Arauna

This was before Jesus died. He died later that day and God took into consideration that Peter had not received the Holy Spirit yet. We read in the Bible that he cried bitterly. It was a mistake (3 times) from human weakness - not a deliberate sin. After he received the holy Spirit and showed genuine remorse he lead the congregation. Most of the scriptures I quoted to you 'above ' was AFTER the ransom was paid and disciples accepted the ransom. These scriptures indicate that deliberate sin is not acceptable after acceptance of the ransom sacrifice. I think we must now agree to disagree because you definitely think your way of thinking is OK and you can go ahead and sin and all will be forgiven. However, Jesus did say: the road is narrow and there is few who are on it. Why? Because one must stay steady to stay on this road... and it is cramped ....and narrow ..but at the end of the road is a beautiful paradise. The broad, easy road is not the road to life.

You cannot bring yourself to repent again if you have nailed the Son of God to the cross again by rejecting him, holding him up to mocking and to public shame. NO you are confused.... this is about people who have already repented and used the ransom sacrifice of Jesus for forgiveness and then go and sin deliberately again after this! If they sin deliberately after accepting ranson sacrifice it means they have rejected it publically!  Yes - the unrighteous are those who never had chance to learn about Jesus in proper way - so God will give them a resurrection as "unrighteous". Which are you? Righteous or unrighteous? You still have not answered my question about a person who has accepted the ransom sacrifice and then after this start to "practice" the wicked things quoted in the scriptures above...... Can a person who claims they have already accepted the ransom sacrifice keep doing wicked sins and keep being forgiven? Can you provide yes or no, please?

You know exactly what this scripture means:- that we cannot go making sins deliberately and then ask for forgiveness. We all sin every day (we talk unkind or we do not show love when we should or we hurt someone's feelings) but we do not do the things which god says is serious sin like adultery or fornication, and then just ask forgiveness and it is forgiven.... God punished Israel severely when they did these things - Jehovah said they were rotting away in their transgressions - so it is good example for us to avoid these things because we know that God does not approve of people who do such things.... You have not answered any of my questions - it seems you think it is OK to break the law of God and commit serious sin and then ask forgiveness? Yes - a person can make mistake but do you think God will keep on forgiving? 1Cor 6: 9-10 Don’t you know that those doing such things have no share in the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who live immoral lives, who are idol worshipers, adulterers or homosexuals—will have no share in his Kingdom. Neither will thieves or greedy people, drunkards, slanderers, or robbers. 11 There was a time when some of you were just like that but now your sins are washed away, and you are set apart for God; and he has accepted you because of what the Lord Jesus Christ and the Spirit of our God have done for you. Everyone who practices sin is also practicing lawlessness. 1Jo3:4. If one makes a serious mistake it is a mistake but if one "practices" any wrong act - you are practicing lawlessness 1Co 15: 33 + 34....34: "Come to your senses in a righteous way and do NOT practice sin, for some have no knowledge of God. I am speaking to move you to shame." Here below is a scripture which shows how dangerous it is to play with God: Hebrews 6Living Bible (TLB) 4 There is no use trying to bring you back to the Lord again if you have once understood the Good News and tasted for yourself the good things of heaven and shared in the Holy Spirit, 5 and know how good the Word of God is, and felt the mighty powers of the world to come, 6 and then have turned against God. You cannot bring yourself to repent again if you have nailed the Son of God to the cross again by rejecting him, holding him up to mocking and to public shame. Hebr 10: 26 If anyone sins deliberately by rejecting the Savior after knowing the truth of forgiveness, this sin is not covered by Christ’s death; there is no way to get rid of it. 27Think how much more terrible the punishment will be for those who have trampled underfoot the Son of God and treated his cleansing blood as though it were common and unhallowed, and insulted and outraged the Holy Spirit who brings God’s mercy to his people. One can also sin in same way as Adam or Judas.....

Sostar: you apply the Bible to suit yourself. I read my Bible and the Bible says you must NOT sin but if you make mistake then we have the ransom of Jesus to cover for us. "My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. 29 If you know that He is righteous, you know that everyone who practices righteousness is born of Him." 1john 2: I preached to preacher long time ago....his wife hated his behavior and used to want to leave the church but it was their livelihood. He used to do bad things, break the marriage contract with other men and women - then he confesses in front of whole church every week and then everyone is forgiven. His church members did the same - they do what they want and then confess in front of everyone and all is forgiven....... You think that God approves of this? Is this true repentance? ..... or does repentance mean that we have to stop doing the bad things and get new personality made in way of God. Eph 4: 17 This I say, therefore, and testify in the Lord, that you should no longer walk as the rest of[d] the Gentiles walk, in the futility of their mind, 18 having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God, because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart; 19 who, being past feeling, have given themselves over to lewdness, to work all uncleanness with greediness. 20 But you have not so learned Christ, 21 if indeed you have heard Him and have been taught by Him, as the truth is in Jesus: 22 that you put off, concerning your former conduct, the old man which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts, 23 and be renewed in the spirit of your mind, 24 and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness and holiness. 30 And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. So - according to the above - would you say that a person repeating same bad things over - is he a good person to have around children as an example? Yes or No please

When Paul circumcised Timothy it is not an example of Paul implementing Jewish Law! This happened AFTER the governing body in Jerusalem had already decided that NO more circumcision to be done by Christians. Acts 15:6-29 Paul knew in his mind how these Jews were prejudiced against Timothy because they knew his father was Greek - and he wanted Timothy to accompany him on the preaching work to the Jewish people. So he knew they would not accept Timothy to preach to them - this is why he was practical to circumcise Timothy. It sets a good example for us to be adaptable when preaching to unbelievers. BUT later he chastised Peter for hypocrisy when he hypocritically did not eat with Christians who were uncircumcised. Rom2:25-29; Phl3:3 Jehovah required the circumcised Jews to also be circumcised in their hearts: Jer 4:4

Sostar, I do not agree. If someone has committed adultery - do you think they have repented if they repeat the behavior? I want a yes or no answer please.

Sostar: Christ - 'anointed one'. Christians are followers of the anointed one from God (Jehovah)! The true messenger from Jehovah. To think that the Christians just replicated the Jewish system shows a lack of knowledge of the Bible. First of all the Jewish system and its many laws and special festivals and even special years represented something to come in the future. Each part of the temple had a special meaning and only the high priest could go into the most Holy. Each festival also had its fulfullment in Jesus. Hebr 10:1; Col 2:17 "Those things are a shadow of the things to come, but the reality belongs to Christ". The moment Jesus died (on Jewish pass over festival and most holy festival) the curtain in front of the Most Holy temple tore to show that Jesus is now the fulfillment of this. He is the new High priest who will go into heaven (The Most Holy presence of God) and lay down his human sacrifice before God. This is why the Jewish rituals were abandoned by Christians. The only yearly ritual we now commemorate is the Death of Jesus - as instructed in the bible. Luke 22: 19& 20. This is when we pass the bread and wine in commemoration of new covenant. Hebr 8:6 Christians broke away from the Jewish temple system.......and Jesus, while on earth, predicted that the temple would be destroyed (Matt 24) - so no Jew can still do the old Temple rituals.... because this was not longer the way to approach God. Today there still is no Jewish temple ..... so the Jews started a new Rabbi system and wrote the Mishnah and Talmud (which was later quoted by Mohammad). However, Jesus chose his foundation of the congregation - the Apostles - to begin the preaching after his death and to organize the congregations with elders and ministerial servants to serve the brothers and do the most needed things. He even gave a list of the qualifications to be an elder or ministerial servant in books Titus and Timothy and told Titus to appoint elders and correct the deviant brothers. Titus 1:5 and read further. Read Timothy 3. So we today are organized like the early Christians were. It was later in the time of Constantine the Great (when Constantine incorporated many pagan teachings into the Catholic church) that we see buildings built like crosses and ritualistic institutions not acceptable to God. We are different to other Christians - do you know that ?

Mr. Rook: Satan also does field service. And he does not count his hours either. In fact he is just happy when he can get others destroyed. What is your MO? You act true to form to place a whole number of old destructive themes on here so we have to defend these all over again. You are really tiresome in your OCD! This is like a recurring theme from a groundhog nightmare movie - your wild accusations with wild words which are so baseless! LOL - You test our patience to the limit! If I was one of the modern youth at Yale university I would have needed a trigger warning! I refer to my old (long) discussions with you about the blood issue. How my own baby SURVIVED because she DID NOT receive blood when she had her cancer. The surgery took the WHOLE DAY and it looked like she was going to die... and how she healed much faster after her blood stabilized and .........how many people die from blood but it is not put on their death certificates as anaphylactic shock... We have been though all this before!!

Just and extra note - the reich which is called the first reich is from Charlemagne until Napoleon - almost 1000 years. (mostly Germanic kings appointed by pope. Holy German empire. Second reich: Willhelm 2 and first world war Third reich: Hitler. "The red Babylon book (very old book) goes into Russian history and the split between Greek and Russian orthodox in tenth century. It is exactly 100 years ago when Russia had a horrific revolution for communism. Karl Marx was a Satanist! and many of his contemporaries atheists - after which 40, million of its own Russian people were starved to death and murdered like fodder. This is the ideology where common people are dispensable fodder. It does not like religion but uses it for its purposes. Many think that we are easy putty in their hands (fodder for these people) because of our neutral stance - but they have Jehovah to deal with!

This world is complicated because Satan is using whatever he can to get people to get involved in politics. He uses money and religion. When I see the -billions- now given to organizations to promote certain ideologies to get people involved and pliable -to be a mass of sheep who can be manipulated - to keep people very busy with other lesser issues - that is satan in power. Academics and even government leaders do not see what is going on and what is coming! Societies are becoming more and more ungovernable. They are truly blinded. So many new laws now in place in Europe and Canada to silence people who want to speak out about injustices happening on a daily basis. The victims are just fodder. They can now be taken to court. for hate speech on line. We have the stealth of oppression already upon us and we do not even know it. They are trying to control the eminent conflagrations among peoples by denying there are problems and silencing those who can speak about the realities. I think that regimes will be come stricter to control people and to try to keep order because the masses are now throwing up debris like an unruly sea. Jes. 57:20 ...They will eventually turn against all religions because many are promoting hateful ideologies and others are teaching decadence. The whole of humankind is now being manipulated by propaganda (a form of spiritism) and they are being sucked in because many now have little regard for obeying te teachings of the bible and its anti violence teachings. I heard of a black brother who left the truth to go and join a violent group which professes to put and end to racism -by the use of violence! I felt so sad! It is now the time to guard our attitudes and beliefs. To stay NEUTRAL is very important. This is the sign of a true believer who Jehovah would like to prepare for life in the new system. One who keeps upright for righteous principles. The king of the north and south may come to fisticuffs but they both know it is assured mutual destruction. Actually they know that a lot of people must die to get their agendas fulfilled - just like first and second world war. So. will they try to call peace and security first - work together for a new world order (Satans world order )- while in the meantime still gathering weapons and influence and gaining more power. America is now open to all kinds of ideologies and this has made it a soft target. It has become a victim of its own freedoms. Governments will try to control the disruptive elements of society (terrorism one of them) and clamp down on religions - because many of them are seeking domination - after this all hell will break loose Which will come first? A peace and security call with a façade of one new world order? or the war.... you think about that! Neutrality is a very BIG issue - I preach daily to people who were indoctrinated from young - a form of religious nationalism and are taught that they are growing world wide and soon will rule the world. Satan is sure ready to use religions who are prepared to fight with a literal sword - and that includes Putin's hoards of Russian orthodox nationalists.

There is NO gap in the explanation of the fourth beast and its horn. ALL is there for us to understand the history and our place in it.

I think you are talking absurdities! Do you really know what a 'religious political' movement is? There are two kinds at present who already have power in the world. One wants to use ' money /banks' to control the world (I will not mention the religious backers) The other: who want to fight with weapons to rule the world (of which ISIS is a good example.) Where there are governments who are totalitarian: JWs NEUTRALITY is a problem for them because we do not want to participate in their voting and wars. They see this action as 'opposing' the political system or being pacifists...... Why? because we only do the preaching and warning work and leave ALL THE FIGHTING in Jehovah's hands to fight the final war and bring his rule. Human governments cannot manipulate JWs to do their bidding. This is a true theocracy where Jehovah and Jesus will have direct rule from heaven. We do NOT get involved with any politics be it racism- feminism or any other form of -ism. We will NOT receive the mark of the beast - which is clearly identified as the political system of the world. Neutrality is going to become a test for all of us in the time of the end! So stay faithful only to Jehovah and his future government - in heaven! Remember Jesus: he was taken before the representative of Ceasar and accused of sedition even after he had healed the soldier's ear and told his disciples not to fight. Why did Jesus instruct them to bring their swords? (2 were there that night) So he could demonstrate to them that we will not use any form of violence on others. We must develop the cooperative spirit now so that we will fully cooperate with the final warning before Armageddon. Also, when we are asked to do something in the new earth - even if it is a sacrifice. The new earth will be organized by shepherds - people who care for us. Satan will not be around. Cooperative, meek people will be the kind of people who will remain in the new earth. If you do not yet understand this principle then I suggest you start studying the bible to develop the right personality traits - because it is a red flag if you do not cooperate! or call them rulers! Zeph: 2:3 Seek the LORD, all you humble of the land, you who do what he commands. Seek righteousness, seek humility; perhaps you will be sheltered on the day of the LORD's anger.

We are seen as extreme in Russia because we refuse to go to army, and refuse blood. (I think the neutrality issue and the preaching issue will be the two things that will lead to JWs persecution all over the world in future - personal opinion!) The Russian ortodox church is the only church endorsed by Putin because he is busy building Russian nationalism. His foreign list of allies is also growing which includes, Assad, Turkey and Iran (the most vile of governments in the middle east who will eventually vie to be the main power (caliphate). For now Russia/Putin is using them for his goals. He obtained a port in Syria did he not? - right on the doorstep of the West! Most people think Putin is doing a better job in the East than Trump and in his own country he is seen as a rock star - even though the economy is not doing as well in Russia due to oil price drop. The Russian ortodox church claimed that JWs are 'extreme' in the landmark court case and JWs were NOT allowed to submit evidence to the contrary. The court case was just a sham. If Ortodox say it is so - then they accept the evidence! So this church is being used as an instrument of the Russian government. (bedfellows Rev 17) The communist block may still be (personal opinion) the king of the north (China -Russia as their influence is spreading all over the world (China has bought most mineral rights in Africa) while they - Russia and China - suppress/oppress every person or religion back home who does not play their game. Iran and Turkey too - are totalitarian governments. Meanwhile, the West has been taken over by cultural decadence - I kind of plan the communists put in place after the Russian revolution hundred years ago when the revolution did not spread - which was propagated intensely after the second world war. It came from communist and atheistic philosophical thinking which started at the Frankfort School of thought. Read up about it. It has led to total deterioration of values in the West, all kinds of degenerate sex freedom, decadent morals and breakdown of gender (67 genders recognized at some universities) - and no sense of right and wrong and 'all religions are the same'. The values of right and wrong is "subjective" - like beauty. Everyone can just do what they feel as long as no-one is hurt. (modern progressive thought which came from the Frankfort school). There is no moral backbone anymore - and this is exactly what satan wants because all these philosophies are taking over. People do not really obey the bible any more - they do their own thing. In the place of the bible - the -isms - are taking over at universities and other institutions, even in the justice system. One smart philosopher who believes in the Bible said: People do not believe in nothing - they believe in 'anything' when they throw the bible out. Many -isms are now taking the place of the bible. Many of the modern 'new age' and other religions which are steeped in Kabbalism as well as many secret organizations all come from the one source - Satan and the occult. Most of the western world has now become an occultocracy. I think Satan is going all out to rule everyone on earth and to replace the people's faith in god with philosophies or organizations which fight for their pet causes. Another powerful ideology is Islam and other religions - which want to rule the earth - and they have the money resources to sow propaganda! Some parts of the world is weak and some are strong..... iron and clay which do not mix. I had to leave my revelation and Daniel book behind in USA when I moved.... but I remember the image which the brother posted above. The fierce beast of iron is the Roman empire and the one horn which rises up and speaks grandiose things was the British empire which rose up later from the Roman empire (the Roman Pope was appointing kings for almost 1000 years in Europe - mostly Germanic kings since the time of Charlemagne until Napoleon took it away.) Britain fought many sea battles against Spain, France and Netherlands (who had colonies all over) to become the world power This was before the anglo-american world power which co-joined and became the last world power. Britain also broke away from the catholic church (king Hendry 8) which later led to the conditions for people to start translating the bible more freely and investigating what the bible really teaches (according to Daniel 12: 3 “And those who are wise—the people of God—shall shine as brightly as the sun’s brilliance, and those who turn many to righteousness will glitter like stars forever. 4 “But Daniel, keep this prophecy a secret; seal it up so that it will not be understood until the end times, when travel and education shall be vastly increased!” It seems like Russia is starting to feature in world affairs (but has a bad economy). This week Russia called for the UN to have greater powers to keep the world from war and further "unity" amongst the world's peoples. Will we see the UN gain more powers when it is extremely corrupt already? Islam is controlling UNESCO and human rights organization at the UN.... and this week they were so silly as to appoint Mugabe to a position (and then remove him after an outcry). World powers are buying weapons again similar to the cold war era. China has started to build its own air craft carrier ships......but is still behind.... we can only watch..... but things are brewing! Many other countries are aspiring to have nuclear weapons which can bring massive destruction. Time will tell - we just watch on the sidelines as we see bible prophecy go into fulfillment!

Sostar , do you know about the government of God that will rule in future? Do you know how this government going to work? Do you know that Jesus was raised by his father Jehovah after his soul and body was BOTH dead? Do you know the purpose that Jehovah had for the earth when he created the earth? Do you know who made satan? Do you know who is in control of the world right now? Give me answer please....have you spoken to JWs about this?.

Witness - your words spoken from your mouth is judging you - you are doing exactly that, for which reason I quoted the scripture. You have a blind spot for yourself - no wisdom - I leave the judgment to God. You go round and round in circles to try and prove yourself correct. ... trying to deceive others to follow you. I have seen this attitude before.... There is NO spirit of Jehovah there..... ! Zion is the heavenly Jerusalem (government under Jesus) Hebrews 12:22 which is now leading the slave. You twist things to suit yourself. Additionally, you have not answered my questions. Do you preach every day in public? And do you belong to a congregation where you can attend meetings? You know you are told to do both by scripture! And if you do preach - do you preach about the Kingdom? That is a future government? with subjects on earth? And a government of 144,000 in heaven? Jesus was really dead for 3 days because he did not have an immortal soul ? Jesus is not God and we pray through him to God. Where did you learn all that? was it by yourself ? or by this group that you now despise? The most important TEACHINGS are SPOT ON.... ! They are now also focusing more on Christian living and Christian personality - more than ever before. While there is time - I suggest you do some good INTROSPECTION. If I was an elder - I would have removed you real quick from the congregation because you come with an insidiousness like no other. And this is my final communication with you.

Sostar : Do you need passport to go to another country? Do you need identification from your country to show where you come from? This is worldly or secular stuff I was referring to. You cannot go out from this world - you need to comply with the law. You need to register a business. When you have people working for you - you need order and you need finance to support them... to buy food and pay electricity...for them. This is things I am talking about. I did not mean that we must be worldly in our personality.... so I think you were misunderstanding me.

These extreme answers are not spoken from wisdom but self-interest.

Obviously you have never seen a real stoning! Not associating with someone cannot be compared to stoning - it is comparing a rock with a banana.

Again the scriptures are used out of its context! You apply the scriptures to your own way of thinking! Israel had a literal building where they used to go and worship - it was part of the system - the pathway Jehovah chose for them to worship as a nation. The building would be destroyed in future to indicate that acceptance of worship at this place was not longer acceptable to God. Jesus fulfilled every aspect of the temple so it was redundant. Now we worship in spirit and truth - and we do not regard the kingdom halls as buildings needing veneration. They are put separate (holy) for worship of Jehovah through his son. I have never seen a JW put their face towards the USA and make the 'organization a place of worship. To speak of accomplishment is not worship. Most organizations in the world that are so very large are run by peopleCEOs who earn MILLIONS of dollars a year. The GB are doing it as a 'group' of simple men without worldly degrees and they get their plate of food and a roof over their head for that.... We were cautioned recently that we should not even ask to have a photo taken with one of the governing body. So they do not get worship but do a function - of organizing the preaching world-wide and feeding the flock. Yes, there are silly people who put them on a pedestal - but those are people who do not have the correct perspective on what the bible teaches..... they still have to grow spiritually. I bet you are not preaching every day - Jesus said 3 times to Peter - feed my sheep! If you are not doing this to the best of your ability you are only benefitting yourself and do not have a basic understanding of your Christian duties. You are also supposed to meet regularly. Where do you meet regularly? I have often thought about the fact that Satan can make it appear to people that they are anointed....... but when you watch these people ...... they are very self-centered..... and usually are a cause for division in the congregation.....In the end Jehovah is the judge. Satan has always used those whom he can manipulate and usually they feel they are more special than anyone else. Saul was humble - Jehovah chose him - but his office made him lose his humility. Since the most soft-spoken people can also be haughty - I reserve judgment...... but I believe that these are the ones who can do the most damage to the true Kingdom heirs. There are many indications of a 'governing body' when the congregation started in Jerusalem and spread throughout the Hellenistic world - which you deny in your words... because you do not acknowledge the GB. Paul went to testify in front of James and the brothers in Jerusalem and they made the final decision about the circumcision. This is an indication of humility on Paul's part because he did not make the decision himself but went up to the men who were appointed with the task. He did however, chastise Peter for his hypocrisy in front of others. How do you think the world-wide work should be organized at present to get uniformity? The prophecy in Matt 24:14 has to be fulfilled - do you not think so? One needs to have a branch registered in every country - by law. To say they are secular because they are legally registered is to throw the baby out with the bathwater. This is short-sighted thinking and putting yourself on high. These worldly rulers can and will (in future) destroy those registered offices very quickly if they want to - proof is in Russia! Does this mean that the brothers cannot go on without the GB? No they have been given the nourishment and knowledge by the GB to go on as a group of Jehovah's people - truly identified by their neutrality regarding world events. But I bet they long to hear encouragement from the world-wide brotherhood! You are quoting scriptures which indicate that these people in the time of the apostles were anointed and sealed. That is correct. A seal is a stamp of authenticity......which is obtained after the anointing and Jehovah will not seal anyone if they have not proved absolutely faithful. Jesus was speaking to those future anointed when he said: The ax is already lying at the root of the trees. Every tree, then, that does not produce fine fruit is to be cut down and thrown into the fire. The hate speech against the governing body on this forum is showing the fruits clearly. I do not fall for the deceitful "holiness" or "righteousness" I see here. Mr Rook: Your hope can be dashed to get the transcripts. You are setting yourself up for disappointment and then you will have a new rod to beat the GB with. As I said before - they do not have time for petty requests from every Tom Dick and Harry. They cannot follow through on every deviant request. Their responsibility is the spiritual food. Any case if you understand the structure of the Russian government you will know that the justice department is subject to the government. Not like in USA where it is independent..... and supposed to be unbiased. But what I have seen lately makes me think that the checks and balances are not as strong as they looked before in USA - the supreme court is highly politicized and prone to make 'party' decisions. Most Americans do not understand how other countries function. Russia is a totalitarian (oligarchy) government which controls everything. To think that a vestige of justice will be found there is ludicrous. They have killed off all their human rights lawyers and anyone talking against the regime in the past 13 years. Remember the Russian who was killed with plutonium - in London? Journalist who write about injustices are assassinated. It is a powerful thugocracy. Putin has filled his own coffers and those of his friends who are all rallying around him. Those who do not play the game are put in prison on trumped up charges and their wealth divided to friends. Again: The GB is not there to fulfill every personal request UNrelated to the preaching work with satisfactory 'service'.

They cannot cater to individuals - I think there is a handful who want to read it ...... and the opportunities were there before. I read some of it. ...... so obviously you are ignoring my previous comment or you do not like the answer.

I agree with your on the serial gripers! The hinges are on the ........

I am not here to determine if people have a mental illness - I just respond to what they say or do which is a reflection of their thoughts.

When people bring in their own teachings and try to promote their own thoughts they are acting directly against Christ. We were warned about this were we not? They say their tongue is sweet but the fountain is pure poison to those who listen to them. They try to sow doubt with the inexperienced - they are cunning deceivers - and it comes from the ego. I have not much love for those who try to mislead the inexperienced! And I see many of them here. I am not over-reacting.... or vitriolic. It is serious when people bring disruptive teachings here without their contributions being contested!

Apologies - Mr S Sostar indicated that we use OT scriptures....

The other answer of Witness shows ignorance regarding procedures of JWs ......or a deliberate twisting of the facts. We use scriptures in the 'New Testament' for not associating with those who have become apostates..... not the Old testament. 'Witness' made the accusation that we are inherently violent and would stone if we could - that is a blatant lie! We would not be following Christ if we had a violent attitude when Jesus said we must love our enemies - especially those who do not love Christ. I work every day amongst people who could kill me and if circumstances change they most probable will! A pioneer sister recently had her throat cut while on field service. We carefully work amongst our enemies who have personalities like wolves. However - the principles are different for those amongst us who have gone back to their "vomit" - apostates. Those people are avoided as they pose a threat to our spirituality and a threat to the morality and unity of the congregation. The instruction from the scriptures are not to greet or not to eat with these people. This means that we must avoid association. THEY are the ones who turn hostile and show their true personality because they still want to associate with us but resent having to stick to the principles laid down by Jesus through the apostles. If you want to belong to a golf club - you have to stick to the rules. If not - you are let go. Why do people expect JWs to tolerate all kinds of bad behavior when organizations in the WORLD do not even tolerate it? Their logic is faulty because they are blind to the problem that they have a problem with the authority of Christ and do not want to obey his principles. They deem themselves above the law of Christ. 2 John 9-11