César Chávez

Yes you win on that one. I needed a name in a hurry and that old brainwashing just took over. I should change it really. 

Ye Ho Wa    YHWH. Um, but is it just the words of men or are they inspired of God's Holy Spirit ? 
Whichever, it is not Jehovah is it ?  No J, no V.   Yehowa, maybe  
 

What! 
So here we have a case of you literally "picking a bone" with me !
Shameful!
I shall report you to the Daisy Hill Puppy Farm!

First of all, the people taken from the nations for God's name, are His chosen anointed since Christ.  They, are to bear the name of God and Jesus Christ - not the name of an organization.(Isa 45:10-12; 1 Pet 2:5,9; Rev 3:12;5:9,10) 
I am sure somewhere buried in Wt's history that truth can be found.  
 
"Blessed are those who are persecuted for righteousness’ sake, For theirs is the kingdom of heaven." Matt 5:10
A.               “righteousness’ sake” - In a broad sense: state of him who is as he ought to be, righteousness, the condition acceptable to God. integrity, virtue, purity of life, rightness, correctness of thinking feeling, and acting
 Is it righteous to hide child abuse cases for years?  Is it righteous to continue promoting a lie that GB members have doubts about, as JWI told us concerning 1914?  To think that your leaders feared being disfellowshipped for exposing 1914 as wrong.  Were they, are they, following in Christ’s footsteps who exposed lies and stood only for truth, or are they following the path of the crooked one?  John 8:44
Is it righteous to lead a person to believe in a date that Armageddon will arrive, and then blame the person for going astray in their anticipating the fulfillment of that date?  (Isa 9:16)
Is it righteous to disfellowship individuals who keep their faith in God and Christ intact, yet reject the dreams of “organization”, which was none other than a “unique idea” to pursue, in Rutherford’s day? 
Is it righteous to shun individuals, caring not whether they live or die? Refusing to help a child who was baptized way too young, and fell into sin.  Today's youths before they reach ten years old, are innocently being baptized into an organization.  What will happen to them when they realize their own folly and leave?  Will they be rejected by the likes of the people here, who have given your post an upvote, a "like", a "thank you"?    
Is it righteous to tell God’s priesthood under Jesus Christ that they must not bond together to study the word of God?  (Dan 11:36,37; Rev 13:5-7)
Is it righteous for elders to act as that priesthood/Temple of God?  (Ezek 44:6-9; 1 Cor 3:16,17; 2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 11:1,2)
There are two types of persecution outlined in the Bible.  Persecution put upon God’s wayward people for sinning (Deut 28:19-25);  and persecution by one’s own people for standing up to the lies of men, and for upholding the truth in Christ.  (John 15:18-20)
Why is this organization persecuted? 
It is not for upholding the truth in Christ when its leaders are so good at creating falsehoods, speaking lies, hiding lies, hiding their sins, and shunning any who disagree with their doctrine. (John 16:2; Rev 13:15)
 
By the way, speaking of doctrines of men, Jesus does not make new “rules” – an excuse for the GB to do so today.  That, is another lie. We have the Bible where the word of God is all we need. The “rules” are set, not to be added to or taken away from.  (Deut 4:2)
Wt 2/2021 ….Headship -  As our head, Jesus has the authority to make and to enforce rules that govern the conduct of individuals, of families, and of the entire congregation. (Gal. 6:2) But Jesus does more than just make rules. He feeds and cherishes each one of us.—Eph. 5:29.
Under the headship of Christ Jesus, the members of the Governing Body provide helpful direction to organize Jehovah’s people worldwide. They appoint Branch Committee members and circuit overseers. (Eph. 4:7-13) In turn, circuit overseers appoint congregation elders. (Acts 14:23; Titus 1:5)
Etc., etc., etc., etc. 
More is said in this article about the GB and their lengthy responsibilities, than Jesus Christ himself. All of these needs that the GB have devised to run the organization, does require rules and regulations as any organization in the world does. But, do JWs really believe that uninspired men are hearing Jesus Christ telling them to make these new rules? Did Jesus Christ tell them they needed to revamp and organize their child abuse policies? If so, what took him so long? Does Jesus Christ tell them to create new doctrine?  Or, as the GB admitted to, they have thought up doctrine and ideas, only to find out they were wrong.
And those who leave such empty philosophy are the apostates? (Col 2:8)  No. The apostates are those who have become slaves of men. (Gal 1:10; Rom 6:16)
Maybe it is the spirit-directed idol that hears the new rules and regulations that must be enforced; such as controlling what God’s priests are allowed to study, and not to study.  (Dan 11:38,39; Rev 13:1,2) 
Work hard so you can present yourself to God and receive his approval. Be a good worker, one who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly explains the word of truth. 16 Avoid worthless, foolish talk that only leads to more godless behavior. 17 This kind of talk spreads like cancer as in the case of Hymenaeus and Philetus. 18 They have left the path of truth, claiming that the resurrection of the dead has already occurred; in this way, they have turned some people away from the faith.
19 But God’s truth stands firm like a foundation stone with this inscription: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and “All who belong to the Lord must turn away from evil.”  2 Tim 2:15-19
 
Persecution
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

Not exactly. They are obedient when it does not conflict with God's 'rules'. But many governments give orders that people must join the military for a few years, and JWs disobey (rightly of course) and get put in prison for it.
Unfortunately the GB and it's Org have earnt the title of being 'secretive'. And we know why of course. 
Once again, unfortunately, the GB and it's Org are also hated for doing 'bad', and we know why.
Again, unfortunately, the GB and their lawyers don't endure it, they cry out that it is all lies. 
BUT, the GB and it's Org are not honest and in some cases not law-abiding. Certainly not living by God's true standards. 
This is where it becomes unfortunate. The Leaders of the many W/t, CCJW, JW Org, etc companies, have been shown to be dishonest. The CSA problems, and the handling of such, earth wide in those orgs, have given it all a bad reputation. The orgs plural now look dirty. Add to this that the Leaders (those 8 men) have gone beyond the things written, raising themselves up above every other person here on this earth, including the (true) Anointed ones. 
Maybe what you see as persecution is actually God through Christ, withholding Holy Spirit, from those orgs, plural. We know that God punished the Nation of Israel for wrong doing. Maybe if those orgs, including the GB, were to repent of their sins, and to turn around and serve God properly, through Christ, then maybe the Holy Spirit would guide them and protect them.  
What happened in Russia reminds me of what happened to Jerusalem, and we know why Jerusalem was destroyed. 
God, through Christ, will be served properly before that great Judgement Day arrives. 

Oh dear Tom, do you really think people will fall for this ?  You deliberately put it in the Open Club. 
In your eyes only. Because God is allowing your eyes to be blinded.
No Tom, it is actually written quite calmly and sensibly. 
Wrong again. I mentioned a few points. One being that the GB dominate the true Anointed.  And the point about military service was because you said that JW always obeyed the laws of the lands. 
Here you pretend to not understand what @Witness has written. So you prove yourself a liar. 
Then you move on to compare the GB / W/t / JW Orgs (plural) to the rest of the world. A bit like me comparing myself to a murderer or bank robber. Well I'm not as bad as they are . You are so childish in this respect, you actually expect people to fall for it.  
 
 

In your first statement, you begin by boasting about the persecution to come upon JWs.
And then, make excuses for the sins of the organization, that have come to light...about child abuse.  
 
The other points I made, are not sins?  Should we compare righteousness of all religions and say, well the WT's righteousness is better than most?  Is that how God gauges righteousness where His people reside?  
A mother sends her child to school and tells him if you eat a piece of birthday cake, you will disappoint "Jehovah".  What a guilt trip to put on a little child.   Yet, Wt. sends its well educated lawyers to court to win a child abuse case, and the leadership feels justified in doing so, because no matter what, they must protect their riches.  Do they feel that any of their actions disappoint God?  Never.  The burden of persecution  is always on the sheep, who are persecuted because they listen to men living a  well insulated life from the persecutions that their flock experiences.  
If we are to suffer for Jesus Christ's sake, we suffer by exposing falsehoods of our own people. This is what John the Baptist did, Jesus Christ and his apostles.  We put our entire faith in only the Father and the Son and we ask for repentance in following false dogma and men who create it.    Persecution is nothing to boast about, Tom.  It is something to understand why it happens to God's people, who reside where the leadership's sins are just now coming to light.   Revelation 18:4-8 is speaking to "my people" - God's elect/saints; but all who are where the "man of lawlessness"/elder body has rulership over the Temple/"living stones" of God, are to leave the organization.  Otherwise, those sins that you say are milder than other religions/organizations, are what all JWs will be found sharing in.  
Matt 24:15,16; 2 Thess 2:3,4; Rev 11:1-3
 
 
 

It hard to know if tom has lost his common sense when he calls truth venom.
I loathe them for disobeying Almighty God and Jesus Christ, and for misleading thousands of people. 
What complete rubbish this is. Only mild when compared to the rest of the world. NOT mild when compared to God's standards. 
What an over reaction tom. you do make yourself appear silly here. 
Unnecessary accusation here.  Shows you being over emotional Tom. The Early Christians were not JWs Tom, those early Christians served God through Christ, not through any other organisation. 
More unnecessary emotion. You should maybe be a politician. You seem to enjoy twisting the truth about everything. 
Your GB have set themselves up as 'kings' above all other people on this earth.
Your GB pretend that 'God and Christ trust them'.  Your GB give themselves the title of 'Faithful and discreet slave'.
But you Tom, you continue to sere that GB blindly. 

UM, haven't missed much have I.  I've not been here for days but having now read it all, well nothing new. 
The one thing I did note is that @xero  is really hung up on people's mental state. @Arauna would call it OCD probably.  Oh yes, and that cesar person seems to think I am @Pudgy, sorry Pudgy. 
I wish you all well. I am too busy selling and then buying vehicles and building sheds. The weather here in England is fabulous so making the most of it. 
@JW Insider seems to make it known how mixed up the GB / leaders of the JW org are concerning the owning or reading of 'other religious literature'.  
Best regards to @Srecko Sostar  and @TrueTomHarley and @Anna 
Take care and be good y'all. I'll try to stay away for another few days.  
 

Reading through various histories, what seems to be absent is what was actually done to convince illiterate people that Christianity was true.  Lots of talk about conversions, but really light on the processes involved.
https://www.history.com/news/inside-the-conversion-tactics-of-the-early-christian-church
Found this. Interesting take. Of course Bart is an atheist.
Now in all this it strikes me that perhaps the reason the trinity garbage got promoted was because it was harder to argue w/the hoi polloi about not worshiping multiple deities when Christianity appeared to have two - namely Jehovah and Jesus though Jesus was a lesser deity (elohim) (325 had nothing to do w/the Holy Spirit). Then too, the bad practice of not using God's name Jehovah further confused these issues.
Of course, the Catholic Church also leveraged the gods of river, or corn or whatever by creating patron saints of this, that or the other thing. So then they could continue with the methadone of their polytheism weaning them off the real heroin of polytheism.
On the other hand, the Bible has always admitted that there ARE other gods. So some might say that to admit that there exist other gods is polytheistic, though that's not really the case, as we worship Jehovah (who is elohim, but not in the same sense at all as other elohim) Just that these are either impotent or unreal or shouldn't be obeyed. The word elohim applies to more than Jehovah in the Bible - it includes other beings. So "Elohim" is just a form of nonphysical life.

On the other hand, maybe it isn’t:
https://bitterwinter.org/jehovahs-witnesses-the-worlds-most-persecuted-religion/
The BitterWinter article links to an USCRIF government report. It is remarkable that it should be this way, given Witnesses’ non-violence, non-meddling in politics, industriousness instilled in members, that individually they are nearly always described as “nice people.”
The scriptures speak so assuredly of persecution. For example: “All those desiring to live with godly devotion in association with Christ Jesus will also be persecuted.” 2 Tim 3:12.
And then the group that most notably fulfills that verse is Jehovah’s Witnesses. I even end a chapter of the new book, I Don’t Know Why We Persecute Jehovah’s Witnesses: Searching for the Why with: “When searching the field of religion, look for the group that is individually praised but collectively maligned.”

The GB are like kids in a candy shop.  They have a plethora of kingdom halls at their disposal. Sounds like they are in the process of trading up real-estate for Ramapo and their mega audio visual center.  
Maybe you need to tell the GB.  As A. Morris just said in his latest video, "“Jehovah’s organization is on the move, and it will not be stopped by the pandemic, or anything else."  If what you say happens, Ramapo may become a money pit.  

That is ASCII text. Converted to decimal is 114 226 131 151

cEEZAR
Do you not realize that by not making specific objections to JWI's account of life at Bethel, that you have validated it?
ALL of it.
Thanks for the validating!
.... don't forget to tip your waitresses.
Note, Question to the great washed masses: What ASCII code produces this ...  r⃗  ?
 

I’ve never heard it put this way before.
I also wonder if I can trick 4Jah and CC into giving me upvotes by posting photos like this:

Wow, hahaha! I wish I could understand what he is saying, but I don't speak Norwegian....
I wonder why him? Surely there are other maybe more suitable people like pop stars or actors? Perhaps though he is quite famous in Norway....

Of course, neither Dogs or Jehovah's Witnesses vote.
For Dogs it is because of the failed French Poodle rebellion of 1870, and we have had to eat from dishes on the ground, since then.

This is known as “jumping the shark“.

It doesn't surprise me. I've been for years meditating on the kinds of personalities necessary to generate a new religious group vs those required to grow the religious group vs those who wish to maintain the status quo.
I realize that I don't have the kind of personality which would gather a group for any purpose. I've always had the attitude of "Go about your affairs. Pursue your interests. The ones whom you run into along the way who are motivated will join in the manner of their choosing." - Clearly we wouldn't have the Bible or any religious organizations if everyone were like me.
I used to irritate this one sister who was a control freak about everything. Our circuit overseer's wife (Bro Rainer) was talking with my wife and she (Bro Rainer's wife) mentioned this diet "blood type diet" by Dr. D'Adamo. Anyway we both sortof got into it for a while and of course since we're all about knowing about blood I did a bunch of research and found while researching that the Japanese and Korean cultures are really big on blood types and personalities associated with them. (In Korea they made a movie entitled "My Boyfriend is type B") and so a bunch of people began to get into it. She, of course because the word "blood" was in the name of the diet was highly suspicious of the whole thing even after she realized it wasn't about eating blood pudding or blood sausages.
Anyway when I mentioned the blood type and personality thing it sortof tickled me that she was so irritated by the whole thing (she said "There are more than four types of people in the world!"), I paused and asked her what blood type she was and she "Replied A" and I said "Ohhhhh! That makes sense now." and she says "What do you mean?" and I say "Well as it turns out, people with blood type A are more likely to get stressed out over perceived ambiguity or perceived disorder because their brains produce more cortisol in response to stress and the way this is manifested when they try to reduce these levels is by trying to control their environment as well as the people around them.....pause...you see"
That annoyed her even more.
I'll bet Klein was blood type A for sure.

In the 1970's it was common for Bethelites to order Bible commentaries like Matthew Henry's and Barnes' Notes on the NT and various Bible translations. Later, they also allowed orders for Jay Green's Hebrew Interlinear and William Whiston's Josephus. Bethelites paid for them, but the price was fairly low because all requests were ordered through a one of Dean Songer's assistants.
Then there was a meeting in 1979, and all such books became impossible to order, and anyone who already had them in their rooms (except for Bible translations) would be looked at suspiciously. In 1980, housekeepers would report to their overseers if these types of books were found, and many Bethelites who owned them would be questioned by an interrogation committee. Within a matter of months, they moved the entire Bethel Library out of reach of all Bethelites by moving the entire Writing Department --along with the library-- out of 124 CH and onto a locked floor down at 25 CH.
Also, even before it moved, no Bethel tours allowed visitors to see the Bethel Library beyond a quick peek from the doorway to the "facing" shelves which were almost all WT material along with a couple sets of encyclopedias and dictionaries. All commentaries and books from other religions were were kept in the rows of shelves behind the first "facing" shelves, and could not be seen. Even the tours at Patterson in the 2000's only allowed a doorway glimpse of a small corner of the Library from the main hallway, about 40 feet from the nearest book.
I remember once when Brother Klein railed against commentaries one morning at breakfast. And he was one of the GB members in the Writing Department. At another meeting he said that using them was "sucking at the teat of Christendom." Now, of course, there is a much more reasonable approach, and I think that most of the brothers are at least partially aware that this is where most of the information in the Insight book comes from. They might be less aware that this is also where we get many of the spiritual gems and treasures in the meeting workbooks, and of course the footnotes in the Study Bible, all those interesting comments about Hebrew and Greek words, etc.

Scandinavian countries have IKEAs, too?

For the benefit of the JW community, a speech like this should be included in the JWTV program as a Special Lecture on Sunday afternoon.
.....Of course, to make it more acceptable for the organizer, the lecture should be given by a man, not a woman :)) I believe, that nowadays an increasing proportion of JW members would readily abandon the idea that only men (male) are allowed to “teach”.

..... unless of course you are a man having a conversation with a woman .... then you are ALWAYS wrong.
The reason men play the Lottery more than women is that they think the odds are better at winning.
...... and the reason that men die almost a decade before women is .....
 
... they want to.

There's a Ted Talk I saw that suggests something along these lines as a sub current to all this
...."How does it feel to be wrong?...ans "It feels like being right."
We never feel like we aren't being unreasonable or unbalanced if we think we're right, but we could be.