Patiently waiting for Truth

I wouldn't think real estate would mean anything as it would have no value in the New World. And money would not mean anything either. Buildings would still exist of course but would be on no financial benefit. No one to sell them to or rent them to. But another question arises. If only those 8 men are the F&DS, and only the F&DS get the reward. Then what happens to the rest of the Anointed Remnant ? Do they get nothing because they were not loyally dispensing timely spiritual food to the domestics ?

Quote @Anna "All this would remove the thought that the GB are the only channel God is using, although G.Jackson admitted that it would be presumptuous to think that they were the only chanel. However I don't think he, or any of the others have put this in writing in any of our publications though. So unless someone has read Jackson's ARC deposition, they will be under the impression that the FDS, therefore the GB are the ONLY chanel God is using, and therefore to question anything they say is tantamount to going against God himself." Yes Anna precisely. When push came to shove, G. Jackson had to admit that the GB were not the only channel God would use. BUT they will not put it in writing. Isn't that being deceptive ? Or more so dishonest ? As you've said most people, including 'boots on the ground' JWs, will not know. Quote "*Questioning God is allowed, but questioning the GB is not! How strange is that? " I'd prefer not to question God. I think God showed Job who is who, and who not to question. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote @JW Insider "Of course, obeying God as ruler and not men, doesn't preclude us from "obeying" our congregation elders.. " It has been the obeying of congregation elders that has kept the Child Sexual Abuse so deeply hidden within JW Org.

Oh dear. It is such a shame when JWs need to cover up the mistakes and lies of their GB by pretending that anyone that shows truth and reveals the lies and mistakes of the GB and the JW Org is an opposer of truth. The sower of seed, just as Tom Harley, deliberately mix up serving God through Christ, with, serving the GB and JW Org. They cannot understand, because they do not have faith, that serving God through Christ is not related to being a JW. And they also do not understand scripture. Mark 9 v 40 & 41 " For whoever is not against us is for us. And whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because you belong to Christ, I tell you truly, he will by no means lose his reward. " Jesus was not talking about his disciples at that time. He was talking about people doing God's will even though they were not direct followers of Christ. However :- Mark 9 v 42. 42 " But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who have faith, it would be better for him if a millstone that is turned by a donkey were put around his neck and he were pitched into the sea." I am neither against God or Christ. I am for both. And i would give more than water to almost anyone that i thought needed it. But I do not preach a false message as I do not wish to stumble anyone. The GB on the other hand have preached many false messages and have stumbled many people, including the Victims of CSA who were literal children at that time of being abused.

@Srecko Sostar Fantastic comment. You are very deep thinking. But can you explain the last paragraph please. Indeed the first century Christians, and even the Jews around at that time, were given lots of 'signs' in ways of miracles, curing all sorts of disease, turning water into wine, producing food enough for 10.000 people or more (I think they only counted the men), raising the dead et al. It was as much seen by the physical eye as it was faith. But now it seems, no one expects miracles.. No one but me maybe. I loved the bit about Russell having 'faith'. gave him wrong insight and understanding. Other people' faiths, around Russell, also accepted same things that made them to be in wrong expectations too. So it is today it seems with the GB and JWs. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------- @Outta Here Quote " And the understanding we have now, as proclaimed by the GB of Jehovah's Witnesses and supported by their application of Scripture, would appear to me to bear this out." More GB worshipping at it's best The blind leading the blind and wow, that is a massive pit they've fallen into.

@Witness Thank you. Those events from 1914 onward were, as Jesus put it, “a beginning of pangs of distress.” (Matthew 24:8) pr section 7 pp. 25-28 Wt’s Greek Kingdom Interlinear: “Will rise up nation upon nation and kingdom against kingdom and will be famines and [earth] quakes down on places; all but these (things) beginning of pangs of birth” Matt 24:8 1914? You have had children. Since when do birth pangs/pains follow birth? And why would the Watchtower not translate their Bible as their Interlinear reads, as “beginning of pangs of BIRTH” if not to support their lie about 1914? New International VersionAll these are the beginning of birth pains. New Living TranslationBut all this is only the first of the birth pains, with more to come. English Standard VersionAll these are but the beginning of the birth pains. Berean Study BibleAll these are the beginning of birth pains. Berean Literal BibleAnd all these are the beginning of birth pains. New American Standard Bible"But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs. And yes, I dug out and dusted off my copy of The Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the GREEK SCRIPTURES. 1985. And sure enough it says " all but these things beginning of pains of birth". Surely this is another example of going beyond the things written, especially as the GB state clearly that they are NOT inspired, so they have no excuse for changing the word of GOD.

I used to do the ministry work with an elder some times, and we would go out into the countryside to witness to 'country folk'. He would look at the nice thatched cottages with lovely gardens and he would say ' One day one of these could be yours'. He meant after Armageddon. There seem to be quite a lot of JW folk that think you won't need to 'build' for a while because there will be enough useable property for those that God through Christ has shown mercy to. I don't think God or Christ are destructive for the sake of it. It wouldbe easy enough for them to remove humans without even damaging one building. The pain and horror for those not found worthy could easily be just being shown what they could have had. Just a quick glimpse of paradise, before they are destroyed. And why destroy everything that is pretty or useful just to destroy that which isn't.

@JW Insider & @Srecko Sostar This helps me to have faith that the True Anointed will get true direction from God through Christ, by Holy Spirit. Because we live in such an important time period and because there is supposed to be a large in gathering before Judgement time, there needs to be real spiritual upbuilding for the Anointed Remnant, so that the direction they give will be positive enough to draw people to God. Hence my feelings that there is quite a long time before that Judgement time. The time period is important but that doesn't mean in is very short. I honestly feel that God or Christ will make much more known to those they chose as worthy of being the F&DS. Whilst i agree with you, the JW Org predicted 1975 or mid 70's. The Org has been talking about world conditions since JWs began. But it could still continue for ten or more years. In my opinion, it is not world conditions that are important, it is God's own reasons for His timing. God could keep it 'simmering ' for another 100 years if He so wished.

I'll repeat what I said above. There is an in between. There is a 'safe harbour'. Not on the JW ship, but not in that murky water either. Um what happened, in your eyes, to the thoughts :- To 'keep oneself without spot from the world'. To, 'first clean the inside of the dish or bowl, then the outside will also be clean'. And for the true Anointed English Standard VersionYou therefore must be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect. And you say :- The problem is NOT that the "organization is "unclean" ... the problem is that it is plagued by the exact same things that plague ALL organized religion. But it seems God said IT SHOULD NOT BE.

I've often said I'm suprised people are not chipped. And the UK has, I think, tried to introduce the idea of cash-less transactions, doing away completely with 'real money' and only allowing transactions via card or phone. I remember watching a film where a man's identification was completely removed from all records, bank accounts and even details of his birth. he basically didn't exist. But many film ideas come from real life happenings. I presume all card and phone transactions are tracked anyway. And I know that online transactions and even enquiries are tracked and then advertisements for similar products are sent to your computer. Give it a try if you use Facebook, Ebay etc. They all link up and send you similar things.

In my opinion the W/t and Awake mags that showed so much destruction, are all wrong. I am of the opinion that many buildings will remain and warehouses full of food, clothing and useful vehicles, and possibly wi/fi and computers . Unless of course God will send angels to take messages all around this Earth. There will need to be communication Earth wide........ But then some folks think we will go back to horses and carts. But then as I'm not a JW, according to them I won't survive anyway

@TrueTomHarley Oh you are good for a laugh Quote " To my mind, the GB do obey him as ruler " You are so funny. You are also so blind. You cannot see that your GB have simply followed on from past lies and mistakes. You cannot see that your GB use dishonest lawyers in courts. You cannot see that your GB are presumptuous in saying that they are the F&DS. You cannot see that your GB are exalting themselves by saying only they, those 8 men, are the F&DS and that the true Anointed should not even contact one another around this Earth, and should not study God's word together. And then the GB admit to not being inspired by God's Holy spirit. And it seems to have been proven that GB members are not chosen by God's Holy spirit. Homosexual GB members ? GB members that have written study books, but then been D/fed ? And the GB are withholding information from the Courts / Authorities concerning Child Sexual Abuse. Information which could help victims to gain peace and closure. Giving that information would show the willingness for justice, mercy, love, and to 'Serve God as ruler rather than men'. But NO. Your GB Govern / Rule over / Dictate to, the Watchtower Soc' and JW Org and 8.5 million sheep. Making up the rules, misusing scriptures, misleading million. Well it's working Tom, it's misleading you. @James Thomas Rook Jr. Thank you for your perspective. Quote " And besides, there will be clueless officers and crew on that ship to make you miserable ... but if you "jump ship", you better have a better place to go. " It seems to me that JWs are brainwashed into thinking that when a person leaves the JW Org, that person will go 'back into the wicked world'. JWs are surely not that naive as to believe that every ex-JW suddenly becomes a 'wicked person' doing all manner of wicked deeds. It's what your GB / Elders et al want you to believe of course. But it isn't so. There is an in between. There is a 'safe harbour'. Not on the JW ship, but not in that murky water either. However Mr Rook, your ship is sinking, the murky water is getting in, the JW ship, as you know, is no longer clean. And why would I wish to be part of what is unclean ?

Then I'll read it tomorrow if I'm on here.

Quote "Who says they weren't true anointed? All of the persons I referred to claimed to be anointed." As do your GB, but, by their works you will know them. And as for repeating the same stuff, well the JW Org is definitely in the wilderness, so I suppose it's like giving them manna. Problem is it's poisonous manna. It used to take me more that two hours to study a Watchtower article, so I would have thought it would take a whole day at least to write one. I suppose there is no relevance as none of it is inspired and therefore only the opinion of the writer.

Oh dear, but that brings about other questions. If the GB was appointed as F&DS in 1919 (which I do not believe) then why was the whole of the Anointed Remnant once known as the F&DS ? And they weren't even called the Governing Body back in 1919 were they ? Weren't they Directors back then ? Anyway, I'm physically out and mentally out but i still believe in Almighty God whose name may or may not be Jehovah. I much prefer Yahweh = YHWH or HWHY in Hebrew, right to left.

@Anna Does fraud only involve money ? Can it involve faith ? Can it involve people's lives ? Can it involve truth ? Wasn't 1975, or the 'mid 70's' a big carrot ? And you spoke of the F&DS - 1914. Which F&DS did you mean ? Did you mean ALL of the Anointed, or just those 8 men ? And PRIDE you mentioned. Doesn't that come before a fall ? And 'a fear of what could happen to the faith of many people as a result of admitting that 1914 could be a mistake. ' Wow, so keep telling lies. Build the JW Org on lies, just to keep the followers in. Anna, you just don't understand, how much that you do understand. It's like you write whilst in a trance and truth tells you what to write. You love the GB and Org so much, yet you tell the truth about them, which shows up what they are really like. @James Thomas Rook Jr. I say the same to you. You tell the truth about the GB and the Org, yet you stick with it. I think it was you that commented about Germany and Hitler. But it's as if the Org is Germany and the GB are Hitler, But still you serve .

@JW Insider The way you write about the Writing Dept' is as if you were writing about a worldly Newspaper office. I see no sign of spirituality in it at all. And, re-using old Watchtower material ? Just feeding the sheep any old rubbish then. Or, completing a new Watchtower article in less that two hours, scriptures included ? Wow, I'm glad I don't go to the KH anymore. And i can further see the need for the true Anointed remnant to put in place by God through Christ.

As you are a typical JW @TrueTomHarley and you are being well trained by your GB and Elders et al, you are presumptuous, and because of that you have already decided your answers before you ask your questions. Quote @TrueTomHarley "Yes, you may say that I did the ministry not of Christ, but of JW.org." Yes exactly, I would and do say that. Quote " Do I have this straight? " Answer : NO You presume, because your mental and emotional being tells you that you must presume, that i do nothing. You answer your own questions with falsehood. Quote " How can you be so self-centered? " Answer : I'm not. Do I 'go out on the ministry' ? No. Do I talk to people about God and Christ and a coming time of Judgement ? Yes. Do I talk to people about 'world conditions' ? Yes I do it online, and I do it face to face with people that, as you might say, are 'sighing and groaning' about world conditions and about how difficult life can be with so much stress and worry etc. I mention that God has plans for a much better way of life for people here on this Earth. And I mention that this world is 'lying in the power of the wicked one', the devil. I tell them, hence there is no point looking to human governments or hoping that protesting will do any good. I tell them that only God can 'sort it all out'. Because only God has the supreme power and ability and only God can see the complete picture Earthwide and therefore knows whats best for humans. I do not go deep into the point that Jesus Christ has been given the power and authority. BUT, as I've said before, but you chose to ignore, I can only tell people things that I TRULY BELIEVE MYSELF. I will not go preaching a false message. I will not go preaching things that i do not believe. I will not go offering a JW book study, when the book used could easily be full of lies or mistakes. I will not go telling people to attend a Kingdom Hall when I know 'it may be unsafe there'. I will not go telling people to attend a Kingdom hall because the teachings are from the GB and the Writing dept' and none of them are inspired of God, hence many of the teaching are lies or mistakes which will be changed to suit the GB at a later date. Quote "Are you not on strike against God? Are you not laying down the law with Him that He had better get His Act together and produce a true anointed good enough for you, ??? " IF YOU ONLY HAD FAITH you would realise that I am doing as i should be doing. I AM WAITING ON GOD. I have faith that God WILL PRODUCE a TRUE ANOINTED. But you do not have such faith, so you cannot understand. JWs are looking for a sign, just as the Jewish religious leaders did. Hence you have been given dates in the past, that failed of course, and you need to keep being given new books and new videos, and new messages to preach (that fail of course). You so much need to see things with your eyes, because you lack faith so cannot 'see' things with your heart. People will need to be encouraged even more in a few years time, but by then the true Anointed may be in their proper place, running either JW Org or some other Organisation of God's choice. You say I'm self-centred, but it has been admitted on here that JWs are looking for the Judgement Day within their own lifetime. Now that is self centred. Putting a date on Armageddon was both selfish and presumptuous. The GB placing themselves above the 'rest of the anointed' is both selfish and presumptuous. I hope this answers your questions Mr Harley, even though I know they were not actually real questions.

I presume life shortened from the time after the flood due to radiation from the sun. Of course it would take time for that to kick in but I presume it had an effect on the human body. Is it radiation or UV something like that ? I know we are now supposed to use 'sun blockers' / sun lotion. Just a thought

You seem to switch from inside the congregation, to outside the congregation. As you said, Paul was talking about inside the Christian congregation, but then you seem to say that it is right for the GB and JW Org to use that scripture to mean 'in the world'. Quote "So what could possibly be wrong with a doctrine that teaches that the final generation of mankind in this system of things should start in 1914? " Firstly, I thought the GB / Org was now going with 'overlapping generations'. Secondly, What age would you want them to have been in 1914 ? Because they would be 106 years old in 2020 if born in 1914. And in Psalms it says that a persons life is 70 years or 80 if they are strong. Seems a bit of a contradiction to me. I know some folks do live to over a hundred but how many, where are they, and do they have true knowledge of God ? Are you actually a Watchtower writer, a 'Talk' writer for Sundays, or a ghost writer for the GB ? Of course the End is getting nearer, that is obvious. But i don't think global problems have any play on it. God through Christ will KNOW EXACTLY when to ACT. It does not matter how many of us humans die in the mean time. The resurrection is a promise from God. A resurrection of the righteous and the unrighteous. Is your faith wavering ? Do you need to see a sign ? Are you looking for that elusive 'generation' ? Remember the words of Jesus "A wicked and adulterous generation keeps seeking a sign,* but no sign will be given it ...............

Yes, they were 'dead' in God's eyes though they still lived human lives.

@César Chávez If you don't know the difference between worldly wisdom and Godly wisdom then you are simply not a spiritual man/woman. You've simply gone round in circles to prove nothing. NWT 1 Corinthians Ch 2 v 14 -15 14 " But a physical man does not accept the things of the spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot get to know them, because they are examined spiritually. 15 However, the spiritual man examines all things,.. " Now I can understand that, so why can't you. And I'm not a JW. And as for this :- Quote "Adding to Christ words and that of God’s is the gravest of intent a human can make." I agree with you, and if only the GB and Watchtower writers understood it, then JW Org might just stand a chance of getting God's approval. The Org constantly go 'beyond the things written' and the GB exhort themselves calling themselves the F&DS. Placing themselves above the true Anointed. But they show themselves as physical men not spiritual men. After all what spiritual man would dare to put a date on the coming Judgement ?

Wow I can see how urgent your Armageddon is, you are still sat at your keyboard As I believe it could be ten years away or more, I'm now going to have lunch.

Quote @TrueTomHarley " The purpose of organization is to magnify an activity. " That is so funny. The Bible Students and JW Org 'magnified their activity' by telling lies and by guessing at dates and getting it all wrong. Wow that was progress wasn't it.

The Ten years was a misquote by @TrueTomHarley the story teller. He loves to tell stories and to mock others by misquoting them. I actually said originally that Judgement day would probably be 10 years away or more as it would take a long time for the JW Org to get back into good standing with God and therefore be useable, or for God to have the true Anointed remnant here on earth doing his will and gathering the earthly class. But i also said that God could do it in 10 days if He so wished. Mr Harley just picked up on the 10 years because he is a storyteller and loves to get attention for himself. He offers nothing that is upbuilding but just loves to ridicule others. Over to you story teller. Update I've just noticed that the story teller or someone, has now added the idea that true Anointed will give the date of the Judgement. No, the true Anointed know that no one knows the day or the hour. It is only false servants of God that put dates to it, and how silly they have shown themselves to be.

@Arauna Quote "We have more than enough reason to thank them for keeping us moral and awake! " Those things you list that you have great knowledge of. You did not learn them from the GB or the JW Org. So your personal 'keeping awake' is not because of your religion. And your religion, the JW Org is not in good standing with people of good morals and you know why. I admit to not having half the 'worldly' knowledge that you have, but I don't think i need all that knowledge, just to know that the world belongs to the devil and it is a wicked place. Unfortunately the religion you are part of has misused it's own knowledge to make false statements in the past. Hence many people no longer trust your religion and its leaders. Add to that, the CSA not being dealt with in a loving and honest way. Add to that the misuse of disfellowshipping and shunning at a time when people need mercy and love. As the world becomes more wicked so does JW Org. instead of shining like a 'lamp on a lamp stand', the JW Org is being seen as part of this world. If, your religion JW Org, honestly believed that Armageddon is so close, then they would all be selling their homes, as they did in the 70's, and would be spending every hour in the ministry possible. None of you would be on here waffling away. You would all be in regular prayer and ministry. You would all be working together and sharing all possessions, just as they did in the first century. You would all see an urgency to preach and worship. But instead, you all sit in your nice homes, just as i do, and we waffle away on here. Where is your urgency if you believe the Judgement is so close ?