Patiently waiting for Truth

Are you expecting a person to predict something totally out of the realm of prophesy already established in the scriptures?  Like…a prediction that money will fall from heaven on a certain date and it happens?   Is that the type of prophesy you’re thinking of? 🙂  It sounds like the work of sorcery, of “lying signs and wonders”, just as 1914 was. (2 Thess 2:9; Matt 24:23-25; 1 Tim 4:1; Col 2:8)
God talks about this in Deut 13:1-5. It says, God “tests” His people.  He allows the test, which originates with the devil. (Luke 22:31)  Where did God’s saints, the remnant, end up over the last 150 years?  In the Watchtower organization that has become their idol.  No JW that is fully devoted to it, can tear themselves away and follow only, the Father and the Son as warned about in the Deuteronomy 13.   (Rev 13:4-8)
John the Baptist preached repentance and to “prepare the way” for the coming of the Messiah.
The last prophet bears a similar message as John the Baptist/”Elijah”, for God’s holy people to “prepare the way” for the return of Christ.  (Isa 42:16; Mark 1:3; Matt 17:11,12; Rev 11:1-3)
 
 

She is a misguided Christian who is shown to lean towards Mainstream ideas without realizing it.
For this I can say everyone is correct concerning Pentecost 33AD, even the likes of @Patiently waiting for Truth granted these gifts essentially began by means of the spirit however, they somehow believe that after Apostle John that these miraculous gifts continued afterwards, like prophesying to predict or have visions.
I asked myself, many times, yet none of them can produce.

One should always appreciate and believe in the honesty and integrity of other people. It is commendable that JW have faith that GB wants to be fair and honest. Other people outside the JW community need to be able to understand that JW members want to trust their leaders and consider them honest. It is a good quality in any interpersonal relationship that enables success.
I think the problem is in withdrawing the thesis that equates (human) perfection with infallibility. It's not quite the same.
The best examples of this are Adam and Eve. Perfect people, but that didn't save them from making a fatal mistake. 
Invoking imperfection, over and over again when something is said and done wrong, becomes meaningless because the state of "imperfection" becomes a tool to justify and excuse one's own inability to do something with the least bad consequences.
GB uses such a tool to justify his own misguided guidelines that they worked for in the name of God. Therein lies their guilt.
If they had said clearly and loudly that they have an opinion and belief about a doctrine that is such because it seems to them most accurate, then they could rightly invoke imperfection, so they were mistaken. But when they claim that doctrines are the only and unique truth because they come from God, then all subsequent wisdom, they later show, makes no sense.
 
 

This is a fact - one cannot say they have NO spirit.  This belies all the promises from Jehovah. They do have our trust because they are honest and do their best for us.  The prophecy in Ezekiel we have just studied indicates that there will be an administration.  Why? because they give us food at the proper time so the whole brotherhood remain in unity. Without this organization everyone will be doing their own thing and teach different things.  We remain one because we are united.  If we understand something differently we wait until better light comes. We realize Jehovah has to work with flawed human beings...... not infallible.   So you seem to have a beef with us.....  but you have NO trust.
The prophecy in Isaiah 2: 2-4 indicates that in the last days Jehovah will have ONE people out of all the nations and law will go forth from Zion....   Surely this info needs to be redistributed?  So yes.... the organization is not your idea of perfection ...... but God never gave an indication that it would be perfect.  But they have been diligent to prepare us for Armageddon and displaying the qualities of god, which includes trust and love for god and for our brothers.

It is with such things that GB juggles.
They claim how they are not inspired by spirit and they are not infallible but they are guided by the spirit, ............. so it is a guarantee that they can be given complete trust.
:))

Ya ever notice that ALL of today’s “faith healers” heal stuff that is invisible to start with?
…… let me know when someone heals a thalidomide baby with no arms or hands, with fingers growing out of her shoulder
THEN you will have my attention!
 
Until then, EVERYBODY is just playing with words, like a retarded kid in a pool full of Scrabble chips.
 

He's actually right, I just responded to him
The miraculous gifts of the holy spirit included were a temporary provision. The Bible foretold that, if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away with; if there are tongues, they will cease.—1 Corinthians 13:8.
Not only does the Watchtower knows this, but people who understood Paul. If one understood how these gifts were passed around in the days of the early Christian congregation, it would make a lot more sense. I made a point to that, and I believe both @Space Merchant and @Arauna said the same thing. @Patiently waiting for Truth was more focused on the anointed Christians who had the holy spirit, but the fact apostle John was throw into the mix, it changes everything. Seeing that these gifts came to an end in the final years of the first century, it makes sense it did pass on with apostle John. The gifts were not passed on to anyone else afterwards, even John's students, and there is no history or evidence of others who had these gifts afterwards into the second century. There were people who did claim to have visions, but never had this gifts at all, or as to what @Space Merchant said, Prophets who are inspired and those who are not.
Whether Space Merchant, or his actual name, Baptiste, says something in a long post or a short post, if you actually read what he said, you'd understand, but from what I am seeing, if someone is actually educated and knows his craft, he a threat apparently. I guess discernment is actually a good thing. But he is clever in making his posts to root out something to challenge.

No.  Paul did not say that  prophesy had ceased, and I'm talking about inspired prophesy.  @Patiently waiting for Truth is right, you are misleading a young one; one that should come out of the organization. (Matt 24:15,16; Rev 18:4-8)
"Love never fails. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away. 9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part. But when that which is [d]perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away.
"perfect" - meaning "complete", this will not happen until Jesus returns. Until the kingdom, prophesy, and  knowledge continue.
If you say that prophesy has ceased, then you may as well say that knowledge has ceased. 
Nowhere in the scriptures did the apostles say that prophesy would cease before all is "complete".  
 
 
 
 
 
 

The true enemy is Satan the devil. And God's word gives us enough information about the 'end times'.  Only YHWH through Yeshua  will save who He wishes to save.  As for the rest of it, persecution will come from all sides, but dying is not a problem when we have faith in the resurrection. 

@Space Merchant  I think that the adult / mature thing for me to say here is that, you and I should agree to have different opinions about things.  As for you saying you do not have opinions, well once again we must differ here. 
My feeling about you is, that you are a 'cold hearted' Theologian.  What I mean by that is, you have vast knowledge of the scriptures but you seem to lack the faith and direction of a True Christian. 
Jehovah's Witnesses are the same. One difference with the JW's though, they are given direction by 8 men in America.  
I have no idea if you 'follow' any direction from any 'religious' humans, though it seems as if you are the one giving direction to others. 
I note you have a young follower here. So sad to see a young man worshipping you. He seems to think you are winning battles here  .  What you are actually doing is pretending that you are always right, and he is fooled by your words. He is young, he will learn. 
You and I cannot have a proper basic discussion because you have a totally different mindset to me. I look to the future with hope, but it's not hope for me, it's hope for other people.  YHWH will work through Yeshua, the Earth will be cleansed, those considered worthy will live on, and the dead will be resurrected. All of those things will bring praise to YHWH through Yeshua.  Those are things that God has allowed me to know in my heart.  
However I still believe that nearer the end of this old system of things, the True Anointed will be given more accurate knowledge through Holy Spirit, and true direction will be given to those seeking to serve YHWH properly.
Ten (earthly) men clinging to the the robe of a (spiritual) Jew.  The True Anointed will become more apparent to real Christians. 

@Space Merchant  I think that the adult / mature thing for me to say here is that, you and I should agree to have different opinions about things.  As for you saying you do not have opinions, well once again we must differ here. 
My feeling about you is, that you are a 'cold hearted' Theologian.  What I mean by that is, you have vast knowledge of the scriptures but you seem to lack the faith and direction of a True Christian. 
Jehovah's Witnesses are the same. One difference with the JW's though, they are given direction by 8 men in America.  
I have no idea if you 'follow' any direction from any 'religious' humans, though it seems as if you are the one giving direction to others. 
I note you have a young follower here. So sad to see a young man worshipping you. He seems to think you are winning battles here  .  What you are actually doing is pretending that you are always right, and he is fooled by your words. He is young, he will learn. 
You and I cannot have a proper basic discussion because you have a totally different mindset to me. I look to the future with hope, but it's not hope for me, it's hope for other people.  YHWH will work through Yeshua, the Earth will be cleansed, those considered worthy will live on, and the dead will be resurrected. All of those things will bring praise to YHWH through Yeshua.  Those are things that God has allowed me to know in my heart.  
However I still believe that nearer the end of this old system of things, the True Anointed will be given more accurate knowledge through Holy Spirit, and true direction will be given to those seeking to serve YHWH properly.
Ten (earthly) men clinging to the the robe of a (spiritual) Jew.  The True Anointed will become more apparent to real Christians. 

@Space Merchant  I think that the adult / mature thing for me to say here is that, you and I should agree to have different opinions about things.  As for you saying you do not have opinions, well once again we must differ here. 
My feeling about you is, that you are a 'cold hearted' Theologian.  What I mean by that is, you have vast knowledge of the scriptures but you seem to lack the faith and direction of a True Christian. 
Jehovah's Witnesses are the same. One difference with the JW's though, they are given direction by 8 men in America.  
I have no idea if you 'follow' any direction from any 'religious' humans, though it seems as if you are the one giving direction to others. 
I note you have a young follower here. So sad to see a young man worshipping you. He seems to think you are winning battles here  .  What you are actually doing is pretending that you are always right, and he is fooled by your words. He is young, he will learn. 
You and I cannot have a proper basic discussion because you have a totally different mindset to me. I look to the future with hope, but it's not hope for me, it's hope for other people.  YHWH will work through Yeshua, the Earth will be cleansed, those considered worthy will live on, and the dead will be resurrected. All of those things will bring praise to YHWH through Yeshua.  Those are things that God has allowed me to know in my heart.  
However I still believe that nearer the end of this old system of things, the True Anointed will be given more accurate knowledge through Holy Spirit, and true direction will be given to those seeking to serve YHWH properly.
Ten (earthly) men clinging to the the robe of a (spiritual) Jew.  The True Anointed will become more apparent to real Christians. 

@Equivocation As you can see, he has nothing. And I will point out that even Butler agrees with him not only for his ill remarks, but sides with a man who defends the Unisex teaching which shows that the patiently waiting for truth moniker, isn't being lived up to.
He claims JW order or Unitarian Order, outlandish assertions, when in reality God's Order is unchanged, God does not change, and has always been the same since the Garden of Eden, concerning Adam, as is Eve.
The Bible’s teaching that the Most High is a God of order, for we understand that his order, for he is not a fan of confusion or disorder as seen in  (1 Corinthians 14:33). This verse is part of a rebuke of the Corinthian church, of which was in the original thread in which both @Witness and @Srecko Sostar were shown to purposely twist in conjunction with Pearl's assertions. Their worship services were out of control (1 Corinthians 14:23), hence why Paul came to upbuild the Church. Paul bases the command for order in the church on the fact that God Himself is a God of order, not chaos.
Likewise with other remarks of Paul, for Paul understand this:
The Head of the Christ is God The head of the Church is the Christ The head of the Man is the Christ The head of the woman is the Man For such order has context, as is the roles of which men and women have in the church, although different, still unified.
As you can see in the way both @Srecko Sostar and @Witness responses, they do not understand what Paul conveys here, even by means of the thread. Due to what they say here, As I told @Dmitar perhaps I may make a refutation thread in regards to Pearl Doxsey's Unisex view, and will do so using the Bible. Normally it is due to Trinitarianism, but in this case, those who protect and defend teachings that is not core to the early church, and not only the thread will be made, as in all debates, an example must be made concerning them as it was done with @Coswhich will harmonize with what Kel stated concerning former members of your faith.
that being said, the same reaction gained from Trinitarians, I already know how the reaction would be here, but it makes no difference because truth cuts through falsehood and those defending.
 

This is completely irrelevant to me, regarding what is important to me given the comment made.
What kind/sort of Unitarian you are or to what denomination you belong or not belong, that is important only to you dear SM. 

Excellent observation!
SM  so strongly advocates a specific Christian Order, but is not prepared to act within the specific Order of the Unitarian Church or here within the Order of JW Church. Both churches are Christian churches.
 
 Are JWs in America back on the 'door to door' work now ?
Space Merchant replied to Patiently waiting for Truth's topic in Jehovah’s Witnesses's Topics
...I am a Biblical Unitarian Christian yes, however I am not of the Unitarian Church.  

Why your objection that others have the wrong mindset, when you yourself are advocating the wrong attitude about women and claiming that God has an unchangeable Order. Well there is no immutable. He revoked the Order from OT and placed another Order through NT. And change will continue to happen.

Yikes looks like the dam cracked wide open in this thread. Was lurking so based on what I am seeing.... 😬😬😬
If one guy is right but a few people who's never been challenged react only to get beat down again. A more detailed look is from what is seen here some Former Jehovah’s Witnesses has never been challenged before and when it actually happens, it shows who is truthful and who isn't. Guess when the shoe is on the other foot it feels unpleasant and to that I will say for another thread that ended up like this.
What a way to go out.
@Pudgy Thank goodness for those comic strip because it helps a lot lol.

On the one hand, God creates Adam and Eve who are not given the concept of patriarchy or the concept of the man (Adam) as the only one who has the last word in everything.
On the other hand, it later allows for a system of patriarchy and polygamy and slavery.
Then enters a phase in which it softens the laws of OT and creates a concept of equality within the Christian community in which it still relies on a slightly softer patriarchal relationship between man and woman.
And as a special new level, architecture emerges in which men and women become representatives of the government with functions that include / unite political and religious power (Kings and priests).
This approach is unique in that it allows women what they have never been allowed to do in either Judaism or Christianity. To rule over the people (the only OT exception, I think, is Deborah in the capacity of Judge) and to perform priestly service.
The activity of the Prophetess was also an exception.
But it is precisely these exceptions that speak of a God who has no problem with the concepts (out of known "Order") in which women are given to be in positions for which some zealous/stubborn men claim to be the only right given to them.

144000 = Kings = political/administrative service/position........both, male and female
144000 = Priests = spiritual/religious service/position.........both, male and female
Priest = https://www.dictionary.com/browse/priest
noun a person whose office it is to perform religious rites, and especially to make sacrificial offerings. (in Christian use) a person ordained to the sacerdotal or pastoral office; a member of the clergy; minister. (in hierarchical churches) a member of the clergy of the order next below that of bishop, authorized to carry out the Christian ministry. a minister of any religion. verb (used with object) to ordain as a priest.   Did Chloe belong to 144,000? Did some other women in the first century and later belong to 144,000? If so, then they had the same type of calling as the male members. Same type of call. Same kind of service. The same amount of pay, so to speak.      

Thank you for your reply. And it seems more natural and accurate to me that JWs consider themselves followers and disciples of Christ. I think that's what other Christian denominations conclude about themselves too.

May I ask how so…??…I would have thought the opposite was happening
Example: a few of us older sister were discussing the old bible story book..you would know them…the scary pictures of a mother holding her Baby appearing to scream for help as the water rises…..
I didnt know a number of those fearful pictures have been removed tho actually depicting truth were really instilling to much fear…and children needed to be taught to love Jehovah and Jesus not from fear .
I think it was a hangover from Christendom  teaching…but we have seen that and as a people corrected it..
I have not needed to use the Bible book of stories for sometime so I didn’t know that…even a firm brother in the truth did not read certain stories to his children because he deemed them not appropriate for them,
The society have seen and understood this and changed their way of teaching ..is this not a good thing?…
I genuinely  would like to know what you mean please .

It’s also been known to be used to distinguish two groups of people, so that you don’t have to say  ‘us and other us.’

….. 
 

It is strange that some people will agree that some prophecy in scripture can have more than one fulfillment. Some prophecies have a small fulfillment, and then many years later, a much bigger fulfillment.  
That is my reasoning behind the Acts scripture that I use. Yes indeed it was fulfilled in a small way at Pentecost 33, but that does not mean it will not be fulfilled in a much bigger way through the Anointed Remnant, before Armageddon. 
The Apostle John was one of the Anointed / chosen ones, and the Anointed Remnant are also of the chosen ones.

You used the word above...  I think you have no concept of the meaning or you are using hyperbole.  I have seen no extremism amongst JWs.  That is why I corrected your use of words.