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Anna

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  1. Thanks
    Anna reacted to The Librarian in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    @Anna I like how you think. Thanks for the summary.
    Post a copy of what you send 
  2. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Noble Berean in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    To be fair, this topic is not under controversial posts, but under Bible discussion, because that was what I was hoping it was going to be....
  3. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Nana Fofana in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Thank you to the other contributors.
    @Gone Fishing has presented excellent reasoning, @JW Insider counter reasoning, @TrueTomHarley realized all too soon this might me one of my "rants" that I don't raise anywhere else and that it could be the next topic for a letter to the GB that I never send, @Noble Berean went straight to the heart of the matter. Thankfully this post has been spared JTR's cartoons because maybe he has not discovered it yet, @Nana Fofana hit the bottle, Allen et al resorted to personal attacks and apportioning down votes left right and center.....so nothing new there, and last but not least Srecko with his obviously biased interpretation, and Bar Avaddhon with his complex interpretations and sometimes difficult to understand discourse but that is not his fault, Google translator needs to do a better job.
    I don't have time right now, but when I do I would like to reply to individual posters in more detail...
  4. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Evacuated in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    To be fair, this topic is not under controversial posts, but under Bible discussion, because that was what I was hoping it was going to be....
  5. Like
    Anna got a reaction from Noble Berean in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Thank you to the other contributors.
    @Gone Fishing has presented excellent reasoning, @JW Insider counter reasoning, @TrueTomHarley realized all too soon this might me one of my "rants" that I don't raise anywhere else and that it could be the next topic for a letter to the GB that I never send, @Noble Berean went straight to the heart of the matter. Thankfully this post has been spared JTR's cartoons because maybe he has not discovered it yet, @Nana Fofana hit the bottle, Allen et al resorted to personal attacks and apportioning down votes left right and center.....so nothing new there, and last but not least Srecko with his obviously biased interpretation, and Bar Avaddhon with his complex interpretations and sometimes difficult to understand discourse but that is not his fault, Google translator needs to do a better job.
    I don't have time right now, but when I do I would like to reply to individual posters in more detail...
  6. Like
    Anna got a reaction from The Librarian in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Thank you to the other contributors.
    @Gone Fishing has presented excellent reasoning, @JW Insider counter reasoning, @TrueTomHarley realized all too soon this might me one of my "rants" that I don't raise anywhere else and that it could be the next topic for a letter to the GB that I never send, @Noble Berean went straight to the heart of the matter. Thankfully this post has been spared JTR's cartoons because maybe he has not discovered it yet, @Nana Fofana hit the bottle, Allen et al resorted to personal attacks and apportioning down votes left right and center.....so nothing new there, and last but not least Srecko with his obviously biased interpretation, and Bar Avaddhon with his complex interpretations and sometimes difficult to understand discourse but that is not his fault, Google translator needs to do a better job.
    I don't have time right now, but when I do I would like to reply to individual posters in more detail...
  7. Haha
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in 24 YEAR OLD BETHELITE WOMAN RECENTLY DISFELLOWSHIPPED FOR APOSTASY COMMITS SUICIDE!   
    Ouch
    Ouch
    I'm on it.
    No
    That's it.
    Sorry.
     
  8. Haha
    Anna got a reaction from Successor in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Most parts in your post were nice, and true, but had actually nothing to do with the discussion...
  9. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Evacuated in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Thank you to the other contributors.
    @Gone Fishing has presented excellent reasoning, @JW Insider counter reasoning, @TrueTomHarley realized all too soon this might me one of my "rants" that I don't raise anywhere else and that it could be the next topic for a letter to the GB that I never send, @Noble Berean went straight to the heart of the matter. Thankfully this post has been spared JTR's cartoons because maybe he has not discovered it yet, @Nana Fofana hit the bottle, Allen et al resorted to personal attacks and apportioning down votes left right and center.....so nothing new there, and last but not least Srecko with his obviously biased interpretation, and Bar Avaddhon with his complex interpretations and sometimes difficult to understand discourse but that is not his fault, Google translator needs to do a better job.
    I don't have time right now, but when I do I would like to reply to individual posters in more detail...
  10. Like
    Anna reacted to Noble Berean in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Perhaps I haven't been very clear with my wording on this forum. I don't actually disagree with a Governing Body existing over the organization of Jehovah's Witnesses. That would be like me questioning why each congregation has an elder body. It is clear that the GB fulfills the role of an elder body over the entire congregation on earth.
    What I take issue with is the unquestioned obedience that the GB demands. I have yet to receive satisfactory, Scriptural evidence for this view. Is this how the first century apostles perceived themselves? Any questioning by JWs is compared to the fatal murmuring of Korah and his associates, but Moses was a prophet for Jehovah God. When he spoke to the people, it was like God himself spoke. He was granted the authority by Jehovah to lead the Israelites like God. Jehovah made his divine support of Moses clear when he parted the Red Sea and performed many miracles in his name. When Moses spoke to the people with a thought generated by his own imperfect mind rather than God's, Jehovah actually removed his blessing of the Promise Land. The GB don't speak as prophets, and it is clear they often speak and direct with thoughts generated by imperfect, human minds rather than God's mind. They acknowledge that they have erred in their direction throughout the organization's history. So, how can they expect the same level of obedience that Moses received? It doesn't add up in my mind. Besides, it is Jesus who is the greater Moses and not the GB.
    Now, you may say that prophets don't exist anymore, so it's unfair to expect prophets in this day and age. That's true. We no longer need prophets, because we have God's complete word in the Bible. I believe that Jesus Christ's leadership is expressed through the Bible. It trumps all human authority. It is the "check" to us all. The Bible stands alone. In my research, I pondered why Jehovah separated the roles of apostles and prophets into two groups in the first century. I have my own theory that Jehovah did so to prevent one  group from gaining too much authority--sort of like the checks and balances in the US government. But the GB acts as those taking the lead and guardians of doctrine. Instead of the Bible "checking" their authority as an independent entity (like an auditor), it has become completely intertwined with the GB. They have stated that they alone have been granted the capacity from God to properly interpret the Bible's message. So, no one else can use the Bible to check them, because they can simply discredit that individual by saying that he/she was not chosen by God to interpret the Bible. Therefore, their interpretation is invalid.
    It's like when the gov't does an internal investigation...we roll our eyes. We know that it won't be too critical against itself, but instead create an outcome that is the most favorable. The GB has interpreted the Bible and structured the org in such a way that gives them maximum control and minimum accountability. They essentially play both sides of the fields: God's channel that deserves unquestioned obedience and the imperfect human group that err. Having to be submissive to a GB who play these 2 conflicting roles is very frustrating for me. I don't know how to work with them.
    And while I've said a lot, I just want to be clear that I don't want to usurp anyone's authority--especially in God's religion. My questioning is how I make my faith and my ideology firmer. I'm a work-in-progress. I'm not so dogmatic to claim I have all the right answers. My views are evolving, and I appreciate the discussions on here.
  11. Like
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    The slave does not produce spiritual food, it's just that any servant that is properly motivated will do what they can to share what they can. Our Governing Body has done an excellent job in finding efficient ways to share "spiritual" food, because the ministry they have chosen to administer for us is a teaching ministry. But the illustration of the "wicked and faithful slave" that this idea is based on says nothing about spiritual food specifically. A true steward will always do what is in his power to effectively carry out his ministry.
    But all of us are slaves of Christ, and all of us should learn from the same illustration, whether it is spiritual food we share, physical food, comfort, clothing, support, encouragement -- our food should be for us to do the will of our Father. But I think it's clear that the "food" includes sharing physical food, wherever such a stewardship and ministry is necessary.
    (James 1:27) 27 The form of worship that is clean and undefiled from the standpoint of our God and Father is this: to look after orphans and widows in their tribulation, and to keep oneself without spot from the world.
    (Acts 6:1) . . ., the Greek-speaking Jews began complaining against the Hebrew-speaking Jews, because their widows were being overlooked in the daily distribution.
    (1 Timothy 5:3-8) 3 Give consideration to widows who are truly widows. 4 But if any widow has children or grandchildren, let these learn first to practice godly devotion in their own household and to repay their parents and grandparents what is due them, for this is acceptable in God’s sight. 5 Now the woman who is truly a widow and left destitute has put her hope in God and continues in supplications and prayers night and day. . . .  8 Certainly if anyone does not provide for those who are his own, and especially for those who are members of his household, he has disowned the faith and is worse than a person without faith.
    (Matthew 10:42) 42 And whoever gives one of these little ones only a cup of cold water to drink because he is a disciple, I tell you truly, he will by no means lose his reward.”
    Paul made a point to show that there is no separate "body" within the "body of the congregation." People who believed this would look to men who were good teachers of spiritual things, like Paul himself, or Apollos. Paul said: all Christians were fellow servants, and that all of us carry the burdens of one another. Yet in the end, we are responsible for our own spiritual standing -- not because of specific teachings produced by others.
    (1 Corinthians 3:5-9) 5 What, then, is A·polʹlos? Yes, what is Paul? Ministers through whom you became believers, just as the Lord granted each one. 6 I planted, A·polʹlos watered, but God kept making it grow, 7 so that neither is the one who plants anything nor is the one who waters, but God who makes it grow. 8 Now the one who plants and the one who waters are one, but each person will receive his own reward according to his own work. 9 For we are God’s fellow workers. You are God’s field under cultivation, God’s building. (Galatians 6:2-5) 2 Go on carrying the burdens of one another, and in this way you will fulfill the law of the Christ. 3 For if anyone thinks he is something when he is nothing, he is deceiving himself. 4 But let each one examine his own actions, and then he will have cause for rejoicing in regard to himself alone, and not in comparison with the other person. 5 For each one will carry his own load.
    1 Corinthians 7:22-24) . . .he that was called when a freeman is a slave of Christ. 23 YOU were bought with a price; stop becoming slaves of men. 24 In whatever condition each one was called, brothers, let him remain in it associated with God.
    I think we should take offense at the idea that the Governing Body produces spiritual food. Jesus is the food. And all of us will be taught ultimately by Jehovah.
    (John 6:45-58) 45 It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by Jehovah.’ Everyone who has listened to the Father and has learned comes to me. 46 Not that any man has seen the Father, except the one who is from God; this one has seen the Father. 47 Most truly I say to you, whoever believes has everlasting life. 48 “I am the bread of life. 49 Your forefathers ate the manna in the wilderness and yet they died. 50 This is the bread that comes down from heaven, so that anyone may eat of it and not die. 51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread he will live forever; and for a fact, the bread that I will give is my flesh in behalf of the life of the world.” 52 Then the Jews began to argue with one another, saying: “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” 53 So Jesus said to them: “Most truly I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, you have no life in yourselves. 54 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day; 55 for my flesh is true food and my blood is true drink. 56 Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood remains in union with me, and I in union with him. 57 Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so also the one who feeds on me will live because of me. 58 This is the bread that came down from heaven. It is not as when your forefathers ate and yet died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.” (1 Corinthians 3:11) 11 For no one can lay any other foundation than what is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
    So far, we should remember that so many times when the Governing Body has attempted to produce food, that food has soon rotted or has become stale. But there has always been great permanent value in everything they have shared, even when they are just sharing a cup of water with another one of Christ's brothers when directing a response to material disasters around the world, or other helpful services, or rebuilding a place of worship, or sharing Bibles and Bible-based publications and videos, talks, sermons, artwork, organizing assemblies, etc. But we shouldn't shirk our own part in all this. It's important that ALL of us are faithful and discreet stewards. Otherwise, I think we have missed the point of Jesus' illustration in Matthew 24, and might sometimes just be relying on obsolete types and antitypes to avoid carrying our own load.
    (1 Peter 4:10-11) 10 To the extent that each one has received a gift, use it in ministering to one another as fine stewards of God’s undeserved kindness that is expressed in various ways. 11 If anyone speaks, let him do so as speaking pronouncements from God; if anyone ministers, let him do so as depending on the strength that God supplies; so that in all things God may be glorified through Jesus Christ.. . . *** Rbi8 1 Peter 4:10 ***    Or, “house managers.” Lit., “house administrators.” Gr., oi·ko·noʹmoi; Lat., di·spen·sa·toʹres; J22(Heb.), kesoh·khenimʹ, “as stewards.” (1 Corinthians 12:27, 28) 27 Now you are Christ’s body, and each of you individually is a member. 28 And God has assigned the respective ones in the congregation:. . . teachers; . . . helpful services; abilities to direct;. . . When Jesus returns to ask who among us were really faithful stewards, and who were shirking our responsibilities, imagine his reaction --in light of these scriptures-- if we were to tell Jesus that we thought we were supposed to depend on a specific body of men to define what he meant by ministering and to define the types of food we shared with others.
    (Luke 12:47, 48) 47 Then that slave who understood the will of his master but did not get ready or do what he asked will be beaten with many strokes. 48 But the one who did not understand and yet did things deserving of strokes will be beaten with few. Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him, and the one who was put in charge of much will have more than usual demanded of him.
  12. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Evacuated in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Then 1Cor 10:31 stands. The concept of  judgement on whether humans are classed figuratively as sheep or goats is drawn from the parable which shows that judgement to be based on how they treat Christs "brothers" (Matt 25:31-46).. So, respect and solidarity for and with anointed Christians, and particularly the Governing Body, is a key component of the favourable judgement.
    But if anyone thinks that just standing by an organisational arrangement serves as the sole ticket to Armageddon survival....well..... let me know how that works out, although the "probably" is starting to look a bit "probably won't" from here.
    I am looking at a whole range of other scriptural criteria as well, (like Mic 6:8), on this issue, and I am going to continue to be very grateful for the provision of a shepherding arrangement to help and support me in the discerning and applying of those requirements. To me that is the part of the purpose of the congregation as described for example at Eph 4:11-16.
    On that basis I cannot see that encouragement to be obedient to instructions and directions by means of the Christian congregation through these crtical times would be in any way a sinister or underhand scheme to over assert authority, or to somehow direct attention away from our need to have complete dependence on the "one who can destroy both soul and body in Ge·hen?na".
    So, I do believe we are kicking into the same goal are we not??.............
  13. Confused
    Anna reacted to Evacuated in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    This is serious wierdness. I do not understand it???
     
  14. Like
    Anna got a reaction from Noble Berean in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    This is speculation. As if Jehovah can only save people when they are gathered in a specific spot?
    They sure are, as far as I can tell.  John 17:3, John 20:31, John 8:12,  Matthew 7:21,  Romans 2:13, James 1:22, 1 John 2:17, 1 John 5:3, Jude 3:3-5, Romans 13:11-13, Heb 10:36,  3John 3,4,  Romans 8:6....etc. etc.
  15. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Melinda Mills in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    " It seems that all true Christians have equal access to the Bible, prayer and holy spirit. "  - Anna
    ------------
    (Psalm 65:2) 2 O Hearer of prayer, to you people of all sorts will come.

    (Proverbs 2:1-22) My son, if you accept my sayings And treasure up my commandments,  2 By making your ear attentive to wisdom And inclining your heart to discernment;  3 Moreover, if you call out for understanding And raise your voice for discernment;  4 If you keep seeking for it as for silver, And you keep searching for it as for hidden treasures;  5 Then you will understand the fear of Jehovah, And you will find the knowledge of God.  6 For Jehovah himself gives wisdom; From his mouth come knowledge and discernment. 
    (John 3:16) “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.
    (Revelation 22:17) And the spirit and the bride keep on saying, “Come!” and let anyone hearing say, “Come!” and let anyone thirsting come; let anyone who wishes take life’s water free.
    (Joel 2:28,29)  28 After that I will pour out my spirit on every sort of flesh, And your sons and your daughters will prophesy, Your old men will dream dreams, And your young men will see visions. 29 And even on my male slaves and female slaves I will pour out my spirit in those days.
    Everyone has equal opportunity to come to Jehovah and receive help.
    =====
    I wanted to send this last night but it disappeared. Thanks to admin for restoring it.
    =====
    This morning I was writing a post and something miraculous happened - I was trying to remember a phrase in the Bible, but did not know where it was in the Bible.  I however continued with my writing, when I looked for the scripture for the next point I realized that I was being helped because the verse above the scripture had the phrase I was looking for to support the previous point. (I really did not know it was there I had seen it.)
    This is not the first time I had experiences that show that Jehovah wants us to help others put confidence in Him and his Word.  God's Word is alive and exerts power.  Sometimes after I research things to help others I often understand them better or things become clearer to me as well.
     

     
     

     
     
     
  16. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    No, no, NO! I protest! I did not propose any spin. In fact part of this whole debate is me trying to reason that no spin should be put on it at all.
    Yes, and I don’t doubt it at all. It just irritates me a little when what is speculation, is presented as fact.
    I would say yes and no. Many rely on Jehovah through the Slave.  What I was meaning “rely directly” was that this reliance will be between individuals and Jehovah only. We have a tendency to do  ”group saving”   through phrases such as “Jehovah’s people as a whole”  “through the congregation arrangement”  etc.  There is nothing wrong with that at all, and is scriptural of course.  But Jesus indicates that this time it will be a little different. Romans14:12 “So, then, each of us will render an account for himself to God” Rev 22:12 “Look! I am coming quickly, and the reward I give is with me, to repay each one according to his work". Matt. 24:41 “Two women will be grinding at the hand mill; one will be taken along and the other abandoned....”.  So I was trying to indicate that concerning Armageddon, speculation on Jehovah  going through specific channels or agents to give us instructions  might be adding to what is not there...in spite of referencing Hebrew scriptures of how it used to be done etc.  As for miracles, I meant the kind of miracles that are not dependent on location or someones activity or that are done on behalf of a group. But the kind of miracle where you are standing in the middle of a war zone by yourself, with bullets flying and bombs going off and you are untouched, Marvel movie style. And then the miracle of actual survival during the aftermath, which I went into already a little.
    The purpose of that question was based on this reasoning in par 20.
    Therefore, we want to develop heartfelt
    obedience to the guidance we are receiving. (1 John 5:3)
    If we do so today, we will be more inclined to obey willingly
    in the future and thus receive the protection of our Father,
     
    I mean the paragraph would have been better without speculations and without the "if's", and the implication that we are so shallow as to obey merely to save our lives, without being granted the dignity that our obedience surely has deeper motives, such as our love for Jehovah and his sovereignty, appreciation for the ransom,  and our desire to please him. Therefor we shouldn't need the  "if's" but rather "because" .
    Am I making too much of a big deal out of this...?
    I think I need @TrueTomHarley to put things into perspective. Because to be honest, all I want to do during Armageddon is hide in the closet and pray like crazy, and afterwards sit on a pile of rubble, hopefully with my loved ones, have crows bring us food and water and just relax for a week or so. Because we will probably all be physically so tired and too emotionally drained and elated at the same time, to even comprehend any instructions blasted at us through a loudspeaker.
     
     
    .
  17. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Exactly, and this is what I tried to explain in the post above, when I said  “We can take this whole survival thing further into the stream of time. Even after being judged as sheep, and after entering the new world, our survival will always depend on obeying Jehovah’s instructions, since we will always be dependent on him to stay alive”.
    Yes indeed, and it has apparently already been spun a certain way, according to those two paragraphs.
    However, thinking about it logically does that kind of a spin make sense?  I see several problems with it. If we are obedient to the Slave now, we will be judged as sheep obviously, and if we are obedient now, it follows we will be obedient during Armageddon, as per the reasoning in par. 20.  So this is a closed circle, since one naturally leads to the other. Therefore on that basis, what is actually the point of those two paragraphs? And what is to say we are at liberty to apply Jehovah's saving arrangements in the past to what he will do in the future?
    Because how can it be categorically said that there will be instructions given to us through some centralized body or agent? Or even congregation overseers? Am I to imagine elder John is going to receive a vision which he will then relay to the rest of the little group?
    To go into even more detail, it was different  with the Israelites for example, coming out of Egypt, following Moses. This kind of a scenario will obviously be impossible during Armageddon, although similar scenes are depicted in our literature. However, if you think about it, something like that is not even remotely possible because:
    How could we be organized into one large group when we are so scattered? Although we are one nation symbolically we are not one nation physically. The next congregation from us is 10 miles away, and even if we were grouped according to circuits, we might have a couple of thousand, with the next couple of thousand in the next city, miles away. On top of that, how are we going to travel with no fuel, (and with the frail and infirm) since there will be no one to operate the stations, and no electricity to pump the fuel out as there will be no one operating the generators, and no one supplying the fuel as there will be no drivers and there will be no pilots to operate planes, no captains to operate ships, and no one to operate the oil rigs.  How are we going to get any messages forwarded across miles and miles of land and sea? This is a very complex modern infrastructure we live in at the present time, and it is wholly reliant on workers, who will be dead. And on top of these obvious logistical and communicational problems, there will be masses of rotting corpses, poisoning the water and air, to contend with. What are we going to be drinking and eating while we are figuring this out? I am sure we can all think of so much more. So what I am trying to say is that it goes without saying we will evidently have to rely directly on Jehovah and on miracles he will probably perform at that time. It stands to reason we will all be direct witnesses of these miracles, and will experience them personally, without them going through some human centralized group, or agents.
    If we are already judged as sheep before Armageddon, would it stand to reason that we would suddenly become disobedient, if we have proved by our life (on the basis of which we were judged) that we were worthy of being judged as sheep by our previous obedience?  It doesn’t make logical sense we would suddenly see the need to not follow instructions, especially after we have obviously been following instructions to get to where we are that point (judged as sheep) and especially when we had just witnessed the supernatural manifestations of the last prophesy being  fulfilled.  If we are honest, are many of us not already psyched up and eagerly waiting for some “special pronouncement” by the slave, so much so that most of us would be willing to move to Timbuktu at the drop of a hat, if those were the instructions given to us by them? And are we not sitting on the edge of our seats in anticipation and hint of any significant turn of events on the world scene any moment?
    Wouldn’t it have been much simpler to say something along the lines of: “How will Jehovah preserve alive those who have been judged as sheep during Armageddon? We will have to wait and see. One thing we can be sure of is that Jehovah knows how to deliver people of Godly devotion. At that time all of us will most likely experience supernatural manifestations on our behalf, and we will want to put our full trust in Jehovah’s protective and life giving powers. Of course it won’t end there, as we will continue to do so after the dust of Armageddon has settled, and in to the distant future"......etc.
    So I am still trying to figure out the motive behind those two paragraphs....
    This is the scripture I always go to, to explain why it's reasonable to expect that God has an organized and a united people on earth today.
  18. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    @Gone Fishing
    We can take this whole survival thing further into the stream of time. Even after being judged as sheep, and after entering the new world, our survival will always depend on obeying Jehovah’s instructions, since we will always be dependent on him to stay alive. Still, I don’t think that warrants us thinking that there will be some kind of “special logistical” instructions at Armageddon, as if Jehovah needs us in one particular place, or do some particular thing in order to be able to save us. Or in order for us to prove we are worthy of salvation. Like one more test on top of a test. And especially not when the reason for that is used to “encourage” us to be obedient now.....  
    Just my thoughts
  19. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Yes, including paragraph 19. But I think the thread might have digressed a little by now.
    I think you might have misunderstood. I have no issue with following  instructions per se. None at all actually. What I am wondering about is the reasoning in par. 19 and 20 in relation to this. There are two questions that came to mind as we were studying the lesson at the midweek meeting (actually a week ago since I read on ahead last week). I already posted my line of thought in several posts above and you might have missed it, so I will just rearrange and copy and paste some of it here:
    In those two paragraphs I was wondering if we might be going beyond what is written by going beyond the application intended for the scriptures that were cited: (Isaiah 25:20 and 30:21, 1John 5:3,  Zephaniah 2:3)( saying that "our survival of coming events will depend on our obedience to Jehovah’s instructions" and  "Therefore, we want to develop heartfelt obedience to the guidance we are receiving. (1 John 5:3) If we do so today, we will be more inclined to obey willingly in the future and thus receive the protection of our Father, Jehovah, and our King, Jesus") It makes me wonder, was this written for the purpose of reaffirming the Slave's God given authority over the flock at the present time?
    Otherwise it doesn't seem to make sense to me that after those who are judged as sheep, and marked for survival then their survival (of coming events) will depend on their obedience to Jehovah’s instructions. I don't see anywhere in the scriptures where Jesus teaches this idea with regard to the final judgement. In fact I see the opposite "Then two men will be in the field; one will be taken along and the other abandoned. Two women will be grinding at the hand mill; one will be taken along and the other abandoned".
    To me, it sounds awfully like some kind of soft threat you make to a child. What I hear when I read those two paragraphs is: “you better obey the Slave NOW, or you’re gonna die later.” And I am thinking, do we really need that? Are we presumed so shallow as to obey merely to save our hides? Or shouldn’t we be granted the dignity that our obedience surely has deeper motives than that?
     

     
     
  20. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Sorry, I know this question wasn't to me, but I find it interesting. As far as I am aware, Jesus doesn't communicate with the anointed (any anointed) directly. I believe all the communication is there for anybody to access, because it's the Bible. Yes, holy spirit is needed to help us understand the scriptures, but anyone can ask for holy spirit for that purpose. The only time in my opinion when there is any direct communication, is at the point when the person receives the heavenly calling. It used to be thought that the anointed would regularly receive some kind of divine flashes of inspiration or insight, but there is no evidence that the anointed, including the GB think that now. It seems that all true Christians have equal access to the Bible, prayer and holy spirit. 
  21. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    I am assuming you mean while still on earth since in heaven they will definitely play a vital role . All the anointed I have ever known (and I have known quite a few) have been very humble people, never ones who pushed ahead and asserted themselves in any way. I cannot imagine that they would suddenly become something they are not. True, I don't now what kind of role you had in mind, and if this role would require some kind of miraculous intervention, since there are many congregations with not a single anointed person in them.
  22. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    You will probably admit that it would be very difficult to accomplish what we have accomplished globally without having a centralized body. I personally see nothing wrong, or even unscriptural about it. Even with regard to keeping a uniform doctrine. 
    Here are two articles from the same WT that go into detail of why this idea is reasonable:
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20130715/jesus-feeds-many/
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20130715/who-is-faithful-discreet-slave/
     
     
  23. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    by going beyond the application intended,  (Isaiah 25:20 and 30:21, 1John 5:3,  Zephaniah 2:3 as cited in the two paragraphs) claiming that "our survival of coming events will depend on our obedience to Jehovah’s instructions" and  "Therefore, we want to develop heartfelt obedience to the guidance we are receiving. (1 John 5:3) If we do so today, we will be more inclined to obey willingly in the future and thus receive the protection of our Father, Jehovah, and our King, Jesus" for the purpose of the Slave reaffirming God given authority over the flock at the present time?
    To me, it sounds awfully like some kind of soft threat you make to a child. What I hear when I read those two paragraphs in the “God’s Kingdom book”  is: “you better obey the Slave NOW or you’re gonna die!” And I am thinking, do we really need that? Are we presumed so shallow as to obey merely to save our hides? Or shouldn’t we be granted the dignity that our obedience surely has deeper motives than that?
     
    There, I’ve said it in a nutshell.
  24. Downvote
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    For the sake of this discussion I see the need to separate for a moment organizational procedures and spiritual matters, (although many times they are intertwined obviously). We understand organizational procedures to involve things like congregational protocol, certain policies on handling various matters etc. etc.
    Spiritual things or doctrinal matters on the other hand are those that we learn when we study the Bible, meditate on, and put into practice what we learn in our lives. This must be what Jesus had in mind when he makes all those references to salvation.
    Organizational matters are important for obvious reasons, and cooperation with those taking the lead in these matters is obviously important too.
    However, when it comes to actual salvation on that day, are we perhaps going beyond what is written if we attach importance to a location, i.e. where we find ourselves physically, when it seems clear from the scriptures that it is our spiritual state that will decide the outcome for an individual at Armageddon?
      
  25. Haha
    Anna got a reaction from Gnosis Pithos in What does a person have to do to survive Armageddon?   
    Further to the topic above, this WT talks about Jehovah's Valley of protection.
    https://www.jw.org/en/publications/magazines/w20130215/jehovahs-valley-of-protection/
    "How vital it will be during the great tribulation to maintain our faith in Jehovah’s saving power and to remain in Jehovah’s valley of protection"!
    " Under Jehovah’s protection, we will survive the end of this wicked system of things and enter into God’s righteous new world. Though we are objects of hatred by all the nations, let us be resolved to remain loyal subjects of God’s Kingdom, ever determined to stay in Jehovah’s valley of protection".
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