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Anna

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  1. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from James Thomas Rook Jr. in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    Yes, that's your opinion. My opinion is the video is embarrassing and would not impress the public.
    That's a whole different topic and a very complex one. Unless you've been directly involved in this issue or have had several personal experiences you can't really know what you're talking about. This topic is discussed elsewhere if you want to comment there.
  2. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from James Thomas Rook Jr. in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    Not always a solution though is it? It very much depends on who takes their place!
  3. Haha
    Anna reacted to Vic Vomidog in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    Hehehehe
  4. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Your answer:
    I certainly don't claim to understand everything about Russell's ideology. I'm actually not even insisting that he erred in judgment. He may very well be right when he claimed that the great crowd of Revelation 7:14 will be in heaven. Our own current teaching on that particular verse could change. Of course, this would not change the Scriptural fact that a great crowd of people would survive the great tribulation and live on earth. And it would not change the fact that Russell also knew --from places outside this particular verse-- that there would be a great crowd of people on earth, which you and I already accept.
    But it makes no sense for you to complain about a claim that Russell might have erred if you also admit that there was a time when he didn't have all the facts and would only eventually receive God's guidance in certain matters. I'm sure that you yourself would also admit that he might have erred in judgment before having all the facts. But you haven't been clear if this means that his "initial" judgment was wrong and he eventually came around to seeing that the "great crowd" would NOT be in heaven, or if he never believed what he said, and/or meant something different all along.
    Neither choice would explain why Rutherford also believed the "great crowd" would be in heaven . This was something Rutherford believed up until at least 1933, and probably up until closer to 1935.
    I'd be happy to change my opinion about what Russell said, if you could show the evidence that he meant something else, or didn't mean what he said, or changed his opinion on this matter over time. That's not just for you, but for anyone who can show any evidence.
    Based on years of interaction, I have a feeling that you dig in your heels and insist on making claims without evidence because you seem anxious to prove your own superior knowledge about Russell and the Bible Students. On certain points, I think you have provided valuable references and resources. On this point however, it's not just Russell's own words you are up against, but you are also opposing the more current understanding of the Watchtower when the beliefs of Russell and the Bible Students are reviewed:
    *** w64 12/1 p. 724 Out of the Tombs to a “Resurrection of Life” ***
    For many years Christian Bible students understood the “resurrection of life” to include (1) the church or congregation of the 144,000 joint heirs of Christ, and (2) an unnumbered “great company” of spiritual Christians not included in the 144,000 but serving under them in heaven I think you've seen evidence that the Watchtower is correct here, and that your claim is incorrect. Bible Students held this belief from as far back as the 1880 Watchtower, and put it in print as recently as 1933. I didn't double-check the Watchtowers of this period, but I see it in Vindication (1932) and Preparation (1933). (When the Jonadab class was still considered separate from the "great multitude.") It's possible that it was even repeated up until the doctrine was changed in 1935.
    Here's a mention of that in 2003 and elsewhere:
    *** w03 2/15 p. 19 par. 9 What Does the Lord’s Evening Meal Mean to You? ***
    But on May 31, 1935, in a discourse given at a convention of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Washington, D.C., U.S.A., it was Scripturally explained that the “great crowd” (“great multitude,” King James Version) refers to the “other sheep” who live during the time of the end. (John 10:16) After that convention, some who had previously partaken of the Memorial emblems stopped partaking because they realized that their hope was earthly, not heavenly. *** w98 2/15 p. 20 par. 8 Glorious Freedom Soon for the Children of God ***
    In 1935 the “great multitude,” or “great crowd”—formerly thought to be a secondary spiritual class that would be “companions” of the bride of Christ in heaven *** w95 2/1 p. 13 par. 16 A Great Crowd of True Worshipers—From Where Have They Come? ***
    For a time Jehovah’s servants believed that the great multitude (or, great crowd) of Revelation 7:9, 10 . . . Because the Bible says that they are “standing before the throne,” it was thought that they would be in heaven, not on thrones, ruling as joint heirs with Christ, but in a secondary place in front of the throne. They were viewed as less faithful Christians, ones who did not show a spirit of true self-sacrifice. In 1935 that view was corrected. You said that following a quote from Volume 2 of "SiS" The Time is at Hand. Unfortunately, that quote and that book also does not support your opposition to Russell's clear statements, and your opposition to the Watchtower's more recent statements quoted above. That book was written when Watch Tower publications were still consistent that both the 144,000 and the "great multitude" would go to heaven. 
    After this you quoted quite a few things from Volume 3 of "SiS" Thy Kingdom Come, especially the portions about the wheat and tares. If you read more of Russell's words on the subject you will see that the portion you quoted was not relevant to his understanding of Revelation 7:9-17. Russell did have a confused belief about the tares, but this was necessary because if you read the contemporary Watch Tower articles on the subject you will see that he actually did tie the tares to other Christian groups and religions of Christendom, and he therefore had to try to remove the idea that being "burnt in the fire" referred to their destruction. After all these "burnt" ones were still going to heaven in Russell's view. Watch carefully how Russell managed this amazing feat, in the same book you quoted, Thy Kingdom Come:
    Is not this a most remarkable agreement between this stone "Witness" and the Bible? The dates, October, 1874, and October, 1881, are exact, while the date 1910, though not furnished in the Scriptures, seems more than a reasonable one for some important event in the Church's experience and final testing, while A.D. 1914 is apparently well-defined as its close, after which the world's greatest trouble is due, in which some of the "great multitude" may have a share. And in this connection let us remember that this date limit--A.D. 1914--may not only witness the completion of the selection and trial and glorification of the entire body of Christ, but it may also witness the purifying of some of that larger company of consecrated believers who, through fear and faint-heartedness, failed to render acceptable sacrifices to God, and who therefore became more or less contaminated with the world's ideas and ways. Some of these, before the end of this period, may come up out of the great tribulation. Many such are now being closely bound in with the various bundles of tares for the burning; and not until the fiery trouble of the latter end of the harvest period shall burn the binding cords of Babylon's bondage shall these be able to make their escape--"saved so as by fire." They must see the utter wreck of Great Babylon and receive some measure of her plagues. The four years from 1910 to the end of 1914, indicated thus in the Great Pyramid, will doubtless be a time of "fiery trial" upon the Church  . . . What Russell did here, of course, was to replace the fiery destruction of the tares (weeds) with the idea that these actually represented the place from which the "great multitude" would be saved from. The "fire" became a time of "fiery trial" with a purifying effect. It becomes 4 years of a great tribulation (from about 1910 to 1914) that would come on the Church. The "great multitude" would be saved out of this "great tribulation." This fire would evidently also burn some of the tares, but notice how he turns the focus of that fire to purification and salvation: "burn the binding cords of Babylon's bondage" and being "saved so as by fire" and "the purifying of some of that larger company." This particular sleight-of-hand interpretation was soon dropped from Russell's teachings, and the tares began to refer only to those fit for destruction, while the less worthy "great multitude" continued to be seen as having a heavenly destination. (See the full article from the February 1916 Watch Tower, for example, quoted in a previous post.) 
    Understanding who Russell referred to doesn't have to fail modern readers. There are people who can even read Shakespeare, or the KJV of the 17th century and understand it. Reading Russell's English is relatively straightforward compared to older English.
    I hate to have to point it out again, but I get the feeling you are doing something that you have become infamous for doing in the past. Your name has become almost synonymous with opposing some small bit of truth that shouldn't even matter that much in the long run. And then when you are shown that you are opposing the evidence, and even opposing the Watchtower in this case, you dig in your heels and start going on about things that were not really related to the question. And another favorite tactic, apparently, is to copy quotes from somewhere that might seem relevant and might make some people believe that you found "evidence" you were right. Perhaps it even convinces some people. But it's very difficult for me to see how you can look at evidence of something and just oppose it or deny it without responding to the evidence and without giving any counter-evidence.
  5. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Yes. We know that the Bible itself says that for many, a time will come when it will be too late for some to repent. But as you say, we don't know when, exactly in the timeline this point occurs. We know that it would be "wicked" for any of us who truly know God's undeserved kindness to use it as an excuse for badness, using the idea that we could always repent at the last minute. But there are so many things we don't know about God's judgment. For example, what if the Great Tribulation goes on for three months, and Armageddon goes on for 25 seconds? What if the Great Tribulation is 100 years long and Armageddon is 200 years long? I think most Witnesses anticipate a period shorter than the common 3.5 and/or 7 year speculation that is often attached by fundamentalists and literalists to either or both of these events. But we have no direct knowledge from the Bible about these timelines, except from Revelation, a book which we usually interpret non-literally. Therefore I don't think most of us would be deeply offended if the Watchtower someday taught that the Great Tribulation turns out to be the entire history of mankind. I don't expect that, and I don't believe it, but there is a lot of flexibility available in the interpretation of symbols.
    For that matter, who is to say whether any great majority in Christian countries have faith in the same Jesus who taught "undeserved kindness" and heart motivation as opposed to those who think Christianity is about a reward for righteous works? Allen Smith has previously questioned whether it is, in fact, only a smaller minority of Jehovah's Witnesses who are really Jehovah's Witnesses. Jesus said at Luke 18:8:
    (Luke 18: 6-8) 6 Then the Lord said: “Hear what the judge, although unrighteous, said! 7 Certainly, then, will not God cause justice to be done for his chosen ones who cry out to him day and night, while he is patient toward them? 8 I tell you, he will cause justice to be done to them speedily. Nevertheless, when the Son of man arrives, will he really find this faith on the earth?” The "type of faith" here is in a God who gives justice, not based on our own merit or works or legalistic requirements, but based on our petitions and desire, as he loves us enough to patiently "put up" with us in our sinful state. This is a difficult concept for most works-based organizations promoting Christianity. There could be an implication that those in supposedly Christian nations are in pretty much 'the same boat' as those in nations who have barely (or never) heard of Jesus.
    And speaking of patience and those "3 billion." Every year that goes by brings an even greater number of people who are not being reached. If as Peter says, that the patience of our Lord means salvation to more people, then there is no evidence that this salvation is related to our efforts to preach to more people. The number of persons alive who will have effectively never even heard of Jehovah's Witnesses (or Jesus) goes up every year. If the end comes today, this might be, as you say, "3 billion." If the end comes in 10 years, the number of persons alive at that time who will never have heard of us (or Jesus) might be "3.5 billion." If the end comes in 20 years, the number of persons alive at that time who will have never heard of us (or Jesus) might be "4 billion." So if it were based on our efforts as Witnesses to reach these persons, then the patience of our Lord would mean greater death and destruction to billions more people.
  6. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Melinda Mills in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    *** it-1 pp. 616-617 Destruction ***
    Will all persons who were destroyed by God in times past be dead forever?
    The Bible indicates that not all destruction is eternal. This is demonstrated by the fact that the Hebrew word ʼavad·dohnʹ (destruction) is used twice to parallel “Sheol.” (Job 26:6; Pr 15:11) The prophet Zephaniah spoke of the destruction of Assyria, whereas Ezekiel said that the Assyrians would go down to Sheol. (Zep 2:13; Eze 32:21, 22) When speaking of the destruction of the rebels Dathan and Abiram, Moses wrote that they went down “alive into Sheol.” (Nu 16:31, 33) Since Sheol in the Bible denotes the common grave of mankind from which there will be a resurrection, it is evident that not all destruction—not even all destruction at the hand of God—is necessarily eternal.
    Everlasting Destruction. The Bible does not indicate that all the dead will be resurrected. Jesus implied this when he spoke of “those who have been counted worthy of gaining that system of things and the resurrection from the dead.” (Lu 20:35) The possibility of eternal destruction for some is also indicated by Jesus’ words at Matthew 10:28: “Do not become fearful of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul; but rather be in fear of him that can destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Regarding this text, The New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology (edited by C. Brown, 1978, Vol. 3, p. 304) states: “Matt. 10:28 teaches not the potential immortality of the soul but the irreversibility of divine judgment on the unrepentant.” Also, Bauer’s Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament (revised by F. W. Gingrich and F. Danker, 1979, p. 95) gives the meaning “eternal death” with reference to the Greek phrase in Matthew 10:28 translated “destroy both soul and body in Gehenna.” Thus, being consigned to Gehenna refers to utter destruction from which no resurrection is possible.—See GEHENNA.
    “Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities about them . . . are placed before us as a warning example by undergoing the judicial punishment of everlasting fire.” (Jude 7) That punishment evidently applies not merely to the physical cities but to their inhabitants as well, because it was the people themselves who committed the gross sins that led to their annihilation.
    The possibility of eternal destruction is particularly an issue during the conclusion of the system of things. When Jesus was asked by his disciples what would be ‘the sign of his presence and of the conclusion of the system of things,’ he included as part of his answer the parable of the sheep and the goats. (Mt 24:3; 25:31-46) Concerning “the goats” it was foretold that the heavenly King would say: “Be on your way from me, you who have been cursed, into the everlasting fire prepared for the Devil and his angels,” and Jesus added, “These will depart into everlasting cutting-off.” Clearly the attitude and actions of some individuals will result in their permanent destruction.  END QUOTE
    The Bible  at Jude 7 did say Sodom and Gomorrah have undergone "everlasting fire".  Certainly Satan and his demons, Judas, Ananias and Sapphira, those destroyed at Noah's Day and at Armageddon, are in that lot.  (Matthew 24: 37-39; Matt 25:41,46))
    I think the point was raised by JWI about Jesus reading hearts and saying the people of Sodom would have repented after seeing certain signs. 
    (Matthew 11:20-24) 20 Then he began to reproach the cities in which most of his powerful works had taken place, for they did not repent: 21 “Woe to you, Cho·raʹzin! Woe to you, Beth·saʹi·da! because if the powerful works that took place in you had taken place in Tyre and Siʹdon, they would long ago have repented in sackcloth and ashes. 22 But I say to you, it will be more endurable for Tyre and Siʹdon on Judgment Day than for you. 23 And you, Ca·perʹna·um, will you perhaps be exalted to heaven? Down to the Grave you will come; because if the powerful works that took place in you had taken place in Sodʹom, it would have remained until this very day. 24 But I say to you, it will be more endurable for the land of Sodʹom on Judgment Day than for you.”
    Checking here is says Sodom would have remained until this day, and that the people of Tyre and Sidon would have repented and it brings the people of Sodom and Gomorrah into the conversation about Judgement Day.  So that is where the speculation begins.
    Thanks for the impetus to do more research. Look forward to your comments and those of others. 
     
     
     

     
  7. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Melinda Mills in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Some interesting points from Anna and JWI. Just commenting on clear signs - JWI - and it being too late for those at Armageddon to repent - Anna.
    By allowing the preaching to continue Jehovah is allowing people to learn, repent and convert.  Even with a non-Christian nation, the Ninevites, he gave them time to repent, even if it was only 40 days. All nations are accountable to God - non-Christian or not.
    The signs from heaven will be clear - including literal celestial phenomena - as Jehovah won't let us be mistaken that it is He who will bring the destruction. (The world powers also have hideous weapons that could also produce some celestial phenomena.) But the Revelation shows that people will say to the mountains and rock-masses to cover them and hide them - nothing stated about their repentance there, but continued looking to earthly sources to protect them, which is idolatry. 
    (Revelation 6:14-17) 14 And the heaven departed as a scroll that is being rolled up, and every mountain and every island was removed from its place. 15 Then the kings of the earth, the high officials, the military commanders, the rich, the strong, every slave, and every free person hid in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 And they keep saying to the mountains and to the rocks: “Fall over us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb, 17 because the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?”
    Note it says all categories of people  - from the elite to the ordinary people , depicted by high officials to slaves -  will understand that the destruction is the result of the anger of the Lamb, Christ Jesus,  authorized by the One seated on the throne, Jehovah God.
    *** w99 12/1 p. 17 pars. 11-12 Be Happy Readers of the Book of Revelation ***
    11 Joyful submission to Jehovah’s sovereignty is the basis for happiness on a personal level and on a universal level. Soon a symbolic great earthquake will shake Satan’s world system to its very foundations and destroy it. There will be no place of refuge for humans who refuse to submit to Christ’s heavenly Kingdom government, representing God’s legitimate domination. The prophecy states: “The kings of the earth and the top-ranking ones and the military commanders and the rich and the strong ones and every slave and every free person hid themselves in the caves and in the rock-masses of the mountains. And they keep saying to the mountains and to the rock-masses: ‘Fall over us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb, because the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?’”—Revelation 6:12, 15-17.
    12 With regard to that question, in the next chapter, the apostle John describes those making up the great crowd, who come out of the great tribulation, as “standing before the throne and before the Lamb.” (Revelation 7:9, 14, 15) Their standing before the throne of God shows that they recognize that throne and fully submit to Jehovah’s sovereignty. They therefore stand approved.
    *** re chap. 18 pp. 112-113 Earthquakes in the Lord’s Day ***
    “Fall Over Us and Hide Us”
    26 John’s words continue: “And the kings of the earth and the top-ranking ones and the military commanders and the rich and the strong ones and every slave and every free person hid themselves in the caves and in the rock-masses of the mountains. And they keep saying to the mountains and to the rock-masses: ‘Fall over us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb, because the great day of their wrath has come, and who is able to stand?’”—Revelation 6:15-17.
    ...
    29 Now, the opening of the sixth seal has shown that something similar will happen during the coming day of Jehovah’s wrath. At the final shaking of this earthly system of things, those committed to supporting it will desperately seek for a hiding place, but they will not find one. False religion, Babylon the Great, has already failed them miserably. Neither caves in the literal mountains nor symbolic mountainlike political and commercial organizations will provide financial security or any other kind of help. Nothing will shelter them from Jehovah’s wrath. Their terror is well described by Jesus: “Then the sign of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in lamentation, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.”—Matthew 24:30.
    30 Yes, those who have refused to recognize the authority of the victorious Rider of the white horse will be forced to admit their error. Humans who have willingly been part of the seed of the serpent will be faced with destruction when Satan’s world passes away. (Genesis 3:15; 1 John 2:17) The world situation at that time will be such that many will, in effect, ask: “Who is able to stand?” They will apparently assume that no one at all can stand approved before Jehovah in that day of his judgment. But they will be wrong, as the book of Revelation goes on to show. END QUOTE
     
    [The scriptures do inform us to seek Jehovah before God's fear-inspiring day. (Zephaniah 2:3). But we leave final decisions to the Righteous Judge, the God of all the earth, as to those who are in the middle of converting their lives.
    Sodom and Gomorrah: These cities were thoroughly corrupt (they even sought to introduce unnatural sex to the angels) and the destruction came suddenly and Lot and his family were moved immediately to safety by the angels before the destruction overtook them.   We have to learn from what happened to the wife of Lot. Lot's wife left the city physically but her heart was still with the materialistic, corrupt society she was living among. So the angels changed her into a pillar of salt. Those angels could read hearts. (For example, when Sarah doubted the angel and laughed about pregnancy in her old age, he asked her why she laughed, but she had not done it audibly, and when she denied doing so, he said "But you did laugh".) Jesus, the 144,000 and other angels coming with him will also be able to read hearts, and that will make it easy for them to be selective in carrying out the execution of people. (Rev 17:14: 19:14)
    Whether these people in Sodom and Gomorrah are in Hades or Gehenna is not clear - we had  some revisions in the publications on that subject. I cannot remember any conclusive comment about it.  Jehovah will do or have done the right thing regarding them. But they and the people in Noah's day are placed before us as a warning of what happens to ungodly people in the future -  2 Peter 2:4-10. We are living in a parallel period now with all types of moral wrongs being sanctioned by various governments and peoples.]
     
  8. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Yes, I agree that Russell's first thoughts were apparent. Which is why Russell made it clear from the start that he believed not just the 144,000 would be anointed and go to heaven but that the great crowd would also be anointed and go to heaven. (Although of a less worthy class.)
    The book you are quoting, above is Divine Plan of the Ages, also known as "Studies in the Scriptures" (or Millennial Dawn), volume 1. That book also shows that Russell believed the "great crowd" would go to heaven. Quoting from page 214:
    They will have everlasting, spirit life as angels have it, . . . . They will serve God in his temple, and stand before the throne, having palms in their hands (Rev. 7:9-17); but though that will be glorious, it will not be so glorious as the position of the "little flock" of overcomers, who will be kings and priests unto God, seated with Jesus in the throne as his bride and joint-heir . . . I'm not sure why you keep insisting on this particular point about Russell's supposed "initial thinking" that only the 144,000 would go to heaven. It is clearly not true, and I'm sure you saw the evidence from what Russell himself said. And now you are quoting another of his books, "SiS V.1," and hinting that this unrelated quote has some relevance to that question. But "SiS V.1" is just another book that shows that Russell was consistent. But I don't get why it's so important to you anyway. If Russell's "initial thinking" was right, and he later changed it to something wrong, then how does this prove that "God gradually opened up his truth," which you also quoted above.  At any rate, Russell was consistent on this point, as far as I can tell.
  9. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Judith Sweeney in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    From a Psychological standpoint, this act causes a person to be self centered. When said "bopper" finds a mate...well, said person is used to the way they themselves do things... the adage "if you want something done right, do it Yourself" may well be the result.  I personally think it is a form of self abuse.   The tub always could use a scrubbing....
     
  10. Upvote
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    If you keep on knocking through regular prayer and continued reading of the Bible and yet are still not moving forward, apparently that is not enough.
    Put aside for a moment the question of whether or not the GB is doing a good job; the point is that there needs be some organized human component of the divine/human interface to move God's work forward in a practical way. Otherwise, individual Christians end up merely flailing away ineffectively, and in time, are absorbed into the popular culture.
  11. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from JW Insider in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have a feeling I read somewhere in our publications (not too long ago) that it will be too late for those at Armageddon to repent.  There are plenty of scriptures that make it clear that only those who put faith in Jesus will be saved....but I don't think there is anything that puts a time frame on it.  Also it might be easy for those who live in Christian countries to put faith in Jesus at the last minute, but what about those in non Christian countries, who don't know much about Jesus or the requirement for salvation. So it would make sense that judging those might involve the reading of hearts, especially considering that there are nearly over 3 billion of such people.  In that case why does WT make that statement about it being too late? What of those over 3 billion people, does the org. believe we will reach all those people before Armageddon, I doubt it.  (I know this has been discussed in a topic here somewhere before, I think I might have I even created that topic)
  12. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Space Merchant in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    I get what you're saying. And yes, I'm sure you know of religions that have done that very thing, banned make up based on scriptures about modesty etc.
    But masturbation isn't in that category, (of going beyond what is written) it has to do more with self control as part of the Christian personality that we are supposed to cultivate.
  13. Haha
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    At airports, three times now, I have been caught by the TSA at airport security with several ounces in my possession. Each time they let me go, but it was confiscated. Embarrassing.
  14. Haha
  15. Haha
    Anna reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    In keeping with Space Merchants pertinent and informative post, there is more to be said along those lines because  ... I have an addiction I cannot shake ... and I will relate my sad experience.
    I am addicted to DiHydrogen Monoxide, (DHMO) also known as "hydroxyl acid".
    I am told it is not a choice ... that I was born that way, as my Mother was also an addict, during my entire gestation.
    If I don't get my daily "fix", I start feeling weak and "out of sorts".
    If I can't get a supply in 24 hours, I start to get really physically ill, and my body starts shutting down.
    I am told that that of I do not ingest  any for six days, I will certainly die ... but hydroxyl acid withdrawal symptom permanent damage will occur before then.
    OF COURSE, it is dangerous what I am doing, and if I overdose on DiHydrogen Monoxide, I will have congestive heart failure and die.
    In February, I was in the hospital for 4 days because of a DHMO overdose, and nearly DID die from congestive heart failure!
    It cost about $16,000 to save my life from this!
    MILLIONS of people have died by suffocation from DHMO, recently  six Jehovah's Witnesses in one day, as it is fatal if inhaled.
    I know that it is used as an industrial solvent ... yet I cannot break this habit ... DHMO has me in its slippery grip, and I cannot do without it!
    In vapor form, it can cause severe burns ... and knowing this I STILL cannot break this habit. Sometimes I mix it with other things and drink it with steam coming off of it !
    It is so insidious that the word "Zohnerism" is used to refer to its dangers on the human mind.
    I hope the Elders do not find out,  as anything that is not specifically permitted, is of course ... forbidden, and I am an unrepentant,  habitual DHMO addict.
    Even though in February, it almost killed me, I REFUSE to quit!
     
  16. Like
    Anna got a reaction from Melinda Mills in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have a feeling I read somewhere in our publications (not too long ago) that it will be too late for those at Armageddon to repent.  There are plenty of scriptures that make it clear that only those who put faith in Jesus will be saved....but I don't think there is anything that puts a time frame on it.  Also it might be easy for those who live in Christian countries to put faith in Jesus at the last minute, but what about those in non Christian countries, who don't know much about Jesus or the requirement for salvation. So it would make sense that judging those might involve the reading of hearts, especially considering that there are nearly over 3 billion of such people.  In that case why does WT make that statement about it being too late? What of those over 3 billion people, does the org. believe we will reach all those people before Armageddon, I doubt it.  (I know this has been discussed in a topic here somewhere before, I think I might have I even created that topic)
  17. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Melinda Mills in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    My understanding from reading the Bible and Bible publications provided is that those who do not cooperate with the Kingdom government after Armageddon (resurrected ones) will be cut off. If they reach the end of the 1000-year reign it is believed that they would have been healed by the King-Priest  and his 144000 associate king-priests and have become perfect.  They would be destroyed only if they fail the final test. (Rev 20)  
    Righteous ones (survivors and those who get a resurrection to life) will most likely continue to be righteous in an environment free of Satan's influence if they did so in the former life with him around.  But they will have to be tested after attaining to perfection. 
    See scriptures below, and comment on how they relate to your statement above.
    "(Isaiah 26:10) Even if the wicked is shown favor, He will not learn righteousness. Even in the land of uprightness he will act wickedly, And he will not see the majesty of Jehovah."                     
    (Resurrected unrighteous ones would be given the opportunity in the new system to see the majesty of Jehovah - those not seeing will have proved to be wicked and will disappear from the earth)
    "(Isaiah 65:20) “No more will there be an infant from that place who lives but a few days, Nor an old man who fails to live out his days. For anyone who dies at a hundred will be considered a mere boy, And the sinner will be cursed, even though he is a hundred years of age. "                            
    (No one will be disadvantaged by hunger, sickness, deformity, disease, short life span, etc.  Will live healthy lives and afforded ample time (lifespan) and opportunity to learn about Jehovah and will be expected to transform their lives according to Jehovah's will (see the eminence of Jehovah's way of doing things).  Those  who continue to love sin, will be cursed/cut off.
    This sabbath period of 1000 years will be for learning about Jehovah (scrolls opened) not the practising of sin.  All the scriptures mentioned by AllenSmith pertain to things people choose to do.   So I don't believe there will be any big group of people sailing along and enjoying the Paradise and not acting in harmony with the expectation for them, after they are taught. I believe they will be taken out of the earth, once they get ample knowledge of Jehovah's requirements.   
    Choosing was always connected with  getting God's approval.  As we learned in our meeting this week, Jehovah draws us but he doesn't force us.  Deut 30:19,20.  All will have to show whether they are on Jehovah's side by their choices.
    Why all who survive to the end of the thousand years will have to be tested:  What the final test will do for those who have been obedient up to the end of the the 1000 years will be to test their fitness for Jehovah granting them eternal life after Jesus would have healed and uplifted them.   Adam had that test while perfect and he failed it; all perfected people then would also have that test.  Satan would be used to test their motive for serving Jehovah.  (On every occasion where we invite people to enjoy themselves, there are always those who come along for the food and the entertainment, not really out of appreciation for the host.  Even in Jesus' time on the earth when large crowds were following him and he fed them, his disciples wanted to understand what he was saying but lots of people were satisfied with the literal bread, and also the cures,  and he detected it, and he told them so. They were not interested in spiritual things. ) Also Jehovah would want to ensure that peace and security would be permanent in the earth. He will eliminate those whose heart is not complete toward Him and who might possibly cause danger in the future. Satan would see to it that any rebellious tendency dormant in their hearts is shown up. 
     
    Even this statement bears out the fact that people will be expected to act now and in the future paradise.
     
  18. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    No. I was referring to what Melinda quoted about Abraham and Sodom, and what Jesus said about how the men of Sodom "would" have repented if they had seen the types of works/signs that Jesus gave to some in the first century.
  19. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Melinda Mills in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    The previous answers have much merit. It can also be summed up like this:
    (Genesis 18:25-28) . . .It is unthinkable that you would act in this manner by putting the righteous man to death with the wicked one so that the outcome for the righteous man and the wicked is the same! It is unthinkable of you. Will the Judge of all the earth not do what is right?” 26 Then Jehovah said: “If I find in Sodʹom 50 righteous men in the city, I will pardon the whole place for their sake.” 27 But Abraham again responded: “Please, here I have presumed to speak to Jehovah, whereas I am dust and ashes. 28 Suppose the 50 righteous should lack five. Because of the five will you destroy the whole city?” To this he said: “I will not destroy it if I find there 45.”
    We can safely leave the details and final decisions  about certain groups to Jehovah.  We must not presume to speak for him above what he has already said.  He will always do what is right. Every detail cannot be written down (John 21:25), but generally all the guidelines are clear (Ps 11:4-7; Ps 15:1-7).
    (Isaiah 55:9) . . .For as the heavens are higher than the earth, So my ways are higher than your ways And my thoughts than your thoughts.
    (Deuteronomy 32:4)  4 The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. A God of faithfulness, with whom there is no injustice; Righteous and upright is he.
    (Malachi 3:6) “For I am Jehovah; I do not change. And you are sons of Jacob; you have not yet come to your finish.
     
     

     

     
  20. Haha
    Anna reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    The criteria Jehovah uses is quite clear.
    Locally, it varies according to the year, location, and policy.
  21. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Evacuated in Can anyone explain this to me?: The rest of the dead did not come to life UNTIL the 1,000 years were ENDED.   
    Well put. This connects with a response I would make to this accusation: "You say only Jehovah's Witnesses will be saved", namely, a question: How do you define a Jehovah's Witness?
  22. Upvote
    Anna reacted to James Thomas Rook Jr. in What If Everyone Who Ever Lived Was Resurrected?   
    What is a Bullfrog had wings .... would he bump his rump every time he took off?
    Jehovah and his type are energy creatures, without DNA.
    They do not need this Universe AT ALL.
    So ..... why did Jehovah create THIS Universe?
    Hmmmmmmm ?
    For the sons and daughters of DNA ... there is a LOT of  Real Estate out there !
    Once you get out of the Earth's gravity well ... you are half way to ANYWHERE!
     
  23. Upvote
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    I have commented before that strict avoidance of all earthy language (which if I recall correctly, reliably triggers your outrage, so that I have sometimes employed it just to get you going) is more a Victorian relic than a biblical one. When Elijah taunts that maybe Baal has excrement, I somehow can't picture him using that clinical word.
    That said, there is one of the 'Church fathers,' I forget who, who rails against masturbation, painting it as a huge sin. 
    Of course, that is not to say that we must follow the church fathers. It is to say, though, that condemnation of masturbation is not a product of the Victorian age.
  24. Upvote
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    I admit to a prejudice against anything having the suffix 'gate' attached to it. It strikes me as too stupid of a word device, a sure sign of running with the herd.
    I haven't seen the videos, not being part of the intended audience.
    One way that the internet can lie, even while telling the truth, is through endless repetition of something meant to be heard once, giving the impression that they talk of nothing else over there.
    JTR (amazingly) is right. The Bible nowhere mentions masturbation. That said, it pretty clearly is an unclean habit, covered under the topic of gaining self-control, and when one becomes enslaved to it, it can warp one's personality.
    I'd say the organization's coverage of it is just about right: occasional discussion in articles geared mostly for young people, with the caveat that it is not the end of the world should one suffer a relapse. The video JTR titillates over was never on the website. Ten years of conventions contain but one mention of it that I can recall.
    Adultery and fornication, on the other hand, is mentioned all the time. The degree of repetition is meaningful, yet that measure is completely lost of the internet, the perfect forum where persons can assert themselves wise while proving themselves foolish, turning down all matters of context as 'strawmen.'
  25. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Evacuated in Anti-Masturbation Training Video For Jehovah's Witnesses!   
    Yes, in terms of Christian morality.
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