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Patiently waiting for Truth

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  1. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in THE GREEK SCRIPTURES ARE FOR THE TRUE ANOINTED ONES.   
    Hello John. I presume your comment was aimed at me.  So firstly I'll quote you here
    Who is the "Head",   The obvious answer is that JESUS is the head. The True Anointed are the 'body of Christ' 
    Is this attitude going to heaven with you? Are you going to be this way after  gaining access to your crown in heaven?
    Answer: As far as i am aware i am not going to heaven. I have never said I'm Anointed and I've never had that longing. So where you get that idea from I do not know. BUT, now think on this, I am not promoting myself.   I am stating that the True Anointed are more important than the earthly class at this time.  
    However your GB do promote themselves, calling themselves the 'Faithful and Discreet Slave'  and saying only they, those 8 men, are to be believed and followed.  Remember that up to 2012 ALL Anointed were considered to be the F&DS, BUT the GB decided to announce in 2013 that ONLY THEY were the F&DS. The GB thereby exalted themselves above their Anointed Brothers.  A time will come soon when the scripture at Luke 14 v 11 will take place.
    For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and the one who humbles himself will be exalted.”
    Even though I am not so humble, I do not exalt myself. My concern is for the True Anointed remnant that are not yet doing the job, here on Earth, that they were Anointed for.  
    As for the 'slave class', I don't think the scripture was meant to be taken literally. It was a Question, not a statement. But your GB are happy to apply it to themselves, yet they refuse to believe the same scripture about the evil slave. 
  2. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in RESIGNATION OR DISFELLOWSHIPPING OF GB MEMBER?   
    Where did the original information come from ?    I'm in England so don't know if I'll be 'allowed' to view it. some things are blocked from UK viewing. 
  3. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to John Houston in THE GREEK SCRIPTURES ARE FOR THE TRUE ANOINTED ONES.   
    So you are saying that all those that are anointed have a say in the workings of the earthly organization while they are here, all of them, they are a part of the slave class? Who is the "Head", the Feet" the hands, the eyes, it is a body, so they all cannot be one thing but parts of the whole correct? So who is the head directing this class? Moses had this problem; Jesus had this problem also. No one wants to follow, to be humble, to be child-like. Is this attitude going to heaven with you? Are you going to be this way after  gaining access to your crown in heaven? Wanting to be ahead, leading, never following? The road is cramped not spacious, somebody has to be behind, following others.If you do not like those who are leading, make your own church like those others, then you can lead; but what we got is fine and if it is not correct, the HEAD will remove, not any of you who are bickering about it. That kind of pressure does not move him to act. You should know this by now! Fix you another cup of coffee and go about your day and let the GB/ELDERS/ANOINTED be, they have to answer to Jehovah God not you or any one else who thinks like you, ok! This medium allows you the time to vent and say what you want, it feels good right? But it changes nothing. It helps my typing skills, I getting very good. So have a good day and stay safe, remember to wash your hands and wear a mask!
  4. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in RESIGNATION OR DISFELLOWSHIPPING OF GB MEMBER?   
    I can't find any other information than what the video states.  Once the video is played (if valid), it should be available to watch any time.  If there is another source of information found regarding this, I'll post it here for you.  
  5. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in RESIGNATION OR DISFELLOWSHIPPING OF GB MEMBER?   
    It is telling me that it will play in 2 hours, which would be 5:00 EST.  You can be alerted when the program starts.  I guess we'll know then if it is valid.
  6. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in THE GREEK SCRIPTURES ARE FOR THE TRUE ANOINTED ONES.   
    The meek shall inherit the earth - together with Abraham, Noah, Isaac, Jacob, Job, Enoch.  Since the same Christian principals apply to both anointed and those who receive earthly resurrection, the new testament must be read just as much and enthusiastically by all.  It is good for teaching and correction in righteousness for all who want to live a clean and faithful life. 
     
  7. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in TWO FACES OF "JWORG Official Website of JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES"   
    1 - EXPLANATION FOR PUBLIC
    Frequently Asked Questions - https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/jw-bible-study/
    Am I Expected to Become One of Jehovah’s Witnesses if I Study the Bible With Them?
    No, you are not obligated in any way. Millions enjoy our Bible study program without becoming Jehovah’s Witnesses. * The purpose of the program is to show you what the Bible teaches. What you decide to do with that knowledge is up to you. We recognize that faith is a personal matter.
    Why do you study with people who don’t join your faith?
    Our primary motive is love for Jehovah God,......We feel that there is no greater privilege than to be “God’s fellow workers” in helping people to learn what his Word teaches.— We are also motivated by love for our neighbors. -- We find joy in sharing with others the wonderful things we have learned.—.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    2 - INSTRUCTIONS FOR JW MEMBERS
    How to Conduct a Bible Study That Leads to Baptism—Part Two - https://www.jw.org/en/library/magazines/watchtower-study-october-2020/How-to-Conduct-a-Bible-Study-That-Leads-to-Baptism-Part-Two/
    THE disciple-making work is a lifesaving work! How do we know? When Jesus gave the command that is recorded at Matthew 28:19, 20, he said: “Go, . . . make disciples . . . , baptizing them.” ......To make disciples, we need to develop the “art of teaching.”....But as noted in the preceding article, we want to know how we can help more of them to become baptized disciples of Jesus Christ.  Teachers must show genuine, personal interest in their students. View them as your future spiritual brothers or sisters. It is not easy for them to give up friends in the world and to make all the necessary changes to serve Jehovah. We need to help them find true friends in the congregation. Talk openly about Christian dedication and baptism. After all, our goal in  conducting a Bible study is to help a person become a baptized disciple. Within a few months of having a regular Bible study and especially after beginning to attend meetings, the student should understand that the purpose of the Bible study is to help him to start serving Jehovah as one of His Witnesses.
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Well, let us repeat what looks like two explanations on JWorg web. First, explanatory sentence for PUBLIC! 
    1) THE PURPOSE of the program is to show you what the Bible teaches.
    Now, as second explanation, JW MEMBERS are reminded WHAT is purpose of Bible Study.
    2)  After all, our goal in  conducting a Bible study is to help a person become a baptized disciple....the student should understand that THE PURPOSE of the Bible study is to help him to start serving Jehovah as one of His Witnesses.
     
  8. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in A FLOWCHART THAT TELLS THE TRUTH   
    GB has a problem with how to incorporate some biblical concepts into the workings of the WT JWorg Organization. The term “holy spirit” occupies one of the three most significant places (Father, Son, Holy Spirit) that can be read about in the Bible.
    1) Is the explanation of who or what the holy spirit is properly explained in WTJWorg theology?
    2) WTJWorg argues that the workings of the Holy Spirit in the past and today are quite different when it comes to the manner and type of "communication" between “Heaven and Earth”.
    3) Why does WTJWorg have trouble with the term/word "inspired"?                                                          4)They say, the WTJWorg Organization and the JW people in the organization are not "inspired by the spirit," but they are "guided by the spirit," "the spirit helps them," the spirit leads them, "the spirit empowered them," "spirit teaches them" and so on. What is the difference?
  9. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in Jehovah Is Directing His Organization ??????????????   
    For those JWs who don't believe in 1914, they should read this.   For those JWs who believe Christ was reigning as King when on the earth, they should take note. This is how the organization established itself, on pure lies.   How dare they use Judges 21:25, when scriptures clearly indicate that he was an established king when he came to earth. 
    My kingdom is not of this world,” said Jesus. “If my kingdom were of this world, my servants would fight, so that I wouldn’t be handed over to the Jews. But as it is, my kingdom is not from here.”
    37 “You are a king then?” Pilate asked.
    “You say that I’m a king,” Jesus replied. “I was born for this, and I have come into the world for this: to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth listens to my voice.”  John 18:36-37
    "He is the radiance of the glory of God and the exact imprint of his nature, and he upholds the universe by the word of his power. After making purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, having become as much superior to angels as the name he has inherited is more excellent than theirs."   Heb 1:3,4
    Who would deceive us by saying that Christ didn't become a reigning king until 1914?
    Who would desire an earthly kingdom based on the falsehood that Jesus was not reigning for 2,000 years after he was resurrected?
    Who offers the kingdoms of this world, with  riches,  prominence and rulership over people?  
    Who desired to destroy Christ?
    Who desires to destroy the members of his Body?
    Look what happened to Stephen when he tried to explain the new way of worship. He was killed, just as what happens to those who try explain  the reign of Christ.  They are termed spiritually "dead" through disfellowshipping - for rejecting an earthly organization.   Disfellowshipping is Satan's way of shutting up the truth about Christ.  The  organization  has created a "world" based on what God rejected - literal "temples" for worship, the choosing of an organizational structure based on earthly matters.  It is filled with blasphemous names and titles -  about itself and its false power and authority over God's anointed.  (Rev 13:1,2)   It is the furthest thing from spiritual righteousness.  It is the enemy of God's spiritual "organization" built on Christ. (1 Cor 12)  Doesn't God and Jesus have the power to know each heart?  Wouldn't they already know who their faithful slaves are and have been over the centuries?   How dare men assume they are superior to Jesus Christ in knowing his servants. 
    Look JWs, the organization is Satan's plan to derail God's Kingdom.  You have been deceived. Wickedness has found its pedestal - the "mountainlike organization" that destroys righteousness. 
     
    "Then the angel who was speaking with me came forward and told me, “Look up and see what this is that is approaching.”
    6 So I asked, “What is it?”
    He responded, “It’s a measuring basket that is approaching.” And he continued, “This is their iniquity in all the land.” 7 Then a lead cover was lifted, and there was a woman sitting inside the basket. 8 “This is Wickedness,” he said. He shoved her down into the basket and pushed the lead weight over its opening. 9 Then I looked up and saw two women approaching with the wind in their wings. Their wings were like those of a stork, and they lifted up the basket between earth and sky.
    10 So I asked the angel who was speaking with me, “Where are they taking the basket?”
    11 “To build a shrine for it in the land of Shinar,” he told me. “When that is ready, the basket will be placed there on its pedestal.”  Zech 5:5-11
    While there are anointed outside of the organization who "fight" on the side of Christ - who expose the WT's lies,  the GB "fights" on the side of its own established wickedness.  They haven't returned to "apostolic teachings", but are false apostles who have set a foundation of doctrine outside of scripture.   For the organization and its leaders to exalt its past leadership and its documented vault of lies, shows what king they have chosen to reign over them.   (John 8:42-47)
    The anointed are messengers - the Greek meaning of "angel".  What message do those "angels" in the organization bear?  "come to Jehovah's organization for salvation".
    What "testimony" is given by Jesus' true servants?
    Rev 14:6-12 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Rev+14%3A6-13&version=CSB
    I didn't use enough scriptures to back up my words, of which I apologize.   I am responding on emotions against unrighteousness.  The sad thing, I am sure there are JWs who have blocked my comments - out of fear, a power their leaders have over them.  So, they preserve their "life" by choosing lies over truth.   
    2 Thess 2:9-12; Matt 10:37-39
     
     
     
     
     
     
  10. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Appointed / Elected / Selected - GB, Elders and others   
    @César Chávez is this your best to offer? No comments, but emoticons aka emotional reaction? :))
  11. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from César Chávez in Churches' fears for conversion bill are unfounded   
    https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/churches-fears-for-conversion-bill-are-unfounded-20201215-p56no3.html
    I think this article puts a bit of balance on things. 
     
    The Victorian government’s bill to ban LGBTQ+ conversion practices has raised confusion and disquiet in some religious communities about potential threats to their religious freedoms.
    These fears are quickly assuaged by a plain reading of the bill and the statement of compatibility with the Charter of Human Rights.
    The Victorian bill carefully weighs the protection of religious freedom against the protection of the rights of LGBTQ+ people and is the product of significant consultation. It does not ban prayer, preaching or pastoral support about gender and sexuality in general. But it does prevent these spiritual practices being misused in attempts to change or suppress a person’s sexuality or gender identity and thereby causing them harm. It has been found to be consistent with Victorian human rights law and does not constitute an overreach.
    Placing limits on religious practices, as proposed in this bill, is not new. Both Australian law and international human rights law provide guidance on when it is appropriate to place limitations on religious practices.
    There are numerous examples where we do this already in Australian law. Jehovah’s Witnesses hold religious objections to blood transfusions, but Australian law overrides the practice of that belief in circumstances where a blood transfusion is necessary to save the life of a child. Several religious communities have traditions of female genital cutting. Yet Australian law overrides that religious practice, making it both illegal to perform in Australia or to remove someone overseas for the practice. And more recently, several Australian jurisdictions have followed the recommendations of the child abuse royal commission to limit the seal of confession in order to protect children from sexual abuse.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    So. we know from scripture that the Superior Authorities are placed or are allowed to be in their position by Almighty God. 
    And we can see some good here that this government is trying to stop female genital cutting and to protect children from sexual abuse. 
    The position concerning blood transfusions is a difficult one. A secular government has to make secular decisions completely separate from religious bias. 
    So at this moment in time it does not look as if they are trying to wipe out Christianity, as some people pretend they are.  
     
  12. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Anna in Churches' fears for conversion bill are unfounded   
    https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/churches-fears-for-conversion-bill-are-unfounded-20201215-p56no3.html
    I think this article puts a bit of balance on things. 
     
    The Victorian government’s bill to ban LGBTQ+ conversion practices has raised confusion and disquiet in some religious communities about potential threats to their religious freedoms.
    These fears are quickly assuaged by a plain reading of the bill and the statement of compatibility with the Charter of Human Rights.
    The Victorian bill carefully weighs the protection of religious freedom against the protection of the rights of LGBTQ+ people and is the product of significant consultation. It does not ban prayer, preaching or pastoral support about gender and sexuality in general. But it does prevent these spiritual practices being misused in attempts to change or suppress a person’s sexuality or gender identity and thereby causing them harm. It has been found to be consistent with Victorian human rights law and does not constitute an overreach.
    Placing limits on religious practices, as proposed in this bill, is not new. Both Australian law and international human rights law provide guidance on when it is appropriate to place limitations on religious practices.
    There are numerous examples where we do this already in Australian law. Jehovah’s Witnesses hold religious objections to blood transfusions, but Australian law overrides the practice of that belief in circumstances where a blood transfusion is necessary to save the life of a child. Several religious communities have traditions of female genital cutting. Yet Australian law overrides that religious practice, making it both illegal to perform in Australia or to remove someone overseas for the practice. And more recently, several Australian jurisdictions have followed the recommendations of the child abuse royal commission to limit the seal of confession in order to protect children from sexual abuse.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    So. we know from scripture that the Superior Authorities are placed or are allowed to be in their position by Almighty God. 
    And we can see some good here that this government is trying to stop female genital cutting and to protect children from sexual abuse. 
    The position concerning blood transfusions is a difficult one. A secular government has to make secular decisions completely separate from religious bias. 
    So at this moment in time it does not look as if they are trying to wipe out Christianity, as some people pretend they are.  
     
  13. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Matthew9969 in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    What gave your governing gods the right to judge apostates worthy of death?
     
  14. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Matthew9969 in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    All you have to do is look at all the proven court cases of jw boys being molested by jw men to substantiate that there are plenty of gay jw's.
  15. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Matthew9969 in UZBEKISTAN: Registration applications denied, officials refuse to explain why   
    I wonder if jw's will believe this is persecution only on them and not the rest of the christian religions trying to apply?
  16. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Appointed / Elected / Selected - GB, Elders and others   
    Part 2.  In this part we will examine nature and meaning of terminology used in WT publications. Here we have main thing, head of problem/answer to understand governing model in WTJWorg. Expression in WT magazine said: the superior appointment of the “faithful and discreet slave. Did you ever before noticed such terminology? FDS aka GB got superior appointment. They have, they are holders of inviolable status. Based on 1919 premise how Jesus and God declared, in heaven, in invisible manner, that Rutherford and people gathered in Bible Students movement, incorporated in WTS are chosen one, are appointed. 
    What is meaning of the words appointment/appointed?  
    - to assign officially, as for a position, responsibility, etc to establish by agreement or decree; to nominate (a person)
    - assigned, appointed, elected, commissioned, selected, elected, installed, delegated, nominated
    Well, procedure and process about it is quit interesting. GB explained "the 1919 process" in manner how Jesus came invisible to Earth and found Russell (of the deceased), Rutherford and Bible Students as only worth to be appointed by Him, because the WTS organization was the only one to teach the truth. Of course, this "Jesus' declaration" is without any evidence and proof. In sense, how only Rutherford and few other in WTS were in position "to hear Jesus' voice" about this.
    Today, we only have Bible Students history, and with our examination of their teachings in those days, we are also able to establish some facts about their past and present claims and their "position before Jesus and God". But also have some interesting explanatory sentences, here and there, about issue. And with this little details we are able to see how questionable are such claims made by individuals and collective in WTJWorg. For example this below:  
    And although Jesus—“the head of every man”—is in heaven, there are still on earth “the remaining ones” of his anointed brothers, who have the hope of ruling with him in the heavens. (Revelation 12:17; 20:6) These make up the composite “faithful and discreet slave.” Christians show their submission to Jesus, and therefore to Jesus’ head, Jehovah, by accepting the oversight of that “slave.” (Matthew 24:45-47; 25:40) -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1998643
    I put in bold this two things in their paragraph. Let me paraphrase :
    Because they are people who have the hope of ruling with him in the heavens it is obvious how  These make up the composite “faithful and discreet slave.  
    Another thing is important question; If by any chance Jesus chose someone in 1919, is that Jesus' appointment inherited, transitions from one member to a new one? Or would it be logical for each new person to be appointed in new appointment process? And that to be made by Jesus, again, and not from some earthly member of the earthly organization?
    In WTJWorg process how to put them (candidate for elder, MS, etc) in some position are same, in fact with similar process in all democratic societies. And that is; appointed / elected / selected ....through process of elections and voting. Those process can be open voting and closed voting. WTJWorg Administration, elders and congregational members participate in such system.
     
  17. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Appointed / Elected / Selected - GB, Elders and others   
    Part 1.  In this part we will meet few quotes in article from one WT magazine which describes administrative functions in WTJWorg past. Many of them stayed till today. 
    Please be free to comment. 
     
    Following Faithful Shepherds with Life in View - https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1967723
    This means we must prove our faith by our course of action, by the things we do. It means that righteous requirements of the King Jesus Christ must be met.......Therefore, in submitting to Jehovah’s visible theocratic organization, we must be in full and complete agreement with every feature of its apostolic procedure and requirements.
    UNITY MAINTAINED BY SUBMISSION
    ...In this way today too the governing body of the Christian congregation serves the entire organization. Solutions to problems arising in one locality are widely circulated so that the unity and oneness of the entire organization might be maintained...In submitting yourself to Jehovah’s visible organization as administered by such servants, you are still not required or expected to follow men..... It is the faith of these men that is to be imitated and their course of conduct that is to be observed....These men too, though occupying responsible positions of oversight themselves, recognize and submit to the superior appointment of the “faithful and discreet slave.”....The account says: “In those days there was no king in Israel.” (Judg. 21:25) So it was in the earlier days of the modern theocratic organization. Jehovah’s administration of righteousness took a pronounced forward step with the return of the Christian congregation to apostolic teachings. But before the King, Jesus Christ, was enthroned in 1914 C.E. the organization was loosely administered. Each “ecclesia” or congregation was self-governed by elected “elders” and “deacons.” But in 1914 Jehovah enthroned his King Jesus Christ, and from 1919 onward the time became due for Jeremiah’s prophecy to be fulfilled: “‘And I myself shall collect together the remnant of my sheep out of all the lands to which I had dispersed them, and I will bring them back to their pasture ground, and they will certainly be fruitful and become many. And I will raise up over them shepherds who will actually shepherd them; and they will be afraid no more, neither will they be struck with any terror, and none will be missing,’ is the utterance of Jehovah.”—Jer. 23:3, 4.
    12 This benefit of theocratic administration did not come all at once. In 1932 the “elective elders” were replaced in the congregation by an appointed “service director,” who was assisted by a group of mature members of the congregation democratically elected to their positions. But not until 1938 did the final change to strictly theocratic order take place. In that year, through the columns of The Watchtower, it was revealed from the Scriptures that the power of appointment of servants in congregations rightfully rests with the governing body of the “faithful and discreet slave” as directed by Jesus Christ from Jehovah’s temple.* This important step in the restoration of theocratic order assured Jehovah’s “sheep” that they would not again be separated into independent “flocks” by unscrupulous “shepherds.” The shepherds that Jehovah promised through Jeremiah would be those fully in agreement with Jesus’ words that “they will become one flock, one shepherd.”—John 10:16.
    14 In 1942 the change came. In the throes of World War II, with the change in administrations of the second and third presidents of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society,...The years since 1942 have told their tale regarding the exploits of the anointed Elisha class, accompanied by an ever-increasing number of the “great crowd.”—Rev. 7:9-17.
    On February 1, 1943, the Watchtower Bible School of Gilead was set up for training missionaries and special representatives of the Watch Tower Society to serve in all parts of the earth. That same year, 1943, a new training program, the Theocratic Ministry School, began in the congregations of Jehovah’s witnesses. At first only male students were enrolled in these schools, but in 1958 provision was made for the women of the congregations to enroll and participate.
    20 Such a theocratic view of matters will enable you always to keep pace with the organization, neither running ahead nor lagging dangerously behind. You will encounter trying circumstances. Do not be overcome by them. Wait on Jehovah and put your hope in him. (Ps. 37:34; 27:14) It might even be that reproof will be necessary on occasion. Do not become offended. If you do, you are undoubtedly taking yourself too seriously, failing to see the point of the reproof. Nor should you persuade yourself that you are of no use to the organization and quit simply because some mistake may be drawn to your attention. Rather, “my son, do not belittle the discipline from Jehovah, neither give out when you are corrected by him; for whom Jehovah loves he disciplines; in fact, he scourges every one whom he receives as a son.”—Heb. 12:5, 6.
    21 On the other hand, it may be that your advancement will be rapid. Guard against an attitude of super-faithfulness. It might ensnare you. Do not feel that others in the congregation are slow and backward. You might even become impatient with the organization. Consider instead the example of Moses, who pleaded with Jehovah to spare his typical theocratic nation when some faithless ones in the organization sinned against Jehovah and brought his anger down upon the entire congregation. (Ex. 32:1-14) Neither should you wait constantly to be directed as to the theocratic activity assigned. Eagerly assume individual responsibility and seek ways of advancing the Kingdom interests in harmony with the program currently outlined by the “faithful and discreet slave.”
    22. Why, then, should we stick loyally to Jehovah’s visible organization?
    22 The Bible sets forth every inducement and encouragement to place the theocratic organization ahead of oneself, to accept it in all its features and stick to it loyally. The theocratic pace of activity is still increasing. What Jehovah will yet require of his faithful servants on earth before Armageddon he will reveal in due time. Staying close to his visible theocratic organization is the only way to find out. Having identified that organization and God’s righteous requirements expressed through his channel, never let it go. Follow Jehovah’s faithful shepherds so that, “just as sin ruled as king with death, likewise also undeserved kindness might rule as king through righteousness with everlasting life in view through Jesus Christ our Lord.”—Rom. 5:21.
  18. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Jehovah Is Directing His Organization ??????????????   
    Part 2.  In this part we will examine nature and meaning of terminology used in WT publications. Here we have main thing, head of problem/answer to understand governing model in WTJWorg. Expression in WT magazine said: the superior appointment of the “faithful and discreet slave. Did you ever before noticed such terminology? FDS aka GB got superior appointment. They have, they are holders of inviolable status. Based on 1919 premise how Jesus and God declared, in heaven, in invisible manner, that Rutherford and people gathered in Bible Students movement, incorporated in WTS are chosen one, are appointed. 
    What is meaning of the words appointment/appointed?  
    - to assign officially, as for a position, responsibility, etc to establish by agreement or decree; to nominate (a person)
    - assigned, appointed, elected, commissioned, selected, elected, installed, delegated, nominated
    Well, procedure and process about it is quit interesting. GB explained "the 1919 process" in manner how Jesus came invisible to Earth and found Russell (of the deceased), Rutherford and Bible Students as only worth to be appointed by Him, because the WTS organization was the only one to teach the truth. Of course, this "Jesu declaration" is without any evidence and proof. In sense, how only Rutherford and few other in WTS were in position "to hear Jesus' voice" about this.
    Today, we only have Bible Students history, and with our examination of their teachings in those days, we are also able to establish some facts about their past and present claims and their "position before Jesus and God". But also have some interesting explanatory sentences, here and there, about issue. And with this little details we are able to see how questionable are such claims made by individuals and collective in WTJWorg. For example this below:  
    And although Jesus—“the head of every man”—is in heaven, there are still on earth “the remaining ones” of his anointed brothers, who have the hope of ruling with him in the heavens. (Revelation 12:17; 20:6) These make up the composite “faithful and discreet slave.” Christians show their submission to Jesus, and therefore to Jesus’ head, Jehovah, by accepting the oversight of that “slave.” (Matthew 24:45-47; 25:40) -https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1998643
    I put in bold this two things in their paragraph. Let me paraphrase :
    Because they are people who have the hope of ruling with him in the heavens it is obvious how  These make up the composite “faithful and discreet slave.  
    Another thing is important question; If by any chance Jesus chose someone in 1919, is that Jesus' appointment inherited, transitions from one member to a new one? Or would it be logical for each new person to be appointed in new appointment process? And that to be made by Jesus, again, and not from some earthly member of the earthly organization?
    In WTJWorg process how to put them (candidate for elder, MS, etc) in some position are same, in fact with similar process in all democratic societies. And that is; appointed / elected / selected ....through process of elections and voting. Those process can be open voting and closed voting. WTJWorg Administration, elders and congregational members participate in such system.
    If you don't mind i will make new topic about these process :)) with this two comments as start.
  19. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Matthew9969 in Belgium: Jehovah's Witnesses will be tried for hate crimes on February 16.   
    Here are many examples of printed hate speech towards disfellowshipped ones, even non disfellowshipped ones who leave the organization to worship with another religion.
    Watchtower Quotes Regarding Apostates (jwfacts.com)
     
  20. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Jehovah Is Directing His Organization ??????????????   
    As i remember one of WT representatives said exactly that before Court.
    In a child abuse case (J Lopez v Watchtower and Bible Tract Society of New York Inc.) in Apr 2016 the WTS claimed the rights of clergy in not producing documentation about the abuse under clergy-penitent privileges (19). Also, in a court case in California in 2012 the attorney for the WTS stated that;
    “I am general counsel for the National Organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses out of Brooklyn, New York…We are a hierarchical religion structured just like the Catholic Church” (20)
    I am in searching for this Court document on internet but am not successful
  21. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in Jehovah Is Directing His Organization ??????????????   
    "It doesn’t take a genius to see what is being depicted in this illustration. This is a clear and unambiguous example of a hierarchy – right down to the numbering of the various groups or positions. It is a list of the various operational elements of the Watch Tower Society in a descending order of importance. When you look closely, you notice that even the chairs are more comfortable the higher up the ladder you happen to be! Governing Body members get plush leather executive chairs, while branch office members must make do with plain office swivel chairs. If you are an elder, you can consider yourself lucky to get a school canteen chair! Evidently the more privileged you are in God’s organization, the more seat padding you require.
    The Governing Body is now so comfortable with its authority that it sees nothing inappropriate about identifying the individual members on an organizational chart But there are other things that are noticeable about this illustration on close inspection. You notice that the current Governing Body members have vainly had their likenesses depicted in the illustration so that, when you look closely enough, they are individually recognizable.
    Perhaps of most striking significance is the one notable absentee from the illustration – Jesus Christ. True, the Society would likely argue that this is a picture depicting the earthly part of God’s organization, and Christ is in the heavenly part. Even so, this hasn’t stopped the Society from depicting Jehovah on his heavenly chariot in the same illustration. Even some of the angels are present. So why no Jesus? Especially if he is supposed to be “head of the congregation?” (Eph. 5:23)
    The answer is simple. Christ plays no role whatsoever in this organization and never actually has. His absence from this illustration may well be an oversight, but it is a telling one. The Governing Body is well and truly in charge, and they want us to know it. They take their orders from nobody but themselves. In this way, they are really no different from the Pope. In fact, take a look at this diagram I have prepared, which I believe demonstrates quite clearly that the hierarchical structures of the Catholic Church and Watch Tower Society are now eerily similar."

    https://jwsurvey.org/cedars-blog/are-jehovahs-witnesses-a-hierarchical-religion-and-does-it-matter
  22. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in DO THE GB HAVE PLANS FOR THE COMING GREAT TRIBULATION ?   
    "The man of sin will come with the power of Satan. He will use every kind of power, including miraculous and wonderful signs. But they will be lies. 10 He will use everything that God disapproves of to deceive those who are dying, those who refused to love the truth that would save them. 11 That’s why God will send them a powerful delusion so that they will believe a lie. 12 Then everyone who did not believe the truth, but was delighted with what God disapproves of, will be condemned. 2 Thess 2:9-12 GWT
    How does God "send" the delusion?  1 Kings chapter 22 gives us an example.
  23. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in DO THE GB HAVE PLANS FOR THE COMING GREAT TRIBULATION ?   
    Yes, I hear that word, but translated to mean -
    "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly are ravening wolves."  Matt 7:15
    Their true identity as wolves appears when we dare question their teachings and their "authority"...as "slaves".  
    Jesus said to them, “The kings (elders) of nations  have power over their people, and those in authority call themselves friends of the people. ("beloved GB")  But you’re not going to be that way! Rather, the greatest among you must be like the youngest, and your leader must be like a servant.  Who’s the greatest, the person who sits at the table or the servant? Isn’t it really the person who sits at the table? But I’m among you as a servant."  Luke 22:25-27 GWT
     
  24. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in DO THE GB HAVE PLANS FOR THE COMING GREAT TRIBULATION ?   
    I do believe the earth will be cleansed of all evil, but there's more to it. There is a physical manifestation devised by Satan to divert the attention of the anointed in the WT (and all), and a spiritual manifestation based on truth battling against lies.   I thought of posting a long article on here, but if you go directly to the blog link, the scriptures pop up, which does not work in the interests of this forum.  The article was written by the husband of Pearl Doxsey, an anointed one.
    http://armageddon-obadiah.blogspot.com/
  25. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Jehovah Is Directing His Organization ??????????????   
    https://www.jw.org/en/library/magazines/watchtower-study-october-2020/Jehovah-Is-Directing-His-Organization/
    1. And you need to keep building your confidence that Jehovah is using his organization today.
    2 Today, Jehovah directs his organization in a way that reflects his personality, purpose, and standards. Let us consider three of Jehovah’s attributes that are reflected in his organization. 
    7. As far back as July 1881, this magazine could say: “We were not called, nor anointed to receive honor and amass wealth but to spend and be spent, and to preach the good news.
    Something went wrong there then. The Watchtower has amassed wealth and real estate. 
    11 In the first century. The governing body in Jerusalem worked unitedly to maintain order and peace among God’s people. (Acts 2:42) For example, when the issue of circumcision came to a head about 49 C.E., the governing body, under  the direction of holy spirit, considered the matter.
    There was NO governing body in the 1st century.  And the circumcision account seems to be the only account the GB can find to talk about. The Apostle Paul was no part of the Twelve in Jerusalem, and it was Paul that wrote under inspiration of Holy Spirit, to all the Congregations. It would seem that Paul had as much authority as the Twelve. 
    15 By means of “the faithful and discreet slave,” 
    Here we see this lie again. The Bible, God's word, does not give any mention as to who the F&DS is, but the GB exalt themselves to that position. 
    17 Soon, the only organization left on earth will be the one led by God’s spirit. So zealously work with Jehovah’s organization. 
    Then as Satan’s world comes to its end, you will not be fearful. Instead, you will confidently stand among those who are loyally serving with Jehovah’s organization.
    This whole article promotes the GB and the Organisation. It does not give any direction to serve God through JESUS CHRIST. 
    The only time Jesus is mentioned is in connection with the disciples. 
    How do you serve Almighty God ? 
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