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Patiently waiting for Truth

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  1. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    So your type of 'normal people' just follow blindly then. Just as JWs blindly follow the GB. Your choice of course.
    I would sooner serve God through Christ. But if you wish to serve your GB blindly without looking into the 'inner workings' of your religion, then you will judged on that. 
  2. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    With WT, there is no program that separates children from parents. Almost all abuse reported is cases among the ‘rank and file’—those from elders or servants are unusual. 
    So says @TrueTomHarley 
    He is deliberately stating falsehoods here.  And I will continue to look for and post every article I can find to prove that Elders and Ministerial Servants commit Child Sexual Abuse. 
    Also, I will post every article concerning all levels of 'people with responsibility' within the CCJW that deliberately hide Child Sexual Abuse / Pedophilia within the CCJW by not reporting it. 
    By not reporting CSA the Elders and others are allowing a pedophile to remain in the congregation unknown to other congregants and unknown to the public. They are allowing such a pedophile to continue to abuse children and to continue to break the law. 
    Whilst there might not be a specific 'programme' of separating children from parents, it is obvious that such separating is allowed and approved of. I know it happens so no point in pretending it doesn't. 
    It happens for personal Bible study, and, for ministry. 
  3. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    moral obligation =
    Point 1 - An obligation arising out of considerations of right and wrong; "he did it out of a feeling of moral obligation"
     A duty which one owes, and which he ought to perform, but which he is not legally bound to fulfill.
     These obligations are of two kinds 1st. 
    Point 2 - Those founded on a natural right; as, the obligation to be charitable, which can never be enforced by law. 2d.  
    Point 3 - Those which are supported by a good or valuable antecedent consideration;
     
    What is ground for moral obligation? Whether GB is missing any of these three points? What moral (or religious, or charity, or company) standard allows GB not to respond to a moral obligation, an official call from the authorities or the law?
    I don’t think this is about whether JWs have or not have separate classes in which they teach young children, without the presence of parents, to their religious education. This is how an institution (WTJWorg) and each JW congregation reacted/reacts to the CSA in its circle.
    WTJWorg and congregations failed that test.
     
  4. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    So called "normal" people perhaps are not members of WTJWorg ?
    Do "normal" people who are JW members care about "inner workings" of GB+Helpers+Lawyers+Elders? 
  5. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    The whole point is that anyone can do whatever they want. 
    Only if a person wants to serve Jehovah, then they must abide by his rules. They must hate what Jehovah hates. 
    This is why it can be said that JWs are neutral with respect to what the world does. But they are definitely not neutral with respect to what the congregation does.
  6. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to TrueTomHarley in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    The key words here are “we think.”
    The WT thinks differently and their thinking makes more sense. To my knowledge, every other party in this redress plan is structured so that children will be separated from their parents—it is not optional—it is standard operating procedure. That being the case, it stands to reason that they should be penalized if they so separate children and then fail to protect them.
    With WT, there is no program that separates children from parents. Almost all abuse reported is cases among the ‘rank and file’—those from elders or servants are unusual. 
    So—it is “within the ranks” in the case of Jehovah’s Witnesses. In these other organizations, there is not even a means to track abuse entirely among ordinary members—let alone the supposition that anyone other than the actual perpetrators ought be held responsible. So the WT should sign on to some plan that equates them to groups that systemically separate children from parents? I think not, and so apparently do they.
    Next thing you know Hyundai will be penalized for any abuse that occurs among its customers. No. The WT being substantially different, it is better to handle all cases on an individual basis rather sign on to some plan that lumps everyone together as though they all operate the same.
    And, goodness knows, these things are often a wedge to drive in further concessions. Even a formal apology that some seem to feel is so important, will no doubt have huge implications in the world of lawyers—who will seize upon it as though a guilty plea.
     
     
  7. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    Robert Luccioni "morning worship" or morning manipulation and damage control, quote:
    "Wicked men and impostors would also inflame statements that people did not understand ...."
    GB blamed in past and blame today own members because they "inflame" WT statements in publications. Do readers of this WT magazines need to, at all, to "inflame" what was already "inflamed"?? about 1941 and 1975??
    Never was there a more moving Sight in these "last days". Many, including strong men, wept at the demonstration. Receiving the gift, the marching children clasped it to them, not a toy or plaything for idle pleasure, but the Lord's provided Instrument for most effective work   in the remaining months before Armageddon. What a gift I and to so many! The manner of releasing the new book Children was an outnght surprise to all, but the almighty hand of the All-wise One, Jehovah, was in it, and the maneuver was most blessed indeed. Thereafter Children, the author's edition, was disposed of to adult conventioneers, on a contribution.   Watchtower 1941 September 15 Page 288
     
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------   “Does God’s rest day parallel the time man has been on earth since his creation? Apparently so. In what year, then, would the first 6,000 years of man’s existence and also the first 6,000 years of Gods rest day come to an end? The year 1975. It means that within a relatively few years we will witness the fulfillment of the remaining prophecies that have to do with the “time of the end”.”Awake! 1966 Oct 8 pp.19-20   “The immediate future is certain to be filled with climactic events, for this old system is nearing its complete end. Within a few years at most the final parts of Bible prophecy relative to these “last days” will undergo fulfillment.” Watchtower 1968 May 1 p.272   “The fact that fifty-four years of the period called the “last days” have already gone by is highly significant. It means that only a few years, at most, remain before the corrupt system of things dominating the earth is destroyed by God.” Awake! 1968 Oct 8 p.13   “If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. Of the generation that observed the beginning of the “last days” in 1914, Jesus foretold: “This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.”-Matt. 24:34. Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!” Awake! 1969 May 22 p.15      
  8. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    copy/paste from @4Jah2me topic: 
    Social Services Minister Anne Ruston said institutions facing an application for redress were expected to join the scheme.
    Jehovah's Witnesses, Kenja Communications and the Lakes Entrance Pony Club are some of the groups holding out.
    "We've been extremely disappointed in the behaviour of the Jehovah's Witnesses," the minister told ABC radio on Friday.
    "We have spent a lot of time trying to explain to them what we think is their moral obligation to participate in this scheme but they have to date declined to do so."
    Survivors can't be given redress unless the institution they were abused by has joined the scheme.
    WTJWorg is "morally neutral" :)) as in same-sex marriage issue ?? It seems how "redress" is also about "political issue" and not "moral issue" ??!! ... or, it is only about "money issue"? :))
  9. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Redress groups risk losing charity status (update)   
    https://7news.com.au/politics/redress-groups-risk-losing-charity-status-c-1659571
    We know this is not actually new news but is just an update
    Institutions refusing to join the national child abuse redress scheme face losing charity status through new laws planned by the Morrison government.
    The government has for months threatened groups failing to join the abuse scheme that they risked losing their charity status and would be banned from receiving federal funding.   The wheels are turning on that threat, with the government planning to introduce draft legislation to parliament in the year's final sitting fortnight to tweak charity laws.
    Social Services Minister Anne Ruston said institutions facing an application for redress were expected to join the scheme.
    Jehovah's Witnesses, Kenja Communications and the Lakes Entrance Pony Club are some of the groups holding out.
    "We've been extremely disappointed in the behaviour of the Jehovah's Witnesses," the minister told ABC radio on Friday.
    "We have spent a lot of time trying to explain to them what we think is their moral obligation to participate in this scheme but they have to date declined to do so."
    Survivors can't be given redress unless the institution they were abused by has joined the scheme.
    The scheme can offer counselling, a direct response from responsible institutions and a redress payment.  ... There are 80 institutions the government hopes will join by the end of the year, and about half are charities. ...The proposed laws change the definition of a basic religious charity to remove a religious institution's eligibility to be classified as one if it has been named in a redress application but refuses to join....A new charities standard would also require registered charities to take all reasonable steps to be part of the scheme if a claim has been or was likely to be made against them. Assistant Charities Minister Zed Seselja aid the changes could result in some institutions being deregistered as charities.   "Deregistration would result in the entity losing access to a range of commonwealth benefits, tax and other concessions," he said. ... About 150 redress claims can now be processed after another 70 institutions joined the scheme. .. More than 8700 applications have been made in total but only 4221 have been processed. ... Head of survivor advocacy group Blue Knot Foundation Cathy Kezelman has applauded the government for the charity plan, saying the groups are not taking responsibility.
    "Every survivor living with the long-term impacts of trauma and abuse is one person too many," Dr Kezelman said.
    "It is time for zero tolerance to the systemic ducking and weaving and abject moral decay institutions failing to join the scheme perpetuate."
    Separate repost says 
    The Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse shocked the nation as it highlighted the systemic failures of thousands of our mainstream institutions. To have 80 institutions abrogating their moral and human responsibility for the often irreparable harm caused to child under their watch is indefensible.
    It is impossible to reconcile religious or community groups purporting to do good works while at the same time presiding over a complete lack of accountability or responsibility for lives lost and decimated.

    The Jehovah’s Witnesses is but one of these recalcitrant institutions; but the scale of the crimes within, with allegations involving 1800 children and 1000 perpetrators, squarely places it front and centre as one whose active intransigence is reprehensible. The government is to be commended for its strong stance.
     
    Every child who is sexually abused is one child too many. Every survivor living with the long-term impacts of trauma and abuse is one person too many. It is time for zero tolerance to the systemic ducking and weaving and abject moral decay institutions failing to join the scheme perpetuate.
    Blue Knot Foundation welcomes the legislation being introduced to parliament to strip charities not signing up to National Redress Scheme of their charity status, said Dr Cathy Kezelman AM in response to the Federal Government’s legislation to strip organisations which do not sign up to the National Redress Scheme of their charitable status.

  10. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    @César Chávez  is throwing his toys out of the pram again and having a sulk.
    Dear C. C. you obviously know nothing about your GB and the Organisation. 
    And, opinions of ex-witnesses and all people are of interest to normal people with balanced minds. It is only people such as yourself that have a closed mind and want to be blind to truth, that pretend ex-witnesses opinions do not matter. 
    A lady on here blocks comments from me and others. A very stupid thing to do as she will never know truth or know a different point of view. I prefer to listen to all viewpoints, even yours, as it widens my thinking and reasoning ability.  You do have some valid points sometimes as do most JWs. 
    As for the Watchtower 'caring about ex-witness' views, I think they do take note of a lot of it.  I actually think this forum is monitored by W/t helpers. Maybe JWI is one of them.  I think that is why John Butler was dis/fed from here. Maybe he got too close to the mark.... 
    Mentioning @JW Insider I think he gave some information about homosexuality within the GB or GB helpers, in Bethel, but of course you will not believe things that you dislike.  
    C.C. Please face reality. The investigations EARTHWIDE cannot all be wrong. Even if 50% are wrong that still leaves a lot of wickedness and sin inside the CCJW. Wickedness and sin that the GB are responsible for. 
     
  11. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from César Chávez in Crystal Lake man, church elder charged with failing to report   
    https://www.nwherald.com/2020/11/24/crystal-lake-man-church-elder-charged-with-failing-to-report-sexual-abuse-of-child/aqqnlcw/
    A Jehovah's Witness church elder is accused of failing to notify police about a known instance of sexual abuse against a minor in his congregation.
    Michael M. Penkava, 71, of Crystal Lake, was charged Nov. 18 with violating reporting provisions. The offense is a misdemeanor typically punishable by less than one year in jail.
  12. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from César Chávez in Crystal Lake man, church elder charged with failing to report   
    Maybe it should be at least five years in jail if proven true. I wonder how long the child has been suffering. 
     
  13. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    This is what JW people need to hear. 100 up votes for this!
  14. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    I don't care about WTJWorg. But it is interesting to see, analyze and show what they are speaking and doing. Perhaps that will help other people to see the truth behind "the truth".
    WTJWorg and GB already accepted "gay rights" inside some specific WT rules. As to my knowledge, JW can be gay/lesbian and part of congregation but he/she is not "allowed to practice his/her propensity". If that is true, some percentage of JW's are homosexuals. 
  15. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    @Anna tries very hard to twist things. She is a well trained JW to be sure. 
    I quote her
    The only message I know of is the message of the Good News and salvation for all those who want to live under God's Kingdom.
    However she deliberately 'forgets' to mention that the 'message' also says 'You have to be a baptised JW to be saved' and that Armageddon is so so so close that you must get into the Org NOW. Ignoring the fact that JWs have been saying this for around 100 years. And that the baptism is not 'In the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit' as Jesus words instruct. No, it is in the name of JW Org. So getting baptised doesn't help one to be a Christian, it only helps one to be a JW.  
    Then Anna says,
    Are you calling God a liar then? Are you saying God's Kingdom won't come? I find that disturbing.
    Don't be delusional Anna, you can see above my comment about what your Org preaches. God never gave a date for Armageddon. God never said we are in the last hour of the last day. And Jesus did not teach to baptise into JW Org. 
    But you do not find those things disturbing it seems. 
     
  16. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    My neighbor made an interesting comment about her husband.  She said, regarding his below par choice of foods, that he still looks fit and strong; I suppose you could say he has a strong muscular “core”, but this will not guarantee a healthy life if he doesn’t eat right.  That was her point.
    Healthy spiritual food, sets in place one’s spiritual “foundation”.  We build on it from there.  Don’t you see that not only did Luccioni compare Jesus with the GB, but he is excusing the GB’s failures while at the same time, it is said that Jesus and God guides their decisions through Holy Spirit?   Jesus expects lasting food, "fruit that remains", to be provided through those whom HE sends, not men who twist their words and place the blame always for failures…somewhere else!  (John 15:16)  
    Luccioni said it is the wicked who twist Jesus’ words. Yes it is. What a pitiful plea he put out there, imploring one's faith and devotion in the GB, to remain "steadfast".  All to preserve an organization with its foundation built on falsehoods.   (Matt 7:26)
    “But know this: Hard times will come in the last days. 2 For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, proud, demeaning, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 unloving, irreconcilable, slanderers, without self-control, brutal, without love for what is good, 4 traitors, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 holding to the form of godliness but denying its power. Avoid these people.
    6 For among them are those who worm their way into households and deceive gullible women overwhelmed by sins and led astray by a variety of passions, 7 always learning and never able to come to a knowledge of the truth. 8 Just as Jannes and Jambres resisted Moses, so these also resist the truth. They are men who are corrupt in mind and worthless in regard to the faith. 9 But they will not make further progress, for their foolishness will be clear to all, as was the foolishness of Jannes and Jambres.”  2 Tim 3:1-9
     
  17. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    Luccioni is comparing the GB to Jesus and to his apostles.   He says that many found Jesus' words to hard to bear.  Jesus, the Son of God, the King, is being compared to men who utter false prophesies.  When will blasphemy come to end, from this organization.  He states faith and a spiritual "core" is needed in God's word, and also in the 'WORD" of the GB.  
    Really.
    He says, it is the wicked ones who cannot take hold of the following burdens.
    Let me quote this man:
    “TODAY WICKED MEN AND IMPOSTERS USE EXACTLY THE SAME TECHNIQUES.  AND ITS’ ONLY GOING TO GET WORSE.  THEY USE LIES AND MISREPRESENTATION.
    THEY LIE ABOUT HOW WE DEAL WITH CHILD ABUSE.
    HOW WE CARE FOR THE VICTIMS OF CHILD ABUSE.
     THEY TWIST STATEMENTS THAT ARE MADE…
     REGARDING OUR STAND ON BLOOD, LOYALTY TO FAMILY.  DISFELLOWSHIPPING.  THEY CAPITALIZE ON WHAT THEY PERCEIVE AS ERRORS.
     PERHAPS DOGMATIC STATEMENTS WE MADE IN THE PAST REGARDING A BIBLE PROPHESY OR OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE TIME OF THE END, AND THEN WE LATER CHANGED IT. 
    THEY ALSO PUT A NEGATIVE SPIN ON CHANGES THEY DO NOT UNDERSTAND. 
    SEE WHY WE SIMPLIFY
    DID REASSIGNMENTS IN 2015.
     A NEW EXPLANATION OF THE GENERATIONS
    CHANGES AT WORLD HEADQUARTERS.
    WHAT’S THE RESULT, WELL SOME ARE SWAYED BY THESE THINGS.
    THEY’RE STUMBLED, THEIR KNOCKED DOWN.  IT’S TOO HEAVY FOR THEM TO CARRY."
    I CAN SEE WHY.  THAT IS A LONG LIST, THAT WOULD MAKE ANYONE LOSE EQUALIBRIUM.  
    JESUS CHRIST SAYS,
    "Come to me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.  Matt 11:28
    His message was simple to begin with.  It didn't need to be "simplified" after screwing with people's lives...for decades, by telling "dogmatic statements regarding a Bible prophesy."
    And the disciples that Luccioni called upon to also compare with your GB's mistakes?  
    Here, for you, the man who cannot tolerate scripture, although your speaker "dogmatically" repeatedly pointed to his corrupted version of the Bible, as necessary to preserve your, and all JW's spiritual core.
    "Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him: We ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to be easily upset or troubled, either by a prophecy or by a message or by a letter supposedly from us, alleging that the day of the Lord has come. 3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way. For that day will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits in God’s temple, proclaiming that he himself is God."  2 Thess 2"1-4
    Where does this message, this prophesy about the coming of Christ originate?   It is with those wicked ones, who compare themselves to the apostles - your GB - your entire leadership from the birth of your organization and rise of the elder body.
    Ask Luccioni, what is the Temple of God, and who "sits"/rules and exalts himself above these "living stones".  
    Dear Tom,
    Comedy, story making and ignorance of God's Word in Christ, will not win us points when we must account for every EMPTY/DISCARDED/WORTHLESS/IDLE word we have spoken before Christ.  Words that proved to be lies.  
    Matt 12:36,37
     
    https://pearl-disgustingthing.blogspot.com/
     
     
      
     
     
     
  18. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    @Anna tries very hard to twist things. She is a well trained JW to be sure. 
    I quote her
    The only message I know of is the message of the Good News and salvation for all those who want to live under God's Kingdom.
    However she deliberately 'forgets' to mention that the 'message' also says 'You have to be a baptised JW to be saved' and that Armageddon is so so so close that you must get into the Org NOW. Ignoring the fact that JWs have been saying this for around 100 years. And that the baptism is not 'In the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit' as Jesus words instruct. No, it is in the name of JW Org. So getting baptised doesn't help one to be a Christian, it only helps one to be a JW.  
    Then Anna says,
    Are you calling God a liar then? Are you saying God's Kingdom won't come? I find that disturbing.
    Don't be delusional Anna, you can see above my comment about what your Org preaches. God never gave a date for Armageddon. God never said we are in the last hour of the last day. And Jesus did not teach to baptise into JW Org. 
    But you do not find those things disturbing it seems. 
     
  19. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    I didn't bother to read @TrueTomHarley book promoting rubbish above, as he just loves to try to be funny and/or make excuses for his failed American Governing Body. It is such a shame that they are all American or American influenced. They have become 'big headed' and obviously do not have God's or Christ's approval. 
    A couple of quotes for dear Tom. 
    It’s called getting the overall picture and not just zeroing in on what you want to see.
    OK, so lets enlarge on that one Tom. Overall picture of the Org' from it's beginning shows that the Org and it's Leaders have been putting dates on Armageddon from step one. It shows the Org' has been using Armageddon to frighten people into the Org'. One reason for doing so is to get more money from people, more congregants = more donations. another reason for doing so is Power. The bigger the Org, the more people the Leaders can control. Add to this that there is then more people to spread the lies of the Leaders. The more the lies are spoken, the more people will start to believe them. 
    Then of course we have, what Tom calls my favourite subject. An overall picture of the Child Sexual Abuse within the CCJW / JW org shows that in Australia they started recoding it 50 years ago, but strangely enough America only seems to have a database / records for the past 25 ish years ???? But overall it can be seen as an Earthwide serious problem within the CCJW. 
    So there we have an overall outlook on a couple of points concerning the CCJW. Just to note that many of us on here do look at the overall picture but then we get criticised for it.
    Second quote 
    And what of this diatribe of yours that the ‘true anointed’ is to manifest itself (out of nowhere) in but a few years max? Is that not you asserting we are in the last of the last?
    It does seem that some on here do not have ANY SPIRITUAL FEELINGS AT ALL. They have NO FAITH IN GOD OR CHRIST.
    I can imagine Tom stood at the Red Sea with Moses. Tom would be saying "What's this diatribe about God saving us from the Egyptians"   Where is your faith Tom ? 
    The last hour of the last day as per your GB, would seem to mean this year or next.  I have said it would take a few years to straighten out the CCJW and that would need a True Anointed to run it.  I like to say 'True Anointed' as it has two meanings. 1. your GB keep saying that some 'anointed' are actually mentally sick. 2. your GB seem to think only they are 'special' and anointed. So TRUE ANOUNTED ones would not be 'sick' and would not be of your GB. 
    I have in the past backed this up with scripture, but it has proven pointless as JW GB worshippers are blind to reason. 
    @Anna quote 
    Yes. It's natural for every generation to want to live to see all the good promises fulfilled in their lifetime. With the right attitude, this should not be a disturbing thing to anyone, at best.
    Sorry Anna, bad try. You seem to be washing over facts, such as your GB  pretending to be the F&DS and previous leaders also pretending to be inspired of God's Holy Spirit. Not only have congregants served those Leaders to the point of worshipping them, but congregants have taken that message to millions of people in the world. The message that has been spread so far and wide has been LIES. If you do not find that disturbing then you have a problem.
    Thank you @Witness for adding further proof of the OVERALL PICTURE which Tom seems to want. 
  20. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Is it still a God dishonoring sin to eat turkey on Thanksgiving day?   
    The Lord’s supper is the term used to describe an arrangement that Jesus instituted on the night of his betrayal. In brief, it consists of a Scriptural discussion, the giving of thanks and the partaking of bread and wine. Some refer to it as the Eucharist, because of Jesus’ “giving thanks” on that occasion. It is also referred to as the Communion and the Mass. Doubtless, the most fitting of all names for it is “the Lord’s evening meal.”—1 Cor. 11:20. - https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1959205
  21. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to TrueTomHarley in Is it still a God dishonoring sin to eat turkey on Thanksgiving day?   
    Yes. “While they were listening to these things, he told another illustration, because he was near Jerusalem and they thought that the Kingdom of God was going to appear instantly.” Luke 19:11
    No. Unrepentant wrongdoers would be expelled, as happens today.
    Yes. “As they traveled on through the cities, they would deliver to them for observance the decrees that had been decided on by the apostles and the elders who were in Jerusalem.” Acts 16:4
  22. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    The only message I know of is the message of the Good News and salvation for all those who want to live under God's Kingdom.
    Are you calling God a liar then? Are you saying God's Kingdom won't come? I find that disturbing.
  23. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    - strong core - 2 tim 3 14,15 .... from whom he learned teaching
    - wicked man and impostors would twist Jesus words - generation teachings - constantly repackage Jesus teachings 
    - spiritual foundational muscles
    - dogmatic statements we made in past
    -
    - etc. etc
    RL speaking about wicked man and impostors that would twist Jesus words.
    What was Jesus' words about, for example, "generation"?? Only what we can read in Gospels.  Truly I tell you, this generation will not pass away until all these things have happened. Mat 24:34 
    And He stopped at that point! 
    Who did constantly repackage Jesus words about "generation"? WT and GB! Period! We are witnesses of at least 3 crucial changes on "generation" interpretations.
    Please, JW's "strong core" depending very much on Teachers from which they primary heard "the word", is one of element RL speaking about. WT Teachers from Russell to nowadays ...they have changed. Various Teachers and JW got/have various spiritual food. So, this famous "spiritual core" he want to highlight, was different for various generations of JW's. Various generation of JW's are/were not UNITED in one and same Teaching in this time period from 19th century until today. Are they UNITED with Teachings from 1st Century??
    And look the miracle. Different, even opposite "spiritual core" that is needed for "spiritual foundational muscles" is based on one, single and same, never changed Jesus' words about "generation". Or about any other Jesus' teachings. But in WTJWorg World everything is possible. To be extracted different and various "divine" teachings from ONE and SAME Bible verse about word "generation" in Mat 24:34.
    Who are "wicked man and impostors" inside WTJWorg that (would) twists Jesus words and constantly repackage Jesus teachings? Ex-JW aka apostates? :))) or GB+Helpers+Elders?
    ?? desanitize = To remove the cleanliness from something; to dirty. To make unsanitary.
    WTJWorg past and present is mixture of clean and unclean things. Is that what RL is trying to explain?? 
    ... one day we may hit the time whether personally or as organization when all the other peripherals are gone, all the extras (conventions, TV, videos, music WT articlec etc).
    What will they have left, to JW's, when traditional and peripherals spiritual elements gone? They will be left with "old questionable spiritual food" ... as in all the years, decades before.
  24. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    I would not say something like that, of course and for sure ...., and you are neither forecaster nor prophet able to know what i will say next :)) 
  25. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in JUST HOW BIG OF A DEBACLE, WAS THE PROPHESY OF 1975?   
    I didn't bother to read @TrueTomHarley book promoting rubbish above, as he just loves to try to be funny and/or make excuses for his failed American Governing Body. It is such a shame that they are all American or American influenced. They have become 'big headed' and obviously do not have God's or Christ's approval. 
    A couple of quotes for dear Tom. 
    It’s called getting the overall picture and not just zeroing in on what you want to see.
    OK, so lets enlarge on that one Tom. Overall picture of the Org' from it's beginning shows that the Org and it's Leaders have been putting dates on Armageddon from step one. It shows the Org' has been using Armageddon to frighten people into the Org'. One reason for doing so is to get more money from people, more congregants = more donations. another reason for doing so is Power. The bigger the Org, the more people the Leaders can control. Add to this that there is then more people to spread the lies of the Leaders. The more the lies are spoken, the more people will start to believe them. 
    Then of course we have, what Tom calls my favourite subject. An overall picture of the Child Sexual Abuse within the CCJW / JW org shows that in Australia they started recoding it 50 years ago, but strangely enough America only seems to have a database / records for the past 25 ish years ???? But overall it can be seen as an Earthwide serious problem within the CCJW. 
    So there we have an overall outlook on a couple of points concerning the CCJW. Just to note that many of us on here do look at the overall picture but then we get criticised for it.
    Second quote 
    And what of this diatribe of yours that the ‘true anointed’ is to manifest itself (out of nowhere) in but a few years max? Is that not you asserting we are in the last of the last?
    It does seem that some on here do not have ANY SPIRITUAL FEELINGS AT ALL. They have NO FAITH IN GOD OR CHRIST.
    I can imagine Tom stood at the Red Sea with Moses. Tom would be saying "What's this diatribe about God saving us from the Egyptians"   Where is your faith Tom ? 
    The last hour of the last day as per your GB, would seem to mean this year or next.  I have said it would take a few years to straighten out the CCJW and that would need a True Anointed to run it.  I like to say 'True Anointed' as it has two meanings. 1. your GB keep saying that some 'anointed' are actually mentally sick. 2. your GB seem to think only they are 'special' and anointed. So TRUE ANOUNTED ones would not be 'sick' and would not be of your GB. 
    I have in the past backed this up with scripture, but it has proven pointless as JW GB worshippers are blind to reason. 
    @Anna quote 
    Yes. It's natural for every generation to want to live to see all the good promises fulfilled in their lifetime. With the right attitude, this should not be a disturbing thing to anyone, at best.
    Sorry Anna, bad try. You seem to be washing over facts, such as your GB  pretending to be the F&DS and previous leaders also pretending to be inspired of God's Holy Spirit. Not only have congregants served those Leaders to the point of worshipping them, but congregants have taken that message to millions of people in the world. The message that has been spread so far and wide has been LIES. If you do not find that disturbing then you have a problem.
    Thank you @Witness for adding further proof of the OVERALL PICTURE which Tom seems to want. 
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