Anna

Something I thought might be relevant since we are studying the God's Kingdom book. Not long ago, in a WT article, it was mentioned in reference to the "Kingdom being preached in all the inhabited earth" that this will not mean that literally everyone on Earth would have heard about the Kingdom before Armageddon starts.
When one does a bit of mathematics (not my forte) and calculates the percentage of current Jehovah's Witnesses in comparison to the World's population we arrive at 0.1%. This is a very small percentage indeed. (8 million JW to 8 billion population)
If we were to assume some averages, and use the United States as a fair example, then we can assume the ratio of 1 publisher to roughly around 400. This seems a fair number since "only a few are the ones finding the road to life". However, as we know, there is practically a non existent ratio when it comes to India and China, two of the world's countries with a population of over 1billion each (the majority of whom have never heard of the Bible, never mind Jehovah's Witnesses).  If we would assume the same ratio of 1:400, then this would immediately create over 3 million Witnesses in each of the two countries, i.e. over 6 million in India and China alone, bringing the total of JWs to over 14 million. If we were to also add 650 thousand in Indonesia, 485 thousand from Pakistan, and 402 thousand from Bangladesh that adds another 1.5 million bringing the total to over 15 million, almost doubling the Witnesses today.
If we go by the fact that all people are equal in Jehovah's eyes, and that no nation is above another when it comes to salvation, and that all people are basically the same, then we have to assume that there are people in those countries who, if given the chance, would embrace the truth and put themselves on Jehovah's side and create that ratio of 1:400.
With that in mind, it is evident that either there is going to have to be a lot of preaching done, verging on the miraculous, in order to bring in over 7 million new Witnesses within the allotted time of the "Generation", or, Jehovah will judge their hearts and allow nearly HALF of the people, (agnostics or believers in false Gods) entry into the new world without them even needing to know him.
Or, is "this Generation" a lot longer than we think.....
Any scriptural thoughts?
 

And of course there is the:
“But if ever that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is delaying,  and he starts to beat his fellow slaves and to eat and drink with the confirmed drunkards, the master of that slave will come on a day that he does not expect and in an hour that he does not know,  and he will punish him with the greatest severity and will assign him his place with the hypocrites. There is where his weeping and the gnashing of his teeth will be". Matt 24: 48 - 51
That would keep me awake at night!

In the past months, there have been quite a few study articles with regard to the GB/Slave. I am trying to get an overall  understanding of 2 particular WT articles on this one topic, so that two quotes from the WTs harmonize. 
Today's WT study (Nov 2016) p.15 par.9:  "Some may feel that they can interpret the Bible on their own. However, Jesus has appointed the ‘faithful slave’ to be the only channel for dispensing spiritual food. Since 1919, the glorified Jesus Christ has been using that slave to help his followers understand God’s own Book and heed its directives.’"
And
WT Feb.2017 p.26. par.12 " The Governing Body is neither inspired nor infallible. Therefore, it can err in doctrinal matters or in organizational direction. In fact, the Watch Tower Publications Index includes the heading “Beliefs Clarified,” which lists adjustments in our Scriptural understanding since 1870".
It seems that the key to making sense of these 2 seemingly opposing quotes is in the above paragraph if we continue reading: " Of course, Jesus did not tell us that his faithful slave would produce perfect spiritual food".

Again with these narratives... The Watchtower was never a member of the United Nations whatsoever because no charter of registration EVER existed at all (such information is unfounded because it never existed). The Guardian, which is part of the MSM is known for making such stories in regards to faiths they do not agree with vs those they are in favor of, this is the same Guardian has been warmongering since the day the US went into Afghanistan when the towers were hit alongside the Pentagon. This is absolute fact granted, us Truthers see the UN as a legitimate threat and know how they operate and the like, as is with the MSM.
The NWT seems to only be deemed inaccuracy by KJV-Onlyist who do not realize Westcott & Hort. Mainly if you understand Strong's Concordances, and roots in the Hebrew or Greek language at a basic sense.
As for ARC, it isn't that shocking when you actually went into the whole thing from start to finish. Especially Case Study 29, mainly in the case of incest. Surprisingly, people actually woke up to what was really said in ARC vs those who make their own commentary and misapply what is true and what is false. In ARC, one person in particular was not even mentioned by EXJWs, and that person is Professor Holly Folk, who attested to the fact that at least 380+ allegations regarding CSA had been reported to the police at the time they had happened, and among them many convictions in the 100+. So the notion that information was hidden from law enforcement, according to EXJWs, was proven to be untrue.
That being said, for a community of folks who hang out with each other, it would be wise to actually show them what is true and what is false. The fact the UN was roped into this when that notion was 100% false shows there is a deliberate action to accept falsehood while claiming to be of Christ. It makes no sense, and it is somewhat of disrespect those who are very confrontation with the United Nations.
 
 
Do not fool your flock. Like I said, you do not have to agree with your former faith, but do not attest to falsehoods and preach it as a truth, that in of itself is something Christians should avoid. This is why you have to really be careful to be a Christian who adheres to the such, even the MSM of all entities, concerning such delusions - Psalm 109:2-4; Matthew 16:6; Romans 16:17-18.

Gulp. No wonder they've got no time to read my stuff

Correct. The real discussions are going on in the closed club. 

Gulp. No wonder they've got no time to read my stuff

Bingo
 

Similarly, it is not as though my current efforts to stay Pudgy’s more outrageous remarks have been ineffective. They have been effective.

It is just that they have not been as effective as they could have been and perhaps I should be searching for a new approach.
 

Berenson has played the idiot for much of the pandemic. So I stopped following anything of his for over a year now. The point is that Fauci is adding his name to a paper that admits vaccine weaknesses that he went to a lot of trouble not to admit before.

The above is curious news, because it has recently been pointed out that there were secret meetings with several leading vaccine specialists (although the reasons these particular scientists and leaders were selected becomes obvious after their decision was made). Fauci was one of those leaders. The point was to discuss whether natural immunity should count as one or more vaccine doses when deciding how widely to try to push the vaccine on the public. Some voted that those who caught Covid should have this counted as one or two doses, or even more due to the (untested) probability that catching the virus was a better protection than the vaccine itself.
Ultimately the vote was not to count it as ANY doses and to LIE and MISLEAD the public about the idea that there is little to NO value in natural immunity. (The very opposite of Fauci's position about respiratory viruses in the previous year before the pandemic.) You can even watch Fauci take that very question from Sanjay Gupta on CNN and watch him prevaricate awkwardly to promote the vaccine through some misleading responses. Later he would be caught directly lying. Later it was also shown that all tests proved the very opposite of the claims made publicly by several of the people involved in the secret meeting. Natural immunity was always better and longer-lasting than the vaccine.

Alex Berenson has been known to stretch the truth, but is often on the right track.  I also read the paper he refers to and he's only slightly stretching it.
Here's his latest "bombshell" about a paper Fauci co-authored very recently:
Dr. Anthony Fauci now admits the mRNA Covid vaccines hardly work and might not be approvable
In fact, a bombshell paper he co-authored last month suggests ALL vaccines for common respiratory viruses may face intractable hurdles. And that's not even the worst news. I'm not exaggerating.
Alex Berenson Feb 8 Last month, three scientists pointed out flu shots barely work and couldn’t be approved based on the standards used for vaccines like measles:
“After more than 60 years of experience with influenza vaccines, very little improvement in vaccine prevention of infection has been noted… our best approved influenza vaccines would be inadequate for licensure for most other vaccine-preventable diseases.” [emphasis added]
True. Several rigorous papers have proven that flu shots are placebos masquerading as public policy.
But the same scientists then compared our beloved and groundbreaking Covid vaccines to those pointless flu jabs:
As variant SARS-CoV-2 strains have emerged, deficiencies in these [Covid] vaccines reminiscent of influenza vaccines have become apparent.
Just who are these vicious anti-vax rebels?
Three researchers at the National Institutes for Health. Including one whose name may ring a bell: the now-retired Dr. Anthony S. Fauci.
Yet the Covid/flu shot comparison is only one of the article’s bombshells.
At its core, the piece raises the question of whether any vaccines can ever work well enough to matter against bugs like common coronaviruses, influenza, and RSV.
And that question hides an even more troubling one, one the authors do not ask: have our efforts to beat Sars-Cov-2 by driving our immune response in ways it was not designed to go caused dangers we are only beginning to understand?

Whoever is the poster I think he or she is not doing it anymore, making he or she a post poster.
How many posts can a post poster post if a post poster can post posts?

Yes. I think this is pretty much the reason some of us like to come here (and even more so the closed club where we can discuss deeper things without the distraction of opposers). If one has been in the truth for a long time, and has had much experience in the truth, then the basics just repeated over and over are not enough for some. There are always new things to learn! And sometimes these things can be a bit controversial and frowned upon by others, but I don't feel bad, in fact I feel positively enlightened 😀

I haven't blocked you. I posted the core beliefs HERE
But I will list them here too, since this a relevant topic here.
God. We worship the one true and Almighty God, the Creator, whose name is Jehovah. (Psalm 83:18; Revelation 4:11) He is the God of Abraham, Moses, and Jesus.—Exodus 3:6; 32:11; John 20:17.
Bible. We recognize the Bible as God’s inspired message to humans. (John 17:17; 2 Timothy 3:16) We base our beliefs on all 66 of its books, which include both the “Old Testament” and the “New Testament.” Professor Jason D. BeDuhn aptly described it when he wrote that Jehovah’s Witnesses built “their system of belief and practice from the raw material of the Bible without predetermining what was to be found there.” *
While we accept the entire Bible, we are not fundamentalists. We recognize that parts of the Bible are written in figurative or symbolic language and are not to be understood literally.—Revelation 1:1.
Jesus. We follow the teachings and example of Jesus Christ and honor him as our Savior and as the Son of God. (Matthew 20:28; Acts 5:31) Thus, we are Christians. (Acts 11:26) However, we have learned from the Bible that Jesus is not Almighty God and that there is no Scriptural basis for the Trinity doctrine.—John 14:28.
The Kingdom of God. This is a real government in heaven, not a condition in the hearts of Christians. It will replace human governments and accomplish God’s purpose for the earth. (Daniel 2:44; Matthew 6:9, 10) It will take these actions soon, for Bible prophecy indicates that we are living in “the last days.”—2 Timothy 3:1-5; Matthew 24:3-14.
Jesus is the King of God’s Kingdom in heaven. He began ruling in 1914.—Revelation 11:15.
Salvation. Deliverance from sin and death is possible through the ransom sacrifice of Jesus. (Matthew 20:28; Acts 4:12) To benefit from that sacrifice, people must not only exercise faith in Jesus but also change their course of life and get baptized. (Matthew 28:19, 20; John 3:16; Acts 3:19, 20) A person’s works prove that his faith is alive. (James 2:24, 26) However, salvation cannot be earned—it comes through “the undeserved kindness of God.”—Galatians 2:16, 21.
Heaven. Jehovah God, Jesus Christ, and the faithful angels reside in the spirit realm. * (Psalm 103:19-21; Acts 7:55) A relatively small number of people—144,000—will be resurrected to life in heaven to rule with Jesus in the Kingdom.—Daniel 7:27; 2 Timothy 2:12; Revelation 5:9, 10; 14:1, 3.
Earth. God created the earth to be mankind’s eternal home. (Psalm 104:5; 115:16; Ecclesiastes 1:4) God will bless obedient people with perfect health and everlasting life in an earthly paradise.—Psalm 37:11, 34.
Evil and suffering. These began when one of God’s angels rebelled. (John 8:44) This angel, who after his rebellion was called “Satan” and “Devil,” persuaded the first human couple to join him, and the consequences have been disastrous for their descendants. (Genesis 3:1-6; Romans 5:12) In order to settle the moral issues raised by Satan, God has allowed evil and suffering, but He will not permit them to continue forever.
Death. People who die pass out of existence. (Psalm 146:4; Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10) They do not suffer in a fiery hell of torment.
God will bring billions back from death by means of a resurrection. (Acts 24:15) However, those who refuse to learn God’s ways after being raised to life will be destroyed forever with no hope of a resurrection.—Revelation 20:14, 15.
Family. We adhere to God’s original standard of marriage as the union of one man and one woman, with sexual immorality being the only valid basis for divorce. (Matthew 19:4-9) We are convinced that the wisdom found in the Bible helps families to succeed.—Ephesians 5:22–6:1.
Our worship. We do not venerate the cross or any other images. (Deuteronomy 4:15-19; 1 John 5:21) Key aspects of our worship include the following:
Praying to God.—Philippians 4:6.
Reading and studying the Bible.—Psalm 1:1-3.
Meditating on what we learn from the Bible.—Psalm 77:12.
Meeting together to pray, study the Bible, sing, express our faith, and encourage fellow Witnesses and others.—Colossians 3:16; Hebrews 10:23-25.
Preaching the “good news of the Kingdom.”—Matthew 24:14.
Helping those in need.—James 2:14-17.
Constructing and maintaining Kingdom Halls and other facilities used to further our worldwide Bible educational work.—Psalm 127:1.
Sharing in disaster relief.—Acts 11:27-30.
Our organization. We are organized into congregations, each of which is overseen by a body of elders. However, the elders do not form a clergy class, and they are unsalaried. (Matthew 10:8; 23:8) We do not practice tithing, and no collections are ever taken at our meetings. (2 Corinthians 9:7) All our activities are supported by anonymous donations.
The Governing Body, a small group of mature Christians who serve at our world headquarters, provides direction for Jehovah’s Witnesses worldwide.—Matthew 24:45.
Our unity. We are globally united in our beliefs. (1 Corinthians 1:10) We also work hard to have no social, ethnic, racial, or class divisions. (Acts 10:34, 35; James 2:4) Our unity allows for personal choice, though. Each Witness makes decisions in harmony with his or her own Bible-trained conscience.—Romans 14:1-4; Hebrews 5:14.
Our conduct. We strive to show unselfish love in all our actions. (John 13:34, 35) We avoid practices that displease God, including the misuse of blood by taking blood transfusions. (Acts 15:28, 29; Galatians 5:19-21) We are peaceful and do not participate in warfare. (Matthew 5:9; Isaiah 2:4) We respect the government where we live and obey its laws as long as these do not call on us to disobey God’s laws.—Matthew 22:21; Acts 5:29.
Our relationships with others. Jesus commanded: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.” He also said that Christians “are no part of the world.” (Matthew 22:39; John 17:16) So we try to “work what is good toward all,” yet we remain strictly neutral in political affairs and avoid affiliation with other religions. (Galatians 6:10; 2 Corinthians 6:14) However, we respect the choices that others make in such matters.—Romans 14:12.
https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/jehovah-witness-beliefs/
 

Thanks  I have been able to get hold of them...big read ahead I suppose 

Very interesting and detailed as usual. B W Schulz and R. M. de Vienne (deceased) showed themselves again to be meticulous researches who clearly took time to read a lot of source material to avoid jumping to conclusions. This topic is an area full of ideas that were arrived at this way.
Some of the details here I have never seen anywhere else.
If anyone has learned things from any of his books so far that they would like to share, or discuss, or even disagree with, then I hope they'll join a conversation about it.
I've read the N.H.Barbour book and Volume 1 of "Separate Identity." I learned a lot from both of those.

The subject was not "imperfection" but the manner at looking at a subject - that it can be interpreted in 16 different ways = which is not possible when one assumes that there is a best way of doing something or the matter of "truth".  Truth is reality, unadulterated, unblemished, uncorrupted, and so on and on. Truth is not ten or 16 different opinions with all of them acceptable.

Aren't they just. I won't be able to look at discussions about apostates in the same way anymore....

The “System” as it is now has enough momentum and inertia that all the things you foresee cannot happen for at least 80 years.
You have your opinion, and I have my opinion, and all people have at least five bodily orifices.
Either way, Arauna, before any of this happens, both you and I will be safely ….. dead.

…. Let the Reader beware ….

It's a little easier for modern readers to accept our theory than it would have been for readers and listeners at the time Revelation was written. It's very easy for modern readers who use Arabic numerals like we do in Western and Arabic-influenced nations.
In European languages or Arabic, the number six-hundred-sixty-six would look like this: 666.
But in the Greek of Revelation the number was written to look more like χξϛ  or in the oldest manuscript of Revelation and a couple of others the number is XIC. which is not 666 but 616. 
In Latin, just as an analogy, it would look like DCLXVI. One of the oldest Latin translations, however, has it as DCXVI. And to show that this wasn't just a copyist error, the number was also spelled out in the Latin words for "six hundred and sixteen" not just the Roman numerals for 616.
Irenaeus knew about the 616 reading as early as 180 CE, which is even earlier than any known Bible manuscripts of Revelation, but he preferred the number 666, and considered 616 to be a copyist's error. 200 years later (380) Jerome made a new translation into Latin and "corrected" the DCXVI to DCLXVI.
In Hebrew it could look like this: (MSV or TRSV).  [Mem [600] Samekh [60] Vav [6] or Tau [400] Resh [200] Samekh [60] Vav [6] ]
But what's even more interesting is that we can't take a number like 616 and make it mean the same thing no matter how we position the numerals. (661 does not equal 166 does not equal 616) But in Greek you could write the number as XIC, CIX, IXC, XCI etc, and it would always say 616. Same in Hebrew. In fact, in old Hebrew documents and even now, certain order exceptions are common or preferred. Note this from  https://smontagu.org/writings/HebrewNumbers.html
The numerical value of each letter is fixed and not determined by position, so reordering a number will not change its value. This may be done when a number spells out a word with negative connotations (e.g. 298: RESH TSADI HET is the Hebrew for “murder” so it is sometimes written as RESH HET TSADI), or when the reordered form has especially positive connotations (e.g 18: YUD HET is often written as HET YUD, the Hebrew for “alive”). Unlike the previous exception, using the regular form in these cases is not considered an error.
If the last two digits of a number are 15 or 16, they should be expressed not as YUD HE (10+5) and YUD VAV (10+6), but as TET VAV (9+6) and TET ZAYIN (9+7). This is done to avoid a close resemblance to the Tetragrammaton (four-letter name of God) YUD HE VAV HE. Although this convention is originally derived from religious practice, it is universally used even in completely secular contexts.
It's obvious, then, that readers of Greek and Hebrew were even more alert to recalculations of numbers, or the words that might be conveyed. After all, most words could also just be a more convoluted way to convey a number. For example, some say that Matthew is putting special emphasis on the Davidic line when he breaks up the generations from Abraham to Jesus into groups of 14. In Hebrew, the word "DAVID" is also a way to write the number 14. Other Jewish writers did this type of thing regularly.
Here's some info from Wikipedia:
... the appearance of the figure 616 in the Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus (C; Paris—one of the four great uncial codices), as well as in the Latin version of Tyconius (DCXVI, ed. Souter in the Journal of Theology, SE, April 1913), and in an ancient Armenian version (ed. Conybeare, 1907). Irenaeus knew about the 616 reading, but did not adopt it (Haer. V, 30). In the 380s, correcting the existing Latin-language version of the New Testament (commonly referred to as the Vetus Latina), Jerome retained "666".[13][14]

  Fragment from Papyrus 115 (P115) of Revelation in the 66th vol. of the Oxyrhynchus series (P. Oxy. 4499).[15] Has the number of the beast as χιϛ, 616. Around 2005, a fragment from Papyrus 115, taken from the Oxyrhynchus site, was discovered at the University of Oxford's Ashmolean Museum. It gave the beast's number as 616 (χις). This fragment is the oldest manuscript (about 1,700 years old) of Revelation 13 found as of 2017.[2][3]Codex Ephraemi Rescriptus, known before the Papyrus 115 finding but dating to after it, has 616 written in full: ἑξακόσιοι δέκα ἕξ, hexakosioi deka hex (lit. "six hundred and sixteen").[16]
Papyrus 115 and Ephraemi Rescriptus have led some scholars to regard 616 as the original number of the beast.[17] According to Paul Louis, "The number 666 has been substituted for 616 either by analogy with 888, the [Greek] number of Jesus (Gustav Adolf Deissmann), or because it is a triangular number, the sum of the first 36 numbers (1+2+3+4+5+6+...+36 = 666)".[18]

I can imagine Jehovah sticking his "hand" up a meat puppet and animating it and I can imagine him doing the same with a so-called spiritual body, but what it is that is Jehovah is always and forever beyond encompassing the understanding by any creature. We can get the fringes of his ways and we can have our senses filled as well, but we might as well be climbing on our roofs to get a closer look at the moon for "getting a better look at Jehovah".

Aren't they just. I won't be able to look at discussions about apostates in the same way anymore....

This is what I think of when we start talking about apostates.
All the parties involved are a bunch of ineffectual, fat corgi's.