Arauna

A thank you to my friend above for clarifying the matter so excellently.
Mr Gordon: worked on translating the Dead Sea scrolls and still works on translating ancient Hebrew language on artifacts - old and newly found. It is his passion.
It is logical to me that Hebrew scholars did not bother on research (or only did superficial research ) on the name when their biblical tradition dictates that it is unacceptable to pronounce the name.  So when they recognize the tetragrammaton, they substitute it.
Gordon says that German translators in the 18th century did not do a good job on ancient Hebrew translations due  to Yiddish influence.
Mr Gorden did research on the Yiddish language and found that the German language influenced the pronunciation of the third letter  in the tetragrammaton as well. Since I speak some German and a semitic language, I understood the subtle change immediately.....  I could clearly see the mechanism.  So pronunciations of letters do definitely change over time...
 There are no vowels... this is ..... thumbsuck.  These old scholars used conjecture. In Hebrew and Arabic one reads without vowels.  That is why the language is difficult. They only write down the consonants. Vowels are only put in to assist the reader. 
This is why it is amazing to me  that someone found old manuscripts with the point system actually supplied in them. No-one bothered to check it because they automatically just recognized the tetragrammaton (read only the consonants as they are used to) and did not notice them there.    
I am not here to win an argument or even to get you to accept the name yehovah - the choice is yours. 
By the way, the translation of the Lords prayer  - let your name be "sanctified' is the best possible translation - according to Gordon. 
 

I have never claimed to be a prophet but merely speculate on what is already happening in the world and where it happens to coincide with bible prophecy..... so do not put words in my mouth......I merely stipulate it to get people to think. 
As far as I know the prophecy about end of days  in Mathew 24 specifically says we will be preaching about the "kingdom"....... so how can you preach about christ as king in the time of end if you do not believe his kingdom has started ruling...?
Matthew also says we will be persecuted for using christs name.  Why?  Because soon they (the powers that be) will require all to accept only one God........ if you still profess the kingdom of christ and his ransom sacrifice (which made the kingdom possible)- you will be persecuted.
Viper is the word Jesus used. Your words mislead those who listen to you.  I have NO agenda .....but your MO is to create hate for the slave. OCD-hate.  I am your target because I accept the slave.
Other way round. My knowledge of the bible helps me to recognize signs going on in the world.  The "slave" has given me a sound basis to see for myself what is out there. I am not a slave to my own desires or "position" or ambition or a wish to be recognised..... just enjoy spiritual things.  I do not have unforgiving hate to contend with and can concentrate on what is really going on.
There is a call to all lost sheep..... there is still time to repent.
Well - the purpose of God is at present not in fulfillment..but he is still "administering his purpose"..... and most people on earth do not even know His real name..... they call him God, lord, the God, and various other titles. They do not even know the tetragrammaton exists.
 You are just like those who stopped using the name of God and blamed jesus for healing on the Sabbath.  
You can write long dissertations about my comment - I will not read them.  I merely answered your accusations so your "disciples on here" - those who hang on your lips and agree with you (just because you hate the organization and use very contradictory reasonings)  can know what they are getting into and be warned...... you are not a spiritual jew............the inconsistencies in your reasoning is proof of that.
I, unlike you, do not profess to be anointed and yes, I do accept 1914 because of the evidence.... and I do accept the slave.  .... and I think it is too late in the stream of time to stay busy with petty disputes.  Jesus warned us to be found in peace.  Have you found peace yet?  One cannot have peace if you have hate. 

This is so sad. When the state goes beyond its authority and doctors do so as well. Seems this doctor trained in China and has this attitude.
My daughter was operated on almost 42 years ago in south africa.  She had cancer as a 8 and half month old baby.  The operation took the entire day. It was a thoractomy without blood. A massive and dangerous surgery.  (Called an OP. In SA)
The brilliant surgeon did a fantastic job, quaterizing arteries as he worked. She healed fast after the operation- she took about a quarter of the time it takes  other patients to heal because they usually take blood.
She overcame the cancer and 6 years ago became a mother of a healthy child - despite doctors warnings.
Jehovah knows best.  I am afraid that China has taken control of the WHO and the human rights council - so in future it will be harder and harder for JWs to control our own bodies and that of our children.  They will treat us as property if the state...... to do with as they please.

This is distressing. I, too, have a family member overseas hopefully convalescing in not very easy surroundings—outcome uncertain. He spent time in two hospitals, one very good and one very bad. 
None of us want to die. It is inconvenient and it makes people feel bad. Death itself, however, holds no fear for us. This is not the ‘real’ life, after all. I have a writer’s bug, an urge to get down everything in writing, and hopefully adequate time to do it. But you never know—I could be gone tomorrow. 
Not to mention should the Great Day come in the interim. With sudden sickness and possible looming depression both coming straight out of the blue, how quickly human edifices fall apart. Maybe things will soon revert to business as normal, but that is by no means a sure thing. Maybe certain anticipated things will ‘speed up.’
Best hopes here to you. I pray you get well. I’ll continue to see you here setting straight the ignoramuses hopefully, but if for crazy human reasons I do not, I will see you in happier times.

Tom, I guess you are hoping to get very old or live through Armageddon. I am sick a second time.  I had these symptoms 6 weeks ago and got over it....... but it came back today.... lol.   I worked with tourists......
I remain in quaranteen and doctor myself. I will never go to a hospital.
This world-wide lockdown reminds me of the 66CE lockdown  in Jerusalem....... I believe we are on our way to that situation we have been waiting for!
After this the money system will be digital and all governance controlling..... central policies by UN....... maybe after our JW message a second lockdown? Like 70CE?
 

It is just an incorrect assumption........ Jesus taught us to pray for His name to be sanctified (by all people in future). This implies that jehovah knows his name is not sanctified by all people at present. 
It would be unloving of jehovah to give us his name and allow his son to teach us the name,  just so he actually wants us to hide it.
The wicked are amongst us and they do not respect anything holy.  Jehovah hope's that they change but each one will pay for their own error.  
The nations shall know I am Jehovah....in Ezekiel... what about the scripture which indicates that jehovah will remove the shame from his name.  This indicates it takes place in this present system.
Joel 2:  26 You will surely eat to satisfaction,And you will praise the name of Jehovah your God,Who has done wonders in your behalf; My people will never again be put to shame.  27 And you will have to know that I am in the midst of Israel And that I am Jehovah your God—there is no other! My people will never again be put to shame. 
 

I've also heard it argued that it showed the greatest example of humility by Jehovah to allow his name to go into obscurity to allow his Son's name to be placed above every other name.
But I don't really buy it. It was through human superstition, not Jehovah's laws, that the name was obscured. The Bible certainly didn't obscure it. It's the most common, proper name in the Bible.

I have never claimed to be a prophet but merely speculate on what is already happening in the world and where it happens to coincide with bible prophecy..... so do not put words in my mouth......I merely stipulate it to get people to think. 
As far as I know the prophecy about end of days  in Mathew 24 specifically says we will be preaching about the "kingdom"....... so how can you preach about christ as king in the time of end if you do not believe his kingdom has started ruling...?
Matthew also says we will be persecuted for using christs name.  Why?  Because soon they (the powers that be) will require all to accept only one God........ if you still profess the kingdom of christ and his ransom sacrifice (which made the kingdom possible)- you will be persecuted.
Viper is the word Jesus used. Your words mislead those who listen to you.  I have NO agenda .....but your MO is to create hate for the slave. OCD-hate.  I am your target because I accept the slave.
Other way round. My knowledge of the bible helps me to recognize signs going on in the world.  The "slave" has given me a sound basis to see for myself what is out there. I am not a slave to my own desires or "position" or ambition or a wish to be recognised..... just enjoy spiritual things.  I do not have unforgiving hate to contend with and can concentrate on what is really going on.
There is a call to all lost sheep..... there is still time to repent.
Well - the purpose of God is at present not in fulfillment..but he is still "administering his purpose"..... and most people on earth do not even know His real name..... they call him God, lord, the God, and various other titles. They do not even know the tetragrammaton exists.
 You are just like those who stopped using the name of God and blamed jesus for healing on the Sabbath.  
You can write long dissertations about my comment - I will not read them.  I merely answered your accusations so your "disciples on here" - those who hang on your lips and agree with you (just because you hate the organization and use very contradictory reasonings)  can know what they are getting into and be warned...... you are not a spiritual jew............the inconsistencies in your reasoning is proof of that.
I, unlike you, do not profess to be anointed and yes, I do accept 1914 because of the evidence.... and I do accept the slave.  .... and I think it is too late in the stream of time to stay busy with petty disputes.  Jesus warned us to be found in peace.  Have you found peace yet?  One cannot have peace if you have hate. 

My best wishes. Get well soon!

Dear sister. Wishing, hoping, and praying you will be well. The hospitals are truly dangerous places now. Just heard a woman (originally from Senegal) "screaming" about what she says happened to her husband in a French hospital. (He was a well known football player, who went in for a non-Covid checkup -a bad headache- and died hours later of a heart attack. She was treated with such disdain, and she is a medical professional.) Things that happen regularly in hospitals today were mostly unheard of in past years.

@Arauna get well soon sis! Are you receiving help from the brothers and sisters?

Says Witness, so you better listen to her!

It is just an incorrect assumption........ Jesus taught us to pray for His name to be sanctified (by all people in future). This implies that jehovah knows his name is not sanctified by all people at present. 
It would be unloving of jehovah to give us his name and allow his son to teach us the name,  just so he actually wants us to hide it.
The wicked are amongst us and they do not respect anything holy.  Jehovah hope's that they change but each one will pay for their own error.  
The nations shall know I am Jehovah....in Ezekiel... what about the scripture which indicates that jehovah will remove the shame from his name.  This indicates it takes place in this present system.
Joel 2:  26 You will surely eat to satisfaction,And you will praise the name of Jehovah your God,Who has done wonders in your behalf; My people will never again be put to shame.  27 And you will have to know that I am in the midst of Israel And that I am Jehovah your God—there is no other! My people will never again be put to shame. 
 

Tom, I guess you are hoping to get very old or live through Armageddon. I am sick a second time.  I had these symptoms 6 weeks ago and got over it....... but it came back today.... lol.   I worked with tourists......
I remain in quaranteen and doctor myself. I will never go to a hospital.
This world-wide lockdown reminds me of the 66CE lockdown  in Jerusalem....... I believe we are on our way to that situation we have been waiting for!
After this the money system will be digital and all governance controlling..... central policies by UN....... maybe after our JW message a second lockdown? Like 70CE?
 

Tom, I guess you are hoping to get very old or live through Armageddon. I am sick a second time.  I had these symptoms 6 weeks ago and got over it....... but it came back today.... lol.   I worked with tourists......
I remain in quaranteen and doctor myself. I will never go to a hospital.
This world-wide lockdown reminds me of the 66CE lockdown  in Jerusalem....... I believe we are on our way to that situation we have been waiting for!
After this the money system will be digital and all governance controlling..... central policies by UN....... maybe after our JW message a second lockdown? Like 70CE?
 

Still, that list is impressive. When I get a spare decade I’m going to watch all those movies.

This is what ought be done unless you want to watch the ‘history’ in which Moses pops Pharaoh in the nose and gets the girl. 

The whole point is that for English speaking people Jehovah is how it is written. In other languages it is written differently and pronounced slightly differently. I never understood why it is such a problem, since many names are written and pronounced differently depending on which country you live in. 

Not if you write it in 
Italian: Parigi
Dutch: Parijs
Croatian: Pariz
Finnish: Pariisi
And then:
Armenian: փարիզ
Chinese: 巴黎
Georgian: პარიზი
Korean:파리
And so on!

A thank you to my friend above for clarifying the matter so excellently.
Mr Gordon: worked on translating the Dead Sea scrolls and still works on translating ancient Hebrew language on artifacts - old and newly found. It is his passion.
It is logical to me that Hebrew scholars did not bother on research (or only did superficial research ) on the name when their biblical tradition dictates that it is unacceptable to pronounce the name.  So when they recognize the tetragrammaton, they substitute it.
Gordon says that German translators in the 18th century did not do a good job on ancient Hebrew translations due  to Yiddish influence.
Mr Gorden did research on the Yiddish language and found that the German language influenced the pronunciation of the third letter  in the tetragrammaton as well. Since I speak some German and a semitic language, I understood the subtle change immediately.....  I could clearly see the mechanism.  So pronunciations of letters do definitely change over time...
 There are no vowels... this is ..... thumbsuck.  These old scholars used conjecture. In Hebrew and Arabic one reads without vowels.  That is why the language is difficult. They only write down the consonants. Vowels are only put in to assist the reader. 
This is why it is amazing to me  that someone found old manuscripts with the point system actually supplied in them. No-one bothered to check it because they automatically just recognized the tetragrammaton (read only the consonants as they are used to) and did not notice them there.    
I am not here to win an argument or even to get you to accept the name yehovah - the choice is yours. 
By the way, the translation of the Lords prayer  - let your name be "sanctified' is the best possible translation - according to Gordon. 
 

A thank you to my friend above for clarifying the matter so excellently.
Mr Gordon: worked on translating the Dead Sea scrolls and still works on translating ancient Hebrew language on artifacts - old and newly found. It is his passion.
It is logical to me that Hebrew scholars did not bother on research (or only did superficial research ) on the name when their biblical tradition dictates that it is unacceptable to pronounce the name.  So when they recognize the tetragrammaton, they substitute it.
Gordon says that German translators in the 18th century did not do a good job on ancient Hebrew translations due  to Yiddish influence.
Mr Gorden did research on the Yiddish language and found that the German language influenced the pronunciation of the third letter  in the tetragrammaton as well. Since I speak some German and a semitic language, I understood the subtle change immediately.....  I could clearly see the mechanism.  So pronunciations of letters do definitely change over time...
 There are no vowels... this is ..... thumbsuck.  These old scholars used conjecture. In Hebrew and Arabic one reads without vowels.  That is why the language is difficult. They only write down the consonants. Vowels are only put in to assist the reader. 
This is why it is amazing to me  that someone found old manuscripts with the point system actually supplied in them. No-one bothered to check it because they automatically just recognized the tetragrammaton (read only the consonants as they are used to) and did not notice them there.    
I am not here to win an argument or even to get you to accept the name yehovah - the choice is yours. 
By the way, the translation of the Lords prayer  - let your name be "sanctified' is the best possible translation - according to Gordon. 
 

Exageration?  Gordon is a 'ancient'  Hebrew language  expert not a modern hebrew expert and he found that no-one had thought of doing  research to find ancient manuscripts which had the point system included  to determine the original pronunciation of God's name.  All he did was find the manuscripts which had the points in them which no-one noticed..... that is all.  No one had done any trouble to find them until now!  So all the old conjectures can be thrown out because  the oldest manuscripts do give conclusive answers.

You are the one with blind faith in old information. The newest information is the discovery that more than 1000 Hebrew manuscripts in various libraries all over the world (including the oldest manuscripts in israel) have the point system in the name ( beyond doubt ) is "yehovah" for which the closest pronunciation in English  is jehovah.

I can deal with someone accusatory. And I can deal with someone stupid. But someone accusatory AND stupid I admit I have a difficult time with. That is largely why I am distancing myself from this particular forum in favor ot the smaller one.

Quote. "... lest ones of that minority ‘deceive’ them by ‘manipulation’ and ‘mind control.’ "
Well the CCJW / W/t Soc' certainly deceived a lot of people around the early 1970's.
And they are certainly deceiving a lot of people about the 'Overlapping generations'
And the 'Final part of the Final part of the days'