Jump to content
The World News Media

Patiently waiting for Truth

Member
  • Posts

    3,150
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    36

Reputation Activity

  1. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Kosonen in 1914   
    The WT has very few times touched Galatians 1:8 (I suspect the writing commitee understands that this can easily be turned against themselves, because many WT doctrines are not well founded in the Bible)
    But I found a perfect application in JW online library from a WT from 1952
    The Watchtower Announcing Jehovah’s Kingdom—1952 9 Who can start a new religion, contrary to God’s written will and Word? “Even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond what we declared to you as good news, let him be accursed,” wrote the inspired apostle Paul. (Gal. 1:8, NW) If even a high and mighty angel from heaven cannot start a new gospel without being accursed, then certainly no man on earth can do so with immunity. Any who declare as gospel or good news something that is different from what is recorded in Jehovah’s Word is accursed in God’s sight, whether he is sincere in his declarations or not. Sincerity does not make a wrong thing right.
    SINCERITY NOT ENOUGH
    10. What proves sincerity and zeal alone are insufficient?
    10 Clearly indicating that sincerity or zeal in a religious organization that is not following God’s Word is insufficient, Romans 10:2, 3 (NW) declares: “I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God; but not according to accurate knowledge; for, because of not knowing the righteousness of God but seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.” These persons had zeal and they must have been sincere, but they did not act in accord with accurate knowledge of God’s Word. They did not know the righteousness of God and sought to establish their own. In their stubbornness and pride in thinking their own religious ideas right and zealously trying to prove them so, they failed to subject themselves to the righteousness of God and his Word.
    11. How does Romans 10:2, 3 fit false religions today, and to what extreme may they even go?
    11 That is the way it is with so many false religions today. They have their creeds and doctrinal beliefs, pluck texts from their setting to support them, and brush aside any scriptures that contradict them. They zealously press on to establish as righteous their own beliefs, not allowing God’s Word to have final say on the matter and not listening to that Word in its entirety, but selecting what suits their purpose and wresting what does not, rather than conforming their belief to the untwisted, unwrested, pure word of truth in the Bible. Such ones lack meekness and teachableness. They are proud, they are stubborn, they refuse to admit wrong. Clinging tenaciously to their self-will in religious belief, they make themselves idolaters according to the divine rule. .........
  2. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in 1914   
    Do you mean this?
    "Special knowledge", in sense it was different than that of main Christendom (Catholic church) but also similar or sourced in other smaller religious groups. And "special faith", in sense he want to believe he found "new and better" or even as he had been chosen for "mission". I wasn't studied about this things as i should. @JW Insider handled with more materials (and have better memory than me :))) to bring out so much or enough quotes (WT publications) to support discussion, to give corrective perception on issues like this, and to introduce reader into unknown possibility, reality.
    WT Society and today successors of religious inheritance (all doctrines and methodologies used to find "the truth") aka GB carry a sort of "burden" of that past. Perhaps they are somehow "forced" to stay on  such track, path of the past, don' know. If they are aware of fact  how past doctrines are not bringing to the future but contrary, holds them in ambys of past spiritual wrongs, because they are afraid of making clear and painful cuts, it is understandable, but also makes whole situation hopeless. It can be, based on experience we see till today, how easiest way to escape from spiritual "errors" they found in idea of "progressive understanding". According to this, Bible Truth never changed, but human (GB) understanding does. To this idea one thing also remain not understandable: what is Bible truth? Because no one is able to say - where we are now standing, on what point in this progress?! How much steps exists from point A to B in this progressive understanding? Because they made a claims how human living at close end of this system they assured themselves, as many time before, how this  "present truth" must be good enough and supported by God. With this attitude you are on a good way to be deceived and self deceived.
     
  3. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in 1914   
    Pretty much what Br. Jackson insinuated, but this was to worldly people. It has yet to be put in plain writing for the congregations because it seems that many do not see it. (unlike you).
  4. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Kosonen in 1914   
    There is no need to believe anything GB or WT says or writes. The Bible is the authority. We should believe in Jesus and what he said. And we should believe the apostles who Jesus had appointed and their writings. And if anyone goes above that, then apostle Paul says:  
    Galatians 1:8 "However, even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as good news something beyond the good news we declared to you, let him be accursed." 
  5. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in 1914   
    Yes, and that according to Bible chronology, the FDS was appointed in 1919. So if 1914 was questioned, when were the FDS appointed? It would remove that whole aspect of what we have been taught, including the brothers being in prison. 
    I agree though that in reality it shouldn't change much about the authority of those taking the lead, because the scriptures say to be obedient to them. And I agree with the sister, I thought it was nothing new either (regarding the FDS only being the GB). But still, everyone is aware that Jesus was supposed to have appointed a specific group to provide spiritual food. If 1914 was removed, that small specific group would be dispersed and would include anyone who was feeding others spiritually, as you have suggested. All this would remove the thought that the GB are the only channel God is using, although G.Jackson admitted that it would be presumptuous to think that they were the only chanel. However I don't think he, or any of the others have put this in writing in any of our publications though. So unless someone has read Jackson's ARC deposition, they will be under the impression that the FDS, therefore the GB  are the ONLY chanel God is using, and therefore to question anything they say is tantamount to going against God himself. A few know this is not true, and the GB themselves think it's not true, but most  r&f believe it. (As you know, this was the reason why I got kicked out of one forum*. And this is  also why it appears that we "worship" the GB, because anything and everything they say is gold and must not be questioned, even if it could be wrong....because they are not infallible and can err...). 
    *Questioning God is allowed, but questioning the GB is not! How strange is that?
  6. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to TrueTomHarley in 1914   
    Several times I have heard this expression from you. I like to think that it could be ten or less years. It helps to keep on the watch.
    I even think that it is today’s emphasis on “critical thinking” that serves to downplay the above verse—as though obedience has nothing whatsoever to do with it—as though it is all a head matter that we ought to be able to figure out.
  7. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to JW Insider in 1914   
    Russell was an excellent student of the Bible. He knew it well. He wrote about the Bible very capably. He preached it. He clearly had insights into many of its teachings and principles. He could use scripture to explain scripture. He could show excellent rational insight along with spiritual insight. He showed faith and he showed discretion and wisdom. And he was one of the most interesting men of his time, because was very aware of the world around him and used this knowledge to help explain some of these insights, but usually without getting too bogged down in the secular, political or scientific arguments of the day.
    But, faith or no faith, he had absolutely no insight or understanding about the end of the gentile times. He made no prediction about a world war. He made absolutely no prediction about 1914 that came true. He made absolutely no prediction about the gentile times that came true.
    Russell thought the "end of the gentile times" was the equivalent of the FULL ESTABLISHMENT of a Jewish government in PALESTINE, and the FINAL END of the United States government and economy, the FINAL END of the United Kingdom's government and economy, the FINAL END of the Turkish government and economy, the FINAL END of the Chinese, Japanese, Russian, German, French, Norwegian, and Mexican governments and economies, too. ALL HUMAN GOVERNMENTS would fall in 1914/1915 and it would be the FULL establishment of a divinely backed Jewish government in Jerusalem, with the re-establishment of Israel in Palestine.
    We can only pretend that he got something right, because he predicted that the chaos of the complete fall of all these non-Jewish governments, along with the rise of Israel in Palestine, would result in a time of trouble that would END in 1914, and then around 1904, he changed it to BEGIN in 1914, and indicated that this chaos in the vacuum of any human political institutions would end in a matter of months after 1914, most likely ending in 1915.
    Which part of his "insight" or "understanding" of this matter came true? Which part was correct?
    It's true he started some backpeddling on his understanding in 1904 (mentioned above), then 1910, then 1913. That's because his view included some expectations that he considered unlikely in view of the time left. 
    Russell didn't think Jesus' invisible presence would start in 1914. Russell didn't think that Jesus' kingship would start in 1914. Russell didn't think a great battle would be fought between Jesus and Satan in 1914. There's NOTHING that we NOW think happened around 1914, that Russell predicted, and he NEVER thought that any of those things (that we now believe about 1914) had happened even after he saw the events of 1914 for himself.
    So where does anyone get the idea that Russell got even one thing right about 1914 prior to 1914?
  8. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to JW Insider in 1914   
    You are saying that they (GB) hang on to 1914 because if they get rid of it, they relinquish a Biblical base of authority. It's "nice" to have a Bible passage that talks about you and it's even "nicer" when that particular passage mentions a measure of authority and trust in advance of even greater authority and trust.
    I'm just saying that the reason they see the passage as speaking about themselves is because of 1914 first. Based on the importance given to that date, they expect to see certain actions that Jesus must have taken, or that it would seem reasonable for him to take. So it's kind of backwards to imply that they hang on to the date because of the authority. They hang onto the authority because of the date.
    But I'm also saying that this authority would be there anyway. Sure, they lose a little if they give "FDS" back to all the anointed, or even if they spread that authority around to include all the elders, or all Witnesses who support [feed] other Witnesses in any way, materially or spiritually or emotionally. (Recall that the verse once meant the anointed feeding the anointed, because the domestics were the anointed, too.)
    Common sense tells us that the purpose of elders in a congregation is to provide teaching and examples to follow and good judgment when it comes to dealing with difficult matters that might arise. We follow their lead. We listen. We copy their example. They persuade us to follow with good teaching and good examples.
    How much more would we think that the ones we consider qualified as elders over the global congregation would be worthy of even more respect. And we would be just as willing or more to follow their lead, listen, copy their example, etc.
    This is why it really came as no surprise to many Witnesses that the GB took upon themselves the entire role they interpreted to be the role of the FDS. To most Witnesses, the FDS always meant the GB anyway. The GB already represented the rest of the anointed in general, who had no say anyway. It was the GB, as head of the departments for Writing, Teaching, Service, Correspondence, etc., who were already considered the top of the "Bethel" headquarters hierarchy. It didn't matter if a certain thing was written by a member of the "other sheep," it was still considered to be under their direction. I actually asked a pioneer sister at the time if she had heard about the new GB=FDS doctrine right after that point from the Annual Meeting was announced on the website. She honestly thought that this was nothing new.
    In other words, something like this same respect for their teaching and example would have happened naturally as a matter of course. It has probably happened in every religion known to man. There have even been other religions that speak of their leadership councils as governing bodies. The level of agreement by the "rank-and-file" Witnesses (as Anthony Morriss III calls us) is just like other religions: a function of the emphasis given on the importance of this level of agreement.
  9. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Leander H. McNelly in 1914   
    @Srecko Sostar Fantastic comment. You are very deep thinking. But can you explain the last paragraph please. 
    Indeed the first century Christians, and even the Jews around at that time, were given lots of 'signs' in ways of miracles, curing all sorts of disease, turning water into wine, producing food enough for 10.000 people or more (I think they only counted the men), raising the dead et al.  It was as much seen by the physical eye as it was faith.  But now it seems, no one expects miracles.. No one but me maybe. 
    I loved the bit about Russell having 'faith'. gave him wrong insight and understanding. Other people' faiths, around Russell, also accepted same things that made them to be in wrong expectations too.
    So it is today it seems with the GB and JWs. 
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    @Outta Here   Quote " And the understanding we have now, as proclaimed by the GB of Jehovah's Witnesses and supported by their application of Scripture, would appear to me to bear this out."
    More GB worshipping at it's best  The blind leading the blind and wow, that is a massive pit they've fallen into. 
  10. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to TrueTomHarley in FAITH. IN WHOM OR WHAT and When ?   
    Yes. To borrow from the political world—which I know is not appreciated by many, still, a parallel is a parallel—something occurs here that is parallel to the media’s obsession with “separating Trump from his base.” What is their goal in doing that? So that the former will become irrelevant and the latter can be absorbed.
    So it is with the obsession with running down the Governing Body. Why is it done? So that they will become irrelevant and those following their lead can be absorbed back into the world. 
  11. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to the Sower of Seed in FAITH. IN WHOM OR WHAT and When ?   
    Just one of an unnamed mob. Just like those Jews that joined in shouting"Impale Him".
    Who were they ? We do not know. They were opposers of the Christ. Jehovah knew there would be misguided men that would bring about that great injustice. They worship Satan in their "works" of their so called faith. Like a ghost ship lost at sea, they are adrift in their reasonings against God, lost at sea.
    Acts 17:5 But the Jews, getting jealous, gathered together some wicked men who were loitering at the marketplace and formed a mob and proceeded to throw the city into an uproar. They assaulted the house of Jaʹson and were seeking to have Paul and Silas brought out to the mob.(Who were they?) 
    Some 20 million people were associated with Jehovah's Witnesses last year, and the year before, and the year before......Their Faith is Individual, They All have a similar faith in the Bible, they recognize that there were mistakes made by imperfect men in the past. Those mistakes are nothing in comparison to the blood guilt that other religions share in. 
    The Governing Body not being inspired is a disclaimer that every word ever written magazines was inspired as the Bible was.
    Are they Inspired YES. The Anointed must be inspired to know they are anointed.The Governing Body are humble men that have served Jehovah according to the faith of every man and woman in the Bible that were shown as having God's favor. Jesus, as a witness of Jehovah and His principles leads the Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses. The Governing Body, anointed or otherwise, examine what Jesus said along with the apostles and others that God used to write the Bible and every example there in, they pray to Jehovah and discuss many topics that are common to men. Those who switch to this form of worship and those who have spent their whole life as Jehovah's Witnesses reflect Peters words at John 6:68 So Jesus said to the Twelve: “You do not want to go also, do you?”68 Simon Peter answered him: “Lord, whom shall we go away to?
    Inspiration comes and goes according to God's Will, not because of mans desire. Many times the Bible states "and the spirit of Jehovah came upon him". That person was not inspired every minute of the day!
    2 Chron.20:14 Then in the middle of the congregation, the spirit of Jehovah came upon Ja·ha·ziʹel son of Zech·a·riʹah son of Be·naiʹah son of Je·iʹel son of Mat·ta·niʹah the Levite of the sons of Aʹsaph. 
     
     
     
     
  12. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in What job do you want in the new system?   
    Well one thing is sure, it's not talking about a literal furnace
  13. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Witness in FAITH. IN WHOM OR WHAT and When ?   
    @Witness Thank you.    Those events from 1914 onward were, as Jesus put it, “a beginning of pangs of distress.” (Matthew 24:8)  pr section 7 pp. 25-28 Wt’s Greek Kingdom Interlinear:  “Will rise up nation upon nation and kingdom against kingdom and will be famines and [earth] quakes down on places; all but these (things) beginning of pangs of birth”  Matt 24:8
    1914?  You have had children.  Since when do birth pangs/pains follow birth?  And why would the Watchtower not translate their Bible as their Interlinear reads, as “beginning of pangs of BIRTH” if not to support their lie about 1914?
    New International Version
    All these are the beginning of birth pains.

    New Living Translation
    But all this is only the first of the birth pains, with more to come.

    English Standard Version
    All these are but the beginning of the birth pains.

    Berean Study Bible
    All these are the beginning of birth pains.

    Berean Literal Bible
    And all these are the beginning of birth pains.

    New American Standard Bible
    "But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs.
    And yes, I dug out and dusted off my copy of The Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the GREEK SCRIPTURES. 1985. 
    And sure enough it says " all but these things beginning of pains of birth".
    Surely this is another example of going beyond the things written, especially as the GB state clearly that they are NOT inspired, so they have no excuse for changing the word of GOD. 
  14. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Anna in What job do you want in the new system?   
    I used to do the ministry work with an elder some times, and we would go out into the countryside to witness to 'country folk'.  He would look at the nice thatched cottages with lovely gardens and he would say ' One day one of these could be yours'. He meant after Armageddon. There seem to be quite a lot of JW folk that think you won't need to 'build' for a while because there will be enough useable property for those that God through Christ has shown mercy to. I don't think God or Christ are destructive for the sake of it. It wouldbe easy enough for them to remove humans without even damaging one building. The pain and horror for those not found worthy could easily be just being shown what they could have had. Just a quick glimpse of paradise, before they are destroyed. And why destroy everything that is pretty or useful just to destroy that which isn't. 
  15. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from James Thomas Rook Jr. in 1914   
    @Srecko Sostar Fantastic comment. You are very deep thinking. But can you explain the last paragraph please. 
    Indeed the first century Christians, and even the Jews around at that time, were given lots of 'signs' in ways of miracles, curing all sorts of disease, turning water into wine, producing food enough for 10.000 people or more (I think they only counted the men), raising the dead et al.  It was as much seen by the physical eye as it was faith.  But now it seems, no one expects miracles.. No one but me maybe. 
    I loved the bit about Russell having 'faith'. gave him wrong insight and understanding. Other people' faiths, around Russell, also accepted same things that made them to be in wrong expectations too.
    So it is today it seems with the GB and JWs. 
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    @Outta Here   Quote " And the understanding we have now, as proclaimed by the GB of Jehovah's Witnesses and supported by their application of Scripture, would appear to me to bear this out."
    More GB worshipping at it's best  The blind leading the blind and wow, that is a massive pit they've fallen into. 
  16. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in 1914   
    We raised issue on some other level. They witnessed to their faith and hope, and to some literal manifestations. But precisely said, they not witnessed in a way that we consider as word "witness" primatly means. It would be as someone today gave testimony as witness on Court about something, and he say to Judge: "I didn't saw what happened but I believe i know what happened because this was promised to me that will happen. And things that i saw are exactly that."   
    Religious people today depending on testimonies made by people in the past who not witnessed to some events, to some they did. Also, people today put trust on people who wrote about this things and also to translators. And finally, people put their trust on spiritual mediators aka church leaders, who are strong force that drive faith and hope of people in particular direction. 
    People in Jesus' days was under promise and expectations that day will SEE supernatural events as Proof how individual who doing this is Send By God. I think how WT Society take this position in their explanations. So, miracles are of important things that surrounding life and faith of people in Israel from the very beginning. Without miracles, many of events described in Bible, would never happened and history will be different and present will be different. No matter did such miracles really happened or not. Christian faith, before and today, would be in some other format without miracles. Christians in 1 century was totally in miracles of all kind. Today, things are different. 
    faith gave a person insight to understand the end of the gentile times in 1914 way before the event of WW1 happened.
    If i understand what i read before about this correctly, faith he had (Russell) gave him wrong insight and understanding. Other people' faiths, around Russell, also accepted same things that made them to be in wrong expectations too.
    It seems how "faith" (own or other' people) is not trustful. It is not what makes things come true. Faith of man, who is blind, who believe he will see, not makes him cured of blindness because of mere faith. Someone who has power to do miracle, have to cure him from blindness. Than, this man' faith have value and justification. Otherwise is superstition, empty hope. Faith (to believe something) not need knowledge. Because knowledge would say, miracles are not possible. Do we have some "special" knowledge? WT Society teaches how 1 century miracles are not possible today. 
    Russell had some "special" knowledge and some "special "faith". And that ended in past. His legal heirs wants to make all that as progress on a way to "ultimate knowledge and faith".  
  17. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Kosonen in FAITH. IN WHOM OR WHAT and When ?   
    @Arauna James 5:7 Be patient then, brothers, until the presence of the Lord.
    This statement, "until the presence of the Lord" indicates that Christ's presence will be a short time period. Why else does James tell us to be patient until the presence of the Lord.
    From the Bible it is clear that in fact Christ's presence begins when the sign of the son of man will be seen on the sky. Then we will know he is present in its real sense. 
    Otherwise it could likewise be said that Jesus has always been present because he said in Matthew 28:20 "And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.”
     
     
     
     
    @4Jah2me 
    Here is a scripture that predict that the WT organization will cease to funtion in the begining of the final years leading up to Armageddon.
    Daniel12:7 “It will be for an appointed time, appointed times, and half a time. As soon as the dashing to pieces of the power of the holy people comes to an end,+ all these things will come to their finish.”
    This scripture is tied to Daniel 11:31 "And arms will stand up, proceeding from him; and they will profane the sanctuary, the fortress, and remove the constant feature. “And they will put in place the disgusting thing that causes desolation."
    The true meaning of these scriptures is about a halting of WT organization by the force of authorities. That has never before happened. WT has been printed without disruption since its beginning. 
    The WT organization does not understand Daniel 11 nor 12 and have been unable to give a true explanation to these prophecies. 
     
  18. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Witness in FAITH. IN WHOM OR WHAT and When ?   
    I answer your comments to me, as presenting the spiritual aspect of truth to any who may be interested. 
    Jesus told the Pharisees,  “An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and a sign will not be given it, except the sign of Jonah.” And He left them and went away.” Matt 16:
    Then some of the scribes and Pharisees said to Him, “Teacher, we want to see a sign from You.” 39 But He answered and said to them, “An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet; 40 for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Matt 12:38-40 
    To involve oneself in the business of the politics and religions of the world is dabbling in the spirit of the world. Satan is the originator of the “signs and false wonders” to deceive.  2 Thess 2:9  The sign Jesus gave to the Pharisees had to do with him, not the world’s business.  Obviously, even though he gave them the “sign”, they still rejected him. He fulfilled the sign and they refused to accept it, because they wanted to see more, what their eyes could physically see, just as JWs want to see more than the spiritual sign:
    At that time two robbers were crucified with Him, one on the right and one on the left. 39 And those passing by were hurling abuse at Him, wagging their heads 40 and saying, “You who are going to destroy the temple and rebuild it in three days, save Yourself! If You are the Son of God, come down from the cross/(stake).” 41 In the same way the chief priests also, along with the scribes and elders, were mocking Him and saying, 42 “He saved others; He cannot save Himself. He is the King of Israel; let Him now come down from the cross, and we will believe in Him. 43 He trusts in God; let God rescue Him now, if He delights in Him; for He said, ‘I am the Son of God.’” 44 The robbers who had been crucified with Him were also insulting Him with the same words.  Matt 27:38-44
    …just as Satan wanted Jesus to do:
    Matt 4:6 – “and said to Him, “If You are the Son of God, throw Yourself down; for it is written, ‘He will command His angels concerning You’; and ‘On their hands they will bear You up, So that You will not strike Your foot against a stone.’”
     
    During the last days, the “sign” has to do with the anointed of the Body of Christ, under the New Covenant.  The Kingdom will not arrive until the Temple built on Christ is completed, with the correct number of faithful and refined “living stones” sealed into it. Zech, chapter 4.   God will then say at the right time , “it is enough”, “and judgment is made in favor of the saints to possess the kingdom.” (Dan 7:21,22,13,14; Matt 24:30)   Does that happen in Satan’s world, or in the “heavens”?  The purging, cleansing of the “heavens and earth” by fire, involves the “kings of the earth” – the anointed of Christ.  (1 Cor 3:12-15; 2 Pet 3:7; Jer 23:29; Rev 1:5)  The war against “nations and kingdoms” (Matt 24:6-8) is a war of truth against lies spoken by Christ’s “kings of the earth” – between those who become unfaithful, and those who are faithful to their Head.   Jesus faced a “son of perdition” who delivered him up to be killed for speaking truth; the anointed also face a “man of lawlessness/son of perdition” who, under the direction of unfaithful anointed, have them spiritually “killed” for representing Christ and not an organization of men.  This is happening now.  (Matt 24:15,16; Luke 21:12; John 16:2; Matt 25:40,45,46; (Acts 9:5) 2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 11:1,2;  1 Cor 3:16,17; Rev 13:1,2,6,7; 11:1-3,7)
     Will they stand up for Christ or continue allowing  a wicked slave feed them lies?  (Matt 24:48-51; Rev 16:13,14)
     Each anointed is tested by Satan, they are presented lies, and either refined by truth in Christ or they continue to follow “false prophets” who “deceive the elect”.  (Matt 24:24; Rev 2:20; Rev 13:11,12)  They are accused and slandered by Satan and those he uses against them for rejecting falsehoods.   If Jesus had become unfaithful to God and the testimony he was to give, he wouldn’t have been killed.  He would have been accepted by the Pharisees.  Matt 16:25
    The signs of the end are spiritual signs that play out in the organization and the anointed, not among the nations of the world.   JWs forget that the Kingdom won’t arrive without God’s right number of anointed being found with “no lie in their mouth”, “pure and blameless” with Christ Jesus as their Head, not listening to men who have a history of false doctrine.  (Rev 14:4,5; Phil 2:15; Jude 1:12,13) Perhaps your definition of truth is WT’s definition, but it isn’t God’s definition.  JWs seem to disregard the parable of the ten virgins. (Matt 25)  They forget that the anointed under the New Covenant “woman” WILL be tested by Satan. (Luke 22:31; Rev 12:1-4)  All of these things are signs that should have great meaning for us if we desire to live in the Kingdom: not whether two nations are at war, or the Pope has made some peace pact with other religions.  The coming of the Kingdom is based on the faithfulness of the anointed in Christ.   
    Maybe @Srecko Sostar can find the quote on truth for me, that he posted a while back, on truth’s simplicity.  What JWs believe, is a twisted, complicated mess that leads one questioning, wondering what is truth and what is a lie – what was truth yesterday, what it will be tomorrow, or a year from now. 
     
    God's word is life; Jesus' teachings are life.  If you were to read them and saw an error, since I am not always accurate in typing them down, I would fix the error.  The opinion of someone is just an opinion, unless it is backed by God's word completely. (Rom 3:4)
    Well, we are on two different planes; yours is the continual blow-by-blow physical enactment of what’s going on in Satan’s world; mine is the spiritual, since Jesus stated his kingdom is “not of this world”.  John 18:36  If we are both “OCD”, what of it?  What is important is truth, no matter how much it is repeated. 
    And after the birth of God’s Kingdom in 1914, it was Satan who began “to wage war” with the remnant of anointed ones. (Rev. 12:17) W 15/5/15 pp. 14-18 Those events from 1914 onward were, as Jesus put it, “a beginning of pangs of distress.” (Matthew 24:8)  pr section 7 pp. 25-28 Wt’s Greek Kingdom Interlinear:  “Will rise up nation upon nation and kingdom against kingdom and will be famines and [earth] quakes down on places; all but these (things) beginning of pangs of birth”  Matt 24:8
    1914?  You have had children.  Since when do birth pangs/pains follow birth?  And why would the Watchtower not translate their Bible as their Interlinear reads, as “beginning of pangs of BIRTH” if not to support their lie about 1914?
     
     But when He was alone, those around Him with the twelve asked Him about the parable. 11 And He said to them, “To you it has been given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God; but to those who are outside, all things come in parables, 12 so that
    ‘Seeing they may see and not perceive,
    And hearing they may hear and not understand;
    Lest they should turn,
    And their sins be forgiven them.’ ”  Mark 4:10-12
     
     Pearl Doxsey - "Labor Pains" 4womaninthewilderness
  19. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in 2 Types of Worshippers on the Earth   
    "He will speak for you to the people, and he will be your spokesman, and you will serve as God to him"    (you will be representing God to him".)
    This quote is from exodus 4 :16 where Moses will be a" God" to Aaron.    This does not mean Moses must be worshipped but he will represent God to Aaron and will in this capacity have higher position than Aaron when representing the people when going before pharoah.
    In ancient times the word "god"  was often used for  the Ceasar.   Jesus is therefore also called "a God" in several places. Also in hebrews 1:9  "
    You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you with the oil of exultation more than your companions.”
     
     
  20. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in What job do you want in the new system?   
    If the windows have glass, and the homes have internal plumbing, I hope some Brothers like to work at Home Depot.
    I would sure hate to have to build a home where the only fasteners were strips of dried out cat gut.
     
  21. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Anna in What job do you want in the new system?   
    He's being sarcastic
  22. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in 1914   
    @JW Insider & @Srecko Sostar This helps me to have faith that the True Anointed will get true direction from God through Christ, by Holy Spirit. 
    Because we live in such an important time period and because there is supposed to be a large in gathering before Judgement time, there needs to be real spiritual upbuilding for the Anointed Remnant, so that the direction they give will be positive enough to draw people to God. Hence my feelings that there is quite a long time before that Judgement time.  The time period is important but that doesn't mean in is very short. I honestly feel that God or Christ will make much more known to those they chose as worthy of being the F&DS. 
    Whilst i agree with you, the JW Org predicted 1975 or mid 70's. The Org has been talking about world conditions since JWs began. But it could still continue for ten or more years. In my opinion, it is not world conditions that are important, it is God's own reasons for His timing. God could keep it 'simmering ' for another 100 years if He so wished. 
  23. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Arauna in 1914   
    True, but Jesus said: “Notice the fig tree and all the other trees.  When they are budding, you see it for yourselves and know that now the summer is near." 
    When I watch world events I compare it to what I have read in the bible.  It helps me to understand what is going on. This is why I agree with the GB.  It is not worship of them which allows me to agree with them -  it is knowledge of the realities around me.   I see the big blossoms opening up everywhere! 
  24. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to JW Insider in 1914   
    Interesting points, in that it made them witnesses of what they saw through the "eyes" of their faith. Faith is assured expectation of things not seen. They saw the resurrected Jesus, but he was in a different state, "materialized." In time, they all had faith that this was not a demon or just any angel materializing as Jesus, but Jesus himself, the one they had previously witnessed in person. (The resurrected Jesus restored as an even more powerful spirit being, but materialized.) Up to 500 persons saw him in this state. And through the outpouring of the holy spirit at Pentecost they realized what they were receiving, in faith, that this was what Jesus had promised after he would sit down at the right hand of the Father's heavenly throne. As a group, however, they witnessed this, too. Stephen had a vision of Jesus standing at God's right hand. (Makes no difference if you are sitting or standing when you are at the right hand of the throne of majesty.)
  25. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in 1914   
    In Act 5 we see how apostles were busy with Jesus' teaching and because of that they fall under persecution. As a tool for defending themselves they said:
    29 Peter and the other apostles replied: “We must obey God rather than human beings! 30 The God of our ancestors raised Jesus from the dead—whom you killed by hanging him on a cross. 31 God exalted him to his own right hand as Prince and Savior that he might bring Israel to repentance and forgive their sins. 32 We are witnesses of these things, and so is the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.”
    They claim how they witnessed of these two things:
    1) Jesus raised from dead
    2) Jesus was exalted to God' own right hand
    Peter and apostles claimed how they are witnesses of this two things. No one of them saw by own eyes Jesus' resurrection. And two of apostles didn't recognize resurrected Jesus when he appeared to them ("they were kept from recognizing him" - verse said, Luke 24).....   When he was at the table with them, he took bread, gave thanks, broke it and began to give it to them. Then their eyes were opened and they recognized him, and he disappeared from their sight. 
    After the Lord Jesus had spoken to them, He was taken up into heaven and sat down at the right hand of God - Mark 16
    He began to be parted from them, and a cloud received Him out of their sight.” - Act 1:9
    As we see from this Bible verse, cloud made impossible for apostles to see how he sat down.
    Important questions are: What sort of witnesses were apostles? To what events they witnessed? 
    They saw resurrected Jesus but not recognized him and they didn't saw nothing what was happened in the Heaven about his sitting down. Now, we have their claim how holy spirit is also witness to this two events. And they call for HS, in front their persecutors, as some sort of undeniable proof to their claims. Perhaps they expected how persecutors will be afraid to go against HS and stop to persecuted them. But that didn't happened. 
    I see here these subject: Apostles calling for HS because they personally didn't saw nothing of spoken claims. But it seems how they want to tell us, how individuals who received (will receive in a close of far future) HS will be in position to see invisible things. But to receive HS you have to Obey. Apostles send message to persecutors how then are not Obeying HS and as result they can't receive HS and as next result they can't see or to be witnesses of this two events.  
    Did apostles received HS to see invisible things? How it came about that HS didn't open their eyes to recognize Jesus at first sight? They didn't been inspired at that moment? But after they were? It seems how these Bible verses talking about importance to be under influence of HS, or to be inspired, as precondition to be able to see, and understand, what is going on.
    Now we came again to one of crucial questions. Is it possible to be inspired by HS and as such, in that condition of mind, hearth, spirituality, to be Witness for things not heard and not seen in literal sense? Because only if we are inspired we See things, invisible. Not only invisible because they are in some other place and time in Universum. But also to see invisible things here on Earth, in the Bible, in WT Society, JW congregation and in society as whole? 
    To what things JW's witnessing today? And what sort of witnesses they are? Are they merely witnesses of their own faith, beliefs? Are they witnesses to "signs"? But as was already said and as it is written in the Bible looking or searching for "signs" are not what Jesus recommended. 
    Of what importance then is, to be witness of 1914 events? or other events in WT history and her life as Mother Organization? 
     
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Service Confirmation Terms of Use Privacy Policy Guidelines We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.