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bruceq

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  1. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Persecution of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia intensifies and targets children   
    Persecution of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia intensifies and targets children
    By LAUREN MARKOE Religion News Service First Published 5 hours ago    •    Updated 4 hours ago Members of Jehovah's Witnesses wait in a court room in Moscow, Russia, on Thursday, April 20, 2017. Russia's Supreme Court has banned the Jehovah's Witnesses from operating in the country, accepting a request from the justice ministry that the religious organisation be considered an extremist group, ordering closure of the group's Russia headquarters and its 395 local chapters, as well as the seizure of its property. (AP Photo/Ivan Sekretarev)      Single page Share This Article Teachers have humiliated Jehovah's Witness children in front of their classmates. Arsonists have burned Witnesses' homes. Security forces have raided their meeting halls.
    Since the Russian Supreme Court on April 20 declared the Jehovah's Witnesses an extremist group, the faith's members have faced increasing harassment from both authorities and suspicious neighbors.
    And last week, for the first time since the decision, a Jehovah's Witness has been not only detained by police, but also jailed by a judge.
    "He read the Bible. That's why he was arrested," said Yaroslav Sivulskiy, a representative of the Jehovah's Witnesses in St. Petersburg.
    For about a month the Witnesses had not felt the full force of the court decision, which calls for the liquidation of the Jehovah's Witnesses organization — not only its Russian headquarters in St. Petersburg, but also the 400 or so Kingdom Halls where more than 100,000 Jehovah's Witnesses across the nation meet.
      Check out all of theb Top Jobs     Yet worship had continued at many of these Kingdom Halls.
    Within the past few weeks, however, intensifying persecution has prompted most congregations to move group worship to private homes, Sivulskiy said.
    Most worrisome to many Witnesses are the recent instances in which schoolteachers, principals and police have turned on children.
    "Officials who were already minded to take action against Jehovah's Witnesses are now emboldened, and ordinary people who have long disliked them are also emboldened," said Felix Corley, a Norway-based religious rights activist who edits the Forum 18 News Service, which tracks abuses in the former Soviet Union and Eastern Europe.
    Sivulskiy, speaking from St. Petersburg, tells the story of an 8-year-old girl recently forced by her school principal to sing a patriotic song at school in front of her classmates.
    Jehovah's Witnesses, an evangelical Christian group founded in Pittsburgh in the late 19th century, see themselves as representatives of God's kingdom and remain neutral in politics. They pay taxes but do not recite patriotic pledges, sing nationalistic songs or join the military.
    Witnesses also report an incident, near Moscow, of another 8-year-old girl, whose parents were brought to her school after she had sung a Jehovah's Witness song and talked about God to classmates. In the presence of the school's psychologist and director of security, the principal handed the parents a document informing them that if this behavior continued, the school would no longer educate the girl.
    In Bezvodnoye, northeast of Moscow, two sixth-grade girls were humiliated by a music teacher who defended her actions by noting that Jehovah's Witnesses are "banned." She reportedly said to the girls' mother: "You are now extremists and there will be no mercy."
    The encounter with the music teacher is one of 50 detailed in a May 25 report the Witnesses — whose world headquarters are outside New York — released on harassment against their co-religionists in Russia.
    The report also describes:
    • Physical attacks, including one in Belgorod, just north of the Ukrainian border, where the perpetrator shouted "you have been banned" and repeatedly punched a Witness in the head, face and upper body.
    • Arson, including an incident in Zheshart, in the northwest, where a building used for religious services was destroyed and a Molotov cocktail was found at the scene. Another attack occurred in Lustino, near Moscow, where the home of a Witness family burned to the ground.
    • Disruption of religious services, such as one that took place in a private home in Pavlovskiy Posad, 42 miles from Moscow. Police officers in plainclothes told Witnesses that the court decision meant they could no longer gather and worship.
    http://www.sltrib.com/home/5358906-155/persecution-of-jehovahs-witnesses-in-russia
  2. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in NEWSWEEK: JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES IN RUSSIA RECEIVE PARENTING AWARDS FROM PUTIN, SPARKING HOPE   
    JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES IN RUSSIA RECEIVE PARENTING AWARDS FROM PUTIN, SPARKING HOPE ON BAN APPEAL
    BY JASON LE MIERE ON 6/15/17 AT 5:06 PM             Russia Bans Jehovah's Witnesses       WORLDJEHOVAH'S WITNESSESVLADIMIR PUTIN Just six weeks after Russia’s Supreme Court banned the practicing of their religion, two Jehovah’s Witnesses were given a parenting award by Russian President Vladimir Putin. The surprising move has fueled hope that the court could overturn the ruling that the Christian denomination constituted an “extremist” group when an appeal verdict is announced Saturday.
    “We view this award as an acknowledgment that the free Bible education provided by Jehovah’s Witnesses helps parents and their children to be productive citizens not only in Russia but all over the world,” David A. Semonian, a spokesman for Jehovah’s Witnesses at their world headquarters in New York, said in a statement last week. “We hope that this award presented by President Putin is considered on July 17, 2017, when the Russian Supreme Court reviews the decision to liquidate the Administrative Center of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia.”
    Valeriy and Tatiana Novik, from Karelia in the northwest of Russia, were given the Order of “Parental Glory,” bestowed annually to parents who are deemed to have raised seven or more children with “due care for their health, education and physical, spiritual and moral development.” The Noviks, who have eight children, were one of eight couples bestowed the award in a ceremony on May 31.
    “Families like yours, large and full of generous parental love, embody centuries-old traditions of empathy and kindness, show through their example that no obstacles stand before the desire to act constructively and do good, and offer beacons for those reflecting on their own choice of future road,” Putin said at the ceremony.
    It was on April 20 that Russia’s Supreme Court banned Jehovah’s Witnesses under the country’s anti-extremism law, liquidating all 395 of its local religious chapters and preventing its 175,000 members from attending worship meetings. In the time since, Jehovah’s Witnesses have faced harassment from police and violent attacks from the public.
    Jehovah's Witnesses sing at a meeting in Russia. Two Jehovah's Witnesses were recently given a prestigious parenting award, despite the group being regarded as "extremist."COURTESY OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES
    Just prior to the parenting award being handed out, a Danish Jehovah’s Witness was arrestedin the Russian city Oryol for attending a private meeting of the group. He is now facing up to 10 years in prison.
    The decision to ban Jehovah’s Witnesses, according to the group’s Russian spokesman, Yaroslav Sivulskiy, did not come down to the evidence heard or the will of the court, but to politics.
    “It’s not this court, it’s not about justice, it’s not about a fair court hearing because even everyone who observed it said we won already, but even so we lost,” Sivulskiy told Newsweeklast month. “We have no big hope for the next level, only if some political wind will change somehow.”
    The religion of the Noviks was not brought up in the Kremlin’s reporting of the award—nor, the parents said, was it broached in their discussion with Putin.
    “There wasn't much time,” Valeriy Novik, a mechanic, told Radio Liberty’s Russian service this week. “You couldn't say everything. And I wanted to treat the head of state respectfully. A leader is a leader and we have to respect that. You don't express your problems, your complaints to him.”
  3. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Jehovah's Witnesses are being honored again in Russia for benefiting the community while being oppressed   
    Languishing in jail Dennis Christensen and his co-religionists have gained appreciation from the local authorities
    June 14, 2017   Photo collage: cleaning of the territory in the city of Eagle and Dennis Christensen
    The City of Eagle was awarded the local Jehovah's Witnesses for their active participation in cleaning the city from garbage. Believers have been nice to get appreciation from the city and a gift from the administration's signature: "In gratitude for a good deed - garbage collection for the benefit of people and nature."
    Signature on a gift from the city administration Jehovah's Witnesses, wherever they live, tend to benefit neighbors not only the spread of Bible knowledge, but also participation in various forms of socially useful activity. The same is citizenship and Dennis Christensen - one of the Oryol Jehovah's Witnesses, who were actively involved in cleaning.Standing foot in cold water Orlik River, it pulled out of a net river trash. All work was carried out free of charge.
    In view of this particularly ironic look that Christensen had almost three weeks languishing in the city jail on false charges of organizing an extremist community. Believers are in disbelief, because, according to city officials, this is the community benefit the city. Garbage collection was the last good thing Dennis that he had to do, while at liberty.
    It is noteworthy that the representative of the administration of the Eagle was sympathetic to Jehovah's Witnesses because of religious persecution in the country and wished them not to lose the power of the spirit.
    https://jw-russia.org/news/17061415-180.html
  4. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Jehovah’s Witnesses refuse to change two-witness rule because ‘that’s our stand’   
    Human standards and practices are always inferior to Jehovah's standards. God's Word endures forever the countries laws that you may follow do not. Jesus said to eat his flesh and blood, but the LAW said that was wrong. Would you obey Jesus and be submissive even if you do not understand the reason for it?
    "All Scripture is inspired of God+and beneficial for teaching,+ for reproving, for setting things straight,* for disciplining in righteousness,+ 17  so that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work." 2 Tim 3:16.
    Be OBEDIENT to those who are taking the lead among you and be SUBMISSIVE" Heb 13:17. 
  5. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Jehovah’s Witnesses refuse to change two-witness rule because ‘that’s our stand’   
    OBEY the Word of God: { WE MUST OBEY GOD AS RULER RATHER THAN MEN}. But some apostates would rather follow men or themselves who are governed by fleshly veiwpoints.
       "I know that after my going away OPPRESSIVE wolves will enter in among you+ and will not TREAT the flock with tenderness, 30  and from among you yourselves men will rise and speak TWISTED  things to draw away the disciples AFTER THEMSELVES". Acts 20:29,30
       "ALL Scripture is inspired of God+and beneficial for teaching,+ for reproving, for SETTING THINGS STRAIGHT,* for disciplining in righteousness,+ 17  so that the man of God may be fully competent, COMPLETELY EQUIPPED for every good work." 2 Tim 3:16.
       Be OBEDIENT to those who are taking the lead among you and be SUBMISSIVE" Heb 13:17. 
     " Do EVERYTHING without COMPLAINING and ARGUING", Phil 2:14 
  6. Downvote
    bruceq reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Jehovah’s Witnesses refuse to change two-witness rule because ‘that’s our stand’   
    A better example is not necessary ... you have confused two different issues.
    Anybody can report a missing person .... even "Bro. Bobby", who in this example SAW me kill "Bro. Jack".
    But if he talks to the Elders first .. he most likely won't go to the Police ... they will talk him out of it so as to not "sully Jehovah's name".
    Keep it hidden, keep it quiet ... that is why as of this date March, 18, 2017 ... the website JW.Org's World News has mentioned nothing, Nothing, NOTHING, NOTHING!, about the Australian Royal commissions investigations  ... NEWS .... Real news.
    Zero, zip, nada, goose eggs ....
    Bro. Bobby is completely free to call the Police and have THEM investigate ANY crime, but because of the Pharisaic APPLICATION of rules that existed thousands of years ago, in a completely different structured civilization and culture, where trials were held in the city gates for all those inside the city and outside the city to be able to see with their own eyes how Justice was administered... we have institutionalized craven cowardice in the REAL application of Justice.
    Justice has become a billion words ... but has also BECOME an extreme rarity in real life, because doing what is RIGHT is never, ever considered .... only what one is FORCED to do. (...PLEASE make us do what is right - GB Geoffery Jackson ....).
    This is not new.
    The Bible records three three Elders that counseled Job in his misery for three days ... but had NOTHING worth recording to say.
    Words, word, and more words ... and Justice is aborted.
    A child molester in the Congregation today with only ONE witness is, and denies it, can retain his congregational standing ... and because the accusations cannot be acted upon, he or she cannot be reported to the police ... by the Elders.
    The instructions are to "Leave it in Jehovah's hands ...".
    This is a CRIMINAL activity ... but in 50 years in over 5,000 cases involving 1,006 alleged perpetrators ... in one country alone, at the "bottom of the world",  the solution was to keep the details hidden in envelopes  in congregational and branch files, and mail copies in special blue envelopes to Bethel in New York.
    Like Nixon's Watergate ... the cover-up is what became global news.
    In the old Soviet Union, the major newspaper was named "PRAVDA" which means "TRUTH".
    All news extolled the wisdom and competence of the Communist leadership, and allegiance and respect for  the good job they were doing.
    Then their administration collapsed of it's own arrogance, and incompetence.

  7. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    No. And I have been asking the same question now I think 5 times without a response. Subject is "Trinity"
    "During World War one or two which side was the Trinity God on?"
    Notice the question deals with two topics both yours and his.
    And the other question was :"If it is right to defend your country then why did Jesus tell Peter not to defend him but to "Return your sword to its place, those who live by the sword will die by the sword"? Mt 26:52.  BTW Your country belongs to Satan just as every other country does.
    However if you wish to change the subject then you may start another post and I may reply if it interests me.
    BTW answering a question with a question is a teaching method used by Jesus. I imitate him sorry if imitating Jesus irritates you.
  8. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    The answer is in the previous post.  Here it is again in case you missed it :"If it is right to defend your country then why did Jesus tell Peter not to defend him but to "Return your sword to its place, those who live by the sword will die by the sword"? Mt 26:52 BTW Your country belongs to Satan just as every other country does. AGAIN see the previous post. 
    I still do not see the answer as to Who's side was the Trinity God on?  Still waiting.
  9. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Since you don't like JW.ORG for some reason  Try these books:
    Christian Neutrality and Jehovah's Witnesses
    God and Man in Washington 
    Beyond Good Intentions 
    Early Christian Attitude to War 
    A History of Christianity 
    It Is Not Lawful For Me To Fight 
    The Court and the Constitution 
    God Versus Ceasar 
    The American Character 
    The Lustre of Our Country 
    On The Road To Civilization 
    Judaism and Christianity in the Age of Constantine 
    Preachers Present Arms [Abrams] 
    World History, the Story of Mans Achievements [Habberton] 
    Christianity and the Roman Government [Hardy] 
    The March of Civilization, Ancient and Medieval World [Wrench] 
    The Church the Gospel and War [Jones] 
    The Ante-Nicene Fathers vol. 3 [Roberts, Donaldson] 
    The Early Fathers on War and Military Service [Swift] 
    Early Church History to the Death of Constantine [Backhouse, Tylor] 
    History of Christianity [Gibbon] 
    A Short Hostory of Rome [Ferrero] 
    The New Worlds Foundations in the Old [West] 
    Those About To Die [Manniz] 
    A History of Christianity [Wolff] 
    Caesar and Christ [Will Durant] 
    Treasury of the Christian World [Nasby] 
    Armed With the Constitution [Newton] 
    State And Salvation  The Jehovah's Witnesses and their Fight For Civil Rights [Kaplan] 
    Varieties of Religious Repression : Why Governments Restrict Religion {Sarkissian} 
    To The Flag The Unlikely History of the Pledge of Alligiance 
    The Courage of Their Convictions 
    Salute! The Case of the Bible VS. The Flag 
    The Supreme Court on Church and State 
    Render Unto Caesar The Flag Salute Controversy 
    Marble Palace The Supreme Court in American Life 
    Religious Freedom : Rights and Liberties Under the Law 
  10. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    The answer is in the previous post.  Here it is again :"If it is right to defend your country then why did Jesus tell Peter not to defend him but to "Return your sword to its place, those who live by the sword will die by the sword"? Mt 26:52 BTW Your country belongs to Satan just as every other country does. AGAIN see the previous post. 
    Jesus gave a NEW Commandment. John 13:34,35
    I did not see the answer as to Who's side was the Trinity God on?  Still waiting.
  11. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    What testimony? They wrote the New Testament. Yet you give us no evidence in Scripture, why?
     Here is a book about the persecution of the early Christians and similarities with Jehovah's Witnesses of today such as with the flag salute and allegiance to the state as similar in Roman times. Note this quote : From Those About to Die, by D.P.Manniz, : “Christians refused to sacrifice to the emperor’s genius—roughly equivalent today to refusing to salute the flag or repeat the oath of allegiance. …Very few of the Christians recanted, although an altar with a fire burning on it was generally kept in the arena for their convenience. All a prisoner had to do was scatter a pinch of incense on the flame and he was given a Certificate of Sacrifice and turned free. It was also carefully explained to him that he was not worshiping the emperor; merely acknowledging the divine character of the emperor as head of the Roman state. Still, almost no Christians availed themselves of the chance to escape.”                 Jehovah's Witnesses just like the first century Christians also do not salute the flag or pledge of allegiance to any country or person other than the Creator. Because of that neutral stand they have been hated and persecuted since World War 1 and through the holocaust of Nazi Germany and in many countries even today such as in South Korea where every Witness male upon reaching the age of 18 are automatically put in prison because they refuse to join the military.           Jesus said that true Christians would be identified by the love they would have among themselves. John 13:34,35. Christianity is a global religion, if one country went to war against another one then Christians would be killing there own brothers such as Catholics and Protestants have done in the World Wars. That is why Jehovah's Witnesses do not get involved or fight for any nation for their allegiance is to God alone and His Kingdom not any bickering government of this earth.    Jesus told us the identifying mark of his true disciples would be that they would have "love among themselves" Jn. 13:34,35. Ask yourself does it show love to slaughter your brother from another religion or even your own religion on the battlefield? What if your government told you to defend its country by fighting against others of your own faith : Catholic verses Catholic, Protestant verses Protestant, Muslims, Hindus ....If it is right to defend your country then why did Jesus tell Peter not to defend him but to "Return your sword to its place, those who live by the sword will die by the sword"? Mt 26:52. Ask yourself the next time there is a war such as during WW1 or WW2 or any war since where Catholics and Protestants killed each other on both sides - WHICH SIDE WAS GOD ON ???? Obviously neither for this world, its religions, nationalism, materialism Governments are all being mislead by Satan the Devil. Revelation 12:9 says : "the one called Devil  and Satan,  who is misleading the entire inhabited earth."   Jesus also clearly shows us John 17:16:  "They are no part of the world, just as I [Jesus] am no part of the world." John 6:15: "Jesus, knowing they [the Jews] were about to come and seize him to make him king, withdrew again into the mountain all alone." Later, he told the Roman governor: "My kingdom is no part of this world. If my kingdom were part of this world, my attendants would have fought that I should not be delivered up to the Jews. But, as it is, my kingdom is not from this source."-John 1836. Jas. 4:4: "Adulteresses, do you not know that the friendship with the world is enmity with God? Whoever, therefore, wants to be a friend of the world is constituting himself an enemy of God." (Why is the matter so serious? Because, as 1 John 5:19 says, "the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one." At John 14:30, Jesus referred to Satan as being "the ruler of the world." So, no matter what worldly faction a person might support, under whose control would he really come?)
  12. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    For answers to any questions please see JW.ORG.
    I did not see the answer as to Who's side was the Trinity God on? 
  13. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Jehovah's Witnesses believe in the divinity of Christ. I have no problem with Jesus being called "God" with a capital "G".{RS pg. 426}  But the Jewish Bible Writers do not believe in a TRINITY.  .. Try again.  
  14. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Any form of "Christianity" they would have converted to may have been a "counterfeit" form of Christianity. How do we know your religion is counterfeit if it looks real? Jesus said "by their fruits you would recognize them" Mt.7 and "By this all will know that you are MY DISCIPLES if you have LOVE among yourselves". Jn 13:35
      I have seen many Trinitarians during war fighting against other Trinitarians Catholics killing Catholics, Protestants killing Protestants during the World Wars both saying the Trinity God was on their side. Who's side was God on? I guess according to your belief one part of the Trinity was on one side and another part of your Trinity was on the other side and the third one must have been a referee. As Jesus said it is actually quite easy to see False Religion.
     I have no problem with Jesus being called "God" with a capital "G". But the Jewish Bible Writers do not believe in a Trinity. And I noticed no Scripture from you to indicate otherwise. {Pg. 213 Rs"}.
  15. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Yup, I sure hope I am not one flesh with my wife!  AND are we not made in God's image. That would make ALL of us Trinities or maybe multiple personalities. LOL
  16. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    I had a Bible study that once said that the Bible condoned drug abuse. He used the Scripture that said "Stephen was stoned". Now you can see how Trinitarians try so hard to use that same kind of reasoning about  something that the Bible writers did not themselves even believe in. "Father Son and spirit are mentioned together means they are the same", by that reasoning "Abraham, Issac and Jacob" are also mentioned together several times does that mean they are all the same being? And BTW those three men were all JEWS and JEWS do not believe in God as a Trinity. {Shema Deut 6:4}.
  17. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Perfect. Thank you, I checked and those Bible writers were Matthew and Paul. Both of them were JEWS who do not believe in a Trinity, why Paul even tells you the tribe he was from which would explain why neither of them ever used the word "Trinity" or anything else to prove a doctrine they themselves did not even believe in. So I am afraid you will have to choose another Scripture from God's Word.
  18. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    They were "no part of the world" as Jesus said which includes false beliefs of religion ,politics...Jon 17. Since your on this subject : Why do Trinitarians who believe in the same God kill other Trinitarians who believe in that God? Does your God condone you killing each other?
  19. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    LOL. Try the BIBLE. Instead of apostate Christians many years after the  Bible was written who burned at the stake anyone who did not believe as they did about God.  Its not rocket science here. If your trying to prove something is in the BIBLE then use the BIBLE ! 
    Ask yourself:  Why did I need to go a hundred years AFTER the Bible was written to find a teaching that is SUPPOSE to actually be IN THE BIBLE??? If a teaching is in the Bible then you should not HAVE to go elsewhere to get it.
  20. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Very good point. After all if the Trinity was in the Bible in the first place then NO ONE would have tried to put it there by a forgery. Which of course proves it is not in the Bible. {Yet that is not the only Bible Scripture found only in the King James and Catholic Douay Bibles that was added by a scribe trying to support the Trinity}.
        Interestingly there are no spurious Scriptures trying to support the Resurrection. Why? Because it is taught in the Bible. There are no spurious Scriptures trying to support Baptism. Why? Because it is taught in the Bible. Yet there are about a dozen trying to support the idea of a Trinity that are only in a couple of Translations from 1610, 1611C.E. that have been proven by scholars to be spurious!!!
        This line of reasoning can also be applied to Evolution. Back in the early 20th Century scientists discovered the "Piltdown Man" but 40 years later it was discovered to have been a forgery by a Scientist trying to prove evolution of humans. Now ponder : Why if evolution was true and a fact would someone create a forgery to prove it? If it was a fact then no one would.  There are no Scientific forgeries for other things like "gravity". So the very proponents of evolution have exposed  that false teaching just as Christendom's scribes have exposed the false doctrine of the Trinity.
  21. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Probably none since the "texts" from the BIBLE were written all by Jews and Jews do not believe in your Trinity God. But please try anyway.
     Cos said:
    Irenaeus (120-202) "For I have shown from the scriptures, that no one of the sons of Adam is as to everything, and absolutely, called God, or named Lord. But that He is Himself in His own right, beyond all men who ever lived, God, and Lord, and King Eternal, and the Incarnate Word, proclaimed by all the prophets, the apostles, and by the Spirit Himself, may be seen by all who have attained to even a small portion of the truth. Now, the scriptures would not have testified these things of Him, if, like others, He had been a mere man.” (Against Heresies, book 3, chapter 19)
     
    Tertullian (155-220) "Thus the connection of the Father in the Son, and of the Son in the Paraclete, produces three coherent Persons, who are yet distinct One from Another. These Three are, one essence, not one Person” (Against Praxeas, chapter 25)
     
    Hippolytus  (170-235) “A man, therefore, even though he will it not, is compelled to acknowledge God the Father Almighty, and Christ Jesus the Son of God, who, being God, became man, to whom also the Father made all things subject, Himself excepted, and the Holy Spirit; and that these, therefore, are three.” (Against The Heresy Of One Noetus, section 8)
     
    This is just a few examples of what the early Christians believed
    These were not the Jewish Bible Writers, I noticed you had to go a hundred or so years after the Bible was written to find anything. . Try again PLEASE.
  22. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Sorry but no one can use this Scripture to defend a doctrine the writer as a Jew did not believe in. If he did perhaps he would have used the word "Trinity" in the Scripture but I checked the 110 different Translations in my library and NONE of them say "Trinity" here since the writer was a Jew and they do not believe in Trinities.  PLEASE try a different Scripture. Thanks.
  23. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    So if the Trinity God was on the winning side then why was he fighting against Trinitarians during World War I and II?
    Or was it just part of your God fighting against the other part.
  24. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    John was a Jew and Jews do not believe in a Trinity so using John to try and prove your point is pointless to say the least. That is like me trying to use your words to show that you believe something that you know you do not believe in. .
  25. Upvote
    bruceq reacted to bruceq in Early Christians Believed in the Trinity   
    Of course I believe in the divinity of Jesus but not the Trinity of him. Because John and other Bible Writers were not Trinitarians.
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