John 12.24to28

Well, it's "not the hill I want to die on," but I don't begrudge anyone the opportunity to peacefully express truth. Hopefully they behave.🙂🫶

43 minutes ago, boyle said:

Yes, there are plenty of your kind of brothers that are not associated with the watchtower. Being an unrepentant disfellowshiped person however does not constitute splintering of the watchtower.

I am not an "unrepentant" person. I repent for my sins. I have done nothing for which to be "disfellowshipped" and I have not "disfellowshipped" most of those who shun me. (Although I did refuse to say "Amen" to the prayers of the corrupt elders who bore false witness about me and who I knew were actively taking part in serious wrongdoing.) I still "associate" with WTBTS by means of watching the meetings every week and reading the articles and watching the videos online. I do not agree with everything they publish, but I have not separated myself from the organization. The elders literally drove me away (by means of bans and revoking implied invitation) by telling me I am not welcome since I won't stop greeting my brothers - they got mad because I said hello to the friends at the Kingdom Hall and the assembly. (I wrote about the most recent time they ran me off in the Status Update on my profile.)

I have not cut off my affections for them, even if some of them cut off their affections for me. I will obey Jesus' command to show love for all the brothers, even if they decide they want to "shun" me. They will come around eventually and realize how foolish it is for them to cause such divisions. Jesus will clear things up soon.

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

the world in it's current state, idle hands are the devil’s playground

We must keep active in love and actively work to show love to others.

"But in your case, beloved ones, we are convinced of better things, things related to salvation, even though we are speaking in this way.  For God is not unrighteous so as to forget your work and the love you showed for his name by ministering and continuing to minister to the holy ones.  But we desire each one of you to show the same industriousness so as to have the full assurance of the hope down to the end,  so that you may not become sluggish, but be imitators of those who through faith and patience inherit the promises."

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

the division caused by it, there is usually an agenda at play

The Devil's agenda is to divide us. Jehovah has a different agenda, and Jehovah's agenda is the One we must follow.

"Whoever acknowledges that Jesus is God’s Son, God remains in union with such one and he in union with God.  And we have come to know and believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and the one who remains in love remains in union with God and God remains in union with him."

"Union" means to be one with somebody. We must be One in Love with those who acknowledge that Jesus is God's Son. That's Jehovah's agenda.

"Beloved ones, if this is how God loved us, then we are also under obligation to love one another."

"Whoever acknowledges that Jesus is God’s Son, God remains in union with such one and he in union with God.  And we have come to know and believe the love that God has for us. God is love, and the one who remains in love remains in union with God and God remains in union with him.  In this way love has been made perfect in us, so that we may have freeness of speech in the day of judgment, because just as that one is, so are we ourselves in this world."

"There is no fear in love, but perfect love casts fear out, because fear restrains us. Indeed, the one who is fearful has not been made perfect in love.  We love, because he first loved us."

"If anyone says, “I love God,” and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For the one who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot love God, whom he has not seen.  And we have this commandment from him, that whoever loves God must also love his brother."

"Who really is my brother?" God's Word says our brother is whoever acknowledges that Jesus is God's Son. 

When the beastly governments are gone ("the heavens" of this world) and when the religious institutions are gone (Babylon the Great) and it's just the Kingdom ruling, how much peace there will be. No more divisions, at last!

"Loyal love and faithfulness will meet together; 

Righteousness and peace will kiss each other."

1 hour ago, Space Merchant said:

I've seen and heard of religious folks get worked up on things as simple as, and or pretty silly stuff, such as the color of a carpet inside of religious buildings, specific foods sparking outrage between pastors, ministers, etc.

I agree that it is silly to have divisions because of non-Bible-command things. (We obviously would not share spiritual fellowship with those who call themselves a brother who practice things that God hates. The Bible is clear that homosexuality is wrong, and murder, etc... Although some of the different churches in Christendom teach various things, the individuals who can be found in those churches really can't be lumped together and judged as one since they don't all adhere to every single teaching of their churches, just like some Jehovah's Witnesses don't believe every single teaching of the FDS.)

I haven't yet had the pleasure of talking to any of my brothers from the True Witnesses of Jehovah or any other group like that, but I will welcome them as my brothers should I get the opportunity, just like I will welcome my brothers from Jehovah's Witnesses or my brothers who are believers among the so-called "disfellowshipped" or so-called "apostates" or Christendom. I wouldn't take part in any ritual or practice that I do not think is scriptural, but that doesn't mean I don't consider those ones not to be brothers just because they have a slightly different understanding at present. (Jehovah's Witnesses used to celebrate Christmas and use the cross in worship too. We still consider them as brothers when we talk about them historically.) "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?”  And extending his hand toward his disciples, he said: “Look! My mother and my brothers!  For whoever does the will of my Father who is in heaven, that one is my brother and sister and mother." If a person is doing their best to follow the Christ, who am I to judge them as not worthy of love and brotherly affection?

I will welcome them in love as brothers because that's what Jesus said to do, and "we must obey God as ruler rather than man." All of us are at different stages in our knowledge and understanding of the Bible. If we exclude people when they are first starting to learn because we feel they're not as "holy", how is that imitating the Christ, who was willing to come hang out with all (humankind) of us even though we didn't understand anything correctly? We have permission to love unbelievers. How much more so we should show love for those who already love the Father and the Son! We are family. We don't need more divisions.

If we are really one of Jehovah's witnesses, then we have to have love. "God is Love".

4 hours ago, derek1956 said:

These are not Jehovahs Witnesses

Do you go to a convention or a meeting in a football shirt?

Theses are apostates 

What do they have in common with the true faith?

NONE, NOTHING

They even try and copy us

 

 

Dear brother @derek1956, here is some more on clothing...

"My brothers, you are not holding to the faith of our glorious Lord Jesus Christ while showing favoritism, are you?  For if a man with gold rings on his fingers and in splendid clothing comes into your meeting, but a poor man in filthy clothing also enters,  do you look with favor on the one wearing the splendid clothing and say, “You take this seat here in a fine place,” and do you say to the poor one, “You keep standing” or, “Take that seat there under my footstool”?  If so, do you not have class distinctions among yourselves, and have you not become judges rendering wicked decisions? Listen, my beloved brothers. Did not God choose those who are poor from the world’s standpoint to be rich in faith and heirs of the Kingdom, which he promised to those who love him?"

Also to think about, how does Jehovah judge whether someone is an "unbeliever"? 

"Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness?  Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Beʹli·al? Or what does a believer share in common with an unbeliever?  And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I will reside among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people.”  “‘Therefore, get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take you in.’”  “‘And I will become a father to you, and you will become sons and daughters to me,’ says Jehovah, the Almighty.”

Jehovah doesn't say a person is an unbeliever if they don't believe the same way as you or I believe. A "Believer" is someone who believes Jesus is God's Son. Some people are a little bit mixed up on the details. Some people think Jesus is Jehovah. Jehovah is patient. He hasn't thrown anybody out yet. Jesus hasn't come to do the judging yet. Is it right for any of us to label a person who says "I believe" as if they are an unbeliever and then cast them outside of our affections, shunning them, and saying "they're not one of Jehovah's witnesses" or "they're not a true Christian"?

"Make room for us in your hearts. We have wronged no one, we have corrupted no one, we have taken advantage of no one.  I do not say this to condemn you. For I have said before that you are in our hearts to die together and to live together.  I have great freeness of speech toward you. I have great boasting in regard to you. I am filled with comfort; I am overflowing with joy in all our affliction."

Jehovah is removing the walls. Jehovah is gathering the flock together. The details of prophecy will be ironed out later. They are not as important as love.

"Keep following the Lamb wherever he goes."

Even a kid can follow the Lamb. Jesus isn't complicated. Show love.

"So calling a young child to him, he stood him in their midst  and said: “Truly I say to you, unless you turn around and become as young children, you will by no means enter into the Kingdom of the heavens.  Therefore, whoever will humble himself like this young child is the one who is the greatest in the Kingdom of the heavens;  and whoever receives one such young child on the basis of my name receives me also.  But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who have faith in me, it would be better for him to have hung around his neck a millstone that is turned by a donkey and to be sunk in the open sea."

Jesus is going to call to account those "stumbling blocks" who try to prevent others from accessing the love of the congregation. Jesus is going to call to account those "stumbling blocks" who make up extra rules to make it difficult for the flock. Jesus is going to call to account those "stumbling blocks" who are causing divisions by means of withholding love from other believers, whether those believers are labeled "disfellowshipped" or "apostate" or "too worldly". (It's just like the corban thing.)

“Woe to the world because of the stumbling blocks! Of course, it is inevitable that stumbling blocks will come, but woe to the man through whom the stumbling block comes!  If, then, your hand or your foot makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it away from you. It is better for you to enter into life maimed or lame than to be thrown with two hands or two feet into the everlasting fire.  Also, if your eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it away from you. It is better for you to enter one-eyed into life than to be thrown with two eyes into the fiery Ge·henʹna.  See that you do not despise one of these little ones, for I tell you that their angels in heaven always look upon the face of my Father who is in heaven."

The time is near for the divisions in the watch tower to end. The UN is going to get rid of all the religious institutions, and then the sheep will follow Jesus instead of men. Jesus will gather us all together. Praise Jehovah.

"“What do you think? If a man has 100 sheep and one of them strays, will he not leave the 99 on the mountains and set out on a search for the one that is straying?  And if he finds it, I certainly tell you, he rejoices more over it than over the 99 that have not strayed.  Likewise, it is not a desirable thing to my Father who is in heaven for even one of these little ones to perish."

We must become "Just like a child" to follow the Lamb.

https://www.jw.org/en/library/music-songs/original-songs/just-like-a-child/?content=video

3 hours ago, boyle said:

I see you have caused a great confusion in understanding

You are blind, my dear, so you cannot see anything. That's okay. There is still time. Someday hopefully you will see. I really hope you have a good day, @boyle.💖

1 hour ago, derek1956 said:

These are not Jehovahs Witnesses

Do you go to a convention or a meeting in a football shirt?

Theses are apostates 

What do they have in common with the true faith?

NONE, NOTHING

They even try and copy us

 

 

Thank you so much for responding, @derek1956. I hope you are well today.🌷

Please consider, my brother, these things...

"Now I would have you know that nobody when speaking by God’s spirit says: “Jesus is accursed!” and nobody can say: “Jesus is Lord!” except by holy spirit."

"John said to him: “Teacher, we saw someone expelling demons by using your name, and we tried to prevent him, because he was not following us.”  But Jesus said: “Do not try to prevent him, for there is no one who will do a powerful work on the basis of my name who will quickly be able to say anything bad about me.  For whoever is not against us is for us.  And whoever gives you a cup of water to drink because you belong to Christ, I tell you truly, he will by no means lose his reward.  But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who have faith, it would be better for him if a millstone that is turned by a donkey were put around his neck and he were pitched into the sea."

The only time the word "apostates" is used in the New World Translation is when talking about individuals still within Jehovah's Name People, Jehovah's organization:

"The elder and highly respected one is the head, 

And the prophet giving false instruction is the tail.  

Those leading this people are causing them to wander, 

And those who are being led are confused.  

That is why Jehovah will not rejoice over their young men, 

And he will have no mercy on their fatherless children and their widows 

Because all of them are apostates and evildoers 

And every mouth is speaking senselessness.  

In view of all this, his anger has not turned back, 

But his hand is still stretched out to strike."

"The sinners in Zion are in dread; 

Trembling has seized the apostates:  

‘Who of us can live where there is a consuming fire? 

Who of us can live with unquenchable flames?'"

Jesus did not say that "apostates" are identified by what they wear on the outside. He said they can be identified by what comes out of their mouths:

"At this he said: “Are you also still without understanding?  Are you not aware that whatever enters into the mouth passes through the stomach and is discharged into the sewer?  However, whatever comes out of the mouth comes from the heart, and those things defile a man.  For example, out of the heart come wicked reasonings: murders, adulteries, sexual immorality, thefts, false testimonies, blasphemies.  These are the things that defile a man; but to take a meal with unwashed hands does not defile a man.”"

"For he is not a Jew who is one on the outside, nor is circumcision something on the outside, on the flesh.  But he is a Jew who is one on the inside, and his circumcision is that of the heart by spirit and not by a written code. That person’s praise comes from God, not from people."

"Do not let your adornment be external—the braiding of hair and the wearing of gold ornaments or fine clothing—  but let it be the secret person of the heart in the incorruptible adornment of the quiet and mild spirit, which is of great value in the eyes of God."

Is there anywhere in the Bible that says there is a certain dress code for meetings for worship? No. There isn't. Do you really think the poor first century Christians wore ties and dress coats? Russell ran a gentleman's goods store. It's not surprising he would wear nice clothes, and there is nothing wrong with that, but it is not a commandment from Jesus to wear a suit.

It is a command to show love.

"Apostates" are not identified by their clothes. They are identified by their lack of love.

"You must love your brother as yourself."

"Keep on speaking and behaving in such a way as those do who are going to be judged by the law of a free people.  For the one who does not practice mercy will have his judgment without mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment."

Please, be careful @derek1956, that you keep on the true garments of righteousness. We must dress modestly, of course, so that our flesh is covered but other than that Love is the only "required" garment.

Jesus said: "Because you say, “I am rich and have acquired riches and do not need anything at all,” but you do not know that you are miserable and pitiful and poor and blind and naked, I advise you to buy from me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, and white garments so that you may become dressed and that the shame of your nakedness may not be exposed, and eyesalve to rub in your eyes so that you may see."

"“Look! I am coming as a thief. Happy is the one who stays awake and keeps his outer garments, so that he may not walk naked and people look upon his shamefulness.”"

"Let your love be without hypocrisy." 

"Love covers a multitude of sins." 

"Clothe yourselves with love."

43 minutes ago, boyle said:

That's the whole point about the bible. What kind of association is favorable to Jehovah?

It was made clear by Jesus and Paul.

It was made clear. Jesus hung out with salt-of-the-earth kind of people. He ate with tax collectors and prostitutes. He spent time with people no one else liked and with people who were unloved. He even showed love for people who were really mean and scary sometimes, like that Legion guy.

Paul used to be a Pharisee who wanted Christians dead. Jehovah loved Paul even before Paul repented, while he was on the road to Damascus to go be naughty to some Christians. Jesus opened Paul's eyes so he could see clearly.

43 minutes ago, boyle said:

Who visited Abraham? 

Jehovah did.

The Bible shows that Jehovah visited Abraham. Jehovah materialized a body and visited Abraham. (No man has seen God at anytime in God's full glory, but lots of people have seen Jehovah in a materialized form in the Bible. God materialized and talked to Moses face-to-face in the tent. God materialized and talked to Adam and Eve in the garden, that's why it says they hid from "the face of Jehovah".)

"Afterward, Jehovah appeared to him among the big trees of Mamʹre while he was sitting at the entrance of the tent during the hottest part of the day.  He looked up and saw three men standing some distance from him. When he saw them, he ran from the entrance of the tent to meet them, and he bowed down to the ground."

Abraham saw Jehovah in a materialized body.  

"Then he said: “Jehovah, if I have found favor in your eyes, please do not pass by your servant.  Please, let a little water be brought and have your feet washed; then recline under the tree.  Seeing that you have come here to your servant, let me bring a piece of bread so that you may refresh yourselves. Then you may go on your way.” 

"At this they said: “All right. You may do as you have spoken.” 

Abraham washed Jehovah's feet.

"So Abraham hurried to the tent to Sarah and said: “Quick! Get three measures of fine flour, knead the dough, and make loaves of bread.”  Next Abraham ran to the herd and chose a tender and good young bull. He gave it to the attendant, who hurried to prepare it.  He then took butter and milk and the young bull that he had prepared and set the food before them. Then he stood by them under the tree as they were eating." 

Jehovah ate.

"They said to him: “Where is your wife Sarah?” He replied: “Here in the tent.”  So one of them continued: “I will surely return to you next year at this time, and look! your wife Sarah will have a son.” Now Sarah was listening at the tent entrance, which was behind the man.  Abraham and Sarah were old, being advanced in years. Sarah was past the age of childbearing.  So Sarah began to laugh to herself, saying: “After I am worn out and my lord is old, will I really have this pleasure?”  Then Jehovah said to Abraham: “Why did Sarah laugh and say, ‘Am I really going to give birth even though I am old?’  Is anything too extraordinary for Jehovah? I will return to you next year at this appointed time, and Sarah will have a son.”  But Sarah denied it, saying, “I did not laugh!” for she was afraid. At this he said: “Yes! You did laugh.”

Jehovah talked to Abraham. (Is anything too extraordinary for Jehovah?)

"When the men got up to leave and looked down toward Sodʹom, Abraham was walking with them to escort them.  Jehovah said: “Am I keeping hidden from Abraham what I am going to do?  Why, Abraham is surely going to become a great and mighty nation, and all the nations of the earth will be blessed by means of him.  For I have come to know him in order that he may command his sons and his household after him to keep Jehovah’s way by doing what is right and just, so that Jehovah may bring about what he has promised concerning Abraham.” 

Jehovah talked more with Abraham.

"Then Jehovah said: “The outcry against Sodʹom and Go·morʹrah is indeed great, and their sin is very heavy.  I will go down to see whether they are acting according to the outcry that has reached me. And if not, I can get to know it.” 

Jehovah went to check it out personally.

"Then the men left from there and went toward Sodʹom, but Jehovah remained with Abraham.  Then Abraham approached and said: “Will you really sweep away the righteous with the wicked?  Suppose there are 50 righteous men within the city. Will you, then, sweep them away and not pardon the place for the sake of the 50 righteous who are inside it?  It is unthinkable that you would act in this manner by putting the righteous man to death with the wicked one so that the outcome for the righteous man and the wicked is the same! It is unthinkable of you. Will the Judge of all the earth not do what is right?”  Then Jehovah said: “If I find in Sodʹom 50 righteous men in the city, I will pardon the whole place for their sake.”  But Abraham again responded: “Please, here I have presumed to speak to Jehovah, whereas I am dust and ashes.  Suppose the 50 righteous should lack five. Because of the five will you destroy the whole city?” To this he said: “I will not destroy it if I find there 45."

Jehovah is reasonable.

"But yet again he spoke to him and said: “Suppose 40 are found there.” He answered: “I will not do it for the sake of the 40.”  But he continued: “Jehovah, please, do not become hot with anger, but let me go on speaking: Suppose only 30 are found there.” He answered: “I will not do it if I find 30 there.”  But he continued: “Please, here I have presumed to speak to Jehovah: Suppose only 20 are found there.” He answered: “I will not destroy it for the sake of the 20.”  Finally he said: “Jehovah, please, do not become hot with anger, but let me speak just once more: Suppose only ten are found there.” He answered: “I will not destroy it for the sake of the ten.”  When Jehovah finished speaking to Abraham, he went his way and Abraham returned to his place."

Certainly Jehovah will rescue all the little sheep who are in the different sects and everywhere else. 

"He does great and unsearchable things, 

Wonderful things that cannot be counted.  

He passes by me, and I cannot see him; 

He moves past me, but I do not discern him."

"Search for Jehovah while he may be found. 

Call to him while he is near. 

Let the wicked man leave his way 

And the evil man his thoughts; 

Let him return to Jehovah, who will have mercy on him, 

To our God, for he will forgive in a large way."

(Goodnight, @boyle 😌🌷)

15 minutes ago, boyle said:

Yes, Jehovah forgives repented confused people. The unrepentant, receive judgment.

And we don't have to decide who is repentant and who is not. We don't have to judge who is a true worshipper and who is not based on outward appearances or any human checklist. Jesus is appointed to do the judging.

3 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

which version of the chocolate cookie is the best version

I love chocolate chip cookies. It doesn't matter to me if they have walnuts or not, if they are double chocolate or if you use Toll House brand morsels. I just love chocolate chip cookies.

Do you think Jehovah loves chocolate chip cookies?

When He visited Abraham, He ate a meal with him. (I don't think they had chocolate chip cookies back then, but if they did, surely Jehovah would enjoy one.)

Jehovah loved Abraham. God's Word says Abraham is God's friend.

"O our God, did you not drive away the inhabitants of this land from before your people Israel and then give it as a lasting possession to the offspring of your friend Abraham?"

"But you, O Israel, are my servant, You, O Jacob, whom I have chosen, The offspring of Abraham my friend..."

"You see that his faith was active along with his works and his faith was perfected by his works,  and the scripture was fulfilled that says: “Abraham put faith in Jehovah, and it was counted to him as righteousness,” and he came to be called Jehovah’s friend."

Abraham was Jehovah's friend before there was "an organization". Abraham was Jehovah's friend before there was a Bible. Abraham was Jehovah's friend before Abraham was circumcised, before he was in a covenant, before he was baptized. (He never was baptized actually! Shocking!)

If Jehovah can be friends with someone before they are baptized, then how much more so He can be friends with sincere people in the different "sects" who are doing their best to read God's Word every single day! "Jehovah knows those who belong to him." 

Jehovah is not complicated. "God is love." He loves them too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfF3DJQs_G0

33 minutes ago, boyle said:

Jehovah will react to true worshipers, not those that confuse his words.

When Jehovah saved the Hebrews and a vast mixed crowd of Egyptians out of Egypt, some those people confused His words. 

(Who was the one who made that golden calf anyway?)

And yet, Aaron became installed as priest. Go figure.

Jehovah forgives. Even confused people. The ransom is enough for them. Praise Jehovah.

Regardless of the business corporation parts or of the apparent "leaders" (be it Russell, Rutherford, Knorr or whoever) the facts are that there are a bunch of people organized into congregations all over the world who already believe the Bible is God's Word, they already believe that Jehovah is God's name, and they already believe some of the basic teachings from the Bible. They've got boots-on-the-ground, so-to-speak. 

When Jesus made food for everybody, he didn't make fancy focaccia bread or exquisitely prepared makimono and uramaki sushi rolls - he used what was on hand, some plain fish and plain bread. 

The basic parts of the organization are sufficient for Jesus to use to do a miracle. "You go with the army you have." Jesus can make up the difference.

When the Hebrews were facing the Red Sea and Pharoah's army was coming down on them, Jehovah did the unexpected. When Lazarus had been dead for four days and starting to stink, Jesus did the unexpected. For those who know the details of the rot and spiritual death in parts of the organization, it would be extremely unexpected that the organization could be used. Which is exactly why we can have confidence that Jehovah will act. His Name is There. He does the unexpected for a purpose. He will act for His Name's Sake and for the sake of His loyal ones. He will get glory for himself by doing the unexpected. He will bring back all the sheep and they will rejoice. It's as good as done. "He is a God, not of the dead, but of the living, for they are all living to him.” Praise Jehovah.

2 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

So I guess we can't trust the current jw's in being the one true religion since there are splinter jw's with their own version of the one true religion. It's almost like which version of the chocolate cookie is the best version since the original recipe came out!!!! Which version of the chocolate cookie is the current jw's?

Jesus said the congregations would be a mess. "Hold fast what you have until I come," he said. Most sheep do not think really deeply. That there would be a congregation is obvious from the scriptures. Jesus will fix it when he gets here. Jehovah's left His name on Jehovah's Witnesses. While they are messed up on many things, if you think from a practical point of view, it would be easier for Jesus to come fix up that organization and bring everyone together there than to just start over. Jesus' name means "Jehovah Is Salvation" and regardless of how you want to pronounce it, Jehovah's name means "He Causes To Become". If He can cause the dead to be raised and if He can heal the sick, then He can cause a messed up organization to become healed and alive in love and truth.

5 hours ago, Matthew9969 said:

Found this interesting read....Who are the True Faith Jehovah’s Witnesses? Why did they break away from Bethel? « Beyond the Watchtower (beyondwatchtower.com)

This thread is called "Division within the watch tower world"...Jesus foretold there would be such divisions. He gave instructions to the angels of the congregations as recorded in Revelation. ("The stars mean the angels of the congregations." Angels are angels, angels here doesn't mean humans. Angels means angels.)

The Son of man will send out his angels to repair the divisions in the congregations at the appointed time. 

Jehovah is sometimes called "Jehovah of Armies". He has many different armies.

Have you ever seen an army of crows go after a hawk? Can you imagine an army of angels going after a wolf?

"There is strong confidence in the fear of Jehovah, 

And it will be a refuge for his children."

"For your confidence to be in Jehovah, 

I am giving you knowledge today."

Jesus will send out his angels to remove the wolves and to gather back the ones who have gone beyond the watchtower.

"God is not a mere man who tells lies,

Nor a son of man who changes his mind.  

When he says something, will he not do it?

When he speaks, will he not carry it out?"

Praise Jehovah of armies.💖

2 minutes ago, boyle said:

Do you personally see Jesus every day to ask him to heal the sick and afflicted?

I ask Jehovah every day to help heal and comfort the spiritually sick and spiritually afflicted, like you. I ask Him in Jesus name. I "see" him answer those kinds of prayers all the time (in a figurative way of course.) Some of those things take a long time, so we have to be patient.

4 minutes ago, boyle said:

I notice how Jesus left instructions to obey God's word, which includes rebuke.

I don't know if you've noticed but I rebuke you all the time. 🤪

5 minutes ago, boyle said:

In your mind, an addict, drunkard, adulterer, fornicator, etc. should not be punished because you want to add your personal emotion to the bible?

Most addicts are trying to cope with pain.

Did you ever notice that Jesus healed and fed people before he taught them?

He set the pattern. That is the preview. Jesus isn't going to just execute everybody before they even have a chance to learn about the truth. How can they learn about the truth in this world? There is too much pain.

Jehovah is not an unreasonable tyrant. He is a Real Father and a Real Shepherd and a Real Teacher. He will make sure the little ones have a chance to taste goodness before they are taught and then they can make a choice. He's not just going to execute all the little ignorant ones at Armageddon. And He most certainly is not going to execute truth-seekers who are just digging in the wrong place.

1 hour ago, Pudgy said:

The shepherds of biblical times used to tenderly care for their sheep, because internet blogging had not been invented, and they were bored sitting around the house all day playing with their dradels.

There is an unsubstantiated rumor that from time to time they would cut their fur off, and kill them, and burn them in FIRE, and EAT them!

(Not everybody eats their domestics.)

"And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those too I must bring in, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd."

"Now all the tax collectors and the sinners kept gathering around him to hear him.  And both the Pharisees and the scribes kept muttering: “This man welcomes sinners and eats with them.”  Then he told them this illustration, saying:  “What man among you with 100 sheep, on losing one of them, will not leave the 99 behind in the wilderness and go after the lost one until he finds it?  And when he has found it, he puts it on his shoulders and rejoices.  And when he gets home, he calls his friends and his neighbors together, saying to them, ‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep that was lost.’  I tell you that in the same way, there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over 99 righteous ones who have no need of repentance."

When one of the domestics gets out (or gets chased out by a predator), you go get them back, even if you have to fight off the predator. There's no question about it.

Jesus is coming to remove the wolves and gather in all the sheep. Wherever they are. Praise Jehovah.

"How much more valuable is a man than a sheep!"

11 minutes ago, boyle said:

Does this mean you believe those that have subjected themselves to a figurative hell, God loves them?

Yes. It's very clear that He does love them.

12 minutes ago, boyle said:

Do you think Jehovah loves Satan and what he did to humanity?

No. The angel that became Satan is already dead. He has been dead a long time. By dead I mean he's gone past the point of being able to be revived. "They are not his children, the defect is their own." 

The rest of humanity still has a chance to repent and turn around, so Jehovah can love them because of the absolute value of the ransom blood. 

14 minutes ago, boyle said:

Is that the point, or is it what God did to Solomon? Have you read 1 Kings 11?

Jehovah was mad at Solomon because Solomon stopped protecting the people. Solomon introduced practices that hurt the people. Jehovah didn't stop loving Solomon. Jehovah hated the bad things Solomon did because they hurt him and others. Jehovah didn't hate the man.

It's the same with the leaders in the organization. And with the sheep that are in all those other sects. He doesn't hate them. He's mad that they do dumb things because He doesn't like seeing people get hurt, but He doesn't hate the people. He's Jehovah. They're His kids.

13 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Before they moved, there used to be a glass cabinet full of “Telly” awards that the Society bought and gave to themselves for excellence in video productions of various sorts. They looked sorta like Oscars, gold and shiny, on a pedestal.

sorta like what Boyle mentioned, above.

I remember seeing them on a tour. Brother Semonian was there and he told us about them.

Kinda like in ancient Israel when a king would do something good, (like when Jehu got rid of Jezebel and Jehoram) but he still left the golden calf worship going on. Or when judge Gideon freed the people of the oppressive invaders but then setup an ephod that was used for false worship. Or when Solomon had all this wisdom and built the temple but helped his wives do false worship. 

"There is nothing new under the sun."

Jehovah still used those imperfect guys in the past. He didn't approve of the stuff they did wrong, but how's that saying go? "You don't go with the army you want... you go with the army you have."

11 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Yeah …

The shepherds of biblical times used to tenderly care for their sheep, because internet blogging had not been invented, and they were bored sitting around the house all day playing with their dradels.

There is an unsubstantiated rumor that from time to time they would cut their fur off, and kill them, and burn them in FIRE, and EAT them!

…. this was before democracies like we have now.

Guess we're looking for more like the "Abel" type of shepherd then? Pre-meat days...

12 minutes ago, boyle said:

Right back at you, with the fake love, lol! 😂

My love for you's not fake, because it comes from Jehovah. 

Jehovah's Love is not fake; it's Real and His Love

"is deeper than the holler

Stronger than the river

Higher than the pine trees growin' tall upon the hill"

Jehovah's Love is "purer than the snowflakes

That fall in late December

And honest as a Robin on a springtime window sill

And longer than the song of a whippoorwill."

Jehovah loves all the little sheep wherever they are, whether they are in the WTBTS or the IBSA or exJWReddit or the beyondwatchtower-place or anywhere else they've landed. He will collect them all at the appointed time. Praise Jehovah.

26 minutes ago, Pudgy said:

Yeah!

An unexplained down vote is like a chicken in a vacuum.

 

"The Joke:

"A farmer has some chickens who don't lay any eggs. The farmer calls a physicist to help. The physicist does some calculation and says "I have a solution but it only works for spherical chickens in a vacuum!".

When Sheldon crashed the conference, he said that it was a good joke

Explanation:

When learning physics, to make things easier and clear, objects are usually spheres or squares in a vacuum (this make the problems easier to calculate). As a result, the physicist in the joke says his solution "only works for spherical chickens in a vacuum", making it an inapplicable solution, but funny because it's truly the way you learn physics." (from website bigbangtheory.fandom.com)

I've never had a chicken in a vacuum, thankfully, but I've had some chickens trying to race and it's just as unclear which way they're going to go as a chicken in a vacuum...

10 minutes ago, boyle said:

There are different sects

It'll be so good when Jesus brings all the sheep back together.

12 minutes ago, boyle said:

Like the one I just gave you? lol! 😂

If I take the "absolute value" of all the red downarrows you've given me, that's a lotta love, lol 😆