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Arauna

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  1. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Anna in The truth about Armageddon...   
    It is a coalition of nations who come up against the Nation of Jehovah in the time of the end... as Ezekiel 38 so well describes.  People of all nations have been collected together in true worship to Jehovah but Gog of Magog devises an evil plan because it looks as if these people have no protection.  When this coalition of nations come up against Jehovah's people, Jehovah will step in to protect a great crowd  ho will survive Armageddon.
    Like you, I have also looked at the names of Togarma, Tubal and Ross (Rus), Persia (Iran) and many of these countries who are (at present) part of the coalition of the King of the North (all with totalitarian regimes). 
    We do not know who will further join the king of the North (India? some of those in africa and south america?) but we know that North Korea, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia are part of this new financial coalition...     We also know who are supporting the king of the South.  It is as if the entire world is now choosing sides. 
    Russia has already started its march towards Jehovah's people on its own (as a single country), but soon there will be a whole coalition of nations together with it who want to take the spiritual spoil - take away all this pure worship. Will Russia and its allies lead this onslaught? - it seems like it .... but it is not a definite outcome.  We know that the UN (the image of the best or scarlet colored beast) will turn against ALL religion and then later, together with king of the North, UNITED against the people of Jehovah as Satan goes forth to finally attack pure worship.  Satan knows it is his deathblow to turn against Jehovah's people but he will be drawn out like a captive animal in iron hooks ........by Jehovah as the nations fulfill Jehovah's prophetic word.
    I do detect that you divide the families of Noah into 3 distinct groups.  This is rather a simplistic view of what happened. While some of the nations can be tracked to the children of Noah and their offspring (many nations have a clear pathway from the children of Noah), one must still be careful to lump them together so simplistically. For 4 thousand years nations were taking slaves, going to war, displacing whole nations and murdering whole villages of peoples.  Some nations were assimilated by others. .... And while the language groups sometimes helps us to detect the origin of a nation (indo-european, sino group, kushites,  etc, a nation usually comprises many gene pools that were mingled - depending on who they fought in wars and how stable the geopolitical area was.  
  2. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from BroRando in The truth about Armageddon...   
    No, we do not do the same. We do not promote man-made schemes.... which is what Peter referred to. He also mentioned the religious leaders of Jesus'day, who taught commands of men as doctrines.  With this I will remind you of the basic teachings such as the trinity and immortality of the soul which are just two of the most false doctrines taught by christendom..
  3. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in The truth about Armageddon...   
    It is a coalition of nations who come up against the Nation of Jehovah in the time of the end... as Ezekiel 38 so well describes.  People of all nations have been collected together in true worship to Jehovah but Gog of Magog devises an evil plan because it looks as if these people have no protection.  When this coalition of nations come up against Jehovah's people, Jehovah will step in to protect a great crowd  ho will survive Armageddon.
    Like you, I have also looked at the names of Togarma, Tubal and Ross (Rus), Persia (Iran) and many of these countries who are (at present) part of the coalition of the King of the North (all with totalitarian regimes). 
    We do not know who will further join the king of the North (India? some of those in africa and south america?) but we know that North Korea, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia are part of this new financial coalition...     We also know who are supporting the king of the South.  It is as if the entire world is now choosing sides. 
    Russia has already started its march towards Jehovah's people on its own (as a single country), but soon there will be a whole coalition of nations together with it who want to take the spiritual spoil - take away all this pure worship. Will Russia and its allies lead this onslaught? - it seems like it .... but it is not a definite outcome.  We know that the UN (the image of the best or scarlet colored beast) will turn against ALL religion and then later, together with king of the North, UNITED against the people of Jehovah as Satan goes forth to finally attack pure worship.  Satan knows it is his deathblow to turn against Jehovah's people but he will be drawn out like a captive animal in iron hooks ........by Jehovah as the nations fulfill Jehovah's prophetic word.
    I do detect that you divide the families of Noah into 3 distinct groups.  This is rather a simplistic view of what happened. While some of the nations can be tracked to the children of Noah and their offspring (many nations have a clear pathway from the children of Noah), one must still be careful to lump them together so simplistically. For 4 thousand years nations were taking slaves, going to war, displacing whole nations and murdering whole villages of peoples.  Some nations were assimilated by others. .... And while the language groups sometimes helps us to detect the origin of a nation (indo-european, sino group, kushites,  etc, a nation usually comprises many gene pools that were mingled - depending on who they fought in wars and how stable the geopolitical area was.  
  4. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from TrueTomHarley in The truth about Armageddon...   
    It is a coalition of nations who come up against the Nation of Jehovah in the time of the end... as Ezekiel 38 so well describes.  People of all nations have been collected together in true worship to Jehovah but Gog of Magog devises an evil plan because it looks as if these people have no protection.  When this coalition of nations come up against Jehovah's people, Jehovah will step in to protect a great crowd  ho will survive Armageddon.
    Like you, I have also looked at the names of Togarma, Tubal and Ross (Rus), Persia (Iran) and many of these countries who are (at present) part of the coalition of the King of the North (all with totalitarian regimes). 
    We do not know who will further join the king of the North (India? some of those in africa and south america?) but we know that North Korea, China, Iran, Saudi Arabia are part of this new financial coalition...     We also know who are supporting the king of the South.  It is as if the entire world is now choosing sides. 
    Russia has already started its march towards Jehovah's people on its own (as a single country), but soon there will be a whole coalition of nations together with it who want to take the spiritual spoil - take away all this pure worship. Will Russia and its allies lead this onslaught? - it seems like it .... but it is not a definite outcome.  We know that the UN (the image of the best or scarlet colored beast) will turn against ALL religion and then later, together with king of the North, UNITED against the people of Jehovah as Satan goes forth to finally attack pure worship.  Satan knows it is his deathblow to turn against Jehovah's people but he will be drawn out like a captive animal in iron hooks ........by Jehovah as the nations fulfill Jehovah's prophetic word.
    I do detect that you divide the families of Noah into 3 distinct groups.  This is rather a simplistic view of what happened. While some of the nations can be tracked to the children of Noah and their offspring (many nations have a clear pathway from the children of Noah), one must still be careful to lump them together so simplistically. For 4 thousand years nations were taking slaves, going to war, displacing whole nations and murdering whole villages of peoples.  Some nations were assimilated by others. .... And while the language groups sometimes helps us to detect the origin of a nation (indo-european, sino group, kushites,  etc, a nation usually comprises many gene pools that were mingled - depending on who they fought in wars and how stable the geopolitical area was.  
  5. Upvote
    Arauna reacted to Chioke Lin in The truth about Armageddon...   
    It doesn't matter who started the discussion. What should matter, how do you prove the points yourself, with the bible without having to rely on the organization's information, since those that oppose the organization will use that information to mislead. So, who else can be linked to the opinions and theories provided?
    Can "google" be used effectively? In my experience, it cannot, since there is so much disinformation. We have to look at every possible avenue to prove someone is not representing the best interest of the bible.
    Let's look at barns with respect to a topic you have a great passion for, Gog and Magog.
    Persia stands in its proper place; but India, under the modifications of Greater and Lesser, is confusedly repeated at different points, while the river Indus is mentioned in the text as the Eastern boundary of Asia. To the North, the castle of Gog and Magog, an Arabian feature, crowns a vast range of mountains, within which, it is said, that the
    Tartars had been imprisoned by Alexander the Great. The Caspian appears, with the bordering countries of Georgia, Hyrcania, and Albania; but these features stand nearly at the Northern boundary of the habitable earth.
    Africa has a sea to the South, stated, however, to be inaccessible, on account of the intensity of the heat. The European countries stand in their due place, not even excepting Russia and Scandinavia, though some oversights are observable in the manner in which the two are connected together.” pp.654-655
    Hasn't the organization mentioned Russia? What is the implication under barns?
    Isaiah 25:2. For thou hast made This is supposed to be uttered by the Jews who should return from Babylon, and therefore refers to what would have been seen by them. In their time it would have occurred that God had made of the city an heap. p 649
    Of a city, I suppose the whole scope of the passage requires us to understand this of Babylon. There has been, however, a great variety of interpretation of this passage. Grotius supposed that Samaria was intended. Calvin that the word is used collectively, and that various cities are intended. Piscator that Rome, the seat of antichrist, was intended. Jerome says that the Jews generally understand it of Rome. Aben Ezra and Kimchi, however, understand it to refer to many cities which they say will be destroyed in the times of Gog and Magog. Nearly all these opinions may be seen subjected to an examination, and shown to be unfounded, in Vitringa.
    How about Godbey Commentary.
    8. We see from this verse that Satan’s army, with which he essays to conquer the world, is made up of Gog and Magog. Now let us see who they are. In Noah’s family originated the trinity of races. Ham in Hebrew means black; Shem, red; and Japheth, white. Upon the subsidence of the Flood, Noah divided the world among his three sons, giving Ham Africa, Shem Asia, and Japheth Europe. Gog and Magog are only spoken of in this passage, <011001>Genesis 10th, and <263801>Ezekiel 38th. Gog means king, and Magog means the kingly people; i.e., the nobility. <011001>Genesis 10th notifies us that they are the children of Japheth, the ancestor of all the white people. In <263801>Ezekiel 38th they are elaborately mentioned as resident in Russia.
    Is the organization the only Org to suggest Russia? I think not. This is how you prove how the organization is correct and in the right track, regardless if the aggressors believe it or not. The point is, do you believe in the Org and accept the ones that are feeding you, spiritual food at the proper time. That should be the theme for every participant that isn't an opponent.
  6. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in The truth about Armageddon...   
    The UN will take power for one hour with the ten new kings (or the kings who have not ruled before).  WHO almost took power 3 weeks ago at the UN's WHO health summit but was thwarted by the African nations who do not trust the WHO any longer.  WHO is the only UN organization which has a constitution to rule.  However, the instituted a "working group" who are working behind the scenes to give the UN more power to control countries who did not completely obey orders during the first lockdown.  They will push through amendments to the 2005 World Health Agreement which most nations signed.  It will then be legally binding.
    Yes, they there will be chaos once they have brought about the propaganda for the "signs" we are expecting to see - peace and security and destruction of religion.  The system will collapse and the money lost will make the merchants cry over their wealth as they see Babylon the great disintegrate and anarchy ruling.  The fear of the nations as their societies and organizations are rocked like an earthquake.
  7. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Peter Carroll in The truth about Armageddon...   
    The start of Armageddon starts with literal actions  such as "peace and security" . Not "spiritual" events.  This may be a request to work together to obtain "peace and different kinds of security" for the globe  by cooperation and actions.  We know that the "image of the beast" has been put in place to bring this goal about from its specified charter document. 
    Thereafter, the turning against all religion is not a spiritual event.... but literal events which will clearly show where we are in the time-line.  The King of the North will go out of his space.....this is not a spiritual event but a real event with specific results which will be visible on earth.
    I suspect - this is my own thought- that those who die before the call for peace and security,  may still receive a resurrection.  This event will be the sign that Armageddon and the Greatest tribulation has started. Those who die in this time - Jesus will  judge as sheep or goats.
    We have all started to put on the new personality..... Jesus, the man with the inkpot (Ezekiel 9) will mark those with the Christian personality for survival. We all need to have on the white robes according to Revelation 7.  
    We will grow to perfection AFTER we have lived through Armageddon and the full value of Christs ransom will be applied for all humans. 
    The wicked will then have been removed. 
  8. Thanks
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    If we were both watching your dog and I said to you: " your dog does that, just like my my cat".  And you say: "why?" .... and I explain: "your dog yawns with a long, stretchy abandon just as my cat does". .......Should you be satisfied with that explanation?..... or  go on and on and try to find many more small little things which are similar between my cat and your dog? 
    That would be excessive would it not?  I was making only one comparison - they yawn the same.
    Similarly, Jesus was only focusing on his death that would happen in future and he called it a sign - which event has a single similarity to the experience of Jonah. What was similar? Jonah was imprisoned in the belly of a fish for 3 days and then he was miraculously released.  Jesus was  imprisoned in death for 3 days and then miraculously released in resurrection.  - that was the sign.
    To go and find out if there are many more little similarities or discrepancies between Jesus and Jonah, going into the number of hours, finding out if Jonah was in a coma within the fish, or dead and then came alive,,, that would be missing the point of the sign that Jesus spoke about.
    It was a sign to prove that Jesus was the Messiah. Jesus knew he would die sometime on Nissan 14 (depending on how long they would take to convict and murder him), because on the original Passover, the  lamb was sacrificed on that date.....and Jesus knew the Law well. He knew the first fruit festival was on Nissan 16 - the second day of the unfermented cakes - and that sometime on that day Jehovah would resurrect him....as the First Fruit to a heavenly life  with a spiritual body.  He gave that as a sign that he was the Messiah.  His death and release.  The messiah came to provide us with a perfect Passover lamb - to be sacrificed and provide the ransom.
  9. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Jesus cried out " my God why have you forsaken me" (paraphrased)..... 
    If God helped Jesus at this time, then Satan could accuse God of not being fair - that Jesus did not give his all together with his life and suffer of his own free will. Satan  could have said that Jesus was unfairly or extraordinarily helped to endure. He did not really have a death of suffering.
    When they offered Jesus myrrh and wine he refused for the same reason.  This combination was known to deaden the pain and was a kind of drug.  Jesus did everything perfectly so that no legitimate accusations could be brought against his sacrifice.  There were of course, many false accusations.
     
    Sheol and Hades: 
    These words mean the same: the common grave of mankind (all humans go to dust in the common grave of mankind). Gehenna is the second death (this can be discussed later as this refers to death which lasts forever.)
    I can explain this to you in more detail later if you want........  but it is important to know that Jesus died completely!
    What do I mean by that? Many Christians believe Jesus was a body with a separate soul.  Is this belief correct? NO! This belief comes from the Babylonian teachings of the "underworld" where the soul lives on after death or is conscious.  The bible does not teach this at all. 
    In fact, the Bible prophesied that Jesus would put his "soul" in death!   Isaiah 53: 12 
    "For that reason I will assign him a portion among the many, And he will apportion the spoil with the mighty, Because he poured out his soul  even to death And was counted among the transgressors; He carried the sin of many people, And he interceded for the transgressors." Soul is equated with your life as a person, and some translations render it as " life" or a breather".  Question: if only Jesus' body died - then why does the bible say that the "soul" that sinneth, it shall die.....  If only his body died - then our souls are not saved because the entire soul dies! Humans - when they die - everything they are goes into death - also the part which can think and be morally responsible for the person's actions. Ezekiel 18:4 "  Look! All the souls*—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so also the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul* who sins is the one who will die."   In fact you are a soul (there are many scriptures in the bible which prove this).  One can kill a soul with a sword, a soul has blood; and animals are also called souls!   Josh 11:11 (many translations has living person or soul in this verse);   Genesis 9:4. God allowed Noah and his family to add animal flesh to their diet after the Flood but commanded them not to eat the blood. God told Noah: “Only flesh with its soul—its blood—you must not eat.”   Leviticus 17:14. “You must not eat the blood of any sort of flesh, because the soul of every sort of flesh is its blood. Anyone eating it will be cut off.” God viewed the soul, or life, as being in the blood and belonging to him.    When Jesus died - he died completely.  No part of him remained alive. Jesus is called the Last Adam:  Jesus died the same death as Adam to save us from death - "a life for a life" or soul for soul. Jesus was the only person and last person to be exactly like Adam - a perfect man. (1 Cor 15:45) Adam was created from dust and god blew breath into his nostrils - he became a living soul or person.  (read Genesis 2:7).   (He could not think or do anything conscious before God blew the breath of life into him - he was dust formed into a body).    When Adam sinned - god said he would go back to the condition he was in before he was conscious - before he knew he existed. God said genesis 3: 3 " You must not eat from it, no, you must not touch it; otherwise you will die.’” 4  At this the serpent said to the woman: “You certainly will not die. Satan lied and many people still believe this lie - that we do not completely die!   Genesis 3:19...... "19  In the sweat of your face you will eat bread* until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” Adam went back into nothingness, oblivion... dust - what he was before god created him.   So Adam was perfect and will never exist again (he is in Gehenna or second death)- he chose to disobey God as a perfect human being.  The ransom sacrifice of Jesus works only for imperfect humans who put faith in him and his resurrection - to get a chance of a resurrection to life.   This scripture usually shocks people:  Eccl 3: " 19  for there is an outcome* for humans and an outcome for animals; they all have the same outcome.  As the one dies, so the other dies; and they all have but one spirit. So man has no superiority over animals, for everything is futile. 20  All are going to the same place. They all come from the dust, and they all are returning to the dust."   We are in the same condition as animals at death.  Animals do not receive a resurrection but humans are different.  We are moral beings (we understand good and bad), and have the opportunity to be resurrected.  All is not futile for those who put their trust in Jehovah and the resurrection of Jesus.  Faith in the resurrection allows us remain faithful.  We know we are not lost in the grave forever even if our persecutors may kill us.   I am sure you will have more questions ... am I right?   That is very good!  Go ahead!
  10. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Saturday was the regular sabbath on which no cooking on any work was to be done.  It was the first day of the Festival of Unfermented cakes.  The first day being a special day- kept like a Sabbath.
    Festival of Unfermented cakes:
    The first convention of the Jews was to be held in early spring and lasted eight days, from Nisan 14 to 21, to celebrate first the Passover; and then the festival of unfermented cakes. 
    They were occasions of great rejoicing before Jehovah and happy fellowship, joyful, upbuilding reunions of the entire nation.
    Four days previously, on the tenth of the month, each family head had to take into the house a sound male lamb or goat, a year old. After sunset of Nisan 14 it was slaughtered without a bone’s being broken and then roasted whole.
     
    "During the first Passover in Egypt - the blood was splashed upon the upper part of the doorway and upon the two doorposts, where every passerby could see it. After this no one was permitted to leave the house.  “Later in the evening the whole family assembled around the table to eat the Passover lamb or goat with unfermented cakes and bitter herbs. They ate in haste, not sitting down at their tables, but standing, with their hips girded, their sandals on their feet and a staff in their hand. They were ready to leave that very night as Jehovah had promised through his prophet Moses. 
    The eating of the Passover lamb with unfermented cakes and bitter greens reminds the Israelites, not only of the afflictions while they were in Egypt and the hasty departure, but also of the miraculous deliverance from cruel slavery under the mighty Pharaoh. This has made Passover a joyous festival. To express this joy, wine was added later to be used during this festival of liberation and songs were sung, such as the ‘Egyptian Hallel’ during the first part of the celebration, that is, Psalms 113 and 114, and at the conclusion of the feast Psalms 115 to 118. 
    “For, indeed, Christ our Passover has been sacrificed.” (1 Cor. 5:7) Yes, Christ Jesus was offered as the perfect Lamb of God exactly on Nisan 14, in the year 33 C.E. B y this sacrifice the basis was laid for a far greater deliverance than the release from Egyptian captivity.
    The day following Passover marked the beginning of the festival of unfermented cakes, which ran for seven days, from Nisan 15 to 21. During these seven days the Israelites continued to eat unfermented cakes; in fact, no fermentation was to be found in their homes. This law was very strict; anyone found eating what was leavened was to be cut off from the people, put to death. 
    The next day of the convention, Nisan 16, was another featured day. It was the second day of the festival of unfermented cakes, the official opening of the harvest. The Jews were not allowed to eat from the product of the new harvest before this day, when the firstfruits were offered to Jehovah. On this day the high priest was required to wave a sheaf of the barley firstfruits to and fro before Jehovah at the sanctuary. (Lev. 23:10-14)
    During the seven-day festival, in addition to the regular sacrifices, two bullocks, one ram and seven male lambs were offered day by day as burnt offerings and a he-goat as a sin offering, besides the many voluntary offerings by individuals. The festival climaxed with a final general assembly on the seventh day, Nisan 21
    By the waving of the sheaf of the firstfruits of the barley harvest, another important point was foreshadowed. Again it is the apostle Paul who gives us the correct understanding: “However, now Christ has been raised up from the dead, the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep . . . Christ the first fruits.” No ferment or leaven, representing sin, was associated with the presentation of the barley firstfruits, for Jesus Christ was “loyal, guileless, undefiled, separated from the sinners.” As the sheaf was waved on Nisan 16 Jesus was raised as the “first fruits,” or the firstborn from the dead, on Nisan 16, 33 C.E. Since Jesus is called the “first fruits” or “first-born from the dead,” there must be more “fruit” following him. This is foreshadowed by the next festival.
    On Sivan 6, the second national convention was held, the festival of weeks, also called Pentecost, meaning the fiftieth day. It was a one-day convention. Many conventioneers stayed in Jerusalem from Passover till Pentecost. Pentecost was a very joyful gathering; it was “the festival of harvest of the first ripe fruits of your labors, of what you sow in the field.” 
     They should be baked leavened, as first ripe fruits to Jehovah.” It is interesting to notice the use of leaven during this festival. 
    The most notable festival of weeks ever held was the one celebrated after Jesus’ resurrection in the year 33 C.E. The historian Dr. Luke has recorded the events of this memorable Pentecost in detail. (See Acts, chapter 2.) It was on this day that the waving of the two fermented loaves began to have fulfillment. The two loaves symbolically represented the entire body of 144,000 spirit-begotten members of Christ’s body as being waved or presented by Christ Jesus, the greater High Priest, before Jehovah as holy unto Him. The 120 disciples who were gathered in the upper room were the first members presented and the ingathering of the remaining ones has continued from Pentecost 33 C.E. until our day, with a remnant yet living on earth. The first ones were taken from the natural Jews, as foreshadowed by one of the loaves, and then others were taken from the Gentile nations, beginning in 36 C.E., when Peter preached to Cornelius, as represented by the second “loaf.”—Acts 10:1-48.
    ]
    The watchtower I found this information  goes on to explain why the breads were fermented etc..    https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1967523
     
    Nissan 15: That is, Nisan 15. The day after Nisan 14 was always observed as a Sabbath, or holy day of rest, no matter what day of the week it fell on. Additionally, in 33 C.E., Nisan 15 fell on the regular weekly Sabbath, making the day a “great,” or double, Sabbath.—Joh 19:31; see App. B12 (this appendix B12 is worth keeping)
     
    John 19:31: New International Version
    31 Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down.  
    Preparation: A name applied to the day preceding the weekly Sabbath. During this day, the Jews got ready for the Sabbath by preparing extra meals and finishing any work that could not wait until after the Sabbath. In this case, the day of Preparation fell on Nisan 14.—Mr 15:42; see Glossary.
    27:63
    three days: This expression can mean parts of three days. This is evident from the request that the tomb “be made secure until the third day,” and not until the fourth.—Mt 27:64; see study note on Mt 12:40.
    three days and three nights: Other Bible accounts show that this expression can mean parts of three days and that part of one day can be considered a whole day.—Ge 42:17, 18; 1Ki 12:5, 12; Mt 27:62-66; 28:1-6.
     
    I looked this up because it is important.  Enjoy!
     
  11. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    This is how I understand it too. Nissan 14 is Passover day (Thursday after Sundown to Friday sundown.....)and Nissan 15 is a sabbath...... and Nissan 15 happened to also fall on the regular Sabbath - so it was a double sabbath.  (what is the chances of that! - amazing!)
    Because it was a double Sabbath when no work was to be done the bones of the criminals were broken so they could be taken off the stakes and buried.  Jesus had already perished. 
     
  12. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    That was good to read.  Only, Jesus did not need any purification, cleaning or any things else regarding cleaning.  He did need time to talk with Jehovah to be able to focus on the purpose of his anointing.
  13. Haha
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    A royal three course meal - fish, then Passover lamb, dessert and coffee
  14. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    One had to prepare before the sabbath - the sabbath was on the Saturday (a double sabbath whereon NO work was to be done - no cooking etc.  
    I am a bit lazy to investigate but Jesus sent two ahead of him to the upper room to prepare for the Passover.  Passover was not a Sabbath so they could prepare the lamb on that day.... I hope I am correct on this.   ....  Maybe someone (JWI) could give us some more details on this.  (My eyes do not allow much any longer). 
  15. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Thinking in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Nowhere does it say it is exactly 72 hours.  It would have been more accurate to say 72 hours if God meant exactly 72 hours.  So they could have thrown him onto the sea very late late night of first day  (which fits in with Jewish day which starts at sundown), and shortly after the third night when daylight came - spewed him on dry land.....  did not think this through but just an idea.  
    Jesus also spoke of the SIGN of Jonah.  A sign is not literal but an indication of something.  So we do not expect literal 3 days and nights but FOCUS on the SIGN..... just as the budding of the first flowers on trees is a sign that spring is arriving.  
    The focus of all of this is the sign and the fact that Jesus died.  The other additional things are the side events.
     
  16. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Chioke Lin in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    I never assumed this my dear!
    Correct
    Actually he was the cause of the problem - they threw him into the sea at his request.  I agree with you that Jehovah later protected him from the very violent Assyrians when he went there but they listened to him. Their hearts were more receptive than the Jews. 
    I read a scripture where it speaks of the great sabbath: john 19:31  Since it was the day of Preparation, so that the bodies would not remain on the torture stakes on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath day was a great one), the Jews asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken away. 
    Don't worry about your English - it is fine.  I am actually originally from Africa.  My first language is Afrikaans.... a form of Dutch because it was a Dutch colony which was later taken over by the British.... 
  17. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from Pudgy in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    If we were both watching your dog and I said to you: " your dog does that, just like my my cat".  And you say: "why?" .... and I explain: "your dog yawns with a long, stretchy abandon just as my cat does". .......Should you be satisfied with that explanation?..... or  go on and on and try to find many more small little things which are similar between my cat and your dog? 
    That would be excessive would it not?  I was making only one comparison - they yawn the same.
    Similarly, Jesus was only focusing on his death that would happen in future and he called it a sign - which event has a single similarity to the experience of Jonah. What was similar? Jonah was imprisoned in the belly of a fish for 3 days and then he was miraculously released.  Jesus was  imprisoned in death for 3 days and then miraculously released in resurrection.  - that was the sign.
    To go and find out if there are many more little similarities or discrepancies between Jesus and Jonah, going into the number of hours, finding out if Jonah was in a coma within the fish, or dead and then came alive,,, that would be missing the point of the sign that Jesus spoke about.
    It was a sign to prove that Jesus was the Messiah. Jesus knew he would die sometime on Nissan 14 (depending on how long they would take to convict and murder him), because on the original Passover, the  lamb was sacrificed on that date.....and Jesus knew the Law well. He knew the first fruit festival was on Nissan 16 - the second day of the unfermented cakes - and that sometime on that day Jehovah would resurrect him....as the First Fruit to a heavenly life  with a spiritual body.  He gave that as a sign that he was the Messiah.  His death and release.  The messiah came to provide us with a perfect Passover lamb - to be sacrificed and provide the ransom.
  18. Upvote
    Arauna reacted to Chioke Lin in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Since, I am referring to Jesus body after death by means of Sheol, or hell, I use the word protected as a means of his body being cloaked from evil in Jesus case, just as Jonah was shielded from evil. My thought is to the 3 days of Jesus death and the 40 hours that seem to be a point of discussion here.
    Maybe I'm not using the right words to express my thoughts well. Sorry.
  19. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from JW Insider in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Saturday was the regular sabbath on which no cooking on any work was to be done.  It was the first day of the Festival of Unfermented cakes.  The first day being a special day- kept like a Sabbath.
    Festival of Unfermented cakes:
    The first convention of the Jews was to be held in early spring and lasted eight days, from Nisan 14 to 21, to celebrate first the Passover; and then the festival of unfermented cakes. 
    They were occasions of great rejoicing before Jehovah and happy fellowship, joyful, upbuilding reunions of the entire nation.
    Four days previously, on the tenth of the month, each family head had to take into the house a sound male lamb or goat, a year old. After sunset of Nisan 14 it was slaughtered without a bone’s being broken and then roasted whole.
     
    "During the first Passover in Egypt - the blood was splashed upon the upper part of the doorway and upon the two doorposts, where every passerby could see it. After this no one was permitted to leave the house.  “Later in the evening the whole family assembled around the table to eat the Passover lamb or goat with unfermented cakes and bitter herbs. They ate in haste, not sitting down at their tables, but standing, with their hips girded, their sandals on their feet and a staff in their hand. They were ready to leave that very night as Jehovah had promised through his prophet Moses. 
    The eating of the Passover lamb with unfermented cakes and bitter greens reminds the Israelites, not only of the afflictions while they were in Egypt and the hasty departure, but also of the miraculous deliverance from cruel slavery under the mighty Pharaoh. This has made Passover a joyous festival. To express this joy, wine was added later to be used during this festival of liberation and songs were sung, such as the ‘Egyptian Hallel’ during the first part of the celebration, that is, Psalms 113 and 114, and at the conclusion of the feast Psalms 115 to 118. 
    “For, indeed, Christ our Passover has been sacrificed.” (1 Cor. 5:7) Yes, Christ Jesus was offered as the perfect Lamb of God exactly on Nisan 14, in the year 33 C.E. B y this sacrifice the basis was laid for a far greater deliverance than the release from Egyptian captivity.
    The day following Passover marked the beginning of the festival of unfermented cakes, which ran for seven days, from Nisan 15 to 21. During these seven days the Israelites continued to eat unfermented cakes; in fact, no fermentation was to be found in their homes. This law was very strict; anyone found eating what was leavened was to be cut off from the people, put to death. 
    The next day of the convention, Nisan 16, was another featured day. It was the second day of the festival of unfermented cakes, the official opening of the harvest. The Jews were not allowed to eat from the product of the new harvest before this day, when the firstfruits were offered to Jehovah. On this day the high priest was required to wave a sheaf of the barley firstfruits to and fro before Jehovah at the sanctuary. (Lev. 23:10-14)
    During the seven-day festival, in addition to the regular sacrifices, two bullocks, one ram and seven male lambs were offered day by day as burnt offerings and a he-goat as a sin offering, besides the many voluntary offerings by individuals. The festival climaxed with a final general assembly on the seventh day, Nisan 21
    By the waving of the sheaf of the firstfruits of the barley harvest, another important point was foreshadowed. Again it is the apostle Paul who gives us the correct understanding: “However, now Christ has been raised up from the dead, the first fruits of those who have fallen asleep . . . Christ the first fruits.” No ferment or leaven, representing sin, was associated with the presentation of the barley firstfruits, for Jesus Christ was “loyal, guileless, undefiled, separated from the sinners.” As the sheaf was waved on Nisan 16 Jesus was raised as the “first fruits,” or the firstborn from the dead, on Nisan 16, 33 C.E. Since Jesus is called the “first fruits” or “first-born from the dead,” there must be more “fruit” following him. This is foreshadowed by the next festival.
    On Sivan 6, the second national convention was held, the festival of weeks, also called Pentecost, meaning the fiftieth day. It was a one-day convention. Many conventioneers stayed in Jerusalem from Passover till Pentecost. Pentecost was a very joyful gathering; it was “the festival of harvest of the first ripe fruits of your labors, of what you sow in the field.” 
     They should be baked leavened, as first ripe fruits to Jehovah.” It is interesting to notice the use of leaven during this festival. 
    The most notable festival of weeks ever held was the one celebrated after Jesus’ resurrection in the year 33 C.E. The historian Dr. Luke has recorded the events of this memorable Pentecost in detail. (See Acts, chapter 2.) It was on this day that the waving of the two fermented loaves began to have fulfillment. The two loaves symbolically represented the entire body of 144,000 spirit-begotten members of Christ’s body as being waved or presented by Christ Jesus, the greater High Priest, before Jehovah as holy unto Him. The 120 disciples who were gathered in the upper room were the first members presented and the ingathering of the remaining ones has continued from Pentecost 33 C.E. until our day, with a remnant yet living on earth. The first ones were taken from the natural Jews, as foreshadowed by one of the loaves, and then others were taken from the Gentile nations, beginning in 36 C.E., when Peter preached to Cornelius, as represented by the second “loaf.”—Acts 10:1-48.
    ]
    The watchtower I found this information  goes on to explain why the breads were fermented etc..    https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1967523
     
    Nissan 15: That is, Nisan 15. The day after Nisan 14 was always observed as a Sabbath, or holy day of rest, no matter what day of the week it fell on. Additionally, in 33 C.E., Nisan 15 fell on the regular weekly Sabbath, making the day a “great,” or double, Sabbath.—Joh 19:31; see App. B12 (this appendix B12 is worth keeping)
     
    John 19:31: New International Version
    31 Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down.  
    Preparation: A name applied to the day preceding the weekly Sabbath. During this day, the Jews got ready for the Sabbath by preparing extra meals and finishing any work that could not wait until after the Sabbath. In this case, the day of Preparation fell on Nisan 14.—Mr 15:42; see Glossary.
    27:63
    three days: This expression can mean parts of three days. This is evident from the request that the tomb “be made secure until the third day,” and not until the fourth.—Mt 27:64; see study note on Mt 12:40.
    three days and three nights: Other Bible accounts show that this expression can mean parts of three days and that part of one day can be considered a whole day.—Ge 42:17, 18; 1Ki 12:5, 12; Mt 27:62-66; 28:1-6.
     
    I looked this up because it is important.  Enjoy!
     
  20. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from JW Insider in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Jesus cried out " my God why have you forsaken me" (paraphrased)..... 
    If God helped Jesus at this time, then Satan could accuse God of not being fair - that Jesus did not give his all together with his life and suffer of his own free will. Satan  could have said that Jesus was unfairly or extraordinarily helped to endure. He did not really have a death of suffering.
    When they offered Jesus myrrh and wine he refused for the same reason.  This combination was known to deaden the pain and was a kind of drug.  Jesus did everything perfectly so that no legitimate accusations could be brought against his sacrifice.  There were of course, many false accusations.
     
    Sheol and Hades: 
    These words mean the same: the common grave of mankind (all humans go to dust in the common grave of mankind). Gehenna is the second death (this can be discussed later as this refers to death which lasts forever.)
    I can explain this to you in more detail later if you want........  but it is important to know that Jesus died completely!
    What do I mean by that? Many Christians believe Jesus was a body with a separate soul.  Is this belief correct? NO! This belief comes from the Babylonian teachings of the "underworld" where the soul lives on after death or is conscious.  The bible does not teach this at all. 
    In fact, the Bible prophesied that Jesus would put his "soul" in death!   Isaiah 53: 12 
    "For that reason I will assign him a portion among the many, And he will apportion the spoil with the mighty, Because he poured out his soul  even to death And was counted among the transgressors; He carried the sin of many people, And he interceded for the transgressors." Soul is equated with your life as a person, and some translations render it as " life" or a breather".  Question: if only Jesus' body died - then why does the bible say that the "soul" that sinneth, it shall die.....  If only his body died - then our souls are not saved because the entire soul dies! Humans - when they die - everything they are goes into death - also the part which can think and be morally responsible for the person's actions. Ezekiel 18:4 "  Look! All the souls*—to me they belong. As the soul of the father so also the soul of the son—to me they belong. The soul* who sins is the one who will die."   In fact you are a soul (there are many scriptures in the bible which prove this).  One can kill a soul with a sword, a soul has blood; and animals are also called souls!   Josh 11:11 (many translations has living person or soul in this verse);   Genesis 9:4. God allowed Noah and his family to add animal flesh to their diet after the Flood but commanded them not to eat the blood. God told Noah: “Only flesh with its soul—its blood—you must not eat.”   Leviticus 17:14. “You must not eat the blood of any sort of flesh, because the soul of every sort of flesh is its blood. Anyone eating it will be cut off.” God viewed the soul, or life, as being in the blood and belonging to him.    When Jesus died - he died completely.  No part of him remained alive. Jesus is called the Last Adam:  Jesus died the same death as Adam to save us from death - "a life for a life" or soul for soul. Jesus was the only person and last person to be exactly like Adam - a perfect man. (1 Cor 15:45) Adam was created from dust and god blew breath into his nostrils - he became a living soul or person.  (read Genesis 2:7).   (He could not think or do anything conscious before God blew the breath of life into him - he was dust formed into a body).    When Adam sinned - god said he would go back to the condition he was in before he was conscious - before he knew he existed. God said genesis 3: 3 " You must not eat from it, no, you must not touch it; otherwise you will die.’” 4  At this the serpent said to the woman: “You certainly will not die. Satan lied and many people still believe this lie - that we do not completely die!   Genesis 3:19...... "19  In the sweat of your face you will eat bread* until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” Adam went back into nothingness, oblivion... dust - what he was before god created him.   So Adam was perfect and will never exist again (he is in Gehenna or second death)- he chose to disobey God as a perfect human being.  The ransom sacrifice of Jesus works only for imperfect humans who put faith in him and his resurrection - to get a chance of a resurrection to life.   This scripture usually shocks people:  Eccl 3: " 19  for there is an outcome* for humans and an outcome for animals; they all have the same outcome.  As the one dies, so the other dies; and they all have but one spirit. So man has no superiority over animals, for everything is futile. 20  All are going to the same place. They all come from the dust, and they all are returning to the dust."   We are in the same condition as animals at death.  Animals do not receive a resurrection but humans are different.  We are moral beings (we understand good and bad), and have the opportunity to be resurrected.  All is not futile for those who put their trust in Jehovah and the resurrection of Jesus.  Faith in the resurrection allows us remain faithful.  We know we are not lost in the grave forever even if our persecutors may kill us.   I am sure you will have more questions ... am I right?   That is very good!  Go ahead!
  21. Haha
    Arauna got a reaction from JW Insider in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    A royal three course meal - fish, then Passover lamb, dessert and coffee
  22. Like
    Arauna reacted to Chioke Lin in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Thank you for the confirmation. I'm going by memory. 
  23. Like
    Arauna reacted to BroRando in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    Hell (“Sheol” and “Hades” in the Bible’s original languages) is simply the grave, not a place of fiery torment. 
    Why not read more about it?
     
    PS... My Personal Story
    What is it like to die?
    I first learned about death through a Bible Study. After learning the truth about death and that death is the last enemy that will be conquered, I wanted to learn more. Here’s a few scriptures that may give you some Relief and Comfort.
    “For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing at all, nor do they have any more reward, because all memory of them is forgotten.” (Ecclesiastes 9:5)
    My Catholic upbringing always taught me that hell was an eternal place of torment and inescapable. This religious teaching never sat well with me. I could never figure out why the God of Love would do such a thing.
    Then at my Bible Study, I came across this scripture, “hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.” (Rev 20:13) This blew my mind because it connected the dots for me. See, the priests would take money from the parishioners to pray for their dead loved ones, telling us this might get them out of hell. All the while, preaching that hell is ETERNAL. Did they know something I didn’t, I wondered? This was nothing but a ponzi scheme.
    Other scriptures that gave me Relief and Comfort is the good news about the Resurrection. “And I have hope toward God, which hope these men also look forward to, that there is going to be a resurrection of both the righteous and the unrighteous.” (Acts 24:15) I was elated to learn this about my loved ones that have passed in death.
    Then Jesus Christ told his followers, “Do not be amazed at this, for the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice  and come out” (John 5:28)
  24. Upvote
    Arauna got a reaction from JW Insider in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    I am sure that if you keep it civil and not just use your post to get at the GB, the librarian will not mind.  We will not mind either.  We like to have new thoughts.
  25. Thanks
    Arauna got a reaction from JW Insider in Bible Prophecy and 2034. Will you gain spiritual discernment to become a Survivor of the Last Days?   
    My discernment is that Jesus had not need for any purification or any added symbolism regarding his death - the "sign" of Jonah was a "sign" not an exact replication - Jesus was not in a fish for three days.  We do not want the superstition of the Jews who find numerology in almost anything to overwhelm us.  We then lose the purpose of the illustration/sign and meaning of his death.
    All the symbolism about the death of Jesus is found in Hebrews. How he replaced the Passover lamb, being High priest of the new covenant; his flesh died and was disposed of by Jehovah (curtain of the Most holy) tore,  and so forth.
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