Anna

Maybe I just couldn’t see the point of this experiment.....all I see is what I have already read from some ex-JWs , especially one  ex GB member  who made it seem like reporting field service created selfish, status climbing, bureaucratic butt kissers (pardon the expression). He was right to a small extend, this did apply to a few, but for the most part, those few are no longer JWs . If you are "slaving" for Jehovah for the wrong reason, it doesn’t last. You don't need to see what would happen if you stopped reporting, true motives become apparent sooner or later regardless. That was my point.
Yes, I agree,  and it does get on my nerves when I hear such expressions as  “so many years in time in full time service" etc. as if these persons are somehow better than someone who is like the widow. But we all know that is not true. If we place too much stock on what others think then obviously that is foolish, because it is ultimately what Jehovah thinks that counts, and he knows our hearts and circumstances. Those who elevate themselves or others because of "titles" well, that's their problem....in the end they too will stand in front of Jehovah and render an account, regardless of what title they have.

Hahaha, just a couple of weeks ago, when reporting my hours for last month to our group elder (a good friend as well) I told him how embarrassing my report was. I wasn't beating myself up over it though,  I had my parents in town and there just wasn't the time like usual as we were making day trips to show them around etc. He told me his weren't much better as he had been on vacation for two weeks

I will make the job easier by supplying #14 myself:
14.) "And the Devil who was misleading them was hurled into the lake of fire...." (Rev 20:10)
That's supposed to bother him? I believe he has a summer cottage on the Lake of Fire.

Just thought I'd point out that this is wrong, imo. I would think the following is more accurate:
Torture is ALWAYS torture, whether there was intent to torture or not. A person tortured through an accidental one-minute dip in carbolic acid is just as tortured as the one who was purposefully dipped for one minute in carbolic acid. The person who was purposefully tortured prior to a bombing because he might have information about it, can be tortured just the same as the one who goes through the ordeal after exploding the bomb.
Also, torture is still torture no matter what the intent, just like homicide is still homicide, even if one is accidental and the other is first-degree premeditated.
Torture is also wrong. God has allowed it, but my God, who is slow to anger and merciful, would not allow something he cannot completely reverse the effects of. 

Maybe I just couldn’t see the point of this experiment.....all I see is what I have already read from some ex-JWs , especially one  ex GB member  who made it seem like reporting field service created selfish, status climbing, bureaucratic butt kissers (pardon the expression). He was right to a small extend, this did apply to a few, but for the most part, those few are no longer JWs . If you are "slaving" for Jehovah for the wrong reason, it doesn’t last. You don't need to see what would happen if you stopped reporting, true motives become apparent sooner or later regardless. That was my point.
Yes, I agree,  and it does get on my nerves when I hear such expressions as  “so many years in time in full time service" etc. as if these persons are somehow better than someone who is like the widow. But we all know that is not true. If we place too much stock on what others think then obviously that is foolish, because it is ultimately what Jehovah thinks that counts, and he knows our hearts and circumstances. Those who elevate themselves or others because of "titles" well, that's their problem....in the end they too will stand in front of Jehovah and render an account, regardless of what title they have.

It bugs me when people act like they are worshiping an organization (the creation) rather than our Creator. It makes us seem cultish. Yes, respect and obedience to his "channel" has always been an integral part of our worship and relationship with Jehovah - even as Moses and Aaron were Jehovah's representatives. But if you were around at that time and saw Aaron making that golden calf, would you have thought you were being obedient to theocratic authority by bowing down to it? We shouldn't treat any human as a god. We shouldn't suspend our "clear thinking faculties" and hand them over to someone else because among other things not all men are who they appear to be. "Imposters...wolves in sheep's clothing...apostates..." we've had them all and still do. 

(Luke 12:47, 48) . . .Then that slave who understood the will of his master but did not get ready or do what he asked will be beaten with many strokes. But the one who did not understand and yet did things deserving of strokes will be beaten with few. Indeed, everyone to whom much was given, much will be demanded of him, and the one who was put in charge of much will have more than usual demanded of him.
 
Anna, everyone of us know who has the responsability to fix the situation: "his master on coming" (Lu 12:43)
So, what can we do? Wait, be busy in the work and making fine things, and pray.
Pray for these brothers in th GB, that they have the wisdom and courage to act. Pray for the humble ones, that Jehovah grant them faith to wait without stumbling

"So.....what we gonna do"?? 
(Vultures from jungle book- in case someone is not familiar with the scene)

Now now. Don't blame the paper!

Fact: Christians have been tasked with preaching the good news of the kingdom in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations before the end comes...That being the case, it makes sense to me that records of both time and resources would need to be kept in order to determine where to allocate said time and resources to where they are needed most. If things didn't take place in a highly organized way ("decently and by arrangement") and everyone kept their figures to themselves as to where, how and how much effort was needed, just doing what THEY felt needed to be done, it would be an anarchy of individual perceptions. After all, who wouldn't want to spend the rest of their lives preaching/living near a beach in Hawaii? (or substitute your favourite destination here). It seems clear to me that extensive records are not just desirable, but necessary. Even corporations recognize that. HOWEVER...as has been discussed, another fact...
Fact: If the motivation for our ministry is to be noticed by man rather than love for neighbour or God then there is something wrong. Can recording hours and handing them in contribute to a mindset of just putting in hours; can it contribute to wanting to be noticed for your "works" before men? I believe that is a possibility, but not a given. It would be unfair to paint with such a wide and tainted brush. Still, and especially lately I have seen pioneers fudge their reports so as to "get their time in." And that fact doesn't go without notice from those who struggle/extend themselves to be out. These "phantom" pioneers are described as "members of the 'Secret Service'" - since only God knows how they get their time in without actually doing anything. (OK, I'm not actually encouraging that type of description or being critical or judgmental of what others do), but I know for a fact that it happens. 
So while I see and recognize that filling in reports and counting time is not a specific requirement spelled out in God's Word, I can see and appreciate why it can be useful in facilitating the preaching work we are endeavoring to do. It just should be with the right motive. Which is essentially what everyone agrees with anyway here as far as I can tell.
 

Not astounded. Just another misreading I'm afraid. Actually I'm expressing disappointment. And believe me, I do not pretend.
Oh, and those resources? I usually equate this with the properly motivated time and energy those who love Jehovah spend in His service. Which is why I included the Psalm 110 reference.
Sorry if it hurt. But I do not agree with your assessment.
You have stated your experience as expressed earlier: "The elder body I served with...".  Your critical and jaded focus on, and descriptions of, the activities of your former colleagues, along with motive assessment (elders and otherwise) are apparent in a number of your postings: (no quotes required). The level of detail. and descriptive nature of these views indicates a period of cultivation.
Also, your similarity in expression to a whole army of critics orginating from within the ranks of Jehovah's Witnesses, along with your similarly recognisable focus on a distorted view of logistics and administrative processes, confirm my impression that this kind of attitude is the product of a process that somehow does it's work within the congregational arrangement. (A world within a world). However, the manifestation of it appears from the sidelines, usually once a form of estrangement has occured.
In light of Douglas Walton's interesting perspective on the ad hominem  (Media Argumentation. Dialectic, Persuasion and Rhetoric), I agree with him that it can be legitimate device when a character critique is directly or indirect­ly related to the point being articulated. I mean, surely we can see that when looking at Jesus words expressed so clearly in his denunciation of the Pharisees and scribes in Matthew Chapter 23.
In this case, I believe that there is no difference in my assessment or method of expressing it than that demonstrated by Paul in his warning to the Ephesians in Acts 20:30.
And to ensure that this posting remains firmly connected with the original posting shared by @Queen Esther, I believe that the joyful and zealous proclamation of the kingdom good news is one clear indicator of a spiritually healthy heart. Field service reports are just one of the tools available to keep those charged before Jehovah with shepherding His sheep alert to their spiritual health and safety. Her excellent poetic reminder is much appreciated.

One thing is being constantly oriented in this way, and the other is merely using "numbers" as a guide. A good Elder is also a good Christian, and as a good Christian he will act in a Christian way, regardless of numbers.
Something tells me this discussion we’ve got going on here has much deeper significance than just having a tizzy over a few record cards and how elders respond to them. Surely we all agree that blowing ones trumpet is wrong, and condemned by Jesus on many occasions.  So really, it can’t be about that, otherwise it would be too obviously hypocritical. Numbers by themselves mean something, but not everything, and as JWI points out IF as a publisher, we are merely concerned with the hours we put in, then we are blowing our own trumpet and merely performing token service. There are some who actually are like that, but eventually this backfires. I've known a few pioneers who left the truth to lead a selfish life. Maybe they had just been concerned about numbers. But we also have to be honest and admit that usually if someone is spiritually low, then the first thing (with Jehovah's Witnesses) is that field service suffers because out of the heart's abundance the mouth speaks.
It was relatively easy for the disciples to be eager about spreading the word. They’d  witnessed Jesus’ resurrection, were filled with holy spirit and experienced divine support. Charged with immense zeal to tell everyone about Jesus, they made Christianity spread like wildfire. BUT, the situation today is entirely different. What motivation is there to do what they did? What motivation is there to make disciples of all nations? What motivation is there to preach the good news? Not much evidently since most members of Christendom’s churches either think that this work is done, or leave it to the pastor, and if they believe there is still room to save a few souls they do not go out and teach the people the truth about God and his purpose. They barely even lead a Christian life themselves.
So if reaching a certain amount of numbers, (besides the love of neighbour), is what initially motivates one to get out of bed and go out and preach, then what is wrong with that? I mean, who of us doesn't admit to occasional reluctance in going out in FS rather than shopping/ golfing/staying in bed etc. and then, and despite "wrong" motivation, being rewarded with a really good and productive call and being happy that we had made the effort, despite initial "wrong" motivation?
Therefore I cannot agree with this statement:
In fact, this is going the way of the sentiments of Carl Olof Jonsson, (and others) whose ideas are very similar to the rest of Christendom, and are a cop out contrary to Paul's admonition to Timothy and by extension any Christian:  "Preach the word; be at it urgently in favorable times and difficult times; reprove, reprimand, exhort, with all patience and art of teaching. For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled. They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.  You, though, keep your senses in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelizer, fully accomplish your ministry"-  2Tim.4:2-5
So it seems this conversation has developed more into an excuse to take it easy as evangelizers, rather than whether it is right to record or not to record.
By the way,  I had a study with a lady who was amazed and impressed at the fact that every JW preaches the word, and for free! It was completely foreign to her since all she knew from her Church was organizing jumble sales (rummage sales) for charity. And that was their ministry. As a side issue, she also said that she had learned more from a few months studying the Bible with JWs than she had learned in 2 years in the church (she had previously been an atheist and "converted" because of a requirement to be able to adopt a child). 
 

It is not rocket science of course. Unfortunately there exist some members of the congregation who are a little "different" and because of that don't get included, and sometimes get outright ignored by the majority. A brother once told me about his wife and two sons. His wife had severe depression, but despite that, would come and sit at the back of the hall. From what he said, I gathered the friends pretty much ignored her. Maybe because they just didn't know what to say to her. Maybe because she was "weird". Unfortunately, it also seems that no one paid much attention to her sons either. Sadly, both her sons left the truth, and one remarked that with the true religion there is supposed to be love, and he didn't feel any love. Of course, that may have just been an excuse, but I know for a fact that there can be many cliques inside a congregation and if you happen not to fit in one, you can be very much on your own, and feel it. Cliques are a natural phenomenon. Mother's with young children hang out with other mothers with young children. Teenagers hang out with other teenagers etc. We have 3 older sisters in our congregation who ALWAYS sit together, so much so that one elder called them the 3 amigos from the platform. But there are some friends that just don't fit anywhere. That is why it's so important to "widen out" and put in special effort to include them. Which means real effort on our part, because it may mean not only inviting that "weird" family to our party, but also paying attention to them on a regular basis....

The same scientists who said it is safe to dump large amounts of industrial fluoride in our water because it will be good for our teeth!  They did not think of the damage it will bring to other organs of the body...
I do not care if it is supposedly safe - (also a lie by the capitalists who need the markets to stay stable)- the bottom line is -  it should NOT be  in the ocean or our food!!  The fishes and we were not made to live in / or consume this. 
BUT as a bible student I realize that there is nothing we can do about (leave it to the activists) because human greed; contamination of water resources due to human activity; will go on until the earth is one big garbage dump and we have a hard time with illnesses due to these phenomena.
Did the bible not say that plagues will be returning in time of end (all kinds I guess- bacterial and induced by contaminated water and food)  and if Jehovah did not step in very little flesh will be saved?
 

My husband says the cranberry dolphin thing is fake?  Please check if it is fact..... then let me know.... if it is true I will paste on FB

They're also fairly unique among Christian denominations about actually doing anything about the Word of God,  insomuch as it involves spreading a united message. Denominations that do not completely neglect that work fritter away most of their energies taking sides over social and national issues, and in the end convey only that 'Jesus is God.' When I see the group that has participated in the fulfillment of Matthew 24:14 to even a fraction of JWs, perhaps I will bolt to them. 
'Advertising the kingdom' is the overwhelming theme today. All else is fine print, arguable this way or that, but fine print nonetheless.
 

Someone should tell him that swallowing little blue pills will work better.

People just do not have respect for blood! Only Jehovah's organization teaches this.... I see no connection between sexual strength, manhood or beauty,  and bathing in blood..... How many of these old wives tales lifted from witchcraft are still going to be believed and how many animals will still have to suffer for silly superstitious beliefs.  

Before taking this story seriously, I'd like to see Putin brag about it himself somewhere. This is exactly the kind of thing that war-mongers and regime-change-mongers monger for. Daily and nightly we see two or three major USA media outlets hawk for some kind of war against Russia in vicarious support of the person who came in second in our last presidential election.
She apparently would have wanted it that way if she won, and the 52% (or so) of Americans that wanted her to win apparently think it would be poetic justice against Trump's imagined Russian friends [if we could start a war].

Putin does not brag openly like Trump does.  He likes to be seen with his shirt off!  He likes to be seen as a sporting man, hunting deer or riding a horse!  He is the quiet, man of ACTION as portrayed by the Russian propaganda machine!

The way to spot "lost sheep" when they are in the middle of many other sheep is to lay on your side and look at their legs and feet to see if they are all facing the same way.

I used to when I was a teenager. Spontaneous drop ins were great as there was an excuse to take a break from homework or some other mundane task! But now our lives are so planned out, even our relaxation time, that any interruption is not really welcomed especially if you have no time to prepare physically or mentally. I thought I would personally kill the two elders that "dropped in while passing by" after I had had sinus surgery and looked like I had been severely beaten up. I was resting on my chaise, still partially drugged up,  and lo and behold, I see these two guys walking past my window. Normally I wouldn't have answered the door, but the combination of the hydrocodone and my fuzzy mind, I thought it was something important, I had no idea it was going to be one of our elders and the CO! I hadn't told anyone about the surgery, and they must have wondered why I was absent for his visit, plus it was raining and they were looking for things to do, lol. Anyway, the week after that I took that elder aside and wagging my finger at him  I jokingly but seriously told him to never ever do that to me again! I think because they are guys, brothers don't understand that women like to put themselves together before accepting visitors.

2 Corinthians 2:3,4: "Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of tender mercies and the God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our trials so that we may be able to comfort others in any sort of trial with the comfort that we receive from God."
 What a wonderful arrangement. 

Thank you for posting such a lovely poem.  I can relate to this poem very well.  Recently (within the last few years) I was in a deep depression.  I would go to meeting arriving just as the song started, sit in the back and leave as soon as the last song and prayer were over.  I didn't have the capacity to visit and the noise afterwards was very overwhelming.   I just wanted to be in the "Satan Free Zone" as I call our meetings.   There were new friends who had moved in and probably thought I was disfellowshipped.  I was visited by 2 sisters while out in service and also the brothers made a point of visiting me on a couple of occasions.  I poured out my heart to them and they were so kind and put no pressure on me, just let me know I was valuable to Jehovah, Jesus and the congregation using scriptures and gentle words.   I love them for that, that is true shepherding (sisters included).  I have recovered now and try to pay-it-forward in service and to my brothers and sisters; giving hugs and kind words seasoned with a sense of humor when appropriate.   I make it a point to look for those who don't feel included so that I can share the love I have with them so that it may encourage them to keep going.   Why should we only be searching for sheep to come through the front door when we are losing so many out the back door?  

People keep track of many numbers - blood pressure, age, speed at which they are driving, weight, exact bank balance. It's not wrong to do it and it doesn't interfere with one's appreciation for 'the real thing.' There will always be some anal people who obsess over any number, but that is them, not the number. 
It's a quick take on one's participation in the work Jesus said people should do. It makes possible an overall glimpse of the regional preaching activity enabling planning and allocation of resources.
Nobody drops people like the paid church preachers, where the only metric they track is donations - the one metric that no one ever knows about in the Christian congregation. Our elders are unpaid volunteers who often have much on their plates - working, and raising families. They do the best they can, feel bad when they fall short, and are continually trained to do better. They don't have to serve at all. 
It's not that your point is invalid, but to obsess over it too much is to show yourself as anal as the ones you gripe about.