Witness

You're saying that there have been no missionaries "preaching" to people in Calcutta at their doors over the years?  Are you also saying that in your Armageddon, these people will not be destroyed?
So, the  choice is to associate with JWs, the only choice that JWs comprehend when a person studies Wt literature with them, which is to join the physical organization.  Is that how they are sanctified?  John 17:17
What does this mean?  According to Jesus what should someone do?  Be dedicated to an organization?  Where in his words does he say this?  Can you show me from the scriptures, or is it only your organization  that says this?  Who's words do JWs listen to?  he Holy Spirit is not restricted to an earthly organization; and believe me, where lies are found - false teachings that cannot be dismissed, Holy Spirit will not be found there.   Jesus said, "For this purpose I have been born, and for this I have come into the world: to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth listens to My voice.”
We have that truth in the scriptures. Do you really believe that Jesus' voice is heard through your leadership that can't even understand his words about "this generation"?  Men, who keep setting dates contrary to what the scriptures tell us? Men who tell their flock that there will be two Armageddon, one now and one a thousand years later?   Are these men truly on the side of truth?
@Arauna, @Thinking - 
"Bible students need to get acquainted with the organization of the “one flock” Jesus spoke about at John 10:16. They must appreciate that identifying themselves with Jehovah’s organization is essential to their salvation. (Rev 7:9,10,15) Therefore, we should start directing our Bible students to the organization as soon as a Bible study is established."    km 11/1990
This is idolatry.  The organization was built "on the earth", "like" other organizations found on the earth.  It was created by men.  Rom 1:25  It is interesting that students are to be directed to what they can literally see established in Satan's world.  1 John 5:19  
‘You shall have no other gods besides Me.
8 ‘You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. 9 You shall not worship them nor serve them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, inflicting the punishment of the fathers on the children, even on the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 10 but showing favor to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."  Deut 5:7-10
As I said, Jesus never taught the foundation members of his temple, to build an earthly organization. They were the "organization" - a heavenly, spiritual one, built on his body.  1 Pet 2:5,9; 1 Cor 3:16; Eph 2:20-22
 
 
 
 

For JWs that "one conclusion" is that the existence of an earthly organization built by uninspired men, is taught as inspired by God. Yet, there are more than one "spirit" that can "inspire" men. (Rev 13:15)
"But the Spirit explicitly says that in later times some will [a]fall ("apostatize") away from the faith, paying attention to deceitful spirits and teachings of demons  by means of the hypocrisy of liars seared in their own conscience as with a branding iron"  1 Tim 4:1,2
Who are the "some" and what do those "some" do?
"But false prophets also appeared among the people, just as there will also be false teachers among you, who will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing swift destruction upon themselves. 2 Many will follow their indecent behavior, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; 3 and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep."   2 Pet 2:1-3
The way of the truth is through Jesus Christ - NEVER THROUGH ANY ORGANIZATION THAT MEN WOULD BUILD.  But that is the one conclusion that every JW has come to believe.  Your leaders have denied their Master who bought them through the anointing.  They have effectively diverted the way of the truth, through their teaching that an organization is necessary to reach salvation.  
 

Ah, this is advertising for the JW Org i see. tithes = donations.  loopholes = clergy penitent privilege 
ever changing rules = new light.   not repentant hearts = immoral elders and m/s. 

I have indeed said myself that I'm due to destruction. As for all the other parts of Babylon the Great, this is a JW forum is it not ? And I 'don't do politics' I leave that to the rest of you. 
Look, it's quite simple. Yeshua showed up the faults of the Pharisees etc, but do you say that He had OCD because He did that ?   Yes, Yeshua had the right to judge them, and you might say i have no right to judge the GB and the Org. But as I've said before, each of us judge things and people everey day. As an example, it seems that tom has judged me to be a moron. But seriously, we all judge what we believe, who we believe, what is truth and what is lies. In my opinion we do not one day without making judgements of some type. You judge me and accuse me of OCD. 
If by giving the warnings that I gave, it helps to save one child from abuse, then I will be happy. If by giving the information that i give it helps just one person to steer clear of lies and destruction, then i will be satisfied.  And Yeshua will judge me. 
 

Answer me this question. Did your GB and it's Org teach that a person "Had to be a baptised JW to be saved" ?
I do not believe that the Watchtower / JW Org is HIS (YHWH) org. If it was it would be a clean Organsation teaching truth. 
But the JW Org is idolatry. And the worship is not pure because the GB and it's helpers try to 'run ahead' of God and His Son. 
I have been a JW, I have seen the hidden sins of the congregations and the false teachings of the GB / org. 

☺️  When wheels spin they make a sound, right? Thoughts put into words. The sound of the  spinning wheels in the brains of the GB, have produced their insane teachings.  "Conflate" - Instead of naming the list of doctrine, "Beliefs Clarified", "Beliefs Conflated" would be more appropriate.
Thanks for that.
 
 

Oh Tom.  
Matt 24:4,5 - And Jesus answered them, “See that no one leads you astray. For many will come in my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and they will lead many astray."
"Christ" means "anointed".  Is it not true that the GB are proudly saying they are the "anointed", who have come in the name of Jesus, but have led their flock astray more times than one can count, without a typed-up wordy list called "Beliefs Clarified" to count from?  Of course, all  wayward teachings of your leaders are not included on that list.  
Since Jesus is Truth, the list alone, has fact-checked Jesus away.  It accuses the Wt leaders before Jesus Christ, as false prophets, false teachers.
As Jesus said, "For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”  Matt 12:37
 

I'll ask my son for a recap.
Who, is seriously spinning their wheels?  Who was implementing intense damage control in the May Broadcast on unity?  Be sure to listen in. 🙂
Truly, Wt. was not built in one day, but I guarantee it will come down a lost faster, than it went up.
Ezekiel chapter 13

@Srecko Sostar "WTJWorg describes its organization as a “place of salvation,” as Noah’s ark."
 
 
 
She undoubtedly believes that the organization is the means of salvation, but here comes the conflict:
@Arauna - No the Org. is NOT the means to our salvation... but Jesus' ransom  and his father Jehovah. 
I notice double blindness is rampant among JWs, a deflecting of any evidence verifying what the GB teaches, and what a JW may believe.  As Arauna many times does, they seem to pick and choose the doctrines they prefer, or the wording they prefer, while dismissing what the leaders may teach in that regard. This, while still holding in reverence, the self-elected position of these false teachers. (Matt 24:24,25; 48-51)  Only exjws who bring out the conflict of belief, as Srecko did, are the “haters”, those with "OCD". JWs can question a doctrine, perhaps realizing it is a lie, and at the same time support the leaders who taught the lie.  That's really all that a JW must do to preserve their place in the organization.  And like Arauna, they are not aware of their own “present truth” – present truth for that year, and for that month. Obviously, Wt. doctrine is hard to keep up with. 
The labels “governing body”, “faithful slave”, “elders”, “organization”, are defended, ruthlessly.  Truths and lies can come and go, but according to Samuel Herd, UNITY to those labels, to the concept behind them; unity practiced at all costs, and defense of men -  their idol and their bogus leadership -  are the only glue that holds these blind people captive in the Wt. (Col 2:8; Rev 13:10; 3:17)
I have four geese, two male, two female, who defend their nest when they are put up each evening.  No matter what feed, what treats they are given, the males attack ruthlessly.  They could starve to death if allowed, if I walked away and let them defend their “organized” haven.  Yes, if I let them, they would create their own famine, just as JWs have done, out of blind spiritual, stiff-necked stupidity.  (Amos 8:11; Rev 18:8)
They refuse to face the truth.  2 Thess 2:9-12
 
How to identify true prophets
 

☺️  When wheels spin they make a sound, right? Thoughts put into words. The sound of the  spinning wheels in the brains of the GB, have produced their insane teachings.  "Conflate" - Instead of naming the list of doctrine, "Beliefs Clarified", "Beliefs Conflated" would be more appropriate.
Thanks for that.
 
 

@Srecko Sostar "WTJWorg describes its organization as a “place of salvation,” as Noah’s ark."
 
 
 
She undoubtedly believes that the organization is the means of salvation, but here comes the conflict:
@Arauna - No the Org. is NOT the means to our salvation... but Jesus' ransom  and his father Jehovah. 
I notice double blindness is rampant among JWs, a deflecting of any evidence verifying what the GB teaches, and what a JW may believe.  As Arauna many times does, they seem to pick and choose the doctrines they prefer, or the wording they prefer, while dismissing what the leaders may teach in that regard. This, while still holding in reverence, the self-elected position of these false teachers. (Matt 24:24,25; 48-51)  Only exjws who bring out the conflict of belief, as Srecko did, are the “haters”, those with "OCD". JWs can question a doctrine, perhaps realizing it is a lie, and at the same time support the leaders who taught the lie.  That's really all that a JW must do to preserve their place in the organization.  And like Arauna, they are not aware of their own “present truth” – present truth for that year, and for that month. Obviously, Wt. doctrine is hard to keep up with. 
The labels “governing body”, “faithful slave”, “elders”, “organization”, are defended, ruthlessly.  Truths and lies can come and go, but according to Samuel Herd, UNITY to those labels, to the concept behind them; unity practiced at all costs, and defense of men -  their idol and their bogus leadership -  are the only glue that holds these blind people captive in the Wt. (Col 2:8; Rev 13:10; 3:17)
I have four geese, two male, two female, who defend their nest when they are put up each evening.  No matter what feed, what treats they are given, the males attack ruthlessly.  They could starve to death if allowed, if I walked away and let them defend their “organized” haven.  Yes, if I let them, they would create their own famine, just as JWs have done, out of blind spiritual, stiff-necked stupidity.  (Amos 8:11; Rev 18:8)
They refuse to face the truth.  2 Thess 2:9-12
 
How to identify true prophets
 

What kind of God do you worship?  One that tells lies?  No doubt. 
God would not send a messenger that presents false predictions, or calls the Pyramid of Giza, “God’s Stone Witness”. 
A messenger from God would tell the truth.  That is the pattern of prophets we see in the scriptures.  Prophets are messengers. 
Read all of Malachi 3 and 4,  to see what that messenger sent in the last days, is assigned to do.  Your leaders have done just the opposite.  
 
 

What kind of God do you worship?  One that tells lies?  No doubt. 
God would not send a messenger that presents false predictions, or calls the Pyramid of Giza, “God’s Stone Witness”. 
A messenger from God would tell the truth.  That is the pattern of prophets we see in the scriptures.  Prophets are messengers. 
Read all of Malachi 3 and 4,  to see what that messenger sent in the last days, is assigned to do.  Your leaders have done just the opposite.  
 
 

What kind of God do you worship?  One that tells lies?  No doubt. 
God would not send a messenger that presents false predictions, or calls the Pyramid of Giza, “God’s Stone Witness”. 
A messenger from God would tell the truth.  That is the pattern of prophets we see in the scriptures.  Prophets are messengers. 
Read all of Malachi 3 and 4,  to see what that messenger sent in the last days, is assigned to do.  Your leaders have done just the opposite.  
 
 

I thought Yeshua (Jesus) was the judge as He has 'all authority in heaven and on earth'. 
It only 'does not matter' if you are wicked enough not to care about the damage they did to other people. What Americans call collateral damage i believe. 
Well the history speaks for itself. Even all the lies about Armageddon which is part of the history ofthe JW org. 
But YHWH didn't find it in the Watchtower /  JW org. From Rusell onward they were not obediant, they were trying to run ahead of God and Christ. How can making false predictions be showing obedience ?  It has all been insults to YHWH and Yeshua. 
 

Russell did not die a martyr's death. No one beheaded him like that "real" messenger John the Baptist. Drawing parallels on the type-antitype model shows its shortcomings, again.
JWs are very disgusted at the mere mention of the word "cross". You see this as a fundamental difference between true and bad worship of God. Russell had no problems with crosses. How is it possible that he saw the truth about “hell” and the “immortal soul” and his mind remained darkened about the “cross”?
How come he didn’t see that he wasn’t FDS or GB or whatever you want to call him? A true “messenger” in the first century said he was not worthy to untie the sandals of Jesus, and Russell allowed his followers to “untie his sandals” and call him titles.
You, as collective, create legends about your religious leaders, past and present, and attribute to them positions, that are in fact, empty and useless like hollow sacks.

Remember Allen, that God abandoned that system of worship, and Jesus fulfilled the law?  (Luke 13:35; Rom 8:4)
2 Cor 4:18 -  So we do not focus on what is seen, but on what is unseen. For what is seen is temporary, but what is unseen is eternal.

Perfect.  It is the lie that the Kingdom of God was born in the heavens; that Jesus began ruling as King in 1914; and that the Gentile times had ended.  
2 Thess 2:  Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered to him: We ask you, brothers and sisters, 2 not to be easily upset or troubled, either by a prophecy or by a message or by a letter supposedly from us, ("false apostles" 2 Cor 11:13) alleging that the day of the Lord has come. 3 Don’t let anyone deceive you in any way. For that day will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction. 4 He opposes and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits in God’s temple, proclaiming that he himself is God.
The Gentile times have not ended.  Elders are spiritual "Gentiles" who rule over the anointed priests/"living stones" of God's dwelling/Temple.  They have trampled the Temple, the anointed of "Israel".  ( Dan 11:31,32,36,38; Mark 13:14; 1 Cor 3:16,17; Rev 11:1,2)

I said, “By your example, at least there are some in the world who get this.”  I wouldn’t call that giving praise to one particular individual.  There are exjws who “get it”.  They refuse to join another religious organization, but prefer to worship “in spirit and truth”.  As you stated, "Organized religion" has given itself such a bad name".  John 4:21-24
From your comment- "putting labels on religions such as "Muslim", "Christian" gets in the way of your prayers to Jesus .....organized religion detracts from Jesus...we've got to take Jesus out of the religious wrapping". This is IT! It's not that religion per say will be destroyed, but organized religion will be.” 
 Aren’t you being a little hypocritical?  Or maybe just blind (Matt 15:14) Truly, I believe you are the one who didn’t “get it”, otherwise you would question the existence of your own organized religion. You said organized religion will be destroyed.  How is it your religion is not included?  Instead, you say it would be impossible to accomplish any mission without organization, obviously condoning your own.  Certainly, you are speaking of religion organized by men, and not by God.  (Zech 4:6,7)
Jesus condemned the “organized” religion that the Wt. practices.  He was speaking to his disciples, chosen people of “Israel”.  In the Wt, there are “Gentiles” and spiritual “Jews”.  Undoubtedly, Jesus knew that his people would ignore his words said in John 4:21-24.
But Jesus called them to Himself and said to them, “You know that those who are considered rulers over the Gentiles (ELDERS) lord it over them, and their great ones (GB) exercise authority over them. 43 Yet it shall not be so among you; but whoever desires to become great among you shall be your servant. 44 And whoever of you desires to be first shall be slave of all. 45 For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give His life a ransom for many.”  Mark 4:42-45
The GB exercises authority over the elder body.  The elder body rules over all JWs - "Gentiles", but especially God’s “special possession” – His priesthood.  (1 Pet 2:5,9) But, forget what Jesus says, right?  This arrangement seems to be all okay with JWs.
However, according to the words of Jesus, it is not okay with God.  In the Wt’s case, “organized religion detracts from Jesus”.   Russel's quote on organization, was the most important group of words he could have ever uttered.  
 
 

And because he said this, you can erase Jesus' words in John 4 as well.  
Then why do you appear to agree with what was said in the show?
@Anna - The journalist whose story this is, overhears Doug Coe, one of the leaders of the Family, saying to another member that "putting labels on religions such as "Muslim", "Christian" gets in the way of your prayers to Jesus .....organized religion detracts from Jesus...we've got to take Jesus out of the religious wrapping". This is IT! It's not that religion per say will be destroyed, but organized religion will be. One of the episodes is called One World Order. Arauna would be proud of me.
And is the Holy Spirit behind this visible force?  Is it behind any other religious organization's productivity?  Is the Wt. better than any other?  Yes, it functions on a sterile level of organization, and not on love for truth. You, of all JWs here, know this.   What good is it, to produce magazines full of teachings that could change in a few months?  And people are disfellowshipped for rejecting doctrine that ends up being changed.  
Beware of "organization.” It is wholly unnecessary. The Bible rules will be the only rules you will need. Do not seek to bind others' consciences, and do not permit others to bind yours. Believe and obey so far as you understand God’s Word today, and so continue growing in grace and knowledge and love day by day. (The Watchtower, September 15, 1895)
 
 
 
 
 

 

Where does your own religious organization fit in?
I know Catholics who are aware I believe in Jesus Christ.  They treat me as if I am a “sister”.
I know Mormons.  As a Catholic I grew up with their children.  They treat me as if I am their “sister”. 
My Baptist neighbor tells me I am her “sister in the faith”, although she knows I would never step foot in her church after my experience with “organization”. 
I know JWs.  They treat me as if I’m dead. 
Which organization, that touts “organization” more so than any other, do you believe Jesus needs to be removed from first?
“Whoever does not do what is right is not of God, especially the one who does not love his brother. 11 For this is the message you have heard from the beginning: We should love one another, 12 unlike Cain, who was of the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his works were evil, and his brother’s were righteous. 13 Do not be surprised, brothers, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers. The one who does not love remains in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him.”  1 John 3
The “world” that hated the disciples of Christ, was the world of the Jews.  Jesus rejected that organization for rejecting TRUTH.  Today’s “Jews” are in the organization that believe it belongs to God.  They tolerate falsehoods and reject truth from those whom Jesus has sent.  (Matt 5:11,12; 23:34; Rev 18:4-8)
Who gets more press; Jesus Christ, the GB or "organization" in the Wt? Why not leave Jesus totally out of it and let the GB sail along as captains of their own organization, their own idol?  Wait, they're already doing that!  (Rom 1:25) So again, what organization does Jesus need to be removed from, first? 
Is it not true that it is said, the Wt is the greatest, the best, and will survive Armageddon?  What other religion is like that organization, what can make war with it?  (Rev 13:4)
Organized religion is physical.  Jesus said, in the last days there would NO physical "mountain", as Wt's "mountainlike organization", that God would approve.  John 4:21-24
By your example, at least there are some in the world who get this.  God's people have hardened hearts, and refuse to worship only, in spirit and in truth.  (2 Thess 2:9-12)
 
 
 
 

Those who say “…Such things could never happen in America …”, perhaps forget that recently we were fined outrageous amounts of money for NOT buying Government health insurance.

Things have changed "in an instant".  BLM.  It was an adjustment to understand that everyone else now knows this term as "Black Lives Matter".  That's perfectly fine with me.  But I still see those letters as representing public land that I can hike on.  I suppose now I am a target to be prosecuted.  

And because he said this, you can erase Jesus' words in John 4 as well.  
Then why do you appear to agree with what was said in the show?
@Anna - The journalist whose story this is, overhears Doug Coe, one of the leaders of the Family, saying to another member that "putting labels on religions such as "Muslim", "Christian" gets in the way of your prayers to Jesus .....organized religion detracts from Jesus...we've got to take Jesus out of the religious wrapping". This is IT! It's not that religion per say will be destroyed, but organized religion will be. One of the episodes is called One World Order. Arauna would be proud of me.
And is the Holy Spirit behind this visible force?  Is it behind any other religious organization's productivity?  Is the Wt. better than any other?  Yes, it functions on a sterile level of organization, and not on love for truth. You, of all JWs here, know this.   What good is it, to produce magazines full of teachings that could change in a few months?  And people are disfellowshipped for rejecting doctrine that ends up being changed.  
Beware of "organization.” It is wholly unnecessary. The Bible rules will be the only rules you will need. Do not seek to bind others' consciences, and do not permit others to bind yours. Believe and obey so far as you understand God’s Word today, and so continue growing in grace and knowledge and love day by day. (The Watchtower, September 15, 1895)
 
 
 
 
 

 

Where does your own religious organization fit in?
I know Catholics who are aware I believe in Jesus Christ.  They treat me as if I am a “sister”.
I know Mormons.  As a Catholic I grew up with their children.  They treat me as if I am their “sister”. 
My Baptist neighbor tells me I am her “sister in the faith”, although she knows I would never step foot in her church after my experience with “organization”. 
I know JWs.  They treat me as if I’m dead. 
Which organization, that touts “organization” more so than any other, do you believe Jesus needs to be removed from first?
“Whoever does not do what is right is not of God, especially the one who does not love his brother. 11 For this is the message you have heard from the beginning: We should love one another, 12 unlike Cain, who was of the evil one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his works were evil, and his brother’s were righteous. 13 Do not be surprised, brothers, if the world hates you. 14 We know that we have passed from death to life because we love our brothers. The one who does not love remains in death. 15 Everyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life residing in him.”  1 John 3
The “world” that hated the disciples of Christ, was the world of the Jews.  Jesus rejected that organization for rejecting TRUTH.  Today’s “Jews” are in the organization that believe it belongs to God.  They tolerate falsehoods and reject truth from those whom Jesus has sent.  (Matt 5:11,12; 23:34; Rev 18:4-8)
Who gets more press; Jesus Christ, the GB or "organization" in the Wt? Why not leave Jesus totally out of it and let the GB sail along as captains of their own organization, their own idol?  Wait, they're already doing that!  (Rom 1:25) So again, what organization does Jesus need to be removed from, first? 
Is it not true that it is said, the Wt is the greatest, the best, and will survive Armageddon?  What other religion is like that organization, what can make war with it?  (Rev 13:4)
Organized religion is physical.  Jesus said, in the last days there would NO physical "mountain", as Wt's "mountainlike organization", that God would approve.  John 4:21-24
By your example, at least there are some in the world who get this.  God's people have hardened hearts, and refuse to worship only, in spirit and in truth.  (2 Thess 2:9-12)