Patiently waiting for Truth

I think you are mostly right. And I was only trying to show how unreasonable the results could be if this was taken seriously. However, I doubt that Arauna is alone in a similar line of thinking that there must be something diabolical even in quotes like the following that she found in the UN documents:
To this exact quote, you may have notice that she responded to it by saying:
"SOUNDS LIKE THEY WANT TO BRING PEACE AND SECURITY !  SATANS VERSION OF JEHOVAH'S GOVERNMENT. See below where they talk of peace and security linked with sustainable development."
So, this type of thinking might not be as absent from among us as you indicated.

Does anybody think that way?  We know not everything the UN does is evil. Not everything the Governments do is evil either, as Paul brings out; "Keep doing good, and you will have praise from it;  for it is God’s minister to you for your good". Wanting to do things "green" is a good thing, so there should be no reason for a Witness to lobby against that..

I think we need to be reasonable though. I know there was all kinds of trouble surrounding the initial project, and I don't know a lot about it, but my impression was that since it wasn't our fault (we had not caused the pollution) it would be fair to expect that we should not have to be responsible for financing the clean up....
I think in these and similar instances if we take advantage of any secular means or provisions that help us achieve our goal, we are only doing what some of Jesus's disciples in the first century did also.

What a spirit guided this JW elder, Shawn Bartlett, who gave instruction and instruction to other elders as to why personal notes and other data should be destroyed. Why? According to what he said it is in this "spirit" --------- To Not be responsible for past actions. If there are no records of past events, then the events did not even happen, "legal world says" he explained.  ..... be as shrewd as snakes ??
 

*** w20 November pp. 14-15 Take Courage—Jehovah Is Your Helper ***
HELP FROM INDIVIDUALS IN AUTHORITY
...
13 What help do we receive? When it is in harmony with his purpose, Jehovah may use his powerful holy spirit to cause people in authority to do what he desires. King Solomon wrote: “A king’s heart is like streams of water in Jehovah’s hand. He directs it wherever He pleases.” (Prov. 21:1) What does this proverb mean? Humans can dig a canal to divert the water of a stream in a direction that fits their plans. Similarly, Jehovah can use his spirit to divert the thoughts of rulers in a direction that is in harmony with his purpose. When that occurs, people in authority feel motivated to make decisions that benefit God’s people.—Compare Ezra 7:21, 25, 26.
14 What can we do? We can pray “concerning kings and all those who are in positions of authority” when these individuals are called on to make decisions that affect our Christian life and ministry. (1 Tim. 2:1, 2, ftn.; Neh. 1:11)
I notice that the Watchtower also includes this within the idea of paying back Caesar's things to Caesar, and even the idea of "being ready for every good work" is subsumed under the idea of performing "government" sponsored works:
*** w90 11/1 pp. 11-12 pars. 7-8 The Christian’s View of the Superior Authorities ***
7 Further, Paul’s exhortation to be in subjection to the superior authorities is in harmony with Jesus’ command to pay back “Caesar’s things to Caesar,” where “Caesar” represents secular authority. (Matthew 22:21) It also agrees with Paul’s later words to Titus: “Continue reminding them to be in subjection and be obedient to governments and authorities as rulers, to be ready for every good work.” (Titus 3:1) Hence, when Christians are ordered by governments to share in community works, they quite properly comply as long as those works do not amount to a compromising substitute for some unscriptural service or otherwise violate Scriptural principles, such as that found at Isaiah 2:4.
8 Peter also affirmed that we should be subject to the secular authorities of this world when he said: “For the Lord’s sake subject yourselves to every human creation: whether to a king as being superior or to governors as being sent by him to inflict punishment on evildoers but to praise doers of good.” (1 Peter 2:13, 14) In harmony with this, Christians would also heed Paul’s admonition to Timothy: “I therefore exhort, first of all, that supplications, prayers, intercessions, offerings of thanks, be made concerning all sorts of men, concerning kings and all those who are in high station; in order that we may go on leading a calm and quiet life.”—1 Timothy 2:1, 2.
Srecko brought up a point about how neutrality might be equated with lack of knowledge, but it is clear that knowledge would be necessary to distinguish whether those community works requested by authorities are not some form of compromise. 
It's easy to imagine a group of Witnesses who are told by government authorities that they must clean up a polluted lake or waterway before undertaking some large building projects on its shores, or that they must clean up the toxins that can carry runoff into the water to protect animals depending on it. In spite of the recent article about neutrality, when such situation occurred, Witness lawyers (and others) actually lobbied the relevant government authorities for favorable rulings. Lawsuits were initiated by the WTS to overcome the costs of some of these decisions. I know that brothers were called in to gain a lot of knowledge about the situation before some of these actions were taken. But I also talked personally with one of the lawyers involved and it was my assessment that the spirit of Jesus' words here were not taken to heart:
(Matthew 5:40-46) . . .And if a person wants to take you to court and get possession of your inner garment, let him also have your outer garment; 41 and if someone in authority compels you into service for a mile, go with him two miles. 42 ... 43 “You heard that it was said: ‘You must love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 However, I say to you: Continue to love your enemies and to pray for those who persecute you, 45 so that you may prove yourselves sons of your Father who is in the heavens, since he makes his sun rise on both the wicked and the good and makes it rain on both the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 For if you love those loving you, what reward do you have? Are not also the tax collectors doing the same thing?
In the future, if WItnesses are told to build buildings that meet certain "green standards" to meet certain SDG's (Sustainable Development Goals) do you think that some Witnesses might rightly lobby against it, because these SDG's were suggested to governmental authorities by the UN, who only promoted them because they were a way of promoting "peace and security"? And we all know that when we support anything that combines "UN" with "peace and security" we are supporting Satan's schemes?
A little bit of knowledge won't hurt us. We should not be ignorant of Satan's designs either:
*** nwtsty 2 Corinthians Study Notes—Chapter 2 ***
we are not ignorant of his designs: Paul does not just say that “we are aware of his designs.” Rather, he uses a figure of speech called litotes, that is, an understatement made in order to give emphasis by saying that the opposite is not true. (An example of litotes can be found at Ac 21:39, where Tarsus is called “no obscure city,” which means an important city.) Accordingly, some translations render this phrase “we are well aware of his schemes” or “we know his wiles all too well,” which conveys similar emphasis.
This is a double-edged argument. Arauna is correct therefore to look to whether any of these "community works" are actually compromising. She correctly said she would have to "go along" with some of them even if she hated where they were coming from. But since we all stand individually before the judgment seat, we should all have a reason for the stand we take.

What sort of "neutrality"? "Neutrality concept" made by WT understanding?
"My people will be silenced,(*destroyed) because there is no knowledge. Because you have rejected knowledge," - Hosea 4:6
May we say how lack of education in "knowledge" about secular and spiritual things is good way to be ruined? 
Lack of knowledge about, what is and what is not "neutrality", is good example of this.
JW members made prayers to God about... and letters, to Russian's "secular authorities".  I don't know what was content of their prayers. And don't know what was content of those letters. Perhaps somebody who have time and information would/will make comparison and comment about it.
Of course, if prophecies (i.e. interpretations) are correct about that, that JW members are and will be under attack of secular governments (in this case Russia) in the "last days of last days" than what is purpose and benefit of "prayers" for JW members and for attackers in high position?
What if "prophecy" is more powerful than "prayers"? Than JW "prayers" means nothing. They will not be "listened". 
And vice versa, if "prayers" of faithful JW members can delete (or delay) fulfillment of "prophecy" about "last days" and attacks on them, than when "end" will come?
In third scenario, two parallel "kingdoms" can live together and forever. Everybody looks for their own business. :))

Oh dear, as someone here would say. I don’t know whether it is worth your time or not but I do know I will miss you if you leave.
As for me, I’ve tried to leave numerous times but the old hen always sings her siren song and lures me back:
”Oh mother, tell your children, not to throwww away their decorum,
Spend your life in sheer misery on the old hen’s world media news forum.“
 

I don't think the scripture meant that we need to pray out any particular persons or schemes, only that the men in high positions who make decisions that might affect us, and our preaching work, will make decisions that result in the kind of peace and security that have a net positive effect.
There's something to that, I agree. We get the necessary peace when they stay out of our way. But the verse can mean a range of things to different persons in different circumstances. Some get more specific in their prayers than others. I think we could even pray that someone comes up with a vaccine for Covid19. Some would say no, because that's like praying for a worldly medical institution.

No. I never saw any evidence provided by the UN with respect to this man from Ethiopia. I never saw any evidence from you either. Just a claim with no evidence.
Your assumption and judgment are both wrong in this case.
Perhaps you have been watching for a longer time, and perhaps, as you say, you don't have the kind of time to watch. But I get the impression that your sources are not from watching the UN anyway, but they come from conspiratorial, racist, lying and/or biased sources. I like to look at the viability of as many sources as I can, and I agree that this can be very time consuming. And I also don't think people should merely repeat slanderous accusations without taking some time to research these claims first.
It's easy to claim things you don't agree with are simply "irrelevant." If you have evidence, point to it. Show it. Give a link to the person who claimed that the WHO president genocided his own people, for example. I think there is none. But there is quite a bit of evidence that this was a lie from racist and politically motivated sources. I go where the evidence takes me, and it's not my fault when evidence for one way or another seems to "dominate."
We all have more important things to do. But I don't have anything against providing evidence. Evidence can come from scholars on all sides of a controversy. We can listen to all of them. And evidence doesn't have to come from just scholars and experts, either. An average person like me can take a video of something and it provides good evidence, too. An average person can track down an expert's contradictory statements, or admissions of making false statements, and this can provide evidence, too. (I just found an amazing admission of false statements by someone this morning and I'll make a post about it when I get time.)
I've given up on this forum a couple of times. But it's the only forum I use. I have a FB account I haven't written on in 4 years, and I have a Twitter account to read news, but I never write anything there. Also, this is a diverse group willing to talk about a lot of different subjects. I don't think any of us know many people at our Hall that would be comfortable with a lot of these topics. So I typically tend to come back after a few days.
I hope your move goes well, and I hope to see you on these pages again.

Actually it sounds like the WT was one of the few organization’s doing it right. Outfits accepted the food boxes but were unwilling to take on the costs of distribution. The only example (from thecounter.org article) of actually bringing the food to the recipients, rather than making them come to some parking lot to retrieve it, is the WT. 
And since (weren’t you ridiculing them over this?—if not, your allies were) JWs are the lowest income faith, almost by definition they will be among the intended beneficiaries. As Anna said, in her congregation, food boxes were delivered to the most needy. Same here. And then, if it turned out they felt others needed it more, they were encouraged to share with any of those they knew of.
If there were any foodstuffs left to rot or spoil, it had nothing to do with JWs.
From the article:
“The USDA paid generously, in part, because it wanted those companies to take on the job of distributing the boxes as well. The plan was called "truck-to-trunk." The companies were supposed to take their food boxes directly to local food bank distribution points and drop the boxes into the trunks of waiting cars.”
Witnesses did better than that. They delivered it directly to homes.
”During the pandemic, many food banks have been running short of volunteers to do this job.”
Didn’t happen here.
“But many food banks, including Cooper's, said that food box contractors refused to do it. Some of them didn't even have the refrigerated truck required to do the job.“
Again, not so here.
No one outfit can do everything, but JWs fully comply with the program, and waste nothing. There were apparently many that did not, and if the story is correct, some of them never intended to. Any faith-based organization guided by Bible principles is not going to forget Galatians 6:10: “let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to us in the faith.” Since you claim to be a true anointed, surely you know this. 
You’re just a bitter old crow.
 
 

I understand this better than previously, when Tom first brought it up on this forum a few months ago.    The organization did have to sign up to be a 503c distributor, but after speaking to Travel Well Holdings– a wholesale purchaser and distributor (whose name I saw on this video -
 I found that they, along with many other contract distributors, were awarded a Federal USDA contract to distribute the food boxes, as is generally known.  When the food banks became glutted with boxes, it was the food banks who reached out to faith-based organizations, to take part in the program. 
The video has the same message as the news article.  They were told not to spread the news, including photographing the boxes. The speaker relates that they tried to decline the box saying they were not in need, but it was delivered anyway. Many other “faith-based” organizations, would specify which families would indeed benefit from the food, instead of elders throwing it away if rejected…stories coming out by others.  Many other religious organizations, follow more closely the understood definition of “charity”, while the org. appears to be clueless.   I was told that stricter guidelines were issued by the USDA in August, requiring a contract to be signed by the organizations, stating food boxes must, and will be distributed only to those who are “food insecure” and are lower income households.    
 
 
Interesting news article:
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/09/03/907128481/how-the-usdas-food-box-initiative-overpaid-and-under-delivered

I understand why they don't if pushback is to be understood as a defense in order to sway the "enemy" to your side. They know they will never convince the "enemy" so what's the point in trying? BUT if it was done for the benefit of those who are not "enemies" but genuinely want explanations and answers to those charges, then I think it would be a good thing. But they're not looking at it like that.....

The problem is that I told the elders I wouldn’t do it. But because I believe the second part of your statement: 
I don’t beat myself up when I break my resolve. And I very much appreciate your kind words on the value of meeting specific accusations. From time to time I get emails stating the same.
When the elders met with me after the meeting, I had no thought at all of putting the experience online, as I have done above. That occurred to me later. 
I just came to think I’d let it stand as a real time example of responding to counsel even if I don’t agree with every aspect of it. The only examples of meeting with the elders that ever appear online are those written by unruly persons already on the edge, like Dathan and those guys, who rail at the attempt at “mind control” and cry ad nauseum over their right to free speech, missing every spiritual point in the process of making theIr dominant fleshy one: “No one’s telling me what to do!”
I don’t resent the counsel at all. I take it for just what it is—loving oversight.  I both accept and appreciate that Jehovah leads his people via a human agency, and I am grateful that there is something that corresponds to verses such as Hebrews 13:17, to “be obedient to those who are taking the lead among you and be submissive, for they are keeping watch over you as those who will render an account, so that they may do this with joy and not with sighing, for this would be damaging to you.”
As such, I accept they have the responsibility to counsel in line with scripture, and I don’t carry on as though my toes are being stepped on or my rights infringed upon. They represent the human link in the divine/human interface, they do not demand lockstep even though they give pointed counsel. I don’t consider myself above them. They are above me as regards authority.
I appreciate their efforts to check me, and as stated, I would be far worse in the absence of godly counsel to not engage with those who show by word or deed that acquiescence to Jehovah’s standards and all that is entailed is repugnant to them. It does me good to be checked by them, for I do believe that we become who we hang out with. We may not become it instantly, but we do so eventually—if not in point of argument then in forfeiting the Christlike manner—and often even in point of argument, as they are all based on following the trends of the day.
I would like it if there was a little more organizational pushback on some of the charges leveled against us. I’ve said it many times before. But you can’t always get what you want. You can’t always get what you want. You can’t always get what you want. But if you try sometime, you just might find, you get what you need. 
And I have. I can’t go charging like an enraged bull. But that kind of conduct can get a guy skewered anyway. It does me well to do what I do under the discipline of conforming to theocratic counsel, even if in a few aspects I am not a stellar example of it. I am in other aspects.

You probably are reading it and 4Jah is writing it. Off course they’re not paid.

Judging by the few comments in response there are ones who understand where you are coming from and are even grateful for ones like you, as one of them said: "My study conductor was always unsure about the what to say to the questions I'd bring. So I began looking for jehovah's witnesses that were/are responding and thankfully I found a good few, including yourself ....... and to be honest I'm not 100% certain that I would have continued if I hadn't been able to get answers to questions and honest perspectives on being a Witness".
In my opinion honesty is the key. Are we willing to admit mistakes and not try to justify or gloss over them? Why would we even want to justify mistakes? Wouldn't it be like saying we do not sin?  "If we make the statement, “We have no sin,” we are misleading ourselves and the truth is not in us. 9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous so as to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10  If we make the statement, “We have not sinned,” we are making him a liar, and his word is not in us". 1 John 1:8-10
For there is no righteous man on earth who always does good and never sins.  (Ecclesiastes 7:20)
So what's the problem, really? In fact the sooner one understands that, the less chance there is of being stumbled or shocked and leaving.

Am I reading that the elders were not volunteering their time to distribute the food boxes, but were paid?   The question is, were they then directed to give the pay received, to the organization?
 

(Sigh...there goes my fine resolve.)
It has not been, you idiot. Examples of that are scarcer then hen’s teeth.
In plenty of other outfits, it is the rule. In fact, there is no mechanism in those outfits to even to detect abuse within the rank and file.
Please NOTE. Stay on topic, and do not pounce breathlessly on an example illustrating something else to bludgeon everyone once again with what you’ve said countless times already.

Alas, Cesar, sometimes I feel that I am becoming one of them.
I told the elders that I would not get into squabbles with these characters, and I said that so as not to be oblivious to theocratic counsel. Yet here I find myself making sporadic ad hominem attacks. Of course, I don’t beat myself up too much over it—If these characters worked on their ad hominems a bit more, it wouldn’t happen. And it is also true that in the absence of theocratic counsel, I would be much worse. But even so, I am allowing personal exasperation to throw barbs here and there after I said I would not do it.
The long response was okay to this thread, of course, because that constitutes as though a letter to the editor. Maybe even the first retort to you-know-who can be overlooked since she is so much the way she is. But the third one was unnecessary and just reflects personal lack of self-control.
“I find, then, this law in my case: When I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me....I see in my body another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my body.  Miserable man that I am!” (Romans 7)
I have to behave better. I said that I would:
https://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2020/01/a-bad-boy-turns-over-a-new-leaf.html

Seriously, would that not constitute a violation of neutrality, to be praying for the success of human schemes? It is enough not to be praying against them.
The little quip with the rabbi I threw in as a joke, but it is more than a joke. That’s how 1 Tim 2:1,2 should be understood, I think, that the governments come to understand our apolitical nature and thus leave us be to do our Bible education work.
As much as I am willing to acknowledge the nobility of many human intentions, it is the implementation that is always the problem, not the lofty goals in themselves, which may indeed be lofty. But the implementation falls short, due to Jer 10:23 about man being incapable of directing his own step.
What sticks in my craw about all these human goals is theIr assumption that it is head education (without mention moral sense) that is most needed.  I think back to that brouhaha with Annie O over her preferred CSA video—the one that drew circles around areas of a child that no one ought touch. It’s as though if a child is touched anywhere, he/she ought to consult the chart in his mind’s eye to decide if he should feel bad over it. Better the WT video that speak of a conscience—a conscience that will develop when ones are immersed and take to heart a godly atmosphere.
It was only icing on the cake when her pedantic video brimming with the wisdom of trusting education declared that it was okay if a doctor touched you in one of those hotspots. (whereas the Caleb and Sophia video said ‘let no one touch you inappropriately) “Ask the young women of the US Gymnastics team which video they think would have protected them more,” I said.

@César Chávez  I want to examine this paragraph of your :
Here itself, it can be seen as those that think the Watchtower plays a role in every person, personal life. They don't. Jesus didn't, the apostles didn't, those sent by Jesus didn't. The "act" of the apostles just like Jesus commandments were to make a spiritual guideline in order for each individual to cleanse themselves from their old ways and return to God with a clean and fresh attitude that would lead to their own personal salvation. That is in essence what the Watchtower is about. The key word here is "choice", it hasn't changed since Jesus made it known.
Well it does in the lives of JWs. How? Because JWs believe what the GB tell them to believe, and the GB's method of communication to the congregants is the Watchtower. So the Watchtower, which is studied every week, does play a very big role in every JWs life.  The GB tells the congregants that 'only the GB', are the F&DS. The GB tells congregants that the rest of the Anointed should not congregate together, the GB saying that if the Anointed did congregate together it would be working against the Holy spirit. These messages are sent via the Watchtower magazine, so they do play a big role in congregants lives. 
So the big difference. Jesus and the Apostles didn't 'control' people's lives. The GB should think about this.
Spiritual guidelines. Yes. And for their own personal salvation, yes.  Not salvation by the CCJW organisation. Not baptism into the CCJW organisation. 
"That is in essence what the Watchtower is about."  NO it isn't.  The Watchtower is one means of control that the Governing Body uses. The only choice is to be in or our of the CCJW. But if in, a person has to obey GB man made rules. 
I still cannot understand why you use the word Watchtower as if it is people. It isn't. It is a business side of the religion and it is a magazine. It is the Governing Body that controls that business and magazine. 
So maybe you should "Reflect on your own words."        And you also, Have a good day.  

Exactly, Tom.  So, when reading these two scripture in the last book of the Bible -  Rev  11:1-3,7; 13:6,7
…how can any organization other than the Wt. know who the anointed are, in order to tread the Temple of God, “make war” and conquer the saints, as all of your leaders are already successfully doing?
You know Tom, I have never showcased myself, but have always “showcased” Jesus Christ, the Father and the Body of Christ/priesthood of God, and their role in the last days.  Only when you began prodding me about my anointing, was there any focus on me; and that was for your own selfish writing motives.  
Yes, they do.  

Oh, for crying out loud!
Never have I seen such endless passages of scripture poured down the drain to no use.
I might believe your stated motive if you did not tirelessly present yourself as one of the true anointed (or perhaps the true anointed) and pounce upon the slightest reference to the priesthood to showcase yourself. Sheesh. Outside of Jehovah’s Witnesses, few even know what anointed is.

It is a ridiculous assumption to believe that God’s people are not the first to be judged. (1 Pet 4:17)   Morris quoted from Isaiah 46.
“who from the beginning declares the end,
    and from before, things that have not been done,
who says, ‘My plan shall stand,’
    and, ‘I will accomplish all my wishes,’
11 who calls a bird of prey from the east,
    the man of his plan from a country from afar.
Indeed I have spoken; indeed I will bring it to being.
    I have formed it; indeed I will do it.”
Who is God speaking to in Isaiah 46?  Jacob – Israel.  It is God’s “Israel” today, that is His concern, and who come under judgment before any of the physical nations in the world. As the "new creation" it is they who are the "heavens and the earth".  (2 Pet 3:12,17)  And this "fire" is symbolic.  (Jer 23:29; Hos 6:5; Luke 12:49,51)  Just as Isaiah brings out about Israel’s idols, and how they ‘compared’ them to God, JWs and “Israel” today,  are doing the same thing.  “Jehovah’s spirit-directed organization” is compared as inseparable, with the Almighty God.  You might want to read that entire chapter.  God is inseparable with His Son, and His Temple dwelling in the anointed priesthood.  Anything else that God is linked to by men, is an idol. (1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Eph 2:20-22; Rev 5:9,10)
As God has planned, through His Son and Head of the anointed Body of Christ, salvation is in “Zion”, the Temple of God – not in your idol.
“I bring my righteousness near; it is not far.
    And my salvation will not delay;
and I will put salvation in Zion,
    for Israel my glory.”   Isa 46:13
Here are those scriptures I previously posted, which fully support the plan of God in Isaiah 46:10,11
Amos 6:8; Zech 4:6-10
Did you happen join in the laughter once Morris snuffed out the match?  
A message to Israel:
Woe to you who long
    for the day of the Lord!
Why do you long for the day of the Lord?
    That day will be darkness, not light.
19 It will be as though a man fled from a lion
    only to meet a bear,
as though he entered his house
    and rested his hand on the wall
    only to have a snake bite him.
20 Will not the day of the Lord be darkness, not light—
    pitch-dark, without a ray of brightness?    Amos 5
 
 

He didn't make it up. It's all in the Bible as you very well know.
2 Thessalonians 1:7-9
7  But you who suffer tribulation will be given relief along with us at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with his powerful angels  8  in a flaming fire, as he brings vengeance on those who do not know God and those who do not obey the good news about our Lord Jesus. 9  These very ones will undergo the judicial punishment of everlasting destruction from before the Lord and from the glory of his strength.
 
 

You ridiculous woman!
Did he said he was going to do it himself, or is it not rather his expression of faith that God is going to replace human rule of the earth with his kingdom?