, it’s contending with the disappointment of not getting it right at “the proper time” and moving past that."

That is so funny when you look back at all the failed predictions. Predictions that would not have been made if God was actually 'running the show'.  

It is one thing for you to suggest that God 'didn't give all the information at one time'. BUT why would God deliberately want His org to tell lies or make false predictions ? 

16 minutes ago, Arauna said:

You were fortunate that JWInsider answered it for you..... but it does not mean you believe it.... having said something different earlier.

Two facts. 1. I answered your question. 2. You didn't like my answer.

So lets move on like adults, yes.

Was in the Jan 2016 WT, but here is the latest, Jan 2020 basically saying the same thing in par 7, as the 2016 WT

Thank you @Anna for sharing this information.   Two points.

1.  JEHOVAH foretold about our time: “Ten men out of all the languages of the nations will take hold, yes, they will take firm hold of the robe of a Jew, saying: ‘We want to go with you, for we have heard that God is with you people.’” (Zech. 8:23) The “Jew” here represents those whom God has anointed by holy spirit. They are also called “the Israel of God.” (Gal. 6:16) The “ten men” represent those who have the hope of living forever on earth. They know that Jehovah has blessed this group of anointed ones and feel that it is an honor to worship him along with them. 

How long have i been saying this on this forum ? Long before this was available in print. BUT the JEW is not the GB or its Writing department. 

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2. ⁷ Anointed Christians do not feel that they should spend time only with other anointed ones, as if they were members of an exclusive club. They do not search out other anointed ones, hoping to discuss their anointing with them or to form private groups for Bible study. (Gal. 1:15-17) The congregation would not be united if anointed ones did those things. They would be working against the holy spirit, which helps God’s people to have peace and unity

Your GB are frightened. And what right do your GB have to tell other Anointed that they would be 'working against the holy spirit' ? 

This shows exactly how the GB are exalting themselves. They think they have the right to tell other Anointed what to do and what not to do. 

Quote @Anna " It’s already been done with the apostles. It’s already all there in writing, in the scriptures for all to see. When the first Bible students got together under Russell, all they did was peel away years of false teachings of Christendom and exposed the grass roots of the Truth. "

1. Yes it's all there in the scriptures, but scriptures get misused, even by the GB / JW org. 

2. The FIRST Bible Students were the International Bible Students Association under Russell. They were Earth wide. They still are. 

The JW Org under Rutherford were apostates to those first Bible Students. 

But as you say many true meanings of many scriptures came forth way back then under Russell. Unfortunately it seems that Rutherford was too ambitious / big headed or something, and took on the role that he should never have taken on. Read the history..........

Quote @Anna " That was the whole point of the Christian congregation, which in those days must have represented the body of Christ because it was composed exclusively of the anointed. Today, the congregation, or body of Christ, remains undisturbed, as Jesus is still their head and the head of the congregation. "

Are you trying to suggest that the 'congregation' (present time) are the 'body of Christ ? 

Is this now GB / JW teaching ?  I do hope not. If so that would certainly be putting the Anointed down. 

Quote @Anna " I wonder what would cause someone to actually say “this is not what I have signed up for”. Maybe you have a few ideas? "

Child Sexual Abuse / Paedophilia hidden within the JW Org. 

Victims of CSA having been disfellowshipped for complaining to Elders. 

Victims of CSA being shunned for going outside the Org for help.

Immoral, dishonest lawyers being used by the GB to tell lies in court cases. 

The GB exalting themselves above the other Anointed. As it seems the complete remnant was the F&DS but now it's only those 8 Men. 

The GB suggesting that the rest of the Anointed 'keep quiet and do as they are told' by the GB / Elders of congregations.

The failed 'prophecies' of the JW Org. (1975 being one) 

The misuse of scriptures. Superior Authorities being one. 

The hypocrisy of the GB / Org advising people to read their own Bible, BUT not to have their own thoughts on scriptures.

The statement by one of the GB that 'God and Jesus Christ trusts us' whilst admitting finally that they are NOT inspired and do get things wrong. 

The list could be endless of course, as the GB are so puffed up with themselves, and make so many stupid videos and make up new rules as they go along. One such, that if a man and a woman spend a night in the same house they will be accused of fornication.... Strange in this day and age but if two men or two women spend a night in the same house I doubt they will be accused of homosexuality.  

And then it seems they are begging kids to give their ice cream money to the Org, whilst the Org is running big business project under different names. IBSA Properties London is one of them. 

Enough for now Anna ? 

2 hours ago, Arauna said:

You have not answered my question - it seems you do not accept that the scriptures that were written later are inspired?  

As I'm not inspired of Holy Spirit I can't answer that question. The Revelation of course was inspired as basically it would not exist otherwise. But as to whether all of Paul's writings were inspired, I don't know.  

My point was though that I don't think Paul saw his letters as being inspired when he wrote them. He wrote in a rather blunt and direct way. 

@Srecko Sostar  has some good points / questions about the 'gathering together' of the writings of the Greek / NT. I don't have memory, though i would once have known, about whom gathered Greek writings together. I think @Srecko Sostar has written that it was the Catholics that gathered those writings together and he asks, 'Did those people have the guidance of Holy Spirit' to collect the correct writings together. I've heard of other writings that were not included.  

But I'll repeat again, that scripture in 2 Timothy 3 v 16 saying 'All scripture is inspired ... '  was written before some of the other Greek writings. And as JWI pointed out, when in context it proves it refers to the Hebrew Scriptures. So if the GB / W/t / JW Org pretend that it refers to the whole Bible then that is being dishonest. I've known JWs use it to mean the complete Bible and of course most people who haven't studied the Bible will not know. However it shows dishonesty. 

30 minutes ago, Arauna said:

My personal opinion is that parents should report abuses if they are aware of it.  Often they do get the option to report it  but refuse because of the shame involved - especially if a family member was involved. 

Before 2007 many chose not to report sex abuse  because the child could be cross examined in court by the prosecutor in the presence of the 'perpetrator.'  This is a second trauma to the child.

I think there has been enough debates on here about that!

I think the debate about it will continue, just as the problem within the JW Org continues, and will continue for a few more years. Just because their dishonest immoral lawyers save them some money does NOT mean that God approves of the GB or its Org. 

Quote @Arauna  " Correct me if I am wrong? So you do  NOT believe that the bible is inspired?  "

As usual you take things out of context. Deliberately of course, I know that. 

However @JW Insider has answered it. I was of course talking about the scripture being taken out of context, because YOU mentioned people on here doing just that. 

The apostle Paul was referring to the Hebrew Scriptures, as @JW Insider made clear.... BUT, where I disagree with JWI is that the Greek scriptures, were not considered inspired back in the days of the Apostles. Do you think Paul would have considered his letters to the congregations as inspired ? Would Paul have written to Timothy that His own letters were inspired ? I don't think so. In my personal opinion Paul was only referring to the Hebrew Scriptures that he knew Timothy was aware of. 

22 minutes ago, Arauna said:

Always suspicious. I am glad there are more registered companies...... if persecution comes on one, the others can still provide limited spiritual food.

I think you are either naive or deliberately trying to defend the GB / Org as usual.

The company here in the UK is not a spiritual one, it is a business one. I am also thinking the Watchtower / GB / JW Org have more business companies earthwide. It might be good for a Government department in the USA to investigate the complete income of W/t / GB / JW Org et al. After all if they have nothing to hide they wouldn't mind handing over information.

Oh yes of course they don't hand over information do they. They keep secrets. 

The GB and their lawyers can act illegally or immorally and call it spiritual warfare it seems. The latest info from Montana proves that. 

Quote @Arauna Every person will only be accountable for him/herself.

This should be true. But if a person is not a JW, or if a person was a JW but has since left the JW Org because they no longer believe the JW teachings, or because they have decided that JW Org is 'unclean', then according to the GB / JW Org, that person had 'no chance' anyway. 

Because the JW teaching is that one MUST BE a Baptised JW to 'be saved'.

So do you believe that, as you say 'Every person will only be accountable for him/herself.' ?

Or do you believe it depends on whether you are a Baptised JW or not ?  Or both ? 

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Quote "there are people on this forum who do not use scripture in context ..."

Ever since Chapter and Verse of the Bible has been numbered, they have been used out of context. 

It sometimes makes me think that the devil was involved in such numbering. 

The only time it is in context is when the 'book' / 'letter' / writing is read from start to finish. Just taking a scripture out of a letter of Paul for instance, makes it out of context against how it was originally written. 

A prime example of taking scripture out of context is the 2 Timothy 3 v 16 " All scripture is inspired of God... "  Written in 65 (NWT), so written before 1, 2, 3, of John and before Revelation, and Paul would not have thought his writings as scripture. Add to this that a Bible complete had not be constructed at the time. 

However the JW Org use that scripture in Timothy to refer to the whole Bible as being inspired, where as it would seem that Paul would have been meaning the Hebrew Scriptures. 

So when you talk about out of context, you can easily apply that to your GB and it JW Org. 

Quote @Anna " Hopefully, before we signed up to become one of JWs we have already cleared that up and accepted the interpretation of JWs. "

A person can get baptised at 10 years of age. That person can then live another 70 years. = 80 years old. Don't you know that GB / JW Org "interpretation " of scriptures can change a dozen times in 70 years. In other words, 'This is not what i signed up for'. 

quote " How do you suggest they should be in contact earth wide? "

You answered this one your self next para' down. Quote " In the days before the internet communication, to be of any value, would have been difficult. Today, this is surely a lot easier, but not everyone is able to communicate via the internet. "

Actually telephones and fax machines have been around a longggggggg time. and people used to write letters too. 

" I joked, and said any True Tom Harley could claim they were anointed. Can you imagine how that would work? It could become a total mess ...  "

I thought that was funny, but frightening.... 

Quote  "The GB is not concerned if the anointed communicate with each other., It is everyone's right to communicate with all of the brotherhood. "

But the GB via the W/t did say that the Anointed would not / should not communicate with each other earthwide.  I wish i had the W/t to quote it from. It became a topic on here a long time ago. 

This has to be your best though :- 

Quote " if some "false anointed" communicated whatever they liked. How would one sift what was genuine from what wasn't genuine?  "

So tell me Anna, how does 'one' sift what is false from what is genuine ?

Because your GB are not inspired by holy spirit and they and their Writing Dept' just write what they think is right. And we needn't go into false prophecy and dates need we. And misuse of scripture such as 'superior authority' and changes of teachings / belief such as 'the blood issue'. But congregants still follow like sheep, following 'false anointed' that tell lies. 

And you would be concerned about the anointed emailing each other earthwide ? 

28 minutes ago, Kosonen said:

Because I love Jehovah God I wish that he will be sanctified. I wish that everyone would live according to his laws that are for our best. So that Jehovah God could be happy about mankind when he sees that people are truly happy. And that is only possible by living according to God's laws. I wish that Jehovah God could rejoice with mankind in a same way as parents rejoice when their children are happy. 

If we are thankful to God, then we wish that every other person would also be that. That would result in the sanctification of God. 

If we love God more than ourselves, then sanctification of God is more important than our own salvation. That means we would be ready to die for God, even for no reward. That would be love in its full sense. 

But what about God? What is more important for God, wellbeing of righteous angels and righteous people or to be sanctified?

WT organization teaches that for God the most important thing is his own sanctification. And the rest is secondary.

Can that be correct? Or is that a teaching that make God egoistic or even narcissistic?

Is there any real proof in the Bible that God's priority is to sanctify himself? Or is God's priority the wellbeing of good angels and good people?

I believe the latter alternative is the right one.

What does the Bible say?

It seems to be a battle between God and Satan that has to be settled once and for all time.  

Humans and angels are onlookers, but angels have greater knowledge of what its all about. 

God has to show once for all time that He has the right to rule in Heaven and over the Earth. 

So, humans are almost like pawns in a chess game. Humans can be resurrected so the death of humans is not so important to God. 

God really does have to prove His right to rule, and to prove He has the power to complete the task. The fact of continuing the human race is probably secondary but to have a human race that will willingly serve Him will be part of the defeat of Satan. 

Quote @TrueTomHarley  "It sounds like what you want is democracy in your place of worship—theocracy by the people, as though ‘if the people come to believe it, it must mean that God has so influenced them.’ It doesn’t work that way. "

Um, I think that is what JW Org has got.  8 men and a writing department have come to believe it, it must mean that God has so influenced them. But as you say, it doesn't work that way.  Your GB and it's Writing dept' are not inspired by holy spirit, they only have their own ideas to go by. 

Quote TTH "Plainly, there must be some interface between the divine and the human. Integral to the faith of Jehovah’s Witnesses is that that interface is the successor of those who brought the truth to us in the first place—whoever fills the shoes of the “older men in Jerusalem.” "

Oh no, are you now trying to say that the GB are descendants of the Apostles. Fail Tom. 

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  22 hours ago, Kosonen said:

But the problem with churches and WT organization is that you can not even present a different view point without disiplinary measures.

Quote TTH "I know where you are coming from on this, but it is overstated. One doesn’t have to believe every little thing, though to be sure, one is encouraged to. But you don’t have to...."

Oh yes you do. For two reasons.

1. If you dare to differ, you will be D/fed for 'causing a division in the congregation'

2. You will get this scripture thrown in your face. 

Hebrews 13 v 17 

⁷  Be obedient to those who are taking the lead among youz and be submissive,

Quote TTH "For most people, the only examination one must make of their vehicle is to observe that it gets them from place to place, ... " 

It's not the vehicle, it's the bad drivers, the GB and it's teachings, and the Elder policemen. The GB certainly go from place to place but not in the right direction and with no guidance. 

Quote TTH  "Maybe he will provide a “true anointed” (essentially from scratch) within ten years. "

Nice that you are keeping this in mind Tom. But you keep wanting to change it though, to misquote me, but ok if it keeps you happy................ True Anointed inside 5 years ,then another 5 years to gather people in, then Judgement. It is going to take at least another 3 years to clean out the JW Org, because American courts / authorities seems to have a deal going down with the GB whereby the JW Org isn't being completely investigated  by whomever has the authority. It seem that other 'civilised' countries have investigations either done or in process, so why not the USA ? Must be a deal going down  

The plot thickens then, or deepens.  Thank you for the info.

But are there still two IBSA's. One serving JW Org and the other opposed to it ?

And it seems the W/t / JW Org have other companies under different names earth wide, so are they business companies / real estate etc ? 

Once again silence.

@Arauna did answer , but more so to divert attention to what the Org says is God's name. 

It seems that the International Bible Students Association took God's message to the world long before the name Jehovah's Witnesses was thought of. But it also seems that the JW Org is trying to hide the IBSA now. 

Has no one any information on this ?  Or is it too sensitive a subject ? 

Quote "When we stand in front of the judgment seat of God, there isn’t going to be an elder holding our hand, or telling us how to think... "          No not then but there are NOW. 

@Anna  said  "Oh really? Well they are not holding mine, and I am sure I am not the only one whose hand they're not holding."

Oh dear. You can see the words that i made bold. 'an elder' 'telling us how to think'. But dear Anna choose to pick the word she wants to play with.  Elders telling congregants how to think goes along with that first scripture about being obedient and submissive or in fact being domineered and giving in under pressure. 

This can be applied to talks given in KH or at Assemblies. Congregants are expected to take all of it as being 'from God' and therefore being expected to submit to every bit of it.  To the point, and unfortunately I can't quote perfectly but, something about congregants being obedient even if the order given seems unreasonable. 

There we are Anna, I've just done to you as you did to me. I think it's called dissecting a conversation. 

Have a good day. 

Be obedient to those who are taking the lead among youz and be submissive,a for they are keeping watch over you* as those who will render an account,b so that they may do this with joy and not with sighing, for this would be damaging to you.

Are you saying this scripture is wrong?

@Anna  I think you know what I said, but I will repeat it. THE SCRIPTURE IS MISUSED. 
Anyone could use it. The Pope or an Archbishop. The scripture itself is not wrong, it is the use of the scripture by those not having authority from God or Christ. That includes the GB and Elders. 

A well known example of this is obviously the Elders telling victims of Child Sexual Abuse, NOT to go to the police or authorities 'because it would bring shame on God's name and the Org'. 

We could also show the misuse of this scripture, as at the time the congregation of JWs were told that the early 1970's was going to be Armageddon and they were told to be ready and to step up the preaching work. So congregants were obedient and submissive and sold their homes and left their jobs and preached full time. And then ................. oh dear. 

The opposite of submissive is domineering which seems suitable for the GB and the Elders.

And the Greek word that is translated 'submissive', in the Interlinear is actually 'yielding'. And yielding means 'giving way under pressure'.  

So the GB / JW Org use that scripture to show congregants how to :- 'give way under pressure' to a domineering GB and their Elders.  

Now I hope that explains it clearly enough for you. 

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Quote @Anna  Ahh, the faults of the GB. Well this too has been brought out many times, that faults and mistakes will will happen, just as they did with Jesus’ disciples.

Did Jesus or the disciples ever put a date on a prophecy and then it didn't take place ? 

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Quote @Anna  Matthew 18:15-17 "  “Moreover, if your brother commits a sin, go and reveal his fault* between you and him alone. If he listens to you, you have gained your brother.16  But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two more, so that on the testimony* of two or three witnesses every matter* may be established.17  If he does not listen* to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen* even to the congregation, let him be to you just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector"

So when exactly do the Elders 'speak to the congregation' and when does the wrongdoer get to listen to the congregation ? 

Matt 18 v 17 If he does not listen* to them, speak to the congregation. If he does not listen* even to the congregation ........... 

The Elders form a committee and things are dealt with 'behind closed doors'. Now according to the Matthew scripture that is going against the things written, because it clearly states to take matters to the congregation, and, to let the wrong doer have conversation with the congregation over the matter. 

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Um, a suspicious silence from those who usually mock me.  

The Watch Tower Society opened overseas branches in London (1900),^[40] Germany (1903), and Australia and Switzerland (1904).^[41] The Society's headquarters were transferred to Brooklyn, New York in 1909.^[42]

International Bible Students Association[edit]

In 1910 Russell introduced the name International Bible Students Association as a means of identifying his worldwide community of Bible study groups. He wrote:

Now in the Lord's providence we have thought of a title suitable, we believe, to the Lord's people everywhere, and free from objection, we believe, on every score—the title at the head of this article (IBSA). It fairly represents our sentiments and endeavors. We are Bible students. We welcome all of God's people to join with us in the study. We believe that the result of such studies is blessed and unifying. We recommend therefore that the little classes everywhere and the larger ones adopt this unobjectionable style and that they use it in the advertising columns of their newspapers. Thus friends everywhere will know how to recognize them when visiting strange cities.^[46]

Russell explained that the Association would be directed and managed by the Peoples [sic] Pulpit Association which, in turn, represented the Watch Tower Bible & Tract Society. All Bible Student classes using Watch Tower Society publications could consider themselves identified with the Association and were authorized to use the name International Bible Students Association in connection with their meetings. The name was also used when advertising and conducting Bible Students conventions.^[46]

^{--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------}

A number of schisms developed within the congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society between 1909 and 1932.^[2][3] The most significant split began in 1917 following the election of Joseph Franklin Rutherford as president of the Watch Tower Society two months after Russell's death. The schism began with Rutherford's controversial replacement of four of the Society's board of directors and publication of The Finished Mystery.

Thousands of members left congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society throughout the 1920s prompted in part by Rutherford's failed predictions for the year 1925, increasing disillusionment with his on-going doctrinal and organizational changes, and his campaign for centralized control of the movement.^[2] William Schnell, author and former Jehovah's Witness, claims that three-quarters of the original Bible Students who had been associating with the Watch Tower Society in 1921 had left by 1931.^[4][a][6] In 1930 Rutherford stated that "the total number of those who have withdrawn from the Society... is comparatively large."

I haven't found any mention of any of this in the 'God's Kingdom  Rules' book, but I'll keep looking. 

15 hours ago, Arauna said:

Jesus himself said that no flesh would be saved unless God stepped in. While it is not a teaching of ours to 'fear'  destruction of the earth there is a prophecy which shows we are indeed  'ruining' the earth. Rev 11:18.

I follow news regarding this issue and the true state if affairs regarding the biosphere is hidden from the public, while scientists are playing along with US government policy to hide the true state if affairs. 

Ice on Himalayas is melting as is a threat to the country of Bhutan, Maldives going down with rising waters.  Forests are dryer in certain areas, leaves and roots so dry that new saplings are dying. Fires in Sweden, Russia etc. The biggest secret is climate engineering..... on and on.... bla bla.... too much information available but people do not go there.

Hebr 11:1   Faith is based on evidence.  Blind faith is not faith. 

 

I will agree that humans are ruining the Earth. But it seems to me that you are still looking for signs. We know that humans cannot destroy this Earth or the human race. We know God's intention from the beginning was to have perfect humans living on a perfect Earth, and God's intentions haven't changed. I used to take an interest in earthwide news articles but many are so depressing and upsetting and some would even make me angry. The suffering and cruelty earthwide is not something I want constant reminders of.  I know, 100% am certain of, that God will put it all right when He is ready. And prior to that people will continue to suffer, but the human race and the earth will remain.  

But there seems to be two IBSA 's. That's what i cannot understand. 

One seems to be the 'original' IBSA that say that, Rutherford / JW's broke away from them. 

Now that would make Rutherford and his new Org, (JW ORG) apostate to the original IBSA. 

The other IBSA seems to be part of the JW Org and is a big property business in London. 

The Original IBSA was, as it says, INTERNATIONAL. So it was preaching the 'Good News' Earthwide long before JW Org.  

So if Rutherford turned against the original IBSA then was he in fact turning away from God.

As for the name Jehovah, the scriptures in English it seems, say YHWH. Now YHWH is much closer to Yahweh than it is to Jehovah. And wasn't the name Jehovah previously used by a Catholic monk ?  I was always told, (way back in the 1960's when I first listened to JWs), that the name Jehovah was used because it was already known to members of the public. The leaders wanted to have a name that people already knew. Convenience it seems ?  But back then I was naive and just accepted it as right. 

One more point. Russell and Co had the International Bible Students Association Earthwide before 1916.   But the GB  / JW Org is against having a Faithful and Discreet Slave Earthwide now. However NOW we have internet, mobile phones / cell phones, all manner of communication, and there must be Anointed earthwide, NOT just in America. It would seem that Russell was far more advanced than the GB and JW Org.  

One word : -  CONSCIENCE 

21 minutes ago, TrueTomHarley said:

Well, in that case your True Anointed would have to start up from scratch (in just 10 years or less), and when I floated that idea by you before, you had a cow over it.

Of course! There they are on Facebook, that site founded by the frat boy in order to rate women by their...um....attributes. Yes! A perfect spot for God to call his own!

Go back to being nonsensical, 4Jah—you don’t mess with people’s heads when you do that.

Funny how you have to but in when I'm replying to someone else that has suggested something with logic. But you have no logic.............

I've no idea what you are talking about concerning Facebook. But then FB and you are both Americans I presume so never mind. It's probably why i can't understand half of what most of you say. It seems Americans have a totally different perspective on life than us British folks. 

See my new topic about the  'original' IBSA. 

But God could cleanse JW Org in whatever time He chose. If He chose 5 years to make your Org clean, then another 5 years until Judgement Day. Plenty of time. Or if God chose to form a new Org He could easily do that. 

You seem to forget that 'boots on the ground' JW congregants know nothing of the CSA, or of the misuse of scriptures by your GB. If JW congregants were shown True new light by the True Anointed, that could easily be 8.5 million people that would change to a true way of worshipping God. Plus all those misled Bible studies could learn real Truth. It would not be a difficult thing for God to achieve. Most congregants already have a 'good heart' but they are just being misled. So, all it takes is God's Holy Spirit and a change in direction. You of little faith.