JW Insider

Before taking this story seriously, I'd like to see Putin brag about it himself somewhere. This is exactly the kind of thing that war-mongers and regime-change-mongers monger for. Daily and nightly we see two or three major USA media outlets hawk for some kind of war against Russia in vicarious support of the person who came in second in our last presidential election.
She apparently would have wanted it that way if she won, and the 52% (or so) of Americans that wanted her to win apparently think it would be poetic justice against Trump's imagined Russian friends [if we could start a war].

2 Corinthians 2:3,4: "Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of tender mercies and the God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our trials so that we may be able to comfort others in any sort of trial with the comfort that we receive from God."
 What a wonderful arrangement. 

Thank you for posting such a lovely poem.  I can relate to this poem very well.  Recently (within the last few years) I was in a deep depression.  I would go to meeting arriving just as the song started, sit in the back and leave as soon as the last song and prayer were over.  I didn't have the capacity to visit and the noise afterwards was very overwhelming.   I just wanted to be in the "Satan Free Zone" as I call our meetings.   There were new friends who had moved in and probably thought I was disfellowshipped.  I was visited by 2 sisters while out in service and also the brothers made a point of visiting me on a couple of occasions.  I poured out my heart to them and they were so kind and put no pressure on me, just let me know I was valuable to Jehovah, Jesus and the congregation using scriptures and gentle words.   I love them for that, that is true shepherding (sisters included).  I have recovered now and try to pay-it-forward in service and to my brothers and sisters; giving hugs and kind words seasoned with a sense of humor when appropriate.   I make it a point to look for those who don't feel included so that I can share the love I have with them so that it may encourage them to keep going.   Why should we only be searching for sheep to come through the front door when we are losing so many out the back door?  

So sorry. I was concerned about the source, and KNEW instantly that it was not from an apostate source. In fact, it sounded familiar. You probably know that there are a couple of Witnesses who write some very good poetry from the heart. They share their poems on facebook pages and probably some other Witness-run web pages.
As JTR said, it wouldn't matter if this was found on an apostate web page, and I would not have been concerned if you had found it there, either. That's because I can tell you have such a good heart and a kind of youthful excitement about the Christian brotherhood (and "sisterhood") even though you also have a spiritual maturity at the same time. So I suspect you are pretty much immune to things that might disappoint and discourage other people.
I think you are doing a great job of putting up great positive items of interest. I have a background that includes being an researcher, editor, proofreader, so I'm sorry if it looks like I focus on mistakes. It's been my "job" since I was 19 years old, and I stayed in related occupations for nearly 30 of the next 40 years.
I didn't see any silly or weird mistakes in what you posted, although it would have been better if you had said "source unknown" because it looks like you are saying that you were the source when you give no other.

Many muslim woman who tried to divorce their husbands have been killed in honor killings -  they commit suicide under direction of husband or family members. So if she does show her face this may even happen sooner.....  This is a dilemma... these judges should also study Sharia to know what they are doing..... because this woman could lose her life.   She is already walking on thin ice....  If they know sharia they will also not try to implement it like some schools in Australia are doing.....  Lobbying for Sharia in law schools.

I used to when I was a teenager. Spontaneous drop ins were great as there was an excuse to take a break from homework or some other mundane task! But now our lives are so planned out, even our relaxation time, that any interruption is not really welcomed especially if you have no time to prepare physically or mentally. I thought I would personally kill the two elders that "dropped in while passing by" after I had had sinus surgery and looked like I had been severely beaten up. I was resting on my chaise, still partially drugged up,  and lo and behold, I see these two guys walking past my window. Normally I wouldn't have answered the door, but the combination of the hydrocodone and my fuzzy mind, I thought it was something important, I had no idea it was going to be one of our elders and the CO! I hadn't told anyone about the surgery, and they must have wondered why I was absent for his visit, plus it was raining and they were looking for things to do, lol. Anyway, the week after that I took that elder aside and wagging my finger at him  I jokingly but seriously told him to never ever do that to me again! I think because they are guys, brothers don't understand that women like to put themselves together before accepting visitors.

Surprisingly there are many people who do enjoy that, but like you Anna I personally am not one of them. My wife and I love our brothers and sisters and enjoy their company, but when we get home from a day of service, we just want to chill or use what little time is left to get stuff done. "Dropping by unannounced" is not something I've ever been cool with - although I know many others are. If someone drives past my house without "just dropping by," I view that as an act of consideration toward me - it's not too much to ask for a brief text or phone call first to ensure it's not an inopportune time. It's happened on more than one occasion for example that it's well into the evening, we have finished supper and I'm sitting on my lounger watching a favourite TV show in my PJ's with a remote in one hand and a glass of Scotch in the other...knock, knock, ding, dong...family with kids in tow "just drops by" = awkward.  

Thanks for your compassionate comments, dear brothers & sisters.
I understand you very well;  we are all imperfect and can't watching anywhere!
We also have a bad phase and need it,  maybe some nice words or some help....
We live in an evil world and unfortunately make mistakes again and again!
I know some problems from my congregation too. Many brothers showing love, but some can't do, thats fact.
But if EVERYBODY  tries, love can grow
Let's pray for more love in our congregation and let's try watching more with our hearts ❤ 
( Jehovah will be happy...)
In this sense,  my best wishes to ALL

Yes. I understand it's a common belief, found in many of the modern commentaries. This particular verse has been suspected of textual tampering from the earliest years of textual study and criticism. The problem is that the kind of criticism that would allow us to claim that this particular verse has been tampered with comes along with a lot of "baggage" that would ask us to pick and choose which of hundreds of other verses and passages supposedly "evolved" over the first two or even three centuries after they were first written. We become selective about which passages we believe are correct and which were added or adjusted. We might end up cherry-picking our own favorite themes and doctrines that tickle our ears, and ignore important teachings we don't like.
Textual criticism results in more accurate Bible manuscripts, and the Watch Tower Society relies heavily on textual criticism (done by others) as the apparatus behind choosing an accurate Greek text of the New Testament. But taken to an extreme, the full study of textual criticism also leads to the potential problem of accepting that nearly half the books of the New Testament were not written as eye-witness accounts in the case of the gospels, but versions of prior documents like "Q" and Mark, and that if half of Paul's letters, really are from the apostle Paul then the other half are probably not from Paul at all, they say, based on textual and content clues. They would claim to show that the writer of John could not have been the same as the writer of Revelation. The same sources that claim that Matthew 28 contains glosses would allow us to dismiss 1 and 2 Peter as books from the second century. And hundreds of other supposed "facts" that would weaken our ability to base much of anything on the Bible itself. We would all be on our own trying to determine which of the inspired utterances were really true or not.
Of course, we have no problem with the value of such studies to determine facts about the apocrypha, the Dead Sea Scrolls, the pseudepigrapha, the Elephantine papyri, or the Gnostic papyri, but some things are still sacrosanct. There is value in such studies, only up to a point.

I'm sure Shiwiii was referring to the following, which we sometimes refer to as the "J-documents:"
*** nwtsty C4 Translations and Reference Works Supporting the Use of the Divine Name in the “New Testament” ***
Translations and Reference Works Supporting the Use of the Divine Name in the “New Testament”
Below is a partial listing of Bible translations and reference works that have used some form of the divine name in what is commonly called the New Testament.
J1
Gospel of Matthew, in Hebrew, edited by J. du Tillet, with a Latin translation by J. Mercier, Paris, 1555.
J2
Hebrew Gospel of Matthew, incorporated as a separate chapter in ʼEʹven boʹchan [“Tried Stone”], by Shem-Tob ben Isaac Ibn Shaprut, 1385. Edition: The Gospel of Matthew According to a Primitive Hebrew Text, by George Howard, Macon, Georgia, U.S.A., 1987.
J3
Gospel of Matthew and Letter to the Hebrews, in Hebrew and Latin, by Sebastian Münster, Basel, 1537 and 1557 respectively.
J4
Gospel of Matthew, in Hebrew, by J. Quinquarboreus, Paris, 1551.
J5
Liturgical Gospels, in Hebrew, by F. Petri, Antwerp, 1581.
J6
Liturgical Gospels, in German, Latin, Greek, and Hebrew, by Johann Clajus, Leipzig, 1576.
J7
New Testament, in 12 languages, including Hebrew, by Elias Hutter, Nuremberg, 1599-1600.
J8
New Testament, in Hebrew, by William Robertson, London, 1661.
J9
The Four Gospels, in Hebrew and Latin, by Giovanni Battista Jona, Rome, 1668.
J10
The New Testament . . . , in Hebrew and English, by Richard Caddick, Vols. I-III, containing the Gospel of Matthew to 1 Corinthians, London, 1798-1805.
J11
New Testament, in Hebrew, by Thomas Fry and others, London, 1817.
J12
New Testament, in Hebrew, by William Greenfield, London, 1831.
J13
New Testament, in Hebrew, by A. McCaul, M. S. Alexander, J. C. Reichardt, and S. Hoga, London, 1838.
J14
New Testament, in Hebrew, by J. C. Reichardt, London, 1846.
J15
Bible books of Luke, Acts, Romans, and Hebrews, in Hebrew, by J.H.R. Biesenthal, Berlin, 1855, 1867, 1853, and 1858 respectively.
J16
New Testament, in Hebrew, by J. C. Reichardt and J.H.R. Biesenthal, London, 1866.
J17
New Testament, in Hebrew, by Franz Delitzsch, London, (1981 Edition).
J18
New Testament, in Hebrew, by Isaac Salkinson and C. D. Ginsburg, London, 1891.
J19
Gospel of John, in Hebrew, by Moshe I. Ben Maeir, Denver, Colorado, 1957.
J20
A Concordance to the Greek Testament, by W. F. Moulton and A. S. Geden, Fourth Edition, Edinburgh, 1963.
J21
The Emphatic Diaglott, (Greek-English interlinear), by Benjamin Wilson, New York, 1864, reprint by Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society, Brooklyn, 1942.
J22
New Testament, in Hebrew, by United Bible Societies, Jerusalem, 1979.
J23
New Testament, in Hebrew, by J. Bauchet and D. Kinnereth (Arteaga), Rome, 1975.
J24
A Literal Translation of the New Testament . . . From the Text of the Vatican Manuscript, by Herman Heinfetter, London, 1863.
J25
St. Paul’s Epistle to the Romans, by W. G. Rutherford, London, 1900.
J26
Bible book of Psalms and Gospel of Matthew 1:1–3:6, in Hebrew, by Anton Margaritha, Leipzig, 1533.
J27
Die heilige Schrift des neuen Testaments, by Dominik von Brentano, Third Edition, Vienna and Prague, 1796.
J28
The New Covenant Commonly Called the New Testament—Peshitta Aramaic Text With a Hebrew Translation, published by The Bible Society, Jerusalem, 1986.
J29
The Original Aramaic New Testament in Plain English (An American Translation of the Aramaic New Testament), by Glenn David Bauscher, published by Lulu Publishing, 2012.
J30
The Aramaic English New Testament, (Third Edition), by Andrew Gabriel Roth, United States, 2008.
J31
The Hebraic Roots Bible, (with study notes), published by Word of Truth Publications, 2012.
J32
The Holy Name Bible, revised by A. B. Traina, The Scripture Research Association, Inc., reprinted by Yahshua Promotions, 2012.
J33
The Christian’s Bible—New Testament, by George N. LeFevre, 1928, (George N. LeFevre, Strasburg, PA).
J34
The Idiomatic Translation of the New Testament, by William Graham MacDonald, 2009 electronic version.
J35
Nkand’a Nzambi i sia vo Luwawanu Luankulu Y’olu Luampa, (The Bible in Kikongo), published by United Bible Societies, Nairobi, Kenya, 2004.
J36
Bibel Barita Na Uli Hata Batak-Toba siganup ari, (Today’s Batak-Toba Version), published by Lembaga Alkitab Indonesia, Jakarta, Indonesia, 1989.
J37
Arorutiet ne Leel ne bo: Kiptaiyandennyo Jesu Kristo Yetindennyo, (New Testament in Kalenjin), Bible Society in East Africa, Nairobi, Kenya, 1968.
J38
Ekonejeu Kabesi ni Dokuj Iesu Keriso, (in Nengone), London, 1870.
J39
Jesu Keriso ve Evanelia Toaripi uri, (The Four Gospels in Toaripi), British and Foreign Bible Society, London, 1902, translated by J. H. Holmes.
J40
Öbufa Testament Öböñ ye Andinyaña nyïn Jesus Christ, (in Efik), National Bible Society of Scotland, Edinburgh, 1949.
J41
Testament Sefa an amam Samol o Rȧn Amanau Jisos Kraist: auili jonai kapas an re kris uili nanai kapas an mortlok, (in Mortlockese), American Bible Society, New York, 1905, by Robert W. Logan.
J42
Ama-Lémrane̱ Ama-Fu ma O̱-Rábbu de̱ O̱-Fū́tia-Ka-Su Yī́sua Masī́a, (Temne New Testament), British and Foreign Bible Society, London, 1868.
J43
The Gospels According to Matthew and John, (Translated out of the Greek into the language of Nguna), New Hebrides, British and Foreign Bible Society, London, 1882.
J44
The New Testament of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, (Translated into the Indian language), (in Wampanoag), Printed by Samuel Green and Marmaduke Johnson, Cambridge, 1661.
J45
Matīyū: Kū Nam Navosavos ugi, (in Eromanga), Printed in London, 1869.
J46
La Bible traduite et présentée par André Chouraqui, (in French), translated by André Chouraqui, 1985.
J47
Biblia Peshitta en Español, (in Spanish), translated by Antiguos Manuscritos Arameos, Broadman and Holman Publishing Group, Nashville, TN, 2006.
J48
The New Testament of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, (Translated into the Choctaw language), American Bible Society, New York, 1968 reprint.
J49
Bosakú-W’ólótsi wa Yesu Masiya boki Matayo la Malako o Kótaka, (Translated into Lomóngo by A. & L. R.), Congo Balolo Mission, Upper Congo, 1905.
J50
Nalologena wo se Yesu Kristo Kome Mataio, (The Gospel according to Matthew in the language of Tasiko, Epi, New Hebrides), British and Foreign Bible Society, London, 1892.
J51
The Restored New Testament, Willis Barnstone, published by W. W. Norton & Company, New York, NY, 2009.
J52
Messianic Jewish Shared Heritage Bible, The Messianic Jewish Family Bible Project, Destiny Image Publishers, Shippensberg, PA, 2012.
J53
The Messages of Jesus According to the Synoptists (The Discourses of Jesus in the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke) by Thomas Cuming Hall, 1901.
J54
Bibel, (Nauru Bible), The Bible Society in the South Pacific, Suva, Fiji, 2005 printing.
J55
Embimbiliya Li Kola, (in Umbundu), Sociedade Bíblica em Angola, Luanda, 1963.
J56
Ka Baibala Hemolele, (Hawaiian Bible), 1948.
J57
Te Nu Tetemanti, ae ana Taeka Ara Uea ao ara Tia Kamaiu are Iesu Kristo, ae Kaetaki man Taetaen Erene, (in Kiribati), 1901.
J58
The Gospel According to S. Luke in the Tongue of Lonwolwol (Fanting), Ambrym, New Hebrides, The British and Foreign Bible Society, 1899.
J59
Intas-Etipup Mat u Iesu Kristo, Natimarid Uja, im Natimi Imyiatamaig Caija, Aneityum, New Hebrides, 1863.
J60
The Bible in Cherokee, American Bible Society, New York, 1860.
J61
Ntestamente Yipia ya Nkambo Wetu ni Mupurushi Yesu Kristu, (in Chiluva), The National Bible Society of Scotland, 1904.
J62
Injili Mar Mathayo (The Gospel According to St. Matthew in Dholuo), British and Foreign Bible Society, 1914.
[Footnote]
Also called the Christian Greek Scriptures.
 

We don't know exactly what happened. I'm just saying you have to be careful with this kind of textual criticism, because it can ultimately turn the Scriptures into "Swiss cheese." It has a certain value, but we should always work from as many kinds of evidence as we can draw upon before stating that a conclusion is a fact.
In this case, we need to look at the circumstance of the statement, too. Also, you left out many additional scriptures that have a bearing on what baptism would mean to the first century Christians. I won't make that list here, but you or someone could create a baptism topic if you wish to discuss it further. I think that the context of some of these might shed some light on the addition of "Holy Spirit" and I think it's possible that Acts 8:12, which you quoted, is a fair "expanded" explanation of the meaning of putting all three together in Matthew 28:
(Matthew 3:1-3) . . .In those days John the Baptist came preaching in the wilderness of Ju·deʹa, 2 saying: “Repent, for the Kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.” 3 This, in fact, is the one spoken of through Isaiah the prophet in these words: “A voice of one calling out in the wilderness: ‘Prepare the way of Jehovah! Make his roads straight.’”
(Matthew 3:11) I, for my part, baptize you with water because of your repentance, but the one coming after me is stronger than I am, whose sandals I am not worthy to take off. That one will baptize you with holy spirit and with fire.
(Acts 19:1-6) . . .There he found some disciples 2 and said to them: “Did you receive holy spirit when you became believers?” They replied to him: “Why, we have never heard that there is a holy spirit.” 3 So he said: “In what, then, were you baptized?” They said: “In John’s baptism.” 4 Paul said: “John baptized with the baptism in symbol of repentance, telling the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” 5 On hearing this, they got baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 And when Paul laid his hands on them, the holy spirit came upon them,. . .
(Acts 10:36-38) 36 He sent out the word to the sons of Israel to declare to them the good news of peace through Jesus Christ—this one is Lord of all. 37 You know the subject that was talked about throughout all Ju·deʹa, starting from Galʹi·lee after the baptism that John preached: 38 about Jesus who was from Nazʹa·reth, how God anointed him with holy spirit and power,. . .
John's baptism focused on the Kingdom of God. Jesus came to allow entrance into the Kingdom of God. Jesus taught us to pray: "Father...Let your Kingdom come!" The good news of peace through Jesus Christ was the good news of the Kingdom of God.
(Matthew 24:14) . . .And this good news of the Kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth . . .
(Matthew 28:18, 19) . . .“All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. 19 Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them . . .
With all that in mind, I now read Acts 8:12 highlighting each of the major points from the context:
(Acts 8:11-17) . . .. 12 But when they believed Philip, who was declaring the good news of the Kingdom of God and of the name of Jesus Christ, both men and women were getting baptized. 13 Simon himself also became a believer, and after being baptized, he continued with Philip; and he was amazed at seeing the signs and great powerful works taking place. 14 When the apostles in Jerusalem heard that Sa·marʹi·a had accepted the word of God, they sent Peter and John to them; 15 and these went down and prayed for them to get holy spirit. 16 For it had not yet come upon any one of them, but they had only been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 17 Then they laid their hands on them, and they began to receive holy spirit.
Notice that baptism in the name of Jesus Christ was NOT enough. Making disciples meant baptism in the holy spirit, too. And to what end? That they can now enter the Kingdom of God the Father now being ruled by his beloved Son.
(Colossians 1:13-2:12) 13 He [the Father, God] rescued us from the authority of the darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14 by means of whom we have our release by ransom, the forgiveness of our sins. 15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation; 16 because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. . . .  22 he has now reconciled by means of that one’s fleshly body through his death, in order to present you holy and unblemished and open to no accusation before him— 23 provided, of course, that you continue in the faith, established on the foundation and steadfast, not being shifted away from the hope of that good news that you heard and that was preached in all creation under heaven. . . .25 I [Paul] became a minister of this congregation in accord with the stewardship from God that was given to me in your behalf to preach the word of God fully, . . . 27 to whom God has been pleased to make known among the nations the glorious riches of this sacred secret, which is Christ in union with you, the hope of his glory. . . .  in order to gain an accurate knowledge of the sacred secret of God, namely, Christ. . . .. 12 For you were buried with him in his baptism, and by your relationship with him you were also raised up together through your faith in the powerful work of God, who raised him up from the dead.
 
 
 

GP, I have to admit that I probably am not understanding all your points, and for that I apologize up front.
Starting with the question I just requoted, I agree with what the Watchtower has said about the resurrection of Christ and the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE. I don't see any question here that is related to the discussion.
I assumed by the word incumbent, you meant "one holding a current office" an office of "kingship" in this case. Of course, I also assume that you will continue to ignore the verse in 1 Timothy that claims that Jesus was already holding the office of kingship. So I think this is a question you don't really wish to respond to, and that might explain why the second sentence doesn't seem to make any relevant point.
I suppose that's a possibility. I don't believe it's that simple. But even if it were, it would still be a lesson for those of us in expectation of a future visitation of judgment upon the entire system of things.
(Romans 15:4) 4 For all the things that were written beforehand were written for our instruction, so that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope.
(1 Corinthians 10:6-11) . . .Now these things became examples for us, in order for us not to desire injurious things, as they desired them. 7 Neither become idolaters, as some of them did; just as it is written: “The people sat down to eat and drink. Then they got up to have a good time.” 8 Neither let us practice sexual immorality, as some of them committed sexual immorality, only to fall, 23,000 of them in one day. 9 Neither let us put Jehovah to the test, as some of them put him to the test, only to perish by the serpents. 10 Neither be murmurers, as some of them murmured, only to perish by the destroyer. 11 Now these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for a warning to us upon whom the ends of the systems of things have come.
Curious use of the plural "ends of the systems of things" in verse 11.
However, I believe the Watchtower is correct when it points out that Revelation must have been written closer to 99 CE, and this therefore is a strong clue that the prophecy was not completely fulfilled upon Jerusalem in 70 CE. In fact, the best evidence of this is the fact that Revelation 11:2,3 references the very same phrase that Jesus used about "Jerusalem being trampled underfoot by the Gentiles," in Luke 21:24, and Revelation ties it to a specific length of the "Gentile Times." It's the only other verse in the whole Bible that mentions these same "Gentile Times" and yet this verse was studiously ignored in that context from the very first article Russell published in 1876 right up the very last articles published on the subject in the last few months. 140 years of ignoring the only verse in the Bible that puts a length to Luke 21:24. It seems obviously that it's because it says that these Gentile Times are not "7 times" in length. Do you have another explanation?
Based on the rest of your comments I think you are making the following argument:
If Jesus' prophecy was about 70 CE, then it must have ONLY been about 70 CE, and could have no application to a future date. Therefore, anyone who thinks Jesus was talking about 70 CE, needs to prove that everything happened in 70 CE (or by 70 CE).
The reason I thought that sounded so odd from someone who has presented himself as one of Jehovah's Witnesses is that the Watchtower has already printed many articles showing that Jesus prophecy had a dual fulfillment. And for most JWs, it would even be damaging to the way that many utilize the Daniel 4 tree dream. If it was fulfilled upon Nebuchadnezzar then you are not allowed to speak about a future fulfillment?

I appreciate your position on these chronology issues. I held on to some of them just as strongly as you from the time I was four until I was nearly twenty-four. I might have still been hanging on to them, even now, if it weren't for the fact that my assignment at Bethel put me right next to a member of the Governing Body (B.Schroeder) who had his own questions, and who also lashed out at others who had questions about them. While looking for solutions to some of these same questions, I became friends with other researchers, especially three non-GB brothers who had been the Writing Department's team researching articles for the "Aid Book" (now "Insight"). Some of them had been asked to look over the initial manuscript from an elder in Sweden, who had done a lot of research himself. The brother who assigned my research projects only showed me portions of it, and I didn't see the whole thing until another Brother, (F.Rusk) let me see it as he was working on it. This brother (Rusk) also gave the main part of my wedding talk (with the vows), and one of the brothers from the Aid Book research team also gave 30 minutes of my wedding talk.
But this manuscript, now a book, was of very little interest to me, because it was mostly about archaeological reasons not to try to "anchor" anything on 607. I was only interested in Bible topics, and didn't really think that counted. I don't think I would have necessarily discovered any of this on my own, and therefore I probably wouldn't even be here if it were not for discovering that several members of the Governing Body, and several members of the Writing Department also had doubts and questions about 1914 and related chronology issues, from a Biblical perspective.
So, now that you have impugned and imputed motives for me, I will let what you know what my real primary motives are:
Love of the Truth, Love for the whole association of brothers, A clean conscience, Of course, I realize you probably don't believe this, and further, you probably could not admit that you believed it if even you knew it was true. I'd prefer to assume that you are like me, when I was in your shoes, and preferred not to think about such questions, and assumed that anyone who asked me to think too strongly about such questions was some kind of apostate.
But, I can also explain why I have presented what I have on this particular forum. A conversation or presentation of information about the topic, still cannot happen in a normal congregation setting. This doesn't mean that it is not important to question. It is your Christian duty to question every claim, at least if you wish to be noble-minded.
I think that most of us who are willing to open up about these questions online all realize that we can't do this in our congregations, and yet we also realize that it is important to question. In a forum like this, where ideas can be exchanged, and challenged, we are also able to question without the same kind of effect that it would have inside the congregation. That's because no one needs to believe that we are sincere, if they don't want to. It's easy to dismiss any challenge by just saying things like: "I don't believe it;" "I don't want to look at the evidence;" "I think anyone who questions such things is probably an apostate." No one need be stumbled, because such information and questions are already all over the internet. 
Yet from the perspective of a Witness who has such a question, on a forum, they can ask any question and it is technically no different from any other person on the street asking such a question. Someone can say Trinity is taught in the Bible, and we can either defend our belief, ignore it, assume the person is sincere, assume the person is insincere, assume they are an ex-JW who has gone back like a dog to his vomit, assume they are just like a neighbor we met in service last week, assume they are dishonest, assume they are honest --- the point is that it doesn't matter. They are online, and we are online too. Therefore we are all subject to the rough and tumble world of online discussion -- a forum for ideas.
We can't claim we are stumbled by a non-Witness we meet at the door who could ask the very same question. Yet, they might have read about our belief in an apostate book or from an apostate site. In fact, a sincere non-JW we meet at the door, may be sincerely curious about whether or not something he or she read or heard is true or not. We could always just say: "Oh, we don't answer that particular question because it was once asked by an apostate." We don't think of doing that for questions about hell-fire or Trinity, or neutrality yet many of us are instantly inclined to respond like that if the question is about 1874, 1925, 1975, pyramids, miracle wheat, Hitler.
In fact, I've noticed that we are usually quite willing to discuss 1914 and its repercussions on other doctrines until WE start realizing that the questions are difficult. At that point, we tend to assume the question is no longer sincere, but is some kind of attack. And that's only based on the level of difficulty. We don't generally start lashing out and making accusations when we feel that our foundation is more solid, as it is on Trinity, hell-fire, neutrality, war, etc.
Now I admit that I made it easy for anyone who is uncomfortable to back away from the conversation when I mentioned the "deception" that invariably accompanies chronology doctrines, especially as time goes on, and no one wants to display their dirty laundry. This is a surprising point to a lot of people but it's easy to find the evidence. How many times have you heard or read something in the Watch Tower publications that sounded like this:  "Decades in advance, the Bible Students as Jehovah's Witnesses were known at the time, announced that 1914 would see the start of a great time of trouble." This has never been true. Decades in advance, 1914 was seen as the END of a great time of trouble not the beginning.
The July 15, 1894, Watch Tower said:
"But bear in mind that the end of 1914 is not the date for the beginning, but for the end of the time of trouble."
Granted, an adjustment to the doctrine occurred one decade prior to 1914, but not "decades" and it was not consistently held to for that entire decade in any case. This could be an honest mistake, even though it has been made at least a dozen times, but it still deceives people into thinking that it's a true statement. However, if we KNOW this, then we should renounce any association with such a claim for the sake of our conscience:
(2 Corinthians 4:2) But we have renounced the shameful, underhanded things, not walking with cunning or adulterating the word of God; but by making the truth manifest, we recommend ourselves to every human conscience in the sight of God.
However, my main goal here is not to highlight the "deceptions." These occur almost naturally and should be expected. My goal is to open up the discussion so that if it is wrong, or I am going down the wrong track, I can be corrected. If there is more to learn on the subject (and for me there is more to learn on any subject) the ideas are out there for anyone who is concerned to add to the discussion, and point out what's wrong. If we have questions on such a serious subject we should not keep them to ourselves, and we should not hold back from asking. We should test every expression, even if we feel it is as good as inspired. (1 Jn 4:1; 2 Th 2:2) It would be underhanded for us to keep such things hidden.
(Mark 4:22) 22 For there is nothing hidden that will not be exposed; nothing is carefully concealed that will not come out in the open.
I was also hoping to find others who might be willing to discuss some of these issues out in the open, and this has already occurred. There are several people who appear willing to discuss it further and I am very interested learning from their views. (Especially on Revelation 11 and 12 with @ComfortMyPeople since I think he has given this more thought than I have.) If you are not interested any further on this type of discussion, and that's your choice, of course.  But I'm sure you'd have something worth considering if you did participate.

You highlighted the above portion of the Insight article. But notice that Hebrews speaks about the same combination of both King and Priest and says:
(Hebrews 8:1) . . .Now this is the main point of what we are saying: We have such a high priest as this, and he has sat down at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens,
Notice that the verse puts it in the past tense, that Jesus already filled this combination position being both a priest and already sitting on the throne. This was the main point of what he was saying! That's what made the manner of Jesus' priesthood different from the manner of Aaron, but the same as the manner of Melchizedek, king of righteousness and king of peace.

Response: This is a very strange claim from someone who appears to be one of Jehovah's Witnesses. Jesus was the one who said he was speaking about Jerusalem. And the Watchtower has even made a video showing that first-century Christians knew that it was about Jerusalem. It followed a passage about a judgment visitation upon Jerusalem at the end of Matthew 23. It's the answer to a question the disciples had about 'when these stones would actually come tumbling down and no stone be left upon another one.' They had been pointing to the literal stones of the temple buildings.
I suppose you are focusing mostly on the term "great earthquakes" in Luke's version of the Olivet Sermon. Luke's version even adds the phrase "When you see Jerusalem surrounded by encamped armies." etc. So why do you think there were no great earthquakes that they might hear about? Luke also wrote Acts and he says:
(Acts 16:26) 26 Suddenly a great earthquake occurred, so that the foundations of the jail were shaken.. . .
Do you really think this was the only one? What about this one?
(Matthew 28:2) 2 And look! a great earthquake had taken place, for Jehovah’s angel had descended from heaven and had come and rolled away the stone, and he was sitting on it.
What about this one?
(Matthew 27:51-54) 51 And look! the curtain of the sanctuary was torn in two, from top to bottom, and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split. 52 And the tombs were opened, and many bodies of the holy ones who had fallen asleep were raised up 53 (and people coming out from among the tombs after his being raised up entered into the holy city), and they became visible to many people. 54 But when the army officer and those with him keeping watch over Jesus saw the earthquake and the things happening, they grew very much afraid and said: “Certainly this was God’s Son.”
Historical records corroborate with more examples . . .
The Pompeii/Vesuvius earthquake preceding the big eruption in 79 CE was in 62 CE. What about food shortages?
(Acts 11:27, 28) 27 In those days prophets came down from Jerusalem to Antioch. 28 One of them named Agʹa·bus stood up and foretold through the spirit that a great famine was about to come on the entire inhabited earth, which, in fact, did take place in the time of Claudius.
In fact, you should probably remember some articles in the Watchtower that basically said that all the items Jesus mentioned were fulfilled in some way in the generation from 33 to 70 C.E., including even the preaching of the good news in the entire inhabited earth:
(Colossians 1:23) . . .that good news that you heard and that was preached in all creation under heaven. . . .
(1 Timothy 3:16) 16 Indeed, the sacred secret of this godly devotion is admittedly great: ‘He was made manifest in flesh, was declared righteous in spirit, appeared to angels, was preached about among nations, . . .
(Acts 17:6) . . .“These men who have overturned the inhabited earth are present here also. . .
(Romans 10:17, 18) . . .what is heard is through the word about Christ. 18 But I ask, They did not fail to hear, did they? Why, in fact, “into all the earth their sound went out, and to the ends of the inhabited earth their message.”
*** w88 10/1 p. 3 The Sign—Not Just Past History ***
Did that generation experience fulfillment of “the sign”? Yes. The Bible refers to “a great famine” as well as three earthquakes, two of them ‘great earthquakes.’ (Acts 11:28; 16:26; Matthew 27:51; 28:1, 2) According to secular history, other earthquakes and food shortages occurred during that period. It was also a time of wars, two of which were fought by Roman armies against the inhabitants of Jerusalem. The second siege of Jerusalem resulted in terrible famine and pestilence, leading up to the destruction of the city and its temple in the year 70 C.E. The site in Jerusalem where the temple used to be stands as mute witness to those terrible first-century events.
*** w78 8/15 p. 31 Questions From Readers ***
That prophecy had a future application beyond what occurred to Jerusalem and on the Jews in 70 C.E., but it also was true as to the history of that city and nation.
These words are in Jesus’ prophetic reply to the apostles’ question about his future presence and the conclusion of the system of things. (Matt. 24:3, 21; Mark 13:19) Jehovah’s Witnesses have often pointed out that much of what Jesus there foretold had two fulfillments: First, a limited fulfillment in the developments leading up to and including the Roman destruction of Jerusalem and the Jewish system of things in 70 C.E. . . . In that prophecy Jesus emphasized the need to keep alert and to be ready. He said: “Keep praying that your flight may not occur in wintertime, nor on the sabbath day; for then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the world’s beginning until now, no, nor will occur again.”—Matt. 24:20, 21.
For Christians living in Jerusalem and Judea who would be directly affected by the end of the Jewish system of things, the warning to keep alert was vital. The Roman armies surrounded the city in 66 C.E., but then unexpectedly withdrew. That was the specific signal that Jesus had mentioned in Luke 21:20-22. And history tells us that obedient Christians responded by fleeing from the city of Jerusalem and from Judea. So it is reasonable to apply also to the literal city of Jerusalem and Judea what Jesus next said, about the “great tribulation.”
The destruction brought by the Romans in 70 C.E. was more extensive and terrible than when the Babylonians destroyed the city of Jerusalem in 607 B.C.E. Also, the tribulation in 70 C.E. brought the permanent destructive end to the Jewish-built city and temple and the system of worship centered around it. So Jesus was correct in prophetically describing the events in 70 C.E. as “great tribulation such as has not occurred [on that city, nation and system of things] since the world’s beginning until now, no, nor will occur again.” . . . The worldwide fulfillment in one generation of Jesus’ prophecies about unprecedented war, famine, earthquakes and so on, confirm that the limited fulfillment on Jerusalem before 70 C.E. was but a type of what we are experiencing.
 
Granted, we have changed emphasis on some of these verses and where they originally applied and which might apply only after 70 C.E., but much of it is just as true as when it was first written.

I take this as a kind of rhetorical question. I think you have already pointed out why much of what happens on the human side of organizations is exactly what we would expect to happen. Similar issues came up in the first century congregations.
Each of us has a responsibility to question. But not everyone is in a position to take their own questions seriously, due to having already put that responsibility onto others. But that's also a natural consequence of our imperfection. So it's not ours to judge the level of understanding of anyone else. It's not ours to judge who was put in charge of much, or who thought they were put in charge of much. But in any case the principle is true. It shows up again when James says that "not all of you should become teachers." It shows up in Hebrews 13:17 "for they are keeping watch over you as those who will render an account." And Hebrews 5:12 shows that it's unavoidable that we will also have the need to rely on teachers. 
(Hebrews 5:12-14) 12 For although by now you should be teachers, you again need someone to teach you from the beginning the elementary things of the sacred pronouncements of God, and you have gone back to needing milk, not solid food. 13 For everyone who continues to feed on milk is unacquainted with the word of righteousness, for he is a young child. 14 But solid food belongs to mature people, to those who through use have their powers of discernment trained to distinguish both right and wrong.
But none of these scriptures are specifically about the persons who publish and promote our doctrines. These scriptures are about all of us: all elders, and all others, too. All of us are expected to be stewards.
(1 Peter 4:10) 10 To the extent that each one has received a gift, use it in ministering to one another as fine stewards of God’s undeserved kindness that is expressed in various ways.
(1 Corinthians 4:2) 2 In this regard, what is expected of stewards is that they be found faithful.
So the principle is surely for all of us. Faithfulness is expected of all of us. And the greater the responsibility, the more seriously we should take it. We may push off our responsibilities onto others, but ultimately:
(Galatians 6:4-6) 4 But let each one examine his own actions, and then he will have cause for rejoicing in regard to himself alone, and not in comparison with the other person. 5 For each one will carry his own load. 6 Moreover, let anyone who is being taught the word share in all good things with the one who gives such teaching.

An interesting theory. But it would mean that every Witness who thinks that our Bible chronology is not ambiguous is a Witness for the wrong reasons. Therefore, according to your theory, it is vitally important that all Witnesses and potential Witnesses be made aware that the chronology is ambiguous.
So, I guess I can't tell if you are thanking me or criticizing me for doing something you believe is so important.

It's a bit off-topic, and I don't mean to pile on here, but this experience was also true for me. I learned to really like some of the same brothers more than some of the stuffier ones. I knew that three of the members of the Governing Body had come out of a previous era were still quite prolific in Rutherford-style swearing. One brother accidentally let slip the S*** word during morning worship. (I'd say for sure it was Jackson, but this might be considered too serious if I got it wrong.) Brother Swingle rarely seemed to hold back, and even thought it was OK to use the N***** word to address brothers of a certain persuasion (never during morning worship). But he was also one of the most down to earth and honest brothers I have ever known. Fred Franz would also use off-color language for effect, to grab your attention, but none of his words were ever vulgar. Franz wore a T-shirt to present the morning worship for three days in a row that had the word "hell" on it. It said "Where in the hell is . . . ?" [with the name of some little "podunk" town, somewhere.] But he wore it only because Brother Sydlik had just announced the previous week that all Bethelites needed to start wearing suit clothes to morning worship and treat it more like a congregation meeting. Franz was clearly sending a message.
I was there during the personal Bible study policing, but I was also there in the Art department during the same time periods that some of the supposed "subliminal art" stuff was supposedly slipped through. I can say for sure that during those years this was all complete "hogwash." There was no such thing. And I knew the brothers in the Art department for the next 10 years, and all the rest of the claims were equally garbage. It's part of the mindset where people see what they want to see. Of course, stupid things happen. Perhaps a brother in one of the filmed dramas thought it would be funny to turn his necklace cross upside-down? Who knows? (More likely it was an accident.)
I haven't pioneered for several years now, but this is the key for me, too. I know that some people have wondered what kind of cognitive dissonance would allow someone who knows about certain items of "deceit" to also go in service with our publications and even study with persons until they reach a decision about baptism. But our goal should be to focus on the more important work of applying Bible principles, and the changes that Jehovah's spirit can accomplish. It outweighs everything else.
I'm glad you are taking some time, and am sorry recent events shut down your local assembly venues. However, if I get time, I will still try to address some of the points you have made that I never responded to yet. So, don't feel that I'm fishing for a response from you, or trying to bait you into coming back. I'll wait patiently with bated breath. Enjoy the fishing.

[Referring especially to the half-dozen or so doctrinal changes related to the term "generation" through the years, along with numerous other doctrinal changes with respect to Matthew 24 & 25:]
That supposed anchor, as you called it, is just a "pretend" anchor anyway, allowing the doctrinal boat to drift along and shift and change, and get tossed about, and even require "tacking" which is a way that a boat can try to fight against the wind, and literally end up in a place that was exactly the opposite of where the "wind" was leading. (Note: Hebrew ruahh, spirit, wind)
(Ephesians 4:14) . . .So we should no longer be children, tossed about as by waves and carried here and there by every wind of teaching by means of the trickery of men, by means of cunning in deceptive schemes.
*** w81 12/1 p. 27 par. 2 The Path of the Righteous Does Keep Getting Brighter ***
2 However, it may have seemed to some as though that path has not always gone straight forward. At times explanations given by Jehovah’s visible organization have shown adjustments, seemingly to previous points of view. But this has not actually been the case. This might be compared to what is known in navigational circles as “tacking.” By maneuvering the sails the sailors can cause a ship to go from right to left, back and forth, but all the time making progress toward their destination in spite of contrary winds. . . . .19 Of course, such development of understanding, involving “tacking” as it were, has often served as a test of loyalty for those associated with the “faithful and discreet slave.”
The seriousness of the problem is that any reliance on chronology almost always involves deception. [even if that deception was not intentional] That's the point made in Ephesians 4:14. [In previous discussions evidence for all of the following points have been made and no one had any counter-evidence:]
There have already been at least a dozen times that the Watchtower has made claims about dates, including 1914, that were plainly not true. There have been claims about what was supposedly predicted decades prior to 1914 that you yourself have seen were not true. A video from the convention implies that the reason for the problem about 1975 started in the local congregations. This same implication has been made many times before. It has almost always been implied that most of what was expected for certain dates, even dates back into the 1800's were mostly correct, even though they were totally false. There has sometimes been a claim that minimizes the error, saying things like: they were expecting the right thing but at the wrong time; or That a particular false teaching was actually better than the true Biblical teaching, because it produced a necessary test of God's people, or That the wrong understanding helped bolster them for a time when they needed to stand up more strongly against enemies. The Watchtower has even gone so far as to print completely unsubstantiated, and flatly wrong, "scholarship" which has obviously deceived people into thinking there was some truth behind it. [Furuli's books, Appendix to the "Kingdom Come" book in 1981, etc.] This has been done by selective quoting, or by using the work of scholars who have been deceitful with evidence. The publications have produced statements about what we can know and what we cannot know about chronology through archaeology and history that have also proved to be deceptive.
I'm not claiming that the motive was dishonesty. People can easily be blinded by what they want to see. But the end result on the readers and audiences is still "deception."
A good example is the way in which C.T.Russell used measurements of the Great Pyramid. (It's an old enough example that it won't invoke biases for or against the current Governing Body, who are doing the exact same type of thing today.) His famous books, "Millennial Dawn" (Studies in the Scriptures) sold by the millions of copies worldwide. His most infamous doctrine was the proof that the Great Pyramid was "Jehovah's witness" in stone. It foretold the dates predicted in the Bible. Here is what he started saying in 1890, in Volume 3, along with an approving letter from an Egyptologist, and other information showing how some of the measurements in the Pyramid were accurate to within a fraction of an inch. (Where each "inch" represented a year, of course.)
"So, then, if we measure backward down the "First Ascending Passage" to its junction with the "Entrance Passage," we shall have a fixed date to mark upon the downward passage. This measure is 1542 inches, and indicates the year BC 1542, as the date at that point. Then measuring down the "Entrance Passage" from that point, to find the distance to the entrance of the "Pit," representing the great trouble and destruction with which this age is to close, when evil will be overthrown from power, we find it to be 3416 inches, symbolizing 3416 years from the above date, BC 1542. This calculation shows AD. 1874 as marking the beginning of the period of trouble; for 1542 years BC plus 1874 years AD. equals 3416 years. Thus the Pyramid witnesses that the close of 1874 was the chronological beginning of the time of trouble such as was not since there was a nation -- no, nor ever shall be afterward. And thus it will be noted that this "Witness" fully corroborates the Bible testimony on this subject...   [all editions of Volume 3, prior to 1910]
Then he made a correction in 1910 when other Bible Students were getting very much involved in corroborating these numbers:
"So, then, if we measure backward down the "First Ascending Passage" to its junction with the "Entrance Passage," we shall have a fixed date to mark upon the downward passage. This measure is 1542 inches, and indicates the year BC 1542, as the date at that point. Then measuring down the "Entrance Passage" from that point, to find the distance to the entrance of the "Pit," representing the great trouble and destruction with which this age is to close, when evil will be overthrown from power, we find it to be 3457 inches, symbolizing 3457 years from the above date, BC 1542. This calculation shows AD. 1915 as marking the beginning of the period of trouble; for 1542 years BC plus 1915 years AD. equals 3457 years. Thus the Pyramid witnesses that the close of 1914 will be the beginning of the time of trouble such as was not since there was a nation -- no, nor ever shall be afterward. And thus it will be noted that this "Witness" fully corroborates the' Bible testimony on this subject..."
It doesn't matter if Russell was personally trying to be deceitful. He made this change without an explanation and the exact same data that once pointed to 1874 now pointed to 1915. (For a time 1915 was considered the Jewish "year" beginning in October 1914 through September 1915. But this was not consistent. As they got closer to the 1914 date, and stopped believing that all they had predicted was possible, there were statements that effectively would have meant that 1915 could even start in October 1915 and therefore run into 1916. It was the Great European War starting in mid-1914, that brought most of this diffusion back into a focus on 1914. Since then, the false claims made about Russell's predictions in a newspaper called "The World" have been quoted in Watch Tower publications about as often as any specific predictions made in our own publications.)
Russell used pseudo-archaeology to bolster his belief in the period from 1874 to 1914. The Watchtower has since used pseudo-archaeology to bolster the belief in the period from 1914 to the Great Tribulation.

Jesus appearance on the earthly scene was the first step in the battle that brought Satan down from his lofty position. I don't know if it started at Jesus' birth, and therefore included the wrath of Herod, or if it was at Jesus baptism after which Satan made his offer of kingship over the kings of the earth to Jesus. But the great anger showed itself through persecutions and difficulties at a time when Christianity was "newborn" -- it's most vulnerable time, when it was vastly outnumbered, even by a religion already identified as the true religion, Judaism. So I think that the image of Revelation 12 mostly refers to Satan trying to keep Christianity from "getting off the ground" especially working through Judaism, which continues to be the damaging force against Christianity even into the time of Revelation (which was written evidently AFTER Jerusalem's temple was destroyed). Notice the references to Judaism and Judaizers in the 7 letters to the congregations.
Also Jesus gave a good hint of the same during his ministry:
(Matthew 12:24-30) . . .” 24 At hearing this, the Pharisees said: “This fellow does not expel the demons except by means of Be·elʹze·bub, the ruler of the demons.” 25 Knowing their thoughts, he said to them: “Every kingdom divided against itself comes to ruin, and every city or house divided against itself will not stand. 26 In the same way, if Satan expels Satan, he has become divided against himself; how, then, will his kingdom stand? 27 Moreover, if I expel the demons by means of Be·elʹze·bub, by whom do your sons expel them? This is why they will be your judges. 28 But if it is by means of God’s spirit that I expel the demons, the Kingdom of God has really overtaken you. 29 Or how can anyone invade the house of a strong man and seize his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man? Only then can he plunder his house. 30 Whoever is not on my side is against me, and whoever does not gather with me scatters.
I do not think the same battle happens again in the life of each Christian. 
The "short time" explanation sounded right.

There is an excellent (and famous) precedent for this idea in the Bible (future "crowing" ceremony, whether or not Jesus is already, technically, king). When a milestone event occurred, such as the moving of the "Ark of the covenant" into Jerusalem, David wrote a psalm that said "Jehovah has become King." Obviously Jehovah was already King. This may also be related to the explanation for why Jesus both hands back the Kingdom to his God and Father, and yet reigns forever in that everlasting Kingdom in fulfillment of the covenant to David.
What I was thinking about with Revelation 6 and the representative horses is that as soon as Jesus began reigning in the midst of his enemies, he also began conquering in the midst of his enemies. He was not passively waiting until some late 19th century or early 20th century world event, but rides through the entire history of Christianity and continues to conquer right up until the last enemies Death & Hades (Grave) are themselves thrown into total destruction (Lake of Fire). Riding alongside the other horses is, to me, a way of saying that, in spite of the long reign of death through various means, Jesus is also conquering for us. We may die, or be killed, even starve, yet can be comforted that we also conquer through Christ Jesus.
I still believe, as you do, that the more joyous fulfillment is future. But I also see a fulfillment now that acknowledges what Paul said in 1 Cor 15, that Jesus is NOW both ruling and conquering. 
Also, although we can look at world history and see dark ages, destruction, apostasy, false doctrine, etc., we may be looking at the situation the way Elijah looked at the situation in Israel, thinking he was the only one who was still faithful, yet he needed to be corrected:
(Romans 11:1-6) 11 I ask, then, God did not reject his people, did he? By no means! For I too am an Israelite, of the offspring of Abraham, from the tribe of Benjamin. 2 God did not reject his people, whom he first recognized. Do you not know what the scripture says in connection with E·liʹjah, as he pleads with God against Israel? 3 “Jehovah, they have killed your prophets, they have dug up your altars, and I alone am left, and now they are trying to take my life.” 4 Yet, what does the divine pronouncement say to him? “I have left for myself 7,000 men who have not bent the knee to Baʹal.” 5 So in the same way, at the present time also, there is a remnant according to a choosing through undeserved kindness.
 
 
 

I enjoyed your exposition of the all these issues related to 1914, Revelation, and the kingship of Jesus, especially the areas that differed from the view I have been holding. I'll get to those issues shortly, but I wanted to say how important is this particular point you just made. It may also provide a starting place to help explain why the view I hold is a bit confusing.
First, it shows that Christians in the first century had NOT come to our present understanding of the 70 weeks. This would seem, at first, to contradict the verses just previously quoted:
(1 Peter 1:10-12) 10 Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the undeserved kindness meant for you made a diligent inquiry and a careful search. 11 They kept on investigating what particular time or what season the spirit within them was indicating concerning Christ as it testified beforehand about the sufferings meant for Christ and about the glory that would follow. 12 It was revealed to them that they were ministering, not to themselves, but to you, regarding what has now been announced to you by those who declared the good news to you with holy spirit sent from heaven. Into these very things, angels are desiring to peer.
The idea I get from this is that many were "making a diligent inquiry" and realized that when it came to chronology ("the particular time or season") there was no way they would have figured it out. Not even an angel could have figured it out. And THAT must even include the time when the Messiah would suffer. And yet the 70 years prophecy of Jeremiah, as expanded by Daniel into 70 "sevens of" years was the most famous of the time prophecies about when the Messiah should suffer.
(Daniel 9:25, 26) 25 You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Mes·siʹah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks. She will be restored and rebuilt, with a public square and moat, but in times of distress. 26 “And after the 62 weeks, Mes·siʹah will be cut off, with nothing for himself.. . .
As an aside, it would have been just as accurate to translate this as "Messiah the Ruler" rather than "Messiah the Leader." The NLT says: "Now listen and understand! Seven sets of seven plus sixty-two sets of seven will pass from the time the command is given to rebuild Jerusalem until a ruler—the Anointed One —comes. Jerusalem will be rebuilt with streets and strong defenses, despite the perilous times." or NIV: "“Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven ‘sevens,’ and sixty-two ‘sevens.’ It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.
But back to the point. I think that after Jesus was manifested in the world at the last days, that Christians are now in a time period when time and dates are meaningless. As 1 Peter says, it was nothing that anyone could really figure out ahead of time, not even angels. All they could do was wait. Jesus arrival marked the "Last Days" according to Hebrews 1:1,2:
1 Long ago God spoke to our forefathers by means of the prophets on many occasions and in many ways. 2 Now at the end of these days [Now, in these last days] he has spoken to us by means of a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the systems of things.
From that point in time, we are all in the same situation until:
(Hebrews 1:6-2:1) But when he again brings his Firstborn into the inhabited earth, he says: “And let all of God’s angels do obeisance to him.” . . . 8 But about the Son, he says: “God is your throne forever and ever, and the scepter of your Kingdom is the scepter of uprightness. 9 You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you with the oil of exultation . . .  13 But about which of the angels has he ever said: “Sit at my right hand until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet”? . . .2 That is why it is necessary for us to pay more than the usual attention to the things we have heard, so that we never drift away.
I don't think I need to repeat that Hebrews 1 uses royal imagery both here and in verses I skipped. It mentions ministers doing obeisance to him just as a king has. It mentions a throne. It mentions a scepter, it mentions a Kingdom, it mentions being anointed with oil, it mentions sitting on a throne while God places all enemies at his feet. The context also mentions garments, and mentions a crown. These are all "kingly" and "royal" concepts that should make us pay attention and never drift away.
So it doesn't matter that there may be more to his ongoing kingship, and more occasions where one could say "Jehovah has become King" or "Jesus has become King." The point is that time and chronology are no longer important to the equation. If they do become important then we are probably missing something in our Christianity and faith. We know he came, we know he will come again. We also know that he is present with us all the days until the end of the system. (Matthew 28:20) Jesus mentioned that presence starting back in 33 and said it would continue until the synteleia. (Technically, if the Watchtower were correct about the synteleia, or conclusion, then Jesus presence would STOP in 1914. Fortunately, the conclusion of the system of things is a future event, not something that started in 1914.)
Another way to look at the same point is to notice how Jesus transitioned from the sign seen upon Jerusalem to the imagery of the "second coming." Jesus says "immediately after the tribulation of those days . . . they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory."
That's a bit hard to square with our current view of time. It's a better fit for what Peter and Psalms says about 1,000 years being the same as a day with Jehovah.
But this is also why I see Revelation speaking of things that were to be considered "as good as if they had been completely fulfilled" during the time they were first read by Christians. All the things happening to them, both good and bad, were evidences that the end of all things was already upon them (1 Pet 4:7). That NOW was the day of salvation. At any moment "immediately" Christ could be seen coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Only if they believed strongly that he was currently the king, with all the authority and power, above all other kings and authorities in heaven and on earth, could that faith be strong enough to carry them through great tribulations and even unto death.
So, the reason I make application to the first century, even of items in Revelation chapters 6 through 12, especially, is because physical, human times and dates were not important. The power of Jehovah and his Christ were powers that moved beyond time. They each could be referred to with names like: the First and the Last, the Alpha and Omega, the One who was, who is, and who is coming.
From a more technical point of view, I would say that it's much easier to explain several of these parts of Revelation as occurring closer to the final manifestation of Jesus. I agree that all these events in the first century continue on to a greater fulfillment when the Kingdom accomplishes the purpose of His will.
(1 Corinthians 15:24-28) 24 Next, the end, when he hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all government and all authority and power. 25 For he must rule as king until God has put all enemies under his feet. 26 And the last enemy, death, is to be brought to nothing. 27 For God “subjected all things under his feet.” But when he says that ‘all things have been subjected,’ it is evident that this does not include the One who subjected all things to him. 28 But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.
Another aside that some might find interesting is that we have often said that Jesus must sit and wait at God's right hand until God has made his enemies a stool for his feet, based on:
(Hebrews 10:12, 13) . . .But this man offered one sacrifice for sins for all time and sat down at the right hand of God, 13 from then on waiting until his enemies should be placed as a stool for his feet.
This would be another damaging element to the 1914 doctrine, because Jesus would have to continue waiting until the last enemy death is brought to nothing according to 1 Cor 15:26. Therefore Jesus is still patiently waiting at God's right hand, and nearly the entire basis for explaining why Jesus didn't become king until 1914 comes crumbling.
 

I think the emphasis lately has been on starting this expression after 1914 especially, not so much before 1914:
*** w00 5/15 p. 11 par. 6 Pay Attention to God’s Prophetic Word for Our Day ***
6 In this time of the end, many faithful Christians have ‘roved about’ in the pages of God’s Word, the Bible. The result? With Jehovah’s blessing on their efforts, true knowledge has become abundant. For instance, anointed Witnesses of Jehovah have been blessed with insight, enabling them to understand that Jesus Christ became heavenly King in the year 1914. In keeping with the apostle’s words recorded at 2 Peter 1:19-21, such anointed ones and their loyal companions are ‘paying attention to the prophetic word’ and are absolutely certain that this is the time of the end.
*** bhs chap. 9 p. 99 par. 13 Is the End of the World Near? *** [2015] 13 Understanding the Bible. The prophet Daniel wrote about the last days. He said: “The true knowledge will become abundant.” (Daniel 12:4) God would give his people the ability to understand the Bible more clearly than ever before. Jehovah has done this especially since 1914. For example, he has taught us the importance of his name and his purpose for the earth as well as the truth about the ransom, what happens when we die, and the resurrection. We have learned that only God’s Kingdom can solve all our problems. We have also learned how to be happy and how to live in a way that pleases God. But what do God’s servants do with what they’ve learned? Another prophecy gives us the answer.—See Endnotes 21 and 25. In 2009, 2012 and 2014 we temporarily moved it back to include Russell's group in 1870.
But I also think that we have a Scriptural answer that fits:
(1 Peter 1:10-12) 10 Concerning this salvation, the prophets who prophesied about the undeserved kindness meant for you made a diligent inquiry and a careful search. 11 They kept on investigating what particular time or what season the spirit within them was indicating concerning Christ as it testified beforehand about the sufferings meant for Christ and about the glory that would follow. 12 It was revealed to them that they were ministering, not to themselves, but to you, regarding what has now been announced to you by those who declared the good news to you with holy spirit sent from heaven. Into these very things, angels are desiring to peer. Note that the NWT indicates that the literal words are more likely used in a metaphorical manner here, so that the NWT footnote in Daniel 12:4 says:
Or “examine it [that is, the book] thoroughly.” So 1 Peter is likely a more exact "fulfillment" of Daniel 12:4 than it might look like, at first.
*** w12 8/15 p. 3 par. 2 “I Am With You” *** Viewed metaphorically and in harmony with the facts of our day, the Hebrew verb here translated “rove about” conveys the idea of a careful examination.

Actually, Jesus is to rule in the midst of his enemies, so there is no Biblical reason that the times of the Gentile nations could not go on while Jesus is king. At any rate, the time of the Gentile nations continue to go on anyway in spite of the fact that Jesus is said to rule from 1914.
From a Biblical viewpoint, God's rulership toward the earth has never been interrupted. Jehovah is the one who can interrupt the rule of others at his will. That was the entire point that Nebuchadnezzar needed to learn in Daniel chapter 4.  So it seems all the more disrespectful to say that Nebuchadnezzar interrupted God's rulership by dethroning Zedekiah.
 

The reason this doesn't make sense to all readers of Luke 21:24 is that Jesus clearly says Jerusalem WILL BE TRAMPLED on. Therefore it was future, and not even in effect yet during Jesus' time on earth. Also Luke 21:24 is referenced in Revelation 11:2,3 and it says nothing there about 7 times, only 3.5 times.
This goes to the same question that Anna just asked about the "last days." Daniel's words were sealed up until the time of the end. Revelation quotes quite a bit from Daniel, but says it's now time that the words of the scroll are opened. As you have shown before, much of Revelation is parallel to Daniel, but this is a consistent exception: It is now time to open and unseal the sealed scrolls.
(Revelation 5:1-5) . . .And I saw in the right hand of the One seated on the throne a scroll written on both sides, sealed tight with seven seals. 2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice: “Who is worthy to open the scroll and break its seals?” 3 But no one in heaven or on earth or underneath the earth was able to open the scroll or to look into it. 4 I gave way to a great deal of weeping because no one was found worthy to open the scroll or to look into it. 5 But one of the elders said to me: “Stop weeping. Look! The Lion of the tribe of Judah, the root of David, has conquered so as to open the scroll and its seven seals.”