John 12.24to28

7 minutes ago, boyle said:

Look up the word definition again, and figure out what was the purpose of the flood. Then read your words again. Adam and Eve were childless in the garden. Can you prove how Jesus filled that gap with child suffering from God?

The Flood provided a sign for everyone on earth today that God has the power to remove every trace of wickedness and sorrow and make a fresh start using imperfect people who are willing to go with the program.

Child suffering is not from God. The solution is from God. 

5 minutes ago, boyle said:

Does your bible state that?

Why are you so mad at Him? It wasn't His fault. You're blaming the wrong person.

4 minutes ago, boyle said:

Not that it really means anything to me until I get a straight and honest answer.

What is your question @boyle

Why do you think people are like cold robots sometimes? Why do you think some of them stop knowing how to love and trust in an innocent way? Why do you think they can't think like kids anymore who trust their dad in heaven? Why do you think they trust strangers instead?

7 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Yeah … I know what you mean. 

Probably warm ‘em up if they got a lube job and had their tires rotated, too.

3 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Get an oil change and replace the air filter.

As far as the robot theology, the story made clear one thing to me. Robots are cold. 

The humans in the story, though imperfect, were not cold. Even the lady that said she'd been called a robot before was still "warm", though not very expressive at times.

Each human is made in God's image. Though imperfect, each human has the ability to reflect something about Jehovah's personality. Humor, exuberance, peace, intelligence, spunk, thoughtfulness - these human qualities help us perceive the qualities of our Creator. 

The more we can show such positive qualities to others, the more we are reflecting Jehovah's glory and light in that way, the more we can truly minister to the needs of those around us. The more we can appreciate those positive qualities to be found in every single individual alive on earth, the more we can "see" Jehovah's personality via the light reflected in the image of the people around us. 

Jehovah said to love our brothers, to love our neighbors. The reason He said "if you do not love your brother you cannot be loving God" is because each one of us came out of Jehovah by extension. We are part of Him. We are not Him, but we are from Him. Jesus came to take Adam's place in the cord that extends from Jehovah to us. That is why we must approach Jehovah through Jesus.

The missing link in our attachment to Jehovah was Adam. Jesus fills in the link. There is no way to live forever through anybody or anything else. No robot AI thing. No evolution thing. No other religion thing. Jesus is the missing piece, the only fit. Jehovah designed it that way. Only those who are willing to humble themselves and accept such a simple solution will be able to benefit from it.

It wasn't a difficult test to not eat the fruit from one tree. It's not a difficult test to believe in Jesus. I don't know why some people are so stubborn. It's like they're as cold as a robot.

14 minutes ago, boyle said:

wrong crowd

Generally speaking, you could say that sinners are the "wrong crowd". Jesus was willing to come down and hang out with "the wrong crowd" because of love. He did not get involved in wrong things. He rejected sin, but He did not reject sinners. He did what he could to show love for them within the bounds of what was proper.

16 minutes ago, boyle said:

1 hour ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

I don't want anything to do with Satan. He's a liar. He is not trustworthy, and neither is any book from anybody who wants to worship him, since the very idea of worshipping that disgusting rebel is completely ridiculous and foolish.

This is counterintuitive. 

"counterintuitive - contrary to intuition or to common-sense expectation (but often nevertheless true)."

19 minutes ago, boyle said:

All they have to do is see your post.

I don't know what you're talking about. I think I make it pretty clear by saying "Praise Jehovah" all the time that it's not me who should get credit for anything.

20 minutes ago, boyle said:

You just rambled on from that.

I do tend to ramble.

20 minutes ago, boyle said:

I wonder why God got upset with the few that were around Noah?

You don't have to wonder, it's right in the book of Genesis.

21 minutes ago, boyle said:

But didn't he die of old age, while his partner was cursed to feel the pain of her sin through childbirth?

When you love someone, you feel their pain. Jehovah was the One who was hurt the most. Adam and Eve's pain reflected Jehovah's pain. The sick, wrenching, killer gut pain of knowing your beloved children are dead though living, that you are carrying them in the womb but you will give birth to them stillborn - Jehovah experienced that again and again and again throughout human history - watching them born knowing they were going to die. The children belonged to Adam and Eve, and that was the inheritance Adam and Eve chose to give to those kids, death. Jehovah was willing to suffer in order to save those kids. He sent Jesus to be the "curse" to take the place of the connection where Adam left a gap. We talked about that in another thread on the ransom.

29 minutes ago, boyle said:

Moses wondered off to the mountains, never to be seen. Can you point out where in the bible it says Moses was translated? Remember translated, in the biblical term.

Now what about Aaron?

Was Aaron and Moses before the flood or after?

Would you like a free home Bible study? You have access to a Bible, @boyle. How do you read? You tell me. Why are you asking? Do you want to be translated too?

26 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

The theology.

Specifically, the two detectives analysis of Robot theology.

I didn't realize they were called "detectives"...maybe because I read it fast or only the first three chapters so far. I just thought Donovan and Powell were called "Earthmen" and they seemed like tech-people.

I noticed they liked to eat a lot, and sleep. Kind of a contrast between them and the robots. 

What do you think was the similarity with the "not being useful anymore" bit? How does that relate to the theology part?

I can answer all those questions, but I don't see that it would do you any good at present, since you don't believe in Jehovah God or His Word anyway. I wish it would do you good, but it won't until you get that chip off your shoulder. I'm not really sure why it's there, and you wear so many masks to hide it. I can't take it off your shoulder, that's something only you can do. Jehovah can help you if you let Him, but you're mad at Him right now about something. I can't read hearts. I can answer the questions if you want to play that game - I like to play that kind of game anyway, "Bible trivia, presented by @boyle!" But I really don't know what you get out of it, @boyle.

Their perception of the cold robots with their illogical and unrelenting ridiculous theories based on simplistic assessments of the universe was right on.

There are many people like that. I've met both atheists and religious people who fit such a definition.

What do you think is the solution for the robot-type-people?

What makes you think they lived only in Antarctica and Australia before the Flood? Did they have a time share there? Lol...

What specifically do you like about chapter 3 of the robot book anyway? (I just read chapters 1-3.)

1 hour ago, boyle said:

2 hours ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

Yes. Some of them were there for me when no "Jehovah's Witnesses" with the label "in good standing" were there. Some of them gave me strength when I was extremely weak, and gave me comfort when I was in pain. Most of them will never know how much strength and comfort they gave me. But Jehovah knows.

That's good. I guess hanging around with the wrong crowd has its benefits for apostates.

The phrase "the wrong crowd" is subjective. "The wrong crowd" from whose point of view? The GB might view a particular person as "an apostate" or "a member of the wrong crowd" but the more important question is "how does Jehovah view that person?" Jesus was viewed as an apostate and a member of the "wrong crowd" by the governing authority in the religion of his day. But at the end of the day, Jehovah resurrected Jesus and those unrepentant haters among the crowd who killed Jesus turned out to be in "the wrong crowd" when Rome came calling.

1 hour ago, boyle said:

2 hours ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

I hate Satan. He is NOT related to me, at all. He's as good as dead anyway. Michael will finish off that waste case Devil.

So, you don't think the following should carry weight? Satanic Bible

"Satanism has been thought of as being synonymous with cruelty and brutality. This is so only because people are afraid to face the truth—and the truth is that human beings are not all benign or all loving. Just because the Satanist admits he is capable of both love and hate, he is considered hateful. On the contrary, because he is able to give vent to his hatred through ritualized expression, he is far more capable of love—the deepest kind of love. By honestly recognizing and admitting to both the hate and the love he feels, there is no confusing one emotion with the other. Without being able to experience one of these emotions, you cannot fully experience the other."

I don't want anything to do with Satan. He's a liar. He is not trustworthy, and neither is any book from anybody who wants to worship him, since the very idea of worshipping that disgusting rebel is completely ridiculous and foolish.

However, people are individuals, and there are some satanists who later decide to worship Jehovah. I have not personally been close friends with anyone who was into that type of thing, but growing up I was close friends with several Wiccans, and I associated with other pagans (I was pagan for a while), and I know each person is an individual with their own emotions, thinking processes, and motivations. I know what goes on at different kinds of religious ceremonies. I would not presume to judge anyone as loving or hateful based on their choice. (I won't say I agree with their choice, or that their choice is wise - to me it's foolish to go that other route knowing what I know now - but I wouldn't say the person is not capable of love. That would be foolish.) We cannot judge people by what religion (or lack of religion) they choose at present. We cannot read hearts and we don't know everybody's backgrounds and opportunities.

I cannot agree with your statement regarding hate and love that "without being able to experience one you cannot experience the other." That is not true, just like it's not true that in order to experience pleasure you need pain, or in order to appreciate goodness you need suffering. That's a bunch of bunk.

1 hour ago, boyle said:

2 hours ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

Only some apostates. I guess you'd have to check their doctrines first. If the "apostate" wants you to put them and their teachings ahead of God and God's teachings, then it's because they think they're better than God.

I ask because your doctrine is similar to theirs. They distort the teaching of Christ and misuse the word of  God.

I do not distort the teaching of Christ. I do not misuse the word of God. Try again, @boyle, lol! I do not think I'm better than anyone. I know how lowly I am. You have no idea.

1 hour ago, boyle said:

2 hours ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

"Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:  “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the seat of Moses.

So, no!

Do you think, when the rain started in Noahs day, people would have noticed the Ark becoming a waterproof shelter and at the very least, the smartest people would have cut down trees to stay afloat? 

The hypothetical is, if it happened, why weren't those floating saved?

Jesus said to obey the things they (the Pharisees) teach in harmony with God's Word, but not to do the things they (the Pharisees) teach that are not in harmony with God's Word.

I already told you, God in the past sometimes put people to sleep before they died. Enoch, Aaron, and Moses were put to sleep before they died. Adam was put to sleep before Jehovah "operated" on him to remove his rib. Saul and his soldiers were put into a deep sleep when David and Abishai came into the camp. The soldiers when Peter got out of jail and when Jesus was resurrected were put in a type of sleep. Jehovah has used sleep before so that people were out of it in certain situations.

I don't think people were floating around on logs and screaming and beating on the walls of the ark during the Flood. I think they were asleep, Jehovah took their life force, and then used the Flood waters to wash the dead bodies away. That fits with Jehovah's personality and with how He has used His power in the past. I wasn't there, so I can't tell you for sure. You'll have to ask Noah when he wakes up, or Jesus when he gets here. He can tell you. 

16 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Well, I try to “Be Prepared” as the Boy Scout motto suggests, although they hardly prepared for the septic quagmire of mental cases they became, long after I left.

it’s customary for me to have lots of yellow construction twine in the left rear pocket of my Levi’s, with a bit hanging out tied to the day’s hunk-o-ham.

…. Which they THINK goes to the string in my pocket.

I can't believe that you don't get mobbed by your chickens, walking around like that...🙂

20 minutes ago, boyle said:

37 minutes ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

Me, too. They are my people, and I love them.

They sure are.

Yes. Some of them were there for me when no "Jehovah's Witnesses" with the label "in good standing" were there. Some of them gave me strength when I was extremely weak, and gave me comfort when I was in pain. Most of them will never know how much strength and comfort they gave me. But Jehovah knows.

22 minutes ago, boyle said:

Do you love Satan, too? He's your people?

I hate Satan. He is NOT related to me, at all. He's as good as dead anyway. Michael will finish off that waste case Devil.

24 minutes ago, boyle said:

Does this mean apostates think they are better than God?

Only some apostates. I guess you'd have to check their doctrines first. If the "apostate" wants you to put them and their teachings ahead of God and God's teachings, then it's because they think they're better than God. There are some "apostates" in the organization who think they're better than God, and there are some "apostates" outside the organization who think they're better than God. That's kinda dumb of them, but they can make that choice if they want to, they have free will. "Apostates" can change, they can repent. Some will.

When the great tribulation starts, a lot of people will wake up. Many will repent, and Jehovah will forgive them. Because He loves them, and He knows a lot of them were just misled, or stumbled by all the hypocrisy going on.

28 minutes ago, boyle said:

Can you prove Jesus accepted the teachings of the pharisees with your bible?

"Then Jesus spoke to the crowds and to his disciples, saying:  “The scribes and the Pharisees have seated themselves in the seat of Moses.  Therefore, all the things they tell you, do and observe, but do not do according to their deeds, for they say but they do not practice what they say.  

"They bind up heavy loads and put them on the shoulders of men, but they themselves are not willing to budge them with their finger.  All the works they do, they do to be seen by men, for they broaden the scripture-containing cases that they wear as safeguards and lengthen the fringes of their garments.  

"They like the most prominent place at evening meals and the front seats in the synagogues  and the greetings in the marketplaces and to be called Rabbi by men.  But you, do not you be called Rabbi, for one is your Teacher, and all of you are brothers.  

"Moreover, do not call anyone your father on earth, for one is your Father, the heavenly One.  Neither be called leaders, for your Leader is one, the Christ.   But the greatest one among you must be your minister.  Whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted."

23 minutes ago, boyle said:

43 minutes ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

Following any man-made doctrine that is not based on truth leads to poisoned thinking.

 

43 minutes ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

"There is no wisdom, nor discernment, nor counsel in opposition to Jehovah."

I hope the disfellowshiped and apostates appreciate your words here.

Me, too. They are my people, and I love them.💞

"For how can I bear to look upon the disaster that will come upon my people, and how can I bear to see the destruction of my relatives?"

But I need not be considered. Jehovah Himself has love for them.

"Even if your people are dispersed to the extremity of the heavens, from there Jehovah your God will gather you and bring you back."

"Jehovah your God will cleanse your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love Jehovah your God with all your heart and all your soul and you may live.  Then Jehovah your God will bring all these curses upon your enemies, who hated and persecuted you."

Praise Jehovah.💖

31 minutes ago, AudreyAnnaNana said:

It's the same trick in a different package.

Following any man-made doctrine that is not based on truth leads to poisoned thinking.

"The green grass dries up,

The blossom withers,

But the word of our God endures forever.”

"Your word is a lamp to my foot,

And a light for my path."

"There is no wisdom, nor discernment, nor counsel in opposition to Jehovah."

There are a lot of really nice, good-hearted people earthwide who believe 1914 is when the kingdom came only because that's what they were told by people who they thought knew better than them. They were indoctrinated. It's in the videos and it's in the books. More than 8 million people who are willing to believe something that's not true just because the guys on the GB wear suits and have a certain title.

There are a lot of really nice, good-hearted people earthwide who believe science disproves the Bible account of the Flood or some other ridiculous outlandish theories only because that's what they were told by people who they thought knew better than them. They were indoctrinated. It's in the videos and it's in the books. Millions of people who are willing to believe something that's not true just because the guys on the Evolutionary Theory Cult GB wear white lab coats or something and have letters after their name.

It's the same trick in a different package.

35 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Years ago, I got a call to go to San Francisco for an engineering job that was supposed to take six months at Parsons Brinckerhoff.

With my trusty HP41CX calculator I finished it in about six weeks. The boss that hired me went to Denver and forgot about me.

Meanwhile, the project was winding down and people were being laid off. I used to be the first one in the office (..and therefore had to make the coffee …), and when others arrived my desks were filled with plans, sketches, calc sheets and curly paper strips from my calculator’s printer.

I was always busy doing calcs and sketches. Nobody knew what I was working on, but it looked important!

People would ask for help, and I said sorry, I’m trying to make a deadline here …

One fellow asked me how long I was going to be here, as every Friday the office lost people. I replied “Well, they promised me six months, but I’m hoping it will be longer than that!”. (Actually, nobody promised me anything …). So, for about 5 months I worked on my own stuff, and taught myself Structural Engineering, being paid very well as a “Consultant”.

I felt I was in a Dilbert Cartoon!

Well, with only about 15 people left, six months rolled by and to the day, I also got laid off, and drove back to Virginia.

Sometimes, doing nothing works out well!

 

I am sure you are a very good engineer. I know there are good scientists who are honest and care about people. I wish they were all that way.

It's kind of like the JW GB teaches some things that are true. They also teach some things that aren't in harmony with Bible truth. Make-Believe based on their own creativity.

Similarly, the Evolutionary Theory Cult GB teaches some things that are true according to real scientific observation and study. They also teach some things that aren't in harmony with real scientific observation and study. Make-Believe based on their own creativity.

It's not "all or nothing." The average bear still has to double check the "facts" before swallowing the sandwich. (There might be strings attached...)

15 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Yeah, like most crazy people I shudder and cringe at a string of asterisks ….

Which reminds me of the time I tied a block of ham on the end of a long string, and one at a time, fed it to some ducks

(… Ducks cannot digest ham, so you just rinse it off and feed it to the next duck …)

After you get six ducks on the string, tie the ends together and run ‘em in a circle, quacking with a lisp.

Hey, you've used that one already with that thing in the attic story! (I hope you used a different string...I don't know how well duck string and alien string go well together, must be some new string theory I haven't heard of yet...)

20 minutes ago, Mankeptforunnaturalporpoises said:

Positively Wildean or something. 

(Speaking of Wildean, how important it is to be earnest when resolutely claiming to have knowledge that God doesn't exist - since He is eventually going to show up at the appointed time and blow that "doesn't exist" theory out of the water...)

30 minutes ago, boyle said:

Owe! Come on! You've done better than that in the list you made ********

Didn't he say something like...

"****    *******   *******  ********?"

Cows Success Fuchsia Assembly?

2 minutes ago, boyle said:

What does BS stand for?

https://www.businessinsider.com/how-much-money-types-of-scientists-make-2019-5#11-postsecondary-atmospheric-earth-marine-and-space-sciences-teachers-had-a-median-annual-salary-of-98070-16

You can see how much these really accurate "science" theories are really helping the planet. 🙄 (At least they are helping some pocket books...)

Some BS will get you a job working at nothin' all day...

56 minutes ago, boyle said:

You mean like, the words you and pudgy have expressed that are yucky?

When did we use any "yucky" words?

If I recall correctly, the only time I've seen @Pudgy use a "yucky" word was when he was quoting you to prove a point.

I can't think of a time I used a "yucky" word, unless you're talking about "BS", which can have more than one meaning I suppose. 😎

"The Bachelor of Arts (BA) and the Bachelor of Science (BS) are undergraduate degrees you can earn to help elevate your career and develop relevant job skills." (from coursera.org)