Anna

So, I have been doing some reading, (Wikipedia so far) and evidently the above statement is far too sweeping to accurately describe quite a complex and multi faceted situation that brought about the death of many, the numbers  of which vary because they cannot be accurately verified. 
I am assuming the reference to "murder" of 40 million is referring to the "Great Leap Forward" and the "great famine" that resulted from it. If I were to sum it up briefly, I would say Mao Zedong was an idiot who shouldn't have tried to implemented something he didn't fully understand. And definitely not on such a large scale. 
I remember in communist Europe private farms being "colectivized" with the animals being taken away from the small holdings and put in huge  pig farms or cattle ranches. All that the farmers had left was chickens and some geese. They didn't make enough money to make repairs to the buildings, and as a consequence the villages became dilapidated, so much so that when my grand parents returned to their homeland after 40 years, and drove through these once pretty villages, they wept. My "bourgeois" grandfather, before he and my grandmother defected, was put in jail (just for a few days) because he owned his own company. Over the years the capital city, once a crowning jewel, became gray and depressing. 
In China, the farmers were forced into collective farming but as opposed to the later European model, where individual farmers didn't make a nickle, the Chinese farmers suffered terribly, millions of them starving to death in what was called "the great famine". 
One of Mao's absurd campaigns was the plan to eradicate sparrows. Wikipedia:
"The Four Pests Campaign (Chinese: 除四害; pinyin: Chú Sì Hài), was one of the first actions taken in the Great Leap Forward in China from 1958 to 1962. The four pests to be eliminated were rats, flies, mosquitoes, and sparrows........which resulted in severe ecological imbalance, being one of the causes of the Great Chinese Famine. In 1960, Mao Zedong ended the campaign against sparrows and redirected the fourth focus to bed bugs" (!)
I don't know about anyone else, but reading this confirms in my mind that Mao was a raving lunatic.
Then there are supposed reports of torture and killing of non compliant farmers. But I will have to pick that one up in my next post. 
 

Huh! All that you have to do here to establish your reputation as Teller of TRUTH is to disappear!
If I wasn’t worried about breaking the heart of the old hen, I’d do it myself!
”Ah, TrueTom,” they will say. “He really was true! But we didn’t realize it until he was long gone! If only we had recognized his genius and integrity while he was with us!”

I can see the game that the administration is playing here. They don't want to remove us completely as it would prove my point about them being Elders disfellowshipping people, just as they disfellowshipped John Butler and probably others. So the admin is playing games of moving comments and starting 'pretend new topics' to make those comments look silly stood alone. Everyone knows that a comment out of context does not stand properly. Well done admin, keep playing your games. Keep pretending it has some 'purpose'.  Hum, you get more like your GB all the time. 
 

that old hen
You’re such a loon, 4J. You’ve been told any number of times just who runs things here—it is entirely unremarkable—and you choose instead some paranoid and zany version.

Thanks. I won't be able to weigh in on this until Monday or so. But this should give ample opportunity for anyone who's interested to get the evidence started. Didn't want this to be TOO easy. It's not a simple topic, after all.

Actually, after communism fell in Eastern Europe, and Jehovah's Witnesses were free to preach and distribute literature, many householders would remark that the paradise illustrations reminded them of communist drawings. More recently, my mum gave the book "God's Kingdom Rules" to one of her studies (a lady in her 70's) and she did not like it at all. She said it was like reading a communist book. This is why in my earlier post I was careful to say that a totalitarian regime ran by imperfect beings is wrong. Most of us know that many of the communist ideologies are actually good, but of course imperfect man is not able to make them work, because man cannot rule over other men.

Yikes! I didn't delete it in time. I removed that because to explain the full point would have taken another page or two. I'll assume you got what I was driving at without needing the full explanation. Hmm. Maybe there's a lesson there in how lengthy my writing should be.
Nah!

that old hen.

My wife’s grandfather was born in Zagreb. My son went to Serbia to “find his roots.” He fell in love with the people, and eventually moved there. “You have to be careful in accepting their hospitality,” he says, “becasue they will give you what they don’t have.” He also confirms what you have said about Tito.

“They pretend to pay us and we pretend to work” Is the expression I have heard of the Soviet Union.

One fine resurrection day: “Hey! TrueTomHarley! Glad to see you made it. I had my doubts.”
“Thanks, brothers. Great to be alive! Now, lead me to my keyboard so I can tell off the fatheads!”
“Um...hate to break it to ya, fella...

When I heard the truncated clip, I was disappointed. It makes our guy look like a religious nut. “It’s a modern-day miracle,” he says, seemingly his lead-off line about the Jehovah’s Witnesses move to present their annual summer conventions online.
It’s not a modern-day miracle. It’s a technological accomplishment—an impressive one, to be sure—after all, it involves 500 languages, done on a crash basis, and broadcast worldwide—but it is not a “miracle.” It is not Jesus walking on water. Forgive me if I admit that when I first saw the clip with that as his lead statement, I supposed that the man was a nut—an over enthusiastic zealot who had drunk too much of his own Kool-Aid.
Yet, do I not come across the entire interview several days later to find it of a completely different flavor? It turns out that he is not that way at all—his remarks were framed to make him sound a fanatic by a media that feels it their duty to do so when dealing with matters of faith, something that is not their forte. He never meant the “miracle” remark literally. It’s a gush of enthusiasm such as anyone will have upon completing an overwhelming project. It is Neil Armstrong saying “one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind.” It is a throw-off line of hyperbole that comes 5 minutes into the interview—not the lead-off pronouncement of the truncated version.
This is so infuriating, but also so typical. Everyone will say something in the course of 15 minutes that can be misconstrued by those of another agenda—who simply can’t get their heads around a different point of view or may even be trying to deliberately sabotage it—to make the person look like a nut.
I almost wonder if something similar is now at work with the doctor from Cameroon recommending the hydroxychloroquine drug for Covid 19. There were ten doctors who banded together for a public statement before the steps of the Supreme Court, but because this one (Stella Immanuel) has made remarks in her past about demons, and the others presumably have not, she becomes the sole media focus to discredit the lot of them. The other nine are sent out to pasture.
I don’t often speak on my blog of demons, nor of the devil. Much of my target audience chokes at mention of God, so should I really send them into orbit with posts of the devil? Besides, humans are perfectly capable of doing evil things all on their own—a line of demarcation is hard to draw. 
But neither do I think someone should be pilloried for bringing up the topic, much less when it has nothing to do with the story at hand. If anything, I am the expedient chicken, not her. Anyone who knows anything about Africa knows that belief in interaction with the spirits is well-nigh universal. She is to be expected not to pick up on it? Let the thinkers today get a handle on evil—even eradicate it a little bit—before they go ridiculing those who go off their materialistic script.
At root, though the doctor and our guy may be poles apart, the reason to trash them is the same, or at least it is a kissing cousin: they are both serious about things not endorsed by today’s prevailing atheistic materialistic view. In her case, there may be more to the story—something that is deliberately discredited. In our case, there certainly is. Us first:
Robert Hendricks, spokesperson for Jehovah’s Witnesses, speaks of how both the door-to-door ministry and the annual conventions have been suspended for the first time in history. The reasons are telling—that of “respect for life” and “love of neighbor.” Probably no one has more potential to spread the Covid 19 virus than Jehovah’s Witnesses in their old model. Not only do they routinely approach people, but their organization is the largest convention-holding one in the world—people converge sometimes by the tens of thousands for events held in stadiums. We just couldn’t see ourselves doing that this year, Hendricks said. With a lead-in time of only about a month, Witnesses put the entire event online to be streamed worldwide. 
Their organization had gone into lockdown even before governments began to require it. “Just because you can drive 75 mph in some areas doesn’t mean that you should,” he stated. I told the CultExpert, he of the #freedomofmind hashtag, that “our” people were more responsible than his. Our people promptly and without fuss laid low—Covid 19 would be long gone by now if all were like them—but “his” people? You don’t think many of them will use their “freedom of mind” to tell the government what it can do with its rules? 
Frankly, since media jumps all over churches that defy “science” by gathering, you would think they would praise to the heavens one that has set the example for being proactive. Yet, even when trying to compliment, they are hamstrung by a mindset that pronounces religion outmoded. Even as the New York Times covers the socially responsible move, (that of suspending the door-to-door ministry, not that of the conventions, which came later), they take for granted that it is done only for the sake of appearances. “It followed anguished discussions at Watchtower headquarters with leaders deciding March 20 that knocking on doors would leave the impression that members were disregarding the safety of those they hoped to convert,” as though the safety itself doesn’t mean beans to them. “Members are called on to share scriptures in person with nonmembers,” it wrote. Well, in fact they are called to do it, but it is by the scriptures themselves, and not the commands of HQ, as they seem to frame it. “Now if I am declaring the good news, it is no reason for me to boast, for necessity is laid upon me. Really, woe to me if I do not declare the good news!” writes the apostle at 1 Corinthians 9:16. Why do these materialistic ones not just say that the Bible itself is a cult manual and be done with it?
As to the 500 languages (1000 in print): the interview branched into this as the newsman asked some questions—it turns out that his mom is a Witness, and he thanked Hendricks for keeping her safe. The languages feat can be done because there is no profit motive, Hendricks said. That’s why no one else even comes close—Google, Apple, Amazon—no one. “There’s no end to what can be done if there is not a profit motive,” he said.
A cynical me says that he will probably be fired for going so far “off-script.” Naw—I don’t really think he will be, but if it is like the Cameroon doctor, he could be. She and her fellow doctors were promptly muzzled on social media for “spreading misinformation.” Will the News13 reporter be accused of “enabling” it as well?
Her turn: A major study of the Henry Ford Healthcare System in Detroit finds that the drug hydroxychloroquine is extremely effective. Why it is trashed as it is, I will never know. But since it is dirt cheap, and since the President has recommended it, it is hard not to think that either or both or these facts suggest possible reasons. 
By the time, the Henry Ford study was released, media had already reached the verdict that the drug was no good. This was based upon an earlier study published in Lancet that said hydroxychloroquine was ineffective, and in fact, even dangerous. However, Lancet later retracted their article. The reason they retracted it is that it was of a study that had not been submitted to peer review. The reason it had not been submitted to peer review is that it would have failed—it was a very sloppy study, sabotaged in numerous ways. The reason it was taken up by the media anyway, despite being so sloppy, is that it discredited Trump, who first said he liked the stuff and later that he even took it. Everything is politicized today—everyone gets into the fray of battling over who will rule the world.
Hydroxychloroquine has been around forever, a mainstay of treatment for several ills. It would have been run off the road long ago were it so dangerous. It is extremely cheap—another reason to attack it from an entirely different quarter—Remdesivir, a competing treatment, costs $1000 per dose! Does the cheaper drug have side effects? Just listen to the side effects of drugs relentlessly hawked on TV today—it is enough to scare your socks off. Cardiologist Dr. William O’Neill, medical director at the Henry Ford Health System in Detroit, Michigan, director of the Detroit study said: “I've never seen science [so] politicized in 40 years of practice.”
 
 
 
 

@4Jah2me a while back you expressed  contempt at the fact that there is a JW only club and mockingly wondered what kind of topics might be discussed there. Well before this topic was moved here, (since it was off topic in the Furuli discussion) I considered making it a topic in the JW only club for the very reason that has become apparent  with your latest comment. In the JW only club, we like to actually discuss scriptures and their application, without inserting child sexual abuse or the imperfections of imperfect people every chance there is. That is the reason why the JW only club was set up, to avoid that. That is not to say the problems regarding child sexual abuse are not discussed there, they are, but under a relevant topic. I wish I had moved this topic there now. 😠

@4Jah2me a while back you expressed  contempt at the fact that there is a JW only club and mockingly wondered what kind of topics might be discussed there. Well before this topic was moved here, (since it was off topic in the Furuli discussion) I considered making it a topic in the JW only club for the very reason that has become apparent  with your latest comment. In the JW only club, we like to actually discuss scriptures and their application, without inserting child sexual abuse or the imperfections of imperfect people every chance there is. That is the reason why the JW only club was set up, to avoid that. That is not to say the problems regarding child sexual abuse are not discussed there, they are, but under a relevant topic. I wish I had moved this topic there now. 😠

@4Jah2me a while back you expressed  contempt at the fact that there is a JW only club and mockingly wondered what kind of topics might be discussed there. Well before this topic was moved here, (since it was off topic in the Furuli discussion) I considered making it a topic in the JW only club for the very reason that has become apparent  with your latest comment. In the JW only club, we like to actually discuss scriptures and their application, without inserting child sexual abuse or the imperfections of imperfect people every chance there is. That is the reason why the JW only club was set up, to avoid that. That is not to say the problems regarding child sexual abuse are not discussed there, they are, but under a relevant topic. I wish I had moved this topic there now. 😠

No, I am definitely not a fan. But, as with everything, there are pluses and minuses. Today, there are still those who mourn those days, missing the camaraderie, the "we have nothing but neither does our neighbor". Those who kissed the Bolshevik's butts fared better than those who didn't. Personally, I can't understand why anyone would like anything about that period, except there was maybe less stress, because no one actually worked, but those who wanted to work, or contribute something useful to society, usually had to emigrate, usually illegally, leaving behind family members. As a child, I could never understand why someone was not allowed to leave the country. I don't know much about China, so I cannot compare their communism to the communism I experienced, I am sure there are similarities but also differences. But any totalitarian regime, run by imperfect people, is wrong. 

No, I am definitely not a fan. But, as with everything, there are pluses and minuses. Today, there are still those who mourn those days, missing the camaraderie, the "we have nothing but neither does our neighbor". Those who kissed the Bolshevik's butts fared better than those who didn't. Personally, I can't understand why anyone would like anything about that period, except there was maybe less stress, because no one actually worked, but those who wanted to work, or contribute something useful to society, usually had to emigrate, usually illegally, leaving behind family members. As a child, I could never understand why someone was not allowed to leave the country. I don't know much about China, so I cannot compare their communism to the communism I experienced, I am sure there are similarities but also differences. But any totalitarian regime, run by imperfect people, is wrong. 

I like this explanation. I think this is the best explanation anyone ever came up with to mesh free will and predestination, both of which seem possible from Jehovah's perspective (based on certain scriptures).

Thank you for all your replies @JW Insider   In summary, as I understand it:

1. Jesus' coming/ parousia/presence although invisible (since he is a spirit) will be manifest in a physical way, like lightning flashing from one end of the earth to the other. At the same time, everyone, good or bad will be aware that this is the manifestation of Jesus, the king, and that he has come to judge the world. We know it as Armageddon. This is also when the  harvest will occur because the wheat (true Christians and those righteously disposed) will be separated from the weeds (false Christians) which will be removed from the earth.

2. Jesus' presence with his disciples till the conclusion of the system of things began in 33 C.E. when he was crowned king (WT interprets this to mean king over the Christians, but it seems like he was made king over the whole earth, although Arauna has made some good points about why this is is not necessarily so ).

All the above makes sense to me. However, we are still left with that secondary,"later application", (as opposed to the 1st century application) with regard to "the conclusion of the system of things" as being a period of time before Armageddon. If we do away with 1914, as there is no need for it if Jesus was crowned king over all in 33 CE , then there is also no need to solve the generation, but there still remain questions with regard to this specific time period.

In other words, where does the "revival" of true religion in the time of the modern day "last days" fit in?  (As the scriptures seem to indicate, and JWs believe). There seems to be plenty of evidence that apostasy did occur, as was predicted by Jesus, and therefor in time there had to be a separation of true Christians and counterfeit Christians. This though meets with conflict when we think of the idea of the two growing together as the weeds and the wheat until the harvest during Christ's coming/parusia/Armageddon because it could be understood that these two, the weeds and the wheat are intermingled, as in a field, and stay that way until they are separated at Armageddon. However, the Bible does say that in the time of the end true knowledge will become abundant, as opposed to apostatized knowledge. It is logical that people of like mind will gather together, and it fits in with the Bible students of Russell's day, and ultimately to our day as Jehovah's Witnesses worshiping together worldwide but in doctrinal unity. This is why I suppose Jehovah’s Witnesses are defined as a restorationist Christian religion as opposed to traditional "Christianity" which sprung up after the apostasy.   Christendom, although believing in some kind of judgement day in the future, does not occupy itself with the possible imminent second coming of Christ. I definitely give Jehovah's Witnesses credit in this regard, because since the beginning of their organized activity, the focus has been on relentlessly preaching the good news of the kingdom, the nearness of Christs coming to settle nutters on earth, and for Christians to be ready and finally to be found by him to be spotless and unblemished (coincidentally this was an item in tonight's meeting). In contrast, Christendom has done nothing to prepare their members for that day....to be ready and found approved by God.... although through the centuries it has acquired many converts (using very un-Chritian means) ultimately, it has taught them many untruths and caused much blood shed in the name of God. Surely, those who separated themselves from that kind of "Christianity" and grouped together were the wheat, and already stood apart from the weeds as if they had been harvested. But as you say the fact that the preaching work is still going on, means that the planting is still going on and  No one continues to plant after the harvest has started. "   I remember the WT and remember thinking the same at the time.....So what is the answer to this problem?

I realize I had skipped this question.
Revelation 2 and 3 show that various congregations should at all times watch out for false teachings and that they might even go through phases of cleaning out false doctrine, immorality, and increasing their Christian "deeds." This is exactly what Russell and the WTS had tried to do, and it's being done in greater measure all the time.
(Revelation 2:18-23) 18 “To the angel of the congregation in Thy·a·tiʹra write: These are the things that the Son of God says, the one who has eyes like a fiery flame and whose feet are like fine copper: 19 ‘I know your deeds, and your love and faith and ministry and endurance, and that your deeds of late are more than those you did at first. 20 “‘Nevertheless, I do hold this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezʹe·bel, who calls herself a prophetess, and she teaches and misleads my slaves to commit sexual immorality and to eat things sacrificed to idols. 21 And I gave her time to repent, but she is not willing to repent of her sexual immorality. . . . so that all the congregations will know that I am the one who searches the innermost thoughts and hearts, and I will give to you individually according to your deeds.
(Revelation 3:1, 2) . . .“To the angel of the congregation in Sarʹdis write: These are the things that he says who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars: ‘I know your deeds, that you have the name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Become watchful, and strengthen the things remaining that were ready to die, for I have not found your works fully performed before my God.
Those were just two of several examples. But they show how Jesus has been head of the congregations, who are responsible for greater accomplishments. The CCJW has done more than any others to accomplish greater deeds to more fully perform the congregation's duties regarding love, faith, ministry, morality, doctrine, and do this on an international scale. We are living in a time when certain methods are just now possible that were not possible before. Being alert to such types of "deeds" have included our ability to go beyond just "house-to-house" and make use of the printed page, transportation, radio, advertising, Internet. Staying alert to doing what we can, when properly motivated, is why we are blessed to be associated in this particular time period. And it seems like a pretty good guess that we are reaching the most critical of critical times. We don't actually "need" any chronology to tell us that it's time to lift our heads up because our deliverance is getting near.

Jesus said that the harvest is the synteleia.
(Matthew 13:39) The harvest is a conclusion [synteleia] of a system of things, and the reapers are angels.
Therefore, there is no specific time period just before Armageddon. This also removes the contradiction we have created against Jesus' words that no one knows the times and seasons. If we say that we know absolutely that we were preaching in the last "measurable" generation prior to Armageddon, then we would be making Jesus out to be a liar. Anything can happen. The UN could actually ban religion just as we expect to happen in the next few years. But claiming that such a thing must happen just before Armageddon makes Jesus out to be a liar. It also causes trouble with the parable of the wheat and the weeds, where both grow together indistinguishably from a human perspective until the angels reap the world.
We should also remember that just because synteleia can be translated as conclusion, that conclusion need not be an extended time period. ("full end" is actually a better translation in the Bible's context.) We could be near the end of a season, and then suddenly everything is concluded, or consummated. You can get near the end of a novel and then in one sentence a conclusion sums up the entire story. We have learned to think of "conclusion" in a sense that was not in the Bible. In the Bible, the "conclusion" is getting near, the "conclusion" is approaching. Even though the disciples were only a few short years from the "conclusion" of a system of things in 70 CE, they weren't "in" the conclusion. The "synteleia" was a destructive conclusion to the entire age.
Note how Mark uses the verb form of the same word (synteleo😞
(Mark 13:4) 4 “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when all these things are to come to a conclusion?”
That translates a better sense of synteleia/synteleo as "conclusion." Literally, the term is about the final end of all things together, therefore the phrase "synteleia" of the "age". Other translations get even closer with their translation of Mark here:
(NLT) “Tell us, when will all this happen? What sign will show us that these things are about to be fulfilled?”
When the full phrase is used, "synteleia of the age," it's a way of saying "the end of all things." Peter used those exact words instead of the synteleia phrase.
(1 Peter 4:7) . . .But the end of all things has drawn close. . . .  (and 2 Peter details how this means the [figurative] passing away of the heavens and earth that now exist.)
If the NWT had used that phrase "end of all things" the idea of a long drawn out conclusion would be gone. For example:
(Matthew 28:20) . . .And look! I am with you all the days until the conclusion of the system of things end of all things.”
 

"Harvest" seems to be a simple enough concept. But it's a good question because the Bible is about spiritual matters, using physical analogies to help us understand. We don't always expect the same physical analogy to be a perfect fit to all the related spiritual concepts. There are several aspects of the Kingdom, for example, and therefore Jesus used multiple physical analogies that all help build up a clearer understanding. (i.e., "The kingdom is like a . . . "]
We live in "historical time" and must use concepts like "harvest time" "thousand year reign" "last days" "last hour" "times of the nations" (gentile times), "this generation." But Jehovah's thoughts are unimaginably higher than our thoughts, especially as he "knows the end from the beginning." Jesus knew the mind of his father, so some of his uses of terms will reflect this. Knowing the end from the beginning can include reading hearts in such a way that Jehovah can already see the "harvest" in someone, even during the "sowing" season. And from this perspective, multiple fulfillments of a prophecy can work out even if not all the details of one fulfillment would fit the next.
In addition, since these are spiritual concepts almost everything we know about the Kingdom from its overarching historical perspective and ultimate fulfillment will also have a corresponding fulfillment in our own life, our personal conduct, and our responsibilities in the world and in the Christian Congregation. Isaiah spoke of a kind of "spiritual" paradise in the nation of "Judea/Israel" for example. Paul spoke of already being "resurrected" to a new life, and already being seated in heavenly places. Therefore, in our personal lives, we "reap what we sow." As Paul said, based on Psalms 112:
(2 Corinthians 9:10, 11) 10 Now the One who abundantly supplies seed to the sower and bread for eating will supply and multiply the seed for you to sow and will increase the harvest of your righteousness.) 11 In everything you are being enriched for every sort of generosity, which produces through us an expression of thanks to God;
In Israel physically, the disciples would have know that there could be a long planting season with various types of seeds to be planted at different times and several harvests across a couple of months depending on what ripened first. So it was especially in the context of Matthew 13 that we get this picture of a sudden, swift harvest carried out by angels. We might not have noticed that if Matthew had not included a second portion of that parable where the disciples asked Jesus to explain.
(Matthew 13:29, 30) . . .He said, ‘No, for fear that while collecting the weeds, you uproot the wheat with them. 30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and in the harvest season, I will tell the reapers: First collect the weeds and bind them in bundles to burn them up; then gather the wheat into my storehouse.’”
Should note that the NWT breaks with its usual translation of kairos as "appointed time" and goes with "season" on this one. This allows for extending the harvest (and therefore the synteleia) over a century or more long period. If this "rule" had been followed, it would have read:
30 Let both grow together until the harvest, and in the appointed time of the harvest,
Imagine how much trouble would have been avoided if "season" had been used here for the same word "kairos":
(Mark 13:32, 33) 32 “Concerning that day or the hour nobody knows, neither the angels in heaven nor the Son, but the Father. 33 Keep looking, keep awake, for you do not know when the appointed time is.
It would have made it clear that we do not know when the "appointed time" is, but also that we do not know when the "season" is.
Compare:
(Revelation 14:15, 16) . . .Another angel emerged from the temple sanctuary, calling with a loud voice to the one seated on the cloud: “Put your sickle in and reap, because the hour has come to reap, for the harvest of the earth is fully ripe.” 16 And the one seated on the cloud thrust his sickle into the earth, and the earth was reaped.
But this doesn't mean that harvest always had that same "sudden" aspect, controlled from a heavenly master, and angels. In Matthew 13, Jesus was the sower, and the fine seed were the sons of the Kingdom. But in other senses, as mentioned above, Paul could say that he was a sower, and Apollos a waterer, for example. Or even this illustration, where the disciples are reapers of a harvest:
(John 4:34-38) 34 Jesus said to them: “My food is to do the will of him who sent me and to finish his work. 35 Do you not say that there are yet four months before the harvest comes? Look! I say to you: Lift up your eyes and view the fields, that they are white for harvesting. Already 36 the reaper is receiving wages and gathering fruit for everlasting life, so that the sower and the reaper may rejoice together. 37 For in this respect the saying is true: One is the sower and another the reaper. 38 I sent you to reap what you did not labor on. Others have labored, and you have entered into the benefit of their labor.”

Thank you for all your replies @JW Insider   In summary, as I understand it:

1. Jesus' coming/ parousia/presence although invisible (since he is a spirit) will be manifest in a physical way, like lightning flashing from one end of the earth to the other. At the same time, everyone, good or bad will be aware that this is the manifestation of Jesus, the king, and that he has come to judge the world. We know it as Armageddon. This is also when the  harvest will occur because the wheat (true Christians and those righteously disposed) will be separated from the weeds (false Christians) which will be removed from the earth.

2. Jesus' presence with his disciples till the conclusion of the system of things began in 33 C.E. when he was crowned king (WT interprets this to mean king over the Christians, but it seems like he was made king over the whole earth, although Arauna has made some good points about why this is is not necessarily so ).

All the above makes sense to me. However, we are still left with that secondary,"later application", (as opposed to the 1st century application) with regard to "the conclusion of the system of things" as being a period of time before Armageddon. If we do away with 1914, as there is no need for it if Jesus was crowned king over all in 33 CE , then there is also no need to solve the generation, but there still remain questions with regard to this specific time period.

In other words, where does the "revival" of true religion in the time of the modern day "last days" fit in?  (As the scriptures seem to indicate, and JWs believe). There seems to be plenty of evidence that apostasy did occur, as was predicted by Jesus, and therefor in time there had to be a separation of true Christians and counterfeit Christians. This though meets with conflict when we think of the idea of the two growing together as the weeds and the wheat until the harvest during Christ's coming/parusia/Armageddon because it could be understood that these two, the weeds and the wheat are intermingled, as in a field, and stay that way until they are separated at Armageddon. However, the Bible does say that in the time of the end true knowledge will become abundant, as opposed to apostatized knowledge. It is logical that people of like mind will gather together, and it fits in with the Bible students of Russell's day, and ultimately to our day as Jehovah's Witnesses worshiping together worldwide but in doctrinal unity. This is why I suppose Jehovah’s Witnesses are defined as a restorationist Christian religion as opposed to traditional "Christianity" which sprung up after the apostasy.   Christendom, although believing in some kind of judgement day in the future, does not occupy itself with the possible imminent second coming of Christ. I definitely give Jehovah's Witnesses credit in this regard, because since the beginning of their organized activity, the focus has been on relentlessly preaching the good news of the kingdom, the nearness of Christs coming to settle nutters on earth, and for Christians to be ready and finally to be found by him to be spotless and unblemished (coincidentally this was an item in tonight's meeting). In contrast, Christendom has done nothing to prepare their members for that day....to be ready and found approved by God.... although through the centuries it has acquired many converts (using very un-Chritian means) ultimately, it has taught them many untruths and caused much blood shed in the name of God. Surely, those who separated themselves from that kind of "Christianity" and grouped together were the wheat, and already stood apart from the weeds as if they had been harvested. But as you say the fact that the preaching work is still going on, means that the planting is still going on and  No one continues to plant after the harvest has started. "   I remember the WT and remember thinking the same at the time.....So what is the answer to this problem?

The most direct meaning needs to make good sense in this context:
Jesus predicts a cataclysmic, catastrophic, spectacular event that no one can miss or ignore because it will involve the destruction of the greatest Jewish city its most important landmark, the Temple at Jerusalem. The disciples, quite logically, ask for an advance warning sign that they can watch out for. Because they asked for a sign Jesus repeats warnings about not being fooled or misled by signs because even though many events will happen, the end they are asking about is not yet. They will see "signs" and see people who will make claims and predictions and perform signs and wonders, and they must make sure they are not misled. Signs they might think are evidence of the end, and it might only be the beginning. In this case. Looking for signs will do no direct good because this particular judgment event will come as if by surprise, like a thief in the night. While people are still grinding at the mill, getting married, eating, and drinking, etc. Within that context, of people falsely interpreting signs, making false predictions, making false claims about their knowledge, falsely claiming to be the Messiah themselves, or even many claiming that Jesus is the Messiah but that only they can lead disciples to him with true knowledge only they know about.
(Matthew 24:4, 5) . . .In answer Jesus said to them: “Look out that nobody misleads you, 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many.
Note that it is possible that people will come on the basis of knowing that Jesus is the Christ, (not themselves) therefore even claiming that "Jesus is the Christ" and will still mislead many. This is much more common than people falsely claiming to be Christ themselves. It is more like the people Jesus described as "performing many powerful works in his name" but Jesus would still say, I never knew you.
Jesus didn't say that any of these might claim that Jesus had returned invisibly. But the effect was the same. They would claim that they had special knowledge of his whereabouts, as if he had gone off and returned somewhere.
And how would the disciples know that these persons who made such claims were wrong? Because Jesus parousia would be highly visible. Unmistakably visible. Think of the brightest lightning you have ever seen, or can imagine: from one extremity of the earth to the other.
I don't think it refers a literal physical presence either:
(Matthew 24:30, 31) . . .and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31 And he will send forth his angels with a great trumpet sound, and they will gather his chosen ones together from the four winds, from one extremity of the heavens to their other extremity. . .
I always thought of it as the "brightness of his glory." The disciples had a glimpse at the Transfiguration. Paul had a glimpse that blinded him. John had a glimpse:
(Revelation 1:16) . . .And he had in his right hand seven stars, and out of his mouth a sharp, long, two-edged sword was protruding, and his countenance was like the sun when it shines at its brightest.
(Matthew 16:27) . . .For the Son of man is destined to come in the glory of his Father with his angels, and then he will recompense each one according to his behavior.
Jesus said that even those resurrected or changed in that day, which is part of it, will shine as the sun.
(Matthew 13:43) . . .At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the Kingdom of their Father.. . .
And it's not just "those with insight" who see this bright manifestation. I think the post responding to Arauna point about this was already copied over to here.
(Matthew 24:30) . . .And then the sign of the Son of man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in lamentation, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
That part does not have to visible to the rest of us. Paul's point in 1 Thess 4:17 for example, was about how those persons with new glorified spiritual bodies, whether resurrected or changed, would meet Jesus Christ. Just how spiritual bodies "see" cannot be imagined by any of us. But when the Bible speaks of angels or heavenly bodies, it often points out how these bodies are glorious, and too glorious for humans to look upon unless the human was somehow shielded from the full "power and glory" of the spiritual body. We know for sure is that the Bible associates Jesus coming on the clouds with "visibility" as in Matt 24:30.
When Jesus ascended the first time, the cloud was associated with a point in time when they could no longer see him as he evidently finally disappeared into the clouds. This was obviously not necessary to have Jesus float upwards, but effective for human description. So it seems like some of the glorious effect (like seeing the power and great glory, or being as visible as a flash of unimaginably bright lightning) is also to help the rest of us make sense of it. More than just an understanding of who is behind it all.
The harvest must actually be after the wheat and the weeds have continued to grow together until it's time for the angels to gather the chosen ones. This must also be the parousia, synteleia, or "day of judgment" when the angels are sent out to the extremities of the earth to gather (harvest) the chosen ones.
This harvest period has been a problem from the beginning of the Watchtower's attempts to explain it.
Originally it was a harvest in the 19th century. Barbour had argued for a harvest only from 1874 to the end of it in 1881. Russell settled on 1874 to 1914. When Jesus was considered to be failing to arrive in 1914 for the "visible" parousia, Russell began moving it (and the Gentile Times end) to 1915, and then Rutherford claimed that Jesus had actually arrived/returned in 1918, so that Rutherford changed the range of the harvest from 1878 to 1918. There had also been discussions of how some of the original 1844 crowd must have been wise virgins, especially when they showed themselves ready to NOT give up on chronology, as Miller had. When the new date for the midnight cry was considered to have occurred between 1844 and 1874 (typically 1859/1860) some preliminary harvesting must have taken place from chronology-compliant virgins even before that point. Originally, the trumpet sounds were extended further back towards the beginning of the last days, starting in 1799. For example a very early Watch Tower on the topic (1880, p.152-3) says that trumpet associated with reaping the first fruits of the Gospel Age went back to 1840: 
As to the time of our change, that it is at, (or during) the sounding of the "last trump,"—the "seventh," Rev. 10:7, and 11:15-18—and after the Lord himself has descended is plainly stated. We need not here repeat the evidences that the "seventh trump" began its sounding A.D. 1840, and will continue until the end of the time of trouble, and the end of "The times of the Gentiles," A.D. 1914, and that it is the trouble of this "Great day," which is here symbolically called the voice of the Archangel when he begins the deliverance of fleshly Israel. "At that time shall Michael stand up, the great Prince. (Archangel) which standeth for the children of thy people, and there shall be a time of trouble such as never was since there was a nation." Dan. 12:1. Nor will we here, again present the conclusive Bible proof that our Lord came for his Bride in 1874, and has an unseen work as Reaper of the first-fruits of this Gospel Age, (Rev. 14:16) in separating between wheat and tares and gathering the living into a condition of readiness for their change.
So the harvest here is especially 1874 to 1914. 1914 was of course, as it says above, the end of the time of trouble, and a time when there would be physical manifestations of the parousia, and FLESHLY Israel would be delivered.
I can't really see how any of this made sense, because we are still planting. No one continues to plant after the harvest has started.
This is also another of those places where trying to extend the period of the synteleia/parousia results in Bible contradictions. Note:
(Matthew 13:39-43) . . .The harvest is a conclusion [synteleia] of a system of things, and the reapers are angels. 40 Therefore, just as the weeds are collected and burned with fire, so it will be in the conclusion [synteleia] of the system of things. 41 The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness, 42 and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be. 43 At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the Kingdom of their Father. . . .
The harvest is the "end of the age" when those who cause stumbling will be pitched into the fiery furnace and the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun. If that has not happened yet, then we are not in the harvest yet. If the wheat and weeds are still growing together, we are not in the harvest yet.
The Watchtower admits this:
*** w13 7/15 p. 13 par. 16 “Look! I Am With You All the Days” ***
Jesus ends his prophecy by saying: “At that time the righteous ones will shine as brightly as the sun in the kingdom of their Father.” (Matt. 13:43) When and where will that be? The fulfillment of these words still lies ahead. Jesus foretold, not an activity currently taking place on earth, but a future event occurring in heaven.
As the footnote admits, for many years we tried to make this apply to the long period of the parousia when the preaching work occurred.
*** w13 7/15 p. 13 “Look! I Am With You All the Days” ***
However, Matthew 13:43 points to the time when they will shine brightly in the heavenly Kingdom. Previously, we thought that both scriptures referred to the same activity—the preaching work.
But now we move this "harvest" into the future, but still claim we are in the time of the harvest, and planting (the preaching work).

I am glad this has moved to its own topic. I have not read the rest of the comments yet (Arauna) only the first one by JWI.
I have always taken this scripture to mean that there will be people pointing to visible signs that Jesus is here. Like that he is physically in one particular spot, in the wilderness, or in an inner room...and that there will be many such people, false Christs (and there have been). So in contrast, and in that context, when v. 27 says that his presence will be from one end of the globe to the other, suggests that it could not be a literal physical presence of a person, since no one can be in more that one place at the same time. So therefor we should not be looking for Christ in one particular spot, in the wilderness or somewhere else. But we will see his "manifestation" from one end of the earth to the other. I know this is also WT interpretation, but it makes sense to me. So do you suggest that Christ will travel and greet every single person? (every eye will see him).
So there are two types of "appearances" :
The first is Christ's presence as the head of the congregation starting after his resurrection in 33 C E. (The WT agrees with that).
The second one is his appearance (manifestation) when he comes to take the remnant to heaven and judge, and every eye will see him because it will be the battle of Armageddon. (The WT agrees with that too). But the problem seems that with WT,  there are three appearances, 1.Christ's presence with the congregation after his resurrection in 33 CE, then interrupted with the great apostasy, then 2. restarted again in the time of the end (beginning 1914) and then 3. the manifestation where every eye will see him (Armageddon).
So the problem is obviously the  "interruption" part. Where is WT's scriptural basis for that? Although Jesus does not mention an interruption regarding his  presence with his disciples, he says he will be with them till the end, and wherever two or three are gathered in his name he will be with them, but what about the apostasy?  Are there  scriptures that the WT mentions in support of Christ no longer being present with two or three gathered in his name starting after the apostasy all the way to the present time; starting back up again in the 20th century? (I am sorry, I would look it all up but I don't have the time right now, you probably already know which scriptures WT uses to support that idea).
The visual this gives me is something that I would rather not imagine as it reminds me of creepy scenes in anecdotal videos of people levitating and rising into the sky like balloons. I just cannot imagine seeing Br. Jackson in his suit and tie, (or would he be casual), ascending into the clouds.  Since flesh and blood cannot enter into the heavens, and those people will be transformed into spirits, that are invisible, how could then this whole scenario be visible? Of course I definitely agree with Armageddon being very visible, but not everyone could see the literal Jesus at the same time. That would be a physically impossibility, but all will know it is Jesus acting. Isn't that what is meant by every eye will see him?
So obviously the  presence of Christ with his disciples from 33 CE onward is different from the presence at the end, since that presence will be the Judgement day/lords day/day of Jehovah etc. basically Armageddon. And this presence will be a literal manifestation as is mentioned by 2 Thessalonians 2:8  "Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence [parousia]".
Yes, I see that the parousia is tied in with not only being gathered to him (I am assuming that means in heaven, therefore the "rapture") but also to the day of Jehovah/Judgement day/Lords day/ Armageddon when those who suffer destruction will "see him" in the sense that they will know it is Jesus who is destroying the wicked.
 
So the WT sees it that Jesus' invisible  presence began in 1914, but we could also say it began in 33 CE because Jesus said he would be (invisibly) present with his followers right up to the end. That bit seems clear enough. In both versions his presence is associated with him becoming King (both 1914 or 33 CE).

Now to his presence being visible and felt in a literal way because he is coming to judge, that would be Armageddon.

The biggest discrepancy I can see, that you highlighted,  is that Jesus said he will be with his disciples till the end, which means throughout the time from 33 CE until now. Which means without a break. The fact that the Bible students started searching and "seeing" Jesus in the 20th Century does not necessarily mean that Jesus had  left off being with anybody (two or three) until that time. In fact we used to teach, and still do, that there have always been individuals who were anointed throughout the ages since the first century. I suppose this is because Jesus did not say he would take a break and come back at a later time. But then we do have those scriptures which point out that big gap with regard to true Christians....the wheat and the weeds, growing together, until the harvest, when true Christians as a group would be identified. When did that harvest start? WT says in the 20th century. 
I'm sorry, I know I have jumped around a lot, and repeated myself. I just put down my thoughts as they came to me and had no time to organize anything. I just copied and pasted.