Arauna

Incorrect - I have spoken to people from these ' inspired churches' who make up a lot of things as they go along and say they are inspired by god's spirit. Usually these inspired things are closer to spiritism than the Bible. The Bible is our "inspired" source.

When a miracle is an unexplained event which is beneficial then....sure I do believe in miracles.

Do you know what is a master copy? Do you know which master copy was used to translate the NWT?

There is such as thing a justified criticism. But it should always be done in a Christian way.

There is a difference: to pray directly to Jesus and different to pray to Jehovah through Jesus who paid the ransom. I am sure this is what he meant.

john 8:7 "7 So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

That is why I left.

You may be using a hammer when a sharp sword is needed. Do you really think there are NO witnesses here? You have judged us all? You are deluding yourself if you think your personal brand of JW is the only kind. There are principles we all have to adhere to and I have not proven unfaithful to Jehovah. If I have - show me what I said which was unfaithful to the word of god - except landing myself in a stupid cat standoff with you (for a silly sentence with less than 10 words). It was NOT Jehovah's ego that was hurt - it as yours.

Then why do you come here? You yourself say - have discipline..... discipline the mind! Walk the talk buddy! I know I am a Witness - but if I am not good enough to your standards, go read the watchtower we studied today!

phew! sigh.....

This is a common problem - family members beg elders to not tell the police. This is why I say that many here do not think of how the families feel or think. They do not think of the family dynamics, except about the reporting. I have mentioned on this forum before how a young boy who touched his cousin out of curiosity was sent to a reformatory and branded a sex offender for the rest of his life...... BUT the people here do not really want to look at the nuances and the pain this brings a family or the victim....... the smell a pound of flesh and use this subject to keep on beating and beating JWs. they are not reasonable.

As far as I remember the congregations were not yet completely established. There were only disciples who followed him. He was not part of the Jewish Sanhedrin and went into the synagogue to read the Hebrew scriptures.

This was talking about a mother and son sleeping together which was shocking. It came to Paul's ears. This scripture does not mean that we must go around reporting on people whom we suspect of having done something wrong.... which you seem to imply. It is common knowledge that child sex abuse ALWAYS happens in secret....... because it is predatory behavior and a CRIME! Similar to a planned murder, these people's consciences know it is wrong and therefore cover their tracks. If you did not know this then please go read up about this.

This is why I think it is a waste of time talking to people like you . You accuse before you think. You never think of implications - only what you see in front of you.

When one works with people one should validate their feelings..... and afterward correct.them..... that is the loving way to do it.

Yes, we all have experience of judicial committees.... lol. Your other words also indicate that we must shut up if we have not been on a committee. So where will I learn about this as a silly woman hmmm....? Will you teach me? .. when you distainfully shut me up or expect me to say nothing or get off the forum? OR will you patiently explain things here on the forum and NOT expect people to dutifully shut up? I learn a lot from you but what you have shamelessly said over the last few days, does not indicate wisdom by NOT looking at things also from another persons perspective. You remind me of the pharisees - all law, and no love. You have to learn to tone down the harshness and one-sidedness. I look past that because I like to learn things - no matter from which mouth it comes , ........ I am not just speaking for myself here. On this forum is not just about having experts on a matter talking. If the forum was merely for experts arguing "cases" then where would us ordinary folk go? I do not want to share photographs of myself on other media or talk about car racing, clothes, or some other silly subject. I come here to get my mind stimulated to get something new to think about ...... not to be an expert..... or to be perfect..... If I wanted oversight I would go to the "closed" part of the forum. Yes - there are those who are silly sometimes... even sloppy.....(I feel entitled to be, having worked hard my whole life)...... but this is made up for by others with extreme puffiness, commedians, bad tempered and deviant experts and others with extreme hate-OCD. There are people on here that would not believe even if christ himself spoke to them from heaven by e-mail.... they would think it is a despicable JW prodding them..... their prejudice is immutable. They think the JW organization should be run the way THEY think it should be run and will always find some handy element to critisize as long as they live ....... no matter how reasonable the arguments....... because they themselves cannot put themselves in any other persons shoes. They are highly flawed but do not know it. Put those very same people in a position of leadership and all justice will disappear because they have no clue about righteousness or justice.

If you do not have the right secular laws in place to get a conviction then the secular system and reporting a crime is useless. For example - police need psychologists to work with the under aged victims to take testimony .... so they are not traumatized by being cross-examined in court (second trauma). If there is not a law for mandatory reporting then there is usually also no infrastructure / support system to determine guilt. Psychologists can help determine this in very difficult cases. Even where these laws are in place it has transpired that the secular system does not follow through because of lack of infrastructure (qualified people). But now that these laws are in place they still blame those who worked with children for their lack of extra procedures - when they themselves lacked procedures... and still are retroactively shifting the blame. The problem has always been the cases wherein it is difficult to prove guilt - one needs additional government support - and this was NOT available. JWs were doing what they possibly could under the secular system that was in place. They put procedures in place and were ridiculed for it. The government was shifting its responsibility to bring in good functional laws to handle these cases. Instead it was left to organizations who worked with children to sort out. Where there are children one will always find renegade people who will step out of line. Satan can get to anyone and any person who denies this is denying the scriptures in the bible which prove that Satan can get to any person - Judas walked with Christ and was a traitor to the trust put in him. I feel the law is acting unjustly by retroactively blaming organizations when they themselves were to blame for the confusion in the first place.

As I said before - JWs had to get by without proper government laws. Now that governments were at last taking their responsibility seriously, to have an inquiry to see how they can close the loopholes in the laws. Now we can use this to improve the outcome of these matters. The ARC came way too late... there were many loopholes in the law.... same as in USA.

I should have used the world "when". And then you go off on a totally different subject about research on this concept............ srecko .... you always go to the ploy of semantics to change the point of the thread. You asked about 2 kinds of unrighteousness...... I give the answer..... without considering this (my use of the word "if" sends you off on a totally other subject...... ....can you not concentrate on one subject at a time...... or is it a deliberate ploy to troll?

Well done Anna- good scenarios. It exposes if a person is reasonable or unreasonable individual.

I did not deal with you! I do not presume to deal with you. I have no wish to "deal" with you. You do not know me and please do not presume to know me. I merely made a comment (which I added to yours) and drew tremendous ire. It was NOT a criticism of you. However, it seems you also have an ego problem....... You have to have your pound of flesh! I have never had any distain for you - in fact I have been the one to commend you more than anyone here because I agree with you mostly. But when you target me I have the right to stand up for myself. I LIKE the fact that you challenge apostates because my ability to research is limited at present. I listen to most of my podcasts. So you have issues with me - I am sorry for that but definitely not devastated. I have NEVER had any issue with you and still do not. The hostility is coming from your side not mine.

I did my dear... maybe not harshly because I was trying to show patience to him. But on many occasion I called him out and I was not always kind. I have not been quiet on this forum when people bend the truth. I give benefit of the doubt until I am sure someone is really bending the truth so much they could be bending spoons!......(in spiritistic way)

The man who was next to Jesus when he died on the stake was an unrighteous man - he died the death which he inherited from Adam. If he gets a resurrection in the new system he will be resurrected from "sheol" or 'hades'. He comes out of the death we all inherited from Adam. If he rebels after this in the new earthly system there is no ransom any longer to pay for his sins. It is a sin to the degree of Adam and Eve, he will see "second death" - Gehenna. The bible itself says that the 'unrighteous' will be raised up Acts 24:15. But it also shows in Revelation 20 that those who are on the earth after Armageddon and rebel against Jehovah when Satan is let lose will see everlasting destruction - Gehenna. I suggest you read revelation 20 for yourself. Mathematics proves that it is possible - that is all. It strengthens our "faith". Our faith is built on evidence of the realities not yet fulfilled. You once asked the question - will there be such faith? Yes there is. We believe in an earthly resurrection for most of those who have lived on the earth. Is it practical to believe this? Yes because it is possible..

What I saw in your last comment, is a trust in worldly governments. - If you have not noticed the dysfunctional, dystopian laws being passed lately, which I call the abuse of children by tmeans of the transgender agenda - giving permissions to government to remove body parts of young minor children (without parental consent), administration of hormones to 10 year olds.... and the leaving of 9 month full gestation (born fetuses) to die without medical care - then you have not been abreast with the news. Australia has brought in laws which make any councilling (biblical or psycholocal) to a person/child who wants to turn back or stop their transition..... against the law. I can mention so many new laws that are now being passed by decree or exec order in USA, UK, Canada, Australia etc. which one cannot even call logical or sane.... because of the disrespect for life and the creation of chaos. Yes the world is being turned topsy turvy by a tsunami of satan-inspired ideas and laws which indicates the true intention of satan...... to make the world an immoral place where no-one can any longer find truth. Soon the truth about Jehovah will not be available..... they will search for it and not be able to find it as new laws will make MORAL thinking illegal. The old idea that governments will be the " mother" to look after our interests in a beneficial and legal way, with individual rights, is a relic of the past. One can no longer trust any government. Individual rights have been replaced by "collective" rights. All governments serve the UN Agenda. Now I am not talking rebellion or disobedience here........ I am only talking trust. I do not trust any human court of law or government to look after my physical interests any longer and definitely NEVER my spiritual interests. If you have not noticed..... the world has gone quite crazy!..... and much more to come. We are going back to the amoral times of Canaan ... more like before the flood.. I think Jehovah will allow the human governments (at the height of technological discovery) to misuse it against the populace. Satan will be drawn out to show his true, dark deceptive goal for the earth. An injust /amoral world will be pitch dark in its outlook and outcomes. Jehovah will thoroughly prove that humans cannot rule the earth - especially if they negate his moral standards. (The issue of Jehovahs good and bad). Your comment quoted above is incorrect. Most JWs know that the kingdom government of jehovah is going to be a real government under the loving laws/ principles of christ - which will be willingly obeyed by everyone! So humans will not really need intense "supervision". They will willingly obey..... and make sacrifices to fix the earth. Because they really have faith and "trust' Jehovah ..... they know that those who deserve destruction will be destroyed and will not live through Armageddon. They trust that jehovah can see the heart..... and those 'unrighteous ones' who will be inclined to obey the government of christ will get a resurrection. They will be resurrected at the right time of Jesus' choice. They know that people will make mistakes in judgment day but will grow to perfection. The 144000 and christ will decide the steps to be taken. They also know that satan will be tied for the 1000 years,..... so when a person rebels against God (without being misled), he will be judged immediately by the one who can see the heart. Second death. This is direct rulership of jehovah by putting in charge his Chief Agent who will administer just laws which will be the same for everyone - no matter the gender, color or whatever. (Secular governments sometimes have just laws but there is no equality under law because they are not enforced equally). This is not the case with the government of jehovah. A person who is a rebel will disappear and everyone will understand why. Aaron did not mourn his 2 sons...... after they disrespected jehovah. Everyone will put love of jehovah first in their lives. Jesus may directly employ angels as messengers - we do not know. But the education work for all to learn Jehovah's laws will be massive! Although the resurrection will be done in steps. This will require organization and cooperation. Brothers on earth who organize us will not be "rulers" as we understand them to be in this system of things. I call them "facilitators". People who serve others and make it easy for them to serve jehovah in an orderly way.. Adam and eve - if they remained faithful and perfect - would not have required kings or people to check their obedience - ever. But family heads may eventually have organized their families ....... such as in Israel the families cooperated and moved in formation under Jehovahs direction. You once said on this forum .... will Jesus find this "faith " .when he comes? ...... yes, his Witnesses put full faith in this future government because of the justice and righteousness it will bring. They really "trust" and have faith in this kingdom government. So we have received enough education about the kingdom to get us through Armageddon and give us the faith to not trust human governments ( 666) but only Jehovahs government. Jehovah and his very capable king will be in charge and we will follow most willingly and obediently. Under resurrection in the insight book (I speak from memory) it gives the mathematical realities of the resurrection. It shows that 20 billion people could be resurrected in the first 500 years. If the first people are resurrected and thereafter only every 33 years..... and given this time to learn about jehovah..... they will then be able to teach the next ones who are resurrected......Exponentially they will have taught all resurrected ones at 33 year increments within the first 500 years.

That is most Christ- like of you.... I recall a scripture which says " knowledge puffs up but LOVE builds up." I think love for jehovah and love for neighbour goes much farther than harshness, pride and all those nasty attributes. Love is the one attribute which can most often help people to recognise the truth. Maybe you came to this forum to also learn a truth about yourself..... you have to work on your Christian attributes. You may have knowledge but you still do not have the love. I recall Corinthians (Paul) said: If I have all the knowledge and I do not have love - then I am NOTHING. So this silly little old sister can also speak directly the truth to you. While I find the "deceivers" on here just as disgusting as you do and have also not been kind to them on occasion....... I at least feel guilty about my failings because my conscience has been trained to distinguish right from wrong, kindness from pride, self-righteousness from true righteousness. I leave it to you to ask yourself: what have I learnt about myself on this forum.