Patiently waiting for Truth

The snag with that is Daniel said the tree represents Nebuchadnezzar himself - not just Babylonian rulership ('The tree ... is you, O King'). While Nebuchadnezzar was ill, the kingdom, its everyday affairs, commerce, government, agriculture, etc. continued.
Another problem (apart from giving the dream an antitypical fulfillment that isn't scripturally warranted), is Babylonian rulership was uniformly seen in the Bible as oppressive to God's people, and yet this oppressive regime that destroyed his people's cities and cruelly held them captive is a type for God's righteous kingdom? How does that work?

They’re not all that hot at writing dialogue, nor are the modern videos, despite clever film technique and historically accurate artifacts, ..um....well, they wouldn’t win the Best Picture Academy Award.
The brothers are in a bind. They don’t want to go beyond what’s written but what’s written is pretty sparse, so they compensate by staying thoroughly “safe” with the result of characters who appear to eat Bible sandwiches.
Counsel is generally laid on with a trowel. I was very pleased at the little quip in the Jonah video of he explaining to a traveler just what was his mission—not so much the line, but his facial expression afterwards, because it displayed a light touch not often seen. Let’s face it—not many of the brothers are actors. 
Lower your dramatic expectations just a little, and the Jonah and Hezekiah videos went tolerably well, with some fine moments.  I thought the Nehemiah video was a step backwards, and I had a hard time with the video of the Witness kid who leaves his happy construction-business home to take a job in the big city and immediately comes to ruin, because it fulfills every Witness stereotype to the tee.
Ah, well. They are what they are. They’re teaching videos for ones who like that means of learning—in short, most people. Do people in the greater world flock to the critically acclaimed movies? Nah. They like schlock, so don’t say it is an attribute just of the brothers. I just came across the factoid that Moby Dick pretty much sank Herman Melville’s career. It was too esoteric for anyone to get their heads around. He had been a well-liked author up that time, but afterwards he fell out of favor and didn’t resurface till much later with a few offerings like Billy Budd.
Besides, the brothers don’t want to go the Hollywood route in which you swoon over the sensitive performance of the leading man, only to learn later that in real life he is some lowlife narcissistic scumbag who beats his wife, snorts heroin, and beds every other man on the planet. 
Jehovah’s people are nothing if not upright and real.

I can never read that dialogue with a straight face. 😆

If WTJWorg looks for parallel interpretation and making claim how "the dream" is illustration for God's Kingdom, than GB need to face the fact that they are actually claiming that God went mad at one point and was left without power over the Earth.
Cameron: That’s all right. The Bible shows that Nebuchadnezzar lost his sanity, evidently for seven years. During that time, he was unable to rule as king. But at the end of the seven times, Nebuchadnezzar regained his sanity and started ruling again. *
Jon: OK, I’m with you so far. But what does all of this have to do with God’s Kingdom and the year 1914?
Cameron: In a nutshell, this prophecy has two fulfillments. The first fulfillment happened when King Nebuchadnezzar’s rulership was interrupted. The second fulfillment involved an interruption of God’s rulership. So it is this second fulfillment that is related to God’s Kingdom.
Nebuchadnezzar = JHVH 
JHVH Kingdom stopped to be (World's) Ultimate Power in 607 BCE, because of .....,  caused by...., lets read how Cameron explained this: 
Cameron: In Bible times, the Israelite kings who ruled in Jerusalem were said to sit on “Jehovah’s throne.” * They represented God in governing his people. So the rulership of those kings  was really an expression of God’s rulership. In time, however, most of those kings became disobedient to God and most of their subjects followed suit. Because of the Israelites’ disobedience, God allowed them to be conquered by the Babylonians in 607 B.C.E. From that time on, no more kings represented Jehovah in Jerusalem. In that sense, then, God’s rulership was interrupted. Are you with me so far?
Kings in Jerusalem = JHVH, But they were conquered by Nebuchadnezzar = JHVH.
Disobedient Kings, Jerusalem = Disobedient JHVH conquered by Mad Nebuchadnezzar = Mad JHVH.
Are you still with Cameron so far? :))
Another thing is for massive consideration. If by any chance JHVH lost his power over Earth in 607 BCE than he also lost his power over Heaven too, because of same reason, and that is his "madness", what ever that could be.
If, by WTJWorg interpretations, JHVH regained his Power in 1914 CE, than question is; Who gave to Jesus Whole Power on Heaven and Earth in 33 CE ??? 
 

I think this happens to be the most disputable assumption in the whole discussion between Cameron and Jon. I actually had a study where the lady, a science teacher, wondered about that date, since no one else except the Witnesses recognized it.....at the time I was not familiar with the topic at all, since like everyone else I assumed that was the date. We had other topics to discuss first, so we never really got into it. She moved, and I lost touch with her. (Although I did pass her onto someone in the area she moved to). Evidently, Jon was not knowledgeable about any other dates and of course we cannot blame him since ancient history, especially something as specific as the razing of Jerusalem by the Babylonians, is not common knowledge.
I know we arrive at that date by counting 70 years back from 537, (Cyrus' 'restoration of the Jews to their homeland and the start of the rebuilding of the temple (I think)).
For some reason this does not seem good enough, and I am sure we will find out why in this thread. Stay tuned 😁

I'll wait for this. But really! 
 
This over 40 page to-ing and fro-ing so obscure and beyond the everyday experience of most that it just creates a gigantic yawn factor.
The Cameron and Jon chat, while admittedly cheesy, is so easy to follow. What are we saying here?
Nebu = Jehovah's representative rulership. 7 times interpreted as 2520 years = the time Gentile rule is uninterrupted by theocratic rule on earth. Starts with with Nebu &co dispensing with a divinely appointed dynasty of earthly kings. Duration= time, (disputed of course), of 2520 years, starting in 607BCE ending 1914CE. At this point, a Messianic king is restored in heaven (Jesus). Satan is ousted to be trapped on earth. That event is marked by a time of unprecedented disruption in earth's affairs (Matt 24, Mark 13, Luke 21, Rev 6 etc,. supply your own verses). Conclusion? = Messianic kingdom restored in the heavens, Satan kicked out and kicks up fuss on earth. We here are in last days since then.
Explain an alternative view in one paragraph of 6 lines. I might be persuaded to consider.

Daniel didn't understand 1914 CE.
Jon don't understand 1914.
But Cameron are able to explain all with Bible. 
Did i said Bible? I meant, with WTJWorg publication. I must be dummy too:))
On what arguments Cameron based interpretation? Let see.
1. But now, in our time, we can understand them more fully.
2. So these prophecies would only be understood much later, during “the time of the end.” And as we will soon discuss in our Bible study, all evidence indicates that we are now living in that time period.
3. In a nutshell, this prophecy has two fulfillments.
 
I don’t think it’s as "convincing" today as it was when we were young and full of "Bible enthusiasm". First to mention is GB confession that their interpretations of the Bible are full of misconceptions , and that their interpretations came through wrong methods (beliefs clarified). So much about GB ability to understand.
Second, WW1 is best "proof" that WTJWorg have (after 1914 fiasco when they expected Armageddon in that year) evidence that humankind living in time of end. Despite Jesus' warning to not be mislead with, You will hear of wars and rumors of wars. 
Third, Type and Anti Type model or Second (Third) Fulfillment is claim without real foundation, and belong to "wrong methods". 

PROJECTION:
If we include Allen Smith##, Billy the Kid, etc., in the count, I think you just reached example number 1,000!!
We should have some kind of celebration.
Wikipedia:
Psychological projection is a defense mechanism in which the ego defends itself against unconscious impulses or qualities (both positive and negative) by denying their existence in themselves by attributing them to others.[1] . . .  It incorporates blame shifting and can manifest as shame dumping.[2]

difference between hating a person and hating the actions and behavior that person demonstrates
Aha, that is what JW video instruct JW member: Mother don't hate dfd daughter but she hates picking up a ringing phone :))
"Morris illustration" is an example of what should be avoided at all costs. What would it be: Jesus was a weak teacher to Morris? Or did Morris learn nothing from Jesus?
We two, are on safe "social distance". I will not be influenced by you, and you will not by me. So, we just "chat" about doctrines and interpretations...and show to known and unknown readers of our posts where we are in a "stream of thoughts and ideas". Is this ok with you?

:))) Stupid and scary at the same time.

Publisher BMG has plunged itself into a copyright lawsuit with elements that are so bizarre it's hard to fathom what the company was thinking of. According to the complaint, BMG illegally used a song owned by religious group Watchtower in a for-profit Christmas album, featuring songs from other faiths, which are set to be sung in cathedrals. Needless to say, Jehovah's Witnesses are outraged.
Music publisher BMG is best known on these pages for its aggressive copyright infringement action against ISP Cox Communications in the United States.
After filing a lawsuit accusing the ISP of doing little to prevent its customers from pirating music time and again, the case went through a tortuous process that eventually led to a “substantial settlement.”
Given the nature of its business and a history of picking over the intricacies of copyright law, it was a surprise to see BMG named as a defendant in a US copyright lawsuit this week. Unusually, however, it’s not simply the copyright aspect of this case that makes it so unusual and interesting.
Singer Aled Jones Releases Album in November
Last month, Welsh singer Aled Jones, who shot to fame as a youngster in the 1980s, teamed up with BMG to release a new album titled ‘Blessings’. The album aims to be religiously inclusive by bundling songs associated with Christians, Catholics, Muslims, Buddhists, and Quakers. But trying to appeal to everyone can have its pitfalls, especially where religion is concerned.
The problem lies in a song on the album called “Listen, Obey and Be Blessed”, a work owned by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, the supervising body and publisher for the Jehovah’s Witness religious group. The appearance of this song on a commercial album immediately raised alarm bells among the religion’s followers who, through their teachings and knowledge of their faith, knew this track shouldn’t have been used in this manner.
Read more: https://torrentfreak.com/jehovahs-witnesses-file-copyright-lawsuit-in-response-to-blundering-christmas-album-201225/

Okay, I can be stupid, because that's how you think of me. No big deal. But I wonder if giving down-vote for someone else’s comments is following Jesus ’example? You know what i mean, in style, love your enemies?  
GB member A. Morris, your human leader, claims that ex-JWs are apostates and that apostates are enemies. And he said how happy he is because all apostates will be dead soon. But he forgot to mention "his Leader Jesus" who says opposite; love your enemies.
:))
If you have time, send message to A. Morris with Bible verses:
Do not rejoice when your enemy falls,
And do not let your heart rejoice when he stumbles,
Otherwise, the Lord will see and be displeased,
And turn His anger away from him. 

@Srecko Sostar This comment below does not include you .
I can only assume that some people on here do not have a loving marriage partner to spend time with.   To spend so much time 'researching' all that 'stuff' and so much more time arguing about it all, when it has no real purpose.  1914 has no real purpose in relation to our Christian love toward God and Christ. And no one knows the day or the hour, and a 'day' in this instance would not mean a literal day. 
The scriptures, especially Paul's letters, tell us not to get caught up in silly arguments.  
But you 'guys' will probably continue to argue.  Oh how we need that True Anointed to guide God's people. 

JW Insider
The fact of the Great War along with after signs proved that the gentile times had ended and that the Kingdom was born and modern history a long with prominent members of clergy in 1917 attested to this fact.
scholar JW

JW Insider
Nope. it works therefore it is that strong cable as it led to the ending of the Gentile Times in 1914 CE a reality proved by the outbreak of the Great War with the birth of God's Heavenly Kingdom . You need not only to properly understand History and Chronology but Biblical Theology namely Salvation History.
scholar JW

As others have pointed out, if the WT chronology is strong because it works, then it must be weak because it doesn't work. The entire reason, as you keep admitting, is so that 1914 will work. But 1914 doesn't work. Recall that 1914 was predicted to be the end of the Gentile Times. What was predicted failed. The Gentile Times did not end, no matter how many times CC keeps repeating that the Jews took over Palestine in or about 1914. The End of the Gentile Times was predicted to be the total collapse within a few months, and by the end of 1915 at the latest, of all authority within all national governments, kingdoms, and human political institutions around the entire world except for one. That one government that would would not collapse in 1914 would be a Jewish kingdom in Palestine that would not collapse like all the others and would be the only remaining kingdom on earth. The Gentile's time had ended, and only a Jewish government in Palestine would be successful in 1914.
So, one of the biggest failures of the 1914 "prophecy" was the claim that it would be the "end of the Gentile Times." The WTS actually had to change the definition of this phrase to make it seem like the prophecy had not failed.

Yes. Just like  Bible commentators all over Judaism and Christendom.  But especially 19th century preachers and  Second Adventists who wanted to overcome Jesus' words that no one knows the day or the hour.

JW Insider
WT Chronology is 'strong' because it works, it alone is functional allowing the honest-hearted to understand where one lays in the stream of time, seeing modern day fulfillment of Bible prophecy. Chronology is simply a mode of interpretation, it is not an absolute but simply relative relying on the history presented albeit not perfect. 'Likely' is good enough for me for if it works then that is all that I require for it is far superior to 'dead-end' NB Chronology which also is imperfect and contains many 'gaps' despite the preponderance of astronomical data also subject to interpretation.
Chronology is always going to be problematic in some areas and that is why Jehovah God has given to his people four prophetic witnesses even at the hands of an Angel, a strong Cable of sacred Bible Chronology corevealed in his Word.
scholar JW

https://torrentfreak.com/jehovahs-witnesses-file-copyright-lawsuit-in-response-to-blundering-christmas-album-201225/
( It's all about the money, money, money.... ) 
Publisher BMG has plunged itself into a copyright lawsuit with elements that are so bizarre it's hard to fathom what the company was thinking of. According to the complaint, BMG illegally used a song owned by religious group Watchtower in a for-profit Christmas album, featuring songs from other faiths, which are set to be sung in cathedrals. Needless to say, Jehovah's Witnesses are outraged.
The problem lies in a song on the album called “Listen, Obey and Be Blessed”, a work owned by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, the supervising body and publisher for the Jehovah’s Witness religious group. The appearance of this song on a commercial album immediately raised alarm bells among the religion’s followers who, through their teachings and knowledge of their faith, knew this track shouldn’t have been used in this manner.
 
Multiple Blunders Considered Antithetical to The Faith
First of all and despite its attempts to be inclusive, Blessings is fairly obviously an album aimed at the Christmas market. However, Jehovah’s Witnesses do not celebrate Christmas, believing that the festival has pagan origins. Second, the religious group doesn’t allow its works to be exploited commercially, as per its own interpretation of the bible. Finally, Jehovah’s Witnesses reject all other religions, so being represented as a group alongside them in the album is offensive, to say the least.
Indeed, these topics and more have been the subject of intense discussion on various Jehovah’s Witness forums over the past several weeks. Many followers have been openly wondering why their leaders haven’t been following the rules, or at the least, why they aren’t doing anything to counter this affront to their religion.
As it turns out, those in command knew all about it well in advance and have been preparing a lawsuit.
Well the W/T need to get money back from somewhere to pay all the Victims of CSA.  it seems to just be business as usual for the GB & Co.
But i do find it kinda funny.  
 

Is all of this supposed to be proving something about 1914 ? 
If so what exactly please ? 
We already know that the Kingdom existed whilst Jesus Christ was here on earth and we already know that HE had been given all Authority after His resurrection in 33 C .E. 
So what exactly is the point of this  43 page discussion ? 

Is all of this supposed to be proving something about 1914 ? 
If so what exactly please ? 
We already know that the Kingdom existed whilst Jesus Christ was here on earth and we already know that HE had been given all Authority after His resurrection in 33 C .E. 
So what exactly is the point of this  43 page discussion ? 

https://torrentfreak.com/jehovahs-witnesses-file-copyright-lawsuit-in-response-to-blundering-christmas-album-201225/
( It's all about the money, money, money.... ) 
Publisher BMG has plunged itself into a copyright lawsuit with elements that are so bizarre it's hard to fathom what the company was thinking of. According to the complaint, BMG illegally used a song owned by religious group Watchtower in a for-profit Christmas album, featuring songs from other faiths, which are set to be sung in cathedrals. Needless to say, Jehovah's Witnesses are outraged.
The problem lies in a song on the album called “Listen, Obey and Be Blessed”, a work owned by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, the supervising body and publisher for the Jehovah’s Witness religious group. The appearance of this song on a commercial album immediately raised alarm bells among the religion’s followers who, through their teachings and knowledge of their faith, knew this track shouldn’t have been used in this manner.
 
Multiple Blunders Considered Antithetical to The Faith
First of all and despite its attempts to be inclusive, Blessings is fairly obviously an album aimed at the Christmas market. However, Jehovah’s Witnesses do not celebrate Christmas, believing that the festival has pagan origins. Second, the religious group doesn’t allow its works to be exploited commercially, as per its own interpretation of the bible. Finally, Jehovah’s Witnesses reject all other religions, so being represented as a group alongside them in the album is offensive, to say the least.
Indeed, these topics and more have been the subject of intense discussion on various Jehovah’s Witness forums over the past several weeks. Many followers have been openly wondering why their leaders haven’t been following the rules, or at the least, why they aren’t doing anything to counter this affront to their religion.
As it turns out, those in command knew all about it well in advance and have been preparing a lawsuit.
Well the W/T need to get money back from somewhere to pay all the Victims of CSA.  it seems to just be business as usual for the GB & Co.
But i do find it kinda funny.  
 

Incorrect. That was not one of the multiple choice options. Try again.

It was already answered, by AlanF, and I will go ahead and answer it again in my next post. But you need to understand why "scholar JW" will always claim that it wasn't really answered. This type of question is a kind of game with "scholar JW." He has about 4 of these types of questions from what I can see.
If you have looked up his former behavior on all forums where he brings such things up, you'll see that "scholar JW" believes this must be a trick question. It's easy to answer correctly, and it's easy to answer in perfect agreement with the INSIGHT book. But "scholar JW" thinks he can be sneaky (slippery) by taking advantage of the fact that the INSIGHT book "waffles" on this point. The INSIGHT book is not as definitive as it could be, and "scholar JW" will use the indecision in the INSIGHT book against the person who answers.
Of course, if a person tries to answer in the same way the INSIGHT book answers it, "scholar JW" can point out that the person answering is being INDECISIVE, and is therefore weak and wrong. If you answer decisively according to the best choice offered in the INSIGHT book, "scholar JW" will simply point out that you did not take the other possible choice into account.
This game played by "scholar JW" works only because he counts on the idea that he thinks almost all JWs who watch these discussions are stupid. But JWs are not so stupid as "scholar JW" thinks. What really happens is that most JWs just won't look into it themselves out of their "fear for their comfort:" that they will have to deal with something they weren't prepared for. Another reason, seen in some Witnesses, is the preferred haughtiness of "knowing" they are always right and anyone who challenges that haughtiness, even another one of Jehovah's Witnesses, can be considered automatically wrong. But most JWs aren't stupid about these matters, they just have their reasons for not wanting to look into it.
In the congregation the reason not to look into such questions is "fear for their comfort." But discussion forums tend to attract people who want to show off their knowledge or their discoveries, along with a lot more people who think that they can feel superior by dismissing knowledge and discoveries, usually with something as simple as "That doesn't fit my religion or my ideology. Therefore, you are wrong, I am right, and I am therefore smarter and superior -- without even trying!"
This must be a great trick to feed someone's ego. And on a forum like this, "scholar JW" (and CC, too, for that matter) will have discovered a great secret. No matter what they say, no matter how stupid or how wrong, it will always be considered correct (and "smart") in front of several other forum-visiting Witnesses. On this topic, other Witnesses only have to think about whether it supports the 1914 doctrine (e.g. 607 for NEB18). If anyone can point out that what "scholar JW" claims happens to be inconsistent with the evidence or even with the WTS publications, it won't ever matter. Automatically, someone like "scholar JW" can be right, even though "scholar JW" doesn't even have to be familiar with the evidence. What could be simpler? One can "win" all arguments without even knowing anything. They can run away from evidence, simply deny it, create a diversion, make completely false counter-claims, and yet, even when they tell lies, they can still be considered almost like little "gods" at least to themselves.
And this now becomes a vicarious ego boost to all Witnesses who do not want to look up the information for themselves. The "smarter" that the person with evidence appears to a person like "scholar JW," the better the "win" against them by the "scholar JW's" of the world." (To this end "scholar JW" will make sure that the person with the most evidence is not just called "supposedly intelligent" but is also called an actual "expert" or "the one with the most information" or "the one who should be able to answer this question." After all, "they" (Witness discussion observers) have just vicariously "stood up" against people who thought they could explain supposedly "complex" secular evidence. The more familiar one seems with the secular evidence, the more the ego boost to the Witness who thinks they are siding with the Bible chronology versus secular chronology. The more complex and unexplainable the secular evidence seems, the better and smarter and haughtier they feel for being able to "win" over "complex" evidence without even needing to bother to look into it. 
That's because the Witness can now think: "Aha! We who support 1914 in the face of "complex" evidence are supporting the Watchtower Society, and therefore the Bible, and therefore Jehovah. And look how the Bible evidence that we Witnesses support is so much better and stronger than the evidence of so the called worldly intellectual. This makes us smarter than people with PhD's, smarter than all secular experts."
Later, when I come back, I'll go ahead and answer that question from "scholar JW."

Your words are good, but your view is that the faithful people of God are within the organization.  I think you need to turn full circle, and see your organization for what it is.  It is the GB/leadership in the elders, who oppose any truth about scripture from other anointed ones, as well as many who confront them about their lies...this dominion, which  makes it their business to "scoff".  So much so, that in judicial committees, the elders show their "enmity" toward truth. The GB's word is all that matters.   I am totally amazed at the support an organization is given that has so many failed teachings and prophesies.  
"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world."  1 John 4:1
You do know that every failed teaching that the GB says comes from God, proves that they are sinners?