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Anna

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  1. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    There is something else I wanted to add to this. It's not that JW's personal views are valueless, but if you look up the definition of "to harbor" you will see that it means something like "keep (a thought or feeling, typically a negative one) in one's mind, especially secretly....with the synonyms  "nurturing" "nursing" "cherishing". It's all about attitude. There may be something that a JW understands differently to the GB/FDS, they just don't see it the same way. If someone understands something differently to the GB/FDS, do you think it would be reasonable to expect that someone to stop seeing it that way just for the sake of it? Or has it more to do with the attitude of that person? For example, someone may not really accept the explanation of the "Generation" although they tried, but just can't. The immature person might want to make a big deal out of it. They may "nurse" their idea until it becomes unbearable and consumes everything else, including all the "truths" they previously cherished. Now the only idea they "cherish" is their own opinion. The mature Christian accepts they may understand things differently and moves on, and waits till things become clearer one way or another. Let's say at some point in the past someone had a personal opinion on a subject which was not the official understanding at the time. Some years later though, the very opinion they had, now becomes the official teaching. Does that mean they were guilty of having the trait of an immature Christian just for having that different opinion? Obviously not. But they would have been an immature Christian had they "harbored" those thoughts to the point of advocating their opinion and becoming consumed by it.
    When it's not merely a personal opinion or idea but a clear unambiguous Bible teaching. This is why it's important to know your Bible well. Those who didn't get carried away with 1975 were cognizant of the scripture which clearly says "no one knows the day or hour" no matter what anyone else was saying. Some who did get carried away blamed the org. for their losses. It's up to each person how they react, in the end we stand alone in front of the judgement seat of God and render an account for ourselves, not for anyone else.
  2. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    I also apologize for the (really) late response.
    Notice I said unquestioned obedience. There is a big difference, and I think this is what our issue should be, not the obedience which results from cooperation,  but obedience which goes above obedience to Jehovah.  The scriptures are clear, we must obey God as ruler rather than men. So if our obedience to anyone, including the GB, conflicts with God, then we do not obey. This rule governs any of those quotes from the WT you posted. Of course, when one discusses the general aspects of obedience, including those quotes, one assumes that in reality the FDS is not going to instruct anyone to go against God and do something unscriptural. So that means that one can take those quotes at face value and happily obey, without any qualms. However, it is possible that some would allow their obedience to cross the threshold of what is scriptural, because they intend to obey the FDS no matter what, and that is the point I was trying to make.
    I understand why you say this, but the context of that particular paragraph is Christian maturity as exemplified by  "oneness of the faith" as spoken of by the apostle Paul in Ephesians 4:11-14 : " And he gave some as apostles, some as prophets, some as evangelizers,  some as shepherds and teachers,  with a view to the readjustment of the holy ones, for ministerial work, to build up the body of the Christ, until we all attain to the oneness of the faith and of the accurate knowledge of the Son of God, to being a full-grown man, attaining the measure of stature that belongs to the fullness of the Christ. So we should no longer be children, tossed about as by waves and carried here and there by every wind of teaching by means of the trickery of men, by means of cunning in deceptive schemes". So if "oneness of the faith" here is the concern, then it is natural to regard "differing private ideas" about Bible interpretation as undesirable. Sometimes though we may not be able to stop "private ideas", and whether this is because of Christian immaturity or not, it is ultimately between us and Jehovah and not the GB/FDS. 
    No doubt it must cross people's minds though that how come 8 men can wield such authority, supposedly over the faith of 8 million people, with only a claim that they are the fds of Matthew 24. But really, although they make that claim, it does not obviously mean that they are inspired or infallible, nor that they actually do wield authority over our lives, or our spirituality/faith. All these aspects are our own responsibility, our personal faith.Their responsibility is to provide food at the proper time, and also, to shepherd the congregations in order to keep them clean with respect to morality and spiritual cleanses (not mixing pagan ideas with Christianity). If the congregation was allowed to get contaminated with worldly attitudes (e.g. immorality) and false teachings, then the congregation would lose God's favor as it would no longer be clean. Some Jws and many ex-jws misinterpret this to mean that the GB controls people's lives.
     
  3. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in How are we to understand the GB/Slave interpreting scripture, as the sole chanel, and at the same time accept that they can err?   
    100% true.  Somehow though I think that the idea of unquestioned obedience to a group of uninspired men exists in the minds of some Witnesses, but not all. I had a conversation along similar lines with Witnesses on another website, and when I pointed out that Br. Jackson of the GB himself indicated that we should not have unquestioning obedience to them, and I even quoted Br. Jackson to support what I said, I got thrown out of the forum. I paraphrase Br. Jackson here as I am on another computer and do not have access to the transcript where he made that quote. Basically, the gist of what he said was that "if the GB said something that was out of line with the scriptures, then all other JWs who have the Bible, would see that it was wrong direction". In other words, if others recognized from the Bible that certain direction was wrong, they would not follow it, no matter who it came from.
    So really, that kind of solves the problem. Someone has to take the lead, and if we use the Bible as a measuring stick, and see that that person, or body of persons are going against the scriptures, then it would be wrong of us to obey them in that particular instance as we must obey God as ruler, rather than men.
  4. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in Will only Jehovah's Witnesses be saved?   
    As I see it, you would have three choices: 1.Don't let it bother you, pray about it, and wait until perhaps things cleared up 2.if it really bothered you, talk to a mature Christian about it, or 3. Leave, because why would you stay if you don't agree.
    What you do, would be up to you. What you chose to do in the end would probably depend on what you disagreed with, and how important it was to you.
  5. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in Will only Jehovah's Witnesses be saved?   
    " there is nothing wrong with a personal opinion, it is the advocating or insisting on it". I would never insist on my opinion with the friends. I will mention it once, have a discussion,  but I will not keep on going on about it.
    I am talking about it here, as this is a controversial section, and people have the choice to either come here and read it or not. In this regard I am not pushing my opinion on a captive audience. In fact I don't think I am pushing my opinion at all (correct me if I am wrong) I am merely explaining how I feel and why.
  6. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in Will only Jehovah's Witnesses be saved?   
    You didn't read my answer properly.
  7. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Thinking in Will only Jehovah's Witnesses be saved?   
    It says a "mature Christian". We are all at different levels of Christian maturity, learning and adjusting out views and opinions. It also suggests there is nothing wrong with a personal opinion, it is the advocating or insisting on it. That is immature. As for harboring private ideas, well, no one can stop private ideas, and no one except Jehovah needs to know about them. Again to what extend and what KIND of private ideas one harbors does have a baring on the maturity of the Christian. The operative idea is NOT "harboring". This suggests that on the contrary, we should be able to talk about them. And if these private ideas foster doubt, then we should definitely talk to a mature Christian about them.
    As regards "To survive the great tribulation and Armageddon, the WTS says the great crowd must be JWs in good standing" JWInsider has covered that.
  8. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    Wouldn't it be interesting to see how true Christians might end up distinguishing themselves by the extent to which we give actual food even to our enemies, motivated by our love for Jehovah and Jesus Christ, and our true admiration of a kingdom based on Biblical principles:
    (Matthew 14:14-16) . . .When he came ashore, he saw a large crowd, and he felt pity for them, and he cured their sick ones. 15 But when evening fell, his disciples came to him and said: “The place is isolated and the hour is already late; send the crowds away, so that they may go into the villages and buy themselves food.” 16 However, Jesus said to them: “They do not have to leave; you give them something to eat.”
    (Matthew 24:45) 45 “Who really is the faithful and discreet slave whom his master appointed over his domestics, to give them their food at the proper time?
    (Acts 2:43-47) . . .. 44 All those who became believers were together and had everything in common, 45 and they were selling their possessions and properties and distributing the proceeds to all, according to what each one needed. 46 And day after day they were in constant attendance in the temple with a united purpose, and they took their meals in different homes and shared their food with great rejoicing and sincerity of heart, 47 praising God and finding favor with all the people.. . .
    (Acts 6:1-3) . . .Now in those days when the disciples were increasing, the Greek-speaking Jews began complaining against the Hebrew-speaking Jews, because their widows were being overlooked in the daily distribution. 2 So the Twelve called the multitude of the disciples together and said: “It is not right for us to leave the word of God to distribute food to tables. 3 So, brothers, select for yourselves seven reputable men from among you, full of spirit and wisdom, that we may appoint them over this necessary matter;
    (James 2:14-17) . . .Of what benefit is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but he does not have works? That faith cannot save him, can it? 15 If any brothers or sisters are lacking clothing and enough food for the day, 16 yet one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but you do not give them what they need for their body, of what benefit is it? 17 So, too, faith by itself, without works, is dead.
    (Romans 12:20) 20 But “if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; . . .
    (1 Timothy 5:8) 8 Certainly if anyone does not provide for those who are his own, and especially for those who are members of his household, he has disowned the faith and is worse than a person without faith.
    Spiritual food and works are still more important in the long run, but I think that sometimes we read verses like Hebrews 10:24, and others, and forget that these referred to material giving:
    (Hebrews 10:24) And let us consider one another so as to incite to love and fine works.
    (Galatians 6:10) . . .So, then, as long as we have the opportunity, let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to us in the faith.
    (Acts 9:36-39) . . .“Dorʹcas.” She abounded in good deeds and gifts of mercy that she was making. . . .  and all the widows presented themselves to him, weeping and showing many garments and robes that Dorʹcas had made while she was with them.
    (Titus 3:8) 8 These words are trustworthy, and I want you to keep stressing these matters, so that those who have believed God may keep their minds focused on maintaining fine works. These things are fine and beneficial to men.
    (1 Timothy 2:10) 10 but in the way that is proper for women professing devotion to God, namely, through good works.
    (1 Timothy 5:9, 10) 9 A widow is to be put on the list if she is not less than 60 years old, was the wife of one husband, 10 having a reputation for fine works, if she raised children, if she practiced hospitality, if she washed the feet of holy ones, if she assisted the afflicted, if she devoted herself to every good work.
    (1 Timothy 6:17-19) . . .Instruct those who are rich in the present system of things not to be arrogant, and to place their hope, not on uncertain riches, but on God, who richly provides us with all the things we enjoy. 18 Tell them to work at good, to be rich in fine works, to be generous, ready to share, 19 safely treasuring up for themselves a fine foundation for the future, so that they may get a firm hold on the real life.
    (Matthew 25:36-40) . . .’ 37 Then the righteous ones will answer him with the words: ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and receive you hospitably, or naked and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and visit you?’ 40 In reply the King will say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of the least of these my brothers, you did it to me.’
  9. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Arauna in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    As skeptical as I am about a lot of things, I cannot agree with you there. There are a lot of things going wrong that I have not seen before. For example just when I go shopping. I want to make bread....I can't get the flour, and haven't been able to for months. This is only one thing. There are many others I won't get into, but once the supply chain is broken somewhere, it's like a domino effect, it affects a lot of other things. In the long run it affects people's livelihoods, and when people don't have money, they get up to all kinds of weird and dangerous things to get it. In my opinion, we have not seen the fallout of 2020 yet. I think we are just seeing the tip of the iceberg right now....
  10. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Evacuated in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I can't speak for others, but I am in it for the long haul, and if it comes sooner, then that's a bonus!
  11. Thanks
    Anna reacted to The Librarian in 2020 "Always Rejoice!" Convention Transcripts   
    Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri AM—Part 1 - v1.doc 84.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri AM—Part 1 - v2.doc 84.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri AM—Part 2- v2.doc 80.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri PM—Part 1 (WAD) - v1.doc 69.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri PM—Part 1 (WAD) - v2.doc 69.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri PM—Part 2 (WAD) - v1.doc 109.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Fri PM—Part 2 (WAD) - v2.doc 109.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat AM—Part 1 - v1.doc 75.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat AM—Part 1 - v2.doc 77.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat AM—Part 1 (WAD) - v2.doc 75.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat AM—Part 2 (WAD) - v1.doc 76.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat AM—Part 2 (WAD) - v2.doc 77.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat PM—Part 1 (WAD) - v2.doc 104.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sat PM—Part 2 (WAD) - v2.doc 72.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun AM—Part 1 - v1.doc 99.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun AM—Part 1 (WAD) - v2.doc 98.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun AM—Part 2 - v1.doc 50.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun AM—Part 2 (WAD) - v2.doc 50.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun PM—Part 1 - v3.doc 71.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun PM—Part 1 (WAD) - v2.doc 53.5 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun PM—Part 2 - v3.doc 84.0 KB     Transcript - 2020 “Always Rejoice”! Conv Sun PM—Part 2 (WAD) - v2.doc 76.0 KB    
  12. Haha
    Anna got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    As skeptical as I am about a lot of things, I cannot agree with you there. There are a lot of things going wrong that I have not seen before. For example just when I go shopping. I want to make bread....I can't get the flour, and haven't been able to for months. This is only one thing. There are many others I won't get into, but once the supply chain is broken somewhere, it's like a domino effect, it affects a lot of other things. In the long run it affects people's livelihoods, and when people don't have money, they get up to all kinds of weird and dangerous things to get it. In my opinion, we have not seen the fallout of 2020 yet. I think we are just seeing the tip of the iceberg right now....
  13. Thanks
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in FOUR problems with latest "GENERATION" teaching   
    A couple of other indications that they were not discerning a sign in 1914, is that Rutherford took the 40-year harvest from 1874-1914, and shifted it to 1878-1918, bypassing the significance of 1914.
    1914 hadn't even shown anything significant yet with respect to the Gentile Times, either, which is why by January 1, 1916, the Watchtower had shifted the End of the Gentile Times to 1915:

    Also, it wasn't until May 1922, that the Watchtower first reported on the idea that Russell had announced on October 1, 1914 that "The Gentile Times have ended!" It took nearly 8 years before anyone thought this story was important. And since then the story has been told as happening on October 4, 1914 and and October 2, 1914.
  14. Thanks
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in FOUR problems with latest "GENERATION" teaching   
    *** Watchtower, October 1, 1930, p.291 ***
    Understanding that the ''day of Christ'' began when Jesus came to the temple of God, in 1918, it appears that the rebellion must precede that day. The beginning of the falling away or rebellion against God's organization would also mark the beginning of the disclosure of the ''man of sin'', even though none of God's children then on earth understood the matter. The Revelation which God gave to Jesus Christ to show to his "servant" began to be disclosed particularly from 1914 forward, but none of God's children on earth had an understanding thereof for fifteen years or more thereafter. They did see the evidence of things coming to pass which mark a fulfilment of Revelation, but they did not discern the meaning thereof. Likewise the faithful have for some years seen the manifestation of lawlessness and now begin to discern the meaning of the term the "man of sin".
    *** end of quote ***
     
    *** Watchtower, November 1, 1931, p. 376 ***
    Who on earth understood prior to 1918 that Zion is God's organization and gives birth to the kingdom and to her children? The fact that no one on earth did so understand prior to the Lord's coming to his temple [in 1918] is proof that it was not God's due time for them to understand. Who understood prior thereto about Satan's organization, the battle in heaven, and the casting of Satan out of heaven?  Manifestly no one could understand these things until the temple of God was open.
    *** end of quote ***
    These are the most direct quotes to start from. Once this context is understood, you can find another ten or so quotes that mean the same thing as "they did not discern" but without using the exact words. It becomes obvious that they did not discern when they "dug in their heels" at hanging on to 1874. 1874 was still officially the "discerned" start of Christ's presence/parousia, and this was repeated often from 1915 and even into the 1930's. (Officially dropped in 1943/1944.)
    Basically, Jesus presence began in 1874, and his coming/advent had also been dated to 1874, but Rutherford often spoke of Jesus coming (erchomai) in 1918. And the End of the Gentile Times could only be proven by events taking place in Palestine, including the resurrection of the ancient worthies like Abraham in 1914. Since the meaning of "Gentile Times" didn't pan out, the meaning was finally officially changed around 1930/1931.
    The September 1, 1930 Watchtower issue says this on pages 201, 202:
    "With the beginning of the second presence of the Lord, approximately A. D. 1875, there was a change in the work. . . .  The evidence seems quite conclusive that the gathering of these members of the body into the temple is almost complete, if not entirely so. The evidence shows that a great separating work has been going on since 1918 and that probably that separating work is not entirely completed, . . . .
     
    The October 15, 1930 Watchtower, p.308 said:
     
    "The second advent of the Lord Jesus Christ dates from about A. D. 1875,"
     
    The idea was barely mentioned for a couple of years, and then in the June 1, 1933 Watchtower (p.174), it goes back to 1874, again:
     
    "The second and invisible presence of Christ dates from about eighteen hundred and seventy-four."
     
    *** Watch Tower, October 1, 1903 [Reprints p. 3249] ***
    "It will be vain for Zionists to hope to establish an independent government in Palestine.... Palestine will be 'trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be filled full'—viz., October, 1914, A.D. By that time the heavenly kingdom will be in power and the ancient worthies—Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and all the holy prophets—will be resurrected and constitute the earthly representatives of the spiritual and invisible kingdom of Christ and his Gospel church." *** end of quote ***
     
    [I'm currently travelling and accessing my computer remotely, so I mostly grabbed the above from things written in a 2016 conversation on this forum with Outta Here, Holly W, you, Allen S, etc.]
  15. Haha
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    Historians of the future will be asked which quarter of 2020 did they specialize in.
    Quarter 1: Pandemic appears out of nowhere and spreads throughout the globe within weeks. Society goes into lockdown. Stock markets plunge. Massive unemployment begins.
    Quarter 2: People get fed up with lockdown. Churches defy them. College students and the young in general defy them. Police shootings prompt major protests in the streets. Renewed spikes in Covid 19 cases.
    Quarter 3: Protests escalate to riots. Pro and anti Trump people fight each other in the streets. Some killings, Huge property damage. Record-setting fires burn throughout western states, destroying entire communities, the smoke dims Eastern skies. GOP and Democrats decline to help unemployed as they did initially, preferring to blame each other Instead for the suffering that ensues.
    Quarter 4: The election. Never has been seen such incivility of opponents. Trump’s enemies proclaim he will not leave if he loses and will have to be dragged out of the White House. Hillary tells Democrats to, under no circumstances, concede a loss come Election Day. Social unrest intensifies. Only about one third of Americans say they will take a vaccine whenever one is produced. Serious talk of civil war is heard.
    Just for starters.
    Nothing to see here, people. Move along, now. Why, from the days of our forefathers, all things continue exactly as from creation’s beginning.
    You do?
  16. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in FOUR problems with latest "GENERATION" teaching   
    I was just browsing this topic and was wondering if you had the reference for this. Thanks! 🙂
  17. Haha
    Anna got a reaction from Patiently waiting for Truth in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    It sure seems like 2020 is quite distinct from any other. It even looks distinct on paper: 2020, an interesting number. When it passes by and in a few more years nothing happens I will refer you to this page and laugh at you.. When something does happen, I will eat humble pie and you will have the right to laugh at me. Not that any of us will be really laughing at the other, we are too nice for that right?
  18. Upvote
    Anna reacted to JW Insider in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    True. I wanted to explain that same weakness, but the post would have been longer. The main point is about the implied meaning of anyone who says to anyone else that we aren't just in the last period of time, but we are in the last part of that last period of time. I could have also used the idea of a sports announcer recalling a previous sports play, saying something about it happening not just in the final period of play, but the final part of that final period. If I had a minute I'd make it about Manchester United and Brighton. But I think you already get it.
    Tennis matches are made up of games, which make up a set, and several sets make up a match. Let's say a recent tennis match announcer had said that Thiem's limp didn't really show up until the last "set" of the match with Zverev, and the announcer claimed that it was actually in the "last part of that last set."  This would be misleading if it had actually shown up any time in the first half of that last set. And it wouldn't be misleading only if we wanted to be misled. It's just plain misleading, whether it was said about a game, a set, or a match.
  19. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from JW Insider in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I can't speak for others, but I am in it for the long haul, and if it comes sooner, then that's a bonus!
  20. Haha
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Organ Harvesting, Falun Gong, Tibet, etc. (The WEST vs. CHINA)   
    I actually did no more than scan it. It wasn’t forwarded specifically to me, but it was thrown out there by someone I know and have regard for.
    This is a little like how after I watch a movie, I will say to my wife how I intend to read some reviews to see if I liked it or not.
  21. Haha
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I’m not doing nothing until we reach the last of the last of the last days. Why inconvenience myself unnecessarily? It’s the same as when over the years the pioneer hour requirement is progressively lowered, then such a thing as ‘auxiliary pioneering’ is concocted, then the hour requirement for them is over time lowered, then it is even devised how to lower it still more during months of special activity. “I’m holding out for 15,” I tell people when I’m feeling punchy.
    I forgive it all. It may sound a little clunky, but I forgive it. I even recommend it—or at least acquiesce to it.
    “Soon we’ll be away from here—step on the gas and wipe that tear away!” That’s what the GB does. They step on the gas. They don’t sit in stuffy boardrooms discussing schematics of the car. The hop in the driver’s seat and drive that sucker! It is not an armchair activity for them. It is a participation sport, and they are not afraid to push pedal to the medal.
    It is a little like Carl Jung after the Holocaust, his values shaken to the core, because he observed it and read a lot about it, and so he completely misses the meaning of Job as he takes shots at God in ‘Answer to Job.’ Jehovah’s Witnesses, on the other hand, didn’t observe it. They didn’t read up on it. They endured it. They lived through it. They were sent to the camps well before the far more numerous Jews, and their integrity saw them though. 
    So it is that the GB today are doers to match their prowess as thinkers, maybe even outrunning it at times, convinced the latter will catch up. Do they counsel obedience for others? They are that way themselves. They obey first, then they think it through more thoroughly afterwards. Should this result in a clunky expression from time to time, so be it. They are not afraid to go all-in, and I so prefer them to the bland people of this system who must hedge everything they do.
    Nor am I not going to be forewarned by it. I’m not about to let my ‘sophistication’ cause me to miss out. They deal with and want to counter the opposite view: “Why, from the days of our forefathers, all things are continuing as at Creation’s beginning!” People are rocked by unheard of calamities today—and yet in no time at all they have adapted to them and accepted whatever is the latest as ‘just one [more] of those things.‘ The urge to sleep is strong. Even 4Jah, saying whatever he has to in order to insult his former faith, not noticing when it contradicts what he has just said, scares us all with ‘Only five years more till the true-anointed appears and brings the end!’ and now sings “Que sera, sera’ no last of the last for me!”
  22. Upvote
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in Prophecy & Signs, Truth & Conspiracy, Covid-19, the UN, Disgusting Thing, Truth and Conspiracies   
    “In my letter I wrote you to stop keeping company with sexually immoral people, not meaning entirely with the sexually immoral people of this world or the greedy people or extortioners or idolaters. Otherwise, you would actually have to get out of the world.” Paul has to clarify who he was speaking about, because, obviously it was not possible to “get out of the world.”
    Today it is! If you follow government advisories and go just a tiny nudge further, you all but have! And nobody saw it coming! Nobody foresaw a pandemic, and in case anyone did, no one foresaw how it would give ample opportunity to get out of the world.
    Let’s get @Kosonengoing on this. We all know that 4J is nuts, denouncing that even if they brush their teeth at Bethel, those choppers are not really clean because it was not guided by holy spirit. Yes, holy spirit doesn’t direct every tiny little thing they do. But neither am I willing to send it out to pasture. Could holy spirit have something to do with this unexpected opportunity to “get out of the world?” What does Kos think?
    One of our elders is very much given to spotting sentences from the Watchtower and reading extra meaning into them that may or may not be there. He was all excited when they commented on the uber-violent entertainment of today, that maybe it is preparing the hearts of non-worshippers for when “each one will lift up his hand against his brother”—pumping them up with an affinity for gore.
    And now here we are just a few years down the road and people seriously discuss the possibility of civil war in the United States! And they are fighting it out right now in several US cities!
    In the United States! The last time there was talk of civil war in the United States was during the Civil War! Now there is that talk again, with society splitting into two factions that hate each other‘s guts. No matter who wins the election in November, the other side is not going to accept it.
    It is more than a joke when it is said: “Future historians will be asked: ‘What quarter of 2020 did you specialize in?’” They didn’t say it about 2019, 2018, or any other year in memory. There is something distinct, groundbreaking, and equally disasterous in each quarter. Factions do not trust one another. The population does not agree on “what the science says” or whether they should follow it regardless of what it says. It doesn’t agree on anything. As Pew uncovered, not only do they not agree on how to act in light of the facts, but they don’t agree on what the facts are. Factions can’t stand each  other and do all they can to demonize the other side.
    Current happenings are entirely in harmony with how God has said he “will incite Egyptians against Egyptians, and they will fight one another, each against his brother and his neighbor.” It seems like a very appropriate time to “get out of the world” to the extent possible, and now current events and the organization’s example make it possible to a greater extent that even Paul’s day. It also seems like an appropriate time to lay off criticism for anyone saying we’re in the last of the last days.
  23. Upvote
    Anna reacted to Evacuated in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I suppose the word "misleading" is what I balk at.
    Miriam Webster defines this as: "to lead in a wrong direction or into a mistaken action or belief often by deliberate deceit"
    I do not think this is the case in respect of the last days or any portion thereof. I think there have been and are speculative expectations regarding the proximity of Jehovah's intervention and that some get carried along with them, embroidering them even. But not all have, or are, even now. An "are we there yet?" mindset is not  that peculiar among humans who are expecting good things to happen. It is just a consequence of impatience and and a bit of tangible reward focus thrown in.
    People who need and want to give up smoking tobacco may be reinforced in this by monetary or health considerations, even peer pressure. The more noble reasons of being undefiled and whole-souled before Jehovah may take time to get their proper place in motivation. But who cares?.... as long as they put the filthy habit behind them.
    So if people do more for Jehovah due to an exaggerated spur of expectation... who cares? Everybody wins in the end. Right motive takes time to develop as Paul made clear at Php. 3:15 and 1Cor. 9:17.
    And for those who now feel they gave up too much for too little in their serving Jehovah? Perhaps a little more meditating on what Jehovah and Jesus gave up for them, and what exactly they gave it up for would not go amiss.
  24. Upvote
    Anna got a reaction from JW Insider in Organ Harvesting, Falun Gong, Tibet, etc. (The WEST vs. CHINA)   
    Interesting read for sure (you could have written it). I am always a little skeptical of "deep state" stuff, but I do believe that money is ultimately behind every decision most people or organizations make. Not sure about the coronavirus being developed to bring on economic collapse though. But anything is possible...
  25. Haha
    Anna reacted to TrueTomHarley in ALL aspects of 1914 doctrine are now problematic from a Scriptural point of view   
    I think the best indication that the Witness organization is on to something with its ‘last of the last days’ characterization is a line I’ve heard on social media—and it invariably triggers an avalanche of likes: 
    “Historians of the future will be asked what quarter of 2020 did they specialize in.”
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