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Evacuated

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  1. Haha
    Evacuated got a reaction from DespicableME in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I'm glad you edited out the reference to born again, Baptist clergymen which was far too specific. And I agree. Such prejudicial stereotyping is indefensible. 
  2. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in Why are the Bible book colors lighter or darker on JW library?   
    Just a simple color coding based on a traditional grouping of Bible Books according to type, not chronology or authorship.  This is not the only grouping in existence, but it is a commonly used version. Others may care to comment in more detail on the history of the particular grouping as used in the New World Translation, but  In the case of the Hebrew Scriptures, the grouping dates back at least to the Septuagint version. 
    The alternate colours make it easy (for some) to find a particular book in the list of 66,  (if you have an idea of the groupings of course).
    Pentateuch or Law (5 books): Genesis to Deuteronomy
    Historical (12 books): Joshua to Esther
    Poetic or Wisdom (5 books): Job to Song of Solomon
    Prophets (17 books): Isaiah to Malachi
    Gospels (4 books): Matthew to John
    Acts (1 book)
    Letters (21 books): Romans to Jude
    Revelation (1 book)
  3. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in Why are the Bible book colors lighter or darker on JW library?   
    Just a simple color coding based on a traditional grouping of Bible Books according to type, not chronology or authorship.  This is not the only grouping in existence, but it is a commonly used version. Others may care to comment in more detail on the history of the particular grouping as used in the New World Translation, but  In the case of the Hebrew Scriptures, the grouping dates back at least to the Septuagint version. 
    The alternate colours make it easy (for some) to find a particular book in the list of 66,  (if you have an idea of the groupings of course).
    Pentateuch or Law (5 books): Genesis to Deuteronomy
    Historical (12 books): Joshua to Esther
    Poetic or Wisdom (5 books): Job to Song of Solomon
    Prophets (17 books): Isaiah to Malachi
    Gospels (4 books): Matthew to John
    Acts (1 book)
    Letters (21 books): Romans to Jude
    Revelation (1 book)
  4. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to TrueTomHarley in THE SESTROTESK DISTRICT COURT LEGALISES THE SEIZURE OF PROPERTIES OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES IN RUSSIA.   
    Nobody even knew that it was still the king of the north after glasnost. I think there was a published comment once that the identities of those kings was then unclear. The terms have not been used for some time.
    No, I don't think it is. What is unthinkable (except by those who do it) is to rebel against them. Everyone knows they are people and can make mistakes. But Jehovah's people also exercise faith, which has been borne out from the oldest times, that God works through humans and does not take kindly to ones that trash them.
  5. Like
    Evacuated reacted to TrueTomHarley in Spiritual Hierarchy Within The Jehovah's Witnesses   
    I will not blow off as nothing the theocratic accomplishments I see playing out today. Perhaps I should wait for oceans to part so GB members can walk to wherever they are going, but I will settle for what I see now.
    It is not nothing that a people are gathered internationally who are entirely undivided by nationalism, by racism, by social or educational class. It happens nowhere else on any scale. I will not take it for granted and not give credit where it is due.
    I will not blow off as nothing that there is one and only one organization that will put a modern Bible without charge into the hands of whoever desires it anywhere. They have to completely circumvent the world's profit-driven distribution channel to do it, inventing their own channel. And in 900 languages, no less. Given time, the Bible translation will approach that figure - you know it will. It is already massive. 
    The smooth functioning and meshing of diverse peoples to attain a common and undiluted spiritual goal - there has been no greater worldwide example of 'you received free, so give free.' It doesn't just happen. Somehow God has enabled humans to accomplish it.
    Human things are not perfect? Timing has been off? That should be a shocker? Jesus said: "Keep on the watch, but don't overdo it?" I don't think so.
    There is fierce opposition today? As though, with a capable leadership, Jesus words would be wrong and the world would love Christians? As though the worse 'wicked thing they would lyingly say' about Jesus' followers is "They woke me up Saturday morning when I was sleeping?" No.
    IF Srecko hehehe :))))))) headed up something with anything to show for itself, minus the missteps, I would investigate it closely. The same with our house annointed person. But there is nothing but crying, muttering and bellyaching from all of them - at least they have pointed to nothing of significance. All they can do is cry that the doers are doing it wrong. Until humans are perfect, who can't do that?
    Regarding authorization by miracles, Paul said such gifts would pass away. What if he had said it on this forum? What responses would he get? "Well - okay, BE that way if you are going to be. But don't expect anything from us! We're not budging unless we see plenty of razzle-dazzle!"
    What we do see ought to be enough.
  6. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Anna in Watchtower pays $4000 per day for disobeying Secular Authority   
    No, they really mean 2018. January. Don't forget as well the Americans write their dates in the month/day/year format. It's under "scheduled actions" and it's due 30 days from when it is issued. So I said it wrong. It was evidently issued 8th December 2017 and is due 8th January 2018
    http://appellatecases.courtinfo.ca.gov/search/case/scheduledActions.cfm?dist=41&doc_id=2150357&doc_no=D070723&request_token=NiIwLSInLkg9WzApSSFNXE1IQEw6UkxbJCJeWzhTQCAgCg%3D%3D
  7. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Noble Berean in Watchtower pays $4000 per day for disobeying Secular Authority   
    Understand the reference as to Jehovah's view.
    But has it been to the highest "earthly" court? Or is there a further appeal pending?  Can't work out where it is from these postings.
  8. Upvote
    Evacuated reacted to Anna in Watchtower pays $4000 per day for disobeying Secular Authority   
    Someone already posted this at the beginning of this thread.
    It is up in the air because it can be appealed. Which no doubt it will be...until it reaches the US supreme court. They have always treated us fair. Ok, most of the time. So there is a possibility this will come to nothing at all.
  9. Like
    Evacuated got a reaction from Noble Berean in Spiritual Hierarchy Within The Jehovah's Witnesses   
    NO No Noble Berean, you are reading too quickly! I said this "Any other "heirarchical perception" exists only in the minds of those men who hold it I'm afraid, whoever they are."
    I didn't say that there isn't a hierachy, I said that any hierarchy that attaches a position-related value to individuals within it exists only in the mind of those who hold that perception. Interesting how an unreality can be part of an unfortunate reality don't you think? 
    Anyway, don't worry yourself unduly over it. It will all get ironed out. "Next, the end, when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power." 1Cor 15:24.
    Seems best to get in line now to me...really! It relieves a great deal of stress and wasted effort. 
     
  10. Haha
    Evacuated reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Spiritual Hierarchy Within The Jehovah's Witnesses   
    ..and now for something completely different, to releve a great deal of stress and wasted effort .... a short musical interlude ...
     
  11. Like
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in Spiritual Hierarchy Within The Jehovah's Witnesses   
    NO No Noble Berean, you are reading too quickly! I said this "Any other "heirarchical perception" exists only in the minds of those men who hold it I'm afraid, whoever they are."
    I didn't say that there isn't a hierachy, I said that any hierarchy that attaches a position-related value to individuals within it exists only in the mind of those who hold that perception. Interesting how an unreality can be part of an unfortunate reality don't you think? 
    Anyway, don't worry yourself unduly over it. It will all get ironed out. "Next, the end, when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power." 1Cor 15:24.
    Seems best to get in line now to me...really! It relieves a great deal of stress and wasted effort. 
     
  12. Like
    Evacuated got a reaction from Noble Berean in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Yes, very neatly laid out. But it still misses the point. The attaching of relative value to people just because they occupy this or that functional role in an arrangement of humans, even if it's theocratic,  is where the problem lies. Everybody does it we know, and as @JW Insiderdeftlly points out:
    Jehovah puts it more bluntly when He says that the inhabitants of the earth "are like grasshoppers" at Is. 40:22.
    Jesus gave clear counsel at Matt.20:24-27 when he instructed his disciples: "Jesus called them to him and said: “You know that the rulers of the nations lord it over them and the great men wield authority over them. This must not be the way among you; but whoever wants to become great among you must be your minister, and whoever wants to be first among you must be your slave".
    There will always be problems when the waiter starts to think he is more important than those at the table, just because he has the job of handing out the food. Even Harry Callahan observed of a "waiter" with deluded self importance "You're a legend in your own mind".
    There is much that could be said on this matter. But to stay on topic, the '75 brouhaha was(is) the product of the minds of "grasshoppers" in the heat of the sun. One starts jumpin'.... they all start jumpin'........
    Thankfully, it's all cooled down a bit now, on that front at least. 
  13. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Srecko Sostar in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    the "current" understanding is all it can ever be until it has passed, and then we "will know accurately", just as we "are accurately known".
  14. Thanks
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Yes, very neatly laid out. But it still misses the point. The attaching of relative value to people just because they occupy this or that functional role in an arrangement of humans, even if it's theocratic,  is where the problem lies. Everybody does it we know, and as @JW Insiderdeftlly points out:
    Jehovah puts it more bluntly when He says that the inhabitants of the earth "are like grasshoppers" at Is. 40:22.
    Jesus gave clear counsel at Matt.20:24-27 when he instructed his disciples: "Jesus called them to him and said: “You know that the rulers of the nations lord it over them and the great men wield authority over them. This must not be the way among you; but whoever wants to become great among you must be your minister, and whoever wants to be first among you must be your slave".
    There will always be problems when the waiter starts to think he is more important than those at the table, just because he has the job of handing out the food. Even Harry Callahan observed of a "waiter" with deluded self importance "You're a legend in your own mind".
    There is much that could be said on this matter. But to stay on topic, the '75 brouhaha was(is) the product of the minds of "grasshoppers" in the heat of the sun. One starts jumpin'.... they all start jumpin'........
    Thankfully, it's all cooled down a bit now, on that front at least. 
  15. Like
    Evacuated reacted to JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Good point. "Rank and file" has bee a common expression within Bethel for the publishers outside the Bethel headquarters.
    Sometimes F.Franz used the term "rank and file" and sometimes just "the publishers" as in "the publishers don't always know what they need until they see it." Assembly talk in 2014 spoke of how the faithful slave is producing material and that "You, the rank and file take it from door to door." (He was a circuit overseer, so I remember wondering if he should have said "We, the rank and file . . .") A member of the Governing Body speaks of the "rank and file" witnesses in the 2011 video "Jehovah's Witnesses -- Faith in Acti0on." Also the Watchtower has used it a couple of times: *** w86 9/1 p. 28 Must You Be in the Limelight? ***
    A similar situation exists in the Christian congregation. Some individuals are used quite prominently, but others play rather inconspicuous roles as rank-and-file publishers of the Kingdom message. Should these ones feel, however, that they are somehow less important because they are not in the limelight? But it's true isn't it, that each of these "prominent ones" should also be considering themselves to to be the "rank and file" at least on weekends.
  16. Haha
    Evacuated reacted to Anna in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Yes. We are supposedly all domestics, including the Slave/GB
    And as a side point, if someone brings up the overlapping generation I'm going to waive my hand dismissively like Br. Herd and go "pfft..."
  17. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Imagine these statements were made in the 1st Century.
    I believe that an example of a life-saving statement then was given by Jesus himself when he said:
    "This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ." John 17:3
    And to match the fuller quote, note the reaction of some at the time to that same life-saving direction that had come from Jehovah's organisation:
    "For the speech about the torture stake is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved, it is God’s power." 1Cor.1:18.
    I'm not sure ironic is the right word without talking to him. I'm open on that one.
    However, (with respect) I get a clear message of "relative unimportance" when it comes to the significance of "generation" debate.
  18. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Amen to that, and probably in that, relief that Armageddon did not come in 1975 if they're honest!

  19. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    This reveals a basic characteristic of those who "observe" JWs from the sidelines. The presumption of a sort of heirarchy along the lines of typical human organisation.
    Actually, all JW's are rank and file. Any other "heirarchical perception" exists only in the minds of those men who hold it I'm afraid, whoever they are.. So in reality, 1975 enthusiasm, (other than enthusiasm for just another "last days" year nearer the end than 1974), was generated by some rank & file JWs. And there were some other rank & file JWs who did not share that enthusiasm.
  20. Haha
    Evacuated got a reaction from Anna in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Great!! I'm gonna max out my Sainsburys card for 30 months and then transfer the balance to Santander!!!
    https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/credit-cards/best-0-credit-cards#longestdeal
  21. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Noble Berean in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Amen to that, and probably in that, relief that Armageddon did not come in 1975 if they're honest!

  22. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from Noble Berean in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    This reveals a basic characteristic of those who "observe" JWs from the sidelines. The presumption of a sort of heirarchy along the lines of typical human organisation.
    Actually, all JW's are rank and file. Any other "heirarchical perception" exists only in the minds of those men who hold it I'm afraid, whoever they are.. So in reality, 1975 enthusiasm, (other than enthusiasm for just another "last days" year nearer the end than 1974), was generated by some rank & file JWs. And there were some other rank & file JWs who did not share that enthusiasm.
  23. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from TrueTomHarley in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    This reveals a basic characteristic of those who "observe" JWs from the sidelines. The presumption of a sort of heirarchy along the lines of typical human organisation.
    Actually, all JW's are rank and file. Any other "heirarchical perception" exists only in the minds of those men who hold it I'm afraid, whoever they are.. So in reality, 1975 enthusiasm, (other than enthusiasm for just another "last days" year nearer the end than 1974), was generated by some rank & file JWs. And there were some other rank & file JWs who did not share that enthusiasm.
  24. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Imagine these statements were made in the 1st Century.
    I believe that an example of a life-saving statement then was given by Jesus himself when he said:
    "This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ." John 17:3
    And to match the fuller quote, note the reaction of some at the time to that same life-saving direction that had come from Jehovah's organisation:
    "For the speech about the torture stake is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved, it is God’s power." 1Cor.1:18.
    I'm not sure ironic is the right word without talking to him. I'm open on that one.
    However, (with respect) I get a clear message of "relative unimportance" when it comes to the significance of "generation" debate.
  25. Upvote
    Evacuated got a reaction from JW Insider in 1975 and the Jehovah's Witnesses   
    Quite true.
    And more than ever I'm convinced this is apparently a US thing. I just can't recall hearing anything particularly emphatic on this matter, other than magazine statements here and there with qualifiers as quoted above, and US CO talks on cassette tapes with starry-eyed brothers saying "You've got to listen to this!".  And of course the odd brother who were (at our level) viewed endearingly as "eccentrics".
    I remember meeting an old friend on the street in early '72 who told me, cynically, that I was expecting the world to end in 1975. I didn't know much about that idea then, but I just said to him well, if it doesn't, we will both be here, but if it does, who will be laughing then? I didn't even bother to follow it up after at all. In reality, it just didn't figure in my day to day thinking. But it certainly effected some it appears.
    It was most definitely NOT a big subject in my experience on a KHall level, neither in the book studies (apart from a brief flurry in the Nations Shall Know study). It didn't figure at at all in my Bible Study coming into the truth. (I was asked to study the Life Everlasting book, but I rejected it over some sort of "great tribulation" confusion.) I remember a  group of witnesses from my area moved to California in '72. They were very "end soon" oriented I remember, but we just thought they were "over the top"!
    It must be a "British" thing. As far as my limited experience goes, we were just not swayed by American hysteria on this matter. We took no notice of end date statements. Maybe we were ALL APOSTATE!!! 
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