Jack Ryan

If it was a crime can you imagine a judge saying "well nobody found out you robbed the bank because you covered it up. Well done you can continue as the bank manager and not go to prison."

unless...

just read the suicide part of the book and it said this:

ATTEMPTED SUICIDE

81. A suicide attempt may be the result of deep despair or major depression.

Elders should deal carefully and compassionately with

such a person. In most cases, a judicial hearing is not required.

—Ps. 88:3, 17, 18; Prov. 15:13; Eccl. 7:7; g 4/14 pp. 6-9.

How dare publishers attempt suicide ! Clearly, they should be threatened with being disfellowshipped. Jehovah's congregation needs to be kept clean from people who try to kill themselves.

This is a fork from an earlier thread:

Here some points I noted not sure if these r different from the previous edition:

• medical marijuana is a personal choice

• Any allegations of child sexual abuse r to b given to the legal department to tell the elders how to proceed.

• Also specific instructions to not make abused persons face their accuser

• The elders should all b made aware of any sexual predators and if they move the new congregation elders should b made aware including parents of children in the congregation. This is only done if the legal department says to.

• Victims of abuse or their parents r to b advised that they can go to the police and r not to b discouraged from doing so.

• Masturbation is not pornia and is not really covered. Not sure if this is new and the org is backing away from discussing it.

• Probing sexual questions r to b avoided during a judicial committee

• Sexual offenders r not to receive any major privileges in the congregation, possibly minor ones such as handling mics after an extended time has passed.

• The elders r to clearly tell people that they r being invited to a judicial committee and what the meeting is about up front.

Things they r still clinging to:

• Still sticking to the two witnesses rule for child abuse

• it says that attempted suicide victims may b subject to a judicial committee ( someone that has mental illness should not b subject to more trauma I find this to b so disgusting)

• Of course all the other ridiculous invasive restrictions we all have experienced

Highlights from the book above (2019 links added)

1. The three year rule is re-iterated without specific mention of "three"

2. An elder or MS will be removed if he allows his adult DA'd child to move into family home

3. An elder can be removed for filing for bankruptcy

4. The language around the definition of rape is better - no more references to the woman having to scream

5. The stayover rule is still there. If you stay in the house of a member of the opposite sex, and two people know about it, it's a judicial matter.

6. "Abhorrent" forms of porn are now a DF offense. Gay, Lez, child, violent, bestial.

7. Gluttony is now listed as a DF offense. Not sure if it was there before

8. They have narrowed the definition of apostasy: " Deliberately Spreading Teachings Contrary to Bible Truth " the end of that sentence used to read "as taught by Jehovah's Witnesses"

9. I think this the first time they explicitly stated that marking talks can be given based on misconduct from unbaptized minors

10. There's a whole new section on CSA. It seems like an improvement overall and includes the child no longer having to confront her rapist in most cases, but it still doesn't have the promised female representation from Jackson's promise to the Australian court.

11. Willingly taking blood remains an automatic disassociation offence.

12. Reinstatement is "several months, a year or even longer"

13. Ownership of kingdom halls. They make clear that regardless of what it says on the title, a congregation does not OWN their own kingdom hall.

14. jw.org email - all correspondance between elders is now via the elders private account on jw.org. I guess they want to make sure they know EVERYTHING

15. Congregation file: Still they say the best place to keep it is at the KH. Therefore, paper records of all judicial matters should be in those files. ALL CSA RECORDS HAVE "DO NOT DESTROY" WRITTEN ON THEM

Here's the entire section on legal action as a result of judicial action. I think it's worth noting that it demonstrates that they will leave you alone if you write a legal letter:

IF THE ACCUSED THREATENS LEGAL ACTION 18. If the accused threatens legal action against the elders, the elders should suspend proceedings and promptly telephone the Legal Department. 19. If a member ofthe media or an attorney representing the accused contacts the elders, they should not give any information about PREPARING FOR JUDICIAL HEARINGS CHAPTER 15 “SHEPHERD THE FLOCK OF GOD” the case or verify that there is a judicial committee. Rather, they should give the following explanation: “The spiritual and physical welfare of Jehovah’s Witnesses is of paramount concern to the elders, who willingly provide spiritual assistance to congregation members. The elders extend this spiritual assistance confidentially. This makes it easier for those who seek the elders’ help to do so without worrying that what they say to the elders will be divulged later. Consequently, we do not comment on whether elders are currently or have formerly met to assist any member of the congregation.” If there is a need to do so, the elders may obtain the inquirer’s name and phone number and inform him that their attorney will contact him. The elders should then promptly telephone the Legal Department. 20. Ifthe authorities request confidential congregation records or ask that elders give testimony regarding confidential congregation matters, the elders should promptly telephone the Legal Department.

This seems like a big change below as it codifies what we have all been hearing about ownership of KH's:

OWNERSHIP 2. A Kingdom Hall is dedicated to the worship of Jehovah. Whether the property title, or deed, is held in the name of a local corporation or by means of a trustee arrangement or it is held in the name of a legal entity managed by the branch office, no congregation should conclude that it “owns” the Kingdom Hall. However, it is the responsibility of the congregations using the property to care for it and see that it is used in harmony with Kingdom interests. 3. As many as three or four congregations may be assigned by the branch office to use the same Kingdom Hall auditorium in order to make full use of the facility and to keep expenses to a minimum. The branch office will generally correspond with only one of the congregations using the facility regarding legal, property, and related matters. Usually, this contact congregation holds the documents related to the Kingdom Hall and the property on which it is located. This is for practical reasons only and does not provide a basis for the contact congregation to make unilateral

https://www.fvn.no/nyheter/norgeogverden/i/P3QWGX/A-Parallel-Court-System-Jehovahs-Witnesses-Judicial-Committees?fbclid=IwAR06hqq4RvdTWL6_pBF0BB1s4pgpsSZK1zg6mroTZkVnAhd8lISdXmq3x8I

Official response:

No Time for an Interview

Over a long period of time Fædrelandsvennen has attempted to get an interview with the JW Branch Office for Scandinavia regarding the practice of the judicial committees.

The Branch Office at Holbæk is the entity which connects the world headquarters at Warwick, New York with the congregations all over Scandinavia.

The Norwegian spokesperson Mr. Dag-Erik Kristoffersen has declined the interview request. He has been provided with information about the specific cases in this article and knows that Fædrelandsvennen is writing about the ’Elder Manual’, «Shepherd the Flock of God».

Kristoffersen’s only reply is an email, and his comments are not on the specific cases:

«We do not wish to spend time on an interview, since the questions you raise are about fundamental issues. All is very clearly explained in our internal book, from which you refer, as well as in magazines such as Watchtower. This is not something secret, something new or unknown.

Jehovah’s Witnesses is a Christian church, and we have some clear biblical guidelines on how to behave in order to enjoy and be part of the life in the congregation. If someone commits serious sins against the moral code of the Bible, a judicial committee must address whether this person can continue to be part of the congregation. The book which you have, explains how a judicial committee works and the biblical principles they must follow.

If there are personal disputes, e.g. financial, the Elders in the congregation will try to help the parties agree to some settlement. In cases of theft or fraud, a judicial committee will be formed. This is also the case when it is necessary to disfellowship a member of the congregation.

A decision by a judicial committee can be appealed, and the case will then be tried before another judicial committee.

It is as simple as this, and we have no more to say about this matter.»

Define "taken part in"? LOL

It's crazy to me that now a lap-dance is fornication/porneia. Which means it is also grounds for divorce!

So what if you just go into the strip club and watch from the table and enjoy your beer and steak. No penalty?

I was sitting beside a friend who expressed his discontent over the explicit detail in a magazine "that kids are supposed to read as well"

I’d like to know under what facts they would not consider this sexual immorality. Like if the stripper wasn’t really into it so you didn’t feel you got your money’s worth?

Although this will leave open the question of what exactly gyrating means.... LOL

In case anyone was confused.... Watchtower defines it for us...... as a SIN!!!

Watchtower continues the pressure to baptize these children before they can understand what exactly they are joining.....

Nowhere near as strong as 60 years ago...

In this installment of my rebuttal series I examine the February 2016 JW Broadcasting debut of Governing Body helper Kenneth Flodin, and offer him some loving counsel on his use of illustrations. I also scrutinize a series of segments designed to draw on the emotions of Jehovah's Witnesses, from the slick contrived cheesiness of Derrick Tillett to the tragic half-told story of Phelicity Sneesby.

Why the heck is WT trying to assert the clergy-penitent privilege to allow elders to NOT report to authorities?

Exhibit A: (State of Delaware v. Laurel Delaware Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses, Joel Mulchansingh and William Perkins)[https://law.justia.com/cases/delaware/superior-court/2016/n14c-05-122-mmj-0.html).

Relevant quote from the case, the JW crew being the defendants:

Defendants assert that all communications among the Elders, Juvenile Member, and Adult Member are subject to the clergy/penitent privilege. Additionally, Defendants argue that the State's claims are barred by the First Amendment to the United States and Delaware Constitutions. Finally, Defendants argue that they are exempt from a reporting duty pursuant to Section 909.

Does that sound like the organization is 'endeavoring' to report abuse? They are 'endeavoring' to legally NOT report abuse. That's how the hell they're trying to comply with secular laws.

I'm sorry for the language, but these *%&$*()*$ are writing articles to the general JW with the obvious intent of making it look like they're TRYING to report abuse and they're not. They're simply not.