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Patiently waiting for Truth

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  1. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Dmitar in The Last Days that began in 1914 are now coming to their End...   
    The truth is you have to kiss the butt of the Elders to be able to get baptised. The Elders rule over the congregations.
    The congregation i was in when I wanted to get baptised, was ruled over by two Elders, a father and son.  The son decided that I wasn't ready, so his father agreed. They STOPPED me getting baptised. But I was humble then, I just said ok. Later when the son wanted me to get baptised i actually didn't want to. But once again I was humble, and I did as I was told, and got baptised. 
    So I know first hand (from more than one experience) that the Elders have complete control over the congregants, and they love every minute of it. But of course they will be judged for it. 
  2. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    From your explanation I would conclude that then the problem is in those JWs who conduct a Bible study with an “interested pedophile,” and later in JW elders who approve of such a candidate to be baptized as a JW.
    It follows from all this that, the JW belief as"the angels guide and supervise their preaching" and thus the biblical teaching on the individual level of the future candidate, is not useful. Or you have such impression how angels are not helpful in JW preaching service?
    Also, prayer at the beginning and end of Bible study does not reach God, because He does not warn them (JW members) of the hidden pitfalls and hidden intentions of the one with whom they study the Bible. 
    JW members believe that God and the Holy Spirit lead/guide this “imperfect” Organization that claims to be the only true Christian congregation. Observers would rightly expect the CSA plague not to be in such proportions at the JW Church. Observers would rightly expect, too, that JW members and especially leaders/elders in JW assemblies be prepared for all, "be able to extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one". But, sadly, JW members and elders failed. They failed the exam/the test.
     
     
  3. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Dmitar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    @Space Merchant If you don't like the IICSA that is your problem.  I think they are trying their best to do a good job. If I can give them and the Police information then I will, because I think it's the Christian thing to do and I also think it's a legal requirement. 
    Tell me what investigations / organisations the USA has that are investigating CSA in religion ?  
    As for the 'grooming gangs' here in UK, most are non-white, non-english, this seems to have been proven in court cases. But when poeple say that they get accused of racism.  And yes, the UK government is currupt, and greedy, dishonest and selfish, but then so are all politicians earthwide. But once again that is all part of the world, and i don't get involved. 
    The main point that I'm concerned with is that True Christians need a Clean True Organisation guided by True Anointed ones, led by God's Holy Spirit, through Christ. 
    Anything outside of that is part of the world. If a person starts to get involved in trying to 'put things right' in the world, then that person will be side tracked from trying to serve God properly.  
    We ARE living in the Last Days. Whether it will be another ten years or another thirty years. So trying to put worldly things right is just a waste of time. You said yourself CSA will get worse. In fact all things will get worse. So the concentration should be on building an Organisation that serves God properly through Christ. And that Organisation needs to be completely clean. i have faith that it will happen. 
     
  4. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in 2034 and its significance...   
    This is always true for people with a total lack of imagination, and motivation.
  5. Haha
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in 2034 and its significance...   
    For humans, the older you get, the more of the threat of being rounded up and put into an interment camp appears to be a good alternative to going to a rest home your children have picked out.
    Dogs have the advantage however because we know we will be loved and cared for at the home of those who love and care for us until the very end, and if necessary they will take us to the vet to be painlessly put down before  we start to rot while  still alive.
    A very great kindness, not available to most humans.
     
  6. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Dmitar in 2034 and its significance...   
    Oh dear another doom and gloom picture, to frighten people. It looks like something from a scary movie  
    And oh dear again. BR in back on the 1914 horse, but I think that horse died long ago. 
    And now 2034 is no longer THE year, but a beginning of something ? 
    And the 120 years of Noah ? Guessing again by putting thoughts into scriptures that God never put there. 
    BR, it seems you are a scare monger wanting attention for yourself. 
    Shame I'll never know, as I will be long dead before 2034 .  
     
  7. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from the Sower of Seed in The Sacred Field Ministry Stopped by a Bad Flu?   
    https://www.jw.org/en/library/books/2020-service-year-report/2020-grand-totals/
    How Many of Jehovah’s Witnesses Are There Worldwide?
    2020 Report
    Number of Jehovah’s Witnesses worldwide 8,695,808
    Congregations
    120,387
    Lands where Jehovah’s Witnesses preach
    240
    2020 Grand Totals
     
    Branches of Jehovah’s Witnesses: 87
    Number of Lands Reporting: 240
    Total Congregations: 120,387
    Worldwide Memorial Attendance: 17,844,773
    Memorial Partakers Worldwide: 21,182
    Peak of Publishers *: 8,695,808
    Average Publishers Preaching Each Month: 8,424,185
    Percentage of Increase Over 2019: -0.6
    Total Number Baptized *: 241,994
    Average Pioneer * Publishers Each Month: 1,299,619
    Average Auxiliary Pioneer Publishers Each Month: 338,568
    Total Hours Spent in Field: 1,669,901,531
    Average Bible Studies * Each Month: 7,705,765
     
     
  8. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    If you start fighting against things in the world then where do you stop that fight ? 
    The idea of the JW religion is to be 'No Part of the World'.  And the point of condemning the JW Org is because they pretend to be so different but are really just as bad as all the others.
    And it seems that you also lack faith. In fact it is difficult to know what you believe really.  You seem to be involved in this world which Jesus said he was no part of. 
     
  9. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    Every good information and action should be supported. If the methods you use are successful, you might be able to send information about it to WTJWorg. It may help them improve their CSA policy.
  10. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    Yes Srecko, hence I truly believe that an organisation needs to be guided by True Anointed ones that are inspired by God's Holy Spirit through Christ. 
    But JWs here don't believe in such things ever happening. They don't believe that God can have a clean organisation. 
    JWs here have no true faith in God at all. Their faith is only in the things seen, such as the GB, Warwick and Ramapo. They have proven that they cannot handle spiritual matters. 
  11. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Dmitar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    I focus on them because they are the official channels, not just hearsay. I have also given information to the IICSA and had direct emails from them and from Police departments. Perhaps I'm slightly more involved than most people think, but I don't tend to spread it all over the internet. 
  12. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Kick_Faceinator in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    Yes Srecko, hence I truly believe that an organisation needs to be guided by True Anointed ones that are inspired by God's Holy Spirit through Christ. 
    But JWs here don't believe in such things ever happening. They don't believe that God can have a clean organisation. 
    JWs here have no true faith in God at all. Their faith is only in the things seen, such as the GB, Warwick and Ramapo. They have proven that they cannot handle spiritual matters. 
  13. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Dmitar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    But I keep coming back to the point that here in the UK we have had two investigations. The Charity Commision and the IICSA. What are the authorities doing in the USA ? What investigations ? 
  14. Like
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    I focus on them because they are the official channels, not just hearsay. I have also given information to the IICSA and had direct emails from them and from Police departments. Perhaps I'm slightly more involved than most people think, but I don't tend to spread it all over the internet. 
  15. Thanks
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from ApostaBabe Linda James in SEPTEMBER 10 2021.......... Jehovah's Witnesses join redress scheme   
    https://www.youngwitness.com.au/story/7424446/jehovahs-witnesses-join-redress-scheme/
    The Jehovah's Witnesses has joined Australia's national redress scheme for child sexual abuse survivors under threat of financial penalties.
    It is one of 34 institutions signing up following rules brought in by the federal government to withhold funding from and strip the charity status of groups refusing to join.
    The Jehovah's Witnesses was initially named and shamed for holding out.
    It flagged its intention to join the scheme in March and has now formally done so.
    The other institutions include Tennis Australia, St John Ambulance Australia Queensland, Ipswich Girl's Grammar School, Youth Off the Streets and Scripture Union Tasmania.
    Social Services Minister Anne Ruston says this means a total of 37 redress applications can be processed.
    "It is clear that the powerful financial, reputational and legislative levers the commonwealth has used have been successful at ensuring institutions understand and recognise their moral obligation to survivors," she said.
    "We are also working hard to make sure that every institution with a history of working with young people joins the scheme no matter when a survivor comes forward to access redress."
    To date, commonwealth, state and territory governments alongside 526 non-government institutions are in the scheme.
    As of last Friday, 11,835 applications had been received and 6208 payments made totalling more than $529.3 million.
    It shows just what the GB will do for money. 
  16. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    Forgiveness of Sin is one thing. But the Elders cannot 'forgive' breaking the law. It is outside of their 'authority' to do so. 
    A person could be forgiven by God for Sin, but should still serve the prison sentence for the Crime. 
    Sin is spiritual. Crime is physical. God allows those 'superior authorities' / governments / legal bodies, to be in place to deal with Crime. Why would any Christian not  want to serve God properly by hiding criminals.
  17. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Child sexual abuse has been found in most major UK religions   
    Do you know how, in which way and after how much time "random folks" become JW members?
  18. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in 2055... the point of no return.   
    How did you get the year 2055?
    It makes no sense whatsoever. 
     
    Why should not a normal, rational, common sense person not consider this “2055” as a delusional fantasy?
    To illustrate …. If I arbitrarily change your “2055” to “2255”, what’s the difference?
     
  19. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to JW Insider in The Last Days that began in 1914 are now coming to their End...   
    [edted to add: The question implies that there were Bible Students who believed that Christ became King in 1914. As far as I know none ever dd. Not even Russell and Rutherford.]
    Remember, though, that most of the Bible Student groups broke off long before even the Bible Students under Russell and Rutherford believed that Christ became King in 1914. Russell believed that Jesus Christ became King in 1878, and he believed this right up until he died. Rutherford believed that Jesus became King in 1878, well into the 1920's. (Remember the famous "Advertise, Advertise, Advertise" speech at Cedar Point, Ohio in 1922?) It wasn't until Rutherford died in 1942, that Fred Franz could officially change Christ's presence from 1874 until 1914. This happened in the books "The Truth Shall Make You Free" (1943) and "The Kingdom Is At Hand" (1944). As jw.org says:
    *** jv chap. 28 p. 632 Testing and Sifting From Within ***
    Based on the premise that events of the first century might find parallels in related events later, they also concluded that if Jesus’ baptism and anointing in the autumn of 29 C.E. paralleled the beginning of an invisible presence in 1874, then his riding into Jerusalem as King in the spring of 33 C.E. would point to the spring of 1878 as the time when he would assume his power as heavenly King.
    *** jv chap. 28 p. 632 Testing and Sifting From Within ***
    That 1878 was a year of significance seemed to be fortified by reference to Jeremiah 16:18 (‘Jacob’s double,’ KJ) along with calculations indicating that 1,845 years had apparently elapsed from Jacob’s death down till 33 C.E., when natural Israel was cast off, and that the double, or duplicate, of this would extend from 33 C.E. down to 1878.
    Extending the parallels further, it was stated that the desolation of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. (37 years after Jesus was hailed as king by his disciples when he rode into Jerusalem) might point to 1915 (37 years after 1878) for a culmination of anarchistic upheaval that they thought God would permit as a means for bringing existing institutions of the world to their end. This date appeared in reprints of Studies in the Scriptures.
    *** ka chap. 11 pp. 209-210 par. 55 “Here Is the Bridegroom!” ***
    In the year 1943 the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society published the book “The Truth Shall Make You Free.” In its chapter 11, entitled “The Count of Time,” it did away with the insertion of 100 years into the period of the Judges and went according to the oldest and most authentic reading of Acts 13:20, and accepted the spelled-out numbers of the Hebrew Scriptures. This moved forward the end of six thousand years of man’s existence into the decade of the 1970’s. Naturally this did away with the year 1874 C.E. as the date of return of the Lord Jesus Christ and the beginning of his invisible presence or parousia. The millennium that was to be marked by the detaining of Satan the Devil enchained in the abyss and by the reign of the 144,000 joint heirs with Christ in heavenly glory was therefore yet in the future. What, then, about the parousia (presence) of Christ? Page 324 of the above book positively says: “The King’s presence or parousia began in 1914.” Also, in the Watchtower issue of July 15, 1949 (page 215, paragraph 22), the statement is made: “ . . . Messiah, the Son of man, came into Kingdom power A.D. 1914 and . . . this constitutes his second coming and the beginning of his second parousía or presence.”
    Over the years Rutherford had made a few sometimes vague comments that the "kingdom" chronology was being adjusted, but he relied on it thoroughly for his 1925 predictions. Also, there were some more specific comments in a 1924 booklet written by Van Amburgh (not written by Rutherford) and in the Golden Age (edited by Woodworth) that made it pretty clear that this change from 1878 to 1914 was in the works. 
    But the publications quoted on jw.org showed that the old 1874/1878 chronology was not completely removed until 1943. During those 60-some years from 1878 to 1943, all the Bible Student spin-offs and break-aways had already left. In fact most of them had left between 1917 and 1929, when apparently less than a quarter of the original Russellite Bible Students were still associated with the Watch Tower Society. Note these (generally factual) ideas from the resources quoted in the Wikipedia footnotes:
    The Bible Student movement is a Millennialist[1]Restorationist Christian movement that emerged from the teachings and ministry of Charles Taze Russell, also known as Pastor Russell. Members of the movement have variously referred to themselves as Bible Students, International Bible Students, Associated Bible Students, or Independent Bible Students. The origins of the movement are associated with . . .Russell's teachings.
    A number of schisms developed within the congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society between 1909 and 1932.[2][3] The most significant split began in 1917 following the election of Joseph Franklin Rutherford . . .
    Thousands of members left congregations of Bible Students associated with the Watch Tower Society throughout the 1920s . . . . William Schnell, author and former Jehovah's Witness, claims that three quarters of the original Bible Students who had been associating with the Watch Tower Society in 1919 had left by 1931.[4][3][a] In 1930 Rutherford stated that "the total number of those who have withdrawn from the Society... is comparatively large."[5]
    Between 1918 and 1929, several factions formed their own independent fellowships, including the Stand Fast Movement, the Pastoral Bible Institute, the Laymen's Home Missionary Movement founded by PSL Johnson, and the Dawn Bible Students Association. These groups range from conservative, claiming to be Russell's true followers, to more liberal, claiming that Russell's role is not as important as once believed.[6] Rutherford's faction of the movement retained control of the Watch Tower Society[6] and adopted the name Jehovah's witnesses in July 1931.[b]
  20. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in Jehovah's Witnesses 'failed to act' over sex abuse claims   
    A saying from our region says: The judge sues, the judge judges. This saying is used when one wants to say that there is no justice, that everything depends on the will of the one who has power.
    It is, also, often said that if you want to obscure things you need to set up a Commission to investigate something. The Commission whose members were elected and appointed by powerful people who have no interest in changing anything will receive instructions in which direction they should conduct the investigation.
    Do you refer to this? 
    In the Conti case, the panel upheld the lower court’s ruling that the Watchtower and elders in the North Fremont congregation failed to supervise Kendrick when he preached door to door in the community, a practice Jehovah’s Witnesses call field service.
    According to Conti, the North Fremont elders would group her with Kendrick for long afternoons of field service. She says he used those opportunities to take her to his house and sexually abuse her.
    “While the Congregation may not have been able to police Kendrick’s behavior after scheduled field service was over, it could have controlled his access to Conti during the field service,” the judges wrote Monday.
    What kind of irony are you talking about that I caused it?
    By this you prove my comment. Thanks.
  21. Upvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Srecko Sostar in SEPTEMBER 10 2021.......... Jehovah's Witnesses join redress scheme   
    I can only guess why WTJWorg refused to join Scheme in first place. This is because joining means acknowledging GB+Helpers+Elders+Legal Department own stake in the event and the inability to sort things out within the JW Organization (for the benefit of the victims, of course).
    Why did they join after pressure? Because in this way, they will pay significantly less money to the victims.
  22. Downvote
  23. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in Can we talk sensibly about Disfellowshipping and shunning.   
    In 1962 two notable things happened, the WTB&TS Came out with the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures  in one volume (the green Bible), and Natalie Wood in the movie “Gypsy”established what it takes to enthusiastically entertain other people. 
     
    Of course, in 1963 John Fitzgerald Kennedy was shot.
  24. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in Can we talk sensibly about Disfellowshipping and shunning.   
    If somebody can sidetrack your conversation with a “throwaway comment“, it wasn’t much of a conversation to start with.
  25. Downvote
    Patiently waiting for Truth reacted to Pudgy in Can we talk sensibly about Disfellowshipping and shunning.   
    That is a silly assumption that has no validity in reality, that  I  want to sidetrack the conversation.
     
    Interjection of a point, salient or not, or an attempt at humor, funny or not, is usually NOT an attempt to sidetrack a conversation.
    Perhaps it’s just a reaction to a conversation that’s based on false premises, or erroneous assumptions. Or perhaps any other number of reasons.
    Just plain silly.
    But even more than that, it’s just plain wrong.
    ……  this is a common problem when people extensively say that they want to discuss facts but then they avoid discussing facts, and start discussing motive…… Which is assumed.
    And, in any discussion there comes a time to shut the hell up and listen to what the other person is saying, including where the conversation is going that you don’t want it to go.
    Often times we don’t really listen, because while the other person is speaking, we’re thinking about what we’re going to say next.
    (… as an aside this quite often happens amongst married folks, where the three second rule becomes very very important.
    The three second rule states that after the other person speaks, count for three full seconds before you give a reply.

    If you wait five seconds while intoning  “….hmmmm“ while scratching your chin, it also helps you to appear wise.)
    The only way you can accurately discuss motive is to determine from the other person what their motive is by actually asking them what is their motive.
    What  NOVEL IDEA!
    You can make all the assumptions in the world and by accident you might stumble across it, or if you were a very good detective you might be able to discern it but the probabilities are not good.
    May I make a suggestion…… Instead of asking five or six questions at a time, ask one question and see if anybody wants to answer it
    (I have ADD, and frequently will walk up to someone, or worse, several people already involved in a conversation of their choosing, and out of the blue start talking about what I want to talk about, usually quantum physics or scuba diving or optics and light propagation. That almost always NEVER works as intended.)
    …. but I digress …..
    Perhaps people do and perhaps people don’t, and perhaps it’s a trick question like “do you still beat your wife?”, Which for most people it’s too much trouble to answer because it’s most times not a yes or a no answer.
    ….. then of course there are the questions that everybody in the group knows the answer and not really questions to be answered for new information, just to be beat into a purée like the traditional “beating the dead horse“.
    …… Not really worth the effort.
    A lot of conversations with agenda driven people are just too much work especially when nothing useful is to be gained by it.
    I am a firm believer in the freedom of speech, and you have the right to ask any question you want, to anybody you want…… But you do not have the right to be entertained if the other person does not want to entertain you.
    They have a perfect right, at their discretion, to completely ignore you and walk away, leaving you there to wave your hands and flap your lips in full expectation that they are going to entertain you with their answers …… And they have a perfect right to not do so.
    They do not need a reason at all.
    As a practical matter, singing to a pig  is a waste of time, just ruins a person’s voice, and irritates the pig.
    Sometimes we are the singer…… And sometimes we are the pig.
     
     
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